| Topic: |
Science > Abortion |
| User: |
"matureopinions" |
| Date: |
18 Jun 2006 01:51:33 PM |
| Object: |
God and the law |
I notice that there are many people on these newsgroups who appear to
support laws that have no secular justification. Since these people
expect
us to accept their religious beliefs as a just cause for imposing legal
restrictions on our behaviour perhaps they'd like to justify their
religious convictions to us. J. Young? Bitchin Bonney? Osprey?
Gnet? Robert Winn? bobandcarole? Alfred Newman? Anybody?
.
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| User: "osprey" |
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| Title: Re: God and the law |
22 Jun 2006 11:01:20 AM |
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matureopinions wrote:
osprey wrote:
For example the morality of alcohol consumption is open
to debate since the activity risks detrimental effects on people's
behaviour
but prohibition proved to be a disaster and the same with other hard
drugs. Criminilization seems to cause more problems than it solves.
Exactly, and that's another reason why I don't think abortion should be
illegal. Because we know it wouldn't work. I even have the same
struggles and arguments for the issue on legalization of some drugs. I
say some drugs because certainly there are some who will feel ALL drugs
should be legal, and that I simply don't agree with.
In principle I don't want all drugs permitted but the fact is that we
can't prevent their use. If we made them legal we would take them
out of the hands of organised crime, make it easier for
addicts to seek help and perhaps even make drug usage less
"cool". It's those sort of considerations I was thinking of.
Question is, what drugs?
Do you want drugs like LSD to be legal? What if people who are supposed
to be trust by the public take these kinds of drugs and have a
"flashback"? People like pilots, police officers, doctors, ect...
Don't you think there has to be a line drawn?
.
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| User: "matureopinions" |
|
| Title: Re: God and the law |
22 Jun 2006 07:36:17 PM |
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osprey wrote:
matureopinions wrote:
osprey wrote:
For example the morality of alcohol consumption is open
to debate since the activity risks detrimental effects on people's
behaviour
but prohibition proved to be a disaster and the same with other hard
drugs. Criminilization seems to cause more problems than it solves.
Exactly, and that's another reason why I don't think abortion should be
illegal. Because we know it wouldn't work. I even have the same
struggles and arguments for the issue on legalization of some drugs. I
say some drugs because certainly there are some who will feel ALL drugs
should be legal, and that I simply don't agree with.
In principle I don't want all drugs permitted but the fact is that we
can't prevent their use. If we made them legal we would take them
out of the hands of organised crime, make it easier for
addicts to seek help and perhaps even make drug usage less
"cool". It's those sort of considerations I was thinking of.
Question is, what drugs?
Do you want drugs like LSD to be legal?
I don't know enough to comment on that.
What if people who are supposed
to be trust by the public take these kinds of drugs and have a
"flashback"? People like pilots, police officers, doctors, ect...
Don't you think there has to be a line drawn?
Yes but the question should not be "how dangerous is
the drug" but "Is criminilazation the best solution
to the problems it causes".
.
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| User: "osprey" |
|
| Title: Re: God and the law |
22 Jun 2006 07:41:52 PM |
|
|
matureopinions wrote:
osprey wrote:
matureopinions wrote:
osprey wrote:
For example the morality of alcohol consumption is open
to debate since the activity risks detrimental effects on people's
behaviour
but prohibition proved to be a disaster and the same with other hard
drugs. Criminilization seems to cause more problems than it solves.
Exactly, and that's another reason why I don't think abortion should be
illegal. Because we know it wouldn't work. I even have the same
struggles and arguments for the issue on legalization of some drugs. I
say some drugs because certainly there are some who will feel ALL drugs
should be legal, and that I simply don't agree with.
In principle I don't want all drugs permitted but the fact is that we
can't prevent their use. If we made them legal we would take them
out of the hands of organised crime, make it easier for
addicts to seek help and perhaps even make drug usage less
"cool". It's those sort of considerations I was thinking of.
Question is, what drugs?
Do you want drugs like LSD to be legal?
I don't know enough to comment on that.
What if people who are supposed
to be trust by the public take these kinds of drugs and have a
"flashback"? People like pilots, police officers, doctors, ect...
Don't you think there has to be a line drawn?
Yes but the question should not be "how dangerous is
the drug" but "Is criminilazation the best solution
to the problems it causes".
I don't believe criminalization is the best solution and that comes
from personal observation. I work in corrections and for 2 1/2 years
of my total career, I worked in a program called the Key Program. It's
a drug and alcohol rehabiliation program.
I have watched the drug addicts come in, some very serious drug
addicts. Treatment, and LONG TERM treatment is part of the key. It's
amazing how it changed my attitude towards criminalizing drug usage.
