| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"rob wade" |
| Date: |
12 Sep 2005 05:47:55 PM |
| Object: |
15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training
How to challenge the misinformation.
Read this before you go.
As a teacher or student, if you are forced to participate in
"diversity" or "sensitivity" training, don't just sit there and
let them spoonfeed twisted concepts through manipulative exercises and
false information. Raise your hand, bring up the following issues and
expose the real nature of what is taking place: they want to force
people to accept homosexual behavior, even if some don't like it and
the responsible facts don't support it.
It's time to object, question and expose the truth in open and frank
discussions. Here are some questions you might ask at appropriate times
in the workshops.
For supporting references, see end.
Issue 1: Safety, Bullying and Harassment. What documented evidence
exists to show that "gay" students are more subject to physical
attacks than others- not including surveys of impressionable students?
Isn't bullying done for all kinds of reasons? Aren't you including
"verbal" in your definition of harassment, and isn't this very
subjective, i.e., what's "harassing" to one person is just a free
exchange of ideas to another? Aren't kids who are fat or non-athletic
bullied, too? Would this mean that, to stop that type of bullying, we
need to teach students that obesity is good and physical fitness is
bad?
Aren't kids involved in homosexuality troubled because of the very
nature of what they are doing? Drug abusing kids are also very
troubled. Do we legalize drugs to make them feel better? Why can't we
just say in general that harassment and bullying are unacceptable,
without forcing acceptance of homosexuality, which has many aspects
(like high health risks) that continue to make it unsupportable?
Issue 2. Is Homosexuality Genetic? There seems to be an assumption here
that homosexuals are a fixed minority group. There's no conclusive
evidence that it's genetic, is there? Can a person go somewhere and
get a test for a "gay" gene? Aren't our bodies clearly built for
heterosexual sex? Aren't there lots of people who've gone back and
forth, like movie star Anne Heche, former "partner" of Ellen
DeGeneres, who recently married a man? What about bisexuality? Isn't
that clearly flexible and an obvious choice?
Issue 3: "Students Can Never Be Influenced to 'Become' Gay!"
Are you saying there's no chance that raising this issue constantly
won't influence some students who would never have thought of it
otherwise to start experimenting with homosexual behavior and like it?
What about those who've changed from heterosexual to homosexual-- as
all the mid-life changes we are hearing about--Gov. Jim McGreevey of
New Jersey, for instance? Are you saying all these people simply
performed heterosexually, without enjoying it at all, all those years?
Isn't human sexuality --for good and bad--more malleable than that?
What about the pro-homosexual advocates telling our kids it's okay to
be "fluid"?
Issue 4: Health Risks of Homosexual Sex. What about the health risks of
homosexual sex? Isn't anal sex always high risk, no matter who does
it, even if it's with only one partner? Isn't the human body really
best adapted to heterosexual sex, which with one partner, can be done
safely all during a person's life?
Issue 5. Parental Choice. What about people who don't want their kids
to believe homosexuality is acceptable? Don't they have the right to
teach their children what they want to? What about parents who don't
want their kids to hear anything at all about homosexuality, pro- or
con? Aren't these people taxpayers, too?
Issue 6. Atheists Can Object, Too. Aren't there some people who
don't have strong religious beliefs who don't want their children to
learn about homosexuality? So--it's not just a religious issue, is
it?
Issue 7. Is Homosexuality Just Another 'Viewpoint'? As far as "equal
access" goes, this assumes homosexuality is a viewpoint. Isn't it a
behavior, not a viewpoint? Would other known high risk activities like
anorexia or smoking also, then, be viewpoints?
Issue 8. Ex-Homosexuals Do Exist. How can you say no one can change
from homosexuality to heterosexuality? Are you saying it's never been
done? Can't people change from heterosexuality to homosexuality? Why
do gay advocacy groups like GLSEN maintain that students have the
"right" to "explore" to "discover" what orientation they
are? Haven't you ever met people who experimented and liked it? Or
experimented and rejected it? Aren't humans a lot more flexible than
you are saying? So--aren't we influencing students when we ask them
to accept homosexuality? How can you say there's no chance of
changing or influencing any student and that some students will just
"be" homosexual?
Issue 9. Why are homosexuals so troubled in other ways? What about all
the other lifestyle factors researchers have discovered about
homosexuals, like much higher rates of alcohol and drug use and higher
rates of mental illness? Doesn't this just scream that there's
something dysfunctional about the person? Aren't some (not all) major
psychological groups just ignoring this evidence because they want to
look trendy, and because so many homosexuals are in leadership
positions on committees?
