Religions > Atheism > British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions
| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"J Young" |
| Date: |
12 Sep 2006 11:44:44 PM |
| Object: |
British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention to.
http://www.lifenews.com/nat2579.html
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between April
and early July.
Just 26 said they had a few or no regrets about their abortions, including
one 74 year-old woman who had three abortions in the 1960s and 70s and
another who had aborted twins.
Of that small group of women, they indicated they had no other alternative
than the abortion or said it was the "right thing" at that moment in their
lives. Still, many said they would not want to do it again. Nine other women
said they were undecided about their abortion experiences.
However, 204 of the 248 women said they deeply regretted their abortions.
LIFE asked 96 women in a follow-up survey whether they would have gone
through with the abortion had they known the medical and emotional problems
abortions can cause. Sixty-four of the women answered no and most very
emphatically.
Virtually all of the women said that women considering abortions should be
given more information on potential problems. Most said they were only told
there would be an inordinate amount of bleeding but were given little or no
counseling or information.
The survey found some of the women who had abortions had severe problems
afterwards, including 14 who had seriously contemplated or attempted
suicide, 15 who had developed alcohol addictions, and three who had severe
eating disorders.
Five confessed to abusing drugs, several had emotional breakdowns and
another four said they got pregnant again quickly to have "atonement"
babies.
LIFE reported that most women reported the kind of post-abortion syndrome
issues abortion advocates routinely deny, including anger, shame, guilt,
self-hatred, loss of confidence, nightmares, flashbacks, and the pain of
anniversaries.
Some of the comments from women who regretted their abortions included: "it
completely ruined my life", "I felt crippled, crucified, stupid, insane," "I
felt dirty and ashamed," "I'm totally grief-stricken, I want my baby and I
feel like a monster," "it was the worst mistake of my life... I cry all the
time," "every baby I see I yearn for the one I got rid of."
Most of the women surveyed said they were treated poorly by abortion
facility staff.
They talked about being treated "like cattle," "conveyor-belted" and "pushed
by bossy nurses."
"They described the bleak atmosphere of waiting rooms and abortion clinics,
and how they were often crying when they came round from the anesthetic,"
LIFE reported.
One woman talked about having an abortion with the mifepristone abortion
drug. She discussed how she gave birth to her dead baby at a gas station and
flushed the baby's body down the toilet.
Women's abortion regrets did not seem to vary based on how long ago they had
the abortion.
A 61-year-old had had her abortion in 1970 and still feels "very guilty and
sad"; another 30 years on and [has] never stopped grieving." Some of the
women had their abortion less than a year ago and already have strong
negative emotional reactions.
--
----------
J Yöung
youngopinions@aol.com
.
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| User: "Ray Fischer" |
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| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Did Not Regret Abortions |
14 Sep 2006 12:12:17 PM |
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J Young <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention to.
Pro-lie propaganda?
Why do you hate the truth?
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision years
down the road.
========================================================================
THE MYTH OF POST-ABORTION TRAUMA
by Henry P David PhD
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Induced abortion is one of the oldest forms of fertility regulation.
Perhaps no other elective procedure has evoked as much public debate,
generated such emotional and moral controversy or received greater
sustained attention from the media. As has long been recognised, there
is no psychologically painless way of coping with an unwanted pregnancy.
While an abortion may elicit feelings of regret, guilt or loss, an
alternative solution, such as a forced marriage, giving a baby up for
adoption or adding an unwanted child to an already strained partner
relationship, is also likely to be accompanied by psychological problems
for the woman, the child and society.
Of all the complications of abortion, psychological responses are the
most difficult to assess and evaluatepfar more so than mortality and
morbidity statistics. Assuming that psychiatric or psychological
morbidity is a real and measurable phenomenon, the explanation for the
wide range of opinions expressed in the literature may well lie in the
inadequacy of much of the published work. Included in the scientific
deficiencies are an overemphasis on clinical case histories that ignore
the large majority of women who terminate unwanted pregnancies and never
seek post-operative mental health consultation; the absence of
standardised follow-up procedures; failure to reach consensus on
diagnostic psychological criteria; or disagreement on psychological
variables related to the sociocultural context within which the abortion
decision occurs. Differing political, moral, ethical and religious
perspectives impinge on how abortion is perceived by diverse observers.
Post-abortion trauma was initially described by Rue1 as a variant of
post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD). Subsequently it has been asserted
that in 1987 the American Psychiatric Association acknowledged in its
newly revised manual of diagnostic criteria, the Diagnostic and
Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders III-R (DSM-III-R) that abortion
is a type of 'psychosocial stressor.' However, the American Psychiatric
Association never published a statement suggesting this. Neither the
1987 nor the 1994 revision of the APA Diagnostic and Statistical Manual
(DSM III-R and IV) mention abortion in relation to post-traumatic stress
disorder. Indeed, the only mention of abortion in DSM IV is spontaneous
abortion.
As defined by the APA, PTSD is a disabling condition 'following exposure
to an extreme traumatic stressor involving direct personal experience of
an event that involves actual or threatened death or serious injury'.
Likely stressors cited by APA as examples of PTSD include military
combat, violent personal assault, terrorist attack, and being held
hostage. It is quite a stretch to claim abortion as a stressor likely to
induce PTSD.
Usdin2, one of the major developers of the concept of post-traumatic
stress disorder noted that one of the criteria for PTSD is experiencing
'an event that is outside the range of usual human experience and that
would be markedly distressing to almost anyone.' Considering that more
than 30 million women in the USA and four million women in the UK have
experienced abortion since its legalisation it can hardly be said that
the abortion experience is outside the range of usual human experience.
There has been no reported increase in public or private mental health
services for women attributing their current psychological problems to
abortion.
