Science > Abortion > Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay
| Topic: |
Science > Abortion |
| User: |
"J Young" |
| Date: |
20 Oct 2005 11:27:02 PM |
| Object: |
Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
This woman should claim that she was only exercising her "right to choose"
and have the ACLU represent her in court.
http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/breaking_news/12955752.htm
Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay
SAN FRANCISCO - A mentally ill woman seen dropping her three sons into San
Francisco Bay from a downtown pier was charged with three counts of murder
Thursday while anguished relatives kept vigil and rescuers combed the chilly
water for the bodies of two of the victims.
Lashuan T. Harris, 23, of Oakland, was held in a hospital jail ward after
police saw her pushing an empty baby stroller away from the pier where a
witness reported spotting a woman drop the children off the end Wednesday
night.
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| User: "Asmodeus bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
22 Oct 2005 04:32:46 PM |
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Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
news:3uall1dcqrmotnhpnvs5uv6tdr63iu27ee@4ax.com:
It is certain to keep her from killing any more.
They don't care. They're liberals. They love criminals, and
squealing about criminal rights.
--
/"\ ||
\ / ASCII RIBBON CAMPAIGN || Oderint Dum Metuant
X AGAINST HTML MAIL || VRWC Proud Life Member
/ \ AND POSTINGS || http://www.rightwingnation.com
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
24 Oct 2005 10:32:00 PM |
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Asmodeus <bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom> wrote:
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
news:3uall1dcqrmotnhpnvs5uv6tdr63iu27ee@4ax.com:
It is certain to keep her from killing any more.
They don't care. They're liberals.
And you're a ,urderous lunatic whose best solution to any problem
is more killing.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
24 Oct 2005 11:06:25 PM |
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Asmodeus <bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom> wrote:
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
news:3uall1dcqrmotnhpnvs5uv6tdr63iu27ee@4ax.com:
It is certain to keep her from killing any more.
They don't care. They're liberals.
And you're a murderous lunatic whose best solution to any problem
is more killing.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
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| User: "Pauline Barclay" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
22 Oct 2005 06:38:03 PM |
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On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 16:32:46 -0500, Asmodeus
<bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom> wrote:
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
news:3uall1dcqrmotnhpnvs5uv6tdr63iu27ee@4ax.com:
It is certain to keep her from killing any more.
They don't care. They're liberals. They love criminals, and
squealing about criminal rights.
I do care which is precisely why it's absolutely imperative to prove
that she can be held legally accountable for her crimes before the
state kills her.
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| User: "Paul Erickson" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
23 Oct 2005 04:18:41 PM |
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On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 11:23:58 -0500, Asmodeus
<bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom> wrote:
David Jensen <david@dajensen-family.com> wrote in
news:iv2jl15po07k958hute6nq90asekjk5qek@4ax.com:
it would be because they are profoundly
incapable of understanding the consequences at the time they did it.
How is that relevant? Three children have been murdered. Thrown
into the water and murdered. Those three children need justice,
and all the "mental disabilities" she may have don't change that.
The kids are dead, dude -- what else do they need beside justice? Some
candy?
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| User: "Asmodeus bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
24 Oct 2005 04:15:43 PM |
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Paul Erickson <prerickson@houston.rr.com> wrote in
news:mgvnl153a5qgfv9grn50ff906c8ko9mnh8@4ax.com:
The kids are dead, dude -- what else do they need beside justice?
Justice, not handwringing over a murderer who chose to go off
her meds and should be held accountable.
--
/"\ ||
\ / ASCII RIBBON CAMPAIGN || Oderint Dum Metuant
X AGAINST HTML MAIL || VRWC Proud Life Member
/ \ AND POSTINGS || http://www.rightwingnation.com
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| User: "Paul Erickson" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
24 Oct 2005 03:54:35 AM |
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On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 16:15:43 -0500, Asmodeus
<bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom> wrote:
Paul Erickson <prerickson@houston.rr.com> wrote in
news:mgvnl153a5qgfv9grn50ff906c8ko9mnh8@4ax.com:
The kids are dead, dude -- what else do they need beside justice?
Justice, not handwringing over a murderer who chose to go off
her meds and should be held accountable.
I think you're just a hateful troll, and I'll leave you to it.
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| User: "Asmodeus bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
25 Oct 2005 10:36:16 AM |
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Paul Erickson <prerickson@houston.rr.com> wrote in
news:g98pl1p3dcof637iv9729e52tvv49ekg14@4ax.com:
I think you're just a hateful troll
Ah, the liberal has nothing of substance.
--
/"\ ||
\ / ASCII RIBBON CAMPAIGN || Oderint Dum Metuant
X AGAINST HTML MAIL || VRWC Proud Life Member
/ \ AND POSTINGS || http://www.rightwingnation.com
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
25 Oct 2005 11:35:10 AM |
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Asmodeus <bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom> wrote:
Paul Erickson <prerickson@houston.rr.com> wrote in
I think you're just a hateful troll
Ah, the liberal has nothing of substance.
