| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"yjk" |
| Date: |
16 Nov 2005 08:03:49 PM |
| Object: |
--- Are you worrying about your future? |
<?>---said:
"To me faith means not worrying."
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| User: "Yournameheres personal Cthulhu" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
17 Nov 2005 11:56:52 AM |
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"yjk" <yjkoooo@webtv.net> suddenly spluttered:
<?>---said:
"To me faith means not worrying."
Lenny the lemming, lifelong Cliff fan.
------------------------------------------------
Conflict over the exact will/purpose/nature of God cannot ever be
resolved, since there are no facts to go on.
D Silverman FLAHN, SMLAHN
AA #2208
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| User: "Denis Loubet" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
16 Nov 2005 08:29:42 PM |
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"yjk" <yjkoooo@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:1132171429.155011.90440@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
<?>---said:
"To me faith means not worrying."
Does it also mean not preparing? Not thinking? Not caring?
--
Denis Loubet
dloubet@io.com
http://www.io.com/~dloubet
http://www.ashenempires.com
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| User: "Robibnikoff" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
16 Nov 2005 09:32:56 PM |
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"Denis Loubet" <dloubet@io.com> wrote in message
news:R7ydnRierI8vC-benZ2dnUVZ_sidnZ2d@io.com...
"yjk" <yjkoooo@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:1132171429.155011.90440@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
<?>---said:
"To me faith means not worrying."
Does it also mean not preparing? Not thinking? Not caring?
"The lord will provide"
Yeah, right! :P
--
Robyn
Resident Witchypoo
#1557
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| User: "dgillesp" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
16 Nov 2005 09:15:52 PM |
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Denis Loubet wrote:
"yjk" <yjkoooo@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:1132171429.155011.90440@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
<?>---said:
"To me faith means not worrying."
Does it also mean not preparing? Not thinking? Not caring?
Only when "faith" is misunderstood to include negatives of that sort.
Perhaps this has more to do with whether or not the universe is to be
basically feared or to be trusted.
--
Denny
"There cannot be a God because, If there were one, I would
not believe that I were not He." - Friedrich Nietzsche
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| User: "Denis Loubet" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
16 Nov 2005 10:09:43 PM |
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"dgillesp" <dgillesp@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:437BA188.A95561BE@nospam.net...
Denis Loubet wrote:
"yjk" <yjkoooo@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:1132171429.155011.90440@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
<?>---said:
"To me faith means not worrying."
Does it also mean not preparing? Not thinking? Not caring?
Only when "faith" is misunderstood to include negatives of that sort.
Oh, I can phrase them as positives: Trusting god to pave your way. Trusting
god to guide you. Trusting a god to look after everything.
Those positives are the same, respectively, as not preparing, not thinking,
and not caring.
Perhaps this has more to do with whether or not the universe is to be
basically feared or to be trusted.
Ask the dinosaurs.
--
Denis Loubet
dloubet@io.com
http://www.io.com/~dloubet
http://www.ashenempires.com
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| User: "Ike" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
17 Nov 2005 08:35:09 AM |
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"dgillesp" <dgillesp@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:437BA188.A95561BE@nospam.net...
Denis Loubet wrote:
"yjk" <yjkoooo@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:1132171429.155011.90440@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
<?>---said:
"To me faith means not worrying."
Does it also mean not preparing? Not thinking? Not caring?
Only when "faith" is misunderstood to include negatives of that sort.
Perhaps this has more to do with whether or not the universe is to be
basically feared or to be trusted.
EEK! The universe.
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| User: "Therion Ware" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
17 Nov 2005 08:51:43 AM |
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On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 08:35:09 GMT in alt.atheism, Ike ("Ike"
<accordiondocxyzxyzxyz@mindspring.com>) said, directing the reply to
alt.atheism
"dgillesp" <dgillesp@nospam.net> wrote in message
news:437BA188.A95561BE@nospam.net...
Denis Loubet wrote:
"yjk" <yjkoooo@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:1132171429.155011.90440@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
<?>---said:
"To me faith means not worrying."
Does it also mean not preparing? Not thinking? Not caring?
Only when "faith" is misunderstood to include negatives of that sort.
Perhaps this has more to do with whether or not the universe is to be
basically feared or to be trusted.
EEK! The universe.
Hide. It's very big. Maybe it won't notice.
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| User: "Josef Balluch" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
16 Nov 2005 11:09:49 PM |
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In a message sent 'round the world, dgillesp poured fuel on the fire
with the following:
Denis Loubet wrote:
"yjk" <yjkoooo@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:1132171429.155011.90440@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
<?>---said:
"To me faith means not worrying."
