| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Tom P" |
| Date: |
18 Jul 2005 06:07:43 PM |
| Object: |
Atheists on Atheism |
Following are the words of atheists on atheism; atheists describing their
atheism; the necessity for their atheism; the fact that atheism is the
necessary prerequisite of materialism; and the objectives of their atheist
movement.
I just thought that atheists wouldn't mind at all if I quoted and posted
some of the leading atheists in world history. Incidentally, three of the
atheists I quote here became heads of governments during the 20th century,
and actually applied their atheist ideals and goals to the populations of
these modern nation states.
There are lots more where these came from. And even more in the various
"Collected Works" of these world famous atheists. Atheists were never shy
or bashful concerning their objectives. They just came right out and said
it.
I deliberately found a public source for these documents. These quotations
may be reproduced and freely distributed with the only caveat being that
credit must be given for the source, which is the Marxists Internet Archive
at http://www.marxists.org/. I quote from this site at
http://www.marxists.org/: "All material within these Archives, unless noted
otherwise, is public domain. MIA created material is protected by the
Creative Commons License." So please give credit where credit is due if you
repost or reproduce these. Thank you. Happy reading.
"Communism begins from the outset with atheism . . ." (Karl Marx, "Private
Property and Communism" in Marx: Economic and Philosophical Manuscripts of
1844: Private Property and Communism." Trans. Martin Mulligan. Moscow:
Progress Publishers, 1959.) Available at: http://www.marxists.org/archive/
"There are, besides, eternal truths, such as Freedom, Justice, etc., that
are common to all states of society. But Communism abolishes eternal truths,
it abolishes all religion, and all morality, instead of constituting them on
a new basis; it therefore acts in contradiction to all past historical
experience." Karl Marx and Frederich Engels, "The Manifesto of the
Communist Party," in Marx/Engels, "Selected Works," Volume One. Trans.:
Samuel Moore. Moscow: Progress Publishers, , pp. 98-137. Available at:
http://www.marxists.org/archive/
"The point is, therefore, to be more radical than everybody else as far as
atheism is concerned. Fortunately it is easy enough to be an atheist today."
And then later in the same essay: "This much is sure: the only service that
can be rendered to God today is to declare atheism a compulsory article of
faith and to outdo Bismarck's Kirchenkulturkampf laws by prohibiting
religion generally...." Frederick Engels. "Emigrant Literature II," 1874,
in "Marx and Engels On Religion." trans. Andy Blunden. Moscow: Progress
Publishers, 1957. Available at: http://www.marxists.org/archive/
"The philosophical basis of Marxism, as Marx and Engels repeatedly declared,
is dialectical materialism, which has fully taken over the historical
traditions of eighteenth-century materialism in France and of Feuerbach
(first half of the nineteenth century) in Germany-a materialism which is
absolutely atheistic and positively hostile to all religion." (From V. I.
Lenin, "The Attitude of the Workers' Party to Religion." Originally
published in "Proletary," No. 45, May 13 (26), 1900. Published according to
the text in Proletary. Source: Lenin, "Collected Works." Moscow:
Progress Publishers, 1973, Volume 15, pages 402-413. Available at:
http://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin
"Our Programme is based entirely on the scientific, and moreover the
materialist, world-outlook. An explanation of our Programme, therefore,
necessarily includes an explanation of the true historical and economic
roots of the religious fog. Our propaganda necessarily includes the
propaganda of atheism; the publication of the appropriate scientific
literature, which the autocratic feudal government has hitherto strictly
forbidden and persecuted, must now form one of the fields of our Party
work." V. I. Lenin' "Socialism and Religion," Novaya Zhizn, No. 28,
December 3, 1905. Signed: N. Lenin. Published according to the text in
Novaya Zhizn. Source: Lenin Collected Works, Progress Publishers, 1965,
Moscow, Volume 10, pages 83-87. Available at:
http://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin
"Dialectical materialism is the world outlook of the Marxist-Leninist party.
It is called dialectical materialism because its approach to the phenomena
of nature, its method of studying and apprehending them, is dialectical,
while its interpretation of the phenomena of nature, its conception of these
phenomena, its theory, is materialistic." J. V. Stalin, "Dialectical and
Historical Materialism." September 1938. Available at
http://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/
"Historical materialism is the extension of the principles of dialectical
materialism to the study of social life, an application of the principles of
dialectical materialism to the phenomena of the life of society, to the
study of society and of its history." J. V. Stalin, "Dialectical and
Historical Materialism." September 1938. Available at
http://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/
"Contrary to idealism, which denies the possibility of knowing the world and
its laws, which does not believe in the authenticity of our knowledge, does
not recognize objective truth, and holds that the world is full of
'things-in-themselves' that can never be known to science, Marxist
philosophical materialism holds that the world and its laws are fully
knowable, that our knowledge of the laws of nature, tested by experiment and
practice, is authentic knowledge having the validity of objective truth, and
that there are no things in the world which are unknowable, but only things
which are as yet not known, but which will be disclosed and made known by
the efforts of science and practice." J. V. Stalin, "Dialectical and
Historical Materialism." September 1938.
Available at http://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/
"The history of science furnishes man with proof of the material nature of
the world and of the fact that it is governed by laws and helps man to see
the futility of the illusions of religion and idealism and to arrive at
materialist conclusions." Mao Zedong, "Dialectical materialism-notes of
lectures"as published in K'ang-chan ta-hsueh, nos. 6 to 8, April to June
1938. Available at
http://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/.
"Marx, Engels and Lenin all explained materialist dialectics as the theory
of development." Mao Zedong, "Dialectical materialism-notes of lectures"as
published in K'ang-chan ta-hsueh, nos. 6 to 8, April to June 1938.
Available at
http://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/.
"Dialectical materialism's theory of movement is in opposition first of all
with philosophical idealism and with the theological concepts of religion.
