| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"J Young" |
| Date: |
05 Mar 2006 02:00:58 PM |
| Object: |
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality theme is quite
overt. The book may be informative, and even entertaining, but it does not
belong in the section for Children's books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family headed by
two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the book "And
Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male penguins who
adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central Park Zoo a few years
ago.
A Savannah, Missouri library official says she consulted with zoo experts in
several states, and found that adoptions aren't unusual in the penguin
world.
But, she says, she's decided to move the books from the children's section
to non-fiction shelves to avoid catching young readers by surprise.
--
" The truth shall set you free "
.
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| User: "Beacon of Truth and Light \maybe" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
05 Mar 2006 02:05:02 PM |
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"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote in message
news:N7qdnUFGWPwW3pbZRVn-qQ@giganews.com...
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality theme is quite
overt. The book may be informative, and even entertaining, but it does not
belong in the section for Children's books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family headed by
two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the book "And
Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male penguins who
adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central Park Zoo a few years
ago.
A Savannah, Missouri library official says she consulted with zoo experts
in
several states, and found that adoptions aren't unusual in the penguin
world.
But, she says, she's decided to move the books from the children's section
to non-fiction shelves to avoid catching young readers by surprise.
Proof that a lot of Americans seriously need to GET A LIFE!!
.
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| User: "Hugh Betcha" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 04:00:10 AM |
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J Young wrote:
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality theme is quite
overt. The book may be informative, and even entertaining, but it does not
belong in the section for Children's books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family headed by
two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the book "And
Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male penguins who
adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central Park Zoo a few years
ago.
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off and
hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book. Not likely,
eh?
.
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| User: "LAmazone" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 07:29:49 AM |
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Hugh Betcha wrote:
J Young wrote:
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality theme is quite
overt. The book may be informative, and even entertaining, but it does not
belong in the section for Children's books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family headed by
two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the book "And
Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male penguins who
adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central Park Zoo a few years
ago.
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off and
hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book. Not likely,
eh?
Different penguins, those two were in Germany
--
Natalie Clifford Barney
Membre; L' Academie des Femmes
One of the Lesbian Immortals of the Left Bank
We never die....
"If too little of the love I invoke appears in this book, it is because I have
better spent it elsewhere. Here there remain only fragments."
.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 06:14:48 AM |
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In News 1141639210.401025.38620@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com,, Hugh Betcha
at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
J Young wrote:
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality theme is
quite overt. The book may be informative, and even entertaining, but
it does not belong in the section for Children's books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family
headed by two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the book
"And Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male penguins
who adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central Park Zoo a
few years ago.
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off and
hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book. Not
likely, eh?
The Penquins in question weren't "gay". Male Penquins do most of the
tending of the nest even when the tending couple is male/female. It is not
unusual for a male, or in this case two males, to adopt a stray egg.
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. - Thomas Jefferson
.
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| User: "Hugh Betcha" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 04:22:10 PM |
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Andrealphus wrote:
In News 1141639210.401025.38620@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com,, Hugh Betcha
at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
J Young wrote:
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality theme is
quite overt. The book may be informative, and even entertaining, but
it does not belong in the section for Children's books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family
headed by two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the book
"And Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male penguins
who adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central Park Zoo a
few years ago.
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off and
hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book. Not
likely, eh?
The Penquins in question weren't "gay". Male Penquins do most of the
tending of the nest even when the tending couple is male/female. It is not
unusual for a male, or in this case two males, to adopt a stray egg.
Shhhh! You're pointing out the obvious! Do you have any idea how much
trouble that will get you into nowadays?
.
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| User: "Bonnie Bitch" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 05:00:00 PM |
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On 6 Mar 2006 14:22:10 -0800, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of "Hugh
Betcha" <gemond@canada.com>
Andrealphus wrote:
In News 1141639210.401025.38620@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com,, Hugh Betcha
at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
J Young wrote:
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality theme is
quite overt. The book may be informative, and even entertaining, but
it does not belong in the section for Children's books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family
headed by two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the book
"And Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male penguins
who adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central Park Zoo a
few years ago.
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off and
hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book. Not
likely, eh?
The Penquins in question weren't "gay". Male Penquins do most of the
tending of the nest even when the tending couple is male/female. It is not
unusual for a male, or in this case two males, to adopt a stray egg.
Shhhh! You're pointing out the obvious! Do you have any idea how much
trouble that will get you into nowadays?
Yeah, especially with all the video footage of Silo and Roy engaging
in mating behavior, such as kissing, foreplay, sex, rejecting female
penguins as potential mates, etc.
Ditto for Wendell and Cass, who belong to a species that mates for
life.
The penguins in question were indeed homosexual, as proven by the
combination of their choice of partner, rejection of potential and
available female partners, and behavior.
.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 05:22:42 PM |
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In News lgfp02p0cfh2g8kc90mfh2ti55rr7s28mn@4ax.com,, Bonnie ***** at
bonnieb@fifismaxi.pad, typed this:
On 6 Mar 2006 14:22:10 -0800, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of "Hugh
Betcha" <gemond@canada.com>
Andrealphus wrote:
In News 1141639210.401025.38620@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com,, Hugh
Betcha at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
J Young wrote:
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality theme
is quite overt. The book may be informative, and even
entertaining, but it does not belong in the section for
Children's books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family
headed by two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the
book "And Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male
penguins who adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central
Park Zoo a few years ago.