Does it also mean not preparing? Not thinking? Not caring?
Only when "faith" is misunderstood to include negatives of that sort.
Is that a matter of fact or a matter of faith, Denny?
Perhaps this has more to do with whether or not the universe is to be
basically feared or to be trusted.
Perhaps?
So that then is just a matter of faith.
Regards,
Josef
"Faith" means not wanting to know what is true.
-- Friedrich Nietzsche
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| User: "dgillesp" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
17 Nov 2005 05:46:44 PM |
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Josef Balluch wrote:
"Faith" means not wanting to know what is true. -- Friedrich Nietzsche
Seems Nietzsche is in company with so many others who are arrested in
the "Either-Or" mindset. True faith seeks understanding, and does not
fear the truth. (Augustine) Faith and knowledge are complementary
("Both-And"), but invariably go astray when separated. "Science without
religion is lame, religion without science is blind." Einstein
--
Denny
"There cannot be a God because, If there were one, I would
not believe that I were not He." - Friedrich Nietzsche
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| User: "Josef Balluch" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
17 Nov 2005 06:19:06 PM |
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In a message sent 'round the world, dgillesp poured fuel on the fire
with the following:
Josef Balluch wrote:
"Faith" means not wanting to know what is true. -- Friedrich Nietzsche
Seems Nietzsche is in company with so many others who are arrested in
the "Either-Or" mindset.
That would be your "either-or" mentality again.
True faith seeks understanding, and does not
fear the truth. (Augustine) Faith and knowledge are complementary
("Both-And"), but invariably go astray when separated. "Science without
religion is lame, religion without science is blind." Einstein
Arguments by Aphorism.
Regards,
Josef
Great minds are sceptical. Convictions are prisons.
-- Nietzsche
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| User: "Uncle Vic" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
17 Nov 2005 02:11:50 AM |
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Once upon a time in alt.atheism, dear sweet dgillesp
(dgillesp@nospam.net) made the light shine upon us with this:
Denis Loubet wrote:
"yjk" <yjkoooo@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:1132171429.155011.90440@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
<?>---said:
"To me faith means not worrying."
Does it also mean not preparing? Not thinking? Not caring?
Only when "faith" is misunderstood to include negatives of that sort.
Perhaps this has more to do with whether or not the universe is to be
basically feared or to be trusted.
Do you fear asteroids? We should. The news recently conveyed the
findings of a couple of astronauts that an asteroid on a collision course
with Earth could realistically be diverted, if we can alter its course in
time. This entire process would require knowledge in science, the
engineering intelligence to build a craft that could reach the intruder
in time, and the fearless gusto to get out there and do it. Faith is not
required. If you noticed a speeding car approaching you as you crossed a
street, would you drop to your knees and pray? Or would you do
something?
With knowledge of science and astronomy, the universe can be understood
and trusted. Armed only with faith, man must fear his surroundings, and
trust only his savior. I know what I prefer.
--
Uncle Vic
aa#2011
Supervisor, EAC Department of little adhesive-backed "L" shaped
chrome-plastic doo-dads to add feet to Jesus fish department
----
"GARGOYLES, PSYCHICS, EVERYTHING UNGODLY, GET THE HELL OUT OF MY
HOUSE, IN JESUS NAME I PRAY. THE DARK SIDE, SHE's NOT A CHRISTIAN,
SHE'S DARK-SIDED, SHE'S DARK-SIDED, THIS IS MY HOUSE, I WANT MY GOD
AND I WANT MY FAMILY. I AM A GOD WARRIOR SHE'S A SPIRITUAL WARRIOR,
SHE WAS THROWN IN THE PITS, OH NO THE HORRORS"
Ain't Christianity great?
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| User: "dgillesp" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
17 Nov 2005 04:45:43 PM |
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Uncle Vic wrote:
Once upon a time in alt.atheism, dear sweet dgillesp
(dgillesp@nospam.net) made the light shine upon us with this:
Denis Loubet wrote:
"yjk" <yjkoooo@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:1132171429.155011.90440@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
<?>---said:
"To me faith means not worrying."
Does it also mean not preparing? Not thinking? Not caring?
Only when "faith" is misunderstood to include negatives of that sort.
Perhaps this has more to do with whether or not the universe is to be
basically feared or to be trusted.
Do you fear asteroids? We should. The news recently conveyed the
findings of a couple of astronauts that an asteroid on a collision course
with Earth could realistically be diverted, if we can alter its course in
time. This entire process would require knowledge in science, the
engineering intelligence to build a craft that could reach the intruder
in time, and the fearless gusto to get out there and do it.
