| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"societopia.net" |
| Date: |
18 Jun 2005 12:06:54 PM |
| Object: |
Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
In a previous thread I explained one characteristic of the atheist ethos;
the lack of values to measure the outcome of exercising one's intellect.
I invite you to examine another characteristic (that manifested itself in
former communist regimes); the price of desertion.
As a little demonstration, you have witnessed on this forum the cost of
attempted criticism of a group of atheist (which was gang violent reaction
towards any speaker in the name of God).
You also know of cultures and religions that preach the death of the
apostate.
How about atheist communities? How do they perceive defection or opposition
from trusted followers or partners? Do your recollect any events from
history where such behavior can be used to understand the atheist ethos?
God bless you,
www.societopia.net
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| User: "Niels van der Linden" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 08:20:02 PM |
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yet I am blessing you.
QED.
You still fail to grasp that this phrase is only meaningful to someone
who already believes not just in "god/s", but in your particular model
of them.
This got me thinking recently: how do theists know that their fellow theists
believe in the same teos? They have absolutely no way of knowing such, and
can just as well be believers of a 'false' teos!!!!!!
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| User: "Fred Stone" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 10:25:35 PM |
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"Niels van der Linden" <n.f.l.vanderlinden@student.utwente.nl> wrote in
news:d92h3g$rat$1@netlx020.civ.utwente.nl:
yet I am blessing you.
QED.
You still fail to grasp that this phrase is only meaningful to
someone who already believes not just in "god/s", but in your
particular model of them.
This got me thinking recently: how do theists know that their fellow
theists believe in the same teos? They have absolutely no way of
knowing such, and can just as well be believers of a 'false'
teos!!!!!!
That's a good point. It seems like they each have their own theos, they
just *think* they agree with other theists.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
"Metaphysics is almost always an attempt to prove
the incredible by an appeal to the unintelligible."
[H.L. Mencken, "Prejudices"]
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| User: "societopia.net" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 10:54:51 PM |
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"Fred Stone" <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:1119151537.b78e13a0b943fb424f0fddbcb66caa1b@teranews...
"Niels van der Linden" <n.f.l.vanderlinden@student.utwente.nl> wrote in
news:d92h3g$rat$1@netlx020.civ.utwente.nl:
yet I am blessing you.
QED.
You still fail to grasp that this phrase is only meaningful to
someone who already believes not just in "god/s", but in your
particular model of them.
This got me thinking recently: how do theists know that their fellow
theists believe in the same teos? They have absolutely no way of
knowing such, and can just as well be believers of a 'false'
teos!!!!!!
That's a good point. It seems like they each have their own theos, they
just *think* they agree with other theists.
They do not claim to be complete in knowledge. They do not fancy re-creating
this universe in a better way than God did it. They obey the earthly
authorities so that not to be a stumbling block to others. They praise God
for all of his blessings. They are fully aware that their King and Judge is
God. They are not manufactured exactly the same (like the communists
regimes or other Societopians attempted to force their citizens and children
to be).
(Notice that in several instances on this forum the respondents were
recommending to me to behave like others in order to gain the welcome of
this forum community. This is an example of having a Societopia; where
every man attempts to become another man judge.)
Freedom is essentially a value of believing in God; otherwise it is a
Societopia.
God Bless You,
www.societopia.net
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| User: "Kate " |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
19 Jun 2005 11:38:02 AM |
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On Sun, 19 Jun 2005 03:54:51 GMT, "societopia.net"
<societopia@societopia.net> wrote:
"Fred Stone" <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote in message
news:1119151537.b78e13a0b943fb424f0fddbcb66caa1b@teranews...
"Niels van der Linden" <n.f.l.vanderlinden@student.utwente.nl> wrote in
news:d92h3g$rat$1@netlx020.civ.utwente.nl:
yet I am blessing you.
QED.
You still fail to grasp that this phrase is only meaningful to
someone who already believes not just in "god/s", but in your
particular model of them.
