| Topic: |
Science > Abortion |
| User: |
"David W. Barnes" |
| Date: |
28 Oct 2006 02:50:35 PM |
| Object: |
More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
Once again, the religious, obsessed with sex, torture someone and ruin
a young life.
<http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/10/27/female.circumcision.ap/index.html>
"He said it was the will of God."
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| User: "No One" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
29 Oct 2006 04:51:17 PM |
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"osprey" <noneedtoknow@mail.com> writes:
ScottyFLL wrote:
Peacenik wrote:
"Manco" <manco_dollars@net2blah.com> wrote in message
news:a%21h.1737$B44.778@trndny07...
Sylvia R. Dickinson wrote:
Evil of all sorts exists in religion-
Ah more moral equivalence *****. Yeah Islam in 2006 =
Christianity in 2006.
Christian fundies would have no qualms about killing or
torturing if given half the chance.
Correct. And their bible gives them many instances for which death is
mandatory. (They keep quiet about it, however, as they are guilty of
many of those things.)
I thought you said that you believe that a person can believe in a
higher power or even an afterlife, if there is one, without having
to follow the biblical scriptures. Are you suggesting that "all
Christian fundies" have no qualms about killing or torturing?
Don't know what ScottyFLL and Peacenik believe, but I'm willing to
wait until the first Tuesday of November, just over a week away, and
we'll see how the Bible Belt votes. If the "Christians" continue to
support Republicans in the election, we can only conclude that
"Christian fundies" will do nothing to stop torture and thus condone
it.
We just had ***** Chenney publicly announce his support for torture
(although he quickly backpeddled for public consumption, pretending
that "dunking" people was as innocuous as playing around in the
pool). Read about it at
<http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2006/10/27/MNG74M100T1.DTL>
A recent news report stated that the Republican-controlled Congress
spent 12 hours investigating Abu Ghraib (see
<http://wakedems.org/news> for an article by Paul Krugman entitled
"One-Letter Politics" ):
The current Congress has shown no inclination to investigate
the Bush administration. Last year The Boston Globe offered an
illuminating comparison: when Bill Clinton was president, the
House took 140 hours of sworn testimony into whether
Mr. Clinton had used the White House Christmas list to
identify possible Democratic donors. But in 2004 and 2005, a
House committee took only 12 hours of testimony on the abuses
at Abu Ghraib.
Also see <http://www.dccc.org/docs/oversight%20report_word.doc> for
a similar statement.
So, we'll have a good indication of "Christian" values a week from
Tuesday based on how they vote!
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| User: "David W. Barnes" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
29 Oct 2006 04:27:53 PM |
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In article <1162157948.406031.248030@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com>,
osprey <noneedtoknow@mail.com> wrote:
ScottyFLL wrote:
Peacenik wrote:
"Manco" <manco_dollars@net2blah.com> wrote in message
news:a%21h.1737$B44.778@trndny07...
Sylvia R. Dickinson wrote:
Evil of all sorts exists in religion-
Ah more moral equivalence *****. Yeah Islam in 2006 = Christianity in
2006.
Christian fundies would have no qualms about killing or torturing if given
half the chance.
Correct. And their bible gives them many instances for which death is
mandatory. (They keep quiet about it, however, as they are guilty of
many of those things.)
I thought you said that you believe that a person can believe in a
higher power or even an afterlife, if there is one, without having to
follow the biblical scriptures.
Are you suggesting that "all Christian fundies" have no qualms about
killing or torturing?
I know a lot of christians who are against killing and torturing of any
kind.
It would be interesting to get your prespective on these issues since
you seem to know so much about the Christian mindset.
I am in Awe of your knowledge!!!
All you atheist seem to know SO MUCH!!!
Osprey, the child, kills the thread.
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| User: "ScottyFLL" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
29 Oct 2006 04:45:45 PM |
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osprey wrote:
I thought you said that you believe that a person can believe in a
higher power or even an afterlife, if there is one, without having to
follow the biblical scriptures.