Issue 10. What about respect for those who disagree?. Isn't it just
another type of bias and bigotry to say that homosexuality must be
accepted by students and teachers? What about people who know all this
information, but come to a different conclusion than you do? Are you
saying they are stupid? Isn't that bigoted and prejudiced?
Issue 11.Adults Corrupting Children in Same Sex Interactions. Isn't
the risk of adults having sex with minors greater when homosexual
teachers teach children, simply because of same sex activities like
coaching, mentoring, etc.? Isn't this the reason homosexuals were
until recently forbidden from teaching kids?
Issue 12.Why does the Red Cross refuse blood from homosexuals? Isn't
AIDS in the U.S. still spread predominantly through male to male
homosexual sex? Isn't this why the Red Cross still refuses blood from
any male who has had sex with another male even once since 1977? The
FDA has the same cautions about giving/receiving blood. How can we in
good conscience in any way say or imply this is acceptable behavior for
students or teachers?
Issue 13. GSA's produce more bigotry, not less. If we allow a gay
straight alliance, won't their discussions of "homophobia" lead
them to form hostile and bigoted beliefs and feelings about other
students, teachers and parents who don't approve of homosexuality?
Don't you just trade what you say is one type of discrimination for
another--at the risk of endangering students exposed to homosexual
activity? And if this club wants to hold diversity days or days of
silence, aren't they acting in a way that discriminates against
others' beliefs?
Issue 14. Objections to homosexuality lead to violence??Are you trying
to imply that all people who believe homosexuality is wrong are
potentially violent, or potential harrassers? Isn't that bigoted and
prejudiced thinking that flies in the face of the facts that many
people "tolerate" people who are homosexual without being violent
or even impolite toward them? Isn't it incredibly offensive, even
shallow and childish, to use the term "hatred" to describe ALL
disapproval of homosexuality?
Issue 15. Future legal problems for the school and teachers. Won't
the school face potential lawsuits in the future if students are taught
that homosexuality is harmless and acceptable, and then later contract
AIDS? What if an underage student meets an adult homosexual through a
school function like a health class or a gay club meeting, and they
begin a sexual relationship? Will the school be held liable for
millions of dollars as in the some of the clergy abuse situations?
Aren't we obligated to give them either both sides of the issue, or
not cover homosexuality at all?
.
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| User: "Dennis Kemmerer" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 11:02:56 AM |
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<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126853199.672830.203220@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Mmmh...if gayness is genetic in origin,homophobia is also likely to
be.
Homophobia is no more genetic in origin than is racism. The correct
corollary would be '...heterosexuality is also likely to be [genetic in
origin].'
Most homophobes have peripheral homosexual tendencies
entwined with the hatred of homosexuality.
The term you're looking for is 'internalized homophobia.'
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 11:32:02 AM |
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In an homophobe,I would tend to see a mainly heterosexual interest
conflicting with peripheral homosexual tendencies.Homophobes aren`t in
secure possession of their
heterosexual privilege.Thus these outbursts of heterosexual zeal of
theirs.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 05:40:46 AM |
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<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126853199.672830.203220@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Mmmh...if gayness is genetic in origin,homophobia is also likely to
be.Most homophobes have peripheral homosexual tendencies entwined with
the hatred of homosexuality.
No, homophobia is learned.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 06:22:48 AM |
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Andrealphus a =E9crit :
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126853199.672830.203220@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Mmmh...if gayness is genetic in origin,homophobia is also likely to
be.Most homophobes have peripheral homosexual tendencies entwined with
the hatred of homosexuality.
No, homophobia is learned.
There is no doubt that it is learned.Its frequent association with
homosexuality and in homophobes - who are failed gays sort of - would
normally put homosexuality in the same category of learned patterns of
behavior.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 06:27:57 AM |
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<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126869768.221403.141510@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Andrealphus a écrit :
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126853199.672830.203220@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Mmmh...if gayness is genetic in origin,homophobia is also likely to
be.Most homophobes have peripheral homosexual tendencies entwined with
the hatred of homosexuality.
No, homophobia is learned.
There is no doubt that it is learned.Its frequent association with
homosexuality and in homophobes - who are failed gays sort of - would
normally put homosexuality in the same category of learned patterns of
behavior.
