| Topic: |
Science > Abortion |
| User: |
"IBen Getiner" |
| Date: |
09 May 2004 01:48:09 AM |
| Object: |
Hell is the absence of reason.. |
http://www.priestsforlife.org/resources/abortionimages/10week/01_10.jpg
http://www.priestsforlife.org/resources/abortionimages/11week/02_11.jpg
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| User: "Patrick Lee Humphrey" |
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| Title: Re: Hell is the absence of reason.. |
09 May 2004 02:09:12 AM |
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(IBen Getiner) writes:
http://[the usual *****]
....and as usual, you go out of your way to prove it beyond a shadow of a
doubt. Just because you chose your course of suicide doesn't oblige anyone to
follow suit.
--
Patrick "The Chief Instigator" Humphrey (patrick@io.com) Houston, Texas
www.chiefinstigator.us.tt/aeros.php (TCI's 2003-04 Houston Aeros)
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| User: "Mark Sebree" |
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| Title: Re: Hell is the absence of reason.. |
10 May 2004 01:40:51 PM |
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(IBen Getiner) wrote in message news:<396a5984.0405082248.98916e7@posting.google.com>...
So, that means that you are going straight to Hell, since you have
shown a complete lack of the ability to reason?
Mark Sebree
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| User: "IBen Getiner" |
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| Title: Re: Hell is the absence of reason.. |
11 May 2004 02:25:02 AM |
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Subject: Re: Hell is the absence of reason..
From: (Mark Sebree)
Date: 5/10/04 2:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: <c30d43e8.0405101040.3bb16491@posting.google.com>
Lappcatt@aol.com (IBen Getiner) wrote in message
news:<396a5984.0405082248.98916e7@posting.google.com>...
So, that means that you are going straight to Hell, since you have
shown a complete lack of the ability to reason?
Mark Sebree
(Mark Sebree) wrote in message
news:<c30d43e8.0405101040.3bb16491@posting.google.com>...
Lappcatt@aol.com (IBen Getiner) wrote in message
news:<396a5984.0405082248.98916e7@posting.google.com>...
So, that means that you are going straight to Hell, since you have
shown a complete lack of the ability to reason?
Mark Sebree
The devil is the father of lies, Mark. How do you expect that I might reason
with you...?
IBen G.
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| User: "Mark Sebree" |
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| Title: Re: Hell is the absence of reason.. |
11 May 2004 03:45:21 PM |
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(IBen Getiner) wrote in message news:<20040511032502.17672.00000730@mb-m23.aol.com>...
Subject: Re: Hell is the absence of reason..
From: (Mark Sebree)
Date: 5/10/04 2:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: <c30d43e8.0405101040.3bb16491@posting.google.com>
Lappcatt@aol.com (IBen Getiner) wrote in message
news:<396a5984.0405082248.98916e7@posting.google.com>...
So, that means that you are going straight to Hell, since you have
shown a complete lack of the ability to reason?
Mark Sebree
The devil is the father of lies, Mark.
You should know, since you follow that mythical figure so ardently and
tell so many lies.
How do you expect that I might reason
with you...?
IBen G.
Because I am intelligent, well educated, open minded, tolerant, broad
minded, well read, strong willed, independent, thoughtful,
considerate, compassionate, and very reasonable.
Basically, your complete opposite.
However, you are not interested in reasoning with me. You want to
shove your intolerant and hateful position down my throat and force me
to live according to your dictates. This is clearly evident in your
posting history. Quite frankly, I am not even sure that you are even
capable of reasoned thought.
Mark Sebree
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| User: "IBen Getiner" |
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| Title: Re: Hell is the absence of reason.. |
11 May 2004 09:48:08 PM |
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(Mark Sebree) wrote in message
news:<c30d43e8.0405111245.30d46ee6@posting.google.com>...
lappcatt@aol.com (IBen Getiner) wrote in message
news:<20040511032502.17672.00000730@mb-m23.aol.com>...
Subject: Re: Hell is the absence of reason..
From: (Mark Sebree)
Date: 5/10/04 2:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: <c30d43e8.0405101040.3bb16491@posting.google.com>
Lappcatt@aol.com (IBen Getiner) wrote in message
news:<396a5984.0405082248.98916e7@posting.google.com>...
