| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"J Young" |
| Date: |
03 Mar 2005 12:17:08 AM |
| Object: |
Assisted suicide backed in poll |
The culture of killing just seems to grow. Somehow the the LLL (Looney
Liberal Left) has convinced themselves that the ability to kill
another, be it unwanted babies, sick people, ect.., is a human right
that no goverment should infringe upon.
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/03/02/BAGAJBJ40N1.DTL
Giving terminally ill the option of assisted suicide backed in poll
Wednesday, March 2, 2005
Sacramento -- Seven in 10 Californians support providing the state's
terminally ill with a legal path to end their lives pre-emptively, with
almost as many saying they would opt to do so themselves should they
ever face the situation, according to a poll released today.
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| User: "Elf M. Sternberg" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 10:43:11 AM |
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"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> writes:
The culture of killing just seems to grow. Somehow the the LLL (Looney
Liberal Left) has convinced themselves that the ability to kill
another, be it unwanted babies, sick people, ect.., is a human right
that no goverment should infringe upon.
Hmm... A law that allows human beings to do what they want with
their own bodies and souls. Yeah, I can see how the Ridiculous
Reactionary Right would hate to see people exercise their free will.
Elf
--
Elf M. Sternberg, Immanentizing the Eschaton since 1988
http://www.drizzle.com/~elf/
"The apocalypse may be closer at hand than even John Derbyshire thinks:
what the hell is Elf Sternberg doing reading Derb's columns?"
-- Charles Murtaugh
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| User: "Ike" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 11:07:56 AM |
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"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1109830628.477224.241470@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Forcing people to attempt suicide with no supervision might result in them
hurting themselves. If they injure themselves permanently and fail in the
attempt, it could raise the cost of medical insurance for everyone.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 11:18:00 AM |
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On Thu, 03 Mar 2005 17:07:56 GMT, "Ike" <accordiondoc@mindspring.com>
wrote:
"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1109830628.477224.241470@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Forcing people to attempt suicide with no supervision might result in them
hurting themselves. If they injure themselves permanently and fail in the
attempt, it could raise the cost of medical insurance for everyone.
I know of one such case. A Friend's dad had suffered some strokes and
wanted to end it. He took pills. He was discovered, pumped,
resuscitated and left in a vegetative state, requiring hydration and
feeding by IV. After many costly efforts to revive him, they
eventually decided to stop support. This means death by dehydration
and starvation. It took about ten days, during which time his kidneys
failed, his catheter bag filled with blood, and one by one his organ
systems shut down in a painful agonizing sequence.
But morphine would have been wrong?
People need to see this to understand what they're arguing for.
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| User: "kathryn" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 12:35:20 PM |
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"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1109830628.477224.241470@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
The culture of killing just seems to grow. Somehow the the LLL (Looney
Liberal Left) has convinced themselves that the ability to kill
another, be it unwanted babies, sick people, ect.., is a human right
that no goverment should infringe upon.
Do you never tire of being an objectionable idiot?
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| User: "Loose Cannon" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 01:33:30 PM |
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"kathryn" <bob@bobbybobbobthebobster.com> wrote in message
news:d07ld8$dud$1@titan.btinternet.com...
"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1109830628.477224.241470@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
The culture of killing just seems to grow. Somehow the the LLL (Looney
Liberal Left) has convinced themselves that the ability to kill
another, be it unwanted babies, sick people, ect.., is a human right
that no goverment should infringe upon.
Do you never tire of being an objectionable idiot?
That is a rhetorical question, right?
"Objectionable idiot" is "J's" schtick.
It gets worse-MUCH worse-when he posts as "IBen Getiner":
Message-ID:
LC~ Knows that schitzoid troll "J" has a sock for every occasion.
"You are doing a great service to the pro-life movement IBen G. Keep up the
good work"~ JYoung, talking to himself again.
From: (Jon Young)
Message-ID:
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| User: "Larry Heath" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 09:31:52 AM |
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"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1109830628.477224.241470@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
The culture of killing just seems to grow. Somehow the the LLL (Looney
Liberal Left) has convinced themselves that the ability to kill
another, be it unwanted babies, sick people, ect.., is a human right
that no goverment should infringe upon.
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/03/02/BAGAJBJ40N1.DTL
Giving terminally ill the option of assisted suicide backed in poll
Wednesday, March 2, 2005
Sacramento -- Seven in 10 Californians support providing the state's
terminally ill with a legal path to end their lives pre-emptively, with
almost as many saying they would opt to do so themselves should they
ever face the situation, according to a poll released today.