Umm.. no. Whether or not it is learned or genetic is irrelevant to the
political issues, but current scientific evidence points to at least a
genetic component, or predispositioning, where a person's sexuality is
concerned. Homophobia is completely learned. Just like racism.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 06:47:43 AM |
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In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.The only part of human sexuality which appears to me as
genetically determined is the primeval sexual drive.The orientation of
that drive is determined by environment and culture.Mankind modifies
many things which it received from nature,and homosexuality is most
probably one such modification.Why humans would modify nature ? Because
it suits their interest.Nothing
evil,no shame in that.On the contrary,if homosexuality is some sort of
invention or discovery of ours,we should be proud of it as gays.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 12:28:05 PM |
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<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126871263.758457.287650@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.
Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, blah. Homophobia is 100% learned behavior. By the
way, it's spelled species.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 04:43:34 PM |
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Andrealphus a =E9crit :
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126871263.758457.287650@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.
Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, blah. Homophobia is 100% learned behavior. By =
the
way, it's spelled species.
Who of us two knows better the language of the other ? For reference,I
am a native French speaker.
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| User: "Dennis Kemmerer" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 06:56:51 PM |
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<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126907014.147346.80700@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Andrealphus a écrit :
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126871263.758457.287650@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.
Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, blah. Homophobia is 100% learned behavior. By
the
way, it's spelled species.
Who of us two knows better the language of the other ? For reference,I
am a native French speaker.
That's irrelevant, since you chose to post in English.
.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 07:18:34 PM |
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"Dennis Kemmerer" <dk@suespammers.org> wrote in message
news:7ZIWe.1261$7x4.762@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126907014.147346.80700@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Andrealphus a écrit :
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126871263.758457.287650@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.
Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, blah. Homophobia is 100% learned behavior. By
the
way, it's spelled species.
Who of us two knows better the language of the other ? For reference,I
am a native French speaker.
That's irrelevant, since you chose to post in English.
Exactly.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 07:33:27 PM |
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Dennis Kemmerer a =E9crit :
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126907014.147346.80700@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Andrealphus a =E9crit :
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126871263.758457.287650@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.
Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, blah. Homophobia is 100% learned behavior. =
By
the
way, it's spelled species.
Who of us two knows better the language of the other ? For reference,I
am a native French speaker.
That's irrelevant, since you chose to post in English.
Well,I could decide to post here in Spanish,which I also speak.Then you
would see something.Isn`t Spanish one of the main languages spoken in
the United States ?
Los aqui que hablan el espanol pueden intercambiar conmigo sin
problema.Yo hablo tambien el espanol mas o menos de corrido.
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| User: "Dennis Kemmerer" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 10:00:25 PM |
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<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126917207.758432.321920@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Dennis Kemmerer a écrit :
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126907014.147346.80700@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Andrealphus a écrit :
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126871263.758457.287650@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.
Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, blah. Homophobia is 100% learned behavior.
By
the
way, it's spelled species.
Who of us two knows better the language of the other ? For reference,I
am a native French speaker.
That's irrelevant, since you chose to post in English.
Well,I could decide to post here in Spanish,which I also speak.Then you
would see something.Isn`t Spanish one of the main languages spoken in
the United States ?
Los aqui que hablan el espanol pueden intercambiar conmigo sin
problema.Yo hablo tambien el espanol mas o menos de corrido.
[woosh]
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| User: "maf1029 ©2001-2008" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
17 Sep 2005 05:36:31 AM |
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On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 23:56:51 GMT, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli opened the heavens and shone his light upon the
wisdom of "Dennis Kemmerer" <dk@suespammers.org>
<piggybacking>
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126907014.147346.80700@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Andrealphus a écrit :
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126871263.758457.287650@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.
Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, blah. Homophobia is 100% learned behavior. By
the
way, it's spelled species.
Who of us two knows better the language of the other ? For reference,I
am a native French speaker.
Whoop-dee-merde, Pierre. English is my second language too, and I
still managed to set my spell-checker to not only check the English
but also to not send a post until it's done correcting my crappy
spelling.
That way, when you say la merde stupidé, then at least you'll have
spelled everything right.
C'est la vie, bongo!
