| Topic: |
Science > Abortion |
| User: |
"Mike D." |
| Date: |
10 Mar 2005 08:59:15 PM |
| Object: |
Question |
Why would people who are 'pro choice' come here to defend abortion? What
concern could they have about whether abortion was legal or not,
particularly if they are not women of breeding age. I can understand
pro -life people coming here and speaking against abortion because they
could say they are acting in the interests of a human life who is in no
position to defend themselves. But to be proactive in favor of abortion the
only possible argument that could bemade is that they are defending the
personal sovereignty of the individual, and they would be extremists by
definition, since they are defending a persons rights even at the cost of
another person's life. If that is the case, logically the pro abortion
people should also be strongly in favor of people right to hunt, or even in
favor of people right's to purchase animals and torture them, since the
only one who counts is the person whose sovereignty is at issue( I hope
this isn't too sophisticated an argument for some of you here, judging by
your statements, I know you aren't too strong in logic and reasoning
skills). By these same arguments, pro choicers should be for total
legalization of drugs, legalization of suicide, etcetera. Are you all?
Mike.
.
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| User: "Andrew W \Paranormal Agnostic" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
13 Mar 2005 02:04:01 PM |
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"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:SrKYd.7283$ju.2494@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au> wrote
in message news:42336b4d$0$5186$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:5PJYd.7275$ju.1097@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote in message news:42335eb9$0$22223$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:VPHYd.7257$ju.5181@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote in message
news:423345f6$0$12026$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
So then everyone who's ever been a soldier in a war is going to
hell.
If they don't have the Lord's forgivness they will.
How can one be forgiven for something which they were coerced into
doing or did on purpose?
Because according to the Bible, all sins are forgivable except one:
Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.
(Mat 12:31) Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy
shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost
shall not be forgiven unto men.
In that case most atheists will not go to hell because most atheists
don't blaspheme the holy spirit, because why would someone blaspheme
something which they don't even believe exists?
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth
and a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for
our sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
And what if the reason for one's denial and rejection of the above is
because they were acquainted with the above through a bible thumping
preacher who tried to force it all down one's throat? Then it's that
preacher's fault for being such an aggressive and untactful jerk, isn't it.
And because it's blasphemy (according to you), that person will never be
forgiven and thus it is futile for that person to continue living in this
world.
Is that right?
I think you've really painted yourself into a corner this time.
--
Andrew W. (Paranormal Agnostic) An interest in the paranormal (spiritual)
but with acknowledgement that it's existence can neither be proved - to
others, nor disproved (agnostic).
History books that contain no lies are extremely dull. The christian bible
is a very interesting book indeed.
Religion Exposed!
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~ajwerner
.
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| User: "Andrew W \Paranormal Agnostic" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 07:07:06 PM |
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"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:SrKYd.7283$ju.2494@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au> wrote
in message news:42336b4d$0$5186$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:5PJYd.7275$ju.1097@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote in message news:42335eb9$0$22223$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:VPHYd.7257$ju.5181@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote in message
news:423345f6$0$12026$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
So then everyone who's ever been a soldier in a war is going to
hell.
If they don't have the Lord's forgivness they will.
How can one be forgiven for something which they were coerced into
doing or did on purpose?
Because according to the Bible, all sins are forgivable except one:
Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.
(Mat 12:31) Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy
shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost
shall not be forgiven unto men.
In that case most atheists will not go to hell because most atheists
don't blaspheme the holy spirit, because why would someone blaspheme
something which they don't even believe exists?
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth
and a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for
our sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
Incorrect. Blasphemy against the holy spirit is speaking ill of the holy
spirit - saying nasty things about it. Check your dictionary.
Atheists don't bother saying bad things about the holy spirit because as far
as they are concerned it doesn't exist.
And since when is it a law that we *must* believe in the christian god and
the bible?
Where is the commandment that says - Thou shalt believe in the Lord your God
and his word?
If it's not a commandment then not doing it cannot be a sin.
The law has to be there before it can be broken.
And what happened to free choice? We have the free choice to believe what we
see as truth.
The problem is that the christian god isn't prepared to accept our
alternative choice so it isn't a choice at all, because when you give
someone a choice, you have to be prepared to accept both of them but the
christian god only accepts one of them, and therefore we only have one
amicable choice, and one choice is no choice.
