| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Neil Kelsey" |
| Date: |
09 Jan 2005 07:14:39 AM |
| Object: |
Any lawyers out there? |
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason Gastrich's
thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit out "...nudity,
sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic violence" and sell these
version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people they are
satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their movie...would CleanFilms
need to get permission in the first place? Can someone censor someone else's
work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
.
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| User: "Ike" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
10 Jan 2005 03:13:19 AM |
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"Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@telus.net> wrote in message
news:zR4Ed.66175$dv1.56842@edtnps89...
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason
Gastrich's
thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit out "...nudity,
sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic violence" and sell
these
version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people they
are
satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their movie...would
CleanFilms
need to get permission in the first place? Can someone censor someone
else's
work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
A parody is permited under "The Fair Use Doctrine".
.
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| User: "Al Klein" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
11 Jan 2005 01:30:12 AM |
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On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 03:13:19 GMT, "Ike" <accordiondoc@mindspring.com>
said in alt.atheism:
A parody is permited under "The Fair Use Doctrine".
There's a difference between a parody and a derivative work. And this
isn't even a derivative work - it's the original with parts missing.
--
"I have repeatedly said that in my opinion the idea of a personal God is
a childlike one. You may call me an agnostic, but I do not share the
crusading spirit of the professional atheist whose fervor is mostly due
to a painful act of liberation from the fetters of religious
indoctrination received in youth. I prefer an attitude of humility
corresponding to the weakness of our intellectual understanding of
nature and of our own being."
- Albert Einstein to Guy H. Raner Jr., Sept. 28, 1949, from article by
Michael R. Gilmore in Skeptic magazine, Vol. 5, No. 2, 19
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
.
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| User: "Clayton Brand Ewok Skin Bedroom Slippers" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
09 Jan 2005 08:21:14 AM |
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"Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@telus.net> wrote in message
news:zR4Ed.66175$dv1.56842@edtnps89...
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason
Gastrich's
thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit out "...nudity,
sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic violence" and sell
these
version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people they
are
satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their movie...would
CleanFilms
need to get permission in the first place? Can someone censor someone
else's
work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
I remember James Cameron threatening to sue them over cutting out Kate
Winslet's nude scene in Titanic. I don't know if he went ahead.
They have to be mentally ill to do something like that! How fucked up must
a person be to actually do that or pay to have it done. Fucking sick
religious psychos!!!!!
.
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| User: "Robibnikoff" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
09 Jan 2005 02:39:03 PM |
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"Clayton Brand Ewok Skin Bedroom Slippers" <cjfat@SPAMBLOCKphonymail.com>
wrote in message news:41e0e8f6$0$5058$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@telus.net> wrote in message
news:zR4Ed.66175$dv1.56842@edtnps89...
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason
Gastrich's
thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit out "...nudity,
sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic violence" and sell
these
version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people they
are
satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their movie...would
CleanFilms
need to get permission in the first place? Can someone censor someone
else's
work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
I remember James Cameron threatening to sue them over cutting out Kate
Winslet's nude scene in Titanic. I don't know if he went ahead.
They have to be mentally ill to do something like that! How fucked up
must
a person be to actually do that or pay to have it done. Fucking sick
religious psychos!!!!!
Hoo, they better not go to any art museums. Plenty of nekid people there!
--
---------
Robyn
Resident Witchypoo
#1557
.
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| User: "Clayton Brand Ewok Skin Bedroom Slippers" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
10 Jan 2005 01:16:02 AM |
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"Robibnikoff" <witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote in message
news:34cu05F4ahmd1U1@individual.net...
"Clayton Brand Ewok Skin Bedroom Slippers" <cjfat@SPAMBLOCKphonymail.com>
wrote in message news:41e0e8f6$0$5058$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@telus.net> wrote in message
news:zR4Ed.66175$dv1.56842@edtnps89...
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason
Gastrich's
thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit out "...nudity,
sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic violence" and sell
these
version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I
can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people
they
are
satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their movie...would
CleanFilms
need to get permission in the first place? Can someone censor someone
else's
work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
I remember James Cameron threatening to sue them over cutting out Kate
Winslet's nude scene in Titanic. I don't know if he went ahead.
They have to be mentally ill to do something like that! How fucked up
must
a person be to actually do that or pay to have it done. Fucking sick
religious psychos!!!!!
Hoo, they better not go to any art museums. Plenty of nekid people there!
