| Topic: |
Science > Abortion |
| User: |
"nospam" |
| Date: |
22 Dec 2004 05:01:43 AM |
| Object: |
FETAL PAIN |
Data in the British Medical Journal, Lancet, gave solid confirmation
of [fetal pain]. It is known that the fetal umbilical cord has no pain
receptors such as the rest of the fetal body. Accordingly, they tested
fetal hormone stress response comparing puncturing of the abdomen and
of the cord.
They observed "the fetus reacts to intrahepatic (liver) needling with
vigorous body and breathing movements, but not to cord needling. The
levels of these hormones did not vary with fetal age." M. Fisk, et
al., Fetal Plasma Cortisol and B-endorphin Response to Intrauterine
Needling, Lancet, Vol. 344, July 9, 1994, Pg. 77
Another excellent British study commented on this:
"It cannot be comfortable for the fetus to have a scalp electrode
implanted on his skin, to have blood taken from the scalp or to suffer
the skull compression that may occur even with spontaneous delivery.
It is hardly surprising that infants delivered by difficult forceps
extraction act as if they have a severe headache." Valman & Pearson,
"What the Fetus Feels," British Med. Jour., Jan. 26, 1980
http://www.abortionfacts.com/online_books/love_them_both/why_cant_we_love_them_both_14.asp
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| User: "carl jones" |
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| Title: Re: FETAL PAIN |
22 Dec 2004 02:47:25 PM |
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"nospam" <gfd@s.fd> wrote in message news:41C95417.BEA2ACE4@s.fd...
Data in the British Medical Journal, Lancet, gave solid confirmation
of [fetal pain]. It is known that the fetal umbilical cord has no pain
receptors such as the rest of the fetal body. Accordingly, they tested
fetal hormone stress response comparing puncturing of the abdomen and
of the cord.
They observed "the fetus reacts to intrahepatic (liver) needling with
vigorous body and breathing movements, but not to cord needling. The
levels of these hormones did not vary with fetal age." M. Fisk, et
al., Fetal Plasma Cortisol and B-endorphin Response to Intrauterine
Needling, Lancet, Vol. 344, July 9, 1994, Pg. 77
Another excellent British study commented on this:
"It cannot be comfortable for the fetus to have a scalp electrode
implanted on his skin, to have blood taken from the scalp or to suffer
the skull compression that may occur even with spontaneous delivery.
It is hardly surprising that infants delivered by difficult forceps
extraction act as if they have a severe headache." Valman & Pearson,
"What the Fetus Feels," British Med. Jour., Jan. 26, 1980
Bravo! the fetus does feel pain and has a memory of it.
These prebirth memories can be recalled under hypnosis. I posted "Is the
fetus conscious?" recently I'd post it again but I don't dare clutter up the
newsgoup!
best
Carl
http://www.abortionfacts.com/online_books/love_them_both/why_cant_we_love_them_both_14.asp
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| User: "Christopher Benson-Manica" |
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| Title: Re: FETAL PAIN |
22 Dec 2004 05:13:16 PM |
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carl jones <carljones@usadatanet.net> spoke thus:
Bravo! the fetus does feel pain and has a memory of it.
Bravo - you forced me to read more of your drivel. Please stay
plonked this time.
--
Christopher Benson-Manica | I *should* know what I'm talking about - if I
ataru(at)cyberspace.org | don't, I need to know. Flames welcome.
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| User: "carl jones" |
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| Title: Re: FETAL PAIN |
26 Dec 2004 12:22:59 PM |
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"Christopher Benson-Manica" <ataru@nospam.cyberspace.org> wrote in message
news:cqcv2c$cjj$1@chessie.cirr.com...
carl jones < > spoke thus:
Bravo! the fetus does feel pain and has a memory of it.
Bravo - you forced me to read more of your drivel. Please stay
plonked this time.
Christopher
This is well-thought out, timely message.
-
Carl
..
