| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Brendan Taylor" |
| Date: |
06 May 2004 03:01:31 PM |
| Object: |
Anthropology and atheism |
Have there been any cultures (modern or ancient) where no form of worship
of the supernatural existed?
Just wondering, as this would nicely counter the assertation that
"everybody knows God".
.
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| User: "Gregory Gadow" |
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| Title: Re: Anthropology and atheism |
06 May 2004 03:08:40 PM |
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Brendan Taylor wrote:
Have there been any cultures (modern or ancient) where no form of worship
of the supernatural existed?
Just wondering, as this would nicely counter the assertation that
"everybody knows God".
Not that I am aware of. However, I would think the incredible variation int
the conception of "god" throughout human cultures does the trick quite
nicely.
It is generally held that primates have an innate need to find and identify
pattern in their environment, and that humans are no different. This
pattern-making ability has strong survival benefit, in that it helps us to
find food and identify friend from foe. It is such a basic need that it is
what give meaning -- even if it is incohate meaning -- to the memory
reorganization that takes place during REM sleep. It is also the driving
source behind our need to make sense of the universe in any way we can, even
if that means making up and believing stories about supernatural agencies.
--
Gregory Gadow
techbear@serv.net
http://www.serv.net/~techbear
"If you make yourself a sheep, the wolves will eat you."
-- Benjamin Franklin
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| User: "LanaXZR" |
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| Title: Re: Anthropology and atheism |
06 May 2004 03:31:37 PM |
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Brendan Taylor wrote:
Have there been any cultures (modern or ancient) where no form of worship
of the supernatural existed?
Just wondering, as this would nicely counter the assertation that
"everybody knows God".
Gregory Gadow wrote:
Not that I am aware of. However, I would think the incredible variation int
the conception of "god" throughout human cultures does the trick quite
nicely.
It is generally held that primates have an innate need to find and identify
pattern in their environment, and that humans are no different. This
pattern-making ability has strong survival benefit, in that it helps us to
find food and identify friend from foe. It is such a basic need that it is
what give meaning -- even if it is incohate meaning -- to the memory
reorganization that takes place during REM sleep. It is also the driving
source behind our need to make sense of the universe in any way we can, even
if that means making up and believing stories about supernatural agencies.
--
It was my interest in cultural anthropolgy as a young girl that helped me
realize I was an atheist. I loved reading about different cultures and soon
realized that each one had developed a religion to explain what they couldn't
understand. And in each one, the children were taught that it was true, real
etc. It wasn't much of a leap to realize that Catholicism was the same thing.
Lana (for whom being a good Catholic girl was never a good fit)
.
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| User: "Denis Loubet" |
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| Title: Re: Anthropology and atheism |
06 May 2004 05:01:27 PM |
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"LanaXZR" <lanaxzr@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040506163137.05832.00000699@mb-m03.aol.com...
Brendan Taylor wrote:
Have there been any cultures (modern or ancient) where no form of
worship
of the supernatural existed?
Just wondering, as this would nicely counter the assertation that
"everybody knows God".
Gregory Gadow wrote:
Not that I am aware of. However, I would think the incredible variation
int
the conception of "god" throughout human cultures does the trick quite
nicely.
It is generally held that primates have an innate need to find and
identify
pattern in their environment, and that humans are no different. This
pattern-making ability has strong survival benefit, in that it helps us
to
find food and identify friend from foe. It is such a basic need that it
is
what give meaning -- even if it is incohate meaning -- to the memory
reorganization that takes place during REM sleep. It is also the driving
source behind our need to make sense of the universe in any way we can,
even
if that means making up and believing stories about supernatural
agencies.
--
It was my interest in cultural anthropolgy as a young girl that helped me
realize I was an atheist. I loved reading about different cultures and
soon
realized that each one had developed a religion to explain what they
couldn't
understand. And in each one, the children were taught that it was true,
real
etc. It wasn't much of a leap to realize that Catholicism was the same
thing.
Bravo! Well done! :-)
Denis Loubet
dloubet@io.com
http://www.io.com/~dloubet
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| User: "John M Price PhD" |
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| Title: aa - AQOTM Nomination was:Re: Anthropology and atheism |
06 May 2004 06:47:36 PM |
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In alt.atheism article <20040506163137.05832.00000699@mb-m03.aol.com> LanaXZR <lanaxzr@aol.com> wrote:
: >Brendan Taylor wrote:
: >
: >> Have there been any cultures (modern or ancient) where no form of worship
: >> of the supernatural existed?