I believe it was the Greeks, who considered suicide to be an honorable way
to end one's life in a number of situations not the least of which was
excruciatingly painful terminal illness. Unfortunately, now days, the
Christian Fascists think that they should decide for people in general if
they should suffer interminably or not. You had best prey to whatever God
you stupidly believe in that you don't contract some lingering terminal
illness, that places you in excruciating pain, for months or even years on
end, with absolutely no hope of recovery.
Obviously the people of California are not ignorant religious fascists!
Three cheers for them!
Later Larry.
aa # 2216
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| User: "Jeff Welch" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 10:09:38 AM |
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"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1109830628.477224.241470@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
The culture of killing just seems to grow. Somehow the the LLL (Looney
Liberal Left) has convinced themselves that the ability to kill
another, be it unwanted babies, sick people, ect.., is a human right
that no goverment should infringe upon.
The right to control one's own body - and control the manner of one's own
death when terminally ill - IS a human right no government should infringe
upon.
This is something that you big-government loving, Constitution-hating,
hypocritical right wingers who prefer to expand and extend human suffering
are incapable of understanding.
-Jeff
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| User: "Sanders Kaufman" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 01:17:23 AM |
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"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1109830628.477224.241470@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
The culture of killing just seems to grow. Somehow the the LLL (Looney
Liberal Left) has convinced themselves that the ability to kill
another, be it unwanted babies, sick people, ect.., is a human right
that no goverment should infringe upon.
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/03/02/BAGAJBJ40N1.DTL
Maybe you didn't notice.
California, like most of the US, is under Republican rule.
If ya got a problem with how they run their state - take it up with the
Republican Party.
If you *really* think the RNC is the "LLL", God help you.
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| User: "Frank J Warner" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 06:53:29 AM |
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In article <7SyVd.60429$iC4.21079@newssvr30.news.prodigy.com>, Sanders
Kaufman <usenet@kaufman.net> wrote:
"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1109830628.477224.241470@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
The culture of killing just seems to grow. Somehow the the LLL (Looney
Liberal Left) has convinced themselves that the ability to kill
another, be it unwanted babies, sick people, ect.., is a human right
that no goverment should infringe upon.
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/03/02/BAGAJBJ40N1.DTL
Maybe you didn't notice.
California, like most of the US, is under Republican rule.
If ya got a problem with how they run their state - take it up with the
Republican Party.
Uh. Not quite so. We have a Republican governor who, despite his
musculature, is virtually powerless, but the legislature is still
strongly Democratic (some would argue too Democratic), and they're the
ones who make the laws and control the funding.
-Frank
--
Here's some of my work:
http://www.franksknives.com
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| User: "GlennGlenn" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 10:25:02 AM |
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In article <1109830628.477224.241470@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>, J
Young <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote:
The culture of killing just seems to grow. Somehow the the LLL (Looney
Liberal Left) has convinced themselves that the ability to kill
another, be it unwanted babies, sick people, ect.., is a human right
that no goverment should infringe upon.
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/03/02/BAGAJBJ40N1.DTL
Giving terminally ill the option of assisted suicide backed in poll
Wednesday, March 2, 2005
Sacramento -- Seven in 10 Californians support providing the state's
terminally ill with a legal path to end their lives pre-emptively, with
almost as many saying they would opt to do so themselves should they
ever face the situation, according to a poll released today.
So... the so-called "LLL" consists of seven out of every ten
Californians, does it?
Not so far on the fringe after all...
I am always pleased when these conservative blowhards can't keep
straight whether their enemy is a left-wing lunatic fringe battling the
mainstream or the mainstream itself.
--
GlennGlenn -- aa#825 --
I am not famous, I am notorious. And if I am rich, it is because I have taken
my wages in people.
‹ Quentin Crisp
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| User: "Sanders Kaufman" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 10:34:37 AM |
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"GlennGlenn" <dipthotdipthot@yahoo.yahoo.com.com> wrote in message
news:030320050824089822%dipthotdipthot@yahoo.yahoo.com.com...
Young <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote:
Sacramento -- Seven in 10 Californians support providing the state's
terminally ill with a legal path to end their lives pre-emptively, with
almost as many saying they would opt to do so themselves should they
ever face the situation, according to a poll released today.
