Religions > Atheism > A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"The Church of The Painful Truth" |
| Date: |
05 Mar 2004 10:10:48 PM |
| Object: |
A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
Francis and Roger Bacon.
Galileo=Heliocentricity
Sir Issac Newton= Calculas and gravity, particle theory of light
Joseph Lister= Antiseptic surgery
Matthew Maury- Discovery of oceanography from Psalms 8:8
Louis Pastuer = sterilization, bacteriology he is one of the greatest
biologists.
Johann Kepler =celestial mechanics astronomy
Robert Boyle= founder of chemistry ( a Christian ).
William Harvey= circulation of the blood.
Modern discoveries by Christians= Michael faraday -made the generator and
electro magnetic induction
Samuel Morris made the telegraph and his first words Numbers 23:23 "what God
has wrought."
James Simpson was the founder of ginecology founded chloroform on Adams deep
sleep (he said his greatest discovery was that he had a savior.)
Charles Barage= Computer, speedometer, opthamaloscope ( a Christian)
Carolus Lineaus= Gave us the family of species the Genesis kind (believer in
the Bible) Taxonomy.
Nicolas Steno= Father of the science of stratography
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| User: "Dave" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
06 Mar 2004 04:39:45 PM |
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"The Church of The Painful Hemorrhoid" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com> wrote in message news:<nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@news.uswest.net>...
A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
[...]
We need to get back to the fundamentals this great country was founded on...
Male-only voting
Slavery
Witch-burning
No income tax
What else?
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| User: "John Wilkins" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
06 Mar 2004 08:06:22 PM |
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Dave <galt_57@hotmail.com> wrote:
"The Church of The Painful Hemorrhoid" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com> wrote in
message news:<nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@news.uswest.net>...
A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
[...]
We need to get back to the fundamentals this great country was founded on...
Male-only voting
Slavery
Witch-burning
No income tax
What else?
Franchise of land-holders...
--
John Wilkins
john_SPAM@wilkins.id.au http://www.wilkins.id.au
"Men mark it when they hit, but do not mark it when they miss"
- Francis Bacon
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| User: "Maverick" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
06 Mar 2004 12:23:45 AM |
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"The Church of The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com> wrote in
news:nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@news.uswest.net:
A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
The fact that some scientists, especially really long ago, were
creationists is no big surprise, even though perhaps it should be,
considering the Ockham's razor and skepticism and all those things they
should've been aware of, even before Darwin published his theories.
Please understand that NONE of their findings and discovieries had anything
to do with creationism. Therefor it's irrelevant.
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| User: "Dave Oldridge" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
06 Mar 2004 05:20:41 PM |
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"The Church of The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com> wrote in
news:nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@news.uswest.net:
A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
That's nice. It was perfectly scientific to be a young-earth creationist
UNTIL the claims were disproven scientifically. After that it became the
pseudoscience it is today.
Francis and Roger Bacon.
Galileo=Heliocentricity
Sir Issac Newton= Calculas and gravity, particle theory of light
Joseph Lister= Antiseptic surgery
Matthew Maury- Discovery of oceanography from Psalms 8:8
Louis Pastuer = sterilization, bacteriology he is one of the greatest
biologists.
Johann Kepler =celestial mechanics astronomy
Robert Boyle= founder of chemistry ( a Christian ).
William Harvey= circulation of the blood.
Modern discoveries by Christians= Michael faraday -made the generator
and electro magnetic induction
Samuel Morris made the telegraph and his first words Numbers 23:23
"what God has wrought."
James Simpson was the founder of ginecology founded chloroform on
Adams deep sleep (he said his greatest discovery was that he had a
savior.)
Charles Barage= Computer, speedometer, opthamaloscope ( a Christian)
Carolus Lineaus= Gave us the family of species the Genesis kind
(believer in the Bible) Taxonomy.