: >>
: >> Just wondering, as this would nicely counter the assertation that
: >> "everybody knows God".
: >
: Gregory Gadow wrote:
: >Not that I am aware of. However, I would think the incredible variation int
: >the conception of "god" throughout human cultures does the trick quite
: >nicely.
: >
: >It is generally held that primates have an innate need to find and identify
: >pattern in their environment, and that humans are no different. This
: >pattern-making ability has strong survival benefit, in that it helps us to
: >find food and identify friend from foe. It is such a basic need that it is
: >what give meaning -- even if it is incohate meaning -- to the memory
: >reorganization that takes place during REM sleep. It is also the driving
: >source behind our need to make sense of the universe in any way we can, even
: >if that means making up and believing stories about supernatural agencies.
: >--
: >
=== begin quote ===
: It was my interest in cultural anthropolgy as a young girl that helped me
: realize I was an atheist. I loved reading about different cultures and soon
: realized that each one had developed a religion to explain what they couldn't
: understand. And in each one, the children were taught that it was true, real
: etc. It wasn't much of a leap to realize that Catholicism was the same thing.
=== end quote ===
: Lana (for whom being a good Catholic girl was never a good fit)
Seconds?
(c) 2004. Copyright, John M. Price, PhD. All Rights Reserved.
Contents may not be republished in any form or medium without prior
written consent of the author with the express and only exception of
followup postings limited to and within usenet.
--
John M. Price, PhD
Life: Chemistry, but with feeling! | PGP Key on request or FTP!
Email responses to my Usenet articles will be posted at my discretion.
Comoderator: sci.psychology.psychotherapy.moderated Atheist# 683
Secular schools can never be tolerated because such schools have no
religious instruction, and a general moral instruction without a religious
foundation is built on air; consequently, all character training and
religion must be derived from faith . . . we need believing people.
-Adolf Hitler, April 26, 1933
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| User: "Michelle Malkin" |
|
| Title: Re: aa - AQOTM Nomination was:Re: Anthropology and atheism |
06 May 2004 09:37:44 PM |
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On 06 May 2004 23:47:36 GMT, John M Price PhD
<jmprice@calweb.com> wrote:
In alt.atheism article <20040506163137.05832.00000699@mb-m03.aol.com> LanaXZR <lanaxzr@aol.com> wrote:
: >Brendan Taylor wrote:
: >
: >> Have there been any cultures (modern or ancient) where no form of worship
: >> of the supernatural existed?
: >>
: >> Just wondering, as this would nicely counter the assertation that
: >> "everybody knows God".
: >
: Gregory Gadow wrote:
: >Not that I am aware of. However, I would think the incredible variation int
: >the conception of "god" throughout human cultures does the trick quite
: >nicely.
: >
: >It is generally held that primates have an innate need to find and identify
: >pattern in their environment, and that humans are no different. This
: >pattern-making ability has strong survival benefit, in that it helps us to
: >find food and identify friend from foe. It is such a basic need that it is
: >what give meaning -- even if it is incohate meaning -- to the memory
: >reorganization that takes place during REM sleep. It is also the driving
: >source behind our need to make sense of the universe in any way we can, even
: >if that means making up and believing stories about supernatural agencies.
: >--
: >
=== begin quote ===
: It was my interest in cultural anthropolgy as a young girl that helped me
: realize I was an atheist. I loved reading about different cultures and soon
: realized that each one had developed a religion to explain what they couldn't
: understand. And in each one, the children were taught that it was true, real
: etc. It wasn't much of a leap to realize that Catholicism was the same thing.
=== end quote ===
: Lana (for whom being a good Catholic girl was never a good fit)
Seconds?
I second.
(c) 2004. Copyright, John M. Price, PhD. All Rights Reserved.
Contents may not be republished in any form or medium without prior
written consent of the author with the express and only exception of
followup postings limited to and within usenet.
^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^
Michelle Malkin (Mickey)
alt.atheism atheist/agnostic list name collector
BAAWA Knight bible thumper thumper
http://questioner.www2.50megs.com
^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^
Give me the storm and tempest of thought and action,
rather than the dead calm of ignorance and faith.
Banish me from Eden when you will, but first let
me eat of the fruit of the tree of knowledge. For
happiness is the only good, reason the only torch,
justice the only worship, and love the only priest.