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off
and hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book. Not
likely, eh?
The Penquins in question weren't "gay". Male Penquins do most of
the tending of the nest even when the tending couple is
male/female. It is not unusual for a male, or in this case two
males, to adopt a stray egg.
Shhhh! You're pointing out the obvious! Do you have any idea how much
trouble that will get you into nowadays?
Yeah, especially with all the video footage of Silo and Roy engaging
in mating behavior, such as kissing, foreplay, sex, rejecting female
penguins as potential mates, etc.
Really? You have a link for this?
Ditto for Wendell and Cass, who belong to a species that mates for
life.
The penguins in question were indeed homosexual, as proven by the
combination of their choice of partner, rejection of potential and
available female partners, and behavior.
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. - Thomas Jefferson
.
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| User: "Bonnie Bitch" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 05:50:59 PM |
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On Mon, 06 Mar 2006 23:22:42 GMT, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL11@THISADDRESS.FOAD>
In News lgfp02p0cfh2g8kc90mfh2ti55rr7s28mn@4ax.com,, Bonnie ***** at
bonnieb@fifismaxi.pad, typed this:
On 6 Mar 2006 14:22:10 -0800, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of "Hugh
Betcha" <gemond@canada.com>
Andrealphus wrote:
In News 1141639210.401025.38620@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com,, Hugh
Betcha at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
J Young wrote:
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality theme
is quite overt. The book may be informative, and even
entertaining, but it does not belong in the section for
Children's books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family
headed by two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the
book "And Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male
penguins who adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central
Park Zoo a few years ago.
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off
and hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book. Not
likely, eh?
The Penquins in question weren't "gay". Male Penquins do most of
the tending of the nest even when the tending couple is
male/female. It is not unusual for a male, or in this case two
males, to adopt a stray egg.
Shhhh! You're pointing out the obvious! Do you have any idea how much
trouble that will get you into nowadays?
Yeah, especially with all the video footage of Silo and Roy engaging
in mating behavior, such as kissing, foreplay, sex, rejecting female
penguins as potential mates, etc.
Really? You have a link for this?
http://www.sensualism.com/gay/index.html
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2004/02/07/MNG3N4RAV41.DTL
<same article, different picture>
http://www.gayheroes.com/penguins.htm
http://www.365gay.com/newscon04/02/020704gayAnimals.htm
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4352011/
http://www.planetout.com/news/feature.html?sernum=1232
(I included this one because it mentions that the reparative therapy
for the six gay penguins at a zoo in Germany failed)
Roy and Silo exhibited many common mating/courtship behaviors toward
each other, including kissing, vocalizing, and sex. When they were
together, they continually rejected the overtures of female penguins.
If the combination of those observed behaviors don't indicate that
they were gay (especially the rejection of available female partners,
indicating that theirs was not a situational instance of
homosexuality), then your cogent, meaningful explanation thereof will
be appreciated.
And feel free to call the Central Park Zoo in Manhattan, NY, and ask
for Rob Gramzay.
And yes -- Roy and Silo did break up, after Tango (their adopted
chick) left home, and Silo took up with a female named Scrappy. But no
mating behaviors between them have been observed.
Also, Roy and Silo were Chinstrap penguins, who, as a species, do not
mate for life. African black-footed penguins do mate for life (cf
Wendell and Cass, New York Aquarium in Coney Island, Brooklyn).
So, there is validity to your point, in that some same-sex pairs of
certain species of penguins do cohabitate in order to raise orphaned
chicks/eggs. But we're not talking about those. We're talking about
two specific pairs of penguins from two specific species who have
exhibited enough behaviors in combination, that one may rightfully
surmise that they are gay.
cf:
Bagemihl, Bruce "Biological Exuberance: Animal Homosexuality and
Natural Diversity"
Stonewall Inn Editions (April 1, 2000)
ISBN: 031225377X
Karsch-Haack, Ferdinand "Liebe auf Sozialität? Eine begründete
Zurückweisung" (1905)
Ditto for Wendell and Cass, who belong to a species that mates for
life.
The penguins in question were indeed homosexual, as proven by the
combination of their choice of partner, rejection of potential and
available female partners, and behavior.
.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 06:12:51 PM |
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In News c6hp025ucgovejc03p5a2b34drak088rj9@4ax.com,, Bonnie ***** at
bonnieb@fifismaxi.pad, typed this:
On Mon, 06 Mar 2006 23:22:42 GMT, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL11@THISADDRESS.FOAD>
In News lgfp02p0cfh2g8kc90mfh2ti55rr7s28mn@4ax.com,, Bonnie ***** at
bonnieb@fifismaxi.pad, typed this:
On 6 Mar 2006 14:22:10 -0800, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of "Hugh
Betcha" <gemond@canada.com>
Andrealphus wrote:
In News 1141639210.401025.38620@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com,,
Hugh Betcha at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
J Young wrote:
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality
theme is quite overt. The book may be informative, and even
entertaining, but it does not belong in the section for
Children's books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family
headed by two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the
book "And Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male
penguins who adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central
Park Zoo a few years ago.