There's a fundamentalist nut in Australia, who in the 80s tried to have all
artworks with nudity moved to an "adults only" area of museums and demanded
that breast cancer awareness posters be removed from public places!
.
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| User: "Robibnikoff" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
10 Jan 2005 12:39:52 PM |
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"Clayton Brand Ewok Skin Bedroom Slippers" <cjfat@SPAMBLOCKphonymail.com>
wrote in message news:41e1d6b8$0$2869$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Robibnikoff" <witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote in message
news:34cu05F4ahmd1U1@individual.net...
snip
Hoo, they better not go to any art museums. Plenty of nekid people
there!
There's a fundamentalist nut in Australia, who in the 80s tried to have
all
artworks with nudity moved to an "adults only" area of museums and
demanded
that breast cancer awareness posters be removed from public places!
Oh brother. Sounds like someone should be attending to his own personal
problems rather than force them on the rest of the populace! :P
--
---------
Robyn
Resident Witchypoo
#1557
.
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| User: "AngryJohn" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
11 Jan 2005 02:57:31 AM |
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On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 07:39:52 -0500, "Robibnikoff"
<witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote:
"Clayton Brand Ewok Skin Bedroom Slippers" <cjfat@SPAMBLOCKphonymail.com>
wrote in message news:41e1d6b8$0$2869$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Robibnikoff" <witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote in message
news:34cu05F4ahmd1U1@individual.net...
snip
Hoo, they better not go to any art museums. Plenty of nekid people
there!
There's a fundamentalist nut in Australia, who in the 80s tried to have
all
artworks with nudity moved to an "adults only" area of museums and
demanded
that breast cancer awareness posters be removed from public places!
Oh brother. Sounds like someone should be attending to his own personal
problems rather than force them on the rest of the populace! :P
Egads, my 14 yo daughter is in an art school. Asked the most
interesting question the other night. If an underage artist paid a
model to pose for a painting/drawing/etc.... would that in some way
break the law?
------------------------------
aa#2106
Remove Belief to reply
.
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| User: "Fred Stone" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
11 Jan 2005 03:04:24 AM |
|
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AngryJohn <AngryJohn@AngryJohnBelief.net> wrote in
news:l2g6u05prid9be52o822ipb8dhqaafkcpd@4ax.com:
On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 07:39:52 -0500, "Robibnikoff"
<witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote:
"Clayton Brand Ewok Skin Bedroom Slippers"
<cjfat@SPAMBLOCKphonymail.com> wrote in message
news:41e1d6b8$0$2869$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Robibnikoff" <witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote in message
news:34cu05F4ahmd1U1@individual.net...
snip
Hoo, they better not go to any art museums. Plenty of nekid people
there!
There's a fundamentalist nut in Australia, who in the 80s tried to
have all
artworks with nudity moved to an "adults only" area of museums and
demanded
that breast cancer awareness posters be removed from public places!
Oh brother. Sounds like someone should be attending to his own
personal problems rather than force them on the rest of the populace!
:P
Egads, my 14 yo daughter is in an art school. Asked the most
interesting question the other night. If an underage artist paid a
model to pose for a painting/drawing/etc.... would that in some way
break the law?
IINM, there was a case not too long ago of an underage boy who was
charged with kiddie porn for posting nude pictures of himself.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Support bacteria! That's all the culture many people will ever have.
.
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| User: "stoney" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
14 Jan 2005 01:53:34 AM |
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On Tue, 11 Jan 2005 03:04:24 +0000 (UTC), Fred Stone
<fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
AngryJohn <AngryJohn@AngryJohnBelief.net> wrote in
news:l2g6u05prid9be52o822ipb8dhqaafkcpd@4ax.com:
On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 07:39:52 -0500, "Robibnikoff"
<witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote:
"Clayton Brand Ewok Skin Bedroom Slippers"
<cjfat@SPAMBLOCKphonymail.com> wrote in message
news:41e1d6b8$0$2869$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Robibnikoff" <witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote in message
news:34cu05F4ahmd1U1@individual.net...
snip
Hoo, they better not go to any art museums. Plenty of nekid people
there!
There's a fundamentalist nut in Australia, who in the 80s tried to
have all
artworks with nudity moved to an "adults only" area of museums and
demanded
that breast cancer awareness posters be removed from public places!
Oh brother. Sounds like someone should be attending to his own
personal problems rather than force them on the rest of the populace!