So, that means that you are going straight to Hell, since you have
shown a complete lack of the ability to reason?
Mark Sebree
The devil is the father of lies, Mark.
You should know, since you follow that mythical figure so ardently and
tell so many lies.
But you see... to those like YOU, the truth is a lie and the lie is the truth.
Jesus said that satan is the father of lies and that there is no truth in him.
And that when he told a lie, it was second nature for him to do so. THAT is
YOU. It's your life. What else can it be?
How do you expect that I might reason
with you...?
IBen G.
Because I am intelligent, well educated, open minded, tolerant, broad
minded, well read, strong willed, independent, thoughtful,
considerate, compassionate, and very reasonable.
Ahh... A legend in your own mind. Who told you all these things, Mark...?
YOU..?? Or maybe it was your..... boyfriend. Only I can make those distinctions
about you at this point. No one else's opinion matters to me here and now.
Basically, your complete opposite.
Like I said, your father is the father of lies. Mine is Jehovah God. The father
of truth and eternal peace. You're the one who wants to MURDER MURDER MURDER
MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER
MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER
MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER all God's unborn children.
And YOU support those who do.
You're the murderer. Not me. Don't forget that, because I won't.
However, you are not interested in reasoning with me.
IOW: leaving me alone to do whatever evil I choose.
You want to
shove your intolerant and hateful position down my throat and force me
to live according to your dictates.
What do you have against the law? If we eventually win, and we will... it'll be
LAW. Face it... YOU just want the latitude to DO AS YOU PLEASE. Something every
selfish person down thru the ages has wanted to do.
We call them 'criminals', by the way, Mark. These selfish people who proceed
onward with their selfish plans, unfettered by those who they might hurt along
the way. That also means that you are a sociopath, Mark. That's what that
means. Anyone who can't see beyond themselves to a point where they can see the
devastation that they bring onto other's lives as a result is a SICKo. That's
you Mark.
This is clearly evident in your
posting history.
Oh, I see.... I have the blacks pegged. I have the faggots pegged. I have the
child-killers pegged. I have the atheists pegged. I have the god-hating
liberals pegged. In other words, all the EVIL VILE REFUSE of this world, I have
pegged for what it is, and people like YOU don't like it!
Well... TUFF. Can't shut all of us up with your PC *****.
Quite frankly, I am not even sure that you are even
capable of reasoned thought.
Mark Sebree
We will never communicate, you and I. This is because I am a human being and
you are a sociopathic ANIMAL. Reptile-brained jerk.
I hope I have been abler to COMMUNICATE my feelingz to you, Mark. I hope that
at least THAT much has been accomplished. I think so. Yes indeed.
Now let's see how long it takes for the devil to ***** it up.
IBen
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| User: "Flower Power" |
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| Title: Re: Hell is the absence of reason.. |
12 May 2004 12:18:24 AM |
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"IBen Getiner" <lappcatt@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040511224808.12117.00000078@mb-m26.aol.com...
Oh, I see.... I have the blacks pegged. I have the faggots pegged. I have
the
child-killers pegged. I have the atheists pegged. I have the god-hating
liberals pegged. In other words, all the EVIL VILE REFUSE of this world, I
have
pegged for what it is, and people like YOU don't like it!
Well... TUFF. Can't shut all of us up with your PC *****.
=================================
Are you a card carrying member of the KKK? Do you burn crosses on people's
lawns and draw swastikas on Synagogues?
What happened in your life to make you so miserable and filled with hate?
--
BTW,.... I'm PRO-CHOICE! :-)
Flower Power...
pro-choice (pr-chois)
adj.
Favoring or supporting the legal right of women and girls to choose
whether or not to continue a pregnancy to term.
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=Pro-Choice
~~~<~~~<~~~{@ ~~~<~~~<~~~{@ ~~~<~~~<~~~{@ ~~~<~~~{@
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| User: "Mizzyandrea" |
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| Title: Re: Hell is the absence of reason.. |
12 May 2004 12:26:28 AM |
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Are you a card carrying member of the KKK? Do you burn crosses on people's
lawns and draw swastikas on Synagogues?