The rationale for post-abortion syndrome (PAS) was developed by A C
Speckhard in 1985 in an unpublished thesis based on interviews with 30
women recruited for her doctoral dissertation in sociology at the
University of Minnesota. The women had been recruited because they
deemed their abortion experience to have been 'highly stressful'. The
time between the retrospective account and the most recent abortion
varied from one to 25 years. Both legal and clandestine abortions were
included. 46 per cent of the sample had second trimester abortions and
four per cent experienced third trimester terminations, both known to be
more psychologically stressful than first trimester procedures. Whereas
over 90 per cent of all women having abortions in 1990 had them in the
first trimester, only 50 per cent of Speckhard's sample reported first
trimester abortions. More than nine out of 10 (92 per cent) of the women
recalled feelings of anger, hostility or rage toward individuals
(including partner, medical professionals and significant others) who
were perceived as having been coercive in the abortion decision-making
process. Moreover, 96 per cent of the subjects 'regarded abortion as the
taking of a life or as murder,' an observation very likely to heighten
feelings of guilt and perceptions of stress. Speckhard later cautioned
readers that 'the generalisability of the results is severely limited by
the size of the sample and the sampling methodology,' adding that 'the
results presented do not necessarily apply to all women who have
abortions, or even to that proportion of women who are highly stressed
following abortion.' It was indeed an atypical sample.
Recognising the political, ethical and moral issues intertwined with
abortion and in response to questions raised in the United States
Congress about the medical and mental health effects of abortion, the
American Psychological Association, in 1989, convened an expert panel to
examine psychological factors. The panel's mission was not to assess
values but to consider the best available evidence on psychological
responses to abortion. It focused on studies with the most rigorous
research designs, reporting findings on the psychological status of
women who had legal abortions under non-restrictive circumstances, that
is, on request in the first trimester and not solely on grounds of
physical or mental health.
The panel found that psychological distress is generally greatest before
the abortion when the woman has to decide how to resolve an unwanted
pregnancy. Responses after abortion reflect the range of psychological
experience and the resources a woman has for coping with negative life
events. While there may be temporary sensations of regret, sadness or
guilt the weight of the evidence indicates that legal abortion of an
unwanted pregnancy in the first trimester does not pose a severe
psychological hazard for the vast majority of women. Indeed, most women
report experiencing a feeling of reliefpof anxiety lifted.
A longer term study3 found that the wellbeing of 773 women, interviewed
annually in a national sample of 5,295 women, was unrelated to their
abortion experience eight years earlier. Women who had had an abortion
had a statistically significant higher global self-esteem rating than
women who had never had an abortion. This difference was even greater
when comparing aborting women with those delivering unwanted pregnancies
(who had the lowest self-esteem). Women who had experienced repeat
abortions did not differ in self-esteem from women who had never had an
abortion. In all, the evidence confirmed earlier findings that factors
other than the abortion experience itself determine post abortion
emotional status, particularly how a woman perceives her pregnancy and
how she believes it to be perceived in her immediate social environment.
Some women continually reconstruct and reinterpret past events in the
light of subsequent experience and can be pressured into feeling guilt
and shame long afterwards.
Denmark offers unique opportunities for research in reproductive health
because it has a uniform national population registration system that
provides access to national abortion, birth and admission to psychiatric
hospital registers. Linkage among these registers makes it possible to
compare the risks of psychiatric hospital admission following abortion
and childbirth. However, because there may be a bias against
hospitalising a new mother, particularly if she is nursing, the relative
psychological risk of abortion compared with childbirth may be
exaggerated by using hospital admission as an operational indicator of
psychiatric illness.
Controlling for previous psychiatric history, first time psychiatric
hospital admissions were tracked three months post-abortion and
postpartum and for all other women experiencing no fertility event under
age 50 residing in Denmark. Data were obtained on 27,234 women
terminating pregnancy, 71,378 women carrying to term and the total
population of 1,169,819 women 15-49 years old.4
Among women who were married or living in a stable partner relationship,
the post-pregnancy risk of admission to a psychiatric hospital was about
the same for abortions or deliveries: approximately 1.3 per 1,000
abortions and 1.2 per 1,000 deliveries. While the difference between
rates for abortions and deliveries was not statistically significant,
the rate for the total population of women was considerably lower (0.7
per 1,000). Among a smaller group of separated, divorced or widowed
women, those who had terminated pregnancies showed a substantially
higher psychiatric admission rate (6.4 per 1,000) than did separated,
divorced or widowed women carrying to term (1.7 per 1,000). Women who
are divorced, separated or widowed may be relatively more likely to be
terminating pregnancies that were originally intended, placing them at
higher risk for negative post-abortion psychological reactions. However,
in the aggregate, there appeared to be little risk to psychological
wellbeing after
either abortion or delivery in Denmark.
In a longer term (up to 11 years) prospective cohort study5 of 13,261
women, organised jointly by the Royal Colleges of Obstetricians and
Gynaecologists and of General Practitioners in the United Kingdom, there
were four comparison groups: 6,151 women who did not request abortion,
6,410 who obtained an abortion, 379 whose request for abortion was
denied, and 371 who requested an abortion and then changed their minds.
Among the study's key findings were that (a) among women with equivalent
past psychiatric histories there were no significant differences between
the comparison groups in overall rates of psychiatric illness; (b) women
with a previous history of psychosis were more likely to experience a
psychotic episode during the period of the study than those who had no
such history and that termination of pregnancy did not appear to
increase the risk; (c) women with a past history of non-psychotic
disorder or no history of psychiatric disorder who had a termination
were significantly less likely to have a psychotic episode than those
who did not request a termination; and (d) in women with no previous
history of psychosis the risk of psychosis after termination appeared to
be lower than after childbirth.