This got me thinking recently: how do theists know that their fellow
theists believe in the same teos? They have absolutely no way of
knowing such, and can just as well be believers of a 'false'
teos!!!!!!
That's a good point. It seems like they each have their own theos, they
just *think* they agree with other theists.
They do not claim to be complete in knowledge. They do not fancy re-creating
this universe in a better way than God did it. They obey the earthly
authorities so that not to be a stumbling block to others. They praise God
for all of his blessings. They are fully aware that their King and Judge is
God. They are not manufactured exactly the same (like the communists
regimes or other Societopians attempted to force their citizens and children
to be).
A - many claim to know 'the truth'
B - it is dishonest to claim to 'know' anything about gods, since
there is no evidence
C - you apparently know nothing of communists or their regimes
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| User: "Abner Mintz" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 03:51:53 PM |
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societopia.net <societopia@societopia.net> wrote:
I invite you to examine another characteristic (that manifested itself in
former communist regimes); the price of desertion.
How about atheist communities? How do they perceive defection or opposition
from trusted followers or partners? Do your recollect any events from
history where such behavior can be used to understand the atheist ethos?
Sure - I've known several former atheists who became theists without
problems from their atheist friends. The distinction is that, though
they became theists, they did not try to proselytize their atheistic
friends. It's proselytization that causes problems, not conversion
itself. A former atheist who says 'I look at the universe and see God,
but understand why you don't, no problem' will have no problem, while
a former atheist who says 'You foul hellspawn, you are completely
evil and will burn in hell if you don't join me in worshipping the one
true God' is not likely to remain friends with any atheists.
The same problem occurs, of course, the other way around - a
former theist who says 'I don't believe in any God, but it's fine
with me if you do so' isn't likely to have problems from any true
friends, but if he starts calling his theistic friends idiots they
aren't going to remain friends long.
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 05:26:04 PM |
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On Sat, 18 Jun 2005 20:51:53 GMT, (Abner
Mintz) wrote:
societopia.net <societopia@societopia.net> wrote:
I invite you to examine another characteristic (that manifested itself in
former communist regimes); the price of desertion.
How about atheist communities? How do they perceive defection or opposition
from trusted followers or partners? Do your recollect any events from
history where such behavior can be used to understand the atheist ethos?
Sure - I've known several former atheists who became theists without
problems from their atheist friends. The distinction is that, though
they became theists, they did not try to proselytize their atheistic
friends. It's proselytization that causes problems, not conversion
itself. A former atheist who says 'I look at the universe and see God,
but understand why you don't, no problem' will have no problem, while
a former atheist who says 'You foul hellspawn, you are completely
evil and will burn in hell if you don't join me in worshipping the one
true God' is not likely to remain friends with any atheists.
A few years ago an atheist with the id "pistol" posted an example of
an atheist turning theist in
http://groups-beta.google.com/group/alt.christnet.bible/msg/6eb0b78a76645bd3?dmode=source&hl=en
where he said:
Not for me. I witnessed one of my atheist "mentors" become a xian,
almost right before my eyes. But when I asked him why the change, his
only response was a shrug of the shoulders and a "My wife convinced me
I was wrong." He did NOT ramble on about how God would communicate
with us through our minds, or any of that mooshy garbage that Lewis
goes through. I would have been very suspicious of his supposed
atheism otherwise.
The same problem occurs, of course, the other way around - a
former theist who says 'I don't believe in any God, but it's fine
with me if you do so' isn't likely to have problems from any true
friends, but if he starts calling his theistic friends idiots they
aren't going to remain friends long.
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| User: "Abner Mintz" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 05:57:26 PM |
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Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> wrote:
A few years ago an atheist with the id "pistol" posted an example of
an atheist turning theist in
http://snipped
where he said:
Not for me. I witnessed one of my atheist "mentors" become a xian,
almost right before my eyes. But when I asked him why the change, his
only response was a shrug of the shoulders and a "My wife convinced me
I was wrong." He did NOT ramble on about how God would communicate
with us through our minds, or any of that mooshy garbage that Lewis
goes through. I would have been very suspicious of his supposed
atheism otherwise.