:P
Egads, my 14 yo daughter is in an art school. Asked the most
interesting question the other night. If an underage artist paid a
model to pose for a painting/drawing/etc.... would that in some way
break the law?
IINM, there was a case not too long ago of an underage boy who was
charged with kiddie porn for posting nude pictures of himself.
That doesn't make any sense at all! (but what else is new?)
--
Contempt of Congress meter reading-offscale.
Hello, theocracy with a fundamentalist US Supreme
Court who will ensure church and state are joined
at the hip like clergy and altar boys.
America 1776-Jan 2001 RIP
.
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| User: "nJb" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
11 Jan 2005 06:10:20 AM |
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AngryJohn wrote:
Egads, my 14 yo daughter is in an art school. Asked the most
interesting question the other night. If an underage artist paid a
model to pose for a painting/drawing/etc.... would that in some way
break the law?
------------------------------
aa#2106
In the US, very likely.
Jack
.
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| User: "Mike Painter" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
12 Jan 2005 01:56:08 AM |
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nJb wrote:
AngryJohn wrote:
Egads, my 14 yo daughter is in an art school. Asked the most
interesting question the other night. If an underage artist paid a
model to pose for a painting/drawing/etc.... would that in some way
break the law?
------------------------------
aa#2106
In the US, very likely.
Jack
It would depend on where you are in the US. Most places have "indecent
exposure" laws on the books. They typically stay there until somebody is
actually charged and the very expensive and time consuming to the community
of deciding what that actually means comes up.
Then they make laws against public nudity or some other silly thing.
Back when I was a cop the complaintaint usually had directions to the "nude
beach where the hippies were" that involved wading, blackberry vines and
poison oak to get to the place.
They never cared themselves but were only worried about what the children
might see.
I never pointed out that children had to be taught that nudity was wrong.
.
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| User: "AngryJohn" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
13 Jan 2005 02:42:33 AM |
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On Wed, 12 Jan 2005 01:56:08 GMT, "Mike Painter"
<mddotpainter@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
nJb wrote:
AngryJohn wrote:
Egads, my 14 yo daughter is in an art school. Asked the most
interesting question the other night. If an underage artist paid a
model to pose for a painting/drawing/etc.... would that in some way
break the law?
------------------------------
aa#2106
In the US, very likely.
Jack
I really am not sure but I would think the age of consent would have
something to do with whether it was actually illegal or not. In the
case she used as an example the artist was 17 the model older. I am
sure if certain peoples found out it would be considered evil at the
very least.
It would depend on where you are in the US. Most places have "indecent
exposure" laws on the books. They typically stay there until somebody is
actually charged and the very expensive and time consuming to the community
of deciding what that actually means comes up.
Then they make laws against public nudity or some other silly thing.
In this case it would not actually be public. An artist hiring a
model to pose in a private studio. In the example she presented the
artist was 17 the model older.
Back when I was a cop the complaintaint usually had directions to the "nude
beach where the hippies were" that involved wading, blackberry vines and
poison oak to get to the place.
They never cared themselves but were only worried about what the children
might see.
I never pointed out that children had to be taught that nudity was wrong.
Finding a nude beach is so hard that someone actually finding their
way there would have to do it on purpose. If they dragged their kids
along, well, that says something about the parent. Then again, I
really find nudity not a big deal. What was it Larry Flynt said?
Something like, "If you don't like breasts and vaginas don't blame me
blame the manufacturer".
------------------------------
aa#2106
Remove Belief to reply
.
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| User: "stoney" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
14 Jan 2005 01:54:42 AM |
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On Wed, 12 Jan 2005 01:56:08 GMT, "Mike Painter"
<mddotpainter@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
nJb wrote:
AngryJohn wrote:
Egads, my 14 yo daughter is in an art school. Asked the most
interesting question the other night. If an underage artist paid a
model to pose for a painting/drawing/etc.... would that in some way
break the law?
------------------------------
aa#2106
In the US, very likely.
Jack
It would depend on where you are in the US. Most places have "indecent
exposure" laws on the books. They typically stay there until somebody is
actually charged and the very expensive and time consuming to the community
of deciding what that actually means comes up.
Then they make laws against public nudity or some other silly thing.
Back when I was a cop the complaintaint usually had directions to the "nude
beach where the hippies were" that involved wading, blackberry vines and
poison oak to get to the place.
They never cared themselves but were only worried about what the children
might see.
I never pointed out that children had to be taught that nudity was wrong.