--
Andrew W. (Paranormal Agnostic) An interest in the paranormal (spiritual)
but with acknowledgement that it's existence can neither be proved - to
others, nor disproved (agnostic).
History books that contain no lies are extremely dull. The christian bible
is a very interesting book indeed.
Religion Exposed!
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~ajwerner
.
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
13 Mar 2005 11:41:31 PM |
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Bill Gamelson <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote:
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au> wrote
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
You realize, of course, that you are guilty of such blasphemy because
you refuse to accept Mohammed as the true prophet.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
.
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| User: "Jim Ledford" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 06:07:10 PM |
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Bill Gamelson wrote:
[....]
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
clarity is such a beautiful thing in and of itself.
good job Bill,
Jim
--
Christian music and sermons on streaming audio:
www.globalnetministries.com
.
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| User: "Andrew W \Paranormal Agnostic" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 07:22:44 PM |
|
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"Jim Ledford" <jimled@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:4233842E.2DD56122@bellsouth.net...
Bill Gamelson wrote:
[....]
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth
and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
clarity is such a beautiful thing in and of itself.
good job Bill,
Jim
To brainwashed individuals everything is perfectly clear.
--
Andrew W. (Paranormal Agnostic) An interest in the paranormal (spiritual)
but with acknowledgement that it's existence can neither be proved - to
others, nor disproved (agnostic).
History books that contain no lies are extremely dull. The christian bible
is a very interesting book indeed.
Religion Exposed!
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~ajwerner
.
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| User: "Your Name Here=Harvey" |
|
| Title: Re: Question |
13 Mar 2005 02:54:38 PM |
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In article <423395e5$0$29450$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au>,
nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au says...
"Jim Ledford" <jimled@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:4233842E.2DD56122@bellsouth.net...
Bill Gamelson wrote:
[....]
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth
and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
clarity is such a beautiful thing in and of itself.
good job Bill,
Jim
To brainwashed individuals everything is perfectly clear.
--
Andrew W. (Paranormal Agnostic) An interest in the paranormal (spiritual)
but with acknowledgement that it's existence can neither be proved - to
others, nor disproved (agnostic).
History books that contain no lies are extremely dull. The christian bible
is a very interesting book indeed.
Religion Exposed!
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~ajwerner
There is something called the 'truth' - the way things actually happened.
Christians forget that - that there are Jews and Muslims, and others who
have a different view of world events than what christians have.
www.tjresearch.info
Is a more accurate view of what actually happened, and whether
Jesus was a myth or not?
Down with current christianity - because it is a lie.
Jesus did not die on the cross and rose again (resurrection).
He did live.
www.tombofjesus.com
Today's christianity has to change, or die.
Harvey
.
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| User: "David W. Barnes" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 06:09:49 PM |
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In article <4233842E.2DD56122@bellsouth.net>, Jim Ledford
<jimled@bellsouth.net> wrote:
Bill Gamelson wrote:
[....]
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
clarity is such a beautiful thing in and of itself.
Why is it no one can explain how believing something purely on "faith"
is "clarity?"
.
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| User: "Tamagotchi" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
13 Mar 2005 10:20:49 AM |
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"David W. Barnes" <dbarnes@aol.com> wrote in message
news:120320051609497694%dbarnes@aol.com...
In article <4233842E.2DD56122@bellsouth.net>, Jim Ledford
<jimled@bellsouth.net> wrote:
Bill Gamelson wrote:
[....]
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his
son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a
myth and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for
our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
clarity is such a beautiful thing in and of itself.
Why is it no one can explain how believing something purely on "faith"
is "clarity?"
And yet in a prior post you have declared "God doesn't exist". Since a
negative cannot ever be proven, it seems that your declaration is as purely
a faith-based statement as one can articulate.
.
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| User: "David W. Barnes" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
13 Mar 2005 12:19:59 PM |
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In article <P86dnfn9_eVm-qnfRVn-ug@adelphia.com>, Tamagotchi
<tamagotchi56@yahoo.com> wrote:
"David W. Barnes" <dbarnes@aol.com> wrote in message
news:120320051609497694%dbarnes@aol.com...
In article <4233842E.2DD56122@bellsouth.net>, Jim Ledford
<jimled@bellsouth.net> wrote:
Bill Gamelson wrote:
[....]