That's irrelevant, since you chose to post in English.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
17 Sep 2005 10:26:07 AM |
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"La merde stupid=E9",though being perfectly understandable to a native
French speaker like my humble self,is far from constituting flawless
French,written or spoken.But it does not enter into my designs to
impose French in this NG.Nor to eventually raise the issue of those
native English speakers - all too many of them American ones - who do
not even write English correctly.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 06:43:56 PM |
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<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126907014.147346.80700@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Andrealphus a écrit :
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126871263.758457.287650@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.
Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, blah. Homophobia is 100% learned behavior. By
the
way, it's spelled species.
Who of us two knows better the language of the other ? For reference,I
am a native French speaker.
Don't care at all. If you're typing in English, then use English spelling.
Every one knows how the French are language Nazis when it comes to the
French language, at least return the courtesy that your people demand.
btw, Homophobia is 100% learned behavior.
.
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| User: "Jenn" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 06:48:01 PM |
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In article <0NIWe.674$Gg1.76@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL2@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126907014.147346.80700@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Andrealphus a écrit :
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126871263.758457.287650@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.
Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, blah. Homophobia is 100% learned behavior. By
the
way, it's spelled species.
Who of us two knows better the language of the other ? For reference,I
am a native French speaker.
Don't care at all. If you're typing in English, then use English spelling.
Every one knows how the French are language Nazis when it comes to the
French language, at least return the courtesy that your people demand.
btw, Homophobia is 100% learned behavior.
As Hammerstein wrote, "You've to to be carefully taught..."
.
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| User: "maf1029 ©2001-2008" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
17 Sep 2005 05:32:07 AM |
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On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 23:48:01 GMT, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli opened the heavens and shone his light upon the
wisdom of Jenn <jennconducts@hotmail.com>
In article <0NIWe.674$Gg1.76@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>,
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL2@THISADDRESS.FOAD> wrote:
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126907014.147346.80700@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Andrealphus a écrit :
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126871263.758457.287650@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.
Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, blah. Homophobia is 100% learned behavior. By
the
way, it's spelled species.
Who of us two knows better the language of the other ? For reference,I
am a native French speaker.
Don't care at all. If you're typing in English, then use English spelling.
Every one knows how the French are language Nazis when it comes to the
French language, at least return the courtesy that your people demand.
btw, Homophobia is 100% learned behavior.
As Hammerstein wrote, "You've to to be carefully taught..."
Thank you so much for that "South Pathetic" flashback, where our Emile
spoke and sang with a Romanian accent, a la Vlad Dracl. (He was aiming
for a French accent, too, imagine that!)
And yes, the entire pit was up for grabs when one night our trombone
player said, "I keeelled a mahn -- I sahcked his blahhhd.... blah blah
blah!"
As long as I don't start re-living "There Ain't Nothin' Like a Dame"
at quarter note = 88, thanks to our drunk music director, I'll be
fine, thanks for asking. Just don't ask about Bali Hi in Lydian mode.
Well, except for the flat 5. <shudder>
.
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| User: "DanielSan" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 08:38:18 PM |
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wrote:
Andrealphus a =E9crit :
=20
=20
< > wrote in message
news:1126871263.758457.287650@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.
Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, blah. Homophobia is 100% learned behavior. B=
y the
way, it's spelled species.
=20
=20
Who of us two knows better the language of the other ? For reference,I
am a native French speaker.
=20
The word "species" is both singular and plural. Like moose. There is a =
word called "specie," but it is a synonym for coinage. For example:
"He was so angry at the electric company, that he paid his bill in specie=
=2E"
--=20
****************************************************
* DanielSan -- alt.atheism #2226 *
*--------------------------------------------------*
* "If God had intended us to walk, he wouldn't *
* have invented roller skates." --Willy Wonka *
****************************************************
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
17 Sep 2005 12:11:31 AM |
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DanielSan a =E9crit :
kingsix@abacom.com wrote:
Andrealphus a =E9crit :
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126871263.758457.287650@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.
Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, blah. Homophobia is 100% learned behavior. B=
y the
way, it's spelled species.
Who of us two knows better the language of the other ? For reference,I
am a native French speaker.
The word "species" is both singular and plural. Like moose. There is a
word called "specie," but it is a synonym for coinage. For example:
"He was so angry at the electric company, that he paid his bill in specie=
.."
The point is that communication between the other gentleman and my
humble self was possible because of my knowledge of English,no matter
how imperfect.
.
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| User: "wbarwell" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 02:12:12 PM |
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Andrealphus wrote:
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126871263.758457.287650@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.
Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, blah.
Homophobia is 100% learned behavior.