As opposed to your bloodthirsty wish to execute a woman for
no reason of any substance?
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
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| User: "David Jensen" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
22 Oct 2005 12:37:21 PM |
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On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 11:23:58 -0500, in alt.atheism
Asmodeus <bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom> wrote in
<Xns96F77E2352108bondcrightwingnation@216.196.97.142>:
David Jensen <david@dajensen-family.com> wrote in
news:iv2jl15po07k958hute6nq90asekjk5qek@4ax.com:
it would be because they are profoundly
incapable of understanding the consequences at the time they did it.
How is that relevant? Three children have been murdered. Thrown
into the water and murdered. Those three children need justice,
and all the "mental disabilities" she may have don't change that.
Killed, murder includes a state of mind.
Why does anyone need your form of 'justice' (which most people call
vengeance)? These children are dead. I know nothing about the mother and
her state of mind, but mothers seldom murder their children when they
are capable of recognizing the effects of their action. If, as may be
likely, she was incapable of recognizing what she was doing for what it
was, she cannot be convicted of murder. Apparently you are unaware that
the justice system America uses has long taken this into account and
does not punish people who are not responsible for their own actions
(though, sadly, many of the centers for the criminally insane were every
bit as bad as some of the worst prisons). I am not aware of any country
that does not take this into account.
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| User: "Asmodeus bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
22 Oct 2005 12:48:24 PM |
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David Jensen <david@dajensen-family.com> wrote in
news:n2tkl1pqts54ti6l0kgrdvrr9839p3o5e5@4ax.com:
Killed, murder includes a state of mind.
So you want to let her go, and to hell with the three murdered
children. Justice is justice. She deserves the death penalty,
no matter how many "disabilities" she has.
It's not about her. It's about those three children. How is
that hard to understand?
--
/"\ ||
\ / ASCII RIBBON CAMPAIGN || Oderint Dum Metuant
X AGAINST HTML MAIL || VRWC Proud Life Member
/ \ AND POSTINGS || http://www.rightwingnation.com
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| User: "Paul Erickson" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
23 Oct 2005 04:22:40 PM |
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On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 12:48:24 -0500, Asmodeus
<bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom> wrote:
David Jensen <david@dajensen-family.com> wrote in
news:n2tkl1pqts54ti6l0kgrdvrr9839p3o5e5@4ax.com:
Killed, murder includes a state of mind.
So you want to let her go, and to hell with the three murdered
children. Justice is justice. She deserves the death penalty,
no matter how many "disabilities" she has.
It's not about her. It's about those three children. How is
that hard to understand?
It's hard to understand because the kids are dead. Even if they are
still aware somewhere, do you think they want their mother to die if
she was suffering from a horrible illness at the time? You presume a
lot about what dead children need.
_They don't need justice, as far as I can tell, but -- perhaps -- _we
do. Or maybe you do.
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| User: "David Jensen" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
22 Oct 2005 01:01:24 PM |
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On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 12:48:24 -0500, in alt.atheism
Asmodeus <bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom> wrote in
<Xns96F78C7452FA3bondcrightwingnation@216.196.97.142>:
David Jensen <david@dajensen-family.com> wrote in
news:n2tkl1pqts54ti6l0kgrdvrr9839p3o5e5@4ax.com:
Killed, murder includes a state of mind.
So you want to let her go, and to hell with the three murdered
children. Justice is justice. She deserves the death penalty,
no matter how many "disabilities" she has.
Justice is justice. You are not advocating justice. You cannot name a
single jurisdiction in any developed country that would allow the
execution of a person who is clearly not responsible for their actions.
I doubt if you could find one anywhere in the world. No one but you
thinks that executing a crazy person has anything to do with justice.
It's not about her. It's about those three children. How is
that hard to understand?
That isn't what our justice system is about. What you are selling is a
truly hateful vengence.
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| User: "Therion Ware" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
22 Oct 2005 01:18:24 PM |
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On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 13:01:24 -0500 in alt.atheism, David Jensen
(David Jensen <david@dajensen-family.com>) said, directing the reply
to alt.atheism
On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 12:48:24 -0500, in alt.atheism
Asmodeus <bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom> wrote in
<Xns96F78C7452FA3bondcrightwingnation@216.196.97.142>:
David Jensen <david@dajensen-family.com> wrote in
news:n2tkl1pqts54ti6l0kgrdvrr9839p3o5e5@4ax.com:
Killed, murder includes a state of mind.
So you want to let her go, and to hell with the three murdered
children. Justice is justice. She deserves the death penalty,
no matter how many "disabilities" she has.