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his
son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a
myth and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for
our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
clarity is such a beautiful thing in and of itself.
Why is it no one can explain how believing something purely on "faith"
is "clarity?"
And yet in a prior post you have declared "God doesn't exist". Since a
negative cannot ever be proven, it seems that your declaration is as purely
a faith-based statement as one can articulate.
Not at all. I just don't accept things as true because we can't prove
they are untrue. Can you prove Pluto isn't inhabited by green
creatures made of cream cheese? No? Must be true then.
.
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| User: "Tamagotchi" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
13 Mar 2005 03:28:14 PM |
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"David W. Barnes" <dbarnes@aol.com> wrote in message
news:130320051019591872%dbarnes@aol.com...
In article <P86dnfn9_eVm-qnfRVn-ug@adelphia.com>, Tamagotchi
<tamagotchi56@yahoo.com> wrote:
"David W. Barnes" <dbarnes@aol.com> wrote in message
news:120320051609497694%dbarnes@aol.com...
In article <4233842E.2DD56122@bellsouth.net>, Jim Ledford
<jimled@bellsouth.net> wrote:
Bill Gamelson wrote:
[....]
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I
see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of
his
son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a
myth and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross
for
our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
clarity is such a beautiful thing in and of itself.
Why is it no one can explain how believing something purely on "faith"
is "clarity?"
And yet in a prior post you have declared "God doesn't exist". Since a
negative cannot ever be proven, it seems that your declaration is as
purely
a faith-based statement as one can articulate.
Not at all. I just don't accept things as true because we can't prove
they are untrue. Can you prove Pluto isn't inhabited by green
creatures made of cream cheese? No? Must be true then.
Once again, you're wrong. You didn't say "I don't accept the existence of
god because it has yet to be proven". This would imply that the facts are
yet to be known, but if they are forthcoming, that you would then believe
that god does exist. You however said, "God doesn't exist" which is an
uncompromising statement of fact. Using your analogy, YOU are the one
saying "Pluto is not inhabited by creatures made of cream cheese". That is
a purely faith-based statement...grounded on nothing.
.
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| User: "David W. Barnes" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
13 Mar 2005 11:56:52 PM |
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In article <0NqdnZqvYOl1MqnfRVn-jA@adelphia.com>, Tamagotchi
<tamagotchi56@yahoo.com> wrote:
"David W. Barnes" <dbarnes@aol.com> wrote in message
news:130320051019591872%dbarnes@aol.com...
In article <P86dnfn9_eVm-qnfRVn-ug@adelphia.com>, Tamagotchi
<tamagotchi56@yahoo.com> wrote:
"David W. Barnes" <dbarnes@aol.com> wrote in message
news:120320051609497694%dbarnes@aol.com...
In article <4233842E.2DD56122@bellsouth.net>, Jim Ledford
<jimled@bellsouth.net> wrote:
Bill Gamelson wrote:
[....]
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I
see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of
his
son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a
myth and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross
for
our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
clarity is such a beautiful thing in and of itself.
Why is it no one can explain how believing something purely on "faith"
is "clarity?"
And yet in a prior post you have declared "God doesn't exist". Since a
negative cannot ever be proven, it seems that your declaration is as
purely
a faith-based statement as one can articulate.
Not at all. I just don't accept things as true because we can't prove
they are untrue. Can you prove Pluto isn't inhabited by green
creatures made of cream cheese? No? Must be true then.
Once again, you're wrong. You didn't say "I don't accept the existence of
god because it has yet to be proven".
Right. How do you prove what isn't true?
This would imply that the facts are
yet to be known, but if they are forthcoming, that you would then believe
that god does exist. You however said, "God doesn't exist" which is an
uncompromising statement of fact.
He doesn't. At least, not the God Christians point to. We know to
much about the real causes of life, the universe, etc.
Using your analogy, YOU are the one
saying "Pluto is not inhabited by creatures made of cream cheese". That is
a purely faith-based statement...grounded on nothing.
Except fact.
.
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| User: "Jim Ledford" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
13 Mar 2005 03:59:32 AM |
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David W. Barnes wrote:
Jim Ledford wrote:
Bill Gamelson wrote:
[....]
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
clarity is such a beautiful thing in and of itself.
