| Topic: |
Science > Abortion |
| User: |
"Immortalist" |
| Date: |
28 Mar 2005 01:41:03 PM |
| Object: |
Is Schiavo aware of everything going on? |
"...I was totally trapped in my body, aware of everything going on around
me, unable to communicate with the outside world. I had to live through the
horror of having a feeding tube inserted without enough anesthesia, so I
felt everything being done to me, could not say anything. That feeding tube
was turned off for eight days. I laid there and literally thought I was
going insane. My body was screaming out. I'm on the inside screaming out,
don't let me die. I don't want to die..."
-----------------------------
Withdrawal of food and water was "one of the most painful experiences you
can imagine"
http://www.lifesite.net/ldn/2005/mar/05031408.html
Eight years ago, Adamson was lying in a U.S. hospital intensive care unit
after a near-fatal brainstem stroke. Doctors described her as being in a
"vegetative" state.
Unable to move or communicate, yet fully aware and sensitive to hunger and
pain, the 33-year-old, New Zealand-born athlete and mother of two heard
people around her discussing her condition, whether she should undergo
surgery - and her death.
"It was terrifying," she recalls. "It the loneliest thing you could imagine.
I had to find some way to be able to let people know I could understand what
was going on around me. I was completely paralyzed."
Adamson was also acutely aware on the day she underwent surgery - without
sufficient anesthetic - to have a feeding tube inserted.
"I was aware of what was going on around me, hearing the chit chat between
the doctor and the nurse," she told CNSNews.com from her Los Angeles home.
"It's a difficult place for me to revisit and the horror of having to live
through that ... I could only endure and survive and pray that I could
somehow live through it."
In Florida, Terri Schiavo was not fed for...
http://www.cnsnews.com/Culture/Archive/200312/CUL20031201a.html
Kate Adamson, in 1995, at age 33, suffered a devastating double brain stem
stroke that left her paralyzed. She not only survived, she made what has
been called a miraculous recovery, regaining mobility and function. She's
the author of the book "Kate's Journey: Triumph Over Adversity." I have the
book right here.
And, now -- but you were not brain dead, were you? You weren't in a
vegetative state?
KATE ADAMSON, AUTHOR, RECOVERED FROM DOUBLE BRAIN-STEM STROKE: Well, first
of all, my husband wouldn't let me be labeled with anything. You've got a
woman here who is being labeled as in a persistent vegetative state. I think
based on what's going on, we need to find out what she can and can't do. I
had less than one in a million odds to survive. My husband hugged the
doctor, he said, praise God, she's going to be the one. He did everything
possible to see that I got the necessary care. He was fighting...
KING: Now, Michael did that, though, for six years. He sued a doctor over
malfeasance with regard to his wife. This -- it was after six years that
he... Right? I mean, he did.
ADAMSON: Larry, I was totally trapped in my body, aware of everything going
on around me, unable to communicate with the outside world. I had to live
through the horror of having a feeding tube inserted without enough
anesthesia, so I felt everything being done to me, could not say anything.
That feeding tube was turned off for eight days. I laid there and literally
thought I was going insane. My body was screaming out. I'm on the inside
screaming out, don't let me die. I don't want to die.
KING: That's amazing.
ADAMSON: Yes, but what's amazing is, I got into rehab. You're looking at a
woman been lying in a hospice in a nursing facility. You've shut me off from
the sunlight, with no human contact, no radio, no TV. I had to have contact.
I had to hear that I was going to survive.
KING: Therefore, are you saying, in a sense, Kate, with your miraculous --
no one should be allowed to die.
ADAMSON: Err on the side of life. Err on the side of life.
KING: In all cases? Even with a living will?
ADAMSON: First of all, at 33, I wasn't thinking about dying. I was thinking
about living.
KING: But you were not, in all cases.