Why not? (curiosity)
--
Contempt of Congress meter reading-offscale.
Hello, theocracy with a fundamentalist US Supreme
Court who will ensure church and state are joined
at the hip like clergy and altar boys.
America 1776-Jan 2001 RIP
.
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| User: "nJb" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
10 Jan 2005 04:56:39 AM |
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Robibnikoff wrote:
"Clayton Brand Ewok Skin Bedroom Slippers" <cjfat@SPAMBLOCKphonymail.com>
wrote in message news:41e0e8f6$0$5058$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...
"Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@telus.net> wrote in message
news:zR4Ed.66175$dv1.56842@edtnps89...
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason
Gastrich's
thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit out "...nudity,
sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic violence" and sell
these
version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people they
are
satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their movie...would
CleanFilms
need to get permission in the first place? Can someone censor someone
else's
work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
I remember James Cameron threatening to sue them over cutting out Kate
Winslet's nude scene in Titanic. I don't know if he went ahead.
They have to be mentally ill to do something like that! How fucked up
must
a person be to actually do that or pay to have it done. Fucking sick
religious psychos!!!!!
Hoo, they better not go to any art museums. Plenty of nekid people there!
--
---------
Robyn
Resident Witchypoo
#1557
In case you missed my other post.
http://weeklywire.com/ww/11-10-97/slc_advdss.html
Jack
.
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| User: "igtheist" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
09 Jan 2005 10:16:50 PM |
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Isn't that a little over the top? I understand their position.
Heck, I was kind of shocked at some of the scenes in Event Horizon.
If I recall correctly Sam Neill takes it in the *****. However there
were quite a few movies witht he same plot that came out at that time
and I might be mistaken about which one. I did however see that
Event Horizon was not to be found as an edited version on this web
site.
What is "mentally ill" or psycho about not wanting gratuitious sex
scenes in a movie? Especially when they have little to do with the
plot.
.
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| User: "Robibnikoff" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
09 Jan 2005 01:02:47 PM |
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"Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@telus.net> wrote in message
news:zR4Ed.66175$dv1.56842@edtnps89...
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason Gastrich's
thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit out "...nudity,
sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic violence" and sell these
version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people they
are satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their movie...would
CleanFilms need to get permission in the first place? Can someone censor
someone else's work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
Apparently it is legal. There's a big video store chain, Blockbuster, that
does pretty much the same thing - So, of course, I'll never rent anything
from them. When you're into horror movies like I am, you certainly don't
want the nasty bits taken out :)
--
---------
Robyn
Resident Witchypoo
#1557
.
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| User: "Clayton Brand Ewok Skin Bedroom Slippers" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
10 Jan 2005 01:17:29 AM |
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"Robibnikoff" <witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote in message
news:34coblF46umb4U1@individual.net...
"Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@telus.net> wrote in message
news:zR4Ed.66175$dv1.56842@edtnps89...
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason
Gastrich's
thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit out "...nudity,
sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic violence" and sell
these
version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people they
are satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their movie...would
CleanFilms need to get permission in the first place? Can someone censor
someone else's work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
Apparently it is legal. There's a big video store chain, Blockbuster,
that
does pretty much the same thing - So, of course, I'll never rent anything
from them. When you're into horror movies like I am, you certainly don't
want the nasty bits taken out :)
I was totally ***** when I bought a copy of "Doppelganger" and found
out that all of Drew Barrymore's nude and sex scenes had been hacked out!
.
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
10 Jan 2005 01:30:50 AM |
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On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 11:17:29 +1000, "Clayton Brand Ewok Skin Bedroom
Slippers" <cjfat@SPAMBLOCKphonymail.com> wrote:
"Robibnikoff" <witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote in message
news:34coblF46umb4U1@individual.net...
"Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@telus.net> wrote in message
news:zR4Ed.66175$dv1.56842@edtnps89...
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason
Gastrich's
thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit out "...nudity,
sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic violence" and sell
these
version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people they
are satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their movie...would
CleanFilms need to get permission in the first place? Can someone censor
someone else's work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
Apparently it is legal. There's a big video store chain, Blockbuster,
that
does pretty much the same thing - So, of course, I'll never rent anything
from them. When you're into horror movies like I am, you certainly don't
want the nasty bits taken out :)
I was totally ***** when I bought a copy of "Doppelganger" and found
out that all of Drew Barrymore's nude and sex scenes had been hacked out!
Did you get your money back?
