Are all arguments for God's existence fallacious?



 Religions > Atheism > Are all arguments for God's existence fallacious?

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Topic: Religions > Atheism
User: "Nico Demusopelous"
Date: 03 Sep 2004 06:29:07 PM
Object: Are all arguments for God's existence fallacious?
Dixit <dix@nospam.net> wrote in message news:<NS0_c.120281$mD.110149@attbi_s02>...

Nico Demusopelous wrote:

It has already been
pointed out to Dixit that one can easily come up with a *VALID*
argument for the existence of a first cause ...


Then where is it?

One example was given right here:
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=2c68d44e.0407291220.588b7b45%40posting.google.com
Of course, the valid argument given in that post was just an example.
The more serious argument (which is also valid) is the following:
(1) A causal chain either stretches back infinitely or
it stretches back a finite distance.
(2) You cannot have an infinite causal regress (i.e. a
causal chain that stretches back infinitely).
(3) If you have a finite causal regress (i.e. a causal
chain that stretches back a finite distance),
there must be a first cause.
(4) Therefore, every causal chain has a first cause.
(5) A first cause is either personal or mechanical.
(6) A first cause cannot be mechanical.
(7) Therefore, a first cause is personal.
But as we saw in the following thread...
http://groups.google.com/groups?threadm=tkBOc.12631%24cL2.3267131%40news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net
....you don't even understand what constitutes a valid argument.

The argument that you are championing, that everything
must have a cause except GodŽ,

I never argued that "everything must have a cause except God." So this
is a strawman. Though this is typical of you.
.

User: "Midjis"

Title: Re: Are all arguments for God's existence fallacious? 04 Sep 2004 01:38:58 AM
(Nico Demusopelous) wrote:

Of course, the valid argument given in that post was just an example.
The more serious argument (which is also valid) is the following:

(1) A causal chain either stretches back infinitely or
it stretches back a finite distance.

Reasonable.

(2) You cannot have an infinite causal regress (i.e. a
causal chain that stretches back infinitely).

Why not?

(3) If you have a finite causal regress (i.e. a causal
chain that stretches back a finite distance),
there must be a first cause.

Reasonable, given that premise.

(4) Therefore, every causal chain has a first cause.

Only if your premise at (2) is true.

(5) A first cause is either personal or mechanical.

Probably.

(6) A first cause cannot be mechanical.

Why not?

(7) Therefore, a first cause is personal.

Only if (6) is true.
So I would want two questions answering before I accept your chain of
reasoning here:
Why can you not have infinite causal regress?
Why can a first cause not be mechanical?
--
Midjis
.


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