What happened in your life to make you so miserable and filled with hate?
-- ***************************************
A mouse bit off his ***** when he was born
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| User: "Loose Cannon" |
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| Title: Re: Hell is the absence of reason.. |
12 May 2004 08:34:52 AM |
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"IBen Getiner" <lappcatt@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040511224808.12117.00000078@mb-m26.aol.com...
LabRatt's delusional posturing mercifully snipped<
Now let's see how long it takes for the devil to ***** it up.
IBen
http://www.nami.org/
LC~ Hopes that "Jon Young" can drive "IBen" to the nearest psych ward, and
soonest.
"Ordinarily he was insane, but he had lucid moments when he was merely
stupid."~Heinrich Heine
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| User: "Mark Sebree" |
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| Title: Re: Hell is the absence of reason.. |
12 May 2004 10:59:03 AM |
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(IBen Getiner) wrote in message news:<20040511224808.12117.00000078@mb-m26.aol.com>...
(Mark Sebree) wrote in message
news:<c30d43e8.0405111245.30d46ee6@posting.google.com>...
(IBen Getiner) wrote in message
news:<20040511032502.17672.00000730@mb-m23.aol.com>...
Subject: Re: Hell is the absence of reason..
From: (Mark Sebree)
Date: 5/10/04 2:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: <c30d43e8.0405101040.3bb16491@posting.google.com>
Lappcatt@aol.com (IBen Getiner) wrote in message
news:<396a5984.0405082248.98916e7@posting.google.com>...
So, that means that you are going straight to Hell, since you have
shown a complete lack of the ability to reason?
Mark Sebree
The devil is the father of lies, Mark.
You should know, since you follow that mythical figure so ardently and
tell so many lies.
But you see... to those like YOU, the truth is a lie and the lie is the truth.
Sorry, but all I have seen from you is blatent lies, and a desire to
control others.
Jesus said that satan is the father of lies and that there is no truth in him.
And your follow satan.
And that when he told a lie, it was second nature for him to do so. THAT is
YOU. It's your life.
Sorry, but you are completely wrong there. I do not follow any deity.
Unlike you, I can think for myself.
What else can it be?
You follow satan. You lie constantly. You desire to harm others.
You are a bigot, filled with hatred and intolerance for others.
How do you expect that I might reason
with you...?
IBen G.
Because I am intelligent, well educated, open minded, tolerant, broad
minded, well read, strong willed, independent, thoughtful,
considerate, compassionate, and very reasonable.
Ahh... A legend in your own mind.
Better than you. I can actually back up what I say.
Who told you all these things, Mark...?
My life. IQ: 141 tested. Master of Science from Purdue University in
Computer Science. All the rest are evidence from my posts. One thing
that I did not add, Honorably Discharged Veteran, U.S. Navy.
YOU..?? Or maybe it was your..... boyfriend.
What boyfriend? I and heterosexual. And actually, it was former
GIRLFRIENDS and female friends that have said that. And before you
ask, I am still friends with my former girlfriends. In fact, I will
be attending one's wedding in a month. I have never had a breakup
that was based in anger, only long term incompatibility for romantic
involvement. Somehow, I doubt that you can say the same thing.
Only I can make those distinctions
about you at this point.
WRONG. You are a very biased person, so you cannot present an
unbiased judgement of another. The distinctions are made by everyone.
I can clearly see the difference in out posting styles and out
positions. Your position is filled with hatred and intolerance. You
demand that others follow your commands without giving sufficient
reasons why they should. You make very bigotted and hateful
statements about others. You make hateful accusations against people
instead of addressing their position and arguments in a reasonable and
intelligent fashion. You are helping the pro-choice position with
every post that you make because people do not want to be associated
with such hatred and intolerance.
Like I said, I am your complete opposite.
No one else's opinion matters to me here and now.
Nobody's opinion ever matters to you. For that matter, the facts
don't matter to you.
Basically, your complete opposite.
Like I said, your father is the father of lies.
No, my father is an architect in Indiana with his own, successful
business.
Mine is Jehovah God. The father
of truth and eternal peace.