Why is it no one can explain how believing something purely on "faith"
is "clarity?"
in this particular case I was remarking on how well Bill
did with his explanation of exactly what blasphemy of the
Holy Spirit actually is. Bill was clear, concise and to
the point without adding anything or leaving anything out.
if more Christians would only repeat the Word of God that
clear, there'd be a lot less confusion and confusion really
has no place in a Christian's walk with The Holy Spirit.
Jim, Christian
thank you God.
.
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| User: "Attila" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
13 Mar 2005 05:24:42 AM |
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On Sun, 13 Mar 2005 04:59:32 -0500, Jim Ledford <jimled@bellsouth.net>
in alt.abortion with message-id <42340F04.8FDE71D7@bellsouth.net>
wrote:
David W. Barnes wrote:
Jim Ledford wrote:
Bill Gamelson wrote:
[....]
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
clarity is such a beautiful thing in and of itself.
Why is it no one can explain how believing something purely on "faith"
is "clarity?"
in this particular case I was remarking on how well Bill
did with his explanation of exactly what blasphemy of the
Holy Spirit actually is. Bill was clear, concise and to
the point without adding anything or leaving anything out.
if more Christians would only repeat the Word of God that
clear, there'd be a lot less confusion and confusion really
has no place in a Christian's walk with The Holy Spirit.
Jim, Christian
thank you God.
Since there is no evidence your god even exists does whatever is said
really matter?
.
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| User: "Jim Ledford" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
13 Mar 2005 05:32:22 AM |
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Attila wrote:
Jim Ledford wrote:
David W. Barnes wrote:
Jim Ledford wrote:
Bill Gamelson wrote:
[....]
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
clarity is such a beautiful thing in and of itself.
Why is it no one can explain how believing something purely on "faith"
is "clarity?"
in this particular case I was remarking on how well Bill
did with his explanation of exactly what blasphemy of the
Holy Spirit actually is. Bill was clear, concise and to
the point without adding anything or leaving anything out.
if more Christians would only repeat the Word of God that
clear, there'd be a lot less confusion and confusion really
has no place in a Christian's walk with The Holy Spirit.
Jim, Christian
thank you God.
Since there is no evidence your god even exists does whatever is said
really matter?
your continued responses in [alt.religion.christian] shows
to me that to you it does.
.
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| User: "Attila" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
13 Mar 2005 05:38:31 AM |
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On Sun, 13 Mar 2005 06:32:22 -0500, Jim Ledford <jimled@bellsouth.net>
in alt.abortion with message-id <423424C6.416CE4A7@bellsouth.net>
wrote:
Attila wrote:
Jim Ledford wrote:
David W. Barnes wrote:
Jim Ledford wrote:
Bill Gamelson wrote:
[....]
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
clarity is such a beautiful thing in and of itself.
Why is it no one can explain how believing something purely on "faith"
is "clarity?"
in this particular case I was remarking on how well Bill
did with his explanation of exactly what blasphemy of the
Holy Spirit actually is. Bill was clear, concise and to
the point without adding anything or leaving anything out.
if more Christians would only repeat the Word of God that
clear, there'd be a lot less confusion and confusion really
has no place in a Christian's walk with The Holy Spirit.
Jim, Christian
thank you God.
Since there is no evidence your god even exists does whatever is said
really matter?
your continued responses in [alt.religion.christian] shows
to me that to you it does.
I respond to posts and they go to wherever the origional post went. I
do not review or eliminate any groups.
Evidently you dislike having those in your group exposed to the truth.
.
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| User: "Jim Ledford" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
13 Mar 2005 05:48:15 AM |
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Attila wrote:
Jim Ledford wrote:
Attila wrote:
Jim Ledford wrote:
David W. Barnes wrote:
Jim Ledford wrote:
Bill Gamelson wrote:
[....]
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
clarity is such a beautiful thing in and of itself.
Why is it no one can explain how believing something purely on "faith"
is "clarity?"
in this particular case I was remarking on how well Bill
did with his explanation of exactly what blasphemy of the
Holy Spirit actually is. Bill was clear, concise and to
the point without adding anything or leaving anything out.
if more Christians would only repeat the Word of God that
clear, there'd be a lot less confusion and confusion really
has no place in a Christian's walk with The Holy Spirit.
Jim, Christian
thank you God.