Totally wrong. This sort of ignorance
is learned behavior for religous fools.
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| User: "The Secretary of HomIntern" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
17 Sep 2005 07:49:10 AM |
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I was busily flonking away in alt.politics.homosexuality, when The Goddess
Eris Herself suddenly made me reply to wbarwell:
Andrealphus wrote:
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote...
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.
Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, blah.
Homophobia is 100% learned behavior.
Totally wrong. This sort of ignorance
is learned behavior for religous fools.
LOL! You missed the "phobia", WCB...;-{)}
--
___________________________________________________________________________
Hail Eris! "The personal _is_ political."
Bent Depraved N. Deviant *****-Smoker, Esq., Superfaggot
"Stupidity excuses nothing. It's only a reason...." -- Phxbrd
Economic Left/Right: -7.63 Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -7.38
"The whining has just begun." -- John Wentzky
Killfiled by: directory; Anim8rfsk
"It's not nice to misrepresent Mother Nature."
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| User: "Dennis Kemmerer" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 11:02:56 AM |
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<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126871263.758457.287650@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.The only part of human sexuality which appears to me as
genetically determined is the primeval sexual drive.The orientation of
that drive is determined by environment and culture.
Current research indicates that sexual orientation has both genetic and
environmental components.
[snip]
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 11:17:35 AM |
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Dennis Kemmerer a =E9crit :
<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126871263.758457.287650@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.The only part of human sexuality which appears to me as
genetically determined is the primeval sexual drive.The orientation of
that drive is determined by environment and culture.
Current research indicates that sexual orientation has both genetic and
environmental components.
Science will eventually tell us in detail whence sexual orientation
came from
in humans.I do not think its findings will be clearcut in the sense of
ascribing
homosexuality either to genetics or to environment exclusively.Science
will simply declare one of these two factors predominant in the genesis
of sexual orientation.In humans,I`d expect the environment and cultural
factor to be not the only,but certainly the main cause of homosexuality.
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| User: "Fritz" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
19 Sep 2005 10:02:00 AM |
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wrote:
In a culturally complex specie like the human specie,it is not always
easy to sort of learned patterns of behavior from genetically
determined ones.The only part of human sexuality which appears to me as
genetically determined is the primeval sexual drive.The orientation of
that drive is determined by environment and culture.Mankind modifies
many things which it received from nature,and homosexuality is most
probably one such modification.Why humans would modify nature ? Because
it suits their interest.Nothing
evil,no shame in that.On the contrary,if homosexuality is some sort of
invention or discovery of ours,we should be proud of it as gays.
Such a deep thinker, way over my head.
-- Fritz ...
"Save a horse, ride a cowboy."
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| User: "The Secretary of HomIntern" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
16 Sep 2005 03:18:30 AM |
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I was busily flonking away in alt.politics.homosexuality, when The Goddess
Eris Herself suddenly made me reply to Boy Toy:
On 15 Sep 2005 09:26:42 -0700, wrote
If gayness is genetic in origin,it can be wiped out by way of genetic
surgery.If it depends only or mainly on the will of the individual and
on his refusal to adhere to heterosexuality,there is nothing one can do
to eliminate it.
Cool. Is there a gene for irrational extremist fundie tendencies?
Maybe we can wipe that out too. We could save the lives of billions.
Remember, this is the gay Canadian who doesn't believe in the existence of
bisexuality, who thinks it's just a bunch of straights trying to be trendy.
--
___________________________________________________________________________
Hail Eris! "The personal _is_ political."
Bent Depraved N. Deviant *****-Smoker, Esq., Superfaggot
"Stupidity excuses nothing. It's only a reason...." -- Phxbrd
Economic Left/Right: -7.63 Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -7.38
"The whining has just begun." -- John Wentzky
Killfiled by: directory; Anim8rfsk
"It's not nice to misrepresent Mother Nature."