"When I look back on all these worries, I remember the story of the old
man who said on his deathbed that he had had a lot of trouble in his
life, most of which had never happened." --Sir Winston Churchill
"What worries you, masters you." --Haddon W. Robinson
Faith is not
required. If you noticed a speeding car approaching you as you crossed a
street, would you drop to your knees and pray? Or would you do
something?
A most unnecessary conflict based on the "Either-Or" mindset, which many
atheists choose to adopt. A more realistic view is the "Both-And"
mindset. Why must one drop to his knees to pray? Prayer and action are
complementary, not mutual exclusives.
With knowledge of science and astronomy, the universe can be understood
and trusted. Armed only with faith, man must fear his surroundings, and
trust only his savior.
More "Either-Or" thinking. Why do faith and knowledge have to be
mutually exclusive?
I know what I prefer.
I prefer neither apart from the other.
--
Denny
"There cannot be a God because, If there were one, I would
not believe that I were not He." - Friedrich Nietzsche
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| User: "Josef Balluch" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
17 Nov 2005 10:31:44 PM |
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In a message sent 'round the world, dgillesp poured fuel on the fire
with the following:
....
More "Either-Or" thinking. Why do faith and knowledge have to be
mutually exclusive?
....
Good point, Denny. I have faith that you are mistaken, and I have
knowledge that you are mistaken.
Case closed.
Regards,
Josef
I respect faith, but doubt is what gets you an education.
-- Wilson Mizner
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| User: "Uncle Vic" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
17 Nov 2005 04:50:26 PM |
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on 17 Nov 2005 in alt.atheism, dear sweet dgillesp (dgillesp@nospam.net)
made the light shine upon us with this:
A most unnecessary conflict based on the "Either-Or" mindset, which many
atheists choose to adopt. A more realistic view is the "Both-And"
mindset. Why must one drop to his knees to pray? Prayer and action are
complementary, not mutual exclusives.
Many states here in the USA have banned the use of cell phones while
driving. Yakking distracts you from performing properly.
--
Uncle Vic
aa#2011
Supervisor, EAC Department of little adhesive-backed "L" shaped
chrome-plastic doo-dads to add feet to Jesus fish department
----
"The world is only 5-6 thousand years old does not mean the planet
earth is only 5-6 thousand years old. There have been many worlds
created and destroyed on this planet. The creation of the planet is
described in Genesis 1. The creation of the world is described in
Genesis 2. Two different kind of creations." --Eric Brze
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| User: "AZ Nomad" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
17 Nov 2005 07:38:49 PM |
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On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 10:50:26 -0600, Uncle Vic <address@withheld.com> wrote:
on 17 Nov 2005 in alt.atheism, dear sweet dgillesp (dgillesp@nospam.net)
made the light shine upon us with this:
A most unnecessary conflict based on the "Either-Or" mindset, which many
atheists choose to adopt. A more realistic view is the "Both-And"
mindset. Why must one drop to his knees to pray? Prayer and action are
complementary, not mutual exclusives.
Many states here in the USA have banned the use of cell phones while
driving. Yakking distracts you from performing properly.
So do a lot of things. Insanely complicated radios, nav systems, etc.
Bitching/screaming passengers. Guys seeing girls with big titties. Trying
to eat lunch, apply makeup, read the newspaper, or type on a laptop.
Frankly, I couldn't care less why a person is driving badly. If somebody is
failing to stay in their lane, or unaware of driving conditions, etc., does
it really matter if the person was talking on a cell phone or not? Charge
the idiot with reckless driving and be done with it.
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| User: "dgillesp" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
17 Nov 2005 05:52:30 PM |
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Uncle Vic wrote:
on 17 Nov 2005 in alt.atheism, dear sweet dgillesp (dgillesp@nospam.net)
made the light shine upon us with this:
A most unnecessary conflict based on the "Either-Or" mindset, which many
atheists choose to adopt. A more realistic view is the "Both-And"
mindset. Why must one drop to his knees to pray? Prayer and action are
complementary, not mutual exclusives.
Many states here in the USA have banned the use of cell phones while
driving. Yakking distracts you from performing properly.
When Simon Peter began to sink in the water, he didn't say, "Where's my
prayer book?" nor did he engage in a lengthy discourse. He
spontaneously uttered 3 little words, "Lord, help me."