If they didn't warn that some scenes were cut then they have to do
that when you return it - even if their "policy" is not to refund if
the goods have been used.
.
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| User: "Clayton Brand Ewok Skin Bedroom Slippers" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
10 Jan 2005 06:45:33 AM |
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|
"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:nam3u0l12mfkr1pdotc7pmgfhi1j96eldl@4ax.com...
On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 11:17:29 +1000, "Clayton Brand Ewok Skin Bedroom
Slippers" <cjfat@SPAMBLOCKphonymail.com> wrote:
"Robibnikoff" <witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote in message
news:34coblF46umb4U1@individual.net...
"Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@telus.net> wrote in message
news:zR4Ed.66175$dv1.56842@edtnps89...
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason
Gastrich's
thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit out
"...nudity,
sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic violence" and sell
these
version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I
can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people
they
are satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their movie...would
CleanFilms need to get permission in the first place? Can someone
censor
someone else's work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
Apparently it is legal. There's a big video store chain, Blockbuster,
that
does pretty much the same thing - So, of course, I'll never rent
anything
from them. When you're into horror movies like I am, you certainly
don't
want the nasty bits taken out :)
I was totally ***** when I bought a copy of "Doppelganger" and found
out that all of Drew Barrymore's nude and sex scenes had been hacked out!
Did you get your money back?
If they didn't warn that some scenes were cut then they have to do
that when you return it - even if their "policy" is not to refund if
the goods have been used.
Unfortunately by the time I actually got around to watching it, the shop had
closed...but the same version is available everywhere.
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
09 Jan 2005 02:34:51 PM |
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In our last episode <34coblF46umb4U1@individual.net>, Robibnikoff lept out
of the bushes shouting:
"Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@telus.net> wrote in message
news:zR4Ed.66175$dv1.56842@edtnps89...
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason
Gastrich's thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit out
"...nudity, sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic violence"
and sell these version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people they
are satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their movie...would
CleanFilms need to get permission in the first place? Can someone censor
someone else's work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
Apparently it is legal.
Actually, it's still being fought over in the courts so we don't know yet
whether it'll be ruled legal or not...
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."
-- Seneca the Younger
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
09 Jan 2005 02:17:20 PM |
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On Sun, 9 Jan 2005 08:02:47 -0500, "Robibnikoff"
<witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote:
"Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@telus.net> wrote in message
news:zR4Ed.66175$dv1.56842@edtnps89...
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason Gastrich's
thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit out "...nudity,
sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic violence" and sell these
version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people they
are satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their movie...would
CleanFilms need to get permission in the first place? Can someone censor
someone else's work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
Apparently it is legal. There's a big video store chain, Blockbuster, that
does pretty much the same thing - So, of course, I'll never rent anything
from them. When you're into horror movies like I am, you certainly don't
want the nasty bits taken out :)
The chains are different. A friend worked for a post production
company, and they actually did different cuts for at least one of
them.
TYhese are actually legal originals not copies.
Which wouldn't matter so much if the censorship were published instead
of kept secret.
Prime example:
In the Way Of The Dragon, Bruce Lee was "fresh off the boat" and
couldn't read an English menu so he pointed at a load of things and
was given a dozen bowls of soup. When I saw it in England in the
theatre this was followed by him going to the lavatory, not knowing
what to do and finally squatting on the seat. A very funny scene.
My US-bought DVD just shows him entering the lavatory.
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
09 Jan 2005 02:33:51 PM |
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In our last episode <zR4Ed.66175$dv1.56842@edtnps89>, Neil Kelsey lept out
of the bushes shouting:
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason
Gastrich's thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit out
"...nudity, sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic violence"
and sell these version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people they
are satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their movie...would
CleanFilms need to get permission in the first place? Can someone censor
someone else's work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
I know the Director's Guild of America filed a counter suit against
some dozen or more companies who does the same thing. "Clean Flicks" (not
Clean Films) actually launched a *preemptive suit against the DGA to try
to get the court's to establish the right to edit the works.
In typically idiotic fashion of the "moral" types, Clean Flicks is trying
to claim 1st Amendment rights when the government is not a party to the
suit (hence, there isn't any legal "censorship" claim to be made) and
while being the side who's doing the "censoring." Go figure.