Justice is justice. You are not advocating justice. You cannot name a
single jurisdiction in any developed country that would allow the
execution of a person who is clearly not responsible for their actions.
Aside: Countries with the death penalty:
Afghanistan
Antigua and Barbuda
Bahamas
Bahrain
Bangladesh
Barbados
Belarus
Belize
Botswana
Burundi
Cameroon
Chad
China (People's Republic)
Comoros
Congo (Democratic Republic)
Cuba
Dominica
Egypt
Equatorial Guinea
Eritrea
Ethiopia
Gabon
Ghana
Guatemala
Guinea
Guyana
India
Indonesia
Iran
Iraq
Jamaica
Japan
Jordan
Kazakhstan
Korea, North
Korea, South
Kuwait
Kyrgyzstan
Laos
Lebanon
Lesotho
Liberia
Libya
Malawi
Malaysia
Mongolia
Nigeria
Oman
Pakistan
Palestinian Authority
Philippines
Qatar
Rwanda
St. Kitts and Nevis
St. Lucia
St. Vincent and the Grenadines
Saudi Arabia
Sierra Leone
Singapore
Somalia
Sudan
Swaziland
Syria
Taiwan
Tajikistan
Tanzania
Thailand
Trinidad and Tobago
Uganda
United Arab Emirates
United States
Uzbekistan
Vietnam
Yemen
Zambia
Zimbabwe
I doubt if you could find one anywhere in the world. No one but you
thinks that executing a crazy person has anything to do with justice.
It's not about her. It's about those three children. How is
that hard to understand?
That isn't what our justice system is about. What you are selling is a
truly hateful vengence.
.
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| User: "Attila" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
22 Oct 2005 04:14:22 PM |
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On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 19:18:24 +0100, Therion Ware
<autodelete@city-of-dis.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<mg0ll11t1gk36b0k0qqmine5c50bublm07@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 13:01:24 -0500 in alt.atheism, David Jensen
(David Jensen <david@dajensen-family.com>) said, directing the reply
to alt.atheism
On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 12:48:24 -0500, in alt.atheism
Asmodeus <bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom> wrote in
<Xns96F78C7452FA3bondcrightwingnation@216.196.97.142>:
David Jensen <david@dajensen-family.com> wrote in
news:n2tkl1pqts54ti6l0kgrdvrr9839p3o5e5@4ax.com:
Killed, murder includes a state of mind.
So you want to let her go, and to hell with the three murdered
children. Justice is justice. She deserves the death penalty,
no matter how many "disabilities" she has.
Justice is justice. You are not advocating justice. You cannot name a
single jurisdiction in any developed country that would allow the
execution of a person who is clearly not responsible for their actions.
Aside: Countries with the death penalty:
Afghanistan
Antigua and Barbuda
Bahamas
Bahrain
Bangladesh
Barbados
Belarus
Belize
Botswana
Burundi
Cameroon
Chad
China (People's Republic)
Comoros
Congo (Democratic Republic)
Cuba
Dominica
Egypt
Equatorial Guinea
Eritrea
Ethiopia
Gabon
Ghana
Guatemala
Guinea
Guyana
India
Indonesia
Iran
Iraq
Jamaica
Japan
Jordan
Kazakhstan
Korea, North
Korea, South
Kuwait
Kyrgyzstan
Laos
Lebanon
Lesotho
Liberia
Libya
Malawi
Malaysia
Mongolia
Nigeria
Oman
Pakistan
Palestinian Authority
Philippines
Qatar
Rwanda
St. Kitts and Nevis
St. Lucia
St. Vincent and the Grenadines
Saudi Arabia
Sierra Leone
Singapore
Somalia
Sudan
Swaziland
Syria
Taiwan
Tajikistan
Tanzania
Thailand
Trinidad and Tobago
Uganda
United Arab Emirates
United States
Uzbekistan
Vietnam
Yemen
Zambia
Zimbabwe
I am glad the US is still on the list.
I doubt if you could find one anywhere in the world. No one but you
thinks that executing a crazy person has anything to do with justice.
It's not about her. It's about those three children. How is
that hard to understand?
That isn't what our justice system is about. What you are selling is a
truly hateful vengence.
.
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| User: "Therion Ware" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
22 Oct 2005 04:50:59 PM |
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On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 17:14:22 -0400 in alt.atheism, Attila (Attila
<prochoice@here.now>) said, directing the reply to alt.atheism
On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 19:18:24 +0100, Therion Ware
<autodelete@city-of-dis.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<mg0ll11t1gk36b0k0qqmine5c50bublm07@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 13:01:24 -0500 in alt.atheism, David Jensen
(David Jensen <david@dajensen-family.com>) said, directing the reply
to alt.atheism
On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 12:48:24 -0500, in alt.atheism
Asmodeus <bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom> wrote in
<Xns96F78C7452FA3bondcrightwingnation@216.196.97.142>:
David Jensen <david@dajensen-family.com> wrote in
news:n2tkl1pqts54ti6l0kgrdvrr9839p3o5e5@4ax.com:
Killed, murder includes a state of mind.