So... the so-called "LLL" consists of seven out of every ten
Californians, does it?
Not so far on the fringe after all...
In Mr. Young's defense - when he refers to the "left", he's doing so from an
extreme right-wing position.
For right-wing extremists like him, *everything* appears leftist.
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 01:12:07 AM |
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J Young <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote:
The culture of killing just seems to grow. Somehow the the LLL (Looney
Liberal Left) has convinced themselves that the ability to kill
Classic propaganda: Accuse the enemy of your own evils.
The Radical Religious Reich supports the killing of tens of thousands
of innocent people in Iraq, supports the execution of children,
supports the enslavement of pregnant women.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
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| User: "Sergeant America" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 04:19:26 AM |
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J Young wrote:
The culture of killing just seems to grow. Somehow the the LLL (Looney
Liberal Left) has convinced themselves that the ability to kill
another, be it unwanted babies, sick people, ect.., is a human right
that no goverment should infringe upon.
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/03/02/BAGAJBJ40N1.DTL
Giving terminally ill the option of assisted suicide backed in poll
Wednesday, March 2, 2005
Sacramento -- Seven in 10 Californians support providing the state's
terminally ill with a legal path to end their lives pre-emptively, with
almost as many saying they would opt to do so themselves should they
ever face the situation, according to a poll released today.
For society to say that any one individual may choose to die, and be
assisted in doing so, it is by necessity saying of such people that ALL
their lives are worthless to society, since theoretically all could
choose to either die or live and it would make no difference. Instead of
affirming the intrinsic worth of all human beings, an entire group of
people are being told, individually, "It doesn't matter to us if you
live or die." No wonder the disabled are sensitive on the issue of mercy
killing and euthanasia; it's usually their lives being talked about.
Does society want to write off the lives of certain groups of disabled
individuals as basically worthless or meaningless as far as it is
concerned? That idea entrenched will only lead more to want to die when
otherwise they would live.
There's are also multiple other reasons that exist - in othre people -
for why that person should or shouldn't die. Euthanasia campaigners
focus only on the "personal suffering" reason but what about the
economic reasons alone by which others have a stake in the issue -
family, hospital, government. Campaigners never talk about those reasons
yet they themselves may be motivated by them.
For example, Hitler's Germany specifically valued the disabled in terms
of their cost to society. This principle was promoted in the mass media.
The times are more subtle today but the exact same ideas are at work.
Don't think they're not.
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| User: "Jeff Welch" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 10:13:27 AM |
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"Sergeant America" <sergeant_america@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4226E4AE.4F85B3D3@yahoo.com...
J Young wrote:
For society to say that any one individual may choose to die, and be
assisted in doing so, it is by necessity saying of such people that ALL
their lives are worthless to society
Oh horse *****.
Instead of affirming the intrinsic worth of all human beings, an entire
group of
people are being told, individually, "It doesn't matter to us if you
live or die."
That's an equally stupid statement. ALL people die (you knew that, right?).
People who are terminally ill (i.e. going to die horribly from their
disease) deserve the right to a compassionate end.
Legal assisted suicide is society saying "we care enough about you to help
you end your suffering peacefully and painlessly, rather than forcing you to
die a prolonged, agonizing death."
What kind of monster ARE you?
-Jeff
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| User: "Sergeant America" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 04:19:04 PM |
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Jeff Welch wrote:
"Sergeant America" <sergeant_america@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4226E4AE.4F85B3D3@yahoo.com...
J Young wrote:
For society to say that any one individual may choose to die, and be
assisted in doing so, it is by necessity saying of such people that ALL
their lives are worthless to society
Oh horse *****.
No refutation *****?
Instead of affirming the intrinsic worth of all human beings, an entire
group of
people are being told, individually, "It doesn't matter to us if you
live or die."
That's an equally stupid statement. ALL people die (you knew that, right?).
People who are terminally ill (i.e. going to die horribly from their
disease) deserve the right to a compassionate end.
Legal assisted suicide is society saying "we care enough about you to help
you end your suffering peacefully and painlessly, rather than forcing you to
die a prolonged, agonizing death."
What kind of monster ARE you?
Those person's conditions are treatable, you ignorant clusterfuck.
You're devaluing the lives of people who are very ill by promoting the
idea that they may as well die as far as you're concerned. What kind of
sick animal are you.
