| Topic: |
Science > Abortion |
| User: |
"Mike D." |
| Date: |
10 Mar 2005 08:59:15 PM |
| Object: |
Question |
Why would people who are 'pro choice' come here to defend abortion? What
concern could they have about whether abortion was legal or not,
particularly if they are not women of breeding age. I can understand
pro -life people coming here and speaking against abortion because they
could say they are acting in the interests of a human life who is in no
position to defend themselves. But to be proactive in favor of abortion the
only possible argument that could bemade is that they are defending the
personal sovereignty of the individual, and they would be extremists by
definition, since they are defending a persons rights even at the cost of
another person's life. If that is the case, logically the pro abortion
people should also be strongly in favor of people right to hunt, or even in
favor of people right's to purchase animals and torture them, since the
only one who counts is the person whose sovereignty is at issue( I hope
this isn't too sophisticated an argument for some of you here, judging by
your statements, I know you aren't too strong in logic and reasoning
skills). By these same arguments, pro choicers should be for total
legalization of drugs, legalization of suicide, etcetera. Are you all?
Mike.
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| User: "Andrew W \Paranormal Agnostic" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 08:53:02 PM |
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"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:i6pYd.7135$ju.5038@okepread07...
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:yijYd.162$WI1.49@news02.roc.ny...
There are currently 126,000 children waiting to be adopted in the United
States. Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
Are you trying to use this as justification to murder?
Raising children in a world where they are unwanted and improperly cared for
is the worst kind of child abuse there is - much worse than the five or ten
minutes of pain from an abortion.
--
Andrew W. (Paranormal Agnostic) An interest in the paranormal (spiritual)
but with acknowledgement that it's existence can neither be proved - to
others, nor disproved (agnostic).
History books that contain no lies are extremely dull. The christian bible
is a very interesting book indeed.
Religion Exposed!
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~ajwerner
.
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| User: "Bill Gamelson" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 01:51:12 AM |
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"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au> wrote
in message news:4232598e$0$29446$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:i6pYd.7135$ju.5038@okepread07...
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:yijYd.162$WI1.49@news02.roc.ny...
There are currently 126,000 children waiting to be adopted in the United
States. Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
Are you trying to use this as justification to murder?
Raising children in a world where they are unwanted and improperly cared
for is the worst kind of child abuse there is - much worse than the five
or ten minutes of pain from an abortion.
Oh well why don't we just kill all the people who are in pain then?
--
Christian music and sermons on streaming audio:
www.globalnetministries.com
.
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| User: "Andrew W \Paranormal Agnostic" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 02:26:24 AM |
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"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:WbxYd.7206$ju.1071@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au> wrote
in message news:4232598e$0$29446$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:i6pYd.7135$ju.5038@okepread07...
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:yijYd.162$WI1.49@news02.roc.ny...
There are currently 126,000 children waiting to be adopted in the
United States. Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
Are you trying to use this as justification to murder?
Raising children in a world where they are unwanted and improperly cared
for is the worst kind of child abuse there is - much worse than the five
or ten minutes of pain from an abortion.
Oh well why don't we just kill all the people who are in pain then?
It's too late for them. They've already grown up.
You and others seem to be in the mind that death is as horrifying for a
foetus as it is for an adult.
An adult has a concept of how bad death can be so they suffer from extreme
fear before and as it's happening.
A foetuses has no concept of anything yet so it just feels some pain and
that's it.
It's much more humane than waiting for the person to grow up, experience
life and then killing them.
--
Andrew W. (Paranormal Agnostic) An interest in the paranormal (spiritual)
but with acknowledgement that it's existence can neither be proved - to
others, nor disproved (agnostic).
History books that contain no lies are extremely dull. The christian bible
is a very interesting book indeed.
Religion Exposed!
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~ajwerner
.
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| User: "Frank Dwyer" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 04:54:39 PM |
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Bill Gamelson wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:yijYd.162$WI1.49@news02.roc.ny...
There are currently 126,000 children waiting to be adopted in the United
States. Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
Are you trying to use this as justification to murder?
Are you trying to avoid the issue by equating a legal act (abortion)
with an illegal one (murder)?
.
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| User: "Bill Gamelson" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 05:07:36 PM |
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"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:PkpYd.244$hg.226@news01.roc.ny...
Bill Gamelson wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:yijYd.162$WI1.49@news02.roc.ny...
There are currently 126,000 children waiting to be adopted in the United
States. Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
Are you trying to use this as justification to murder?