ADAMSON: Every case is different. This is a feeding tube. We're not
talking -- I was on life support.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0503/24/lkl.01.html
Adamson said Terri is "labeled in a persistent vegetative state," but no one
has given her the opportunity "to see what she can do and cannot do." She
said, "When I had the opportunity to get into rehab, I had to be the one to
do the work." She said she had "ten years of rehab." She said "Terri was
once beautiful and of course, when you push someone aside, they're going to
lose their looks and appeal." She said she was "lying there, totally trapped
in my body. I was actually aware but nobody thought I was in there. They
didn't know what I was aware of."
http://www.newshounds.us/2005/03/22/forget_the_facts_its_about_distortion_spin.php
One has to wonder how many people are aware, but locked in, and never
emerge, as Kate has done, to tell their stories. A recent study (Dr.
Nicholas Schiff, et al, published in Neurology) suggests that there may be
far more awareness than previously thought in patients who are thought to be
minimally conscious or in a vegetative state. Using the latest fMRI
technology to measure brain response to stimuli, the researchers found that
minimally conscious patients, while lacking in other areas of brain
function, responded almost identically to normal subjects to the voices of
relatives telling stories of shared experiences. There were even indications
of activity in the brain's visual processing areas of a patient with his
eyes closed, listening to his sister's voice. This could be an indication
that he was forming mental images as he heard her speak.
http://www.discardedlies.com/entries/2005/03/kate_adamson_speaks_out_on_terri.php
http://commonsenserunswild.typepad.com/common_sense_runs_wild/2005/02/fighting_to_sav.html
http://myopiczeal.blogsome.com/2005/03/23/kate-adamsons-story/
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| User: "Lazarus" |
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| Title: Re: Is Schiavo aware of everything going on? |
28 Mar 2005 03:43:08 PM |
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"Immortalist" <Reanimater_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:jbCdnRc6QaNSwNXfRVn-hw@adelphia.com...
[--Kate Adamson--]
A couple of points here: Adamson's stroke attacked her brain stem, not her
cerebral cortex, which was intact. Schiavo's heart stoppage deprived her
brain of oxygen and started a degenerative process that led to her not
having a cerebral cortex at all. So Adamson had the capacity to be aware of
her condition and her surroundings. Schiavo has had no such capacity for
several years.
And as compelling as Adamson's story is, I sincerely doubt that Schiavo
would be better off in her parents' custody.
.
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| User: "G*rd*n" |
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| Title: Re: Is Schiavo aware of everything going on? |
28 Mar 2005 04:57:40 PM |
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"Immortalist" <Reanimater_2000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:jbCdnRc6QaNSwNXfRVn-hw@adelphia.com...
[--Kate Adamson--]
"Lazarus" <no.spam@this.address>:
A couple of points here: Adamson's stroke attacked her brain stem, not her
cerebral cortex, which was intact. Schiavo's heart stoppage deprived her
brain of oxygen and started a degenerative process that led to her not
having a cerebral cortex at all. So Adamson had the capacity to be aware of
her condition and her surroundings. Schiavo has had no such capacity for
several years.
And as compelling as Adamson's story is, I sincerely doubt that Schiavo
would be better off in her parents' custody.
If she's really brain-dead, then it won't make any
difference, will it?
This is sort of like the Pope dying. There are evidently
millions of people who want to have some kind of _feeling_
about something, but they can't work it up for anyone they
know, anyone down the street they might actually be called
upon to do anything for, but they can go to the TV and there's
someone or something they can get all worked up about cleanly
and safely. Why not turn this body over to them to play with?
Hmmm. How shall we dress Terri today?
Congress is involved. So bring it and its life-support
system to Washington and have it "testify" before various
committees and appear at a Prayer Breakfast with George
W. Bush.
And then there's the Jerry Springer show....
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| User: "G*rd*n" |
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| Title: Re: Is Schiavo aware of everything going on? |
28 Mar 2005 02:31:37 PM |
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Anything like this is a tough call. Yes, the person could be
trapped inside her body, wanting to live and being unable to
communicate. Or wanting to die, and being unable to communicate.
Or not really there at all.
What we need to do to solve this very difficult problem is
for Usenetters, with their long- and well-known assets of
infinite, absolute knowledge, incisive and accurate logic,
and all-ecompassing compassion, to step into the breach and
let everyone know what they should do, from the immediate
family and the doctors actually on the case, all the way
down to the dog in the yard, Congress in its pen, and G. W.
Bush howling at the electoral moon. I'm sure everyone is
waiting for our verdict!