So, out of curiousity - since you're one of the atheists here who most
abuses the proselytizing theists we get in here - would you abuse a
friend who turned theist but behaved as you just described? I rather
strongly suspect not - and if not, societopia's claim goes straight
down the tubes. :)
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 06:43:44 PM |
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On Sat, 18 Jun 2005 22:57:26 GMT, (Abner
Mintz) wrote:
Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> wrote:
A few years ago an atheist with the id "pistol" posted an example of
an atheist turning theist in
http://snipped
where he said:
Not for me. I witnessed one of my atheist "mentors" become a xian,
almost right before my eyes. But when I asked him why the change, his
only response was a shrug of the shoulders and a "My wife convinced me
I was wrong." He did NOT ramble on about how God would communicate
with us through our minds, or any of that mooshy garbage that Lewis
goes through. I would have been very suspicious of his supposed
atheism otherwise.
So, out of curiousity - since you're one of the atheists here who most
abuses the proselytizing theists we get in here - would you abuse a
friend who turned theist but behaved as you just described? I rather
strongly suspect not - and if not, societopia's claim goes straight
down the tubes. :)
I usually give even theists the benefit of the doubt - and a chance to
get it right. But none of them do. After which they get treated as
they have treated us - and they don't like it.
I haven't actually had any atheist friends turn theist. But many of my
friends are theist including The Lady In My Life.
She doesn't try to prosetylise me. And actually understands what an
atheist is, and how her religion is seen from outside. But then she
like me is an immigrant from a (different) country where Hindus,
Catholics and Muslims live side by side.
It seems that folk who have seen different religions are more
understanding than those who have only seen their own.
Some of her circle, when they feel they know me well enough start
broaching the subject. But they're not equipped for it - they simply
have no idea how to think outside the box, or what an atheist is.
I have lost several friends who took it too far.
I had a visitor staying here last week, who is still a friend - just.
He thought I might be interested in what made C S Lewis "renounce his
atheism". Which was remarkably tactless. Just like many of them here.
He didn't recognise any of the warning signals. So I shouted him down
with "Don't ever tell an atheist CS Lewis was one", and then rattled
off the reasons we conclude he wasn't. Trying to explain that if he
ever had been, the switch was before he claimed, because at that point
he already thought like a Christian, granted Christian doctrines etc.
Then he wanted to know "how I had arrived at my belief in atheism" -
which showed he hadn't been listening. Like most of them he doesn't
understand that rest of the world doesn't start from the his religious
presumptions. He also felt that being stopped from prosetylising
somehow impacted his freedom of religion.
Which is the nub of the problem. It has made sociopaths of them, who
think their view of everything (including us) is the only one, and who
imagine that their freedom to practice their religion supercedes
anybody else's rights. Their religion tells them to do it to us, and
we are grossly unreasonable if we don't put up with it.
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| User: "Katt" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 07:32:38 PM |
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"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:joa9b19nnfvc67k3tm4ga6gu59tbrd4rel
It seems that folk who have seen different religions are more
understanding than those who have only seen their own.
Absolutely! And this is even one of the reasons behind the flowering of
Ancient Greek culture all those centuries ago: those old Greeks *encountered
so many different cultures*, and *traded with so many different cultures*,
that they achieved a 'quantum leap' in human understanding!
Cue my favourite quotation from Xenophanes [~530BC]:
----------
15. But if oxen (and horses) and lions had hands or could draw with hands
and create works of art like those made by men, horses would draw pictures
of gods like horses, and oxen gods like oxen, and they would make the bodies
(of their gods) in accordance with the form that each species itself
possesses.
16. Ethiopians have gods with snub noses and black hair; Thracians have gods
with gray eyes and red hair.
18. Truly the gods have not revealed to mortals all things from the
beginning; but mortals by long seeking discover what is better.
---------
Wow!! And that from *530BC*...!! Isn't that *absolutely beautiful*,
people...??