- Robert Green Ingersoll
**************************************************************
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| User: "Liz" |
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| Title: Re: aa - AQOTM Nomination was:Re: Anthropology and atheism |
06 May 2004 06:59:41 PM |
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On 06 May 2004 23:47:36 GMT, John M Price PhD <jmprice@calweb.com> in
news message <409ace98$0$28687$d368eab@news.calweb.com> wrote:
In alt.atheism article <20040506163137.05832.00000699@mb-m03.aol.com> LanaXZR <lanaxzr@aol.com> wrote:
: >Brendan Taylor wrote:
: >
: >> Have there been any cultures (modern or ancient) where no form of worship
: >> of the supernatural existed?
: >>
: >> Just wondering, as this would nicely counter the assertation that
: >> "everybody knows God".
: >
: Gregory Gadow wrote:
: >Not that I am aware of. However, I would think the incredible variation int
: >the conception of "god" throughout human cultures does the trick quite
: >nicely.
: >
: >It is generally held that primates have an innate need to find and identify
: >pattern in their environment, and that humans are no different. This
: >pattern-making ability has strong survival benefit, in that it helps us to
: >find food and identify friend from foe. It is such a basic need that it is
: >what give meaning -- even if it is incohate meaning -- to the memory
: >reorganization that takes place during REM sleep. It is also the driving
: >source behind our need to make sense of the universe in any way we can, even
: >if that means making up and believing stories about supernatural agencies.
: >--
: >
=== begin quote ===
: It was my interest in cultural anthropolgy as a young girl that helped me
: realize I was an atheist. I loved reading about different cultures and soon
: realized that each one had developed a religion to explain what they couldn't
: understand. And in each one, the children were taught that it was true, real
: etc. It wasn't much of a leap to realize that Catholicism was the same thing.
=== end quote ===
: Lana (for whom being a good Catholic girl was never a good fit)
Seconds?
I second.
Liz #658 BAAWA
Many...freely confess that they believe what it makes them
feel good to believe. Evidence doesn't play much of a role.
They are alleviating their fear of randomness by identifying
regularities that are not there. - Murray Gell-Mann
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| User: "*nemo*" |
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| Title: Re: aa - AQOTM Nomination was:Re: Anthropology and atheism |
07 May 2004 05:50:01 PM |
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In article <alkl90lasrpfvnivjq6aa9sbtu1887mdp1@4ax.com>,
Liz <ehuth1@donotspam.com> wrote:
On 06 May 2004 23:47:36 GMT, John M Price PhD <jmprice@calweb.com> in
news message <409ace98$0$28687$d368eab@news.calweb.com> wrote:
In alt.atheism article <20040506163137.05832.00000699@mb-m03.aol.com>
LanaXZR <lanaxzr@aol.com> wrote:
: >Brendan Taylor wrote:
: >
: >> Have there been any cultures (modern or ancient) where no form of
: >> worship
: >> of the supernatural existed?
: >>
: >> Just wondering, as this would nicely counter the assertation that
: >> "everybody knows God".
: >
: Gregory Gadow wrote:
: >Not that I am aware of. However, I would think the incredible variation
: >int
: >the conception of "god" throughout human cultures does the trick quite
: >nicely.
: >
: >It is generally held that primates have an innate need to find and
: >identify
: >pattern in their environment, and that humans are no different. This
: >pattern-making ability has strong survival benefit, in that it helps us
: >to
: >find food and identify friend from foe. It is such a basic need that it
: >is
: >what give meaning -- even if it is incohate meaning -- to the memory
: >reorganization that takes place during REM sleep. It is also the driving
: >source behind our need to make sense of the universe in any way we can,
: >even
: >if that means making up and believing stories about supernatural
: >agencies.
: >--
: >
=== begin quote ===
: It was my interest in cultural anthropolgy as a young girl that helped me
: realize I was an atheist. I loved reading about different cultures and
: soon
: realized that each one had developed a religion to explain what they
: couldn't
: understand. And in each one, the children were taught that it was true,
: real
: etc. It wasn't much of a leap to realize that Catholicism was the same
: thing.
=== end quote ===
: Lana (for whom being a good Catholic girl was never a good fit)
Seconds?
I second.
Recorded.
Liz #658 BAAWA
Many...freely confess that they believe what it makes them
feel good to believe. Evidence doesn't play much of a role.