The fundamental nature of all philosophical idealism and religious theology
derives from their denial of the unity and material nature of the world; and
in imagining that the movement and development of the world takes place
apart from matter, or took place at least in the beginning apart from
matter, and is the result of the action of spirit, God, or divine forces."
Mao Zedong, "Dialectical materialism-notes of lectures"as published in
K'ang-chan ta-hsueh, nos. 6 to 8, April to June 1938. Available at
http://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/mao/selected-works/.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Fall of Communism proves superiority of atheism (Re: Atheists on Atheism) |
21 Jul 2005 08:24:10 AM |
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In <su-dnX3F34i4F0LfRVn-uA@giganews.com>, on 07/21/05
at 06:41 AM, "Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> said:
Christopher A. Lee wrote in message ...
On Tue, 19 Jul 2005 13:39:53 -0500, "Rick"
<pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
It *is* usually not enough for an atheists to have a mere lack of belief -
proselytising is a major tenet of the religion of Atheism.
Either a liar or an idiot. Doesn't matter which, the end result is the
same: an arrogant *****
Why is it that so many atheists lose control and become juvenile
potty-mouths? And please don't say that I made you do it.
Its called frustration over hearing & seeing the same lies & ***** way to many times. Considering the atheist news group is our virtual living room wjhere we interact with the occasioonal good guest & clean up behind the routine liars for jesus [on occasion all & krishna as well], one can understand that out of over 1000 posts a dayh, very few will be dedicated to fun, information, or social banter. Possibly less than ten percent.
who lies to atheists about their atheism.
All because his egocentric bigotry won't let them have the position
they actually do.
If only you all would act according to your claims.
Indeed if only all xians would act according to their claims, they would be to busy arguing about who is going to hell & leave the remainder of humanity alone. But they always have time to act the ***** & irritate those that know more about the history of their myth than they do. Probably about 90 percent of them IAW the average xain post to the atheist groups.
What "religion of atheism", deliberately nasty liar?
What "prosetyising", deliberately nasty liar?
I probably don't have the time to look up all the thousands of of
You have the time, but you don't have the time to look up the xian initiated posts to the atheist groups that were meant to do nothing constructive, beyond making the xain think he done good. I suspect the majority of those posts you are talking about come from responses to that bleater, & the bleater hiding by not telling which group they are posting from. Rather like, where are you posting from? We know where Chris is posting from but he can not do the courteous thing & trim headers for you may be in any of the following groups.
alt.bible,alt.religion.christian.baptist,alt.religion.christian.roman-catholic,alt.atheism,talk.politics.libertarian
Alt.bible is rather famous for being a breeding ground for ignorant xians.
unsolicited and unprovoked criticism and attacks on various Christian
newsgroups or individual Christians in various settings. Many atheists
Name them, I klnow of one, but the others may not post to one of the two groups I read.
act with a missionary zeal that would put to shame many theists. And I've
heard expressed many times in many ways that religion is dangerous and
needs to be silenced or done away with.
I don't agree, but I do agree that it needs to be confined to its proper v enue, whbich is not in bed with any government nor where it is not invited.
What "tenet", deliberately nasty liar?
You're projecting what your own religion does, onto people who have
neither a deity nor a religion.
Is it really so hard to understand that the rare occasions
Rare? Did you actually intend to say rare? What an incredibly and
deliberate, nasty liar your are!!!
Actually, it is rare, the majority of atheists [that post to alt.atheism as an example] do accept the possibility of a god, its just that they all play hide & seek so well its not worth th effort to pretend that they exist. There is a sub-set of atheists that hold that position, as I hold that there is no God as claimed by the xian myth. That sub-set, known as strong atheism, is catholic in its approach to the lack of gods problem.
an atheist says there's no god it's in exactly the vein
you say there are no fairies?
There you go again...lying. Have you ever heard me say there are no
fairies? You haven't, have you? To say there is no God goes far beyond a
Can't say I have, but it appears you are word picking. The you above, taken in context, indicates people in general, xians to be specific.
mere lack of belief in God(s). And yet atheists say this or imply it
constantly. I don't believe there are fairies, but then I don't have the
There you go, & the same thjing applies to you.
deep-seated need to continually mock and deride people who do believe in
fairies. Atheists constantly claim to just have a lack of belief, but
You just did, by indicating you do not believe in the wee folk, who are well documented world wide unlike your missing messiah, you imply that those that do are out of it. It is in the way you string your words together. Yet you complain when Chris does what you just did.
they act with the deepest confidence that there is no God(s). I
personally don't have the need to prove my intellectual superiority by
That's good, for if you believe in gods, the xian ones in particular, you would bring any intellectual superiority claims under serious suspicion of being a falsehood. At best, that superiority would be limited.
acting as though there is no doubt whatsoever that there are no fairies.
Ah, but in spite of you, they are accepted world wide. So maybe your vaunted intellectual superiority [implied, stated actually] is lacking just as you imply Chris is lacking in his approach to your god problem?
- Rick
walksalone who does understand that liars just hate it when they are called liars, but then, if the word fits, then what better descriptor can be used?
--
You believe in a book that has talking animals, wizards, witches, demons,
sticks turning into snakes, food falling from the sky, people walking on
water, and all sorts of magical, absurd and primitive stories, and you say
that we are the ones that need help?
-- Jon Stol
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| User: "Don Kresch" |
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| Title: Re: Fall of Communism proves superiority of atheism (Re: Atheists on Atheism) |
21 Jul 2005 07:53:08 AM |
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In alt.atheism On Thu, 21 Jul 2005 06:41:28 -0500, "Rick"
<pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> let us all know that:
Christopher A. Lee wrote in message ...
On Tue, 19 Jul 2005 13:39:53 -0500, "Rick"
<pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
It *is* usually not enough for an atheists to have a mere lack of belief -
proselytising is a major tenet of the religion of Atheism.
Either a liar or an idiot. Doesn't matter which, the end result is the
same: an arrogant *****
Why is it that so many atheists lose control and become juvenile
potty-mouths?