I said nothing about an afterlife. Nothing serious, anyway. I
sometimes joke about going "downtown", but that is where people like
you think I'm going anyway.
Are you suggesting that "all Christian fundies" have no qualms about
killing or torturing?
No. But some of them do, and for those who do, there are biblical
passages that validate their feelings. Indeed, there are biblical
MANDATES for death.
When we speak of "fundies", we are talking about the radicals -- we are
not talking about the people who espouse the teachings of Jesus and a
"love thy neighbor", "judge not lest ye be judged", Golden Rule way of
life. Rather, we are talking about the brand of Christian that insists
that if we do not do everything according to the dictates of THEIR
religion and THEIR interpretation of the bible, we are doomed to
eternal damnation and hellfire.
I went to a gay rodeo this spring and we were met by fundies holding
signs calling for our death. There were only about 8 of 'em, sad
little things out on a beautiful Sunday morning in South Florida with
apparently nothing better to do than to spread hatred and ignorance.
They didn't prevent anyone from getting in, and the hundreds of people
who attended the rodeo had a great time.
I know a lot of christians who are against killing and torturing of any
kind.
As do I. But what we define as a "fundie" generally has no problem
with the death penalty, for example. The kind of Christian you're
talking about in the sentence above would likely NOT be a fundie, then.
It would be interesting to get your prespective on these issues since
you seem to know so much about the Christian mindset.
There is no one "Christian mindset". There are as many "Christian
mindsets" as there are individuals who claim to be Christian.
I am in Awe of your knowledge!!!
As I said before, I don't care what you think of me.
All you atheist seem to know SO MUCH!!!
I did not say I am an atheist.
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| User: "osprey" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
29 Oct 2006 05:04:19 PM |
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ScottyFLL wrote:
osprey wrote:
I thought you said that you believe that a person can believe in a
higher power or even an afterlife, if there is one, without having to
follow the biblical scriptures.
I said nothing about an afterlife.
O.k..
Nothing serious, anyway. I
sometimes joke about going "downtown", but that is where people like
you think I'm going anyway.
Oh? And where did I ever say that? Come on Scott, you should know
better than this. If you want to make up the rules and demand that
people prove their statements, then it's only fair that the same be
required of you. So where did I ever say you were going "downtown".
Are you suggesting that "all Christian fundies" have no qualms about
killing or torturing?
No. But some of them do
Yes, some of them do. Some have serious medical problems as well. Then
again, it's not limited to just "christian fundies" either.
, and for those who do, there are biblical
passages that validate their feelings.
Yes, some do read the bible that way I agree.
Indeed, there are biblical
MANDATES for death.
Again, this is where it's important to read the verse in context and
learn what it means. I agree, that some verses appear to be saying one
thing; however, when you learn greek and hebrew translations in some
verses we may find out it is saying something else.
Also I try to keep in mind the bible has been re-written and translated
so many times how can we really know what the bible is saying today, is
what it originally said then?
When we speak of "fundies", we are talking about the radicals
O.k., and keep in mind there are radicals in all shapes and sizes.
It's not just limited to religion, I have seen radical atheist as well
and there are many radical liberals in here.
-- we are
not talking about the people who espouse the teachings of Jesus and a
"love thy neighbor", "judge not lest ye be judged", Golden Rule way of
life. Rather, we are talking about the brand of Christian that insists
that if we do not do everything according to the dictates of THEIR
religion and THEIR interpretation of the bible, we are doomed to
eternal damnation and hellfire.
O.k., thank you for clarifying that.
I went to a gay rodeo this spring and we were met by fundies holding
signs calling for our death.
I despise those fundies. I may not agree with the "homosexual" act
itself; however, I do not believe in judging the person and holding
anything against the person. What a person does behind his or her
bedroom door is no one elses business, and even though I personally
view the act of homosexuality as being unnatural, it's still not my
place to judge.