If you look into the Holland and Belgium situation you'll see the
long-term result of euthanasia, namely many questionable (i.e.
nonvoluntary) deaths. It's the path Nazi Germany followed in devaluing
the lives of groups of people they deemed as socially accceptable to
die, which is what you're promoting here.
http://www.euthanasia.com/holland99.html
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/1037381.stm
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| User: "Douglas Berry" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 09:06:45 PM |
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On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 11:19:04 +1300, Sergeant America
<sergeant_america@yahoo.com> drained his beer, leaned back in the
alt.atheism beanbag and drunkenly proclaimed the following
Those person's conditions are treatable, you ignorant clusterfuck.
The law in Oregon, and the proposed law in California, require that
two doctors come to the conclusion that the person is in the terminal
stage of an untreatable illness, and has six months to live or less.
--
Douglas E. Berry Do the OBVIOUS thing to send e-mail
Atheist #2147, Atheist Vet #5
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as
when they do it from religious conviction."
Blaise Pascal (1623-1662), Pense'es, #894.
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| User: "lmk" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
10 Mar 2005 02:25:19 PM |
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My grandfather has lung cancer. He was told by more than one doctor he had
less than 6 months to live. The 6 months was up in February. He is still
living at home, doing the things he likes to do and his condition has not
worsened since he was first diagnosed. If he had listened to the doctors,
and assisted suicide was legal, he may have very well chosen to commit
suicide. If he had done so, my baby daughter would have missed the
opportunity she's had in the last couple of months to have a relationship
with her great-grandfather.
Doctors are sometimes wrong.
I would even start to go into the issue concerning the pressure families can
put on patients to die. It's horrifying to me the attitude my aunts and
uncles have towards my grandfather consisting of mainly, "Hurry up and die
you old fart so we can get ahold of your assets." When an ederly person
diagnosed with a terminal illness receives that kind of reaction from family
members, you don't think they're going to fill the pressure to end it all,
even if they have a chance at living a few more years?
LMK
"Douglas Berry" <penguin_boy@mindOBVIOUSspring.com> wrote in message
news:a7kf21p50ilus84m2jeou5qcgtn3ocdubk@4ax.com...
On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 11:19:04 +1300, Sergeant America
<sergeant_america@yahoo.com> drained his beer, leaned back in the
alt.atheism beanbag and drunkenly proclaimed the following
Those person's conditions are treatable, you ignorant clusterfuck.
The law in Oregon, and the proposed law in California, require that
two doctors come to the conclusion that the person is in the terminal
stage of an untreatable illness, and has six months to live or less.
--
Douglas E. Berry Do the OBVIOUS thing to send e-mail
Atheist #2147, Atheist Vet #5
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as
when they do it from religious conviction."
Blaise Pascal (1623-1662), Pense'es, #894.
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| User: "Michael Calwell" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
10 Mar 2005 02:41:42 PM |
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lmk wrote:
My grandfather has lung cancer. He was told by more than one doctor he had
less than 6 months to live. The 6 months was up in February.
There was a piece on BBC Radio recently about how many elderly people
are living neglected lives, and are increasingly bored, depressed and
lonely.
What a neat plan eh? Drive people to the edge, treat them as worthless,
then give them the "choice" to end their strife. Sounds a bit like
another "choice" doesn't it?
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| User: "Sanders Kaufman" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
10 Mar 2005 04:53:21 PM |
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"Michael Calwell" <michael.calwell@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
news:4230b52f$0$32616$db0fefd9@news.zen.co.uk...
lmk wrote:
My grandfather has lung cancer. He was told by more than one doctor he
had
less than 6 months to live. The 6 months was up in February.
There was a piece on BBC Radio recently about how many elderly people are
living neglected lives, and are increasingly bored, depressed and lonely.
What a neat plan eh? Drive people to the edge, treat them as worthless,
then give them the "choice" to end their strife. Sounds a bit like another
"choice" doesn't it?
Of course, NOBODY is proposing euthanasia for *depression*.
That you claim that IS the case shows the kind of immoral and mentally
defective traits so common among Americans these days.
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| User: "Pat Winstanley" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
10 Mar 2005 06:08:27 PM |
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In article <Bd4Yd.7775$YD4.4889@newssvr12.news.prodigy.com>,
usenet@kaufman.net says...
"Michael Calwell" <michael.calwell@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
news:4230b52f$0$32616$db0fefd9@news.zen.co.uk...
lmk wrote:
My grandfather has lung cancer. He was told by more than one doctor he
had
less than 6 months to live. The 6 months was up in February.