The authors note that many women were lost to follow-up during the study
and that at the end just 2,122 (34.4 per cent) of the termination group
and 3,000 (42.4 per cent) of those who did not request a termination
were still under observation but that comparisons between the groups
were still valid.
Severe psychological reactions after abortion are infrequent. Psychoses
are very uncommon, being reported in only 0.3 to 1.2 per 1,000 legal
abortions. Individual case studies and anecdotal reports of severe
stress or psychopathology following abortion abound in some of the
literature but there is no clear evidence of causal linkage to abortion.
While such responses can be emotionally overwhelming for the woman
concerned and for her family, the number of such cases is very small,
and has been characterised by former US Surgeon General C Everett Koop
as 'minuscule from a public health perspective'. Women identified in the
research literature as being at some risk for negative psychological
reactionspand in potential need of special counsellingpare those who
terminate a very much wanted pregnancy for medical reasons; lack support
from partners or parents for their decision; were coerced into making a
decision they subsequently regretted; are conflicted about deeply held
religious values; are uncertain of their coping abilities beforehand;
blame themselves for the pregnancy; delay into the second trimester or
had a previous psychiatric episode.
For the vast majority of women, an abortion will be followed by a
mixture of emotions, with a predominance of positive feelings. This
holds immediately after abortion and for some time afterward. Little is
known about very long term effects beyond 10 years. However, the
positive picture reported up to eight years after abortion makes it
unlikely that more negative responses will emerge later. Severe negative
reactions are rare. The time of greatest stress is likely to be before
the abortion decision is made. In all, evidence from the research
literature suggests that, in the aggregate, legal abortion of an
unwanted pregnancy in the first trimester does not pose a psychological
hazard for most women. They tend to cope successfully and go on with
their lives. There is, as yet, no credible evidence for the existence of
post-abortion syndrome.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
1Rue VM. Abortion and family relations, Testimony presented before the
Subcommittee on the Constitution, US Senate Judiciary Committee, US
Senate, 97th Congress, Washington DC 1981.
2Usdin G. Psychiatry, letters, February 1990.
3Russo NF, Zierk KL. Abortion, childbearing and women's well-being,
Professional Psychology: Research and Practice 1992, 23: 269-280.
4David HP. Post-abortion and postpartum psychiatric hospitalisation in R
Porter and M O'Connor (eds) Abortion: Medical progress and social
implications Ciba Symposium No 45 London, Pitman 1985,150-161.
5Gilchrist AC, Hannaford PC, Frank P, Kay CR. Termination of pregnancy
and psychiatric morbidity, British Journal of Psychiatry 1995, 167:
243-248.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Prepared for presentation at the international conference on abortion,
Abortion Matters, in Amsterdam, The Netherlands, 27-29 March 1996. An
expanded, fully referenced version of this paper is available from Birth
Control Trust.
--
Ray Fischer
rfischer@sonic.net
.
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| User: "Parsifal" |
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| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
13 Sep 2006 07:14:45 AM |
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J Young schrieb:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention to.
Let's see where our nazi turd takes his source...
http://www.lifenews.com/nat2579.html
Ah yes, another model of objective information.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision yea=
rs
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between Apr=
il
and early July.
Just 26 said they had a few or no regrets about their abortions, including
one 74 year-old woman who had three abortions in the 1960s and 70s and
another who had aborted twins.
Of that small group of women, they indicated they had no other alternative
than the abortion or said it was the "right thing" at that moment in their
lives. Still, many said they would not want to do it again. Nine other wo=
men
said they were undecided about their abortion experiences.
However, 204 of the 248 women said they deeply regretted their abortions.
LIFE asked 96 women in a follow-up survey whether they would have gone
through with the abortion had they known the medical and emotional proble=
ms
abortions can cause. Sixty-four of the women answered no and most very
emphatically.
Virtually all of the women said that women considering abortions should be
given more information on potential problems. Most said they were only to=
ld
there would be an inordinate amount of bleeding but were given little or =
no
counseling or information.
The survey found some of the women who had abortions had severe problems
afterwards, including 14 who had seriously contemplated or attempted
suicide, 15 who had developed alcohol addictions, and three who had severe
eating disorders.
Five confessed to abusing drugs, several had emotional breakdowns and
another four said they got pregnant again quickly to have "atonement"
babies.
LIFE reported that most women reported the kind of post-abortion syndrome
issues abortion advocates routinely deny, including anger, shame, guilt,
self-hatred, loss of confidence, nightmares, flashbacks, and the pain of
anniversaries.
Some of the comments from women who regretted their abortions included: "=
it
completely ruined my life", "I felt crippled, crucified, stupid, insane,"=
"I
felt dirty and ashamed," "I'm totally grief-stricken, I want my baby and I
feel like a monster," "it was the worst mistake of my life... I cry all t=
he
time," "every baby I see I yearn for the one I got rid of."
Most of the women surveyed said they were treated poorly by abortion
facility staff.
They talked about being treated "like cattle," "conveyor-belted" and "pus=
hed
by bossy nurses."
"They described the bleak atmosphere of waiting rooms and abortion clinic=
s,
and how they were often crying when they came round from the anesthetic,"
LIFE reported.
One woman talked about having an abortion with the mifepristone abortion
drug. She discussed how she gave birth to her dead baby at a gas station =
and
flushed the baby's body down the toilet.
Women's abortion regrets did not seem to vary based on how long ago they =
had
the abortion.
A 61-year-old had had her abortion in 1970 and still feels "very guilty a=
nd
sad"; another 30 years on and [has] never stopped grieving." Some of the
women had their abortion less than a year ago and already have strong
negative emotional reactions.
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
--=20
----------
=20
J Y=F6ung
youngopinions@aol.com
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| User: "Martin" |
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| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women RegrettedAbortions |
13 Sep 2006 05:04:26 AM |
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J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
.