Nicolas Steno= Father of the science of stratography
That's nice. And don't forget that some of the most important work in
modern evolutioniary genetics was done by Theodosius Dobzhansky and
Francisco Ayala, both Christians.
Of course we'll never know what scientists of bygone eras would think of
modern latter-day pseudoscientific young-earth creationism, but, judging
from their tolerance of similar nonsense in their own day, I doubt they
would give it any ringing endorsement. You see, the moment the YEC
movement became dogmatic about departing from honesty, that was the
moment its leaders became heretics, outcast from the main body of Christ.
--
Dave Oldridge
ICQ 1800667
Paradoxically, most real events are highly improbable.
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| User: "Steve" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
05 Mar 2004 10:23:24 PM |
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"The Church of The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com> wrote in message
news:nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@news.uswest.net...
: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
:
: Francis and Roger Bacon.
:
: Galileo=Heliocentricity
:
: Sir Issac Newton= Calculas and gravity, particle theory of light
:
: Joseph Lister= Antiseptic surgery
:
: Matthew Maury- Discovery of oceanography from Psalms 8:8
:
: Louis Pastuer = sterilization, bacteriology he is one of the greatest
: biologists.
:
: Johann Kepler =celestial mechanics astronomy
:
: Robert Boyle= founder of chemistry ( a Christian ).
:
: William Harvey= circulation of the blood.
:
: Modern discoveries by Christians= Michael faraday -made the generator and
: electro magnetic induction
:
: Samuel Morris made the telegraph and his first words Numbers 23:23 "what
God
: has wrought."
:
: James Simpson was the founder of ginecology founded chloroform on Adams
deep
: sleep (he said his greatest discovery was that he had a savior.)
:
: Charles Barage= Computer, speedometer, opthamaloscope ( a Christian)
:
: Carolus Lineaus= Gave us the family of species the Genesis kind (believer
in
: the Bible) Taxonomy.
:
: Nicolas Steno= Father of the science of stratography
:
I think most of these people achievements are DESPITE being christian..not
because they were
--
Steve
The Earth is degenerating these days. Bribery and corruption abound.
Children no longer mind their parents, every man wants to write a book, and
it is evident that the end of the world is fast approaching.
- Assyrian Stone Tablet, c.2800BC
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| User: "Clayton the Doormat...Walk All Over Me Ladies" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
06 Mar 2004 04:59:54 PM |
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"The Church of The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com> wrote in
message
news:nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@news.uswest.net...
: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
A good portion of sailing and sea going principles and technology was
founded by people who thought the world was flat and didn't want to sail off
the edge....don't make it so!! They were right about one and and wrong
about the other, because they didn't know any better...one has nothing to do
with the other. Considering most of those on your little troll list weren't
actually "creationists" because no other option was possible at the time.
Civilization was created looooong before Christianity...therefore, by your
logic, nothing Christianity has added to civilization is of any worth or
relevance because it wasn't the belief of those who begun civilization.
What am I doing wasting time talking to a brain dead troll like you?
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| User: "Rubystars" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
07 Mar 2004 11:19:30 AM |
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"Clayton the Doormat...Walk All Over Me Ladies"
<cjfat@SPAMBLOCKnotmyemail.com> wrote in message
news:404a594e$0$3955$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"The Church of The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com> wrote in
message
news:nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@news.uswest.net...
: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
A good portion of sailing and sea going principles and technology was
founded by people who thought the world was flat and didn't want to sail
off
the edge....don't make it so!! They were right about one and and wrong
about the other, because they didn't know any better...one has nothing to
do
with the other. Considering most of those on your little troll list
weren't
actually "creationists" because no other option was possible at the time.
Civilization was created looooong before Christianity...therefore, by your
logic, nothing Christianity has added to civilization is of any worth or
relevance because it wasn't the belief of those who begun civilization.