I dunno who you were, Xenophanes, but I bet you loved rich, red wine -- and
so, 2535 years later, *I raise my glass to you*, and *am proud to do so*...!
Katt.
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| User: "Abner Mintz" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
19 Jun 2005 11:46:46 AM |
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Katt <seruhshjaudn@dfhu.net> wrote:
Cue my favourite quotation from Xenophanes [~530BC]:
----------
15. But if oxen (and horses) and lions had hands or could draw with hands
and create works of art like those made by men, horses would draw pictures
of gods like horses, and oxen gods like oxen, and they would make the bodies
(of their gods) in accordance with the form that each species itself
possesses.
16. Ethiopians have gods with snub noses and black hair; Thracians have gods
with gray eyes and red hair.
18. Truly the gods have not revealed to mortals all things from the
beginning; but mortals by long seeking discover what is better.
---------
Wow!! And that from *530BC*...!! Isn't that *absolutely beautiful*,
people...??
That's a *beautiful* quote. I'm tempted to put it into permanent
storage!
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| User: "Katt" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
19 Jun 2005 05:04:09 PM |
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"Abner Mintz" <abnermintz@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1gyem5y.rjxhu31teb45cN%abnermintz@earthlink.net...
Katt <seruhshjaudn@dfhu.net> wrote:
Cue my favourite quotation from Xenophanes [~530BC]:
----------
15. But if oxen (and horses) and lions had hands or could draw with hands
and create works of art like those made by men, horses would draw
pictures
of gods like horses, and oxen gods like oxen, and they would make the
bodies
(of their gods) in accordance with the form that each species itself
possesses.
16. Ethiopians have gods with snub noses and black hair; Thracians have
gods
with gray eyes and red hair.
18. Truly the gods have not revealed to mortals all things from the
beginning; but mortals by long seeking discover what is better.
---------
Wow!! And that from *530BC*...!! Isn't that *absolutely beautiful*,
people...??
That's a *beautiful* quote. I'm tempted to put it into permanent
storage!
Thank you, dear boy! It's a *keeper*, isn't it...?!? I remember that *I
cried* when I first chanced upon it in a book: the millennia just *dissolved
away*, and suddenly dear old Xenophanes and his friends became completely
real, believable, thinking people for me!
What a deep and wonderful realisation! What a discovery they made! *2500
years ago*!! Before any of this 'New Tesament' crap had even been
imagined...!
Katt.
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| User: "Abner Mintz" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
19 Jun 2005 11:46:45 AM |
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Christopher A. Lee <calee@optonline.net> wrote:
I usually give even theists the benefit of the doubt - and a chance to
get it right. But none of them do.
I haven't actually had any atheist friends turn theist. But many of my
friends are theist including The Lady In My Life.
Well, then *they* got it right, eh? :)
She doesn't try to prosetylise me. And actually understands what an
atheist is, and how her religion is seen from outside. But then she
like me is an immigrant from a (different) country where Hindus,
Catholics and Muslims live side by side.
It seems that folk who have seen different religions are more
understanding than those who have only seen their own.
Very true. I really think a country where almost every group is
a minority in one way or another has a real advantage there:
with everyone a minority, *everyone* understands how that
feels and is more likely to treat other groups with respect (and
understand that measures that prevent power grabs help
everyone).
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| User: "Olrik" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
19 Jun 2005 01:31:46 AM |
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societopia.net wrote:
<snip>
I, for one, welcome your posts. You make me laugh, of course, but what
gets me is your magnificent lack of intelligence. It's marvelous,
incredible and fascinating.
You are an exquisite specimen of a perfect moron. It's not an insult,
mind you, just an observation.
Please post again.
God bless you,
www.societopia.net
--
Olrik
aa #1981
Qualified SMASH member
EAC Chief Food Inspector, Bacon Division
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| User: "J Forbes" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 12:11:49 PM |
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societopia.net wrote:
How about atheist communities? How do they perceive defection or opposition
from trusted followers or partners? Do your recollect any events from
history where such behavior can be used to understand the atheist ethos?