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| User: "osprey" |
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| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
13 Sep 2006 05:34:06 AM |
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Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
Second - the problem with these surveys, regardless of who takes them;
they are not reliable and therefore they are not valid. You can have a
survey that shows women do not regret their abortions, and it STILL
wouldn't be a valid and/or reliable survey.
Any survey should be read with caution and be questioned.
.
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| User: "David W. Barnes" |
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| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
13 Sep 2006 09:53:21 AM |
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In article <1158143646.014336.269670@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com>,
osprey <noneedtoknow@mail.com> wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision
years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between
April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
Second - the problem with these surveys, regardless of who takes them;
they are not reliable and therefore they are not valid. You can have a
survey that shows women do not regret their abortions, and it STILL
wouldn't be a valid and/or reliable survey.
And THIRD, it doesn't matter if they regret them or not. It is THERE
CHOICE! Stop acting like you have some authority to tell women what to
do.
.
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| User: "Attila" |
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| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
13 Sep 2006 07:00:14 AM |
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On 13 Sep 2006 03:34:06 -0700, "osprey" <noneedtoknow@mail.com> in
alt.abortion with message-id
<1158143646.014336.269670@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
Do you think they would take a chance on getting a response they did
not want?
Most women simply go about their lives and don't bother to respond to
such questions. Those who have a hang up would tend to be more likely
to respond.
Such a voluntary 'advertisement' is useless no matter what the
response.
Second - the problem with these surveys, regardless of who takes them;
they are not reliable and therefore they are not valid. You can have a
survey that shows women do not regret their abortions, and it STILL
wouldn't be a valid and/or reliable survey.
Any survey should be read with caution and be questioned.
--
Pro-Choice is Pro-Freedom
.
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| User: "osprey" |
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| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
13 Sep 2006 10:06:12 AM |
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Attila wrote:
On 13 Sep 2006 03:34:06 -0700, "osprey" <noneedtoknow@mail.com> in
alt.abortion with message-id
<1158143646.014336.269670@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
Do you think they would take a chance on getting a response they did
not want?
Neither side would. That's another reason surveys can not be trusted.
Now speaking from personal knowledge, I do happen to know women who did
get an abortion, and all of them do regret it. That is not to say that
would be the same for all women. I am speaking only of the ones I have
talked to about this and who were willing to talk to me about it.
Most women simply go about their lives and don't bother to respond to
such questions. Those who have a hang up would tend to be more likely
to respond.
Such a voluntary 'advertisement' is useless no matter what the
response.
Second - the problem with these surveys, regardless of who takes them;
they are not reliable and therefore they are not valid. You can have a
survey that shows women do not regret their abortions, and it STILL
wouldn't be a valid and/or reliable survey.
Any survey should be read with caution and be questioned.
--
Pro-Choice is Pro-Freedom
.
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| User: "David W. Barnes" |
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| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
13 Sep 2006 10:27:11 AM |
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In article <1158159972.361971.186220@e63g2000cwd.googlegroups.com>,
osprey <noneedtoknow@mail.com> wrote:
Attila wrote:
On 13 Sep 2006 03:34:06 -0700, "osprey" <noneedtoknow@mail.com> in
alt.abortion with message-id
<1158143646.014336.269670@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention
to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the
experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision
years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded
indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between
April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
Do you think they would take a chance on getting a response they did
not want?
Neither side would. That's another reason surveys can not be trusted.
Now speaking from personal knowledge, I do happen to know women who did
get an abortion, and all of them do regret it. That is not to say that
would be the same for all women. I am speaking only of the ones I have
talked to about this and who were willing to talk to me about it.
Take the handcuffs off of them and see how cooperative they are.
.
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| User: "Osprey" |
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| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
13 Sep 2006 10:34:56 AM |
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"David W. Barnes" <dbarnes@aol.com> wrote in message
news:130920060827118925%dbarnes@aol.com...
In article <1158159972.361971.186220@e63g2000cwd.googlegroups.com>,
osprey <noneedtoknow@mail.com> wrote:
Attila wrote:
On 13 Sep 2006 03:34:06 -0700, "osprey" <noneedtoknow@mail.com> in
alt.abortion with message-id
<1158143646.014336.269670@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying
attention
to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the
experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their
decision
years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded
indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE
between
April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
Do you think they would take a chance on getting a response they did
not want?
Neither side would. That's another reason surveys can not be trusted.
Now speaking from personal knowledge, I do happen to know women who did
get an abortion, and all of them do regret it. That is not to say that
would be the same for all women. I am speaking only of the ones I have
talked to about this and who were willing to talk to me about it.
Take the handcuffs off of them and see how cooperative they are.
I am not into your sick perversions.
.
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| User: "Martin" |
|
| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women RegrettedAbortions |
13 Sep 2006 02:03:46 PM |
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|
Osprey wrote:
"David W. Barnes" <dbarnes@aol.com> wrote in message
Now speaking from personal knowledge, I do happen to know women who did
get an abortion, and all of them do regret it. That is not to say that
would be the same for all women. I am speaking only of the ones I have
talked to about this and who were willing to talk to me about it.
Take the handcuffs off of them and see how cooperative they are.
I am not into your sick perversions.
What's 'sick' about a bit of bondage?
.
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| User: "Attila" |
|
| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
13 Sep 2006 01:34:18 PM |
|
|
On 13 Sep 2006 08:06:12 -0700, "osprey" <noneedtoknow@mail.com> in
alt.abortion with message-id
<1158159972.361971.186220@e63g2000cwd.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Attila wrote:
On 13 Sep 2006 03:34:06 -0700, "osprey" <noneedtoknow@mail.com> in
alt.abortion with message-id
<1158143646.014336.269670@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
Do you think they would take a chance on getting a response they did
not want?