There was a piece on BBC Radio recently about how many elderly people are
living neglected lives, and are increasingly bored, depressed and lonely.
What a neat plan eh? Drive people to the edge, treat them as worthless,
then give them the "choice" to end their strife. Sounds a bit like another
"choice" doesn't it?
Of course, NOBODY is proposing euthanasia for *depression*.
That you claim that IS the case shows the kind of immoral and mentally
defective traits so common among Americans these days.
I think Michael is British... but it makes no difference - he's simply a
liar! ;-))
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| User: "stoney" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
11 Mar 2005 10:27:48 AM |
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On Fri, 11 Mar 2005 00:08:27 -0000, Pat Winstanley
<boredofspam2004@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
In article <Bd4Yd.7775$YD4.4889@newssvr12.news.prodigy.com>,
usenet@kaufman.net says...
"Michael Calwell" <michael.calwell@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
news:4230b52f$0$32616$db0fefd9@news.zen.co.uk...
lmk wrote:
My grandfather has lung cancer. He was told by more than one doctor he
had
less than 6 months to live. The 6 months was up in February.
There was a piece on BBC Radio recently about how many elderly people are
living neglected lives, and are increasingly bored, depressed and lonely.
What a neat plan eh? Drive people to the edge, treat them as worthless,
then give them the "choice" to end their strife. Sounds a bit like another
"choice" doesn't it?
Of course, NOBODY is proposing euthanasia for *depression*.
That you claim that IS the case shows the kind of immoral and mentally
defective traits so common among Americans these days.
I think Michael is British... but it makes no difference - he's simply a
liar! ;-))
Yes, Michael is indeed a terminal git.
--
Contempt of Congress meter reading-offscale.
Hello, theocracy with a fundamentalist US Supreme
Court who will ensure church and state are joined
at the hip like clergy and altar boys.
America 1776-Jan 2001 RIP
Religion is the original war crime.
-Michelle Malkin (Feb 26, 2005)
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| User: "stoney" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
11 Mar 2005 10:27:03 AM |
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On Thu, 10 Mar 2005 22:53:21 GMT, "Sanders Kaufman"
<usenet@kaufman.net> wrote:
"Michael Calwell" <michael.calwell@btopenworld.com> wrote in message
news:4230b52f$0$32616$db0fefd9@news.zen.co.uk...
lmk wrote:
My grandfather has lung cancer. He was told by more than one doctor he
had
less than 6 months to live. The 6 months was up in February.
There was a piece on BBC Radio recently about how many elderly people are
living neglected lives, and are increasingly bored, depressed and lonely.
What a neat plan eh? Drive people to the edge, treat them as worthless,
then give them the "choice" to end their strife. Sounds a bit like another
"choice" doesn't it?
Of course, NOBODY is proposing euthanasia for *depression*.
That you claim that IS the case shows the kind of immoral and mentally
defective traits so common among Americans these days.
Unfortunately, said defectiveness has spread to Britain.
--
Contempt of Congress meter reading-offscale.
Hello, theocracy with a fundamentalist US Supreme
Court who will ensure church and state are joined
at the hip like clergy and altar boys.
America 1776-Jan 2001 RIP
Religion is the original war crime.
-Michelle Malkin (Feb 26, 2005)
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
10 Mar 2005 09:06:46 PM |
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Michael Calwell <michael.calwell@btopenworld.com> wrote:
lmk wrote:
My grandfather has lung cancer. He was told by more than one doctor he had
less than 6 months to live. The 6 months was up in February.
There was a piece on BBC Radio recently about how many elderly people
are living neglected lives, and are increasingly bored, depressed and
lonely.
What a neat plan eh? Drive people to the edge, treat them as worthless,
then give them the "choice" to end their strife. Sounds a bit like
another "choice" doesn't it?
Whereas you want to force people to suffer and then ignore them so you
don't have to deal with the suffering you cause?
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
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| User: "BOB" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
10 Mar 2005 03:12:57 PM |
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Michael Calwell <michael.calwell@btopenworld.com> wrote in
news:4230b52f$0$32616$db0fefd9@news.zen.co.uk:
lmk wrote:
My grandfather has lung cancer. He was told by more than one doctor
he had less than 6 months to live. The 6 months was up in February.