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
17 Sep 2005 02:38:51 AM |
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The Secretary of HomIntern a =E9crit :
Remember, this is the gay Canadian who doesn't believe in the existence of
bisexuality, who thinks it's just a bunch of straights trying to be trend=
y=2E
Bisexuals actually are an heterosexual minority.They apparently have a
problem of defection to the full blown hetero lifestyle,outside the
so-called ex-gay movement and antedating the said movement.Helen
Degeneres`s former girlfriend,Ann Heche,is pretty typical in that
respect,and is probably only one among thousands.The so-called ex-gay
movement is simply a more developped expression,political in kind,of
this trend among bisexuals,who tend to prozelytise heterosexually
speaking when they are dealing with gays.On such a precarious
basis,bisexuals are of course incapable of any independence,cultural
and even less political,from the heterosexual interest and privilege
which in the main dictates their course of action.All the more that
they are not,like other heterosexuals,in secure possession of the said
privilege owing to their peripheral homosexual interests.Which accounts
for some of their excesses of zeal in the service and furthering of the
heterosexual interest.In regarding bisexuals as a variety of somewhat
exotic heterosexuals,we will not be dissapointed by anything they will
do.Actually,their behavior in that respect will appear to us as
predictable and logical.
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| User: "Dennis Kemmerer" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
17 Sep 2005 09:17:34 AM |
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<kingsix@abacom.com> wrote in message
news:1126942731.264139.53710@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
The Secretary of HomIntern a écrit :
Remember, this is the gay Canadian who doesn't believe in the existence
of
bisexuality, who thinks it's just a bunch of straights trying to be
trendy.
Bisexuals actually are an heterosexual minority.They apparently have a
problem of defection to the full blown hetero lifestyle,outside the
so-called ex-gay movement and antedating the said movement.Helen
Degeneres`s former girlfriend,Ann Heche,is pretty typical in that
respect,and is probably only one among thousands.The so-called ex-gay
movement is simply a more developped expression,political in kind,of
this trend among bisexuals,who tend to prozelytise heterosexually
speaking when they are dealing with gays.On such a precarious
basis,bisexuals are of course incapable of any independence,cultural
and even less political,from the heterosexual interest and privilege
which in the main dictates their course of action.All the more that
they are not,like other heterosexuals,in secure possession of the said
privilege owing to their peripheral homosexual interests.Which accounts
for some of their excesses of zeal in the service and furthering of the
heterosexual interest.In regarding bisexuals as a variety of somewhat
exotic heterosexuals,we will not be dissapointed by anything they will
do.Actually,their behavior in that respect will appear to us as
predictable and logical.
Pardon me while I fan the steam off of that pile.
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| User: "BYTE ME!" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
17 Sep 2005 08:17:45 PM |
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wrote:
The Secretary of HomIntern a =E9crit :
=20
=20
Remember, this is the gay Canadian who doesn't believe in the existence=
of
bisexuality, who thinks it's just a bunch of straights trying to be tre=
ndy.
=20
=20
Bisexuals actually are an heterosexual minority.They apparently have a
problem of defection to the full blown hetero lifestyle,outside the
so-called ex-gay movement and antedating the said movement.Helen
Degeneres`s former girlfriend,Ann Heche,is pretty typical in that
respect,and is probably only one among thousands.The so-called ex-gay
movement is simply a more developped expression,political in kind,of
this trend among bisexuals,who tend to prozelytise heterosexually
speaking when they are dealing with gays.On such a precarious
basis,bisexuals are of course incapable of any independence,cultural
and even less political,from the heterosexual interest and privilege
which in the main dictates their course of action.All the more that
they are not,like other heterosexuals,in secure possession of the said
privilege owing to their peripheral homosexual interests.Which accounts=
for some of their excesses of zeal in the service and furthering of the=
heterosexual interest.In regarding bisexuals as a variety of somewhat
exotic heterosexuals,we will not be dissapointed by anything they will
do.Actually,their behavior in that respect will appear to us as
predictable and logical.
=20
Do you ghost write for world nut daily or do you just pick these gems=20
out of your ***** on the fly?
--=20
Of all the systems of religion that ever were invented, there is none=20
more derogatory to the Almighty, more unedifying to man, more repugnant=20
to reason, and more contradictory in itself, than this thing called=20
Christianity. Too absurd for belief, too impossible to convince, and too =
inconsistent for practice, it renders the heart torpid, or produces only =
atheists and fanatics. As an engine of power, it serves the purpose of=20
despotism; and as a means of wealth, the avarice of priests; but so far=20
as respects the good of man in general, it leads to nothing here or=20
hereafter. =96Thomas Paine
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| User: "The Secretary of HomIntern" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
17 Sep 2005 08:31:42 AM |
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I was busily flonking away in alt.politics.homosexuality, when The Goddess
Eris Herself suddenly made me reply to kingsix@abacom.com:
The Secretary of HomIntern a écrit :
Remember, this is the gay Canadian who doesn't believe in the existence
of bisexuality, who thinks it's just a bunch of straights trying to be
trendy.