Since there is no evidence your god even exists does whatever is said
really matter?
your continued responses in [alt.religion.christian] shows
to me that to you it does.
I respond to posts and they go to wherever the origional post went. I
do not review or eliminate any groups.
yes, you respond.
Evidently you dislike having those in your group exposed to the truth.
on the contrary it is often a good learning experience
for Christians to see a person such as you who denies
the existence of My Lord God Almighty. brings back
the memories of when I was like you as well as the
thoughts of how I never want to be withOUT God in
my life again.
Attila, thank you.
.
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| User: "David W. Barnes" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
13 Mar 2005 12:18:08 PM |
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In article <4234287F.9FCCC263@bellsouth.net>, Jim Ledford
<jimled@bellsouth.net> wrote:
I respond to posts and they go to wherever the origional post went. I
do not review or eliminate any groups.
yes, you respond.
Evidently you dislike having those in your group exposed to the truth.
on the contrary it is often a good learning experience
for Christians to see a person such as you who denies
the existence of My Lord God Almighty. brings back
the memories of when I was like you as well as the
thoughts of how I never want to be withOUT God in
my life again.
I've seen heroin addicts who said the same thing about heroin. Why
can't you demonstrate the existence of God?
.
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| User: "Attila" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
13 Mar 2005 07:44:10 AM |
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On Sun, 13 Mar 2005 06:48:15 -0500, Jim Ledford <jimled@bellsouth.net>
in alt.abortion with message-id <4234287F.9FCCC263@bellsouth.net>
wrote:
Attila wrote:
Jim Ledford wrote:
Attila wrote:
Jim Ledford wrote:
David W. Barnes wrote:
Jim Ledford wrote:
Bill Gamelson wrote:
[....]
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
clarity is such a beautiful thing in and of itself.
Why is it no one can explain how believing something purely on "faith"
is "clarity?"
in this particular case I was remarking on how well Bill
did with his explanation of exactly what blasphemy of the
Holy Spirit actually is. Bill was clear, concise and to
the point without adding anything or leaving anything out.
if more Christians would only repeat the Word of God that
clear, there'd be a lot less confusion and confusion really
has no place in a Christian's walk with The Holy Spirit.
Jim, Christian
thank you God.
Since there is no evidence your god even exists does whatever is said
really matter?
your continued responses in [alt.religion.christian] shows
to me that to you it does.
I respond to posts and they go to wherever the origional post went. I
do not review or eliminate any groups.
yes, you respond.
I seldom let someone refer to a god without a challenge to prove that
god exists. So far I have received no factual responses. I see you
are not an exception are you?
Evidently you dislike having those in your group exposed to the truth.
on the contrary it is often a good learning experience
for Christians to see a person such as you who denies
the existence of My Lord God Almighty.
Please give a reference where I have done this. If I indicated there
was no god I would need to prove it, and I admit I cannot prove a
negative.
I have only requested those who indicate there is a god prove that
assertion. I find it interesting that you equate a request for proof
of existence with denial of existence. It shows the extent of your
conditioning.
brings back
the memories of when I was like you as well as the
thoughts of how I never want to be withOUT God in
my life again.
Attila, thank you.
.
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| User: "David W. Barnes" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 05:51:59 PM |
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In article <SrKYd.7283$ju.2494@okepread07>, Bill Gamelson
<bgamelson@cox.net> wrote:
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au> wrote
in message news:42336b4d$0$5186$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:5PJYd.7275$ju.1097@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote in message news:42335eb9$0$22223$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:VPHYd.7257$ju.5181@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote in message news:423345f6$0$12026$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
So then everyone who's ever been a soldier in a war is going to
hell.
If they don't have the Lord's forgivness they will.
How can one be forgiven for something which they were coerced into
doing or did on purpose?
Because according to the Bible, all sins are forgivable except one:
Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.
(Mat 12:31) Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy
shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost
shall not be forgiven unto men.
In that case most atheists will not go to hell because most atheists
don't blaspheme the holy spirit, because why would someone blaspheme
something which they don't even believe exists?
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
What is it about "believing" that is a sin? If believing was so damn
important, and God really does exist. Why wouldn't he simply ensure
that we all "believed" if that is so important?
.