If that is true, then why do you constantly lie and promote hatred and
intolerance, which leads to violence and destruction? You might want
to double check the sign on the door and your mythological figure's
ID. They probably do not match.
You're the one who wants to MURDER MURDER MURDER
MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER
MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER
MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER MURDER all God's unborn children.
And yet, not only does abortion NOT fulfill the requirements of
murder, you are comnpletely ignoring the rights of the woman. The
woman has the right to decide for herself what uses her body may be
put to. She is under no obligation to suffer the physical and
emotional torture of an unwanted pregnancy, as well as financial
attendant hardship, just because you want her to.
After all, you do not respect her opinions and beliefs, so why should
she pay any attention to yours?
And YOU support those who do.
Sorry, but I do not support murderers or terrorists. That is why I am
pro-choice.
You're the murderer.
The report me to the police. I am from Fort Wayne, IN, and I use my
real name. If you think that I am a murderer, by law you are required
to report me to the police, along with all your evidence in your
possession that supports your claim.
However, I am willing to bet that you do not report me, because you
know that your accusation is a lie, and making false police reports is
a crime known as perjury. So, you lose either way. If you report me,
your lies are exposed. If you don't report me, your lies are exposed.
Not me. Don't forget that, because I won't.
You are the one that promotes slavery, intolerance, bigotry, and war.
You are the one that is filled with hate and constantly lies.
Quite frankly, I couldn't care less if you remember your opinion of me
or not, because it is only your opinion, and it does not coincide with
the facts.
However, you are not interested in reasoning with me.
IOW: leaving me alone to do whatever evil I choose.
No, I have seen you post before. In this reply to me, you are not
trying to reason at all. You are just lobbing insults right and left.
You are demanding that I cowtow to your opinions without giving any
reasons for me doing so.
Also, you have failed to show that defending women's rights to make
their own decisions about their own bodies is "evil". Howvever, you
have shown that you are evil quite clearly.
You want to
shove your intolerant and hateful position down my throat and force me
to live according to your dictates.
What do you have against the law?
Nothing whatsoever. After all, if you check above, I tell you to obey
the law and your beliefs, and report me for "murder", "conspiracy to
commit murder", and/or "aiding and abetting murder". I am betting
that you will not.
If we eventually win, and we will... it'll be LAW.
Only for as long as it takes to get that irrational and idiotic law
overturned, again. And that decision is likely to be a stronger one
than Row vs. Wade.
Face it... YOU just want the latitude to DO AS YOU PLEASE.
Like YOU are doing. As the Wiccan Creed states, "As it harms none, do
as thou will".
Something every
selfish person down thru the ages has wanted to do.
So, you are admitting that you are selfish. We already knew that. It
is clearly evident in your posts.
We call them 'criminals', by the way, Mark.
No, we call them "human" and "people". "Criminals" are people that
break the law and harm other people for their own gain. They harm
others physically and emotionally and violate the victim's civil and
personal rights.
Note that an unwanted embryo or fetus can be considered a "criminal"
in this definition. It is assaulting the woman very physically. It
is stealing her body's resources, and using her body without the
woman's permission. (And the permission to use a person's body can be
withdrawn at any time. That is why it is considered rape or sexual
assault if a person changes his or her mind during sex, and the
partner does not stop.) The embryo or fetus also affects the woman's
health, and causes her long term to permanent physical damage, in
addition to short term physical harm. The embryo and fetus also pumps
foreign substances into her body, causing physical changes and
emotional changes.
If a woman does not accept the pregnancy voluntarily, then she should
not be forced to endure it.
If what was done by an embryo or fetus was done by any person, you
would have no problem with that person being harmed, or even killed if
that is what it took, by the woman or a third party in order to make
that attacker stop. Given that this is true, why does a embryo or
fetus get more rights than any person, including the right to use the
woman's body in any way the it sees fit without the woman's
permission?
These selfish people who proceed
onward with their selfish plans, unfettered by those who they might hurt along
the way.
You mean like you do. You selfishly promote that people should suffer
because you say so, but you are not required to suffer in any similar
way. You think that people should accept you opinion without anything
to back those opinions up, but you are not willing to That is
selfish.
That also means that you are a sociopath, Mark.