Bisexuals actually are an heterosexual minority.
Uh-huh. Blow it out your ear; I am attracted to both men and women,
particularly to those who are also bisexual.
They apparently have a problem of defection to the full blown hetero
lifestyle, outside the so-called ex-gay movement and antedating the said
movement.
I prefer the term "subversion", FYVM.
Helen
"Ellen".
Degeneres`s former girlfriend, Ann
A relatively minor niggle -- "Anne".
Heche, is pretty typical in that respect, and is probably only one among
thousands.
Well, _she_, IMO, has simply fled back into the closet, instead of
exhibiting bisexuality.
The so-called ex-gay movement is simply a more developped expression,
political in kind, of this trend among bisexuals, who tend to prozelytise
heterosexually speaking when they are dealing with gays.
I neither proselytise nor know any bisexuals who do so. "Turning someone bi"
is as impossible as turning them gay or straight. OTOH, relatively few
people are truly 100% gay /or/ straight, since one need not be either a
Kinsey Zero in order to marry the opposite sex and breed, or a Kinsey Six
in order to engage in a LTR with a person of the same sex and breed with a
little help or choose not to do so.
On such a precarious basis, bisexuals are of course incapable of any
independence, cultural and even less political, from the heterosexual
interest and privilege which in the main dictates their course of action.
Except when we voluntarily elect to be so independent. Since the end of
1997, I have made a habit of wearing a large white button on my black hat,
which says, in six-point bold capitals, ******* -- clearly in reference to
myself -- meaning that the default assumption is that I'm gay. Then they
see the back of my hat, and read "I'm bisexual and I'm not attracted to
you", at which point they sometimes "get it". I'm not concerned with gay
biphobes such as yourself; you're a splinter of a splinter. Homophobes who
are disinclined to distinguish between bi- and homosexuals are, however,
quite another matter. Flipping them the bird without getting quite so
explicit and crudely, unwittily blunt as to actually be making that gesture
all the time is one of my missions in life.
All the more that they are not, like other heterosexuals, in secure
possession of the said privilege owing to their peripheral homosexual
interests.
You're referring to Kinsey Ones and Twos, here. Not all bisexuals are
predominantly straight; some are evenly bi, and others are predominantly
gay.
Which accounts for some of their excesses of zeal in the service and
furthering of the heterosexual interest.
Alright, now you're making almost as little sense as John Shocked. I
consider myself, just FYI, to be "in the service and furthering of the
*homosexual* interest". For five years (1999-2004), I was a regular
operator and/or host on Vancouver's Co-operative Radio, CFRO 102.7FM, for
The Coming Out Show/Fruit Salad, which is exactly as gay as it sounds.
In regarding bisexuals as a variety of somewhat exotic heterosexuals, we
will not be dissapointed by anything they will do.
That's alright, I'm perfectly willing to ignore you as much as I generally
do Fred Phelps.
Actually, their behavior in that respect will appear to us as predictable
and logical.
You needn't bother with your condescending ***** towards me, since I
don't have all that much use for the French, either, or Quebec. BTW, you
can thank me later for adding the proper spacing after your commas.
--
___________________________________________________________________________
Hail Eris! "The personal _is_ political."
Bent Depraved N. Deviant *****-Smoker, Esq., Superfaggot
"Stupidity excuses nothing. It's only a reason...." -- Phxbrd
Economic Left/Right: -7.63 Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -7.38
"The whining has just begun." -- John Wentzky
Killfiled by: directory; Anim8rfsk
"It's not nice to misrepresent Mother Nature."
.
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| User: "maf1029 ©2001-2008" |
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| Title: Re: 15 Frank Issues to Raise in Homosexual Diversity Training |
17 Sep 2005 09:00:40 AM |
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On Sat, 17 Sep 2005 13:31:42 GMT, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli opened the heavens and shone his light upon the
wisdom of The Secretary of HomIntern <ý|<®åñ5ë9ô9@\/\/òé|\/|.6®ó>
I was busily flonking away in alt.politics.homosexuality, when The Goddess
Eris Herself suddenly made me reply to kingsix@abacom.com:
The Secretary of HomIntern a écrit :
Remember, this is the gay Canadian who doesn't believe in the existence
of bisexuality, who thinks it's just a bunch of straights trying to be
trendy.
Bisexuals actually are an heterosexual minority.