What the ***** is a "potty-mouth", and why the ***** is it bad?
What "religion of atheism", deliberately nasty liar?
What "prosetyising", deliberately nasty liar?
I probably don't have the time to look up all the thousands of of
unsolicited and unprovoked criticism and attacks on various Christian
newsgroups or individual Christians in various settings.
They are never unsolicited or unprovoked.
an atheist says there's no god it's in exactly the vein
you say there are no fairies?
There you go again...lying. Have you ever heard me say there are no fairies?
Do you?
You haven't, have you? To say there is no God goes far beyond a mere lack of
belief in God(s). And yet atheists say this or imply it constantly. I don't
believe there are fairies, but then I don't have the deep-seated need to
continually mock and deride people who do believe in fairies.
And atheists don't have a deep-seated need to continually mock
and deride people who do believe in a god. However, the theists have a
deep-seated need to spew their god-***** where it isn't wanted.
Thus, they incur mocking and derision.
Don
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| User: "Ash" |
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| Title: Re: Fall of Communism proves superiority of atheism (Re: Atheistson Atheism) |
21 Jul 2005 11:57:45 AM |
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Rick wrote:
Christopher A. Lee wrote in message ...
On Tue, 19 Jul 2005 13:39:53 -0500, "Rick"
<pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
It *is* usually not enough for an atheists to have a mere lack of belief -
proselytising is a major tenet of the religion of Atheism.
Either a liar or an idiot. Doesn't matter which, the end result is the
same: an arrogant *****
Why is it that so many atheists lose control and become juvenile
potty-mouths? And please don't say that I made you do it.
Potty mouths? Are you 6?
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
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| Title: Re: Fall of Communism proves superiority of atheism (Re: Atheists on Atheism) |
21 Jul 2005 02:48:00 PM |
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On Thu, 21 Jul 2005 17:57:45 +0100, Ash
<ashamanic@winterfell73.fsnet.co.uk> wrote:
Rick wrote:
Christopher A. Lee wrote in message ...
On Tue, 19 Jul 2005 13:39:53 -0500, "Rick"
<pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
It *is* usually not enough for an atheists to have a mere lack of belief -
proselytising is a major tenet of the religion of Atheism.
Either a liar or an idiot. Doesn't matter which, the end result is the
same: an arrogant *****
Why is it that so many atheists lose control and become juvenile
potty-mouths? And please don't say that I made you do it.
Potty mouths? Are you 6?
Nobody has lost control, but it enables him to hide his dishonesty by
being an even more sanctimonious hypocrite.
I don't know what it is with US Christians, but they see nothing wrong
with repeating vicious slanders about atheists, and imagine we have to
put up with it.
It's not rocket science, but if they only thought about it before they
opened their mouthe, they wouldn't make them.
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| User: "DanielSan" |
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| Title: Re: Fall of Communism proves superiority of atheism (Re: Atheistson Atheism) |
21 Jul 2005 05:47:10 PM |
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Rick wrote:
Christopher A. Lee wrote in message ...
On Tue, 19 Jul 2005 13:39:53 -0500, "Rick"
<pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
It *is* usually not enough for an atheists to have a mere lack of belief -
proselytising is a major tenet of the religion of Atheism.
Either a liar or an idiot. Doesn't matter which, the end result is the
same: an arrogant *****
Why is it that so many atheists lose control and become juvenile
potty-mouths? And please don't say that I made you do it.
I notice that folks like you only respond to the folks who do not feel
the need to clean up their language, but never to folks like myself who
do not use certain words unless they're really, REALLY needed.
Why is this? Easy targets? Are you lazy?
who lies to atheists about their atheism.
All because his egocentric bigotry won't let them have the position
they actually do.
If only you all would act according to your claims.
I do. What now?
What "religion of atheism", deliberately nasty liar?
What "prosetyising", deliberately nasty liar?
I probably don't have the time to look up all the thousands of of
unsolicited and unprovoked criticism and attacks on various Christian
newsgroups or individual Christians in various settings.
Have you visited alt.atheism? Have you seen the unsolicited and
unprovoked criticisms, attacks, and outright lies about atheists by
various Christians that post there?
Many atheists act
with a missionary zeal that would put to shame many theists. And I've heard
expressed many times in many ways that religion is dangerous and needs to be
silenced or done away with.
Those are not atheists. Those are antitheists. Atheists simply do not
believe in gods. Those who go beyond this sole tenet of atheism are not
expressing atheism; they're expressing their own sociopolitical opinion
and, to lump all atheists together with those antitheist, is to be
absurdly deceitful.
--
****************************************************
* DanielSan -- alt.atheism #2226 *
*--------------------------------------------------*
* "No one ever demonstrated, so far as I am aware, *
* the non-existence of Zeus or Thor - but they *
* have few followers now." Arthur C. Clarke *
****************************************************
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| User: "Ben Dolan" |
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| Title: Re: Fall of Communism proves superiority of atheism (Re: Atheists on Atheism) |
20 Jul 2005 11:09:15 AM |
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Rick <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
It *is* usually not enough for an atheists to have a mere lack of belief -
proselytising is a major tenet of the religion of Atheism.
Oh, right. My doorbell rings constantly with those smiling, cleancut
young atheists who say "Have you rejected Jesus as your personal
savior?"
And everytime I check into a hotel, I find a copy of "Atlas Shrugged" in
the nightstand...
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| User: "Pastor Dave" |
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| Title: Re: Fall of Communism proves superiority of atheism (Re: Atheists on Atheism) |
20 Jul 2005 11:29:10 AM |
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On Wed, 20 Jul 2005 09:09:15 -0700,
ben_dolan_III@reet.com (Ben Dolan) spake thusly:
Rick <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
It *is* usually not enough for an atheists to have a mere lack of belief -
proselytising is a major tenet of the religion of Atheism.