From Dictionary.com:
Sociopath:
One who is affected with a personality disorder marked by antisocial
behavior
Interesting. That seems to describe you far more than it describes
me. I have not exibited any antisocial behavior, and you have
exibited a great deal of it.
That's what that
means. Anyone who can't see beyond themselves to a point where they can see the
devastation that they bring onto other's lives as a result is a SICKo.
Like you do. You cannot see beyond yourself, your own beliefs, and
your own opinions. You cannot see the devastation that an unwanted
pregnancy can do to woman, and the ruin that it can make in their
lives. You cannot see that being forced to continue an unwanted
pregnancy can be a devasting experience for the woman, and it can
destroy hopes, dreams, and plans for her own future. And if she is
forced to raise this unwanted child, that leads to further and
continuing devastation, not only to her own life, but to the child's,
and probably to the child's descendants.
By your own statement, you are the one that is a "sicko", since you
are the one that wants to bring devastation to other people's lives.
What's more, you have not shown any devastation that I bring to anyone
else's lives. So I do not fulfill your own definition of a "sicko".
That's
you Mark.
Correction, that it you. You have not shown that I devestate anyone's
life.
This is clearly evident in your
posting history.
Oh, I see.... I have the blacks pegged.
Somehow, I doubt it.
I have the faggots pegged.
I seriously doubt it.
I have the child-killers pegged.
If you mean pro-choice people, I know that this is false.
I have the atheists pegged.
I seriously doubt it.
I have the god-hating liberals pegged.
And I know that this is false as well. For one thing, liberals do not
hate "god", they just accept that other people have different beliefs
and worship in different manners. And therefore, since this country
has a little thing called "Freedom of Religion", they also don't want
anyone, particularly those in public, authoritative positions, to
force his or her personal beliefs on other people, particularly those
under them.
For example, how would you feel if you were forced to sit quietly
while your boss opened every meeting with Hindu prayers? Or your
school started every school day that way?
In other words, all the EVIL VILE REFUSE of this world, I have
pegged for what it is, and people like YOU don't like it!
Actually, You are the evil and vile refuse of this world. You and
other bigots and hate mongers. It is unlikely that you have anyone
"pegged". You think that everyone should accept your opinion just
because it is your opinion. You are unwilling to accept other people
as their are, and learn the variety in the world. Every time you
post, you help the parties that you post against, because nobody wants
to be associated with you or your intolerance and hatred.
Well... TUFF. Can't shut all of us up with your PC *****.
Actually, it is you that is trying to shut people up. I want you to
speak, because why you do, you harm your own position with your
intolerance, bigotry, and irrational hatred.
Quite frankly, I am not even sure that you are even
capable of reasoned thought.
Mark Sebree
We will never communicate, you and I.
That I already know. All you have is anger and hatred. You are
incapable of reason, or presenting a reasonable and fact based
argument to someone that opposes you. What's more, you are incapable
of showing an opponent any respct. All you are capable of are
personal attacks, filled with bile and hatred.
This is because I am a human being and
you are a sociopathic ANIMAL. Reptile-brained jerk.
Then why are you the one that has come across as a sociopathic animal
and a reptile-brained jerk, and I am the one that comes across as a
reasonable and well educated human being? After all, you are the one
calling me names and flinging hate filled insults, not me. That
suggests that you are the one that is not in control of your emotions.
I hope I have been abler to COMMUNICATE my feelingz to you, Mark.
Yes, your hatred, irrationality, intolerance, and bigotry were quite
clear.
I hope that
at least THAT much has been accomplished. I think so. Yes indeed.
Yes, it was. And that is why I would never voluntarily associate with
you in real life. Your hatred, intolerance, and bigotry is something
that I find most repugnant.
Now let's see how long it takes for the devil to ***** it up.
IBen
You spent your entire post "fucking it up", so I would say "no time at
all". If you thought that I would respond to your post in a manner
similar to yours, sorry to disappoint you. I do not let my emotions,
particularly anger, rule or overrule my mind or my common sense. Like
I said in my previous post, I am your complete opposite, and your post
demonstrates that better than I ever could.