Neither side would. That's another reason surveys can not be trusted.
Now speaking from personal knowledge, I do happen to know women who did
get an abortion, and all of them do regret it.
I know women who got an abortion and none of them regret it.
That is not to say that
would be the same for all women. I am speaking only of the ones I have
talked to about this and who were willing to talk to me about it.
Most women simply go about their lives and don't bother to respond to
such questions. Those who have a hang up would tend to be more likely
to respond.
Such a voluntary 'advertisement' is useless no matter what the
response.
Second - the problem with these surveys, regardless of who takes them;
they are not reliable and therefore they are not valid. You can have a
survey that shows women do not regret their abortions, and it STILL
wouldn't be a valid and/or reliable survey.
Any survey should be read with caution and be questioned.
--
Pro-Choice is Pro-Freedom
--
Pro-Choice is Pro-Freedom
.
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| User: "checker player" |
|
| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
27 Sep 2006 11:41:44 AM |
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|
yeah well everyone does the right thing. nobody ever deliberately did what
they thought was the wrong thing. oh, they may have decided to do a bad
thing but they though it was the right thing at the time, so if they are
feeling regret now they've forgotten why they did it in the first place.
just my 2c. so lighten the ***** up.
"Attila" <<prochoice@here.now> wrote in message
news:2ojgg29ucl83hom303klu8ij5ue5bpee1b@4ax.com...
On 13 Sep 2006 08:06:12 -0700, "osprey" <noneedtoknow@mail.com> in
alt.abortion with message-id
<1158159972.361971.186220@e63g2000cwd.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Attila wrote:
On 13 Sep 2006 03:34:06 -0700, "osprey" <noneedtoknow@mail.com> in
alt.abortion with message-id
<1158143646.014336.269670@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying
attention to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the
experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their
decision years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded
indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE
between April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
Do you think they would take a chance on getting a response they did
not want?
Neither side would. That's another reason surveys can not be trusted.
Now speaking from personal knowledge, I do happen to know women who did
get an abortion, and all of them do regret it.
I know women who got an abortion and none of them regret it.
That is not to say that
would be the same for all women. I am speaking only of the ones I have
talked to about this and who were willing to talk to me about it.
Most women simply go about their lives and don't bother to respond to
such questions. Those who have a hang up would tend to be more likely
to respond.
Such a voluntary 'advertisement' is useless no matter what the
response.
Second - the problem with these surveys, regardless of who takes them;
they are not reliable and therefore they are not valid. You can have a
survey that shows women do not regret their abortions, and it STILL
wouldn't be a valid and/or reliable survey.
Any survey should be read with caution and be questioned.
--
Pro-Choice is Pro-Freedom
--
Pro-Choice is Pro-Freedom
.
|
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| User: "Attila" |
|
| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
27 Sep 2006 04:31:25 PM |
|
|
On Wed, 27 Sep 2006 16:41:44 GMT, "checker player"
<jlmullins73@earthlink.net> in alt.abortion with message-id
<cRxSg.6995$UG4.6993@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net> wrote:
"Attila" <<prochoice@here.now> wrote in message
news:2ojgg29ucl83hom303klu8ij5ue5bpee1b@4ax.com...
On 13 Sep 2006 08:06:12 -0700, "osprey" <noneedtoknow@mail.com> in
alt.abortion with message-id
<1158159972.361971.186220@e63g2000cwd.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Attila wrote:
On 13 Sep 2006 03:34:06 -0700, "osprey" <noneedtoknow@mail.com> in
alt.abortion with message-id
<1158143646.014336.269670@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying
attention to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the
experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their
decision years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded
indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE
between April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
Do you think they would take a chance on getting a response they did
not want?
Neither side would. That's another reason surveys can not be trusted.
Now speaking from personal knowledge, I do happen to know women who did
get an abortion, and all of them do regret it.
I know women who got an abortion and none of them regret it.
That is not to say that
would be the same for all women. I am speaking only of the ones I have
talked to about this and who were willing to talk to me about it.
Most women simply go about their lives and don't bother to respond to
such questions. Those who have a hang up would tend to be more likely
to respond.
Such a voluntary 'advertisement' is useless no matter what the
response.
Second - the problem with these surveys, regardless of who takes them;
they are not reliable and therefore they are not valid. You can have a
survey that shows women do not regret their abortions, and it STILL
wouldn't be a valid and/or reliable survey.
Any survey should be read with caution and be questioned.
--
Pro-Choice is Pro-Freedom
--
Pro-Choice is Pro-Freedom
yeah well everyone does the right thing. nobody ever deliberately did what
they thought was the wrong thing.
Right and wrong have no intrinsic values and will change from person
to person and over time.
oh, they may have decided to do a bad
thing but they though it was the right thing at the time, so if they are
feeling regret now they've forgotten why they did it in the first place.
And if they don't perhaps they feel they made the correct decision for
them.
just my 2c.
About what it is worth.
so lighten the ***** up.
As soon as this is no longer an issue.
This link explains what top posting is and why it is bad.
http://www.dickalba.demon.co.uk/usenet/guide/faq_topp.html
--
Pro-Choice is Pro-Freedom
.
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|
| User: "Martin" |
|
| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women RegrettedAbortions |
13 Sep 2006 07:03:39 AM |
|
|
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
yes we do, it says so in the report. Idiot!
.
|
|
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| User: "osprey" |
|
| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
13 Sep 2006 10:06:58 AM |
|
|
Martin wrote:
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
yes we do, it says so in the report. Idiot!
No, we don't. And for you to even pay attention to any survey proves
that you are the idiot. Surveys can not be trust, period!!!