I think there were other options, though maybe they wouldn't have wanted to
talk about contrary views publicly. Anyway, I think the argument goes like
this:
1. Evolutionists claim you can't be a scientist (especially in Biology)
unless you accept evolution
2. Here are some examples of scientists (especially doing something related
to Biology) who were creationists.
3. Therefore, evolutionists are wrong.
The problem with this argument is that while this may have been true for the
people listed in #2, modern Biology and much of the other sciences require
acceptance of evolution today.
-Rubystars
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
06 Mar 2004 05:33:12 PM |
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On Sat, 6 Mar 2004 04:23:24 +0000 (UTC), "Steve"
<dontbother@hotmail.com> wrote:
"The Church of The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com> wrote in message
news:nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@news.uswest.net...
: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
:
[snip]
I think most of these people achievements are DESPITE being christian..not
because they were
They were none of them creationists - that is a relatively modern
phenomenon. The liars for God imagine that anybody who was Christian
could only have been their kind of Christian.
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| User: "Dana Tweedy" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
05 Mar 2004 10:59:53 PM |
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Piggybacking
"Steve" <dontbother@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c2bk2n$cuj$1@lust.ihug.co.nz...
"The Church of The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com> wrote in
message
news:nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@news.uswest.net...
: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
snipping list of people who lived before the theory of evolution was
published.
: Louis Pastuer = sterilization, bacteriology he is one of the greatest
: biologists.
:
What evidence do you have that Pasteur was a Creationist?
Snip rest.
DJT
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| User: "Mike Painter" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
06 Mar 2004 11:20:21 AM |
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"The Church of The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com> wrote in message
news:nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@news.uswest.net...
A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
Most of the names on the list died at a time when not being a christian
meant that at best, your career would be ruined and you could never be
published.
For many it would have meant death.
One name not on the list is the man who discovered that blood circulated in
the human body.
He wanted to be a moderate christian, saying that all sects were essentially
the same.
They killed him for that.
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| User: "Grinder" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
05 Mar 2004 11:31:18 PM |
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"The Church of The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com> wrote in message
news:nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@news.uswest.net...
A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
[snip]
Charles Barage= Computer, speedometer, opthamaloscope ( a Christian)
[snip]
I guess you mean Charles Babbage. But then again, I would guess you don't
know what you mean.
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| User: "Dana Tweedy" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
05 Mar 2004 11:53:56 PM |
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"Grinder" <grinder@no.spam.maam.net> wrote in message
news:esd2c.52734$ko6.403865@attbi_s02...
"The Church of The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com> wrote in
message
news:nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@news.uswest.net...
A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
[snip]
Charles Barage= Computer, speedometer, opthamaloscope ( a Christian)
[snip]
I guess you mean Charles Babbage. But then again, I would guess you don't
know what you mean.
You know, if we were interested, we could probably follow the phylogenic
tree of this regurgipost, and trace it back to it's original ancestor, using
the common errors to determine which version is most likely the common
ancestor.
Since the creationists who have copied and recopied this piece have made
spelling errors, getting the names of the scientists wrong, they obviously
never actually bothered to research this list to see if the "scientists"
actually held Creationist opinions. It's interesting to see how even a
creationist screed can demonstrate the principle of common descent.
Most, if not all seem to be on the list because they have at one time or
another claimed to be Christian. Why this makes them automatically
creationist, is not revealed.
DJT
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| User: "Harlequin" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
06 Mar 2004 05:37:17 PM |
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"Dana Tweedy" <tweedyd@cvn.net> wrote in
news:c2bpci$1rbfi5$1@ID-35161.news.uni-berlin.de:
"Grinder" <grinder@no.spam.maam.net> wrote in message
news:esd2c.52734$ko6.403865@attbi_s02...
"The Church of The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com> wrote in
message
news:nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@news.uswest.net...
A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
[snip]
Charles Barage= Computer, speedometer, opthamaloscope ( a
Christian)
[snip]
I guess you mean Charles Babbage. But then again, I would guess you
don't know what you mean.