Are you trying to avoid the issue by equating a legal act (abortion) with
an illegal one (murder)?
Answer my question, then I'll answer yours.
--
Christian music and sermons on streaming audio:
www.globalnetministries.com
.
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| User: "Frank Dwyer" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 05:13:33 PM |
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Bill Gamelson wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:PkpYd.244$hg.226@news01.roc.ny...
Bill Gamelson wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:yijYd.162$WI1.49@news02.roc.ny...
There are currently 126,000 children waiting to be adopted in the United
States. Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
Are you trying to use this as justification to murder?
Are you trying to avoid the issue by equating a legal act (abortion) with
an illegal one (murder)?
Answer my question, then I'll answer yours.
The answer to your question is obviously "no".
You now have two unanswered questions:
Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
Are you trying to avoid the issue by equating a legal act (abortion)
with an illegal one (murder)?
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| User: "Bill Gamelson" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 05:19:03 PM |
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"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:xCpYd.254$hg.70@news01.roc.ny...
Bill Gamelson wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:PkpYd.244$hg.226@news01.roc.ny...
Bill Gamelson wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:yijYd.162$WI1.49@news02.roc.ny...
There are currently 126,000 children waiting to be adopted in the
United States. Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
Are you trying to use this as justification to murder?
Are you trying to avoid the issue by equating a legal act (abortion) with
an illegal one (murder)?
Answer my question, then I'll answer yours.
The answer to your question is obviously "no".
Ok then, the answer to yours is "no."
You now have two unanswered questions:
Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
How am I supposed to know the answer to that?
Are you trying to avoid the issue by equating a legal act (abortion) with
an illegal one (murder)?
No.
--
Christian music and sermons on streaming audio:
www.globalnetministries.com
.
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| User: "Frank Dwyer" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 05:29:37 PM |
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Bill Gamelson wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:xCpYd.254$hg.70@news01.roc.ny...
Bill Gamelson wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:PkpYd.244$hg.226@news01.roc.ny...
Bill Gamelson wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:yijYd.162$WI1.49@news02.roc.ny...
There are currently 126,000 children waiting to be adopted in the
United States. Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
Are you trying to use this as justification to murder?
Are you trying to avoid the issue by equating a legal act (abortion) with
an illegal one (murder)?
Answer my question, then I'll answer yours.
The answer to your question is obviously "no".
Ok then, the answer to yours is "no."
You now have two unanswered questions:
Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
How am I supposed to know the answer to that?
You aren't, but one can reasonable assume that since there are over
100,000 children waiting to be adopted, those families simply don't exist.
Are you trying to avoid the issue by equating a legal act (abortion) with
an illegal one (murder)?
No.
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| User: "Bill Gamelson" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 05:56:30 PM |
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"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:BRpYd.223$pX1.52@news02.roc.ny...
Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
How am I supposed to know the answer to that?
You aren't,
Then why did you ask me?
but one can reasonable assume that since there are over 100,000 children
waiting to be adopted, those families simply don't exist.
So what is your point?
--
Christian music and sermons on streaming audio:
www.globalnetministries.com
.
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| User: "Patrick Lee Humphrey" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 11:02:45 PM |
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"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> writes:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:BRpYd.223$pX1.52@news02.roc.ny...
Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
How am I supposed to know the answer to that?
You aren't,
Then why did you ask me?
You're the funnyperson demanding that women not be allowed to abort, but
ignoring the logical consequence of obeying your demands.
but one can reasonable assume that since there are over 100,000 children
waiting to be adopted, those families simply don't exist.
So what is your point?
Obviously, if you have to ask, you'll never know. Not that that's a surprise,
or anything...
--
Patrick "The Chief Instigator" Humphrey (patrick@io.com) Houston, Texas
www.chiefinstigator.us.tt/aeros.php (TCI's 2004-05 Houston Aeros)
LAST GAME: Milwaukee 5, Houston 0 (March 10)
NEXT GAME: Saturday, March 12 vs. San Antonio, 7:35
.
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| User: "Frank Dwyer" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 09:09:20 PM |
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Bill Gamelson wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:BRpYd.223$pX1.52@news02.roc.ny...
Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
How am I supposed to know the answer to that?
You aren't,
Then why did you ask me?
but one can reasonable assume that since there are over 100,000 children
waiting to be adopted, those families simply don't exist.
So what is your point?