--
Denny
"There cannot be a God because, If there were one, I would
not believe that I were not He." - Friedrich Nietzsche
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| User: "Brian Henderson" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
18 Nov 2005 04:12:17 PM |
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On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 12:52:30 -0500, dgillesp <dgillesp@nospam.net>
wrote:
When Simon Peter began to sink in the water, he didn't say, "Where's my
prayer book?" nor did he engage in a lengthy discourse. He
spontaneously uttered 3 little words, "Lord, help me."
Would have been more intelligent to have resorted to four little
words, "Throw me a rope!"
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| User: "Steve Knight" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
19 Nov 2005 01:51:02 AM |
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On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 12:52:30 -0500, dgillesp <dgillesp@nospam.net>
wrote:
When Simon Peter began to sink in the water, he didn't say, "Where's my
prayer book?" nor did he engage in a lengthy discourse. He
spontaneously uttered 3 little words, "Lord, help me."
And.... as reality... in every single instance throughout all
time... says is a worthless pursuit.
Warlord Steve
BAAWA
www.sonic.net/~wooly
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| User: "Uncle Vic" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
19 Nov 2005 04:07:44 AM |
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Once upon a time in alt.atheism, dear sweet Steve Knight (wooly@sonic.net)
made the light shine upon us with this:
On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 12:52:30 -0500, dgillesp <dgillesp@nospam.net>
wrote:
When Simon Peter began to sink in the water, he didn't say, "Where's my
prayer book?" nor did he engage in a lengthy discourse. He
spontaneously uttered 3 little words, "Lord, help me."
And.... as reality... in every single instance throughout all
time... says is a worthless pursuit.
Trivial?
--
Uncle Vic
aa#2011
Supervisor, EAC Department of little adhesive-backed "L" shaped
chrome-plastic doo-dads to add feet to Jesus fish department
----
"GARGOYLES, PSYCHICS, EVERYTHING UNGODLY, GET THE HELL OUT OF MY
HOUSE, IN JESUS NAME I PRAY. THE DARK SIDE, SHE's NOT A CHRISTIAN,
SHE'S DARK-SIDED, SHE'S DARK-SIDED, THIS IS MY HOUSE, I WANT MY GOD
AND I WANT MY FAMILY. I AM A GOD WARRIOR SHE'S A SPIRITUAL WARRIOR,
SHE WAS THROWN IN THE PITS, OH NO THE HORRORS"
Ain't Christianity great?
.
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| User: "AZ Nomad" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
18 Nov 2005 04:24:30 PM |
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On Fri, 18 Nov 2005 16:12:17 GMT, Brian Henderson <BrianL.Henderson@NOSPAM.verizon.net> wrote:
On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 12:52:30 -0500, dgillesp <dgillesp@nospam.net>
wrote:
When Simon Peter began to sink in the water, he didn't say, "Where's my
prayer book?" nor did he engage in a lengthy discourse. He
spontaneously uttered 3 little words, "Lord, help me."
Would have been more intelligent to have resorted to four little
words, "Throw me a rope!"
Actually it was "throw me the fucking rope!"
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| User: "Michael Gray" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
19 Nov 2005 03:47:18 AM |
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On Fri, 18 Nov 2005 16:24:30 GMT, AZ Nomad <aznomad@PmunOgeBOX.com>
wrote:
On Fri, 18 Nov 2005 16:12:17 GMT, Brian Henderson <BrianL.Henderson@NOSPAM.verizon.net> wrote:
On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 12:52:30 -0500, dgillesp <dgillesp@nospam.net>
wrote:
When Simon Peter began to sink in the water, he didn't say, "Where's my
prayer book?" nor did he engage in a lengthy discourse. He
spontaneously uttered 3 little words, "Lord, help me."
Would have been more intelligent to have resorted to four little
words, "Throw me a rope!"
Actually it was "throw me the fucking rope!"
In low Aramaic, of course.
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| User: "Uncle Vic" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
18 Nov 2005 04:24:30 PM |
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on 18 Nov 2005 in alt.atheism, dear sweet Brian Henderson
(BrianL.Henderson@NOSPAM.verizon.net) made the light shine upon us with
this:
On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 12:52:30 -0500, dgillesp <dgillesp@nospam.net>
wrote:
When Simon Peter began to sink in the water, he didn't say, "Where's my
prayer book?" nor did he engage in a lengthy discourse. He
spontaneously uttered 3 little words, "Lord, help me."
Would have been more intelligent to have resorted to four little
words, "Throw me a rope!"
This is where the Flying Spaghetti Monster could really excel.