So you want to let her go, and to hell with the three murdered
children. Justice is justice. She deserves the death penalty,
no matter how many "disabilities" she has.
Justice is justice. You are not advocating justice. You cannot name a
single jurisdiction in any developed country that would allow the
execution of a person who is clearly not responsible for their actions.
Aside: Countries with the death penalty:
Afghanistan
Antigua and Barbuda
Bahamas
Bahrain
Bangladesh
Barbados
Belarus
Belize
Botswana
Burundi
Cameroon
Chad
China (People's Republic)
Comoros
Congo (Democratic Republic)
Cuba
Dominica
Egypt
Equatorial Guinea
Eritrea
Ethiopia
Gabon
Ghana
Guatemala
Guinea
Guyana
India
Indonesia
Iran
Iraq
Jamaica
Japan
Jordan
Kazakhstan
Korea, North
Korea, South
Kuwait
Kyrgyzstan
Laos
Lebanon
Lesotho
Liberia
Libya
Malawi
Malaysia
Mongolia
Nigeria
Oman
Pakistan
Palestinian Authority
Philippines
Qatar
Rwanda
St. Kitts and Nevis
St. Lucia
St. Vincent and the Grenadines
Saudi Arabia
Sierra Leone
Singapore
Somalia
Sudan
Swaziland
Syria
Taiwan
Tajikistan
Tanzania
Thailand
Trinidad and Tobago
Uganda
United Arab Emirates
United States
Uzbekistan
Vietnam
Yemen
Zambia
Zimbabwe
I am glad the US is still on the list.
Well, I suppose the company is, erm, elevating. Still that said, I
suppose that while you might feel that the death penalty is
appropriate for some kinds of crime, it is rather a shame that you
apparently consider the state of US society to be such that you find
yourself taking pleasure in that rather final solution. I can see that
someone might argue that the death penalty is a "regrettable necessity
under the circumstances," etc- but "glad" really doesn't strike me as
an appropriate term.
[snip]
.
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| User: "Attila" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
23 Oct 2005 07:01:11 AM |
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On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 22:50:59 +0100, Therion Ware
<autodelete@city-of-dis.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<g8cll1l34r932h7va6o1p90saeham39nmc@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 17:14:22 -0400 in alt.atheism, Attila (Attila
<prochoice@here.now>) said, directing the reply to alt.atheism
On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 19:18:24 +0100, Therion Ware
<autodelete@city-of-dis.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<mg0ll11t1gk36b0k0qqmine5c50bublm07@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 13:01:24 -0500 in alt.atheism, David Jensen
(David Jensen <david@dajensen-family.com>) said, directing the reply
to alt.atheism
On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 12:48:24 -0500, in alt.atheism
Asmodeus <bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom> wrote in
<Xns96F78C7452FA3bondcrightwingnation@216.196.97.142>:
David Jensen <david@dajensen-family.com> wrote in
news:n2tkl1pqts54ti6l0kgrdvrr9839p3o5e5@4ax.com:
Killed, murder includes a state of mind.
So you want to let her go, and to hell with the three murdered
children. Justice is justice. She deserves the death penalty,
no matter how many "disabilities" she has.
Justice is justice. You are not advocating justice. You cannot name a
single jurisdiction in any developed country that would allow the
execution of a person who is clearly not responsible for their actions.
Aside: Countries with the death penalty:
Afghanistan
Antigua and Barbuda
Bahamas
Bahrain
Bangladesh
Barbados
Belarus
Belize
Botswana
Burundi
Cameroon
Chad
China (People's Republic)
Comoros
Congo (Democratic Republic)
Cuba
Dominica
Egypt
Equatorial Guinea
Eritrea
Ethiopia
Gabon
Ghana
Guatemala
Guinea
Guyana
India
Indonesia
Iran
Iraq
Jamaica
Japan
Jordan
Kazakhstan
Korea, North
Korea, South
Kuwait
Kyrgyzstan
Laos
Lebanon
Lesotho
Liberia
Libya
Malawi
Malaysia
Mongolia
Nigeria
Oman
Pakistan
Palestinian Authority
Philippines
Qatar
Rwanda
St. Kitts and Nevis
St. Lucia
St. Vincent and the Grenadines
Saudi Arabia
Sierra Leone
Singapore
Somalia
Sudan
Swaziland
Syria
Taiwan
Tajikistan
Tanzania
Thailand
Trinidad and Tobago
Uganda
United Arab Emirates
United States
Uzbekistan
Vietnam
Yemen
Zambia
Zimbabwe
I am glad the US is still on the list.