There were only about 8 of 'em, sad
little things out on a beautiful Sunday morning in South Florida with
apparently nothing better to do than to spread hatred and ignorance.
They didn't prevent anyone from getting in, and the hundreds of people
who attended the rodeo had a great time.
I know a lot of christians who are against killing and torturing of any
kind.
As do I. But what we define as a "fundie" generally has no problem
with the death penalty, for example. The kind of Christian you're
talking about in the sentence above would likely NOT be a fundie, then.
It would be interesting to get your prespective on these issues since
you seem to know so much about the Christian mindset.
There is no one "Christian mindset". There are as many "Christian
mindsets" as there are individuals who claim to be Christian.
I am in Awe of your knowledge!!!
As I said before, I don't care what you think of me.
I am being sarcastic.
Since we both seem to not care for one another and we both seem to want
to keep the ill feelings alive, I can either go along with it or I can
work towards our mending our feelings.
All you atheist seem to know SO MUCH!!!
I did not say I am an atheist.
Fair enough, you didn't say that. My apology to you for my mistake.
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| User: "Dave of Kan" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
29 Oct 2006 08:38:28 PM |
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Peacenik wrote:
"Manco" <manco_dollars@net2blah.com> wrote in message
news:a%21h.1737$B44.778@trndny07...
Sylvia R. Dickinson wrote:
Evil of all sorts exists in religion-
Ah more moral equivalence *****. Yeah Islam in 2006 = Christianity in
2006.
Christian fundies would have no qualms about killing or torturing if given
half the chance. Or any fundy, even Buddhist fundies - like Aum Shinrikyo.
I have to reply once again because I have seen all the sites this post goes to:
I'm starting a new religion, The religion of the Sun. It's based upon the ancient
religion of Egypt. This new religion has been predicted, foretold in the writings
of now deceased seer Jeanne Dixon in her book "My Life and Prophecies" so
whatever I do pro or con, the religion is supposed to come about. I have a blog
on myspace.....myspace.manual100 where I give some info on the new up-
coming religion.
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| User: "Dave of Kan" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
29 Oct 2006 08:29:28 PM |
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Peacenik wrote:
"Manco" <manco_dollars@net2blah.com> wrote in message
news:a%21h.1737$B44.778@trndny07...
Sylvia R. Dickinson wrote:
Evil of all sorts exists in religion-
Ah more moral equivalence *****. Yeah Islam in 2006 = Christianity in
2006.
Christian fundies would have no qualms about killing or torturing if given
half the chance. Or any fundy, even Buddhist fundies - like Aum Shinrikyo.
Yes, that sounds about right
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| User: "bowman" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
29 Oct 2006 05:24:04 PM |
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Peacenik wrote:
Christian fundies would have no qualms about killing or torturing if given
half the chance. Or any fundy, even Buddhist fundies - like Aum Shinrikyo.
Aum Shinrikyo is a syncretic religion that owes as much to Hinduism and
Christianity as to Buddhism. It is not Buddhism, fundamental or otherwise.
----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
29 Oct 2006 12:12:45 PM |
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Manco <manco_dollars@net2blah.com> wrote:
Sylvia R. Dickinson wrote:
Evil of all sorts exists in religion-
Ah more moral equivalence *****. Yeah Islam in 2006 = Christianity in
2006. ***** that LIE.
Christians kill FAR more people these days.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
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| User: "George Peatty" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
29 Oct 2006 04:31:13 PM |
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On 29 Oct 2006 18:12:45 GMT, (Ray Fischer) wrote:
Christians kill FAR more people these days.
Oh, ***** ..
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| User: "Manco" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
29 Oct 2006 01:11:14 PM |
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Ray Fischer wrote:
Manco <manco_dollars@net2blah.com> wrote:
Sylvia R. Dickinson wrote:
Evil of all sorts exists in religion-
Ah more moral equivalence *****. Yeah Islam in 2006 =
Christianity in 2006. ***** that LIE.