.
|
|
|
| User: "David W. Barnes" |
|
| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
13 Sep 2006 10:27:12 AM |
|
|
In article <1158160018.348465.21710@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com>,
osprey <noneedtoknow@mail.com> wrote:
Martin wrote:
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention
to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the experiences
of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision
years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between
April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
yes we do, it says so in the report. Idiot!
No, we don't. And for you to even pay attention to any survey proves
that you are the idiot. Surveys can not be trust, period!!!
Osprey read that somewhere.
.
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| User: "Martin" |
|
| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women RegrettedAbortions |
13 Sep 2006 02:02:00 PM |
|
|
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
yes we do, it says so in the report. Idiot!
No, we don't.
so which part of "A British pro-life group placed advertisements in six
women's magazines ... Some 248 women replied to the ads ..."
makes you think it's not a self-selecting group?
And for you to even pay attention to any survey proves
that you are the idiot. Surveys can not be trust, period!!!
Strange then that large companies spend a fortune on properly conducted
surveys.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Osprey" |
|
| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
13 Sep 2006 03:28:02 PM |
|
|
"Martin" <usenet2@etiqa.co.uk> wrote in message
news:45085590$0$2506$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention
to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the
experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision
years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded
indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between
April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
yes we do, it says so in the report. Idiot!
No, we don't.
so which part of "A British pro-life group placed advertisements in six
women's magazines ... Some 248 women replied to the ads ..."
makes you think it's not a self-selecting group?
It's more reason to question the survey, but it doesn't necessarily mean
that only "pro-life" people answered.
And for you to even pay attention to any survey proves
that you are the idiot. Surveys can not be trust, period!!!
Strange then that large companies spend a fortune on properly conducted
surveys.
To get a general opinion. They are not reliable nor valid though. They can
and must always be questioned.
You can take a survey today, and next week take another survey and get
completely different results.
Take political candidate surveys and opinion polls for example.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Attila" |
|
| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
13 Sep 2006 04:21:05 PM |
|
|
On Wed, 13 Sep 2006 16:28:02 -0400, "Osprey" <noneedtoknow@mail.com>
in alt.abortion with message-id
<of-dnfxMm_ln9JXYnZ2dnUVZ_uydnZ2d@comcast.com> wrote:
"Martin" <usenet2@etiqa.co.uk> wrote in message
news:45085590$0$2506$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention
to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the
experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision
years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded
indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between
April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
yes we do, it says so in the report. Idiot!
No, we don't.
so which part of "A British pro-life group placed advertisements in six
women's magazines ... Some 248 women replied to the ads ..."
makes you think it's not a self-selecting group?
It's more reason to question the survey, but it doesn't necessarily mean
that only "pro-life" people answered.
I wonder about these so-called 'women's magazines'.
And for you to even pay attention to any survey proves
that you are the idiot. Surveys can not be trust, period!!!
Strange then that large companies spend a fortune on properly conducted
surveys.
To get a general opinion. They are not reliable nor valid though. They can
and must always be questioned.
You can take a survey today, and next week take another survey and get
completely different results.
Take political candidate surveys and opinion polls for example.
--
Pro-Choice is Pro-Freedom
.
|
|
|
| User: "osprey" |
|
| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
13 Sep 2006 11:50:31 PM |
|
|
Attila wrote:
On Wed, 13 Sep 2006 16:28:02 -0400, "Osprey" <noneedtoknow@mail.com>
in alt.abortion with message-id
<of-dnfxMm_ln9JXYnZ2dnUVZ_uydnZ2d@comcast.com> wrote:
"Martin" <usenet2@etiqa.co.uk> wrote in message
news:45085590$0$2506$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying attention
to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the
experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their decision
years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded
indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between
April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
yes we do, it says so in the report. Idiot!
No, we don't.
so which part of "A British pro-life group placed advertisements in six
women's magazines ... Some 248 women replied to the ads ..."
makes you think it's not a self-selecting group?
It's more reason to question the survey, but it doesn't necessarily mean
that only "pro-life" people answered.
I wonder about these so-called 'women's magazines'.
Like any magazine, they are probably very biased towards their own
agenda. The only source that might be trustworthy is one that comes
from a journal.
And for you to even pay attention to any survey proves
that you are the idiot. Surveys can not be trust, period!!!
Strange then that large companies spend a fortune on properly conducted
surveys.
To get a general opinion. They are not reliable nor valid though. They can
and must always be questioned.
You can take a survey today, and next week take another survey and get
completely different results.
Take political candidate surveys and opinion polls for example.
--
Pro-Choice is Pro-Freedom
.
|
|
|
| User: "David W. Barnes" |
|
| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
14 Sep 2006 12:06:20 AM |
|
|
In article <1158209431.145280.203150@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com>,
osprey <noneedtoknow@mail.com> wrote:
Attila wrote:
On Wed, 13 Sep 2006 16:28:02 -0400, "Osprey" <noneedtoknow@mail.com>
in alt.abortion with message-id
<of-dnfxMm_ln9JXYnZ2dnUVZ_uydnZ2d@comcast.com> wrote:
"Martin" <usenet2@etiqa.co.uk> wrote in message
news:45085590$0$2506$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying
attention
to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the
experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their
decision
years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded
indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions.
Some 248 women replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE
between
April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
yes we do, it says so in the report. Idiot!
No, we don't.
so which part of "A British pro-life group placed advertisements in six
women's magazines ... Some 248 women replied to the ads ..."
makes you think it's not a self-selecting group?
It's more reason to question the survey, but it doesn't necessarily mean
that only "pro-life" people answered.
I wonder about these so-called 'women's magazines'.
Like any magazine, they are probably very biased towards their own
agenda.