Well, I suppose the company is, erm, elevating. Still that said, I
suppose that while you might feel that the death penalty is
appropriate for some kinds of crime, it is rather a shame that you
apparently consider the state of US society to be such that you find
yourself taking pleasure in that rather final solution. I can see that
someone might argue that the death penalty is a "regrettable necessity
under the circumstances," etc- but "glad" really doesn't strike me as
an appropriate term.
I don't know of a single executed person who has ever killed or hurt
someone else. Do you?
[snip]
.
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| User: "Therion Ware" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
23 Oct 2005 08:17:01 AM |
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On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 08:01:11 -0400 in alt.atheism, Attila (Attila
<prochoice@here.now>) said, directing the reply to alt.atheism
On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 22:50:59 +0100, Therion Ware
<autodelete@city-of-dis.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<g8cll1l34r932h7va6o1p90saeham39nmc@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 17:14:22 -0400 in alt.atheism, Attila (Attila
<prochoice@here.now>) said, directing the reply to alt.atheism
On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 19:18:24 +0100, Therion Ware
<autodelete@city-of-dis.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<mg0ll11t1gk36b0k0qqmine5c50bublm07@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 13:01:24 -0500 in alt.atheism, David Jensen
(David Jensen <david@dajensen-family.com>) said, directing the reply
to alt.atheism
On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 12:48:24 -0500, in alt.atheism
Asmodeus <bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom> wrote in
<Xns96F78C7452FA3bondcrightwingnation@216.196.97.142>:
David Jensen <david@dajensen-family.com> wrote in
news:n2tkl1pqts54ti6l0kgrdvrr9839p3o5e5@4ax.com:
Killed, murder includes a state of mind.
So you want to let her go, and to hell with the three murdered
children. Justice is justice. She deserves the death penalty,
no matter how many "disabilities" she has.
Justice is justice. You are not advocating justice. You cannot name a
single jurisdiction in any developed country that would allow the
execution of a person who is clearly not responsible for their actions.
Aside: Countries with the death penalty:
Afghanistan
Antigua and Barbuda
Bahamas
Bahrain
Bangladesh
Barbados
Belarus
Belize
Botswana
Burundi
Cameroon
Chad
China (People's Republic)
Comoros
Congo (Democratic Republic)
Cuba
Dominica
Egypt
Equatorial Guinea
Eritrea
Ethiopia
Gabon
Ghana
Guatemala
Guinea
Guyana
India
Indonesia
Iran
Iraq
Jamaica
Japan
Jordan
Kazakhstan
Korea, North
Korea, South
Kuwait
Kyrgyzstan
Laos
Lebanon
Lesotho
Liberia
Libya
Malawi
Malaysia
Mongolia
Nigeria
Oman
Pakistan
Palestinian Authority
Philippines
Qatar
Rwanda
St. Kitts and Nevis
St. Lucia
St. Vincent and the Grenadines
Saudi Arabia
Sierra Leone
Singapore
Somalia
Sudan
Swaziland
Syria
Taiwan
Tajikistan
Tanzania
Thailand
Trinidad and Tobago
Uganda
United Arab Emirates
United States
Uzbekistan
Vietnam
Yemen
Zambia
Zimbabwe
I am glad the US is still on the list.
Well, I suppose the company is, erm, elevating. Still that said, I
suppose that while you might feel that the death penalty is
appropriate for some kinds of crime, it is rather a shame that you
apparently consider the state of US society to be such that you find
yourself taking pleasure in that rather final solution. I can see that
someone might argue that the death penalty is a "regrettable necessity
under the circumstances," etc- but "glad" really doesn't strike me as
an appropriate term.
I don't know of a single executed person who has ever killed or hurt
someone else. Do you?
No. Similarly I know of no person who was executed and subsequently
shown to be innocent who's gone on to any crime of any description, or
indeed to accomplish anything at all. Perhaps you could tell me what
you consider the acceptable execution error rate to be.
.
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| User: "Attila" |
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| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
23 Oct 2005 02:45:58 PM |
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On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 14:17:01 +0100, Therion Ware
<autodelete@city-of-dis.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<ip2nl11oi0kjn6todah0lgfinqiv7fql8j@4ax.com> wrote:
No. Similarly I know of no person who was executed and subsequently
shown to be innocent who's gone on to any crime of any description, or
indeed to accomplish anything at all. Perhaps you could tell me what
you consider the acceptable execution error rate to be.
I don't know how many survive but I would expect the number to be low
if it's done correctly.
.