Christians kill FAR more people these days.
Evidence? Darfur is done by Muslims *****.
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
29 Oct 2006 02:14:03 PM |
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Manco <manco_dollars@net2blah.com> wrote:
Ray Fischer wrote:
Manco <manco_dollars@net2blah.com> wrote:
Sylvia R. Dickinson wrote:
Evil of all sorts exists in religion-
Ah more moral equivalence *****. Yeah Islam in 2006 =
Christianity in 2006. ***** that LIE.
Christians kill FAR more people these days.
Evidence?
600,000+ dead in Iraq. Tens of thousands in Afghanistan.
And then there's some less recent wars such as Viet Nam, which
killed about 5,000,000, and WWII, and WWI. And there was Reagan
promoting terrorism in Central America...
Darfur is done by Muslims *****.
Except when it's done by non-Muslims, bigot.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
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| User: "George Peatty" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
29 Oct 2006 04:32:35 PM |
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On 29 Oct 2006 20:14:03 GMT, (Ray Fischer) wrote:
600,000+ dead in Iraq. Tens of thousands in Afghanistan.
And then there's some less recent wars such as Viet Nam, which
killed about 5,000,000, and WWII, and WWI. And there was Reagan
promoting terrorism in Central America...
It is braindead lunacy to attribute any of this to Christians ..
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
29 Oct 2006 11:23:46 PM |
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George Peatty <peattyg47-1230@copper.net> wrote:
rfischer@sonic.net (Ray Fischer) wrote:
600,000+ dead in Iraq. Tens of thousands in Afghanistan.
And then there's some less recent wars such as Viet Nam, which
killed about 5,000,000, and WWII, and WWI. And there was Reagan
promoting terrorism in Central America...
It is braindead lunacy to attribute any of this to Christians ..
Hitler claimed to be doing God's work. Reagan pretended to be a good
Christian. The US is supposed to be a Christian nation.
Talk is cheap. Lies are easy.
Look at the results.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
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| User: "George Peatty" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
30 Oct 2006 01:41:29 PM |
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In article <45458c62$0$34575$742ec2ed@news.sonic.net>, Ray Fischer says...
[snip]
Hitler claimed to be doing God's work.
... only when it served his purposes. He was equally intent on destroying the
church, when it served his purposes ..
Reagan pretended to be a good Christian.
If you say his profession was pretense, then it's hardly fair to attribute the
motives for his actions to a set of beliefs he was only feigning ..
The US is supposed to be a Christian nation.
Less so with each passing day. The US of Quincy Adams, Daniel Webster, and de
Tocqueville is dead and buried, and has been since the Supremes ruined the
Establishment Clause ..
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
30 Oct 2006 10:46:45 PM |
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George Peatty <pttyg47-1230@copper.net> wrote:
Ray Fischer says...
Hitler claimed to be doing God's work.
.. only when it served his purposes.
Much like almost every other Christian.
He was equally intent on destroying the
church, when it served his purposes ..
Much like the Pope.
Reagan pretended to be a good Christian.
If you say his profession was pretense, then it's hardly fair to attribute the
motives for his actions to a set of beliefs he was only feigning ..
What's the difference between Reagan's pretense and every other
Christian's pretense?
The US is supposed to be a Christian nation.
Less so with each passing day.
Fortunately the anti-Christian religious right is losing ground.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
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| User: "Alric Knebel" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
30 Oct 2006 06:13:40 PM |
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George Peatty wrote:
In article <45458c62$0$34575$742ec2ed@news.sonic.net>, Ray Fischer says...
[snip]
Hitler claimed to be doing God's work.
.. only when it served his purposes. He was equally intent on destroying the
church, when it served his purposes ..
Reagan pretended to be a good Christian.