You know, if we were interested, we could probably follow the
phylogenic tree of this regurgipost, and trace it back to it's
original ancestor, using the common errors to determine which version
is most likely the common ancestor.
Since the creationists who have copied and recopied this piece have
made
spelling errors, getting the names of the scientists wrong, they
obviously never actually bothered to research this list to see if the
"scientists" actually held Creationist opinions. It's interesting to
see how even a creationist screed can demonstrate the principle of
common descent.
Most, if not all seem to be on the list because they have at one time
or
another claimed to be Christian. Why this makes them automatically
creationist, is not revealed.
The following appears to be the original.
http://www.letusreason.org/Apolo6.htm
A Google search for "Charles Babbage" gives only the above URL and
a Christian Forums thread which honestly copies and pastes it with
the URL as a reference. Google Groups shows several post postings
of it.
Going back to the main list I find "Modern discoveries by Christians=
Michael faraday -made the generator and electro magnetic induction"
to be fairly amusing. They have a strange idea for "modern" in this
context.
--
Anti-spam: replace "usenet" with "harlequin2"
I am Mike and I approve this message.
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| User: "Grinder" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
06 Mar 2004 01:05:06 AM |
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"Dana Tweedy" <tweedyd@cvn.net> wrote in message
news:c2bpci$1rbfi5$1@ID-35161.news.uni-berlin.de...
"Grinder" <grinder@no.spam.maam.net> wrote in message
news:esd2c.52734$ko6.403865@attbi_s02...
"The Church of The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com> wrote in
message
news:nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@news.uswest.net...
A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
[snip]
Charles Barage= Computer, speedometer, opthamaloscope ( a Christian)
[snip]
I guess you mean Charles Babbage. But then again, I would guess you
don't
know what you mean.
You know, if we were interested, we could probably follow the phylogenic
tree of this regurgipost, and trace it back to it's original ancestor,
using
the common errors to determine which version is most likely the common
ancestor.
Since the creationists who have copied and recopied this piece have
made
spelling errors, getting the names of the scientists wrong, they obviously
never actually bothered to research this list to see if the "scientists"
actually held Creationist opinions. It's interesting to see how even a
creationist screed can demonstrate the principle of common descent.
Most, if not all seem to be on the list because they have at one time or
another claimed to be Christian. Why this makes them automatically
creationist, is not revealed.
The is the earliest thing I can find on the web -- the list was tacked onto
the end of a pre-exising "essay."
http://web.archive.org/web/20020602103631/http://letusreason.org/Apolo6.htm
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
06 Mar 2004 05:33:12 PM |
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On Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:31:18 +0000 (UTC), "Grinder"
<grinder@no.spam.maam.net> wrote:
"The Church of The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com> wrote in message
news:nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@news.uswest.net...
A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
[snip]
Charles Barage= Computer, speedometer, opthamaloscope ( a Christian)
[snip]
I guess you mean Charles Babbage. But then again, I would guess you don't
know what you mean.
He also invented the railroad dynamometer car and (AFAIR) the
freewheel mechanism for bicycles.
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| User: "Sporkmastar Fred" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
06 Mar 2004 11:49:36 AM |
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"The Church of The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com> wrote in message news:<nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@news.uswest.net>...
A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
How could they be anything else? Darwin hadn't been born yet.
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| User: "Thore Schmechtig" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
06 Mar 2004 02:53:25 AM |
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--
UNWRITTEN RULES OF (PSEUDO-CHRISTIAN) FUNDAMENTALISM
1. "I'm right and you are wrong".
2. Never admit that you are wrong, even if you really are.
3. When you have nothing to say, hurl insults.
4. Regard and portray your own violence, whether physical, psychological,
or verbal, at all times as defensive
4a. Specific example for 4.: Cry for "freedom of religion", but whenever followers of other faiths want the same freedom and courts agree, scream "Persecution!"