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| User: "Bill Gamelson" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 06:20:45 PM |
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"David W. Barnes" <dbarnes@aol.com> wrote in message
news:120320051551591260%dbarnes@aol.com...
In article <SrKYd.7283$ju.2494@okepread07>, Bill Gamelson
<bgamelson@cox.net> wrote:
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote
in message news:42336b4d$0$5186$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:5PJYd.7275$ju.1097@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote in message
news:42335eb9$0$22223$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:VPHYd.7257$ju.5181@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote in message
news:423345f6$0$12026$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
So then everyone who's ever been a soldier in a war is going to
hell.
If they don't have the Lord's forgivness they will.
How can one be forgiven for something which they were coerced into
doing or did on purpose?
Because according to the Bible, all sins are forgivable except one:
Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.
(Mat 12:31) Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and
blasphemy
shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost
shall not be forgiven unto men.
In that case most atheists will not go to hell because most atheists
don't blaspheme the holy spirit, because why would someone blaspheme
something which they don't even believe exists?
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth
and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
What is it about "believing" that is a sin? If believing was so damn
important, and God really does exist. Why wouldn't he simply ensure
that we all "believed" if that is so important?
I'll answer that with a question. If you are married, would you want your
wife to stick around because she was a slave to you and has no choice in the
matter or because she wants to. Wouldn't it make you feel better if she
told you she could have any man in the world but she wants you and only you?
That's why God gave us a choice.
--
Christian music and sermons on streaming audio:
www.globalnetministries.com
.
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| User: "Andrew W \Paranormal Agnostic" |
|
| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 07:19:38 PM |
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"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:EHLYd.7305$ju.842@okepread07...
"David W. Barnes" <dbarnes@aol.com> wrote in message
news:120320051551591260%dbarnes@aol.com...
In article <SrKYd.7283$ju.2494@okepread07>, Bill Gamelson
<bgamelson@cox.net> wrote:
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote
in message news:42336b4d$0$5186$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:5PJYd.7275$ju.1097@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote in message
news:42335eb9$0$22223$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:VPHYd.7257$ju.5181@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)"
<nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote in message
news:423345f6$0$12026$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
So then everyone who's ever been a soldier in a war is going to
hell.
If they don't have the Lord's forgivness they will.
How can one be forgiven for something which they were coerced into
doing or did on purpose?
Because according to the Bible, all sins are forgivable except one:
Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.
(Mat 12:31) Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and
blasphemy
shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy
Ghost
shall not be forgiven unto men.
In that case most atheists will not go to hell because most atheists
don't blaspheme the holy spirit, because why would someone blaspheme
something which they don't even believe exists?
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his
son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth
and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for
our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
What is it about "believing" that is a sin? If believing was so damn
important, and God really does exist. Why wouldn't he simply ensure
that we all "believed" if that is so important?
I'll answer that with a question. If you are married, would you want your
wife to stick around because she was a slave to you and has no choice in
the matter or because she wants to. Wouldn't it make you feel better if
she told you she could have any man in the world but she wants you and
only you?
That's why God gave us a choice.
If a person getting married was perfect like a god then he would make sure
that he marries someone whom he's fully compatible with to start with and
then there would be no issue of his wife wanting to leave him in the first
place.
Obviously the christian god has created beings that are horribly
incompatible with him. Why would he do that?
--
Andrew W. (Paranormal Agnostic) An interest in the paranormal (spiritual)
but with acknowledgement that it's existence can neither be proved - to
others, nor disproved (agnostic).
History books that contain no lies are extremely dull. The christian bible
is a very interesting book indeed.
Religion Exposed!
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~ajwerner
.
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| User: "Bill Gamelson" |
|
| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 08:25:38 PM |
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"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au> wrote
in message news:4233952b$0$5598$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
Obviously the christian god has created beings that are horribly
incompatible with him. Why would he do that?
He didn't. We did it to ourselves.
--
Christian music and sermons on streaming audio:
www.globalnetministries.com
.
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| User: "Andrew W \Paranormal Agnostic" |
|
| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 08:49:29 PM |
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"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:KwNYd.7322$ju.6762@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au> wrote
in message news:4233952b$0$5598$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
Obviously the christian god has created beings that are horribly
incompatible with him. Why would he do that?
He didn't. We did it to ourselves.