Oh, right. My doorbell rings constantly with those smiling, cleancut
young atheists who say "Have you rejected Jesus as your personal
savior?"
And everytime I check into a hotel, I find a copy of "Atlas Shrugged" in
the nightstand...
And yet, we see them subscribed to Christian news
groups. I have proved this more than once by simply
trimming the groups down to only Christian groups
when I respond and they do indeed see me message
and respond again. And they spend their time telling
us how the Bible is false. That sir, is proselytizing.
--
Pastor Dave
Silence in the Face of Doctrinal Criticism is Suicide
http://www.ecclesia.org/truth/solution.html
http://tinyurl.com/ce97m
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| User: "Ben Dolan" |
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| Title: Re: Fall of Communism proves superiority of atheism (Re: Atheists on Atheism) |
21 Jul 2005 12:26:07 AM |
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Pastor Dave <news-group-mail@nospam-tampa-bay.rr.com> wrote:
And they spend their time telling us how the Bible is false.
That sir, is proselytizing.
No, that sir, is stating a fact.
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| User: "Rick" |
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| Title: Re: Fall of Communism proves superiority of atheism (Re: Atheists on Atheism) |
20 Jul 2005 07:28:54 PM |
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Pastor Dave wrote in message <0rusd1d2s22780efr2ffleci2iengo6pfl@4ax.com>...
On Wed, 20 Jul 2005 09:09:15 -0700,
ben_dolan_III@reet.com (Ben Dolan) spake thusly:
Rick <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
It *is* usually not enough for an atheists to have a mere lack of
belief -
proselytising is a major tenet of the religion of Atheism.
Oh, right. My doorbell rings constantly with those smiling, cleancut
young atheists who say "Have you rejected Jesus as your personal
savior?"
And everytime I check into a hotel, I find a copy of "Atlas Shrugged" in
the nightstand...
And yet, we see them subscribed to Christian news
groups. I have proved this more than once by simply
trimming the groups down to only Christian groups
when I respond and they do indeed see me message
and respond again. And they spend their time telling
us how the Bible is false. That sir, is proselytizing.
Yeah, but the theists proselytized them first!!!
Atheism as they want to define it does not exist, ecept in very rare
exceptions.
- Rick
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
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| Title: Re: Fall of Communism proves superiority of atheism (Re: Atheists on Atheism) |
20 Jul 2005 07:35:55 PM |
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On Wed, 20 Jul 2005 19:28:54 -0500, "Rick"
<pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Atheism as they want to define it does not exist, ecept in very rare
exceptions.
Lying hypocrite.
- Rick
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Fall of Communism proves superiority of atheism (Re: Atheists on Atheism) |
03 Aug 2005 03:41:39 PM |
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Pastor Dave wrote:
On Wed, 20 Jul 2005 09:09:15 -0700,
ben_dolan_III@reet.com (Ben Dolan) spake thusly:
Rick <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
It *is* usually not enough for an atheists to have a mere lack of belief -
proselytising is a major tenet of the religion of Atheism.
Oh, right. My doorbell rings constantly with those smiling, cleancut
young atheists who say "Have you rejected Jesus as your personal
savior?"
And everytime I check into a hotel, I find a copy of "Atlas Shrugged" in
the nightstand...
And yet, we see them subscribed to Christian news
groups. I have proved this more than once by simply
trimming the groups down to only Christian groups
when I respond and they do indeed see me message
and respond again. And they spend their time telling
us how the Bible is false. That sir, is proselytizing.
I found your post in alt.atheism. If I reply to it
and you then trim the headers and then reply in kind
I will find it because I search my name to see if
anyone replied. I will not alter the headers and
thus our conversation will have moved to whatever
groups you have left in the headers.
Larry
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| User: "Wayne Delia" |
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| Title: Re: Fall of Communism proves superiority of atheism (Re: Atheistson Atheism) |
19 Jul 2005 10:57:42 PM |
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Rick wrote:
It *is* usually not enough for an atheists to have a mere lack of belief -
proselytising is a major tenet of the religion of Atheism.
I realize your comprehension isn't at its best when hung over on a
Saturday morning, but those early-morning doorbell ringers were
Jehovah's Witnesses, not atheists.
--
Wayne Delia,
Delta Iota Chapter Advisor, Phi Kappa Sigma at Marist College
"Don't eat me! I have a wife and kids! Eat them!" (Homer Simpson)
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| User: "bob young" |
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| Title: Re: Fall of Communism proves superiority of atheism (Re: Atheists onAtheism) |
19 Jul 2005 11:33:13 PM |
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Rick wrote:
bob young wrote in message <42DC8D6A.C6F7D33@netvigator.com>...
Tom P wrote:
<wonderful@Phreaker.net> wrote in message
news:1121734448.273011.199210@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Tom P wrote:
Following are the words of atheists on atheism; atheists describing
their
atheism; the necessity for their atheism; the fact that atheism is
the
necessary prerequisite of materialism; and the objectives of their
atheist
movement.
(communist BS snipped)
No, atheist BS . . .Marx and Engels said it was atheism, and Lenin,
Stalin,
and Mao agreed. Not me.
Yes, the communist dictatorships were officially atheist and therefore
had to promise the people happy life in the "bright future".
Yes, they were. Some still are in power.
But it works only once - after a while even the dumbest folks find out
that life is still miserable and the "happy future" is not coming.
Seems to me there is little hope for any change in China, North Korea,
Vietnam, and a few other places.
China is booming, thanks to american Industrial investment coupled with
Chinese hard work. Buildings going up everywhere and overseas tourism
increasing 200% annually.
Is your above remark an indication of the accuracy of your other comments
??
The priests of all gods have it far easier - they can just promise
their followers heaven after death!
That's true. They can.
It's no surprise that the atheist tyranny lasted no more than 70 years,
while religious one lasts for thousands of years and show no sign of
abating.
Are the regimes in place in North Korea, Vietnam, Laos, China, and other
places no longer atheist?