They are alleviating their fear of randomness by identifying
regularities that are not there. - Murray Gell-Mann
--
Nemo - EAC Commissioner for Bible Belt Underwater Operations.
Atheist #1331 (the Palindrome of doom!)
BAAWA Knight! - One of those warm Southern Knights, y'all!
Charter member, SMASH!!
http://home.earthlink.net/~jehdjh/Relpg.html
Draco Dormiens Nunquam Titillandus
Quotemeister since March 2002
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| User: "Don Kresch" |
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| Title: Re: Anthropology and atheism |
06 May 2004 06:19:17 PM |
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In alt.atheism on Thu, 06 May 2004 20:01:31 GMT, Brendan Taylor
<temp@fungoid.dot.dyndns.dot.org> let us all know that:
Have there been any cultures (modern or ancient) where no form of worship
of the supernatural existed?
Just wondering, as this would nicely counter the assertation that
"everybody knows God".
The assertion is question-begging in the first place, and easily
refuted by the fact that there are atheists. Not to mention it's a
crass reification.
Don
---
aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde
Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert.
"No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another"
Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man"
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| User: "johac" |
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| Title: Re: Anthropology and atheism |
07 May 2004 01:34:27 AM |
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In article <vQwmc.390133$oR5.47904@pd7tw3no>,
Brendan Taylor <temp@fungoid.dot.dyndns.dot.org> wrote:
Have there been any cultures (modern or ancient) where no form of worship
of the supernatural existed?
Just wondering, as this would nicely counter the assertation that
"everybody knows God".
I don't know exactly when worship of the supernatural began, but I
think that the statement "everybody knows god" is refuted by the fact
that children are born without knowledge of gods. They have to be taught.
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Men become civilized not in their willingness to believe, but in
proportion to their readiness to doubt." - H. L. Mencken
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| User: "Meteorite Debris" |
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| Title: Re: Anthropology and atheism |
06 May 2004 09:18:26 PM |
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On Thu, 06 May 2004 20:01:31 GMT the ET form known as Brendan
Taylor<temp@fungoid.dot.dyndns.dot.org> sent a radio signal across the
vast expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.
Have there been any cultures (modern or ancient) where no form of worship
of the supernatural existed?
Just wondering, as this would nicely counter the assertation that
"everybody knows God".
Theists always confuse their own YHWH with all supernatural beliefs.
It's like saying "everyone knows how to speak therefore everyone knows
English".
--
epicurus1*at*optusnet*dot*com*dot*au
apatriot #1, atheist #1417,
Chief EAC prophet -
Evil Atheist Conspiracy
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~pk1956/
"Properly read, the Bible is the most potent force for atheism ever
conceived." - Isaac Asimov
Fingerprint for PGP Keys at key server or go to
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~pk1956/
RSA - 71 BA 7C 45 B5 4A 5F EA 72 DB EC 7F 7F A8 70 99
DSS - 9217 21A9 9C3F EB0B E302 AD0E 69C5 0F06 402E 0943
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| User: "Thomas P." |
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| Title: Re: Anthropology and atheism |
07 May 2004 02:22:52 AM |
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On Fri, 7 May 2004 11:48:26 +0930, Meteorite Debris <abuse@yahoo.com>
wrote:
On Thu, 06 May 2004 20:01:31 GMT the ET form known as Brendan
Taylor<temp@fungoid.dot.dyndns.dot.org> sent a radio signal across the
vast expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.
Have there been any cultures (modern or ancient) where no form of worship
of the supernatural existed?
Just wondering, as this would nicely counter the assertation that
"everybody knows God".
Theists always confuse their own YHWH with all supernatural beliefs.
It's like saying "everyone knows how to speak therefore everyone knows
English".
That is the claim Americans make and disprove simultaneously : )
Thomas P.
None of the Emperor's clothes had been so successful before.
"But he has got nothing on," said a little child.
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| User: "Vic Sagerquist" |
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| Title: Re: Anthropology and atheism |
06 May 2004 09:53:04 PM |
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One day in alt.atheism, Also Sprach Meteorite Debris:
On Thu, 06 May 2004 20:01:31 GMT the ET form known as Brendan
Taylor<temp@fungoid.dot.dyndns.dot.org> sent a radio signal across the
vast expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.
Have there been any cultures (modern or ancient) where no form of
worship of the supernatural existed?