The only general thing you can accurately say about atheists, is that
they don't have a belief in god.
But you don't seem to care about accuracy, now, do you?
--
Jim
Visit the Selectric Typewriter Museum!
http://www.selectric.org
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| User: "societopia.net" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 01:48:01 PM |
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"J Forbes" <jforbspam@fastmail.fm> wrote in message
news:pBYse.6140$jX6.1703@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
societopia.net wrote:
How about atheist communities? How do they perceive defection or
opposition
from trusted followers or partners? Do your recollect any events from
history where such behavior can be used to understand the atheist ethos?
The only general thing you can accurately say about atheists, is that
they don't have a belief in god.
I agree with you. I would just one more characteristic to it; they do not
usually put the pieces together :-) First, if you define them as not having
belief in God then what is god? Then if one atheist would hastily say; "god
is a fiction", then how come every new generation discovers Him by mere
experience in life?
But you don't seem to care about accuracy, now, do you?
Of course I do. :-)
God bless you,
www.societopia.net
.
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| User: "The other Donald" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 01:54:24 PM |
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"societopia.net" <societopia@societopia.net> wrote in message
news:B%Zse.1731262$6l.457522@pd7tw2no...
"J Forbes" <jforbspam@fastmail.fm> wrote in message
news:pBYse.6140$jX6.1703@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
societopia.net wrote:
How about atheist communities? How do they perceive defection or
opposition
from trusted followers or partners? Do your recollect any events from
history where such behavior can be used to understand the atheist
ethos?
The only general thing you can accurately say about atheists, is that
they don't have a belief in god.
I agree with you. I would just one more characteristic to it; they do not
usually put the pieces together :-)
And it will be invalid. There is no "Atheist Ethos." Atheism is "without
theism," or lack of belief in god(s)/God/Gawd/Dog/Zeus/Allah, etc, ad
nauseum. Nothing more, nothing less.
First, if you define them as not having
belief in God then what is god?
Any and all of the thousands of gods created over the years. All of them,
without exception.
Then if one atheist would hastily say; "god
is a fiction", then how come every new generation discovers Him by mere
experience in life?
Wrong. You are conditioned to believe in whatever "god" your family or those
that raise you, much the same way kids believe in Santa Claus.
--
-Donald in Austin
AA #2104
Apatriot #22
Atheist FF/EMT
.....and ordained minister
Stork pin recipient: May 1, 2003 -Madelyn
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| User: "societopia.net" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 02:03:50 PM |
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"The other Donald" <the_donald_13@yahooX.com> wrote in message
news:A5_se.66578$6g3.31030@tornado.texas.rr.com...
....
Wrong. You are conditioned to believe in whatever "god" your family or
those
that raise you, much the same way kids believe in Santa Claus.
You see. I know your statement is false because you are talking to a guy
who believe *despite* what his family or culture believed. That's my proof
of reality; whereas you espouse an intellect that is way misguided because
it dropped the values out of love and mercy out of it. Whoever loves knows
God because God is love.
God bless you,
www.societopia.net
.
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| User: "Bill Door" |
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| Title: Re: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 02:41:05 PM |
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In the great debate about "Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos"
in alt.atheism, "societopia.net" <societopia@societopia.net>
catapaulted the following boulder:
Whoever loves knows
God because God is love.
How come I love Mankind more than any theist I've ever met, then?
David Silverman F.L.A.H.N. aa #2208
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| User: "societopia.net" |
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| Title: Re: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 03:07:42 PM |
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"Bill Door" <bill.door@scythesrus.com> wrote in message
news:q5u8b15ud8evhnfj86ippiv30hrdjkt172@4ax.com...
In the great debate about "Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos"
in alt.atheism, "societopia.net" <societopia@societopia.net>
catapaulted the following boulder:
Whoever loves knows
God because God is love.
How come I love Mankind more than any theist I've ever met, then?