No, they still have their old communist administrations greatly changed
from
thirty years back.
They worship hard work and a profit for their families and kids.
They do not recognise 'gods' other than in their history books teaching
their
children how silly the primitives were.
If you think hammering away at the Communist states is going to score you
any
brownie points you are wasting everybody's time.
Try the UK. UK Christian followers in 1922 was 85%. Today in 2005 around
15%
Christian followers. The swing is to 'non believers' like Mao; but they
are
not atheists, since they are too busy doing other things,
And here I thought atheists merely had a lack of belief in God(s).
instead of trying to bash sense into godbots.
It *is* usually not enough for an atheists to have a mere lack of belief -
proselytising is a major tenet of the religion of Atheism.
the last thing atheists have is...................... 'religion'
- Rick
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Fall of Communism proves superiority of atheism (Re: Atheists on Atheism) |
04 Aug 2005 12:23:25 AM |
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Rick wrote:
bob young wrote in message <42DC8D6A.C6F7D33@netvigator.com>...
Christian followers. The swing is to 'non believers'
like Mao; but they are not atheists, since they are
too busy doing other things,
And here I thought atheists merely had a lack of belief in God(s).
instead of trying to bash sense into godbots.
It *is* usually not enough for an atheists to have a mere
lack of belief - proselytising is a major tenet of
the religion of Atheism.
Wrong Rick, atheism is not a religion.
Atheists like to spread the knowledge
that we have learned like anyone else.
Unlike most theists however, atheists
have little to gain from converting
theists except the betterment of
mankind from a more rational world.
Larry
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Russian communists: Down with atheism, Long live religion ! (Re: Atheists on Atheism) |
18 Jul 2005 08:01:50 PM |
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Tom P wrote:
Following are the words of atheists on atheism; atheists describing their
atheism; the necessity for their atheism; the fact that atheism is the
necessary prerequisite of materialism; and the objectives of their atheist
movement.
As I understand you, your only problem with communists is they do not
believe in god.
If this is the case, then the Russian Communist party is now your kind
of party!
Praise Jesus!
Russian communists: Down with atheism, Long live religion
http://www.iamik.ru
October 30, 2003
In the press center of "Arguments and Facts" a press conference was
called by CPRF chairman Gennadiy Zyuganov on the theme, "Communists and
Orthodoxy." The underlying goal of the press conference was the
presentation of Gennadiy Zyuganov's new book, "Svyatay Rus i
Koshcheyevo tsarstvo" ("Holy Russia and Koshchey's Kingdom"), along
with a commentary by the CPRF leader on several political events.
Before the press conference began, all the journalists were given a
copy of G. Zyuganov's new book, a booklet with the electoral platform
of the CPRF and a press release, in which the results of a socialist
survey was published, which was conducted by the Center for Research
into the Political Culture of Russia. The main question for which the
sociologists sought an answer: whose electorate was the most churchy?
This led further to three diagrams, in which the answers were tabulated
to the following questions: "Your religion? If you're Orthodox, then
how long since last confession and communion? If you're Orthodox, then
do you observe the Lent fast?"
It was most interesting that the participants of this survey were all
adherents of the CPRF, "One Russia" and citizens who were still
undecided about their political choice. The journalists were not
surprised by the results of the survey. The Center for Research into
the Political Culture of Russia came to the conclusion that in the
Orthodox electorate, "One Russia" was almost 2.5 times less churchly
than the communists. The survey concluded that "The phenomenon of the
most extensive churchliness of the CPRF voters obviously requires a
very careful analysis."
After the survey results were declared, G. Zyuganov commented that
"Russia is a multi-national country. It has representatives of all the
world religions, and we have always found and will find a common
language with representatives of any religion. This is necessary for
the strengthening of the government." The leader of the Communist Party
commented further on his position with regards to the written appeal of
Boris Berezovskiy to the leaders of various political parties. As is
known, in his appeal Berezovskiy expressed anxiety for the future of
the country and proposed that the left (CPRF etc.) and the right (SPS,
"Yabloko" etc.) parties consolidate a declaration about refusing to
participate in the parliamentary elections, which are supposed to take
place December 7, 2003, and appealed to his voters not to go to the
elections or even to vote against everybody. To this appeal, G.
Zyuganov replied in the following manner, "I can say that our country
is falling apart, branches of power are completely corrupt, the mass
media are not independent, dirt and lies are everywhere. I see only two
ways out of this situation." His first conclusion was that all the
people need to rise up and tell the RF government, "Get out! So how are
you in the government not able to manage even basic responsibilities?"
The second choice is to elect those in the election who are in a
position to correct the situation in Russia. By law, after the
elections are over and the votes are counted, the election committee
has to have a record and a copy, therefore the people, after the close
of the electoral district, needed to block their department until the
time when members of the voting commission give the people a copy of
the records. Perhaps then criminality and machinations will not reign.
"I can say that we can do this, we are against the devastation of the
country, and the people's block needs friendly support," underscored G.
Zyuganov.
The CPRF leader commented further on the situation about the hearsay
which the mass media was printing about the RF Communist Party being
connected with the Chechen terrorists and combatants. "The senior
terrorists are sitting in the Kremlin - this was Yeltsin. He began the
war in Chechnia, he issued the orders to shoot and wage war. The CPRF
was always against waging this war and against it unanimously, and also
submitted the proposal not to start the war, but raise the standard of
living for the people in the Chechen Republic," explained Zyuganov.
To the request of journalists to comment on the Yukos situation and, in
particular, the arrest of Mikhail Khodorkovskiy, G. Zyuganov replied as
follows, "There's nothing new for us or for me here. Like only
Khodorkovskiy decided to get involved in politics, V.V. saw in it
competition at the elections. That's all."
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| User: "Ash" |
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| Title: Re: Atheists on Atheism |
18 Jul 2005 07:29:07 PM |
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Tom P wrote:
Following are the words of atheists on atheism; atheists describing their
atheism; the necessity for their atheism; the fact that atheism is the
necessary prerequisite of materialism; and the objectives of their atheist
movement.