Uh-huh. Blow it out your ear; I am attracted to both men and women,
Woo and hoo! Doubles your chances for getting a date on Saturday
night.
particularly to those who are also bisexual.
Ooooohhhh --- that just significantly lowered your chances of getting
a date on Saturday night. But hey -- a girl's got to have standards,
right? :-)
They apparently have a problem of defection to the full blown hetero
lifestyle, outside the so-called ex-gay movement and antedating the said
movement.
I prefer the term "subversion", FYVM.
Helen
"Ellen".
Degeneres`s former girlfriend, Ann
A relatively minor niggle -- "Anne".
Heche, is pretty typical in that respect, and is probably only one among
thousands.
Well, _she_, IMO, has simply fled back into the closet, instead of
exhibiting bisexuality.
She is a total nutbucket. Look at her career -- she was winning Emmys
as Marley/Victoria on Another World, and she quit, right before
winning that third Emmy, and then she gets up at the Emmy's and her
acceptance speech amounted to, "Please hire me, because I'm
unemployed."
She comes out, shacks up with Ellen, then does a movie with Harrison
Ford (who's old enough to be her father, BTW), and the movie tanks
because she was incredibly unbelievable as both being attracted to men
and having sex with Harrison Ford.
She dumps Ellen when she realizes that her career is stalling because
she came out. Then she shacks up with Greg Vaughan and then she ends
up in some lady's kitchen in northern California after binging on
drugs and driving nowhere in particular for two days straight.
She's bonkers, and I don't give a fig if she's lesbian, bi, trans,
Romulan, or an aardvark-o-phile.
The so-called ex-gay movement is simply a more developped expression,
political in kind, of this trend among bisexuals, who tend to prozelytise
heterosexually speaking when they are dealing with gays.
I neither proselytise nor know any bisexuals who do so. "Turning someone bi"
is as impossible as turning them gay or straight.
Then you're not doing it right. <ducking for cover>
OTOH, relatively few
people are truly 100% gay /or/ straight, since one need not be either a
Kinsey Zero in order to marry the opposite sex and breed, or a Kinsey Six
in order to engage in a LTR with a person of the same sex and breed with a
little help or choose not to do so.
I learned I was not a perfect Kinsey 6 the night I saw Marina Sirtis
mount Matt McCoy on an episode of ST:TNG, and I wasn't looking at Matt
McCoy (ok, he's disgusting to look at, because he's so damned
emaciated)
On such a precarious basis, bisexuals are of course incapable of any
independence, cultural and even less political, from the heterosexual
interest and privilege which in the main dictates their course of action.
Except when we voluntarily elect to be so independent. Since the end of
1997, I have made a habit of wearing a large white button on my black hat,
which says, in six-point bold capitals, ******* -- clearly in reference to
myself -- meaning that the default assumption is that I'm gay. Then they
see the back of my hat, and read "I'm bisexual and I'm not attracted to
you", at which point they sometimes "get it". I'm not concerned with gay
biphobes such as yourself; you're a splinter of a splinter. Homophobes who
are disinclined to distinguish between bi- and homosexuals are, however,
quite another matter. Flipping them the bird without getting quite so
explicit and crudely, unwittily blunt as to actually be making that gesture
all the time is one of my missions in life.
All the more that they are not, like other heterosexuals, in secure
possession of the said privilege owing to their peripheral homosexual
interests.
You're referring to Kinsey Ones and Twos, here. Not all bisexuals are
predominantly straight; some are evenly bi, and others are predominantly
gay.
Which accounts for some of their excesses of zeal in the service and
furthering of the heterosexual interest.
Alright, now you're making almost as little sense as John Shocked. I
consider myself, just FYI, to be "in the service and furthering of the
*homosexual* interest". For five years (1999-2004), I was a regular
operator and/or host on Vancouver's Co-operative Radio, CFRO 102.7FM, for
The Coming Out Show/Fruit Salad, which is exactly as gay as it sounds.
In regarding bisexuals as a variety of somewhat exotic heterosexuals, we
will not be dissapointed by anything they will do.
That's alright, I'm perfectly willing to ignore you as much as I generally
do Fred Phelps.
Actually, their behavior in that respect will appear to us as predictable
and logical.
You needn't bother with your condescending ***** towards me, since I
don't have all that much use for the French, either, or Quebec. BTW, you
can thank me later for adding the proper spacing after your commas.
You go, girl!
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