Love of mankind can mean different things to different people. If you mean
that whenever you see a broken person you stand mercifully with them until
they pass through their trial then you have God in your heart even though
you do not define God as more than a fiction.
The most common occurrences of those who have rejected the Biblical
definition of God happened because the latter contradicted their definition
of love.
For example, it is not loving to think that you would create a paradise of
justice on earth and attempt to enforce that idea. Why? Because you would
be transgressing on God's estate and accusing Him of failure to manage his
estate. Man did not create God's estate or his children. In every attempt
when man sought to establish his perception of justice on others, he ended
up torturing them to see his intellect and they ended up vehemently
rejecting it.
Only God can manage his estate. If any one of us claims to love mankind,
then love your neighbor as yourself, similar to the parable of the Good
Samaritan. You do not to barricade on a militant forum where the mob throws
insults at any passersby blessing God.
There is no love here. Trust me.
God bless you,
www.societopia.net
.
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| User: "Bill Door" |
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| Title: Re: Re: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 03:14:17 PM |
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In the great debate about "Re: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist
Ethos" in alt.atheism, "societopia.net" <societopia@societopia.net>
catapaulted the following boulder:
you have God in your heart even though
you do not define God as more than a fiction.
You need meds, mate.
David Silverman F.L.A.H.N. aa #2208
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| User: "societopia.net" |
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| Title: Re: Re: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 03:21:23 PM |
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"Bill Door" <bill.door@scythesrus.com> wrote in message
news:d409b1df4h7ea6pad17vl70lt7q2avbdt8@4ax.com...
....
You need meds, mate.
God bless you,
www.societopia.net
.
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: Re: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
24 Jun 2005 11:24:36 AM |
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In our last episode <7n%se.27809$El.6076@pd7tw1no>, societopia.net
pirouetted gracefully and with great fanfare proclaimed:
"Bill Door" <bill.door@scythesrus.com> wrote in message
news:d409b1df4h7ea6pad17vl70lt7q2avbdt8@4ax.com... ...
You need meds, mate.
God bless you,
www.societopia.net
You know, god called me last night and mentioned he just cannot *stand you...
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
--------------------------------------------------
"Come to think of it, there are already a million
monkeys on a million typewriters, and the Usenet
is NOTHING like Shakespeare!" -- Blair Houghton
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| User: "Fred Stone" |
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| Title: Re: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 04:22:00 PM |
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Bill Door <bill.door@scythesrus.com> wrote in
news:q5u8b15ud8evhnfj86ippiv30hrdjkt172@4ax.com:
In the great debate about "Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos"
in alt.atheism, "societopia.net" <societopia@societopia.net>
catapaulted the following boulder:
Whoever loves knows
God because God is love.
How come I love Mankind more than any theist I've ever met, then?
If I love myself does that mean that I am God?
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
"Metaphysics is almost always an attempt to prove
the incredible by an appeal to the unintelligible."
[H.L. Mencken, "Prejudices"]
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| User: "Dubh Ghall" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
19 Jun 2005 03:15:04 PM |
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On Sat, 18 Jun 2005 19:03:50 GMT, "societopia.net" <societopia@societopia.net>
wrote:
"The other Donald" <the_donald_13@yahooX.com> wrote in message
news:A5_se.66578$6g3.31030@tornado.texas.rr.com...
...
Wrong. You are conditioned to believe in whatever "god" your family or
those
that raise you, much the same way kids believe in Santa Claus.
You see. I know your statement is false because you are talking to a guy
who believe *despite* what his family or culture believed. That's my proof
of reality; whereas you espouse an intellect that is way misguided because
it dropped the values out of love and mercy out of it. Whoever loves knows
God because God is love.
Are you going to tell us that you were raised in a pure atheist culture?
--
Puck Greenman
The spelling, Like any opinion stated here,
is purely my own
#162 BAAWA Knight.