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| User: "Joshua Holmes" |
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| Title: Re: Is Schiavo aware of everything going on? |
28 Mar 2005 02:44:33 PM |
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In alt.society.anarchy G*rd*n <gcf@panix.com> wrote:
: Anything like this is a tough call. Yes, the person could be
: trapped inside her body, wanting to live and being unable to
: communicate. Or wanting to die, and being unable to communicate.
: Or not really there at all.
:
: What we need to do to solve this very difficult problem is
: for Usenetters, with their long- and well-known assets of
: infinite, absolute knowledge, incisive and accurate logic,
: and all-ecompassing compassion, to step into the breach and
: let everyone know what they should do, from the immediate
: family and the doctors actually on the case, all the way
: down to the dog in the yard, Congress in its pen, and G. W.
: Bush howling at the electoral moon. I'm sure everyone is
: waiting for our verdict!
It's too bad Clinton isn't president any more. He never had any
problems getting a tube down a woman's throat.
--
Joshua Holmes
jdholmes@force.stwing.upenn.edu
Does a man tell you of sacrifice?
Beware, he intends to make you the bull.
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| User: "cat herder" |
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| Title: Re: Is Schiavo aware of everything going on? |
28 Mar 2005 03:45:26 PM |
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The tube is through her abdomen wall and is far less invasive
than a tube down the throat. It is actually almost unnoticeable
and allows people to get nutrition that they might not even be
able to get orally.
"Joshua Holmes" <> wrote in message
news:d29qbh$2ces$1@netnews.upenn.edu...
: In alt.society.anarchy G*rd*n <gcf@panix.com> wrote:
:: Anything like this is a tough call. Yes, the person could be
:: trapped inside her body, wanting to live and being unable to
:: communicate. Or wanting to die, and being unable to communicate.
:: Or not really there at all.
::
:: What we need to do to solve this very difficult problem is
:: for Usenetters, with their long- and well-known assets of
:: infinite, absolute knowledge, incisive and accurate logic,
:: and all-ecompassing compassion, to step into the breach and
:: let everyone know what they should do, from the immediate
:: family and the doctors actually on the case, all the way
:: down to the dog in the yard, Congress in its pen, and G. W.
:: Bush howling at the electoral moon. I'm sure everyone is
:: waiting for our verdict!
:
: It's too bad Clinton isn't president any more. He never had any
: problems getting a tube down a woman's throat.
:
: --
: Joshua Holmes
:
:
: Does a man tell you of sacrifice?
: Beware, he intends to make you the bull.
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| User: "cat herder" |
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| Title: Re: Is Schiavo aware of everything going on? |
28 Mar 2005 02:43:06 PM |
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What makes you think you or anyone else but
Terry's parents have a right to make the call?
Dumb *****, sorry but you are so blind it's not
funny.
The morons who make this a religious issue are
showing how narrow minded they are.
"G*rd*n" <gcf@panix.com> wrote in message
news:d29pj9$dh4$1@reader1.panix.com...
: Anything like this is a tough call. Yes, the person could be
: trapped inside her body, wanting to live and being unable to
: communicate. Or wanting to die, and being unable to communicate.
: Or not really there at all.
:
: What we need to do to solve this very difficult problem is
: for Usenetters, with their long- and well-known assets of
: infinite, absolute knowledge, incisive and accurate logic,
: and all-ecompassing compassion, to step into the breach and
: let everyone know what they should do, from the immediate
: family and the doctors actually on the case, all the way
: down to the dog in the yard, Congress in its pen, and G. W.
: Bush howling at the electoral moon. I'm sure everyone is
: waiting for our verdict!
:
.
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| User: "Bushwhacker" |
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| Title: Re: Is Schiavo aware of everything going on? |
29 Mar 2005 01:39:22 PM |
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If a Heaven exists, her soul has been there for 15 years, so no, she is not
aware of anything; no moreso than a rock or a dead embalmed corpse...
All she possesses is reflex.
--
"Being a soccer fan involves having a certain amount of undiagnosed brain
damage"
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| User: "Liberals,HATE-America.,;" |
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| Title: Re: Is Schiavo aware of everything going on? |
29 Mar 2005 02:48:27 PM |
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"Bushwhacker" <bushwhackerz0252@nospamyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:v4vbspyyq6d5$.r2ycmmavka0u$.dlg@40tude.net...