There aren't a large group of couples waiting to adopt an unwanted
child, they're waiting to adopt a "certain type" of child.
And ultimately...
Adoption is not an alternative to abortion. It's an alternative to
raising the child, after giving birth.
.
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| User: "Bill Gamelson" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 01:55:02 AM |
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"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:A3tYd.272$hg.55@news01.roc.ny...
Bill Gamelson wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:BRpYd.223$pX1.52@news02.roc.ny...
Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
How am I supposed to know the answer to that?
You aren't,
Then why did you ask me?
but one can reasonable assume that since there are over 100,000 children
waiting to be adopted, those families simply don't exist.
So what is your point?
There aren't a large group of couples waiting to adopt an unwanted child,
they're waiting to adopt a "certain type" of child.
And ultimately...
Adoption is not an alternative to abortion. It's an alternative to raising
the child, after giving birth.
That's a guilt relief cop-out. Adoption is an alternate to abortion.
--
Christian music and sermons on streaming audio:
www.globalnetministries.com
.
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| User: "Frank Dwyer" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 02:11:45 AM |
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Bill Gamelson wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:A3tYd.272$hg.55@news01.roc.ny...
Bill Gamelson wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:BRpYd.223$pX1.52@news02.roc.ny...
Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
How am I supposed to know the answer to that?
You aren't,
Then why did you ask me?
but one can reasonable assume that since there are over 100,000 children
waiting to be adopted, those families simply don't exist.
So what is your point?
There aren't a large group of couples waiting to adopt an unwanted child,
they're waiting to adopt a "certain type" of child.
And ultimately...
Adoption is not an alternative to abortion. It's an alternative to raising
the child, after giving birth.
That's a guilt relief cop-out. Adoption is an alternate to abortion.
There is one, and only one, alternative to abortion... birth. While
pregnant, it's either carry to term or abort. There is no third option.
After giving birth, one has a variety of options, adoption being one of
them.
.
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| User: "Attila" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 06:19:40 AM |
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On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 01:55:02 -0600, "Bill Gamelson"
<bgamelson@cox.net> in alt.abortion with message-id
<wfxYd.7208$ju.1427@okepread07> wrote:
And ultimately...
Adoption is not an alternative to abortion. It's an alternative to raising
the child, after giving birth.
That's a guilt relief cop-out. Adoption is an alternate to abortion.
Nonsense. A pregnant woman has only two options:
1. Continue her pregnancy until it is complete.
2. Terminate it before completion.
Please advise how adoption or any thing else does not first require
one of these two options.
Idiot.
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| User: "Paul Duca" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 10:32:40 AM |
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in article wfxYd.7208$ju.1427@okepread07, Bill Gamelson at
wrote on 3/12/05 2:55 AM:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:A3tYd.272$hg.55@news01.roc.ny...
Bill Gamelson wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:BRpYd.223$pX1.52@news02.roc.ny...
Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
How am I supposed to know the answer to that?
You aren't,
Then why did you ask me?
but one can reasonable assume that since there are over 100,000 children
waiting to be adopted, those families simply don't exist.
So what is your point?
There aren't a large group of couples waiting to adopt an unwanted child,
they're waiting to adopt a "certain type" of child.
And ultimately...
Adoption is not an alternative to abortion. It's an alternative to raising
the child, after giving birth.
That's a guilt relief cop-out. Adoption is an alternate to abortion.
Then we only have to restrict abortion for white Protestant women
with healthly fetuses....minority babies and ones born with sicknesses are a
glut on the adoption market.
Paul
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| User: "Attila" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 05:46:43 PM |
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On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:39:06 -0600, "Bill Gamelson"
<bgamelson@cox.net> in alt.abortion with message-id
<i6pYd.7135$ju.5038@okepread07> wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:yijYd.162$WI1.49@news02.roc.ny...
There are currently 126,000 children waiting to be adopted in the United
States. Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
Are you trying to use this as justification to murder?
Abortion is not murder.
.
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| User: "Bill Gamelson" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 05:59:55 PM |
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"Attila" <prochoice@here.now> wrote in message
news:oeb431t86enrogi22iav7o9o7q3io3plp2@4ax.com...
On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:39:06 -0600, "Bill Gamelson"
<bgamelson@cox.net> in alt.abortion with message-id
<i6pYd.7135$ju.5038@okepread07> wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:yijYd.162$WI1.49@news02.roc.ny...
There are currently 126,000 children waiting to be adopted in the United
States. Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
Are you trying to use this as justification to murder?