--
Uncle Vic
aa#2011
Supervisor, EAC Department of little adhesive-backed "L" shaped
chrome-plastic doo-dads to add feet to Jesus fish department
----
"The world is only 5-6 thousand years old does not mean the planet
earth is only 5-6 thousand years old. There have been many worlds
created and destroyed on this planet. The creation of the planet is
described in Genesis 1. The creation of the world is described in
Genesis 2. Two different kind of creations." --Eric Brze
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| User: "Uncle Vic" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
17 Nov 2005 07:38:07 PM |
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on 17 Nov 2005 in alt.atheism, dear sweet dgillesp
(dgillesp@nospam.net) made the light shine upon us with this:
Uncle Vic wrote:
on 17 Nov 2005 in alt.atheism, dear sweet dgillesp
(dgillesp@nospam.net) made the light shine upon us with this:
A most unnecessary conflict based on the "Either-Or" mindset,
which many atheists choose to adopt. A more realistic view is the
"Both-And" mindset. Why must one drop to his knees to pray?
Prayer and action are complementary, not mutual exclusives.
Many states here in the USA have banned the use of cell phones while
driving. Yakking distracts you from performing properly.
When Simon Peter began to sink in the water, he didn't say, "Where's
my prayer book?" nor did he engage in a lengthy discourse. He
spontaneously uttered 3 little words, "Lord, help me."
Did the lord help him?
--
Uncle Vic
aa#2011
Supervisor, EAC Department of little adhesive-backed "L" shaped
chrome-plastic doo-dads to add feet to Jesus fish department
----
"The world is only 5-6 thousand years old does not mean the planet
earth is only 5-6 thousand years old. There have been many worlds
created and destroyed on this planet. The creation of the planet is
described in Genesis 1. The creation of the world is described in
Genesis 2. Two different kind of creations." --Eric Brze
.
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| User: "Enkidu the Atheist" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
16 Nov 2005 10:43:14 PM |
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"yjk" <yjkoooo@webtv.net> wrote in news:1132171429.155011.90440
@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:
<?>---said:
"To me faith means not worrying."
I think you mean "To me faith means not thinking."
--
Enkidu AA#2165
EAC Chaplain and ordained minister,
ULC, Modesto, CA
PGP ID: 0xC4CE8CF0
An immoral god - a hangover from stone age minds - still corrupts human
mentality with its scapegoat justice and the threat of eternal damnation.
-- (Reverend) Reginald Howard Bass
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| User: "Lars Eighner" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
16 Nov 2005 10:23:24 PM |
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In our last episode,
<1132171429.155011.90440@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
the lovely and talented yjk
broadcast on alt.atheism:
<?>---said:
"To me faith means not worrying."
To me not being a sniveling, pathetic little ***** means not
worrying.
--
Rev. Lars Eighner, ULC http://www.larseighner.com/
The Mint Jelly of GodŽ -- The World's Best Atheist -- Unholier Than Thou
First Church of Electro-Baptism ***Atheist #1965*** One Short Circuit to Jesus
Jesus Loves Me, This I Know / For the Voices Tell Me So.
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| User: "Uncle Vic" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
16 Nov 2005 09:00:42 PM |
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on 16 Nov 2005 in alt.atheism, dear sweet yjk (yjkoooo@webtv.net) made the
light shine upon us with this:
<?>---said:
"To me faith means not worrying."
Facing your fears is far more healthy than making up stories to make them
go away.
--
Uncle Vic
aa#2011
Supervisor, EAC Department of little adhesive-backed "L" shaped
chrome-plastic doo-dads to add feet to Jesus fish department
----
"The world is only 5-6 thousand years old does not mean the planet
earth is only 5-6 thousand years old. There have been many worlds
created and destroyed on this planet. The creation of the planet is
described in Genesis 1. The creation of the world is described in
Genesis 2. Two different kind of creations." --Eric Brze
.
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| User: "Thurisaz, Germanic barbarian" |
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| Title: No. |
16 Nov 2005 09:43:01 PM |
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yjk wrote:
<?>---said:
"To me faith means not worrying."
Agreed ;)
--
"To his friend a man a friend shall prove,
And gifts with gifts requite;
But men shall mocking with mockery answer,
And fraud with falsehood meet."
(The Poetic Edda)
Must have been written with fundies in mind...
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| User: "J Forbes" |
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| Title: Re: --- Are you worrying about your future? |
16 Nov 2005 10:46:15 PM |
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yjk wrote:
<?>---said:
"To me faith means not worrying."
I'm not worried about my future.
But to me, faith means lying to myself.
Jim
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