5. Be prepared at all times to lie and bluster, particularly when backed
into a corner in an argument
5a. When caught lying, always accuse the opposition of lying rather than be honest and admit the obvious
6. Never accept responsibility for any mess you have personally caused.
7. When you are forced to admit to an error, regard the whole process of
error and correction as part of God's personal plan for you and not as a
something for which you should apologise retract or make amends except
verbally and secretly to God himself
8. Always see yourself and you personal actions as part of God's plans for
the world. Recognise that even your errors are just part of Gods will for
the betterment of mankind.
9.Profess humility but avoid the actual experience of it.
10.Refuse to take in information that differs from your own view and
oppose all such information through classification of such information in
a derogatory and simplistic manner(eg by categorising it as left wing
propaganda)
11.Refuse to accept that truth is not black and white; that reality is
complex and there are shades of grey
12.Refuse to forgive anyone else for anything unless you purport to
forgive on behalf of other people unconnected with you for whom you don't
have that right anyhow.
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| User: "SReeseMe" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
06 Mar 2004 03:40:52 PM |
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Subject: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
From: "The Church of The Painful Truth"
Date: 03/05/2004 11:10 PM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <nospam-Igc2c.697$%s5.63630@ne
A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
Francis and Roger Bacon.
Galileo=Heliocentricity
Sir Issac Newton= Calculas and
gravity, particle theory of light
Didn't all these people live and work BEFORE Darwin published his theory?
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| User: "Matt Silberstein" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
06 Mar 2004 12:09:44 AM |
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In alt.talk.creationism I read this message from "The Church of
The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com>:
A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
Francis and Roger Bacon.
Galileo=Heliocentricity
Sir Issac Newton= Calculas and gravity, particle theory of light
Joseph Lister= Antiseptic surgery
Matthew Maury- Discovery of oceanography from Psalms 8:8
Louis Pastuer = sterilization, bacteriology he is one of the greatest
biologists.
Johann Kepler =celestial mechanics astronomy
Robert Boyle= founder of chemistry ( a Christian ).
William Harvey= circulation of the blood.
Modern discoveries by Christians= Michael faraday -made the generator and
electro magnetic induction
Samuel Morris made the telegraph and his first words Numbers 23:23 "what God
has wrought."
James Simpson was the founder of ginecology founded chloroform on Adams deep
sleep (he said his greatest discovery was that he had a savior.)
Charles Barage= Computer, speedometer, opthamaloscope ( a Christian)
Carolus Lineaus= Gave us the family of species the Genesis kind (believer in
the Bible) Taxonomy.
Nicolas Steno= Father of the science of stratography
How many of them did their work after Darwin published? How many
of those said anything about Darwin? You should understand that
equivocation is a form of lying and Jesus hates liars.
--
Matt Silberstein
Donate to the C.A.N.D.L.E.S. Museum, burnt down by arsonists who wrote
"Remember Timothy McVeigh" on the wall.
C.A.N.D.L.E.S. stands for Children of Auschwitz Nazi Deadly Lab Experiments
Survivors.
www.candles-museum.com
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| User: "Richard" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
06 Mar 2004 05:37:19 PM |
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Matt Silberstein wrote:
In alt.talk.creationism I read this message from "The Church of
The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com>:
A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists.
Francis and Roger Bacon.
died before Darwin was born
Galileo=Heliocentricity
died before Darwin was born, persecuted by the church
Sir Issac Newton= Calculas and gravity, particle theory of light
died before Darwin was born
Joseph Lister= Antiseptic surgery
Matthew Maury- Discovery of oceanography from Psalms 8:8
contemporary of Darwin, work published before Darwin's Origin of the Species
Louis Pastuer = sterilization, bacteriology he is one of the greatest
biologists.