Abortion is not murder.
It most certainly is. It has been proven that life begins at conception.
Even your buddie John Kerry admited this. To abort a living human being is
murder, whether it is currently legal or not.
--
Christian music and sermons on streaming audio:
www.globalnetministries.com
.
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| User: "Patrick Lee Humphrey" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 09:55:19 PM |
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"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> writes:
"Attila" <prochoice@here.now> wrote in message
news:oeb431t86enrogi22iav7o9o7q3io3plp2@4ax.com...
On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:39:06 -0600, "Bill Gamelson"
<bgamelson@cox.net> in alt.abortion with message-id
<i6pYd.7135$ju.5038@okepread07> wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:yijYd.162$WI1.49@news02.roc.ny...
There are currently 126,000 children waiting to be adopted in the United
States. Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
Are you trying to use this as justification to murder?
Abortion is not murder.
It most certainly is. It has been proven that life begins at conception.
It hasn't been (and can't be) proved that personhood begins at conception --
and that's the issue at hand.
Even your buddie John Kerry admited this. To abort a living human being is
murder, whether it is currently legal or not.
Idiot. Murder is illegal, by definition. Abortion is legal. Connect the
dots, if your alleged god will let you do so.
--
Patrick "The Chief Instigator" Humphrey (patrick@io.com) Houston, Texas
www.chiefinstigator.us.tt/aeros.php (TCI's 2004-05 Houston Aeros)
LAST GAME: Milwaukee 5, Houston 0 (March 10)
NEXT GAME: Saturday, March 12 vs. San Antonio, 7:35
.
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| User: "Andrew W \Paranormal Agnostic" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 09:04:56 PM |
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"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:3iqYd.7153$ju.3556@okepread07...
"Attila" <prochoice@here.now> wrote in message
news:oeb431t86enrogi22iav7o9o7q3io3plp2@4ax.com...
On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:39:06 -0600, "Bill Gamelson"
<bgamelson@cox.net> in alt.abortion with message-id
<i6pYd.7135$ju.5038@okepread07> wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:yijYd.162$WI1.49@news02.roc.ny...
There are currently 126,000 children waiting to be adopted in the
United
States. Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
Are you trying to use this as justification to murder?
Abortion is not murder.
It most certainly is. It has been proven that life begins at conception.
Even your buddie John Kerry admited this. To abort a living human being
is murder, whether it is currently legal or not.
How do you know that God doesn't plan abortions on purpose to teach the
potential parents some important lessons about life?
--
Andrew W. (Paranormal Agnostic) An interest in the paranormal (spiritual)
but with acknowledgement that it's existence can neither be proved - to
others, nor disproved (agnostic).
History books that contain no lies are extremely dull. The christian bible
is a very interesting book indeed.
Religion Exposed!
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~ajwerner
.
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| User: "Craig Chilton -- On 1/20/09, itll be BYE-BYE Bushie! Then, GOOD RIDDANCE!" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 08:54:29 PM |
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On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 17:59:55 -0600,
Bill Gamelson <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote:
"Attila" <prochoice@here.now> wrote:
[ ... ]
Abortion is not murder.
It most certainly is. It has been proven that life begins
at conception.
ROTFL!!!!
Fine. Do this experiment: combine some DEAD gametes in a
petri dish and see how many LIVE zygotes you get. It's funnier
than hell to watch you utterly MINDLESS lemmings of the RRR
cult falling hook, line, and sinker for your leaders' lying and
propagandistic tripe. Especially since that serves to REMIND
all *sensible* people of just **how** DISHONEST the cult's
leaders are (for spewing such mindless lies) and how IGNORANT
the lemmings are, for being gullible enough to actually *believe*
such mindlessness.
Go to New York City. put an ad in a local newspaper letting
everyone know that you're looking for that person who's willing to
sell the deed to the Brooklyn Bridge for a bargain-basement price.
[ANTI-Choicers: some of the world's DUMBEST people!)
-- Craig Chilton <xanadu222_@mchsi.com>
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
Dumb, Dumber, and "Dumberer" STILL...
Homophobes = incredibly-ignorant tools \
Racists = incredibly-ignorant tools \
Anti-Choicers = incredibly-ignorant tools \ = Mindless BIGOTS
Taliban = incredibly-ignorant tools /
RRR Cultists = incredibly-ignorant tools /
Anti-Semites = incredibly-ignorant tools /
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
(To e-mail me, simply remove the space ( _ ) from my address.)