If you say his profession was pretense, then it's hardly fair to attribute the
motives for his actions to a set of beliefs he was only feigning ..
The US is supposed to be a Christian nation.
Less so with each passing day. The US of Quincy Adams, Daniel Webster, and de
Tocqueville is dead and buried, and has been since the Supremes ruined the
Establishment Clause ..
And we're a much better country because of it. Back in those days,
blacks and women and men without property couldn't vote. The
Constitution was taken as a protection of privilege than the enforcer of
rights for all people. Religion doesn't really facilitate social
enlightenment, and social enlightenment is what's really important to
individuals, and our social relationships.
--
______________________________________________
Alric Knebel
http://www.ironeyefortress.com/C-SPAN_loon.html
http://www.ironeyefortress.com
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| User: "George Peatty" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
30 Oct 2006 06:49:25 PM |
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In article <12kd59nnh2m4ob6@corp.supernews.com>, Alric Knebel
<alric@[cableone.net]> says...
[snip]
And we're a much better country because of it. Back in those days,
blacks and women and men without property couldn't vote. The
Constitution was taken as a protection of privilege than the enforcer of
rights for all people. Religion doesn't really facilitate social
enlightenment, and social enlightenment is what's really important to
individuals, and our social relationships.
Nonsense. The very notion of government of the people, by the people, for the
people" is a religious one. The first great political document on American soil
was the Mayflower Compact of 1620, which informs both the Declaration of
Independence and the Constitution.
Historian Paul Johnson, author of A History of the American People, says of this
document: "What was remarkable about this contract was that it was not between
a servant and a master, or a people and a king, but between a group of
like-minded individuals and each other, with God as a witness and symbolic
co-signatory."
Chaplain Peter Marshall says of the Pilgrims: "This was the only place on the
face of the earth where free Christian people were creating their own
government, electing their own civil leadership -- the only time in history, as
a matter of fact, where a nation from scratch was based on God's word."
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
30 Oct 2006 10:48:43 PM |
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George Peatty <pttyg47-1230@copper.net> wrote:
Nonsense. The very notion of government of the people, by the people, for the
people" is a religious one.
Religions are fundamentally opposed to liberty and to democracy.
Freedom is the enemy of religion because it gives people the power
to reject churches.
The first great political document on American soil
was the Mayflower Compact of 1620, which informs both the Declaration of
Independence and the Constitution.
The US Constitution directly opposes many of the 10 commandments.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
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| User: "Alric Knebel" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
30 Oct 2006 09:51:49 PM |
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George Peatty wrote:
In article <12kd59nnh2m4ob6@corp.supernews.com>, Alric Knebel
<alric@[cableone.net]> says...
[snip]
And we're a much better country because of it. Back in those days,
blacks and women and men without property couldn't vote. The
Constitution was taken as a protection of privilege than the enforcer of
rights for all people. Religion doesn't really facilitate social
enlightenment, and social enlightenment is what's really important to
individuals, and our social relationships.
Nonsense. The very notion of government of the people, by the people, for the
people" is a religious one. The first great political document on American soil
was the Mayflower Compact of 1620, which informs both the Declaration of
Independence and the Constitution.
Historian Paul Johnson, author of A History of the American People, says of this
document: "What was remarkable about this contract was that it was not between
a servant and a master, or a people and a king, but between a group of
like-minded individuals and each other, with God as a witness and symbolic
co-signatory."
Chaplain Peter Marshall says of the Pilgrims: "This was the only place on the
face of the earth where free Christian people were creating their own
government, electing their own civil leadership -- the only time in history, as
a matter of fact, where a nation from scratch was based on God's word."
