rfischer@bolt.sonic.net (Ray Fischer) in alt.abortion with message-id <djquvq$fgd$1@bolt.sonic.net>

Attila <Attila> wrote:

Except that studies have shown that the death penalty is not a
deterrant. Indeed, the states with the highest rates of executions
are among the highest for violent crime!

I know of no crime committed by an executed criminal. Do you?

And so we should kill everybody in order to prevent crime.

There you go again.

On Fri, 28 Oct 2005 02:05:10 GMT, Douglas Berry
<penguin_boy@mindOBVIOUSspring.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<7n13m15det5i1po1hnjaef348l1269jits@4ax.com> wrote:

What's so funny about peace, love and Attila <prochoice@here.now>
posting the following on Thu, 27 Oct 2005 09:25:33 -0400 iin
alt.atheism?

Except that studies have shown that the death penalty is not a
deterrant. Indeed, the states with the highest rates of executions
are among the highest for violent crime!

I know of no crime committed by an executed criminal. Do you?

Faced with a fact, you fall back on ridiculous sayings. No, dead
people don't committ crimes.

I am glad that point is finally settled.

Neither do people in supermax facilities
where they spend 23 hours a day in their cells, and rarely (if ever)
have any contact with others except through a heavy sheet of glass.

But there is no additional expense if they are dead.

Now, care to address the numerous studies showing no correlation
between the death penalty and lower crime rates?

Not particularly. Would you care to discuss the expense difference
between someone who is dead and someone who is in your supermax
facility?

Now, care to address the numerous studies showing no correlation
between the death penalty and lower crime rates?

Not particularly. Would you care to discuss the expense difference
between someone who is dead and someone who is in your supermax
facility?

On Mon, 24 Oct 2005 06:07:14 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<0ecpl19h82neikrvm2ii568acn1oah0psf@4ax.com>:

On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 16:38:39 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<8i0ol19gpencn7a31a6f1pvkubc30orvtl@4ax.com> wrote:

On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 15:39:12 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<9jpnl1lf90hqmsmub4t5e5cf5n9mlsmnhr@4ax.com>:

On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 09:00:31 -0500, David Jensen
<david@dajensen-family.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<7o5nl1d4l7rvarr1m0t65us7llt0nodlql@4ax.com> wrote:

On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 07:59:25 -0400, in alt.atheism
Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
<jkuml11ajapnfnmhifnf91u5abp18jccdc@4ax.com>:

On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 22:23:48 GMT, Douglas Berry
<penguin_boy@mindOBVIOUSspring.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<2rell11ksqu0q3u5sutqg59iv0rmq1ofs9@4ax.com> wrote:

What's so funny about peace, love and Asmodeus
<bondcATrightwingnationDOTcom> posting the following on Sat, 22 Oct
2005 16:32:09 -0500 iin alt.atheism?

Attila <prochoice@here.now> wrote in
news:csall1pglbu7u9cdloaihdqeqr7v2095cr@4ax.com:

I am glad the US is still on the list.

Thank God for that.

My objection to the death penalty is based on the fact that the
justice system does make mistakes. Innocent people are convicted, and
then proven innocent years, if not decades later.

We just had a case like that here in SF. A man convicted of raping a
13 year old girl was freed after DNA testing proved he couldn't have
been the attacker. For his nine years in prison, the state is
coughing up $350,000.

Which is silly.

It's the best they can do. They can't give the person those years back.

But not a reason for the taxpayers to be soaked in case of error.

Who should pay for this miscarriage of justice? Isn't it bad enough that
the victim was imprisoned? I realize that you call yourself Attila, but
I doubt that even he was indifferent to whether his people perceived him
to be unjust.

Being convicted is not unjust. It may be an error, but it is in
accordance with the justice system in place.

No, a stated goal of our judicial system is that it not convict the
innocent.

Prosecutorial misconduct was a major cause of false
convictions.

Is that a legitimate part of our legal system?

Since when?
Providing adequate counsel to the accused is a good, if not perfect way
to discourage prosecutorial misconduct.

With the death penalty, you can't rectifiy an error. In essence, the
state has murdered an innocent.

Wrong. Murder requires an illegal act. Execution of a convicted
criminal cannot be murder. Whether the person is eventually shown to
be innocent is irrelevant.

If you are convicted of murder and sentenced to die, will you not care
whether you did it?

Of course I would. But I would not expect anyone else to do so.

That's the difference between you and civilized people.

In your opinion.

In the opinion of the vast majority.

Lock them up, and let them rot. It's cheaper too!

Not if the execution process is streamlined. How much does one bullet
cost?

Why bother with a justice system at all then.

The alternative is chaos.

But you advocate chaos under color of justice.

A properly working justice system based upon the law is the antithesis
of chaos.

But your statements have shown that you don't care if there is a
properly working justice system. You care about the superficial, like
the religious zealots.