If a Heaven exists, her soul has been there for 15 years, so no, she is
not
aware of anything; no moreso than a rock or a dead embalmed corpse...
All she possesses is reflex.
And you know this how? 1500 babies being slaughtered every day is not enough
for you bloodthirsty liberals, is it? Hitler would be proud of you, killing
the disabled because they serve no useful purpose to you. That's just what
he did.
--
Liberals are EVERYTHING they accuse the right of being.
They are mean, vicious, hateful, greedy, cold-hearted, closed-minded,
selfish, intolerant, bigoted and racist.
www.liberalscum.com
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| User: "G*rd*n" |
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| Title: Re: Is Schiavo aware of everything going on? |
29 Mar 2005 03:40:05 PM |
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"Bushwhacker" <bushwhackerz0252@nospamyahoo.com> wrote in message
If a Heaven exists, her soul has been there for 15 years, so no, she is
not
aware of anything; no moreso than a rock or a dead embalmed corpse...
All she possesses is reflex.
"Liberals,HATE-America.,;" <kjbaskd7@liberal-R-scum1.org>:
And you know this how? 1500 babies being slaughtered every day is not enough
for you bloodthirsty liberals, is it? Hitler would be proud of you, killing
the disabled because they serve no useful purpose to you. That's just what
he did.
Yes, why kill the disabled when we can play with them?
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: Is Schiavo aware of everything going on? |
29 Mar 2005 11:21:39 PM |
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Liberals,HATE-America.,; <kjbaskd7@liberal-R-scum1.org> wrote:
"Bushwhacker" <bushwhackerz0252@nospamyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:v4vbspyyq6d5$.r2ycmmavka0u$.dlg@40tude.net...
If a Heaven exists, her soul has been there for 15 years, so no, she is
not
aware of anything; no moreso than a rock or a dead embalmed corpse...
All she possesses is reflex.
And you know this how? 1500 babies being slaughtered every day is not enough
for you bloodthirsty liberals, is it? Hitler would be proud of you, killing
the disabled because they serve no useful purpose to you. That's just what
See the screeching hate typical of the neofascist.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
.
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| User: "Frank Dwyer" |
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| Title: Re: Is Schiavo aware of everything going on? |
28 Mar 2005 02:19:38 PM |
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Immortalist wrote:
"...I was totally trapped in my body, aware of everything going on
around me, unable to communicate with the outside world. I had to live
through the horror of having a feeding tube inserted without enough
anesthesia, so I felt everything being done to me, could not say
anything. That feeding tube was turned off for eight days. I laid there
and literally thought I was going insane. My body was screaming out. I'm
on the inside screaming out, don't let me die. I don't want to die..."
-----------------------------
Withdrawal of food and water was "one of the most painful experiences
you can imagine"
http://www.lifesite.net/ldn/2005/mar/05031408.html
Eight years ago, Adamson was lying in a U.S. hospital intensive care
unit after a near-fatal brainstem stroke. Doctors described her as being
in a "vegetative" state.
Unable to move or communicate, yet fully aware and sensitive to hunger
and pain, the 33-year-old, New Zealand-born athlete and mother of two
heard people around her discussing her condition, whether she should
undergo surgery - and her death.
"It was terrifying," she recalls. "It the loneliest thing you could
imagine. I had to find some way to be able to let people know I could
understand what was going on around me. I was completely paralyzed."
Adamson was also acutely aware on the day she underwent surgery -
without sufficient anesthetic - to have a feeding tube inserted.
"I was aware of what was going on around me, hearing the chit chat
between the doctor and the nurse," she told CNSNews.com from her Los
Angeles home. "It's a difficult place for me to revisit and the horror
of having to live through that ... I could only endure and survive and
pray that I could somehow live through it."
In Florida, Terri Schiavo was not fed for...
http://www.cnsnews.com/Culture/Archive/200312/CUL20031201a.html
Kate Adamson, in 1995, at age 33, suffered a devastating double brain
stem stroke that left her paralyzed. She not only survived, she made
what has been called a miraculous recovery, regaining mobility and
function. She's the author of the book "Kate's Journey: Triumph Over
Adversity." I have the book right here.