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| User: "Attila" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 07:01:28 PM |
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On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 17:59:55 -0600, "Bill Gamelson"
<bgamelson@cox.net> in alt.abortion with message-id
<3iqYd.7153$ju.3556@okepread07> wrote:
"Attila" <prochoice@here.now> wrote in message
news:oeb431t86enrogi22iav7o9o7q3io3plp2@4ax.com...
On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:39:06 -0600, "Bill Gamelson"
<bgamelson@cox.net> in alt.abortion with message-id
<i6pYd.7135$ju.5038@okepread07> wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:yijYd.162$WI1.49@news02.roc.ny...
There are currently 126,000 children waiting to be adopted in the United
States. Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
Are you trying to use this as justification to murder?
Abortion is not murder.
It most certainly is. It has been proven that life begins at conception.
Irrelevant.
Even your buddie John Kerry admited this. To abort a living human being is
murder, whether it is currently legal or not.
A fetus is not a human being, and your definition of murder is wrong.
.
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| User: "Bill Gamelson" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 07:29:47 PM |
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"Attila" <prochoice@here.now> wrote in message
news:3qf4319aqbhfe1otqbo7oc252ub1nfj25t@4ax.com...
On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 17:59:55 -0600, "Bill Gamelson"
<bgamelson@cox.net> in alt.abortion with message-id
<3iqYd.7153$ju.3556@okepread07> wrote:
"Attila" <prochoice@here.now> wrote in message
news:oeb431t86enrogi22iav7o9o7q3io3plp2@4ax.com...
On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:39:06 -0600, "Bill Gamelson"
<bgamelson@cox.net> in alt.abortion with message-id
<i6pYd.7135$ju.5038@okepread07> wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:yijYd.162$WI1.49@news02.roc.ny...
There are currently 126,000 children waiting to be adopted in the
United
States. Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
Are you trying to use this as justification to murder?
Abortion is not murder.
It most certainly is. It has been proven that life begins at conception.
Irrelevant.
Even your buddie John Kerry admited this. To abort a living human being
is
murder, whether it is currently legal or not.
A fetus is not a human being, and your definition of murder is wrong.
Yes it is and no it's not.
--
Christian music and sermons on streaming audio:
www.globalnetministries.com
.
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| User: "Craig Chilton -- On 1/20/09, itll be BYE-BYE Bushie! Then, GOOD RIDDANCE!" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 08:58:36 PM |
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On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 19:29:47 -0600,
Bill Gamelson <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote:
"Attila" <prochoice@here.now> wrote:
[ ... ]
A fetus is not a human being, and your definition
of murder is wrong.
Yes it is and no it's not.
LOL!!!! Okay, Clueless Wonder. Let's see you DISPROVE
**any** of the FACTS contained in this outline:
ANALYZING ABORTION-ON-REQUEST* in the USA
*(Abortion Rights as they have existed since 1-22-73)
Abortion terminates entities (z/e/fs: zygotes, embryoes &
fetuses, up until the 7th month of gestation) which have ALL
of these characteristics in common with sperm and ova:
-- Human
-- Unique
-- As a stage of development, indispensable to future birth
-- Have NEVER experienced conscious awareness
-- Alive
...which makes it hypocritical when abortion opponents
try to defend z/e/fs but NOT sperm and ova.
And the Bible, which is the primary moral authority for the
majority of Americans:
-- In NO way condemns abortion
-- Doesn't even MENTION abortion
-- By Jesus' day, abortion had been around for 1,000 yrs.
-- Contains NO defenses of s/o/z/e/fs
-- Reserves ALL of its protection for already-BORN people
-- That the Bible regards personhood to begin at BIRTH is
made clear by it's immense emphasis on the importance
of BIRTH order, and BIRTHrights.