I just thought that atheists wouldn't mind at all if I quoted and posted
some of the leading atheists in world history. Incidentally, three of the
atheists I quote here became heads of governments during the 20th century,
and actually applied their atheist ideals and goals to the populations of
these modern nation states.
any particular reason for doing so?
.
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| User: "Tom P" |
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| Title: Re: Atheists on Atheism |
18 Jul 2005 09:36:40 PM |
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"Ash" <ashamanic@winterfell73.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:dbhhge$1ut$2@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
Tom P wrote:
Following are the words of atheists on atheism; atheists describing
their
atheism; the necessity for their atheism; the fact that atheism is the
necessary prerequisite of materialism; and the objectives of their
atheist
movement.
I just thought that atheists wouldn't mind at all if I quoted and posted
some of the leading atheists in world history. Incidentally, three of
the
atheists I quote here became heads of governments during the 20th
century,
and actually applied their atheist ideals and goals to the populations
of
these modern nation states.
any particular reason for doing so?
Why do I need a reason?
If you insist upon a reason, how about this one? Exercising my
constitutional right to freedom of expression.
.
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| User: "GoDrex" |
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| Title: Re: Atheists on Atheism |
18 Jul 2005 10:44:46 PM |
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"Tom P" <t_h_om_as_p@iyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:42dc63dc$0$22361$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com...
"Ash" <ashamanic@winterfell73.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:dbhhge$1ut$2@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
Tom P wrote:
Following are the words of atheists on atheism; atheists describing
their
atheism; the necessity for their atheism; the fact that atheism is the
necessary prerequisite of materialism; and the objectives of their
atheist
movement.
I just thought that atheists wouldn't mind at all if I quoted and
posted
some of the leading atheists in world history. Incidentally, three of
the
atheists I quote here became heads of governments during the 20th
century,
and actually applied their atheist ideals and goals to the populations
of
these modern nation states.
any particular reason for doing so?
Why do I need a reason?
If you insist upon a reason, how about this one? Exercising my
constitutional right to freedom of expression.
but what are you trying to express?
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| User: "Wayne Delia" |
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| Title: Re: Atheists on Atheism |
18 Jul 2005 11:40:35 PM |
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GoDrex wrote:
any particular reason for doing so?
Why do I need a reason?
If you insist upon a reason, how about this one? Exercising my
constitutional right to freedom of expression.
but what are you trying to express?
It appears to me that he's too cowardly to specify it, but rather is
willing to let people read into it what they will (or what they prefer
to hear), such as identifying the authors as "leading atheists" and
letting people infer that the authors are therefore "atheist leaders"
spouting doctrine which, presumably, is necessarily held by anyone
identifying themselves as an atheist. That'll appeal to anyone holding
the opposite view, theism, and theists are aware how tightly they hold
to their own doctrine. What he's actually presented is nothing more than
Communism 101, which he is equivocating with atheism. Personally, I
don't need any leaders at all to disbelieve in gods of any kind. I just
chalk it up to a typical frustrated Christian blowhard who has had his
feelings hurt somewhere along the way, and is now loaded for bear with
nothing to aim at.
--
Wayne Delia,
Delta Iota Chapter Advisor, Phi Kappa Sigma at Marist College
"Don't eat me! I have a wife and kids! Eat them!" (Homer Simpson)
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| User: "Greywolf" |
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| Title: Re: Atheists on Atheism |
19 Jul 2005 10:32:47 PM |
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"Wayne Delia" <> wrote in message
news:7v%Ce.1262$SZ3.1181@trndny02...
GoDrex wrote:
any particular reason for doing so?
Why do I need a reason?
If you insist upon a reason, how about this one? Exercising my
constitutional right to freedom of expression.
but what are you trying to express?
It appears to me that he's too cowardly to specify it, but rather is
willing to let people read into it what they will (or what they prefer to
hear), such as identifying the authors as "leading atheists" and letting
people infer that the authors are therefore "atheist leaders" spouting
doctrine which, presumably, is necessarily held by anyone identifying
themselves as an atheist. That'll appeal to anyone holding the opposite
view, theism, and theists are aware how tightly they hold to their own
doctrine. What he's actually presented is nothing more than Communism 101,
which he is equivocating with atheism. Personally, I don't need any
leaders at all to disbelieve in gods of any kind. I just chalk it up to a
typical frustrated Christian blowhard who has had his feelings hurt
somewhere along the way, and is now loaded for bear with nothing to aim
at.
--
Wayne Delia,
Delta Iota Chapter Advisor, Phi Kappa Sigma at Marist College
"Don't eat me! I have a wife and kids! Eat them!" (Homer Simpson)
I agree with the leaderless part of atheism. Atheists are independent
almost to a fault. That's good! What bothers me though is that the
religious right has a lot of political clout right now and are hell-bent
on imposing their will on the rest of us. They don't give a damn about any
rational arguments we may put up.In fact, they, for the most part, simply
ignore them. They hate atheists and are just too irrational to just sit
back and do nothing about. I think confronting them in the various NG's is
the best way to get the more open-minded among them to think more clearly
and recognize that their belief-system is seriously flawed. This
"frustrated Christian blowhard" is loaded for bear alright, but I do have
something to aim at - religious ignorance and intolerance.
Greywolf
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| User: "Wayne Delia" |
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| Title: Re: Atheists on Atheism |
19 Jul 2005 11:09:31 PM |
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Greywolf wrote:
I agree with the leaderless part of atheism. Atheists are independent
almost to a fault. That's good!