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| User: "David Jensen" |
|
| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
23 Oct 2005 04:44:46 PM |
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On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 15:45:58 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<k1qnl1h2tsa7jtalijg6k8g5n2bubq2lfp@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 14:17:01 +0100, Therion Ware
<autodelete@city-of-dis.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<ip2nl11oi0kjn6todah0lgfinqiv7fql8j@4ax.com> wrote:
No. Similarly I know of no person who was executed and subsequently
shown to be innocent who's gone on to any crime of any description, or
indeed to accomplish anything at all. Perhaps you could tell me what
you consider the acceptable execution error rate to be.
I don't know how many survive but I would expect the number to be low
if it's done correctly.
Remember, with your approach the real criminal is free and still killing
because you don't care if the person punished is the person who actually
committed the crime.
.
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| User: "Attila" |
|
| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
24 Oct 2005 05:23:02 AM |
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|
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 16:44:46 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<711ol1dn6rh9b65qek71q29k1g6r55drci@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 15:45:58 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<k1qnl1h2tsa7jtalijg6k8g5n2bubq2lfp@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 14:17:01 +0100, Therion Ware
<autodelete@city-of-dis.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<ip2nl11oi0kjn6todah0lgfinqiv7fql8j@4ax.com> wrote:
No. Similarly I know of no person who was executed and subsequently
shown to be innocent who's gone on to any crime of any description, or
indeed to accomplish anything at all. Perhaps you could tell me what
you consider the acceptable execution error rate to be.
I don't know how many survive but I would expect the number to be low
if it's done correctly.
Remember, with your approach the real criminal is free and still killing
because you don't care if the person punished is the person who actually
committed the crime.
If someone is convicted of a crime that case is considered closed. The
penalty has nothing to do with that. If it is subsequently determined
the convicted person was not guilty and the case reopened again the
penalty has nothing to do with it.
It would make no difference if the convicted person was available to
be released, had died in prison, had escaped, had been paroled or
completed the sentence, or had been executed. The case would still be
reopened in exactly the same manner under each situation.
.
|
|
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| User: "David Jensen" |
|
| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
24 Oct 2005 07:48:16 AM |
|
|
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 06:23:02 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<76dpl19tlg4v3l9he789oif5ddnb25vl8o@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 16:44:46 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<711ol1dn6rh9b65qek71q29k1g6r55drci@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 15:45:58 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<k1qnl1h2tsa7jtalijg6k8g5n2bubq2lfp@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 14:17:01 +0100, Therion Ware
<autodelete@city-of-dis.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<ip2nl11oi0kjn6todah0lgfinqiv7fql8j@4ax.com> wrote:
No. Similarly I know of no person who was executed and subsequently
shown to be innocent who's gone on to any crime of any description, or
indeed to accomplish anything at all. Perhaps you could tell me what
you consider the acceptable execution error rate to be.
I don't know how many survive but I would expect the number to be low
if it's done correctly.
Remember, with your approach the real criminal is free and still killing
because you don't care if the person punished is the person who actually
committed the crime.
If someone is convicted of a crime that case is considered closed.
No, then they are allowed to appeal.
The
penalty has nothing to do with that. If it is subsequently determined
the convicted person was not guilty and the case reopened again the
penalty has nothing to do with it.
You are wrong.
It would make no difference if the convicted person was available to
be released, had died in prison, had escaped, had been paroled or
completed the sentence, or had been executed. The case would still be
reopened in exactly the same manner under each situation.
No, it would not.
Your claims about the legal system do not coincide with actual
procedures.
.
|
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| User: "Attila" |
|
| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
24 Oct 2005 04:19:18 PM |
|
|
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 07:48:16 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<6ulpl1lcestjig2b3n51tr2mtts47ibpfv@4ax.com> wrote:
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 06:23:02 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<76dpl19tlg4v3l9he789oif5ddnb25vl8o@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 16:44:46 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<711ol1dn6rh9b65qek71q29k1g6r55drci@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 15:45:58 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<k1qnl1h2tsa7jtalijg6k8g5n2bubq2lfp@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 14:17:01 +0100, Therion Ware
<autodelete@city-of-dis.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<ip2nl11oi0kjn6todah0lgfinqiv7fql8j@4ax.com> wrote:
No. Similarly I know of no person who was executed and subsequently
shown to be innocent who's gone on to any crime of any description, or
indeed to accomplish anything at all. Perhaps you could tell me what
you consider the acceptable execution error rate to be.
I don't know how many survive but I would expect the number to be low
if it's done correctly.
Remember, with your approach the real criminal is free and still killing
because you don't care if the person punished is the person who actually
committed the crime.
If someone is convicted of a crime that case is considered closed.
No, then they are allowed to appeal.
True, but the case is considered closed.
The
penalty has nothing to do with that. If it is subsequently determined
the convicted person was not guilty and the case reopened again the
penalty has nothing to do with it.
You are wrong.