Here's a Find Law commentary written after Clean Flicks filed suit but
before the DGA countered:
http://writ.news.findlaw.com/hilden/20020903.html
I would tend to disagree with her that this is "fair use." It's creation
and distribution of a derivative work. Though she cites the case of "The
Wind Done Gone," a parody of "Gone with the Wind" as her strongest
argument that Clean Flicks may be able to get away with what they're
doing, I can't help but think that *parody is the creation of a separate
work, not a derivative.
I would hope the courts will draw a similar line and put the "cleansing"
companies out of business.
Over here:
http://research.yale.edu/lawmeme/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1428
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/04/19/entertainment/main612603.shtml
Is more recent talk of a DVD player that'll do the filtering for you. That
I'm not so much against as I strongly support fair use for *individuals.
If *you want to make a copy of a movie sans "naught bits" that you feel is
less "offensive," fine. But for a company to create an unauthorized
derivative work for profit is wrong in my opinion.
Apparently the case is still in the courts two years after filing so
there's a way to go. I'm sure, though, the DGA intends to go to the
Supreme Court...
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."
-- Seneca the Younger
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| User: "FreeThink" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
10 Jan 2005 07:03:12 AM |
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Mark K. Bilbo wrote:
In our last episode <zR4Ed.66175$dv1.56842@edtnps89>, Neil Kelsey
lept out
of the bushes shouting:
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason
Gastrich's thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit
out
"...nudity, sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic
violence"
and sell these version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I
can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people
they
are satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their
movie...would
CleanFilms need to get permission in the first place? Can someone
censor
someone else's work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
I know the Director's Guild of America filed a counter suit against
some dozen or more companies who does the same thing. "Clean Flicks"
(not
Clean Films) actually launched a *preemptive suit against the DGA to
try
to get the court's to establish the right to edit the works.
In typically idiotic fashion of the "moral" types, Clean Flicks is
trying
to claim 1st Amendment rights when the government is not a party to
the
suit (hence, there isn't any legal "censorship" claim to be made) and
while being the side who's doing the "censoring." Go figure.
Here's a Find Law commentary written after Clean Flicks filed suit
but
before the DGA countered:
http://writ.news.findlaw.com/hilden/20020903.html
I would tend to disagree with her that this is "fair use." It's
creation
and distribution of a derivative work. Though she cites the case of
"The
Wind Done Gone," a parody of "Gone with the Wind" as her strongest
argument that Clean Flicks may be able to get away with what they're
doing, I can't help but think that *parody is the creation of a
separate
work, not a derivative.
I would hope the courts will draw a similar line and put the
"cleansing"
companies out of business.
Over here:
http://research.yale.edu/lawmeme/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1428
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/04/19/entertainment/main612603.shtml
Is more recent talk of a DVD player that'll do the filtering for you.
That
I'm not so much against as I strongly support fair use for
*individuals.
If *you want to make a copy of a movie sans "naught bits" that you
feel is
less "offensive," fine. But for a company to create an unauthorized
derivative work for profit is wrong in my opinion.
Apparently the case is still in the courts two years after filing so
there's a way to go. I'm sure, though, the DGA intends to go to the
Supreme Court...
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."
-- Seneca the Younger
Why not just design a mechanical headset to do this? For each movie it
could programmed to keep track of the periods of time to censor. Then
it would lower blinders over the users eyes and stick ear plugs in
their ears. They might even find more uses for this in their everyday
lives.
I wonder what poor Christian has to watch the movies in order to censor
them? Oh the humanity!
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| User: "Mike Painter" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
11 Jan 2005 12:39:08 AM |
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FreeThink wrote:
<snip>
Why not just design a mechanical headset to do this? For each movie it
could programmed to keep track of the periods of time to censor. Then
it would lower blinders over the users eyes and stick ear plugs in
their ears. They might even find more uses for this in their everyday
lives.
The OAEEP was plagued with design problems from the start.
That and lawsuits brought about when users were involved in accidents when
the device activated while people drove started it's down hill slide.
The slide into failure increased when the San Francisco firm that handled
the advertising account came up with a new slogan.
"The Ostrich Automatic Ear and Eye Plugger, a Fucking Good Idea."
The device might have survived even that until a definitive double blind
study revealed that the device was "on" less often during XXX snuff films
than when reading the bible.
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| User: "Harry F. Leopold" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
11 Jan 2005 01:21:32 PM |
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On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 18:39:08 -0600, Mike Painter wrote
(in article <MeFEd.9165$wZ2.6138@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com>):
FreeThink wrote:
<snip>
Why not just design a mechanical headset to do this? For each movie it
could programmed to keep track of the periods of time to censor. Then
it would lower blinders over the users eyes and stick ear plugs in
their ears. They might even find more uses for this in their everyday
lives.