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off
and hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book.
Not likely, eh?
The Penquins in question weren't "gay". Male Penquins do most of
the tending of the nest even when the tending couple is
male/female. It is not unusual for a male, or in this case two
males, to adopt a stray egg.
Shhhh! You're pointing out the obvious! Do you have any idea how
much trouble that will get you into nowadays?
Yeah, especially with all the video footage of Silo and Roy engaging
in mating behavior, such as kissing, foreplay, sex, rejecting female
penguins as potential mates, etc.
Really? You have a link for this?
http://www.sensualism.com/gay/index.html
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2004/02/07/MNG3N4RAV41.DTL
My bad then, I guess they are a couple of queer birds. :)
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. - Thomas Jefferson
.
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| User: "Bonnie Bitch" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 08:42:55 PM |
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On Tue, 07 Mar 2006 00:12:51 GMT, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL11@THISADDRESS.FOAD>
In News c6hp025ucgovejc03p5a2b34drak088rj9@4ax.com,, Bonnie ***** at
bonnieb@fifismaxi.pad, typed this:
On Mon, 06 Mar 2006 23:22:42 GMT, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL11@THISADDRESS.FOAD>
In News lgfp02p0cfh2g8kc90mfh2ti55rr7s28mn@4ax.com,, Bonnie ***** at
bonnieb@fifismaxi.pad, typed this:
On 6 Mar 2006 14:22:10 -0800, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of "Hugh
Betcha" <gemond@canada.com>
Andrealphus wrote:
In News 1141639210.401025.38620@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com,,
Hugh Betcha at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
J Young wrote:
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality
theme is quite overt. The book may be informative, and even
entertaining, but it does not belong in the section for
Children's books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family
headed by two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the
book "And Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male
penguins who adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central
Park Zoo a few years ago.
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off
and hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book.
Not likely, eh?
The Penquins in question weren't "gay". Male Penquins do most of
the tending of the nest even when the tending couple is
male/female. It is not unusual for a male, or in this case two
males, to adopt a stray egg.
Shhhh! You're pointing out the obvious! Do you have any idea how
much trouble that will get you into nowadays?
Yeah, especially with all the video footage of Silo and Roy engaging
in mating behavior, such as kissing, foreplay, sex, rejecting female
penguins as potential mates, etc.
Really? You have a link for this?
http://www.sensualism.com/gay/index.html
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2004/02/07/MNG3N4RAV41.DTL
My bad then, I guess they are a couple of queer birds. :)
Don't feel bad -- their zookeepers are fine with it.
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 04:29:06 PM |
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Oh my goodness, isn't that the job of the female penguin. The book
should be BANNED for challenging traditional family values!
I am appalled!!!
Andrealphus wrote:
In News 1141639210.401025.38620@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com,, Hugh Betcha
at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
J Young wrote:
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality theme is
quite overt. The book may be informative, and even entertaining, but
it does not belong in the section for Children's books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family
headed by two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the book
"And Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male penguins
who adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central Park Zoo a
few years ago.
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off and
hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book. Not
likely, eh?
The Penquins in question weren't "gay". Male Penquins do most of the
tending of the nest even when the tending couple is male/female. It is not
unusual for a male, or in this case two males, to adopt a stray egg.
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. - Thomas Jefferson
.
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| User: "Andrealphus" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 04:38:55 PM |
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In News 1141684146.791854.109290@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com,,
lyndseymcglynn@yahoo.co.uk at lyndseymcglynn@yahoo.co.uk, typed this:
Oh my goodness, isn't that the job of the female penguin. The book
should be BANNED for challenging traditional family values!
I am appalled!!!
Wait until my new book comes out. The title will be "Daddy Seahorse".
Andrealphus wrote:
In News 1141639210.401025.38620@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com,, Hugh
Betcha at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
J Young wrote:
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality theme
is quite overt. The book may be informative, and even
entertaining, but it does not belong in the section for Children's
books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family
headed by two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the
book "And Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male
penguins who adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central
Park Zoo a few years ago.
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off and
hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book. Not
likely, eh?
The Penquins in question weren't "gay". Male Penquins do most of
the tending of the nest even when the tending couple is male/female.
It is not unusual for a male, or in this case two males, to adopt a
stray egg.
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of
blindfolded fear. - Thomas Jefferson
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of blindfolded
fear. - Thomas Jefferson
.
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| User: "Bonnie Bitch" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 05:08:25 PM |
|
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On Mon, 06 Mar 2006 22:38:55 GMT, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of
"Andrealphus" <NOREALEMAIL11@THISADDRESS.FOAD>
In News 1141684146.791854.109290@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com,,
lyndseymcglynn@yahoo.co.uk at lyndseymcglynn@yahoo.co.uk, typed this:
Oh my goodness, isn't that the job of the female penguin. The book
should be BANNED for challenging traditional family values!
I am appalled!!!