-- In certain cases, condemned BABIES to horrible deaths
-- Never indicates that there is anything "special" about
fertilization
-- Thus making z/e/f and sperm & ova of EQUAL worth
Abortion-on-request enables women to:
-- Put their lives back on track immediately
-- Restore their well-being to pre-unplanned pregnancy levels
-- Vast majority of women are happy with this decision
-- Most women have no regrets
-- Restore their full range of future opportunities
-- Avoid physical difficulties of a 9-month pregnancy
-- Especially important for young girls, ~12-16
-- Statistically 6-10 times safer than carrying-to-term
-- Avoid the trauma of adopting-out, and wondering later
-- Avoid possibility of changing mind about adopting-out
-- Reduce likelihood of long-term economic deprivation
-- Avoid bringing child into less-loving home
-- Avoid bringing child into unstable environment
-- Wait until timing is better before having children
-- Who then are MORE likely to be loved
-- Who then are MORE likely to be in stable home
-- And thus are LESS like to have troubled childhoods
-- And therefore more likely NOT to become criminals
-- And thus are MORE likely to become successful
Legal abortion-on-request:
-- Is exponentially safer than illegal abortions
-- Thus saving the lives of hundreds or thousands of women/yr.
-- Has been available throughout the USA since early 1973
-- Between 1973 and 2000, 30 million women have had them
-- Between 1973 and 2000, 40 million abortions have been done
Other related facts include:
-- MOST women who have abortions go on to HAVE kids later,
when the timing is better
-- Those children would NOT have been born if the abortions
had not taken place earlier, because the same sperm and
ova would not have matched up.
-- Those "2nd-round" kids STARTED reaching age 13 in
significant numbers by 1988. By the early 1990s, millions
of those "2nd-round" kids were in their mid-teens by the
early 1990s.
-- Mid-teens is the highest risk age for crime, and this
continues into the early 20s.
-- As pointed out above, wanted and loved children are
LESS prone to criminal behavior.
-- By 1995, millions of "2nd-round kids" were entering the
workforce. Perhaps a million-plus MORE have entered it
every year SINCE. By 2000, the oldest ones had reached
the age where they could be getting quite successful.
-- Since the early 1990s, the rate of violent crime in the USA
has declined dramatically, and by 2000 was at 40-year
lows in many categories.
-- The decade of the 1990s, and the year 2002 to date, in
the USA, has been the most economically-dynamic of
any nation in the entire history of the world.
Although the exact figures may be impossible to derive, the
probability that abortion-on-request has SIGNIFICANTLY benefited
all of America's society in terms of the crime rate and the economy
is QUITE strong, despite the temporary anomaly caused by the attack
on Sept. 11, 2001. And a strong U.S. economy benefits the entire
world.
-- Craig Chilton <xanadu222_@mchsi.com>
.
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| User: "Bill Gamelson" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 01:53:30 AM |
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"Craig Chilton -- On 1/20/09, it'll be BYE-BYE Bushie! Then, GOOD RIDDANCE!"
<xanadu222_@mchsi.com> wrote in message
news:hem431tilee98ccun60dnpumo8n1u1r5ha@4ax.com...
On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 19:29:47 -0600,
Bill Gamelson <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote:
"Attila" <prochoice@here.now> wrote:
[ ... ]
A fetus is not a human being, and your definition
of murder is wrong.
Yes it is and no it's not.
LOL!!!! Okay, Clueless Wonder. Let's see you DISPROVE
**any** of the FACTS contained in this outline:
Let's see you treat me with a little human respect first.
--
Christian music and sermons on streaming audio:
www.globalnetministries.com
.
|
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| User: "Craig Chilton -- On 1/20/09, itll be BYE-BYE Bushie! Then, GOOD RIDDANCE!" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 11:11:59 AM |
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On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 01:53:30 -0600,
Bill Gamelson <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote:
Craig Chilton <xanadu222_@mchsi.com> wrote:
Bill Gamelson <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote:
"Attila" <prochoice@here.now> wrote:
[ ... ]
A fetus is not a human being, and your definition
of murder is wrong.
Yes it is and no it's not.
LOL!!!! Okay, Clueless Wonder. Let's see you DISPROVE
**any** of the FACTS contained in this outline:
Let's see you treat me with a little human respect first.
Do you DESERVE any?
You mindlessly support an utterly LOATHSOME agenda that seeks
to impose IMMENSE hardship upon no fewer than tens of MILLIONS
of women by FORCING childbirth upon them. AGAINST their will.
Resulting in the DENIAL of their rights... their RELEGATION to
second-class-citizen status... their INVOLUNTARY SERVITUDE to
mere, NON-sentient developing entities which are, in all important
ways, equivalent to sperm and ova (human, unique, NON-sentient,
a stage of development without which NO births would occur --
and alive); entities which the WOMEN would very properly, under
the circumstances, regard to be parasitic. Further manifestations of
that hardship would be the DISRUPTION of their well-being, both
short-term and long-term (as in, for decades or a lifetime)... and the
DESTRUCTION of countless of their opportunities.