Do you think? Maybe that is why they call them "Women's Magazines."
LOL!
The only source that might be trustworthy is one that comes
from a journal.
LOL! Yeah - they have no agenda.
And for you to even pay attention to any survey proves
that you are the idiot. Surveys can not be trust, period!!!
Strange then that large companies spend a fortune on properly conducted
surveys.
To get a general opinion. They are not reliable nor valid though. They
can
and must always be questioned.
You can take a survey today, and next week take another survey and get
completely different results.
Take political candidate surveys and opinion polls for example.
--
Pro-Choice is Pro-Freedom
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "MarkA" |
|
| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
14 Sep 2006 08:41:19 AM |
|
|
On Wed, 13 Sep 2006 16:28:02 -0400, Osprey wrote:
"Martin" <usenet2@etiqa.co.uk> wrote in message
news:45085590$0$2506$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying
attention to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the
experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their
decision years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded
indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions. Some 248 women
replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
yes we do, it says so in the report. Idiot!
No, we don't.
so which part of "A British pro-life group placed advertisements in six
women's magazines ... Some 248 women replied to the ads ..."
makes you think it's not a self-selecting group?
It's more reason to question the survey, but it doesn't necessarily mean
that only "pro-life" people answered.
He's not saying that "only pro-life people answered." The point is that
survey sample consists of "women who have had an abortion and are
motivated to respond to a survey regarding their experience." Such a
population would be slanted toward those wanting to express a negative
opinion. Hence the term, 'self-selected'.
--
MarkA
(this space accidentally filled in)
.
|
|
|
| User: "osprey" |
|
| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
14 Sep 2006 11:18:36 AM |
|
|
MarkA wrote:
On Wed, 13 Sep 2006 16:28:02 -0400, Osprey wrote:
"Martin" <usenet2@etiqa.co.uk> wrote in message
news:45085590$0$2506$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying
attention to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the
experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their
decision years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded
indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions. Some 248 women
replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
yes we do, it says so in the report. Idiot!
No, we don't.
so which part of "A British pro-life group placed advertisements in six
women's magazines ... Some 248 women replied to the ads ..."
makes you think it's not a self-selecting group?
It's more reason to question the survey, but it doesn't necessarily mean
that only "pro-life" people answered.
He's not saying that "only pro-life people answered." The point is that
survey sample consists of "women who have had an abortion and are
motivated to respond to a survey regarding their experience." Such a
population would be slanted toward those wanting to express a negative
opinion. Hence the term, 'self-selected'.
Regardless, the survey isn't valid and is not reliable. No survey is.
Let me make one point clear. Many times I hear in here from radical
pro-choicers, that there are no women who regret having an abortion.
Fact is, there are and there are many. So what do you tell women who
abort and regret it? If the pro-choicer truly cares about the women,
as he or she claims, you would think they would be willing to do
something or try to, to help women who do regret having an abortion.
Which is why I am one of those who do support a minimal waiting period
for women who want to get an abortion. Give them a day to really think
about it, away from anyone who can influence them and give them the
resources they might need to help them make a decision they can live
with.
Radical pro-choice doesn't want this and the only theory I can come up
with is that they don't want this because they fear a woman might
change her mind and not abort.
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| User: "james g. keegan jr." |
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| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
14 Sep 2006 04:33:22 PM |
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In article <1158250716.569984.273040@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com>,
"osprey" <noneedtoknow@mail.com> wrote:
Let me make one point clear. Many times I hear in here from radical
pro-choicers, that there are no women who regret having an abortion.
if you mean "newsgroups," by "in here," i have never seen a single
person make the claim "that there are no women who regret having an
abortion."
never.
not once, and i have been reading alt and talk abortion since they
were created.
you said
"If you are going to make the claim, prove it. "
coward bobby heishman posting as osprey
news:8912d58d.0307090126.4a25ab87@posting.google.com:
so i know you are going to post evidence showing proof of your claim.
right?
*smirk*
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| User: "David W. Barnes" |
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| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
14 Sep 2006 10:58:05 PM |
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In article <1158250716.569984.273040@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com>,
osprey <noneedtoknow@mail.com> wrote:
MarkA wrote:
On Wed, 13 Sep 2006 16:28:02 -0400, Osprey wrote:
"Martin" <usenet2@etiqa.co.uk> wrote in message
news:45085590$0$2506$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying
attention to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the
experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their
decision years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded
indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions. Some 248 women
replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
yes we do, it says so in the report. Idiot!
No, we don't.
so which part of "A British pro-life group placed advertisements in six
women's magazines ... Some 248 women replied to the ads ..."
makes you think it's not a self-selecting group?
It's more reason to question the survey, but it doesn't necessarily mean
that only "pro-life" people answered.
He's not saying that "only pro-life people answered." The point is that
survey sample consists of "women who have had an abortion and are
motivated to respond to a survey regarding their experience." Such a
population would be slanted toward those wanting to express a negative
opinion. Hence the term, 'self-selected'.
Regardless, the survey isn't valid and is not reliable. No survey is.
Most surveys are very reliable and valid. The issue is, what do they
mean?
Let me make one point clear. Many times I hear in here from radical
pro-choicers, that there are no women who regret having an abortion.
I defy you to find ONE, ANYONE, who has ever said that.
Fact is, there are and there are many.
Stop pretending to know things you could not possibly know.
So what do you tell women who
abort and regret it?
You don't "TELL" them anything!
If the pro-choicer truly cares about the women,
as he or she claims, you would think they would be willing to do
something or try to, to help women who do regret having an abortion.
Why them and not those who regret getting married, or not going to
college, or the choice of colors in their bedroom?
Which is why I am one of those who do support a minimal waiting period
for women who want to get an abortion.