Drug usage is a mental and behavior issue.
Now, unless the person committed a crime against another person and was
under the influence...well, then the act he or she committed is the
criminal part.
.
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| User: "matureopinions" |
|
| Title: Re: God and the law |
22 Jun 2006 08:07:49 PM |
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osprey wrote:
matureopinions wrote:
osprey wrote:
matureopinions wrote:
osprey wrote:
For example the morality of alcohol consumption is open
to debate since the activity risks detrimental effects on people's
behaviour
but prohibition proved to be a disaster and the same with other hard
drugs. Criminilization seems to cause more problems than it solves.
Exactly, and that's another reason why I don't think abortion should be
illegal. Because we know it wouldn't work. I even have the same
struggles and arguments for the issue on legalization of some drugs. I
say some drugs because certainly there are some who will feel ALL drugs
should be legal, and that I simply don't agree with.
In principle I don't want all drugs permitted but the fact is that we
can't prevent their use. If we made them legal we would take them
out of the hands of organised crime, make it easier for
addicts to seek help and perhaps even make drug usage less
"cool". It's those sort of considerations I was thinking of.
Question is, what drugs?
Do you want drugs like LSD to be legal?
I don't know enough to comment on that.
What if people who are supposed
to be trust by the public take these kinds of drugs and have a
"flashback"? People like pilots, police officers, doctors, ect...
Don't you think there has to be a line drawn?
Yes but the question should not be "how dangerous is
the drug" but "Is criminilazation the best solution
to the problems it causes".
I don't believe criminalization is the best solution and that comes
from personal observation. I work in corrections and for 2 1/2 years
of my total career, I worked in a program called the Key Program. It's
a drug and alcohol rehabiliation program.
I have watched the drug addicts come in, some very serious drug
addicts. Treatment, and LONG TERM treatment is part of the key. It's
amazing how it changed my attitude towards criminalizing drug usage.
Drug usage is a mental and behavior issue.
Now, unless the person committed a crime against another person and was
under the influence...well, then the act he or she committed is the
criminal part.
What does your experience tell you about LSD? Is that an exception
for which criminalization is the best answer?
.
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| User: "osprey" |
|
| Title: Re: God and the law |
22 Jun 2006 08:27:48 PM |
|
|
matureopinions wrote:
osprey wrote:
matureopinions wrote:
osprey wrote:
matureopinions wrote:
osprey wrote:
For example the morality of alcohol consumption is open
to debate since the activity risks detrimental effects on people's
behaviour
but prohibition proved to be a disaster and the same with other hard
drugs. Criminilization seems to cause more problems than it solves.
Exactly, and that's another reason why I don't think abortion should be
illegal. Because we know it wouldn't work. I even have the same
struggles and arguments for the issue on legalization of some drugs. I
say some drugs because certainly there are some who will feel ALL drugs
should be legal, and that I simply don't agree with.
In principle I don't want all drugs permitted but the fact is that we
can't prevent their use. If we made them legal we would take them
out of the hands of organised crime, make it easier for
addicts to seek help and perhaps even make drug usage less
"cool". It's those sort of considerations I was thinking of.
Question is, what drugs?
Do you want drugs like LSD to be legal?
I don't know enough to comment on that.
What if people who are supposed
to be trust by the public take these kinds of drugs and have a
"flashback"? People like pilots, police officers, doctors, ect...
Don't you think there has to be a line drawn?
Yes but the question should not be "how dangerous is
the drug" but "Is criminilazation the best solution
to the problems it causes".
I don't believe criminalization is the best solution and that comes
from personal observation. I work in corrections and for 2 1/2 years
of my total career, I worked in a program called the Key Program. It's
a drug and alcohol rehabiliation program.
I have watched the drug addicts come in, some very serious drug
addicts. Treatment, and LONG TERM treatment is part of the key. It's
amazing how it changed my attitude towards criminalizing drug usage.
Drug usage is a mental and behavior issue.
Now, unless the person committed a crime against another person and was
under the influence...well, then the act he or she committed is the
criminal part.
What does your experience tell you about LSD? Is that an exception
for which criminalization is the best answer?
The only reason I mentioned LSD was because at the time, it was the
only drug I could think of as an example for a drug that shouldn't ever
be legal to use. I used the example of pilots, police officers,
doctors, ect... because these are the people that we put trust in, not
only for our safety but for our very lives sometimes.
My point was, drugs like LSD, cause serious problems in our actions,
behavior, mental state, and so forth. It isn't like marijuana, were
the effects do wear off and we can for the most part still function
normally.
Personally, I don't think any drug use is good. I have no need for
them.