There was a piece on BBC Radio recently about how many elderly people
are living neglected lives, and are increasingly bored, depressed and
lonely.
Then why don't you do something to help them, if you really care that is.
What a neat plan eh? Drive people to the edge, treat them as worthless,
then give them the "choice" to end their strife.
Are you speaking from experience?
Sounds a bit like
another "choice" doesn't it?
Life is full of choices. You get to make yours and everyone else gets to
make theirs. Your trouble is you want to make the choices for other
people, people you don't even know.
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| User: "Mike Painter" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
10 Mar 2005 05:16:02 PM |
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Michael Calwell wrote:
lmk wrote:
My grandfather has lung cancer. He was told by more than one doctor
he had less than 6 months to live. The 6 months was up in February.
There was a piece on BBC Radio recently about how many elderly people
are living neglected lives, and are increasingly bored, depressed and
lonely.
It's the same people who are against assisted suicide that are ignoring
these people.
What a neat plan eh? Drive people to the edge, treat them as
worthless, then give them the "choice" to end their strife. Sounds a
bit like another "choice" doesn't it?
Assisted suicide would not apply to these people.
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| User: "Rev. Karl E. Taylor" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 10:32:06 AM |
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Jeff Welch wrote:
"Sergeant America" <sergeant_america@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4226E4AE.4F85B3D3@yahoo.com...
J Young wrote:
For society to say that any one individual may choose to die, and be
assisted in doing so, it is by necessity saying of such people that ALL
their lives are worthless to society
Oh horse *****.
Instead of affirming the intrinsic worth of all human beings, an entire
group of
people are being told, individually, "It doesn't matter to us if you
live or die."
That's an equally stupid statement. ALL people die (you knew that, right?).
People who are terminally ill (i.e. going to die horribly from their
disease) deserve the right to a compassionate end.
Legal assisted suicide is society saying "we care enough about you to help
you end your suffering peacefully and painlessly, rather than forcing you to
die a prolonged, agonizing death."
What kind of monster ARE you?
J Young and his ilk, are the kind of monsters that use suffering, pain,
fear, and death, to further their own twisted agendas. To try and
"bring people into the fold.", and increase their brownie points with
gawd. The more people suffer, the better chance they might turn to gawd
in their hour of need. The more they fear death, the better the chance
of conversion.
Torture is illegal, to all but the fanatic.
--
There are none more ignorant and useless,
than they that seek answers on their knees,
with their eyes closed.
____________________________________________________________________
Rev. Karl E. Taylor
A.A #1143 PLONKED by Bob
Apostle of Dr. Lao EAC: Virgin Conversion Unit Director
____________________________________________________________________
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| User: "Sanders Kaufman" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 10:27:22 AM |
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"Sergeant America" <sergeant_america@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4226E4AE.4F85B3D3@yahoo.com...
J Young wrote:
Instead of
affirming the intrinsic worth of all human beings, an entire group of
people are being told, individually, "It doesn't matter to us if you
live or die." No wonder the disabled are sensitive on the issue of mercy
killing and euthanasia; it's usually their lives being talked about.
You seem to base that evil position on the assumption that the patient, if
not assisted, will live a life.
Furthermore you bring up this nutty idea that the giving the Terminally Ill
the right to die will mean death for the DISABLED.
That is a totally bogus position that you take in a dishonest attempt to
support your position.
It's like when your fellow whackos say that without taxpayer funding for the
the 10 Graven Images, God will leave America.
It's notable that you nutbags have to make up imaginary threats in order to
justify y'alls hate-based faith.
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| User: "Sergeant America" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
03 Mar 2005 04:31:53 PM |
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Sanders Kaufman wrote:
"Sergeant America" <sergeant_america@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4226E4AE.4F85B3D3@yahoo.com...
J Young wrote:
Instead of
affirming the intrinsic worth of all human beings, an entire group of
people are being told, individually, "It doesn't matter to us if you
live or die." No wonder the disabled are sensitive on the issue of mercy
killing and euthanasia; it's usually their lives being talked about.
You seem to base that evil position on the assumption that the patient, if
not assisted, will live a life.
Furthermore you bring up this nutty idea that the giving the Terminally Ill
the right to die will mean death for the DISABLED.
Don't try that. Those are also the cases the media uses to justify it,
you complete moron. What about Peter Singer? Another pro-euthanasia
nutjob dehumanizing the lives of all disabled.