Plonked by Rob Duncan
Na bister 500,000
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| User: "Azrael" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 10:12:06 PM |
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On Sat, 18 Jun 2005 18:48:01 GMT, "societopia.net"
<societopia@societopia.net> wrote:
"J Forbes" <jforbspam@fastmail.fm> wrote in message
news:pBYse.6140$jX6.1703@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
societopia.net wrote:
How about atheist communities? How do they perceive defection or
opposition
from trusted followers or partners? Do your recollect any events from
history where such behavior can be used to understand the atheist ethos?
The only general thing you can accurately say about atheists, is that
they don't have a belief in god.
I agree with you. I would just one more characteristic to it; they do not
usually put the pieces together :-) First, if you define them as not having
belief in God then what is god? Then if one atheist would hastily say; "god
is a fiction", then how come every new generation discovers Him by mere
experience in life?
Not one new generation has discovered god ever, they are brain washed
into believing.
But you don't seem to care about accuracy, now, do you?
Of course I do. :-)
Then use some honesty, and you might be believed.
God bless you,
www.societopia.net
Azrael
The thiest/diest defense:
1)I believe in god, ergo god exists
2)I believe in god, ergo I know what god wills, wants, the path to god, etc.
3)I believe in god, ergo I am right/correct
4)You don't agree with me, you are wrong (see 1,2,and/or 3 above)
5)You dont' beleive as I do then you are wrong (see 1,2,and/or 3 above)
6)You want proof of god? (see 1,2,and/or 3 above)
7)You have evidence god does not exist (see 1,2,and/or 3 above)
8)If you don't believe as I do you are wrong (see 1,2,and/or 3 above)
There was no "before" the beginning of our universe, because once upon a time there was no time.
John D. Barrow
Question #1: If I get im my spaceship and fly to the very edge of the universe what do I see out the front window?
Question #2: What is the most mass/matter that a black hole can obsorb and what happens after it reaches that point and trys to absorb more matter?
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| User: "societopia.net" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 10:24:42 PM |
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"Azrael" <god@my.computer.palace.com> wrote in message
news:2do9b19q9df0irgd89quvlpss53190jria@4ax.com...
....
Not one new generation has discovered god ever, they are brain washed
into believing.
I assume then you claim the knowledge of all humanity; that you are
knowledgeable of their experiences, their thought and their motives; that
you are an anointed judge who can judge all those trillions and trillions
who believed and continue to believe :-)
Thanks for demonstrating another ethos of the Atheist Ethos.
God Bless You,
www.societopia.net
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| User: "Azrael" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
21 Jun 2005 04:04:27 PM |
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On Sun, 19 Jun 2005 03:24:42 GMT, "societopia.net"
<societopia@societopia.net> wrote:
"Azrael" <god@my.computer.palace.com> wrote in message
news:2do9b19q9df0irgd89quvlpss53190jria@4ax.com...
...
Not one new generation has discovered god ever, they are brain washed
into believing.
I assume then you claim the knowledge of all humanity; that you are
knowledgeable of their experiences, their thought and their motives;
And just how many people have you heard of who just walking down the
street discovered god, an entity that they had never heard of before?
You have to be brainwashed into believing in god.
that you are an anointed judge who can judge all those trillions and trillions
who believed and continue to believe :-)
Ah such honesty from you, or is it ignorance since not a single
trillion people have existed since the beginning of the species upon
this planet.
And they believe becuase they were taught to believe.
Azrael
The thiest/diest defense:
1)I believe in god, ergo god exists
2)I believe in god, ergo I know what god wills, wants, the path to god, etc.
3)I believe in god, ergo I am right/correct
4)You don't agree with me, you are wrong (see 1,2,and/or 3 above)
5)You dont' beleive as I do then you are wrong (see 1,2,and/or 3 above)
6)You want proof of god? (see 1,2,and/or 3 above)
7)You have evidence god does not exist (see 1,2,and/or 3 above)
8)If you don't believe as I do you are wrong (see 1,2,and/or 3 above)
There was no "before" the beginning of our universe, because once upon a time there was no time.