Johann Kepler =celestial mechanics astronomy
died before Darwin was born
Robert Boyle= founder of chemistry ( a Christian ).
died before Darwin was born
William Harvey= circulation of the blood.
died before Darwin was born
Modern discoveries by Christians= Michael faraday -made the generator and
electro magnetic induction
contemporary of Darwin, discoveries all came before Darwin's Origin
of the Species
Samuel Morris made the telegraph and his first words Numbers 23:23 "what God
has wrought."
contemporary of Darwin, work produced before Darwin's Origin of the Species
James Simpson was the founder of ginecology founded chloroform on Adams deep
sleep (he said his greatest discovery was that he had a savior.)
Charles Barage= Computer, speedometer, opthamaloscope ( a Christian)
Charles Babbage, contemporary of Darwin, discoveries all came before
Darwin's Origin of the Species
Carolus Lineaus= Gave us the family of species the Genesis kind (believer in
the Bible) Taxonomy.
died before Darwin was born
Nicolas Steno= Father of the science of stratography
died before Darwin was born
How many of them did their work after Darwin published? How many
of those said anything about Darwin? You should understand that
equivocation is a form of lying and Jesus hates liars.
As is typical of lists of this sort,the work of most of the people
on his list predates Darwin, in some cases by centuries. Moreover,
being a Christian doesn't automatically make you a creationist, Stephen
J. Gould being the ultimate modern example.
Richard
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| User: "Mike Dworetsky" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
07 Mar 2004 04:36:36 AM |
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"Richard" <richard@nospam.edu> wrote in message
news:nOe2c.16175$Pc.7811@okepread02...
Matt Silberstein wrote:
In alt.talk.creationism I read this message from "The Church of
The Painful Truth" <Nospam@Nomarketing.com>:
Charles Barage= Computer, speedometer, opthamaloscope ( a Christian)
Charles Babbage, contemporary of Darwin, discoveries all came before
Darwin's Origin of the Species
Whatever Babbage's religious views were, it is worth pointing out that he
was a university student with, and very close friend of, Sir John Herschel,
the noted astronomer, who was "mainstream" Christian and very much opposed
to fundy Creationistic claptrap, even before Darwin's publication of Origin
of Species.
It is also very much worth pointing out that Darwin spent most of his adult
life happily married to a supportive and devout Christian wife.
Being Christian (or anything else) does not imply support for creationism.
Generally the opposite.
--
Mike Dworetsky
(Remove "pants" spamblock to send e-mail)
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| User: "Kadaitcha Man" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
07 Mar 2004 06:02:57 AM |
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Mike Dworetsky wrote:
Being Christian (or anything else) does not imply support for
creationism. Generally the opposite.
*blink*
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| User: "Mike Dworetsky" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
07 Mar 2004 06:26:41 AM |
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"Kadaitcha Man" <nospam@kadaitcha.cx> wrote in message
news:iJS0LIzp5cq242A0D9DBE69355663m68osaCbzdS@kadaitcha.cx...
Mike Dworetsky wrote:
Being Christian (or anything else) does not imply support for
creationism. Generally the opposite.
*blink*
A bit difficult to interpret this short interjection. If you mean you are
surprised that many people who regard themselves as Christian, Jewish,
Mohammedan, or anything else, also accept modern science's astronomy,
geology, biology, and physical evolution, and reject fundy creationism, then
I don't understand how you come to that conclusion. Look up the quotes from
mainstream religions on http://www.talkorigins.org
It is true that creationists try to portray themselves as the only true
Christians, thereby painting themselves into a narrow sectarian corner
rejected by mainstream religious groups of all faiths. Don't assume they
speak for all religious persons.
--
Mike Dworetsky
(Remove "pants" spamblock to send e-mail)
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
07 Mar 2004 06:07:24 AM |
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Kadaitcha Man <nospam@kadaitcha.cx> wrote in alt.atheism
Mike Dworetsky wrote:
Being Christian (or anything else) does not imply support for
creationism. Generally the opposite.
*blink*
Are you a creationist?