Mark Sebree
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| User: "Alan" |
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| Title: Re: Hell is the absence of reason.. |
10 May 2004 05:22:06 PM |
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(IBen Getiner)AKA (Jon Young)
AKA (Hate Feminism) AKA (Osprey) wrote in message news:
<396a5984.0405082248.98916e7@posting.google.com>...
http://www.priestsforlife.org/resources/abortionimages/10week/01_10.jpg
http://www.priestsforlife.org/resources/abortionimages/11week/02_11.jpg
Hey IBen! My man!
You sneaky little irrelevant you. Sneakin around with all these alias
names.
You've decided to show up as the IBen I see.
Pretty cool pictures you got there my freind.
They might mean something if you weren't irrelevant.
You see IBen, no one gives a ***** about a liar.
Furthermore IBen, no one can actually be sure if those pictures are
authentic.
Certainly if one cannot trust the identity of the presentor then how
can one trust the presentation.
No defense to the contrary of the truth my friend.
You lose again.
Your everpresent pain in the *****
Alan C.
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| User: "quibbler" |
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| Title: Re: Hell is the absence of reason.. |
09 May 2004 08:21:17 AM |
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In article <396a5984.0405082248.98916e7@posting.google.com>,
Lappcatt@aol.com says...
If hell is the absence of reason then all religious people are going to
hell. They spend their whole lives appealing to blind faith, rather
than reason.
--
Quibbler (quibbler247atyahoo.com)
"It is fashionable to wax apocalyptic about the
threat to humanity posed by the AIDS virus, 'mad cow'
disease, and many others, but I think a case can be
made that faith is one of the world's great evils,
comparable to the smallpox virus but harder to
eradicate." -- Richard Dawkins
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| User: "Beate123" |
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| Title: Re: Hell is the absence of reason.. |
09 May 2004 08:33:45 AM |
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quibbler wrote:
In article <396a5984.0405082248.98916e7@posting.google.com>,
Lappcatt@aol.com says...
If hell is the absence of reason then all religious people are going to
hell. They spend their whole lives appealing to blind faith, rather
than reason.
Well said.
And I have to say I feel far more sympathy for an abused and killed pet
than an aborted fetus of the size of a thumb. A pet is just so much more
of a sophisticated and highly-developed organism.
Beate
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| User: "Flower Power" |
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| Title: Re: Hell is the absence of reason.. |
09 May 2004 10:47:35 AM |
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"Beate123" <beatchen1@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c7lbup$7fn$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk...
quibbler wrote:
In article <396a5984.0405082248.98916e7@posting.google.com>,
Lappcatt@aol.com says...
If hell is the absence of reason then all religious people are going to
hell. They spend their whole lives appealing to blind faith, rather
than reason.
Well said.
And I have to say I feel far more sympathy for an abused and killed pet
than an aborted fetus of the size of a thumb. A pet is just so much more
of a sophisticated and highly-developed organism.
Beate
================================
These anti-choicers keep talking about god, hell etc. If there was a god
he/she/it sure wouldn't send one of these so-called unwanted "blessings" to
women/teens who don't want them, are too young to be mothers or who already
have several kids and can't afford any more. How come they never think of
that?
--
FP.....
"Men never do evil so completely and
cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
~ Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ~
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| User: "Beate123" |
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| Title: Re: Hell is the absence of reason.. |
09 May 2004 11:18:58 AM |
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Flower Power wrote:
"Beate123" <beatchen1@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c7lbup$7fn$1@news8.svr.pol.co.uk...
quibbler wrote:
In article <396a5984.0405082248.98916e7@posting.google.com>,
Lappcatt@aol.com says...
If hell is the absence of reason then all religious people are going to
hell. They spend their whole lives appealing to blind faith, rather
than reason.
Well said.
And I have to say I feel far more sympathy for an abused and killed pet
than an aborted fetus of the size of a thumb. A pet is just so much more
of a sophisticated and highly-developed organism.
Beate
================================
These anti-choicers keep talking about god, hell etc. If there was a god
he/she/it sure wouldn't send one of these so-called unwanted "blessings" to
women/teens who don't want them, are too young to be mothers or who already
have several kids and can't afford any more. How come they never think of
that?
Because they've got their heads stuffed with sectarian *****, and
that obviously keeps people from thinking straight.
Beate
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