You give your religion too much credit, as most of your brainwashed
types do. Those very same principles outlined in the constitution were
practiced by the Greeks and Romans. Voting, representative government
-- the whole nine yards. The Indians themselves practiced democracy and
freedom. None of these groups were Christian. This is common
knowledge, and known even to yourself. You fail to recognize your own
knowledge of this fact because your indoctrination by your religion
scumbles your reality, and you mix up truth with nationalism. You guys
are incapable of critical thinking, describing everything your part of
in these gushing superlatives. Take a closer look at history. Our own
history is fraught with a lot of promise, but these aren't new ideals,
and we're really not -- nor have we ever been -- that hell-bent on
achieving them.
And you need to really get up on your history. You're ridiculous. That
community was founded on religion, but not the country itself. Any
politician who says so is a liar. They're just pandering to the
gullible. From the very formation of the states, religion had nothing
to do with it. Wave after wave of settlers coming after the very first
landing weren't one bit interested in religion. Those are the facts,
once you get past the fifth-grade history lesson. Grow up.
--
______________________________________________
Alric Knebel
http://www.ironeyefortress.com/C-SPAN_loon.html
http://www.ironeyefortress.com
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| User: "George Peatty" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
31 Oct 2006 08:08:31 AM |
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In article <12kdi2pd721i608@corp.supernews.com>, Alric Knebel
<alric@[cableone.net]> says...
[snip]
You give your religion too much credit, as most of your brainwashed
types do. Those very same principles outlined in the constitution were
practiced by the Greeks and Romans. Voting, representative government
-- the whole nine yards.
I've never seen the Greeks or the Romans mentioned in any of the literature of
the Pilgrims and Puritans. Show me where these people were even aware of them.
And, even if they were, it changes nothing, for it is clear from the documents
themselves what the sources of their inspiration were. You withhold credit
where it is clearly due.
The Indians themselves practiced democracy and freedom.
Well, I'm no expert on colonial Indian affairs, but I call ***** unless you
can produce a credible site.
[snip]
And you need to really get up on your history. You're ridiculous. That
community was founded on religion, but not the country itself. Any
politician who says so is a liar.
You are the liar for saying otherwise. The evidence is in the documents
themselves and the written records of the statements of the men who founded this
country. That evidence is clear, convincing, uneqivocal, final and
irrefragable. No amount of revisionist ***** from a secularist like you can
change that.
They're just pandering to the gullible. From the very formation of the >states,
religion had nothing to do with it. Wave after wave of settlers coming after
the very first landing weren't one bit interested in religion.
Read Sydney Ahlstrom's A Religious History of the American People, and learn
that wave after wave of American settlers were interested in little else
Those are the facts, once you get past the fifth-grade history lesson. Grow
up.
Cite any scholar, record, historian that says so, and the evidence he uses to
back it up. You are ranting your own delusional fantasies and that is all you
are doing ..
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
31 Oct 2006 12:41:43 PM |
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George Peatty <pttyg47-1230@copper.net> wrote:
Alric Knebel
You give your religion too much credit, as most of your brainwashed
types do. Those very same principles outlined in the constitution were
practiced by the Greeks and Romans. Voting, representative government
-- the whole nine yards.
I've never seen the Greeks or the Romans mentioned in any of the literature of
the Pilgrims and Puritans. Show me where these people were even aware of them.
That says more about the ignorance of the Pilgrims and Puritans.
And, even if they were, it changes nothing, for it is clear from the documents
themselves what the sources of their inspiration were. You withhold credit
where it is clearly due.
Freedom and democracy are incompatible with the Bible.
The Indians themselves practiced democracy and freedom.
Well, I'm no expert on colonial Indian affairs, but I call ***** unless you
can produce a credible site.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iroquois
http://www.ratical.org/many_worlds/6Nations/
And you need to really get up on your history. You're ridiculous. That
community was founded on religion, but not the country itself. Any
politician who says so is a liar.
You are the liar for saying otherwise. The evidence is in the documents
themselves and the written records of the statements of the men who founded this
country. That evidence is clear, convincing, uneqivocal, final and
irrefragable. No amount of revisionist ***** from a secularist like you can
change that.