"Conspiracy? We couldn't even agree on lunch!" (Abbie Hoffman, at the
trial of the Chicago Seven)
--
Wayne Delia,
Delta Iota Chapter Advisor, Phi Kappa Sigma at Marist College
"Don't eat me! I have a wife and kids! Eat them!" (Homer Simpson)
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| User: "Robibnikoff" |
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| Title: Re: Atheists on Atheism |
19 Jul 2005 08:52:56 AM |
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"Tom P" <t_h_om_as_p@iyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:42dc63dc$0$22361$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com...
"Ash" <ashamanic@winterfell73.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:dbhhge$1ut$2@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
Tom P wrote:
Following are the words of atheists on atheism; atheists describing
their
atheism; the necessity for their atheism; the fact that atheism is the
necessary prerequisite of materialism; and the objectives of their
atheist
movement.
I just thought that atheists wouldn't mind at all if I quoted and
posted
some of the leading atheists in world history. Incidentally, three of
the
atheists I quote here became heads of governments during the 20th
century,
and actually applied their atheist ideals and goals to the populations
of
these modern nation states.
any particular reason for doing so?
Why do I need a reason?
Question too hard to answer, I see.
--
------
Robyn
Resident Witchypoo
#1557
Science doesn't burn people at the stake for disagreeing - Vic Sagerquist
.
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| User: "Ash" |
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| Title: Re: Atheists on Atheism |
19 Jul 2005 10:25:32 AM |
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Robibnikoff wrote:
"Tom P" <t_h_om_as_p@iyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:42dc63dc$0$22361$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com...
"Ash" <ashamanic@winterfell73.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:dbhhge$1ut$2@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
Tom P wrote:
Following are the words of atheists on atheism; atheists describing
their
atheism; the necessity for their atheism; the fact that atheism is the
necessary prerequisite of materialism; and the objectives of their
atheist
movement.
I just thought that atheists wouldn't mind at all if I quoted and
posted
some of the leading atheists in world history. Incidentally, three of
the
atheists I quote here became heads of governments during the 20th
century,
and actually applied their atheist ideals and goals to the populations
of
these modern nation states.
any particular reason for doing so?
Why do I need a reason?
Question too hard to answer, I see.
He seemed to think "because I can" a good reason. no, because it was
interesting/educational/informative, or even that it might annoy people,
just "because I can"
.
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| User: "Greywolf" |
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| Title: Re: Atheists on Atheism |
19 Jul 2005 12:43:41 AM |
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"Tom P" <t_h_om_as_p@iyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:42dc63dc$0$22361$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com...
"Ash" <ashamanic@winterfell73.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:dbhhge$1ut$2@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
Tom P wrote:
Following are the words of atheists on atheism; atheists describing
their
atheism; the necessity for their atheism; the fact that atheism is the
necessary prerequisite of materialism; and the objectives of their
atheist
movement.
I just thought that atheists wouldn't mind at all if I quoted and
posted
some of the leading atheists in world history. Incidentally, three of
the
atheists I quote here became heads of governments during the 20th
century,
and actually applied their atheist ideals and goals to the populations
of
these modern nation states.
any particular reason for doing so?
Why do I need a reason?
If you insist upon a reason, how about this one? Exercising my
constitutional right to freedom of expression.
You sure do! But why did you *really* post your message? I'll tell you part
of the reason why. It's because you want to insult us atheists in a hateful
way. You can't call us "fags," because you are probably aware that the
majority of atheists are heterosexual. You can't call us "stupid," because
you know better. You can't call us "violent" or "murderous" (as some of your
ilk have) because you know that, in the main, that is not true as well. You
equate Atheism with Communism because you think *that* is the one thing that
will hurt us and you want to rub our nose in it. Deep down inside, however,
you know we atheists can kick your sorry-***** theological asses any day of
the week. And that hurts *you*! Get over it. And, next time, post something
when you have something *important* to say.
Greywolf
.
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| User: "Tom P" |
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| Title: Re: Atheists on Atheism |
22 Jul 2005 02:28:32 PM |
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"Greywolf" <greywolf@cybrzn.com> wrote in message
news:11dp4ogjlrpvh33@corp.supernews.com...
"Tom P" <t_h_om_as_p@iyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:42dc63dc$0$22361$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com...
"Ash" <ashamanic@winterfell73.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:dbhhge$1ut$2@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
Tom P wrote:
Following are the words of atheists on atheism; atheists describing
their
atheism; the necessity for their atheism; the fact that atheism is
the
necessary prerequisite of materialism; and the objectives of their
atheist
movement.
I just thought that atheists wouldn't mind at all if I quoted and
posted
some of the leading atheists in world history. Incidentally, three
of
the
atheists I quote here became heads of governments during the 20th
century,
and actually applied their atheist ideals and goals to the
populations
of
these modern nation states.
any particular reason for doing so?
Why do I need a reason?
If you insist upon a reason, how about this one? Exercising my
constitutional right to freedom of expression.
You sure do! But why did you *really* post your message? I'll tell you
part
of the reason why. It's because you want to insult us atheists in a
hateful
way. You can't call us "fags," because you are probably aware that the
majority of atheists are heterosexual. You can't call us "stupid," because
you know better. You can't call us "violent" or "murderous" (as some of
your
ilk have) because you know that, in the main, that is not true as well.
You
equate Atheism with Communism because you think *that* is the one thing
that
will hurt us and you want to rub our nose in it. Deep down inside,
however,
you know we atheists can kick your sorry-***** theological asses any day of
the week. And that hurts *you*! Get over it. And, next time, post
something
when you have something *important* to say.
Greywolf
And I thought you atheist fellas supported liberty of conscience and freedom
of expression. It seems my tolerance of your atheism is far greater than
your tolerance for my theism. (With thanks to T. Cross)
Didn't Lenin, Stalin, Mao, and a few other atheist mass murderers practice
kicking "sorry-***** theological asses"? Yes, it's a fact they did. On way
too many days. Over far too many years. And left far more corpses behind
than any Christians or Moslems. Those are simply the facts as they are. So
much for the much ballyhooed ethical superiority of atheism.