That makes you a LOSER deserving of NO respect. A bottom-
feeder. A sociopathic rat turd in humanity's punchbowl.
Here again is the outline that neither you, nor any other of your
hateful and ignorant ilk will EVER be able to disprove ANY part of.
And it will continue to INDICT Anti-choice, until that loathsome
agenda joins its first cousin in bigotry, segregation -- in EXTINCTION.
ANALYZING ABORTION-ON-REQUEST* in the USA
*(Abortion Rights as they have existed since 1-22-73)
Abortion terminates entities (z/e/fs: zygotes, embryoes &
fetuses, up until the 7th month of gestation) which have ALL
of these characteristics in common with sperm and ova:
-- Human
-- Unique
-- As a stage of development, indispensable to future birth
-- Have NEVER experienced conscious awareness
-- Alive
...which makes it hypocritical when abortion opponents
try to defend z/e/fs but NOT sperm and ova.
And the Bible, which is the primary moral authority for the
majority of Americans:
-- In NO way condemns abortion
-- Doesn't even MENTION abortion
-- By Jesus' day, abortion had been around for 1,000 yrs.
-- Contains NO defenses of s/o/z/e/fs
-- Reserves ALL of its protection for already-BORN people
-- That the Bible regards personhood to begin at BIRTH is
made clear by it's immense emphasis on the importance
of BIRTH order, and BIRTHrights.
-- In certain cases, condemned BABIES to horrible deaths
-- Never indicates that there is anything "special" about
fertilization
-- Thus making z/e/f and sperm & ova of EQUAL worth
Abortion-on-request enables women to:
-- Put their lives back on track immediately
-- Restore their well-being to pre-unplanned pregnancy levels
-- Vast majority of women are happy with this decision
-- Most women have no regrets
-- Restore their full range of future opportunities
-- Avoid physical difficulties of a 9-month pregnancy
-- Especially important for young girls, ~12-16
-- Statistically 6-10 times safer than carrying-to-term
-- Avoid the trauma of adopting-out, and wondering later
-- Avoid possibility of changing mind about adopting-out
-- Reduce likelihood of long-term economic deprivation
-- Avoid bringing child into less-loving home
-- Avoid bringing child into unstable environment
-- Wait until timing is better before having children
-- Who then are MORE likely to be loved
-- Who then are MORE likely to be in stable home
-- And thus are LESS like to have troubled childhoods
-- And therefore more likely NOT to become criminals
-- And thus are MORE likely to become successful
Legal abortion-on-request:
-- Is exponentially safer than illegal abortions
-- Thus saving the lives of hundreds or thousands of women/yr.
-- Has been available throughout the USA since early 1973
-- Between 1973 and 2000, 30 million women have had them
-- Between 1973 and 2000, 40 million abortions have been done
Other related facts include:
-- MOST women who have abortions go on to HAVE kids later,
when the timing is better
-- Those children would NOT have been born if the abortions
had not taken place earlier, because the same sperm and
ova would not have matched up.
-- Those "2nd-round" kids STARTED reaching age 13 in
significant numbers by 1988. By the early 1990s, millions
of those "2nd-round" kids were in their mid-teens by the
early 1990s.
-- Mid-teens is the highest risk age for crime, and this
continues into the early 20s.
-- As pointed out above, wanted and loved children are
LESS prone to criminal behavior.
-- By 1995, millions of "2nd-round kids" were entering the
workforce. Perhaps a million-plus MORE have entered it
every year SINCE. By 2000, the oldest ones had reached
the age where they could be getting quite successful.
-- Since the early 1990s, the rate of violent crime in the USA
has declined dramatically, and by 2000 was at 40-year
lows in many categories.
-- The decade of the 1990s, and the year 2002 to date, in
the USA, has been the most economically-dynamic of
any nation in the entire history of the world.
Although the exact figures may be impossible to derive, the
probability that abortion-on-request has SIGNIFICANTLY benefited
all of America's society in terms of the crime rate and the economy
is QUITE strong, despite the temporary anomaly caused by the attack
on Sept. 11, 2001. And a strong U.S. economy benefits the entire
world.
-- Originally posted to alt.abortion
and talk.abortion on Aug. 13, 2000
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
-- Craig Chilton <xanadu222_@mchsi.com>
.