Several of the Bill of Rights in the Constitution directly oppose the
ten commandments of the Bible.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
30 Oct 2006 07:46:27 PM |
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In News ei66il0kbu@drn.newsguy.com,, George Peatty at
pttyg47-1230@copper.net, typed this:
In article <12kd59nnh2m4ob6@corp.supernews.com>, Alric Knebel
<alric@[cableone.net]> says...
[snip]
And we're a much better country because of it. Back in those days,
blacks and women and men without property couldn't vote. The
Constitution was taken as a protection of privilege than the
enforcer of rights for all people. Religion doesn't really
facilitate social enlightenment, and social enlightenment is what's
really important to individuals, and our social relationships.
Nonsense. The very notion of government of the people, by the
people, for the people" is a religious one.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
Oh sorry, what you said was just so ludicrous that I had to laugh.
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. – Thomas Jefferson
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| User: "Free Lunch" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
30 Oct 2006 07:30:06 PM |
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On 30 Oct 2006 16:49:25 -0800, in alt.atheism
George Peatty <pttyg47-1230@copper.net> wrote in
<ei66il0kbu@drn.newsguy.com>:
In article <12kd59nnh2m4ob6@corp.supernews.com>, Alric Knebel
<alric@[cableone.net]> says...
[snip]
And we're a much better country because of it. Back in those days,
blacks and women and men without property couldn't vote. The
Constitution was taken as a protection of privilege than the enforcer of
rights for all people. Religion doesn't really facilitate social
enlightenment, and social enlightenment is what's really important to
individuals, and our social relationships.
Nonsense. The very notion of government of the people, by the people, for the
people" is a religious one. The first great political document on American soil
was the Mayflower Compact of 1620, which informs both the Declaration of
Independence and the Constitution.
You'll have to make up your mind. Religion is not democratic and it
doesn't support either the Declaration of Independence or the
Constitution. The Mayflower Compact was developed by people who had no
use for freedom of any other religions.
Historian Paul Johnson, author of A History of the American People, says of this
document: "What was remarkable about this contract was that it was not between
a servant and a master, or a people and a king, but between a group of
like-minded individuals and each other, with God as a witness and symbolic
co-signatory."
Chaplain Peter Marshall says of the Pilgrims: "This was the only place on the
face of the earth where free Christian people were creating their own
government, electing their own civil leadership -- the only time in history, as
a matter of fact, where a nation from scratch was based on God's word."
What hogwash. Religions had been running the west for well over a
thousand years by that point. The only difference was that the Mayflower
theocracy was one that represented people who had been oppressed
elsewhere, but they proudly went on to oppresss others when they had the
opportunity.
Theocracy is evil.
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| User: "BOB" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
29 Oct 2006 10:14:24 PM |
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George Peatty <peattyg47-1230@copper.net> wrote in
news:euaak21p8a1s49jp5gr0i8voojcbtthts8@4ax.com:
On 29 Oct 2006 20:14:03 GMT, (Ray Fischer) wrote:
600,000+ dead in Iraq. Tens of thousands in Afghanistan.
And then there's some less recent wars such as Viet Nam, which
killed about 5,000,000, and WWII, and WWI. And there was Reagan
promoting terrorism in Central America...
It is braindead lunacy to attribute any of this to Christians ..
Why? Weren't most of the political leaders and decision makers for those
wars professed "xtians"?
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| User: "Sylvia R. Dickinson" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
30 Oct 2006 04:30:13 AM |
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George Peatty wrote:
On 29 Oct 2006 20:14:03 GMT, (Ray Fischer) wrote:
600,000+ dead in Iraq. Tens of thousands in Afghanistan.
And then there's some less recent wars such as Viet Nam, which
killed about 5,000,000, and WWII, and WWI. And there was Reagan
promoting terrorism in Central America...
It is braindead lunacy to attribute any of this to Christians ..