Empowering the people who care for the terminally ill to kill them
instead. Well, do you think that's a good idea? Look at the abuses in
the likes of Holland and Belgium which have had enough years of
euthanasia for us to see that what I say is dead-on accurate.
Not that a lowering in the value of life would matter to you: That's the
view you have of these people already, isn't it?
That is a totally bogus position that you take in a dishonest attempt to
support your position.
It's like when your fellow whackos say that without taxpayer funding for the
the 10 Graven Images, God will leave America.
Who's talking about God here? Another reactionary atheist obsessed over
God.... They can't think their own thoughts except by attacking the
thoughts of others.
It's notable that you nutbags have to make up imaginary threats in order to
justify y'alls hate-based faith.
Madalyn Murray O'Hair was as hate-based as any of the imaginary
religious bogeymen you attack daily on Usenet. And she was a real
person. In fact she was sort of the equivalent of Jerry Falwell. Heh, no
comparison really.
http://www.rfcnet.org/news/default.asp?action=detail&article=144
You're the fundmentalist bigots as much as anyone:
http://www.washtimes.com/upi-breaking/20050301-123015-2069r.htm
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| User: "Sanders Kaufman" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
04 Mar 2005 03:08:19 AM |
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"Sergeant America" <sergeant_america@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:42279059.81FF693A@yahoo.com...
Sanders Kaufman wrote:
You seem to base that evil position on the assumption that the patient,
if
not assisted, will live a life.
Furthermore you bring up this nutty idea that the giving the Terminally
Ill
the right to die will mean death for the DISABLED.
Don't try that. Those are also the cases the media uses to justify it,
you complete moron. What about Peter Singer? Another pro-euthanasia
nutjob dehumanizing the lives of all disabled.
The reason the media uses those reasons to justify it is because... THEY'RE
TRUE.
Terminally ill patients WILL die - that's why they're called Terminal
instead of "immortal".
Why do you oppose reducing suffering in the world?
Empowering the people who care for the terminally ill to kill them
instead. Well, do you think that's a good idea? Look at the abuses in
Your position - that we shouldn't pass the law simply because someone might
break it is, of course, insane.
By your logic, no President should be allowed to wage war - simply because
Bush and Nixon abused that power.
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| User: "Douglas Berry" |
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| Title: Re: Assisted suicide backed in poll |
04 Mar 2005 03:32:32 PM |
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On Thu, 03 Mar 2005 23:19:26 +1300, Sergeant America
<sergeant_america@yahoo.com> drained his beer, leaned back in the
alt.atheism beanbag and drunkenly proclaimed the following
For society to say that any one individual may choose to die, and be
assisted in doing so, it is by necessity saying of such people that ALL
their lives are worthless to society, since theoretically all could
choose to either die or live and it would make no difference. Instead of
affirming the intrinsic worth of all human beings, an entire group of
people are being told, individually, "It doesn't matter to us if you
live or die." No wonder the disabled are sensitive on the issue of mercy
killing and euthanasia; it's usually their lives being talked about.
These people are *dying*. By law, assisted suicide is only avialable
to those who will die within six months anyway.
Does society want to write off the lives of certain groups of disabled
individuals as basically worthless or meaningless as far as it is
concerned? That idea entrenched will only lead more to want to die when
otherwise they would live.
If the law ever mentioned the diabled, you might have an argument.
http://www.ohsu.edu/ethics/guidebook/toc.pdf
http://www.ohd.hr.state.or.us/chs/pas/pas.cfm
There. Some facts for you.
There's are also multiple other reasons that exist - in othre people -
for why that person should or shouldn't die. Euthanasia campaigners
focus only on the "personal suffering" reason but what about the
economic reasons alone by which others have a stake in the issue -
family, hospital, government. Campaigners never talk about those reasons
yet they themselves may be motivated by them.
Does it penetrate your skull that others cannot make the decision?
That the choice is in the hands of the ill person alone?
For example, Hitler's Germany specifically valued the disabled in terms
of their cost to society. This principle was promoted in the mass media.
The times are more subtle today but the exact same ideas are at work.
Don't think they're not.
Again, show me where anyone in the Death with Dignity movement is
advocating euthanasia without consent.
--
Douglas E. Berry Do the OBVIOUS thing to send e-mail
Atheist #2147, Atheist Vet #5
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as
when they do it from religious conviction."
Blaise Pascal (1623-1662), Pense'es, #894.
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