In regards to your question on criminilization, no, I don't think using
LSD should be a "criminal" act and the person should be treated like a
criminal. I do think that the person should receive treatment and help
to get off of it and to not use it.
But no, they are not criminals for the use of LSD alone.
.
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| User: "Slate" |
|
| Title: Re: God and the law |
23 Jun 2006 07:26:42 AM |
|
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On 22 Jun 2006 18:27:48 -0700, "osprey" <noneedtoknow@mail.com> wrote:
matureopinions wrote:
osprey wrote:
matureopinions wrote:
osprey wrote:
matureopinions wrote:
osprey wrote:
For example the morality of alcohol consumption is open
to debate since the activity risks detrimental effects on people's
behaviour
but prohibition proved to be a disaster and the same with other hard
drugs. Criminilization seems to cause more problems than it solves.
Exactly, and that's another reason why I don't think abortion should be
illegal. Because we know it wouldn't work. I even have the same
struggles and arguments for the issue on legalization of some drugs. I
say some drugs because certainly there are some who will feel ALL drugs
should be legal, and that I simply don't agree with.
In principle I don't want all drugs permitted but the fact is that we
can't prevent their use. If we made them legal we would take them
out of the hands of organised crime, make it easier for
addicts to seek help and perhaps even make drug usage less
"cool". It's those sort of considerations I was thinking of.
Question is, what drugs?
Do you want drugs like LSD to be legal?
I don't know enough to comment on that.
What if people who are supposed
to be trust by the public take these kinds of drugs and have a
"flashback"? People like pilots, police officers, doctors, ect...
Don't you think there has to be a line drawn?
Yes but the question should not be "how dangerous is
the drug" but "Is criminilazation the best solution
to the problems it causes".
I don't believe criminalization is the best solution and that comes
from personal observation. I work in corrections and for 2 1/2 years
of my total career, I worked in a program called the Key Program. It's
a drug and alcohol rehabiliation program.
I have watched the drug addicts come in, some very serious drug
addicts. Treatment, and LONG TERM treatment is part of the key. It's
amazing how it changed my attitude towards criminalizing drug usage.
Drug usage is a mental and behavior issue.
Now, unless the person committed a crime against another person and was
under the influence...well, then the act he or she committed is the
criminal part.
What does your experience tell you about LSD? Is that an exception
for which criminalization is the best answer?
The only reason I mentioned LSD was because at the time, it was the
only drug I could think of as an example for a drug that shouldn't ever
be legal to use. I used the example of pilots, police officers,
doctors, ect... because these are the people that we put trust in, not
only for our safety but for our very lives sometimes.
My point was, drugs like LSD, cause serious problems in our actions,
behavior, mental state, and so forth. It isn't like marijuana, were
the effects do wear off and we can for the most part still function
normally.
Those same people "pilots, police officers, doctors, etc.", may use
alcohol at inappropriate times too. Why isn't alcohol illegal as well?
Like anything else we do, taking personal responsibility for our
own actions is the only logical answer. Drugs should be legalized.
Take the billions of dollars squandered on the "drug war", and
spend the money paying for prescription drugs the elderly need.
This country should be ashamed of itself putting many older
Americans in the position to have to choose between food or
drugs every month.
Slate
<Snip>...
.
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| User: "Miriam Cohen" |
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| Title: Re: God and the law |
22 Jun 2006 10:18:01 PM |
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osprey wrote:
The only reason I mentioned LSD was because at the time, it was the
only drug I could think of as an example for a drug that shouldn't ever
be legal to use. I used the example of pilots, police officers,
doctors, ect...
These people should also not drink on the job and for the exact same
reason. The difference between the things (other than one of them being
illegal) is that LSD isn't addictive and has no long lasting side
effects (diseased liver, brain cell loss) like alcohol does.
--
L'Chaim
Miriam
In the beginning
the Word already was.
.
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| User: "thomas p" |
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| Title: Re: God and the law |
25 Jun 2006 10:01:11 AM |
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On Thu, 22 Jun 2006 20:18:01 -0700, Miriam Cohen
<mimiNOSPAMgal@cox.net> wrote:
osprey wrote:
The only reason I mentioned LSD was because at the time, it was the
only drug I could think of as an example for a drug that shouldn't ever
be legal to use. I used the example of pilots, police officers,
doctors, ect...
These people should also not drink on the job and for the exact same
reason. The difference between the things (other than one of them being
illegal) is that LSD isn't addictive and has no long lasting side
effects (diseased liver, brain cell loss) like alcohol does.
And it's a great deal cheaper.
Thomas P.
"Life must be lived forwards but understood backwards"
(Kierkegaard)
.
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