"Brain-dead lunacy" is a religious requisite.
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| User: "stoney" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
30 Oct 2006 09:36:30 PM |
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On 30 Oct 2006 02:30:13 -0800, "Sylvia R. Dickinson"
<sylviadickinson@bluebottle.com> wrote in alt.atheism
George Peatty wrote:
On 29 Oct 2006 20:14:03 GMT, (Ray Fischer) wrote:
600,000+ dead in Iraq. Tens of thousands in Afghanistan.
And then there's some less recent wars such as Viet Nam, which
killed about 5,000,000, and WWII, and WWI. And there was Reagan
promoting terrorism in Central America...
It is braindead lunacy to attribute any of this to Christians ..
"Brain-dead lunacy" is a religious requisite.
As people like George continually demonstrate.
--
Fundies and trolls are cordially invited to
shove a wooden cross up their arses and rotate
at a high rate of speed. I trust you'll
be 'blessed' with a plethora of splinters.
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| User: "Michael Gray" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
29 Oct 2006 08:15:58 PM |
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On Sun, 29 Oct 2006 19:11:14 GMT, "Manco" <manco_dollars@net2blah.com>
wrote:
- Refer: <m171h.2083$mX4.756@trndny03>
Ray Fischer wrote:
Manco <manco_dollars@net2blah.com> wrote:
Sylvia R. Dickinson wrote:
Evil of all sorts exists in religion-
Ah more moral equivalence *****. Yeah Islam in 2006 =
Christianity in 2006. ***** that LIE.
Christians kill FAR more people these days.
Evidence? Darfur is done by Muslims *****.
The pope's ban on contraceptives kill a 9/11 sized group EVERY DAY.
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| User: "Sylvia R. Dickinson" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
30 Oct 2006 03:54:32 AM |
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Manco wrote:
Sylvia R. Dickinson wrote:
Evil of all sorts exists in religion-
Ah more moral equivalence *****. Yeah Islam in 2006 = Christianity in
2006. ***** that LIE.
Like I said==evil of all sorts exists in religion.
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| User: "stoney" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
30 Oct 2006 09:49:13 PM |
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On 30 Oct 2006 01:54:32 -0800, "Sylvia R. Dickinson"
<sylviadickinson@bluebottle.com> wrote in alt.atheism
Manco wrote:
Sylvia R. Dickinson wrote:
Evil of all sorts exists in religion-
Ah more moral equivalence *****. Yeah Islam in 2006 = Christianity in
2006. ***** that LIE.
Like I said==evil of all sorts exists in religion.
The Abrahamic superstitions are the epitome of evil.
--
Fundies and trolls are cordially invited to
shove a wooden cross up their arses and rotate
at a high rate of speed. I trust you'll
be 'blessed' with a plethora of splinters.
.
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| User: "Strife767" |
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| Title: Re: More Pain and Suffering Due to Religion |
29 Oct 2006 05:19:14 PM |
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On Sun, 29 Oct 2006 09:35:50 -0500, Manco <manco_dollars@net2blah.com> =
wrote:
Sylvia R. Dickinson wrote:
Evil of all sorts exists in religion-
Ah more moral equivalence *****. Yeah Islam in 2006 =3D Christianit=
y in
2006. ***** that LIE.
Pfff. What's worse, syphilis or herpes? Who gives a *****? We'd be much =
better off without either--thankfully, we don't have to choose between =
just one or the other.
-- =
____________ _____________ __________________
__ ___/_ /__________(_)__ __/____/__ /_ ___/__ /
_____ \_ __/_ ___/_ /__ /_ _ _ \_ /_ __ \__ /
____/ // /_ _ / _ / _ __/ / __/ / / /_/ /_ /
/____/ \__/ /_/ /_/ /_/ \___//_/ \____/ /_/
Skeptic, atheist...and somehow an optimist. Go figure.
I want to change the world.
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