And I believe I shall post whatever, whenever, and wherever I damned well
please. How can you stop me? So much for atheist notions of tolerance, eh?
.
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
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| Title: Re: Atheists on Atheism |
22 Jul 2005 02:38:56 PM |
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On Fri, 22 Jul 2005 14:28:32 -0500, "Tom P" <t_h_om_as_p@iyahoo.com>
wrote:
And I thought you atheist fellas supported liberty of conscience and freedom
of expression. It seems my tolerance of your atheism is far greater than
your tolerance for my theism. (With thanks to T. Cross)
The paranoia of a liar who pretends he is treated like the ***** he
shows himself in every post, is because he is Christian.
When in reality he is treated like an anal sphincter for being a
rectal orifice.
Didn't Lenin, Stalin, Mao, and a few other atheist mass murderers practice
kicking "sorry-***** theological asses"? Yes, it's a fact they did. On way
too many days. Over far too many years. And left far more corpses behind
than any Christians or Moslems. Those are simply the facts as they are. So
much for the much ballyhooed ethical superiority of atheism.
What "ballyhooed ethical superiority of atheism", liar?
What does not believing in Santa Claus make you do, liar?
And I believe I shall post whatever, whenever, and wherever I damned well
please. How can you stop me? So much for atheist notions of tolerance, eh?
Translation: you will continue to be an -in-your-face nasty liar.
You imagine tolerance means we have to put up with your bigoted
nastiness?
.
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| User: "Wayne Delia" |
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| Title: Re: Atheists on Atheism |
22 Jul 2005 05:30:43 PM |
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Christopher A. Lee wrote:
On Fri, 22 Jul 2005 14:28:32 -0500, "Tom P" <t_h_om_as_p@iyahoo.com>
wrote:
And I thought you atheist fellas supported liberty of conscience and freedom
of expression. It seems my tolerance of your atheism is far greater than
your tolerance for my theism. (With thanks to T. Cross)
The paranoia of a liar who pretends he is treated like the ***** he
shows himself in every post, is because he is Christian.
When in reality he is treated like an anal sphincter for being a
rectal orifice.
In this respect he reminds me very much of David Sears: a Christian who
acts like an ***** on alt.atheism, and claims he's persecuted when
people point out he's an *****.
--
Wayne Delia,
Delta Iota Chapter Advisor, Phi Kappa Sigma at Marist College
"Don't eat me! I have a wife and kids! Eat them!" (Homer Simpson)
.
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: Atheists on Atheism |
18 Jul 2005 11:07:27 PM |
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In episode <42dc63dc$0$22361$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com>, Tom P burst
into the room and exclaimed:
"Ash" <ashamanic@winterfell73.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:dbhhge$1ut$2@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
Tom P wrote:
Following are the words of atheists on atheism; atheists describing
their
atheism; the necessity for their atheism; the fact that atheism is the
necessary prerequisite of materialism; and the objectives of their
atheist
movement.
I just thought that atheists wouldn't mind at all if I quoted and
posted some of the leading atheists in world history. Incidentally,
three of
the
atheists I quote here became heads of governments during the 20th
century,
and actually applied their atheist ideals and goals to the populations
of
these modern nation states.
any particular reason for doing so?
Why do I need a reason?
If you insist upon a reason, how about this one? Exercising my
constitutional right to freedom of expression.
Yawn.
Newsgroups are carried on private systems. There is no censorship where no
government is party. This is a nonstarter.
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
--------------------------------------------------
"Come to think of it, there are already a million
monkeys on a million typewriters, and the Usenet
is NOTHING like Shakespeare!" -- Blair Houghton
.
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| User: "Kate " |
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| Title: Re: Atheists on Atheism |
18 Jul 2005 11:31:01 PM |
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On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 21:36:40 -0500, "Tom P" <t_h_om_as_p@iyahoo.com>
wrote:
"Ash" <ashamanic@winterfell73.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:dbhhge$1ut$2@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
Tom P wrote:
Following are the words of atheists on atheism; atheists describing
their
atheism; the necessity for their atheism; the fact that atheism is the
necessary prerequisite of materialism; and the objectives of their
atheist
movement.
I just thought that atheists wouldn't mind at all if I quoted and posted
some of the leading atheists in world history. Incidentally, three of
the
atheists I quote here became heads of governments during the 20th
century,
and actually applied their atheist ideals and goals to the populations
of
these modern nation states.
any particular reason for doing so?
Why do I need a reason?
If you insist upon a reason, how about this one? Exercising my
constitutional right to freedom of expression.
Expressing what? You seem afraid to state the conclusion you keep
implying.
If you have nothing to say except a bunch of unrelated irrelevant
quotes, you pretty much aren't worth bothering with.
.
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| User: "Tom P" |
|
| Title: Re: Atheists on Atheism |
22 Jul 2005 02:25:50 PM |
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"Kate " <cobalt@newscene.com> wrote in message
news:42e0814d.186186109@news-west.newscene.com...
On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 21:36:40 -0500, "Tom P" <t_h_om_as_p@iyahoo.com>
wrote:
"Ash" <ashamanic@winterfell73.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:dbhhge$1ut$2@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
Tom P wrote:
Following are the words of atheists on atheism; atheists describing
their
atheism; the necessity for their atheism; the fact that atheism is
the
necessary prerequisite of materialism; and the objectives of their
atheist
movement.
I just thought that atheists wouldn't mind at all if I quoted and
posted
some of the leading atheists in world history. Incidentally, three
of
the
atheists I quote here became heads of governments during the 20th
century,
and actually applied their atheist ideals and goals to the
populations
of
these modern nation states.
any particular reason for doing so?
Why do I need a reason?
If you insist upon a reason, how about this one? Exercising my
constitutional right to freedom of expression.
Expressing what? You seem afraid to state the conclusion you keep
implying.
If you have nothing to say except a bunch of unrelated irrelevant
quotes, you pretty much aren't worth bothering with.
Then why did you bother?
.
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