Why does a perfect deity create creatures that automatically destroy
themselves almost immediately?
If a factory were to make such products then it would go broke almost
immediately.
The bible god is cuckoo.
--
Andrew W. (Paranormal Agnostic) An interest in the paranormal (spiritual)
but with acknowledgement that it's existence can neither be proved - to
others, nor disproved (agnostic).
History books that contain no lies are extremely dull. The christian bible
is a very interesting book indeed.
Religion Exposed!
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~ajwerner
.
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| User: "Murdoc" |
|
| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 09:53:18 PM |
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Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic) wrote:
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:KwNYd.7322$ju.6762@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au> wrote
in message news:4233952b$0$5598$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
Obviously the christian god has created beings that are horribly
incompatible with him. Why would he do that?
He didn't. We did it to ourselves.
Why does a perfect deity create creatures that automatically destroy
themselves almost immediately?
A better question is: Why would such creatures (us) choose a path that leads to their destruction?
<snipped rest />
--
Murdoc
Posted with XanaNews v1.17.2.7
Grabel's Law: 2 is not equal to 3 -- not even for large values of 2.
.
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| User: "Andrew W \Paranormal Agnostic" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 10:33:28 PM |
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"Murdoc" <murdoc_0@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:xn0dzpf6idnn9e004@news.individual.net...
Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic) wrote:
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:KwNYd.7322$ju.6762@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote
in message news:4233952b$0$5598$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
Obviously the christian god has created beings that are horribly
incompatible with him. Why would he do that?
He didn't. We did it to ourselves.
Why does a perfect deity create creatures that automatically destroy
themselves almost immediately?
A better question is: Why would such creatures (us) choose a path that
leads to > their destruction?
Where does it say in the scriptures that we made any choice?
A&E were misled by a talkative serpent. That's all.
The bible god made a trap for them and they fell into it.
Why didn't he simply make smarter humans?
--
Andrew W. (Paranormal Agnostic) An interest in the paranormal (spiritual)
but with acknowledgement that it's existence can neither be proved - to
others, nor disproved (agnostic).
History books that contain no lies are extremely dull. The christian bible
is a very interesting book indeed.
Religion Exposed!
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~ajwerner
.
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| User: "David W. Barnes" |
|
| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 11:50:25 PM |
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In article <xn0dzpf6idnn9e004@news.individual.net>, Murdoc
<murdoc_0@hotmail.com> wrote:
Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic) wrote:
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:KwNYd.7322$ju.6762@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote
in message news:4233952b$0$5598$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
Obviously the christian god has created beings that are horribly
incompatible with him. Why would he do that?
He didn't. We did it to ourselves.
Why does a perfect deity create creatures that automatically destroy
themselves almost immediately?
A better question is: Why would such creatures (us) choose a path that leads to their destruction?
A better question is why would a creature believe this ***** based
on nothing but superstition?
.
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| User: "Somewriter" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
13 Mar 2005 05:41:46 AM |
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On 13 Mar 2005 03:53:18 GMT, "Murdoc" <murdoc_0@hotmail.com> wrote:
Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic) wrote:
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:KwNYd.7322$ju.6762@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au> wrote
in message news:4233952b$0$5598$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
Obviously the christian god has created beings that are horribly
incompatible with him. Why would he do that?
He didn't. We did it to ourselves.
Why does a perfect deity create creatures that automatically destroy
themselves almost immediately?
A better question is:
Why have you not repent for you forgeries, Murdick?
.
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| User: "David W. Barnes" |
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| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 08:26:56 PM |
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In article <KwNYd.7322$ju.6762@okepread07>, Bill Gamelson
<bgamelson@cox.net> wrote:
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au> wrote
in message news:4233952b$0$5598$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
Obviously the christian god has created beings that are horribly
incompatible with him. Why would he do that?
He didn't. We did it to ourselves.
How could we do it ourselves if God created us? He did it.
.
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| User: "David W. Barnes" |
|
| Title: Re: Question |
12 Mar 2005 06:25:31 PM |
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In article <EHLYd.7305$ju.842@okepread07>, Bill Gamelson
<bgamelson@cox.net> wrote:
"David W. Barnes" <dbarnes@aol.com> wrote in message
news:120320051551591260%dbarnes@aol.com...