John D. Barrow
Question #1: If I get im my spaceship and fly to the very edge of the universe what do I see out the front window?
Question #2: What is the most mass/matter that a black hole can obsorb and what happens after it reaches that point and trys to absorb more matter?
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| User: "Dubh Ghall" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
19 Jun 2005 03:22:17 PM |
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On Sun, 19 Jun 2005 03:24:42 GMT, "societopia.net" <societopia@societopia.net>
wrote:
"Azrael" <god@my.computer.palace.com> wrote in message
news:2do9b19q9df0irgd89quvlpss53190jria@4ax.com...
...
Not one new generation has discovered god ever, they are brain washed
into believing.
I assume then you claim the knowledge of all humanity; that you are
knowledgeable of their experiences, their thought and their motives; that
you are an anointed judge who can judge all those trillions and trillions
who believed and continue to believe :-)
You really ought to try reading for comprehension.
Oh yea, stop exaggerating.
Thanks for demonstrating another ethos of the Atheist Ethos.
I think I begin to see what the problem is.
English aint Sociopath;s first language.
--
Puck Greenman
The spelling, Like any opinion stated here,
is purely my own
#162 BAAWA Knight.
Plonked by Rob Duncan
Na bister 500,000
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| User: "Dubh Ghall" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
19 Jun 2005 03:13:09 PM |
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On Sat, 18 Jun 2005 18:48:01 GMT, "societopia.net" <societopia@societopia.net>
wrote:
"J Forbes" <jforbspam@fastmail.fm> wrote in message
news:pBYse.6140$jX6.1703@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
societopia.net wrote:
How about atheist communities? How do they perceive defection or
opposition
from trusted followers or partners? Do your recollect any events from
history where such behavior can be used to understand the atheist ethos?
The only general thing you can accurately say about atheists, is that
they don't have a belief in god.
I agree with you. I would just one more characteristic to it; they do not
usually put the pieces together :-) First, if you define them as not having
belief in God then what is god?
According to the dictionary.
god
god [ god ]
noun (plural gods)
1. supernatural being: one of a group of supernatural male beings in some
religions, each of which is worshiped as the personification or controller of
some aspect of the universe
e.g, Thor, the Norse god of thunder, etc.
goddess
god·dess [ gódd?ss ] (plural god·dess·es)
noun
1. supernatural being: one of the group of supernatural female beings in some
religions, worshiped as the personification or controller of some aspect of the
universe
Athena, the Greek goddess of wisdom.
--
Puck Greenman
The spelling, Like any opinion stated here,
is purely my own
#162 BAAWA Knight.
Plonked by Rob Duncan
Na bister 500,000
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| User: "J Forbes" |
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| Title: Re: Characteristics of the Atheist Ethos |
18 Jun 2005 02:22:07 PM |
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societopia.net wrote:
"J Forbes" <jforbspam@fastmail.fm> wrote in message
news:pBYse.6140$jX6.1703@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
societopia.net wrote:
How about atheist communities? How do they perceive defection or
opposition
from trusted followers or partners? Do your recollect any events from
history where such behavior can be used to understand the atheist ethos?
The only general thing you can accurately say about atheists, is that
they don't have a belief in god.
I agree with you.
that is not obvious.
I would just one more characteristic to it; they do not
usually put the pieces together :-)
I can't speak for other atheists, but I think I've done a pretty good
job of putting the pieces together.
First, if you define them as not having
belief in God then what is god?
as far as I can tell, god is other peoples' imaginary friend; god is a
figment of many humans' imagination.
Then if one atheist would hastily say; "god
is a fiction", then how come every new generation discovers Him by mere
experience in life?
I disagree. Each new generation learns about the god concept from
their parents/peers. It's essentially a mind virus, it is an idea
that is easy for many people to believe (because of how our minds
evolved), and it is opportunistic about spreading itself.
But you don't seem to care about accuracy, now, do you?
Of course I do. :-)
That is not obvious either.
--
Jim
Visit the Selectric Typewriter Museum!
http://www.selectric.org
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