Wait until my new book comes out. The title will be "Daddy Seahorse".
LOL!
Oh, and I forgot to tell you -- the penguins in question were gay
(Silo and Roy). They didn't just adopt an egg. They were gay gay gay,
as evidenced by their courtship behavior and rejection of available
females.
Andrealphus wrote:
In News 1141639210.401025.38620@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com,, Hugh
Betcha at gemond@canada.com, typed this:
J Young wrote:
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality theme
is quite overt. The book may be informative, and even
entertaining, but it does not belong in the section for Children's
books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family
headed by two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the
book "And Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male
penguins who adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central
Park Zoo a few years ago.
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off and
hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book. Not
likely, eh?
The Penquins in question weren't "gay". Male Penquins do most of
the tending of the nest even when the tending couple is male/female.
It is not unusual for a male, or in this case two males, to adopt a
stray egg.
--
Question with boldness even the existence of god; because if there be
one, he must more approve the homage of reason than that of
blindfolded fear. - Thomas Jefferson
.
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| User: "Bonnie Bitch" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 04:55:20 AM |
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On 6 Mar 2006 02:00:10 -0800, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of "Hugh
Betcha" <gemond@canada.com>
J Young wrote:
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality theme is quite
overt. The book may be informative, and even entertaining, but it does not
belong in the section for Children's books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family headed by
two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the book "And
Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male penguins who
adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central Park Zoo a few years
ago.
Bagemihl, Bruce "Biological Exuberance: Animal Homosexuality and
Natural Diversity"
Stonewall Inn Editions (April 1, 2000)
ISBN: 031225377X
cf also
Karsch-Haack, Ferdinand "Liebe auf Sozialität? Eine begründete
Zurückweisung" (1905)
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off and
hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book. Not likely,
eh?
Wendell and Cass, the same-sex penguin couple at New York Aquarium in
Coney Island, Brooklyn, are African black-footed penguins, which mate
for life, unlike most christstain humans. Wendell and Cass have been
together for 10 years to date. (Eat your heart out, Britney Spears).
Central Park Zoo's Silo and Roy, Chinstrap penguins, do not mate for
life, just like most human christstains. After raising their chick
Tango, Silo did leave Roy, after 9 years, for a female named Scrappy
in September of 2005.
Unlike most of their human christstain counterparts, however, Silo and
Roy did wait until Tango was out of the nest before amicably
divorcing.
Although Roy is still single and celibate, unlike most human
christstain allegedly heterosexual males, Silo is practicing his
celibacy with his girlfriend Scrappy. Zookeepers are certain that
neither has ever seen an episode of "Will and Grace."
Must suck for ya, Hugh, that two pairs of gay penguins have a better
track record than 50+% of marriages between humans who happen to be
christstains.
Oh, and Tango (Silo and Roy's adopted child) turned out heterosexual,
healthy, and happy.
And yes, all of the above is true, I kid you not.
Bagemihl, Bruce "Biological Exuberance: Animal Homosexuality and
Natural Diversity"
Stonewall Inn Editions (April 1, 2000)
ISBN: 031225377X
cf also
Karsch-Haack, Ferdinand "Liebe auf Sozialität? Eine begründete
Zurückweisung" (1905)
.
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| User: "Hugh Betcha" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 04:18:22 PM |
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Bonnie ***** wrote:
On 6 Mar 2006 02:00:10 -0800, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of "Hugh
Betcha" <gemond@canada.com>
J Young wrote:
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality theme is q=
uite
overt. The book may be informative, and even entertaining, but it does=
not
belong in the section for Children's books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family heade=
d by
two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the book "=
And
Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male penguins w=
ho
adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central Park Zoo a few yea=
rs
ago.
Bagemihl, Bruce "Biological Exuberance: Animal Homosexuality and
Natural Diversity"
Stonewall Inn Editions (April 1, 2000)
ISBN: 031225377X
cf also
Karsch-Haack, Ferdinand "Liebe auf Sozialit=E4t? Eine begr=FCndete
Zur=FCckweisung" (1905)
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off and
hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book. Not likely,
eh?
Wendell and Cass, the same-sex penguin couple at New York Aquarium in
Coney Island, Brooklyn, are African black-footed penguins, which mate
for life, unlike most christstain humans. Wendell and Cass have been
together for 10 years to date. (Eat your heart out, Britney Spears).
Central Park Zoo's Silo and Roy, Chinstrap penguins, do not mate for
life, just like most human christstains. After raising their chick
Tango, Silo did leave Roy, after 9 years, for a female named Scrappy
in September of 2005.
Unlike most of their human christstain counterparts, however, Silo and
Roy did wait until Tango was out of the nest before amicably
divorcing.
Although Roy is still single and celibate, unlike most human
christstain allegedly heterosexual males, Silo is practicing his
celibacy with his girlfriend Scrappy. Zookeepers are certain that
neither has ever seen an episode of "Will and Grace."
Must suck for ya, Hugh, that two pairs of gay penguins have a better
track record than 50+% of marriages between humans who happen to be
christstains.
Oh, and Tango (Silo and Roy's adopted child) turned out heterosexual,
healthy, and happy.