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| User: "Attila" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 06:20:29 AM |
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On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 01:53:30 -0600, "Bill Gamelson"
<bgamelson@cox.net> in alt.abortion with message-id
<4exYd.7207$ju.1076@okepread07> wrote:
"Craig Chilton -- On 1/20/09, it'll be BYE-BYE Bushie! Then, GOOD RIDDANCE!"
<xanadu222_@mchsi.com> wrote in message
news:hem431tilee98ccun60dnpumo8n1u1r5ha@4ax.com...
On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 19:29:47 -0600,
Bill Gamelson <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote:
"Attila" <prochoice@here.now> wrote:
[ ... ]
A fetus is not a human being, and your definition
of murder is wrong.
Yes it is and no it's not.
LOL!!!! Okay, Clueless Wonder. Let's see you DISPROVE
**any** of the FACTS contained in this outline:
Let's see you treat me with a little human respect first.
That is amusing considering some of your comments.
.
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| User: "Paul Duca" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 10:33:09 AM |
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in article 4exYd.7207$ju.1076@okepread07, Bill Gamelson at
wrote on 3/12/05 2:53 AM:
"Craig Chilton -- On 1/20/09, it'll be BYE-BYE Bushie! Then, GOOD RIDDANCE!"
<xanadu222_@mchsi.com> wrote in message
news:hem431tilee98ccun60dnpumo8n1u1r5ha@4ax.com...
On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 19:29:47 -0600,
Bill Gamelson < > wrote:
"Attila" <prochoice@here.now> wrote:
[ ... ]
A fetus is not a human being, and your definition
of murder is wrong.
Yes it is and no it's not.
LOL!!!! Okay, Clueless Wonder. Let's see you DISPROVE
**any** of the FACTS contained in this outline:
Let's see you treat me with a little human respect first.
Why should we do anything for you that God WON'T?
Paul
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| User: "Attila" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
11 Mar 2005 09:29:56 PM |
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On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 19:29:47 -0600, "Bill Gamelson"
<bgamelson@cox.net> in alt.abortion with message-id
<kCrYd.7168$ju.6350@okepread07> wrote:
"Attila" <prochoice@here.now> wrote in message
news:3qf4319aqbhfe1otqbo7oc252ub1nfj25t@4ax.com...
On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 17:59:55 -0600, "Bill Gamelson"
<bgamelson@cox.net> in alt.abortion with message-id
<3iqYd.7153$ju.3556@okepread07> wrote:
"Attila" <prochoice@here.now> wrote in message
news:oeb431t86enrogi22iav7o9o7q3io3plp2@4ax.com...
On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 16:39:06 -0600, "Bill Gamelson"
<bgamelson@cox.net> in alt.abortion with message-id
<i6pYd.7135$ju.5038@okepread07> wrote:
"Frank Dwyer" <fdwyer@XcitlinkX.net> wrote in message
news:yijYd.162$WI1.49@news02.roc.ny...
There are currently 126,000 children waiting to be adopted in the
United
States. Where are the "caring" families who can't have children?
Are you trying to use this as justification to murder?
Abortion is not murder.
It most certainly is. It has been proven that life begins at conception.
Irrelevant.
Even your buddie John Kerry admited this. To abort a living human being
is
murder, whether it is currently legal or not.
A fetus is not a human being, and your definition of murder is wrong.
Yes it is and no it's not.
The status of human being is a socio-legal status requiring live birth
to qualify.
My definition of murder is from Webster. Argue with them.
.
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| User: "Bill Gamelson" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 02:11:04 AM |
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"Attila" <prochoice@here.now> wrote in message
news:6fo4319u5kp2hhkh1hoek80tlvjskk1p7u@4ax.com...
The status of human being is a socio-legal status requiring live birth
to qualify.
You have no proof of that.
--
Christian music and sermons on streaming audio:
www.globalnetministries.com
.
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| User: "Attila" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 06:22:34 AM |
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On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 02:11:04 -0600, "Bill Gamelson"
<bgamelson@cox.net> in alt.abortion with message-id
<zuxYd.7215$ju.1560@okepread07> wrote:
"Attila" <prochoice@here.now> wrote in message
news:6fo4319u5kp2hhkh1hoek80tlvjskk1p7u@4ax.com...
The status of human being is a socio-legal status requiring live birth
to qualify.
You have no proof of that.
It is proven by the variety of laws which require live birth to be
included. Such as citizenship, inheritance, tax laws, property
ownership, and census laws just to name a few.
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