In article <SrKYd.7283$ju.2494@okepread07>, Bill Gamelson
<bgamelson@cox.net> wrote:
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote
in message news:42336b4d$0$5186$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:5PJYd.7275$ju.1097@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote in message
news:42335eb9$0$22223$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:VPHYd.7257$ju.5181@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote in message
news:423345f6$0$12026$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
So then everyone who's ever been a soldier in a war is going to
hell.
If they don't have the Lord's forgivness they will.
How can one be forgiven for something which they were coerced into
doing or did on purpose?
Because according to the Bible, all sins are forgivable except one:
Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.
(Mat 12:31) Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and
blasphemy
shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost
shall not be forgiven unto men.
In that case most atheists will not go to hell because most atheists
don't blaspheme the holy spirit, because why would someone blaspheme
something which they don't even believe exists?
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a myth
and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
What is it about "believing" that is a sin? If believing was so damn
important, and God really does exist. Why wouldn't he simply ensure
that we all "believed" if that is so important?
I'll answer that with a question. If you are married, would you want your
wife to stick around because she was a slave to you and has no choice in the
matter or because she wants to. Wouldn't it make you feel better if she
told you she could have any man in the world but she wants you and only you?
That's why God gave us a choice.
Then why try to coerce us into believing? Lets use your analogy. If
you are married and you want your wife to stick around, wouldn't you
rather she did it because she decided on her own to do so rather than
staying with you because she feels "guilty" or that divorcing you is a
"sin?"
If God really wanted what you claim, he wouldn't try to convince people
not believing is a sin.
You are painting yourself in a corner with arguments like that.
.
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| User: "Glenn \Christian Mystic" |
|
| Title: Re: Question |
04 Jun 2005 04:00:52 PM |
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He is trying to reach you right now, and has been for a long time...the ball
remains in your court
"David W. Barnes" <dbarnes@aol.com> wrote in message
news:120320051625314177%dbarnes@aol.com...
In article <EHLYd.7305$ju.842@okepread07>, Bill Gamelson
<bgamelson@cox.net> wrote:
"David W. Barnes" <dbarnes@aol.com> wrote in message
news:120320051551591260%dbarnes@aol.com...
In article <SrKYd.7283$ju.2494@okepread07>, Bill Gamelson
<bgamelson@cox.net> wrote:
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)" <nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote
in message news:42336b4d$0$5186$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:5PJYd.7275$ju.1097@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)"
<nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote in message
news:42335eb9$0$22223$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Bill Gamelson" <bgamelson@cox.net> wrote in message
news:VPHYd.7257$ju.5181@okepread07...
"Andrew W (Paranormal Agnostic)"
<nospaam_ajwerner@optushome.com.au>
wrote in message
news:423345f6$0$12026$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
So then everyone who's ever been a soldier in a war is going
to
hell.
If they don't have the Lord's forgivness they will.
How can one be forgiven for something which they were coerced
into
doing or did on purpose?
Because according to the Bible, all sins are forgivable except
one:
Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.
(Mat 12:31) Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and
blasphemy
shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy
Ghost
shall not be forgiven unto men.
In that case most atheists will not go to hell because most
atheists
don't blaspheme the holy spirit, because why would someone
blaspheme
something which they don't even believe exists?
You obviously don't know what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is I
see.
Tell me then.
It is living your entire life in complete denial of God's gift of his
son
Jesus. It is living your entire life believing that the Bible is a
myth
and
a fairy tale, and rejecting the fact that Jesus died on the cross for
our
sins so we may be forgiven. That is the only unforgivable sin.
What is it about "believing" that is a sin? If believing was so damn
important, and God really does exist. Why wouldn't he simply ensure
that we all "believed" if that is so important?
I'll answer that with a question. If you are married, would you want
your
wife to stick around because she was a slave to you and has no choice in
the
matter or because she wants to. Wouldn't it make you feel better if she
told you she could have any man in the world but she wants you and only
you?
That's why God gave us a choice.
Then why try to coerce us into believing? Lets use your analogy. If
you are married and you want your wife to stick around, wouldn't you
rather she did it because she decided on her own to do so rather than
staying with you because she feels "guilty" or that divorcing you is a
"sin?"
If God really wanted what you claim, he wouldn't try to convince people
not believing is a sin.
You are painting yourself in a corner with arguments like that.
.
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