And yes, all of the above is true, I kid you not.
Well, thank you for clearing that up, BB, caustic and uncalled for
comments notwithstanding.
Bagemihl, Bruce "Biological Exuberance: Animal Homosexuality and
Natural Diversity"
Stonewall Inn Editions (April 1, 2000)
ISBN: 031225377X
What's this? Actually, having spent time on a farm and having many pets
in the household, I've noticed 'homosexual' behaviour amongst the
critters. Always the young males going through the motions on each
other, but they do quickly outgrow it. I figure it's instinctive 'gotta
hump something' behaivour, not unlike that observed in human males.
It's not homosexual per se, as you have pointed out, that behaviour is
not related to orientation; as the critters go on to be normal heteros.
Interesting, eh? Anyhow, about the book: does it suggest that there are
actual homo-oriented-sexual animals? Good grief, that serves no
biological purpose whatsoever and defies natural selection; what would
the Darwinists say?
cf also
Karsch-Haack, Ferdinand "Liebe auf Sozialit=E4t? Eine begr=FCndete
Zur=FCckweisung" (1905)
.
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| User: "Bonnie Bitch" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 04:56:00 PM |
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On 6 Mar 2006 14:18:22 -0800, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of "Hugh
Betcha" <gemond@canada.com>
Bonnie ***** wrote:
On 6 Mar 2006 02:00:10 -0800, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of "Hugh
Betcha" <gemond@canada.com>
J Young wrote:
This book does not have gay 'undertones', the homosexuality theme is quite
overt. The book may be informative, and even entertaining, but it does not
belong in the section for Children's books.
http://cbs5.com/topstories/local_story_063202744.html
Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints
(AP) Savannah, Missouri A children's book about a penguin family headed by
two males is creating a flap in Missouri.
Parents complained to librarians in southwest Missouri that the book "And
Tango Makes Three" has homosexual undertones.
The illustrated tale is based on the true story of two male penguins who
adopted an abandoned egg at New York City's Central Park Zoo a few years
ago.
Bagemihl, Bruce "Biological Exuberance: Animal Homosexuality and
Natural Diversity"
Stonewall Inn Editions (April 1, 2000)
ISBN: 031225377X
cf also
Karsch-Haack, Ferdinand "Liebe auf Sozialität? Eine begründete
Zurückweisung" (1905)
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off and
hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book. Not likely,
eh?
Wendell and Cass, the same-sex penguin couple at New York Aquarium in
Coney Island, Brooklyn, are African black-footed penguins, which mate
for life, unlike most christstain humans. Wendell and Cass have been
together for 10 years to date. (Eat your heart out, Britney Spears).
Central Park Zoo's Silo and Roy, Chinstrap penguins, do not mate for
life, just like most human christstains. After raising their chick
Tango, Silo did leave Roy, after 9 years, for a female named Scrappy
in September of 2005.
Unlike most of their human christstain counterparts, however, Silo and
Roy did wait until Tango was out of the nest before amicably
divorcing.
Although Roy is still single and celibate, unlike most human
christstain allegedly heterosexual males, Silo is practicing his
celibacy with his girlfriend Scrappy. Zookeepers are certain that
neither has ever seen an episode of "Will and Grace."
Must suck for ya, Hugh, that two pairs of gay penguins have a better
track record than 50+% of marriages between humans who happen to be
christstains.
Oh, and Tango (Silo and Roy's adopted child) turned out heterosexual,
healthy, and happy.
And yes, all of the above is true, I kid you not.
Well, thank you for clearing that up, BB, caustic and uncalled for
comments notwithstanding.
So, when a pair of gay penguins demonstrates a better track record
than OVER HALF of all marriages by members of your own cult, you find
that offensive because it's true. Cute.
Bagemihl, Bruce "Biological Exuberance: Animal Homosexuality and
Natural Diversity"
Stonewall Inn Editions (April 1, 2000)
ISBN: 031225377X
What's this?
A proper citation of peer-reviewed, current, mainstream scientific
literature, which substantiates all the claims above WRT African
black-footed and Chinstrap penguins. Take note. I know this is a lot
of new information for you to process, but I have _faith_ in your
ability to do so.
<snip Hugh's recounting of his past romantic encounters>
Now *that* was caustic. Oh, oops. My bad.
Anyhow, about the book: does it suggest that there are
actual homo-oriented-sexual animals?
It does not suggest. It documents and provides proof thereof.
I realize that reality-based evidence is anathema in your cult, but
that shouldn't preclude you from reading it for yourself.
The other tome (Karsch-Haack) is, AFAIK, out of print, but you should
be able to procure a copy through the inter-library loan service at
your local public library.
The fact of homosexuality occurring naturally among species other than
homo sapiens is neither new nor original.
Good grief, that serves no
biological purpose whatsoever and defies natural selection; what would
the Darwinists say?
After they were done laughing, they'd first tell you that although
Darwin developed the labeling and codifying of the basic principles of
the scientific fact of evolution, his work has been improved upon and
updated in the last 150 years, and that you should try harder to keep
up.
cf also
Karsch-Haack, Ferdinand "Liebe auf Sozialität? Eine begründete
Zurückweisung" (1905)
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 09:14:14 PM |
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<snip>
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off and
hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book. Not likely,
eh?