The OAEEP was plagued with design problems from the start.
That and lawsuits brought about when users were involved in accidents when
the device activated while people drove started it's down hill slide.
The slide into failure increased when the San Francisco firm that handled
the advertising account came up with a new slogan.
"The Ostrich Automatic Ear and Eye Plugger, a Fucking Good Idea."
The device might have survived even that until a definitive double blind
study revealed that the device was "on" less often during XXX snuff films
than when reading the bible.
Snort! Damned good.
--
Harry F. Leopold
aa #2076
AA/Vet #4
The Prints of Darkness
(remove gene to email)
"The line separating painfully bad analogies from weirdly good ones is as
thin as a soup made from the shadow of a chicken that was starved to death."
- Alydar2
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
10 Jan 2005 01:50:20 PM |
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In our last episode
<1105340592.355914.12960@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>, FreeThink lept out
of the bushes shouting:
Why not just design a mechanical headset to do this?
Would you believe somebody's made a DVD player that'll do it? It's about
to ship.
For each movie it
could programmed to keep track of the periods of time to censor. Then it
would lower blinders over the users eyes and stick ear plugs in their
ears. They might even find more uses for this in their everyday lives.
I wonder what poor Christian has to watch the movies in order to censor
them? Oh the humanity!
And watch it again and again and again... for editing purposes of course...
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."
-- Seneca the Younger
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| User: "nJb" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
10 Jan 2005 04:51:50 AM |
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Neil Kelsey wrote:
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason Gastrich's
thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit out "...nudity,
sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic violence" and sell these
version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people they are
satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their movie...would CleanFilms
need to get permission in the first place? Can someone censor someone else's
work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
I first heard of this crap about 10 years ago here in Utah (home of the
20th century puritan). There was a guy doing it before Cleanflicks. I
think the jury is still out on this one.
http://www.csmonitor.com/2002/0828/p09s02-cojh.html
To give you an idea of the mental illness that pervades Utah, check this
out:
http://weeklywire.com/ww/11-10-97/slc_advdss.html
We have some sick mofos here.
Jack
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| User: "Mike Painter" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
09 Jan 2005 07:42:53 AM |
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Neil Kelsey wrote:
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason
Gastrich's thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit
out "...nudity, sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic
violence" and sell these version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I
can't imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very
people they are satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their
movie...would CleanFilms need to get permission in the first place?
Can someone censor someone else's work and then sell it? This seems
very odd to me.
They probably can in America, the land of free speech, where most TV and
radio shows are censored and it can cost a *lot* of money to say "do-do"
words.
Our president wants to make it expensive to say "Oh *****" on the air and
inexpensive when an incompetent doctor says "Oh *****" in the operating room.
He's the one that got a round of applause when he said he did not want to
penalize doctors who made no mistakes. Duh.
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| User: "Kate " |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
09 Jan 2005 08:32:03 PM |
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On Sun, 09 Jan 2005 07:14:39 GMT, "Neil Kelsey"
<neil_kelsey@telus.net> wrote:
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason Gastrich's
thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit out "...nudity,
sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic violence" and sell these
version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people they are
satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their movie...would CleanFilms
need to get permission in the first place? Can someone censor someone else's
work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
No, not without permission from the copyright holder.
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| User: "Levy Oates" |
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| Title: Re: Any lawyers out there? |
09 Jan 2005 03:46:12 PM |
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On Sun, 09 Jan 2005 07:14:39 GMT, "Neil Kelsey" <neil_kelsey@telus.net> wrote:
I was not aware of an organization called CleanFilms until Jason Gastrich's
thread (Saved!Movie). These people take movies and edit out "...nudity,
sexual situations, offensive language, and graphic violence" and sell these
version over the internet. Here is a link:
http://www.cleanfilms.com/
Is this legal? I think the movie Saved! might be a good example. I can't
imagine the producers of the movie give CleanFilms, the very people they are
satirizing, permission to butcher (my words) their movie...would CleanFilms
need to get permission in the first place? Can someone censor someone else's
work and then sell it? This seems very odd to me.
Do you think they do a clean version of Mel Gibson's Passion of Christ, without
all the gratuitous violence? Would there be anything left?
---------
Levy Oates
http://www.angelfire.com/alt/bumblism/
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