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| User: "carl jones" |
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| Title: Re: FETAL PAIN |
28 Dec 2004 01:22:26 AM |
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"Christopher Benson-Manica" <ataru@nospam.cyberspace.org> wrote in message
news:cqcv2c$cjj$1@chessie.cirr.com...
carl jones <carljones@usadatanet.net> spoke thus:
Bravo! the fetus does feel pain and has a memory of it.
Bravo - you forced me to read more of your drivel. Please stay
plonked this time.
Why, whyever, do you feel forced?
Carl
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| User: "carl jones" |
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| Title: fetal pain again |
22 Dec 2004 02:50:19 PM |
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http://www.abortionfacts.com/online_books/love_them_both/why_cant_we_love_them_both_14.asp
Thanks for posting this web site. It is really great!
I saved it to disk
Carl
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: fetal pain again |
23 Dec 2004 12:11:32 AM |
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carl jones <carljones@usadatanet.net> wrote:
http://www.abortionfacts.com/
Thanks for posting this web site. It is really great!
Except that it's riddled with disinformation, hate, and lies.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: FETAL PAIN |
23 Dec 2004 12:10:51 AM |
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nospam <gfd@s.fd> wrote:
Data in the British Medical Journal, Lancet, gave solid confirmation
of [fetal pain]. It is known that the fetal umbilical cord has no pain
receptors such as the rest of the fetal body. Accordingly, they tested
fetal hormone stress response comparing puncturing of the abdomen and
of the cord.
Plants show similar kinds of stress response.
They observed "the fetus reacts to intrahepatic (liver) needling with
vigorous body and breathing movements, but not to cord needling. The
levels of these hormones did not vary with fetal age." M. Fisk, et
al., Fetal Plasma Cortisol and B-endorphin Response to Intrauterine
Needling, Lancet, Vol. 344, July 9, 1994, Pg. 77
90% of abortions are done during the 1st trimester, before there's any
possibility of fetal awareness.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
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| User: "carl jones" |
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| Title: Re: FETAL PAIN |
26 Dec 2004 12:25:30 PM |
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"Ray Fischer" <rfischer@bolt.sonic.net> wrote in message
news:cqdnha$qqo$1@bolt.sonic.net...
nospam <gfd@s.fd> wrote:
Data in the British Medical Journal, Lancet, gave solid confirmation
of [fetal pain]. It is known that the fetal umbilical cord has no pain
receptors such as the rest of the fetal body. Accordingly, they tested
fetal hormone stress response comparing puncturing of the abdomen and
of the cord.
Plants show similar kinds of stress response.
They observed "the fetus reacts to intrahepatic (liver) needling with
vigorous body and breathing movements, but not to cord needling. The
levels of these hormones did not vary with fetal age." M. Fisk, et
al., Fetal Plasma Cortisol and B-endorphin Response to Intrauterine
Needling, Lancet, Vol. 344, July 9, 1994, Pg. 77
90% of abortions are done during the 1st trimester, before there's any
possibility of fetal awareness.
We have perception, memory, and awareness before we have all our
equipment. Responses in plants - as you mentioned - support this point
Carl
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: FETAL PAIN |
26 Dec 2004 02:47:33 PM |
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carl jones <carljones@usadatanet.net> wrote:
"Ray Fischer" <rfischer@bolt.sonic.net> wrote in message
nospam <gfd@s.fd> wrote:
Data in the British Medical Journal, Lancet, gave solid confirmation
of [fetal pain]. It is known that the fetal umbilical cord has no pain
receptors such as the rest of the fetal body. Accordingly, they tested
fetal hormone stress response comparing puncturing of the abdomen and
of the cord.
Plants show similar kinds of stress response.
They observed "the fetus reacts to intrahepatic (liver) needling with
vigorous body and breathing movements, but not to cord needling. The
levels of these hormones did not vary with fetal age." M. Fisk, et
al., Fetal Plasma Cortisol and B-endorphin Response to Intrauterine
Needling, Lancet, Vol. 344, July 9, 1994, Pg. 77
90% of abortions are done during the 1st trimester, before there's any
possibility of fetal awareness.
We have perception, memory, and awareness before we have all our
equipment.
Impossible, moron.
Responses in plants - as you mentioned - support this point
Plants aren't aware, idiot.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
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