How can the penalty affect the determination that a verdict was not
correct?
It would make no difference if the convicted person was available to
be released, had died in prison, had escaped, had been paroled or
completed the sentence, or had been executed. The case would still be
reopened in exactly the same manner under each situation.
No, it would not.
Your claims about the legal system do not coincide with actual
procedures.
I do not pretend to be an expert, but I fail to see why or how the
status of the convicted person (whether dead or alive) would have
anything to do with reopening a case. Such an action can only be
based on evidence.
.
|
|
|
| User: "David Jensen" |
|
| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
24 Oct 2005 04:43:39 PM |
|
|
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 17:19:18 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<0ojql1t5hagv4h6688rcph4jnga1gfsg0d@4ax.com>:
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 07:48:16 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<6ulpl1lcestjig2b3n51tr2mtts47ibpfv@4ax.com> wrote:
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 06:23:02 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<76dpl19tlg4v3l9he789oif5ddnb25vl8o@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 16:44:46 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<711ol1dn6rh9b65qek71q29k1g6r55drci@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 15:45:58 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<k1qnl1h2tsa7jtalijg6k8g5n2bubq2lfp@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 14:17:01 +0100, Therion Ware
<autodelete@city-of-dis.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<ip2nl11oi0kjn6todah0lgfinqiv7fql8j@4ax.com> wrote:
No. Similarly I know of no person who was executed and subsequently
shown to be innocent who's gone on to any crime of any description, or
indeed to accomplish anything at all. Perhaps you could tell me what
you consider the acceptable execution error rate to be.
I don't know how many survive but I would expect the number to be low
if it's done correctly.
Remember, with your approach the real criminal is free and still killing
because you don't care if the person punished is the person who actually
committed the crime.
If someone is convicted of a crime that case is considered closed.
No, then they are allowed to appeal.
True, but the case is considered closed.
The
penalty has nothing to do with that. If it is subsequently determined
the convicted person was not guilty and the case reopened again the
penalty has nothing to do with it.
You are wrong.
How can the penalty affect the determination that a verdict was not
correct?
It would make no difference if the convicted person was available to
be released, had died in prison, had escaped, had been paroled or
completed the sentence, or had been executed. The case would still be
reopened in exactly the same manner under each situation.
No, it would not.
Your claims about the legal system do not coincide with actual
procedures.
I do not pretend to be an expert, but I fail to see why or how the
status of the convicted person (whether dead or alive) would have
anything to do with reopening a case. Such an action can only be
based on evidence.
There is little incentive to reopen a case of a person who has already
been executed. It is far too embarrassing to the state and cannot do
anything for the victim of the execution.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Attila" |
|
| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
25 Oct 2005 04:14:13 AM |
|
|
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 16:43:39 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<ualql1t6euvjj44bprp8om03s28f2n4r2i@4ax.com> wrote:
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 17:19:18 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<0ojql1t5hagv4h6688rcph4jnga1gfsg0d@4ax.com>:
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 07:48:16 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<6ulpl1lcestjig2b3n51tr2mtts47ibpfv@4ax.com> wrote:
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 06:23:02 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<76dpl19tlg4v3l9he789oif5ddnb25vl8o@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 16:44:46 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<711ol1dn6rh9b65qek71q29k1g6r55drci@4ax.com> wrote:
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 15:45:58 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<k1qnl1h2tsa7jtalijg6k8g5n2bubq2lfp@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 14:17:01 +0100, Therion Ware
<autodelete@city-of-dis.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<ip2nl11oi0kjn6todah0lgfinqiv7fql8j@4ax.com> wrote:
No. Similarly I know of no person who was executed and subsequently
shown to be innocent who's gone on to any crime of any description, or
indeed to accomplish anything at all. Perhaps you could tell me what
you consider the acceptable execution error rate to be.
I don't know how many survive but I would expect the number to be low
if it's done correctly.
Remember, with your approach the real criminal is free and still killing
because you don't care if the person punished is the person who actually
committed the crime.
If someone is convicted of a crime that case is considered closed.
No, then they are allowed to appeal.
True, but the case is considered closed.
The
penalty has nothing to do with that. If it is subsequently determined
the convicted person was not guilty and the case reopened again the
penalty has nothing to do with it.
You are wrong.
How can the penalty affect the determination that a verdict was not
correct?
It would make no difference if the convicted person was available to
be released, had died in prison, had escaped, had been paroled or
completed the sentence, or had been executed. The case would still be
reopened in exactly the same manner under each situation.
No, it would not.
Your claims about the legal system do not coincide with actual
procedures.
I do not pretend to be an expert, but I fail to see why or how the
status of the convicted person (whether dead or alive) would have
anything to do with reopening a case. Such an action can only be
based on evidence.