Wendell and Cass, the same-sex penguin couple at New York Aquarium in
Coney Island, Brooklyn, are African black-footed penguins, which mate
for life, unlike most christstain humans. Wendell and Cass have been
together for 10 years to date. (Eat your heart out, Britney Spears).
Central Park Zoo's Silo and Roy, Chinstrap penguins, do not mate for
life, just like most human christstains. After raising their chick
Tango, Silo did leave Roy, after 9 years, for a female named Scrappy
in September of 2005.
Unlike most of their human christstain counterparts, however, Silo and
Roy did wait until Tango was out of the nest before amicably
divorcing.
Although Roy is still single and celibate, unlike most human
christstain allegedly heterosexual males, Silo is practicing his
celibacy with his girlfriend Scrappy. Zookeepers are certain that
neither has ever seen an episode of "Will and Grace."
Must suck for ya, Hugh, that two pairs of gay penguins have a better
track record than 50+% of marriages between humans who happen to be
christstains.
Oh, and Tango (Silo and Roy's adopted child) turned out heterosexual,
healthy, and happy.
And yes, all of the above is true, I kid you not.
Well, thank you for clearing that up, BB, caustic and uncalled for
comments notwithstanding.
So, when a pair of gay penguins demonstrates a better track record
than OVER HALF of all marriages by members of your own cult, you find
that offensive because it's true. Cute.
Yeah.. but the penguins split up- oh, never mind.
Bagemihl, Bruce "Biological Exuberance: Animal Homosexuality and
Natural Diversity"
Stonewall Inn Editions (April 1, 2000)
ISBN: 031225377X
What's this?
A proper citation of peer-reviewed, current, mainstream scientific
literature, which substantiates all the claims above WRT African
black-footed and Chinstrap penguins. Take note. I know this is a lot
of new information for you to process, but I have _faith_ in your
ability to do so.
<snip Hugh's recounting of his past romantic encounters>
Oh, you're just nasty, aren't you?
Now *that* was caustic. Oh, oops. My bad.
sheesh.
Anyhow, about the book: does it suggest that there are
actual homo-oriented-sexual animals?
It does not suggest. It documents and provides proof thereof.
I realize that reality-based evidence is anathema in your cult, but
that shouldn't preclude you from reading it for yourself.
The other tome (Karsch-Haack) is, AFAIK, out of print, but you should
be able to procure a copy through the inter-library loan service at
your local public library.
The fact of homosexuality occurring naturally among species other than
homo sapiens is neither new nor original.
Good grief, that serves no
biological purpose whatsoever and defies natural selection; what would
the Darwinists say?
After they were done laughing, they'd first tell you that although
Darwin developed the labeling and codifying of the basic principles of
the scientific fact of evolution, his work has been improved upon and
updated in the last 150 years, and that you should try harder to keep
up.
Okay, other than serving no biological purpose, homosexuality is a
trait that cannot be passed genetically (for obvious reasons) Yet,
despite being continuously bred out of the population it seems to
reoccur in subsequent generations. Just how does this happen? It
doesn't fit with the scientific 'fact' of evolution. A flaw in our DNA?
Surely, such a useless genetic aberration would disappear via natural
selection. Consider the appendix; the last remnants of digestive organ
that we no longer use; no doubt future generations of humans will no
longer have one. However, there are still homosexuals; more than ever
it would seem. Our (Catholic) theory of people being 'created' rather
than just evolving from a slurry of random genetic material seems to
make more logical sense in this case; don't you think?
H.
--
"There is no strength in unbelief. Even the unbelief of what is false
is no source of might. It is the truth shining from behind that gives
the strength to disbelieve."
-George MacDonald
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| User: "Bonnie Bitch" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
06 Mar 2006 10:01:53 PM |
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On 6 Mar 2006 19:14:14 -0800, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of
gemond@canada.com
<snip>
Didn't those two supposedly 'gay' penguins eventually waddle off and
hook up with females? I wonder if THAT part is in the book. Not likely,
eh?
Wendell and Cass, the same-sex penguin couple at New York Aquarium in
Coney Island, Brooklyn, are African black-footed penguins, which mate
for life, unlike most christstain humans. Wendell and Cass have been
together for 10 years to date. (Eat your heart out, Britney Spears).
Central Park Zoo's Silo and Roy, Chinstrap penguins, do not mate for
life, just like most human christstains. After raising their chick
Tango, Silo did leave Roy, after 9 years, for a female named Scrappy
in September of 2005.
Unlike most of their human christstain counterparts, however, Silo and
Roy did wait until Tango was out of the nest before amicably
divorcing.
Although Roy is still single and celibate, unlike most human
christstain allegedly heterosexual males, Silo is practicing his
celibacy with his girlfriend Scrappy. Zookeepers are certain that
neither has ever seen an episode of "Will and Grace."
Must suck for ya, Hugh, that two pairs of gay penguins have a better
track record than 50+% of marriages between humans who happen to be
christstains.