--
Elroy Willis
EAP Chief Editor and Newshound
http://web2.airmail.net/~elo/news
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| User: "Kadaitcha Man" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
07 Mar 2004 06:19:48 AM |
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Elroy Willis wrote:
Kadaitcha Man <nospam@kadaitcha.cx> wrote in alt.atheism
Mike Dworetsky wrote:
Being Christian (or anything else) does not imply support for
creationism. Generally the opposite.
*blink*
Are you a creationist?
I'm a Christian. Whilst I don't deny that evolution has it's place for
explaining speciation in vertebrates and a very narrow class of arthropods,
that we evolved out of some primordial soup is as equally valid a
proposition as is that we were created. What the moron up there just wrote,
in effect, was that Christians generally don't believe in an act of
creation. Sheesh. I'd like to see some supporting references for that
statement. It's absurd.
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| User: "Matt Silberstein" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
07 Mar 2004 10:53:16 AM |
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In alt.talk.creationism I read this message from "Kadaitcha Man"
<nospam@kadaitcha.cx>:
Elroy Willis wrote:
Kadaitcha Man <nospam@kadaitcha.cx> wrote in alt.atheism
Mike Dworetsky wrote:
Being Christian (or anything else) does not imply support for
creationism. Generally the opposite.
*blink*
Are you a creationist?
I'm a Christian. Whilst I don't deny that evolution has it's place for
explaining speciation in vertebrates and a very narrow class of arthropods,
This is so odd a comment. Do you think that evolution is not
responsible for speciation outside those groups? Do you deny
speciation outside those groups or think something else explains
it?
that we evolved out of some primordial soup is as equally valid a
proposition as is that we were created. What the moron up there just wrote,
in effect, was that Christians generally don't believe in an act of
creation. Sheesh. I'd like to see some supporting references for that
statement. It's absurd.
"Creationist" has multiple meanings. In general, the
"evolutionist" side use "creationist" as short hand for "young
Earth scientific creationist", which means someone who think that
Genesis is a accurate descriptive account of the beginning of the
world and of life and that the evidence supports this claim. The
other side likes to use multiple meanings of the term. Sometimes
they use the above, sometimes they go with "God is responsible
for things", an entirely different meaning.
--
Matt Silberstein
Donate to the C.A.N.D.L.E.S. Museum, burnt down by arsonists who wrote
"Remember Timothy McVeigh" on the wall.
C.A.N.D.L.E.S. stands for Children of Auschwitz Nazi Deadly Lab Experiments
Survivors.
www.candles-museum.com
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
07 Mar 2004 07:24:00 AM |
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Kadaitcha Man <nospam@kadaitcha.cx> wrote in alt.atheism
Elroy Willis wrote:
Kadaitcha Man <nospam@kadaitcha.cx> wrote in alt.atheism
Mike Dworetsky wrote:
Being Christian (or anything else) does not imply support for
creationism. Generally the opposite.
*blink*
Are you a creationist?
I'm a Christian. Whilst I don't deny that evolution has it's place for
explaining speciation in vertebrates and a very narrow class of arthropods,
that we evolved out of some primordial soup is as equally valid a
proposition as is that we were created. What the moron up there just wrote,
in effect, was that Christians generally don't believe in an act of
creation. Sheesh. I'd like to see some supporting references for that
statement. It's absurd.
When do you consider creation took place for people, exactly?
Do you actually believe the Adam and Eve story, literally?
How do you explain all the 20,000+ year-old cave paintings and artwork
that's been found? The Venus of Willendorf is at least 20,000 years
old... And those ice mummies, what about them? And the neanderthals
must give you a bit of trouble, eh? Were they descendants of Noah?
Did Noah gather them two by two as well as gathering a couple
cro-magnon people as well? Did he convince a pair of Australian
aboriginees to build a boat to sail to the middle east with all the
Australian animals on board, or did all those animals magically swim
to the middle east instead. The kangaroos hopped across the water,
did they?