Just wondering, as this would nicely counter the assertation that
"everybody knows God".
Theists always confuse their own YHWH with all supernatural beliefs.
It's like saying "everyone knows how to speak therefore everyone knows
English".
No *****. I remember a spiel by Dr. Robert Schuller about incendiary
religions, and their similarity to Christianity. Looking just a step
deeper I was able to determine that these <tribal> religions were
tributaries, just as Christianity is, of a mainstream superstition
dealing with Sun worship. Schuller's comment was that miraculously,
everyone seemed to believe in the same god above, but all had different
names for him. *****. All religion stems from the same observation:
the rising and setting of the sun, its seasonal movement, and its life-
giving qualities. This observation (and the fear that stems from it) is
global, and needs no supernatural godly network of creation to supply a
connection. The only connection is what all humans, regardless of
geographical location, can see.
It makes me wonder, if there was no tilt of the Earth's axis, would we
have religion today?
--
Vic Sagerquist
aa#2011
Supervisor, EAC Department of little adhesive-backed "L" shaped
chrome-plastic doo-dads to add feet to Jesus fish department
______________
Give a man a fish, and you'll feed him for a day.
Give him a religion, and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish.
--Timothy Jones
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| User: "Firelock" |
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| Title: Re: Anthropology and atheism |
07 May 2004 08:11:12 AM |
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Vic Sagerquist <address@withheld.com> wrote in message news:<Xns94E1CA7041C5Cvicman@63.240.76.16>...
It makes me wonder, if there was no tilt of the Earth's axis, would we
have religion today?
How did that lecture go...
Warning: Gross simplification ahead!
People who develop their cultures where there are strong seasonal
variations, where a biggest bad thing (winter) happens every year
on a reliable schedule, develop pantheons of gods where the good
gods like or even love humans, and the bad gods make the biggest
bad thing and all other bad things happen. Good and evil are,
spiritually speaking, seperated.
People who develop their cultures where there aren't strong
seasonal variations, where the biggest bad things (fires,
famines, massacres, etc) are seemingly completely random,
develop pantheons of vengeful, authoritarian gods who
spend a lot of their time punishing people. Good and
evil are combined, and power is all that matters.
I thought it an interesting idea when I heard of it, but
I think there are a lot of exceptions out there to make
this theory a bit iffy.
Walt Smith
Firelock on DALNet
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| User: "pan" |
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| Title: Re: Anthropology and atheism |
07 May 2004 09:56:28 PM |
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On Thu, 06 May 2004 20:01:31 GMT, Brendan Taylor
<temp@fungoid.dot.dyndns.dot.org> wrote:
Have there been any cultures (modern or ancient) where no form of worship
of the supernatural existed?
Just wondering, as this would nicely counter the assertation that
"everybody knows God".
Humans have the tendency to believe-in 'supernatural' entities.
This does not indicate that these entities are real, it only indicates
that many of us have a particular type of psychological quirk.
(e.g. The tendency to anthropomorphize objects or natural forces,
etc).
Many children throughout the world believe they have imaginary
'friends', but this does not indicate that these 'friends' actually
exist.
Although, one could easily argue that 'imaginary' friends are more
likely to exist than gods, because (presumably) these children were
never *taught* to believe in their invisible friends.
pan
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| User: "sol" |
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| Title: Re: Anthropology and atheism |
06 May 2004 11:03:22 PM |
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Yes, quite a number. When it comes to worship, worshiping gods is in the
minority and is usually done only in more sophisticated societies. The
majority of cultures worship more tangible things. For example, the majority
of hunter-gatherer societies such as those in Africa or New Guinea worship
various animals. Early Middle-Eastern and Mediterranean societies worshiped
the sacred bulls (vestiges of this worship survive in Spain and France today
in the form of bull-fighting and bull-dancing).
The Chinese, by and large, worship dead ancestors. I wouldn't regard these
believes as believing in "supernatural" as the objects of the belief are
tangible. However most hope that the objects of their worship are able to
intercede on their behalf.
"Brendan Taylor" <temp@fungoid.dot.dyndns.dot.org> wrote in message
news:vQwmc.390133$oR5.47904@pd7tw3no...
Have there been any cultures (modern or ancient) where no form of worship
of the supernatural existed?
Just wondering, as this would nicely counter the assertation that
"everybody knows God".
.
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