Oh, and Tango (Silo and Roy's adopted child) turned out heterosexual,
healthy, and happy.
And yes, all of the above is true, I kid you not.
Well, thank you for clearing that up, BB, caustic and uncalled for
comments notwithstanding.
So, when a pair of gay penguins demonstrates a better track record
than OVER HALF of all marriages by members of your own cult, you find
that offensive because it's true. Cute.
Yeah.. but the penguins split up- oh, never mind.
Yeah, Roy and Silo split up, just like over half of all christstain
marriages. Unlike the christstains, though, they waited to divorce
until the kid was out of the house.
And Silo and Scrappy have yet to exhibit any mating behavior.
Zookeepers have confirmed that neither Scrappy nor Silo has seen an
episode of Will & Grace or The 700 Club.
Besides, Silo and Roy's marriage lasted 3105 times longer than Britney
Spears' first bout with "holy matrimony" did.
Now, let's talk about Wendell and Cass, two male African black-footed
penguins, which species mates for life.
Bagemihl, Bruce "Biological Exuberance: Animal Homosexuality and
Natural Diversity"
Stonewall Inn Editions (April 1, 2000)
ISBN: 031225377X
What's this?
A proper citation of peer-reviewed, current, mainstream scientific
literature, which substantiates all the claims above WRT African
black-footed and Chinstrap penguins. Take note. I know this is a lot
of new information for you to process, but I have _faith_ in your
ability to do so.
<snip Hugh's recounting of his past romantic encounters>
Oh, you're just nasty, aren't you?
Honey, did catch my screen name? It ain't Nancy Nice.
Besides, YOU earned it, Hughie.
Now *that* was caustic. Oh, oops. My bad.
sheesh.
And now you know the difference between humor and caustic, Hughie.
Anyhow, about the book: does it suggest that there are
actual homo-oriented-sexual animals?
It does not suggest. It documents and provides proof thereof.
I realize that reality-based evidence is anathema in your cult, but
that shouldn't preclude you from reading it for yourself.
The other tome (Karsch-Haack) is, AFAIK, out of print, but you should
be able to procure a copy through the inter-library loan service at
your local public library.
The fact of homosexuality occurring naturally among species other than
homo sapiens is neither new nor original.
Good grief, that serves no
biological purpose whatsoever and defies natural selection; what would
the Darwinists say?
After they were done laughing, they'd first tell you that although
Darwin developed the labeling and codifying of the basic principles of
the scientific fact of evolution, his work has been improved upon and
updated in the last 150 years, and that you should try harder to keep
up.
Okay, other than serving no biological purpose,
Just like non-reproductive sex between you heterosexuals, which would
amount to about 98% of all the sex you people have........
homosexuality is a
trait that cannot be passed genetically (for obvious reasons)
And yet, bunky, it keeps occurring at the same steady rate, from
generation to generation.
Just as one need not have blue eyes to pass along blue eyes to
offspring, one need not have the genetic
predisposition/propensity/trait for homosexuality to pass that along,
either.
Are you starting to grasp why the "Darwinists" are laughing at you,
Hughie?
Yet,
despite being continuously bred out of the population
Except for that not happening and having never happened and never
happening......
it seems to
reoccur in subsequent generations.
Then it's not being "bred out." Thanks for defeating your own
argument.
Just how does this happen?
Just as one need not have blue eyes to pass along blue eyes to
offspring, one need not have the genetic
predisposition/propensity/trait for homosexuality to pass that along,
either.
It
doesn't fit with the scientific 'fact' of evolution.
Sure it does. Traits need not be double dominant to be passed along.
Basic biology, which discipline is based on the FACT of evolution.
A flaw in our DNA?
Nope. Care to try again?
Think "benefit."
Surely, such a useless genetic aberration would disappear via natural
selection.
And yet, by your own admission, it hasn't disappeared. Again, thanks
for refuting yourself.
Consider the appendix; the last remnants of digestive organ
that we no longer use; no doubt future generations of humans will no
longer have one. However, there are still homosexuals; more than ever
it would seem. Our (Catholic) theory of people being 'created' rather
than just evolving from a slurry of random genetic material seems to
make more logical sense in this case; don't you think?
So why would your alleged "creator" give people vestigial organs WHOSE
MALFUNCTIONING CAN KILL YOU?
Is your "creator" really that big of a dipshit?
(Go ahead, use the "the eye couldn't have evolved" schtick, because I
have a really caustic comeback for that one, along with the science
proving that it did evolve.)
And, by your own admission just now, your "creator" made homosexuals
just as they are, which sort of kills the rest of your spurious,
specious rationalizations.
As for the rest -- I do think, which is how I know your bifurcated
musing is crap.
Look, I know you have HUGE issues with science and reality-based fact,
Hugh, but this is basic biology. Surely they were teaching biology at
your cult training center when you attended?
Since you want to be judgmental and rationalize your anti-gay bigotry
by a priori labeling homosexuality a "genetic defect," then trying to
justify it with your lackluster ignorance of biology, please suit
yourself.