Quite frankly, I never could answer all those questions, even back
when I was young child and learned about those things in
school. It was around then that I pretty much dumped Christianity.
Now I'm called a fundy atheist by many believers. :-)
It used to sort of annoy me, but now I think I might actually be proud
of it.
So, Kadaitcha Man, where does human creation take place in your little
theistic world, exactly? Give the details...
--
Elroy Willis
EAP Chief Editor and Newshound
http://web2.airmail.net/~elo/news
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| User: "John Wilkins" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
07 Mar 2004 06:32:14 AM |
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Kadaitcha Man <nospam@kadaitcha.cx> wrote:
Elroy Willis wrote:
Kadaitcha Man <nospam@kadaitcha.cx> wrote in alt.atheism
Mike Dworetsky wrote:
Being Christian (or anything else) does not imply support for
creationism. Generally the opposite.
*blink*
Are you a creationist?
I'm a Christian. Whilst I don't deny that evolution has it's place for
explaining speciation in vertebrates and a very narrow class of arthropods,
that we evolved out of some primordial soup is as equally valid a
proposition as is that we were created. What the moron up there just wrote,
in effect, was that Christians generally don't believe in an act of
creation. Sheesh. I'd like to see some supporting references for that
statement. It's absurd.
No he didn't. He said that generally Christians aren't creation*ists* -
that is, do not assert that God created the earth as it now is at the
beginning, or that all species are exactly now as they were created,
pace the Fall.
Believing in a creator god is not creationism, in the modern sense.
--
John Wilkins
john_SPAM@wilkins.id.au http://www.wilkins.id.au
"Men mark it when they hit, but do not mark it when they miss"
- Francis Bacon
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
07 Mar 2004 07:08:06 AM |
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(John Wilkins) wrote in alt.atheism
Kadaitcha Man <nospam@kadaitcha.cx> wrote:
Elroy Willis wrote:
Kadaitcha Man <nospam@kadaitcha.cx> wrote in alt.atheism
Mike Dworetsky wrote:
Being Christian (or anything else) does not imply support for
creationism. Generally the opposite.
*blink*
Are you a creationist?
I'm a Christian. Whilst I don't deny that evolution has it's place for
explaining speciation in vertebrates and a very narrow class of arthropods,
that we evolved out of some primordial soup is as equally valid a
proposition as is that we were created. What the moron up there just
wrote, in effect, was that Christians generally don't believe in an act of
creation. Sheesh. I'd like to see some supporting references for that
statement. It's absurd.
No he didn't. He said that generally Christians aren't creation*ists* -
that is, do not assert that God created the earth as it now is at the
beginning, or that all species are exactly now as they were created,
pace the Fall.
Believing in a creator god is not creationism, in the modern sense.
When do the Christians who believe in evolution think their god
"breathed life" into the first human or humans? Was it before those
humans who made cave paintings and tools out of stone and bone?
Before humans conquered fire? Exactly when was it, according to
them? Any idea?
--
Elroy Willis
EAP Chief Editor and Newshound
http://web2.airmail.net/~elo/news
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| User: "Dana Tweedy" |
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| Title: Re: A good portion of our modern science was founded by creationists. |
07 Mar 2004 03:52:49 PM |
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"Elroy Willis" <elo@airmail.net> wrote in message
news:6m7m40l41vfjjhnjng43nn7g4v0fscgl0q@4ax.com...
snippint
When do the Christians who believe in evolution think their god
"breathed life" into the first human or humans? Was it before those
humans who made cave paintings and tools out of stone and bone?
Before humans conquered fire? Exactly when was it, according to
them? Any idea?
I can't speak for others, but for myself, I see the "breathe life" as being
part of the creation legend, and not a literal statement. Personally, I
think all life has the "Breath of God", not just human beings. That's my
religious opinion, however, nothing I expect others to accept, and nothing I
can support by any evidence.
DJT
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