There is little incentive to reopen a case of a person who has already
been executed. It is far too embarrassing to the state and cannot do
anything for the victim of the execution.
A case would be reopened based on new evidence. That would have
nothing to do with the status of the convicted person.
.
|
|
|
| User: "David Jensen" |
|
| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
25 Oct 2005 07:36:05 AM |
|
|
On Tue, 25 Oct 2005 05:14:13 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<bptrl1tnej3g6nu30hcpq2j1bg7unlpqgq@4ax.com>:
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 16:43:39 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<ualql1t6euvjj44bprp8om03s28f2n4r2i@4ax.com> wrote:
....
There is little incentive to reopen a case of a person who has already
been executed. It is far too embarrassing to the state and cannot do
anything for the victim of the execution.
A case would be reopened based on new evidence. That would have
nothing to do with the status of the convicted person.
Who would reopen it? The victim of the miscarriage of justice is dead.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Attila" |
|
| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
26 Oct 2005 04:31:23 AM |
|
|
On Tue, 25 Oct 2005 07:36:05 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<ck9sl1hu132d7kgvm081e887jhhb2n0lce@4ax.com> wrote:
On Tue, 25 Oct 2005 05:14:13 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<bptrl1tnej3g6nu30hcpq2j1bg7unlpqgq@4ax.com>:
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 16:43:39 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<ualql1t6euvjj44bprp8om03s28f2n4r2i@4ax.com> wrote:
...
There is little incentive to reopen a case of a person who has already
been executed. It is far too embarrassing to the state and cannot do
anything for the victim of the execution.
A case would be reopened based on new evidence. That would have
nothing to do with the status of the convicted person.
Who would reopen it? The victim of the miscarriage of justice is dead.
If the prisoner is serving time who would reopen it?
.
|
|
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| User: "David Jensen" |
|
| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
26 Oct 2005 08:27:55 AM |
|
|
On Wed, 26 Oct 2005 05:31:23 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<16jul1tfk3csu6fc3j7c7etm701ojehns6@4ax.com>:
On Tue, 25 Oct 2005 07:36:05 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<ck9sl1hu132d7kgvm081e887jhhb2n0lce@4ax.com> wrote:
On Tue, 25 Oct 2005 05:14:13 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<bptrl1tnej3g6nu30hcpq2j1bg7unlpqgq@4ax.com>:
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 16:43:39 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<ualql1t6euvjj44bprp8om03s28f2n4r2i@4ax.com> wrote:
...
There is little incentive to reopen a case of a person who has already
been executed. It is far too embarrassing to the state and cannot do
anything for the victim of the execution.
A case would be reopened based on new evidence. That would have
nothing to do with the status of the convicted person.
Who would reopen it? The victim of the miscarriage of justice is dead.
If the prisoner is serving time who would reopen it?
The motion of the prisoner through his lawyer. We do not reopen cases
after a person who has been unjustly convicted of committing a capital
offense has been executed.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Attila" |
|
| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
26 Oct 2005 11:01:53 AM |
|
|
On Wed, 26 Oct 2005 08:27:55 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<4t0vl1tqel8t5cd3t5vefd72es3lsho7p6@4ax.com> wrote:
On Wed, 26 Oct 2005 05:31:23 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<16jul1tfk3csu6fc3j7c7etm701ojehns6@4ax.com>:
On Tue, 25 Oct 2005 07:36:05 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<ck9sl1hu132d7kgvm081e887jhhb2n0lce@4ax.com> wrote:
On Tue, 25 Oct 2005 05:14:13 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<bptrl1tnej3g6nu30hcpq2j1bg7unlpqgq@4ax.com>:
On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 16:43:39 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<ualql1t6euvjj44bprp8om03s28f2n4r2i@4ax.com> wrote:
...
There is little incentive to reopen a case of a person who has already
been executed. It is far too embarrassing to the state and cannot do
anything for the victim of the execution.
A case would be reopened based on new evidence. That would have
nothing to do with the status of the convicted person.
Who would reopen it? The victim of the miscarriage of justice is dead.
If the prisoner is serving time who would reopen it?
The motion of the prisoner through his lawyer. We do not reopen cases
after a person who has been unjustly convicted of committing a capital
offense has been executed.
If evidence turned up showing either that the executed man was
innocent or someone else was guilty it would be reopened.
.
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
|
| Title: Re: Mom charged with murder after allegedly throwing kids into SF Bay |
26 Oct 2005 10:08:55 PM |
|
|
Attila <Attila> wrote:
David Jensen
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
If the prisoner is serving time who would reopen it?
The motion of the prisoner through his lawyer. We do not reopen cases
after a person who has been unjustly convicted of committing a capital
offense has been executed.
If evidence turned up showing either that the executed man was
innocent or someone else was guilty it would be reopened.
And that's going to bring the person back to life?
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
.
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