And, now -- but you were not brain dead, were you? You weren't in a
vegetative state?
KATE ADAMSON, AUTHOR, RECOVERED FROM DOUBLE BRAIN-STEM STROKE: Well,
first of all, my husband wouldn't let me be labeled with anything.
You've got a woman here who is being labeled as in a persistent
vegetative state. I think based on what's going on, we need to find out
what she can and can't do. I had less than one in a million odds to
survive. My husband hugged the doctor, he said, praise God, she's going
to be the one. He did everything possible to see that I got the
necessary care. He was fighting...
KING: Now, Michael did that, though, for six years. He sued a doctor
over malfeasance with regard to his wife. This -- it was after six years
that he... Right? I mean, he did.
ADAMSON: Larry, I was totally trapped in my body, aware of everything
going on around me, unable to communicate with the outside world. I had
to live through the horror of having a feeding tube inserted without
enough anesthesia, so I felt everything being done to me, could not say
anything. That feeding tube was turned off for eight days. I laid there
and literally thought I was going insane. My body was screaming out. I'm
on the inside screaming out, don't let me die. I don't want to die.
KING: That's amazing.
ADAMSON: Yes, but what's amazing is, I got into rehab. You're looking at
a woman been lying in a hospice in a nursing facility. You've shut me
off from the sunlight, with no human contact, no radio, no TV. I had to
have contact. I had to hear that I was going to survive.
KING: Therefore, are you saying, in a sense, Kate, with your miraculous
-- no one should be allowed to die.
ADAMSON: Err on the side of life. Err on the side of life.
KING: In all cases? Even with a living will?
ADAMSON: First of all, at 33, I wasn't thinking about dying. I was
thinking about living.
KING: But you were not, in all cases.
ADAMSON: Every case is different. This is a feeding tube. We're not
talking -- I was on life support.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0503/24/lkl.01.html
Adamson said Terri is "labeled in a persistent vegetative state," but no
one has given her the opportunity "to see what she can do and cannot
do." She said, "When I had the opportunity to get into rehab, I had to
be the one to do the work." She said she had "ten years of rehab." She
said "Terri was once beautiful and of course, when you push someone
aside, they're going to lose their looks and appeal." She said she was
"lying there, totally trapped in my body. I was actually aware but
nobody thought I was in there. They didn't know what I was aware of."
http://www.newshounds.us/2005/03/22/forget_the_facts_its_about_distortion_spin.php
One has to wonder how many people are aware, but locked in, and never
emerge, as Kate has done, to tell their stories. A recent study (Dr.
Nicholas Schiff, et al, published in Neurology) suggests that there may
be far more awareness than previously thought in patients who are
thought to be minimally conscious or in a vegetative state. Using the
latest fMRI technology to measure brain response to stimuli, the
researchers found that minimally conscious patients, while lacking in
other areas of brain function, responded almost identically to normal
subjects to the voices of relatives telling stories of shared
experiences. There were even indications of activity in the brain's
visual processing areas of a patient with his eyes closed, listening to
his sister's voice. This could be an indication that he was forming
mental images as he heard her speak.
http://www.discardedlies.com/entries/2005/03/kate_adamson_speaks_out_on_terri.php
http://commonsenserunswild.typepad.com/common_sense_runs_wild/2005/02/fighting_to_sav.html
http://myopiczeal.blogsome.com/2005/03/23/kate-adamsons-story/
Her cerebral cortex was intact and functioning, it was her brain stem
that took the hit. That's the exact opposite of Terri's condition. (no
functioning cortex/ brain stem intact)
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| User: "Immortalist" |
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| Title: Re: Is Schiavo aware of everything going on? |
28 Mar 2005 01:43:17 PM |
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http://www.katesjourney.com/
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| User: "Shawn Hearn" |
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| Title: Re: Is Schiavo aware of everything going on? |
28 Mar 2005 10:10:55 PM |
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In article <65ydnalV5JXIw9XfRVn-qQ@adelphia.com>,
"Immortalist" <Reanimater_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
http://www.katesjourney.com/
Reposting the reference does not change the fact that you are comparing
apples with oranges.
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