Because women need YOU to watch out for them. After all, they are so
irresponsible.
Give them a day to really think
about it, away from anyone who can influence them and give them the
resources they might need to help them make a decision they can live
with.
In other words, make it harder for poor women to have an abortion.
Radical pro-choice doesn't want this and the only theory I can come up
with is that they don't want this because they fear a woman might
change her mind and not abort.
Or you could go with the truth. We "radical pro-choice" believe women
should be treated like any other citizen. Furthermore, many states
have very few, if any, abortion clinics. The poor often need to scrape
their pennies together and go long distances, in a car, to pay for the
abortion. The last thing they need is to have to take an additional
day from work, at the expense of a hotel or motel room, restaurants,
etc., just because the "pro-life" think they know better.
News flash: Women don't just go out at the spur of the moment and have
an abortion. They are smarter and more responsible than that. And if
they did, who better than to deny motherhood?
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| User: "osprey" |
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| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
14 Sep 2006 11:48:30 PM |
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David W. Barnes wrote:
In article <1158250716.569984.273040@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com>,
osprey <noneedtoknow@mail.com> wrote:
MarkA wrote:
On Wed, 13 Sep 2006 16:28:02 -0400, Osprey wrote:
"Martin" <usenet2@etiqa.co.uk> wrote in message
news:45085590$0$2506$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying
attention to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the
experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their
decision years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded
indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions. Some 248 women
replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
yes we do, it says so in the report. Idiot!
No, we don't.
so which part of "A British pro-life group placed advertisements in six
women's magazines ... Some 248 women replied to the ads ..."
makes you think it's not a self-selecting group?
It's more reason to question the survey, but it doesn't necessarily mean
that only "pro-life" people answered.
He's not saying that "only pro-life people answered." The point is that
survey sample consists of "women who have had an abortion and are
motivated to respond to a survey regarding their experience." Such a
population would be slanted toward those wanting to express a negative
opinion. Hence the term, 'self-selected'.
Regardless, the survey isn't valid and is not reliable. No survey is.
Most surveys are very reliable and valid. The issue is, what do they
mean?
Wrong, they are not. And the main reason being is because you can take
the same survey, hand it out, and you will not always get the same
results. Therefore, they are NOT reliable nor valid. They serve as a
method to evaluate opinions and shifts in opinions. Example: You can
take a sample survey today on the approval rating on Bush, and let's
say it comes back with less than 40% approval rating. Take the same
survey a week later, and the approval rating is above 40%. The survey
is NOT valid nor reliable; however, it does show shifts in opinions.
Let me make one point clear. Many times I hear in here from radical
pro-choicers, that there are no women who regret having an abortion.
I defy you to find ONE, ANYONE, who has ever said that.
YOU SAID IT.
Fact is, there are and there are many.
Stop pretending to know things you could not possibly know.
So what do you tell women who
abort and regret it?
You don't "TELL" them anything!
So you just cast them to the side and say screw you. Well, you already
told the American public to get screwed, so I can believe you would
tell a woman that.
If the pro-choicer truly cares about the women,
as he or she claims, you would think they would be willing to do
something or try to, to help women who do regret having an abortion.
Why them and not those who regret getting married, or not going to
college, or the choice of colors in their bedroom?
regretting getting married or not going to college is something that
doesn't cause mental trauma. Regretting an abortion, can.
Which is why I am one of those who do support a minimal waiting period
for women who want to get an abortion.
Because women need YOU to watch out for them. After all, they are so
irresponsible.
Hey, you said it..not I. Don't cry when those words come back on you.
Give them a day to really think
about it, away from anyone who can influence them and give them the
resources they might need to help them make a decision they can live
with.
In other words, make it harder for poor women to have an abortion.
Not at all, it doesn't make it harder and it might just help them. You
on the other hand, don't care about women or their feelings.
Radical pro-choice doesn't want this and the only theory I can come up
with is that they don't want this because they fear a woman might
change her mind and not abort.
Or you could go with the truth. We "radical pro-choice" believe women
should be treated like any other citizen.
You don't, and stop pretending you do.
<snip>
.
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| User: "David W. Barnes" |
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| Title: Re: British Survey Finds Overwhelming Majority of Women Regretted Abortions |
15 Sep 2006 12:06:26 AM |
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In article <1158295710.542526.56300@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
osprey <noneedtoknow@mail.com> wrote:
David W. Barnes wrote:
In article <1158250716.569984.273040@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com>,
osprey <noneedtoknow@mail.com> wrote:
MarkA wrote:
On Wed, 13 Sep 2006 16:28:02 -0400, Osprey wrote:
"Martin" <usenet2@etiqa.co.uk> wrote in message
news:45085590$0$2506$fa0fcedb@news.zen.co.uk...
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
osprey wrote:
Martin wrote:
J Young wrote:
These are the types of articles more women should be paying
attention to.
you're talking crap and you know it.
London, England (LifeNews.com) -- A British pro-life group
placed
advertisements in six women's magazines there to gather the
experiences of
women who had abortions and find out their reaction to their
decision years
down the road. More than 82 percent of the women who responded
indicated
they deeply regretted their abortion decisions. Some 248 women
replied to the ads sponsored by the group LIFE between April
and early July.
If I phrased the right question I could 'prove' anything with a
self-selected group.
Tosser!
First - We don't know if this was a self-selected group.
yes we do, it says so in the report. Idiot!
No, we don't.
so which part of "A British pro-life group placed advertisements in
six
women's magazines ... Some 248 women replied to the ads ..."
makes you think it's not a self-selecting group?
It's more reason to question the survey, but it doesn't necessarily
mean
that only "pro-life" people answered.
He's not saying that "only pro- | | | | | | | | | | | |