IF, by some remote chance, you do want to have a real discussion, then
you have to do three things:
1. Give up the anti-gay crap.
2. Abandon the whacko a priori assumptions.
3. Familiarize yourself with the following terms, in the context of
biology:
DNA, RNA, heredity, dominant, recessive, trait, double dominant,
congenital, genetic, flaw, benefit, and purpose.
Also, "reoccur" is not a word. The word you were grasping for is
"recur."
If you can manage to do that, then we can discuss, as equals.
Until then, I am under no obligation to even entertain your
rationalized crap, let alone provide you with an education.
Your choice.
.
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| User: "Hugh Betcha" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
07 Mar 2006 01:20:17 AM |
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Yeah.. but the penguins split up- oh, never mind.
Yeah, Roy and Silo split up, just like over half of all christstain
marriages. Unlike the christstains, though, they waited to divorce
until the kid was out of the house.
And Silo and Scrappy have yet to exhibit any mating behavior.
Zookeepers have confirmed that neither Scrappy nor Silo has seen an
episode of Will & Grace or The 700 Club.
Neither have I, to be honest.
Besides, Silo and Roy's marriage lasted 3105 times longer than Britney
Spears' first bout with "holy matrimony" did.
Nothing 'holy' about that.
Now, let's talk about Wendell and Cass, two male African black-footed
penguins, which species mates for life.
MORE gay penguins?! What is it with those birds?
<snippitysnipsnipsnip>
And, by your own admission just now, your "creator" made homosexuals
just as they are, which sort of kills the rest of your spurious,
specious rationalizations.
Actually, I was trying to support the 'creator' theory... It's you that
is making the assumptions. I don't really think gay people are 'genetic
defects' or 'aberrations'; my use of those terms was a backhanded dig
at you... at least I now when you are insulting me; I don't need it
explained. Anyhow, back to the matter at hand.
Okay, Darwin Darling, explain to me how traits that don't exist as
genes are passed down by people who don't procreate. We're assuming
that evolution is real now, and every part of our beings evolved as a
result of random genetic mutations filtered through 'survival of the
fittest' or the more PC 'natural selection' Now some things are
obviously useful; the eyes, as you mentioned, and the opposable thumbs.
Some traits however; such as homosexuality or, to be fair, belief in
the supernatural, are patently useless and even detrimental to our
survival. Yet, these traits continue to be 'passed down'.
As for the rest -- I do think, which is how I know your bifurcated
musing is crap.
I actually had to look up "bifurcated" Good one.
Look, I know you have HUGE issues with science and reality-based fact,
Hugh, but this is basic biology. Surely they were teaching biology at
your cult training center when you attended?
Since you want to be judgmental and rationalize your anti-gay bigotry
by a priori labeling homosexuality a "genetic defect," then trying to
justify it with your lackluster ignorance of biology, please suit
yourself.
You've failed to demonstrate an understanding of the subject any higher
than elementary school yourself, you know. Saying : "I'm right and
you're an idiot." doesn't actually require any expertise.
IF, by some remote chance, you do want to have a real discussion, then
you have to do three things:
1. Give up the anti-gay crap.
I'm far from anti-gay. So far, it's my desire to lump gays in with the
rest of us human beings and not put them on some sort of pedestal that
pisses you off.
2. Abandon the whacko a priori assumptions.
Okay, you first.
3. Familiarize yourself with the following terms, in the context of
biology:
DNA, RNA, heredity, dominant, recessive, trait, double dominant,
congenital, genetic, flaw, benefit, and purpose.
Also, "reoccur" is not a word. The word you were grasping for is
"recur."
Ooooh. A spelling flame... thou hast fatally wounded me... ahhh ....
the rest is silence...
*exeunt*
If you can manage to do that, then we can discuss, as equals.
Until then, I am under no obligation to even entertain your
rationalized crap, let alone provide you with an education.
Naw, you can't help yourself; you HAVE to have the last word.
.
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| User: "LAmazone" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
07 Mar 2006 08:03:58 AM |
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Hugh Betcha wrote:
Now, let's talk about Wendell and Cass, two male African black-footed
penguins, which species mates for life.
MORE gay penguins?! What is it with those birds?
Male birds in tuxedos, of course there will be a higher incidence of
homosexuality
--
Natalie Clifford Barney
Membre; L' Academie des Femmes
One of the Lesbian Immortals of the Left Bank
We never die....
"If too little of the love I invoke appears in this book, it is because I
have better spent it elsewhere. Here there remain only fragments."
.
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| User: "Jeff North" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
07 Mar 2006 03:02:36 AM |
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On 6 Mar 2006 23:20:17 -0800, in alt.politics.homosexuality "Hugh
Betcha" <gemond@canada.com>
<1141716017.283810.317370@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com> wrote:
[snip]
| Actually, I was trying to support the 'creator' theory... It's you that
| is making the assumptions. I don't really think gay people are 'genetic
| defects' or 'aberrations'; my use of those terms was a backhanded dig
| at you... at least I now when you are insulting me; I don't need it
| explained. Anyhow, back to the matter at hand.
| Okay, Darwin Darling, explain to me how traits that don't exist as
| genes are passed down by people who don't procreate.
Such as sterile male and females who can't procreate.
| We're assuming
| that evolution is real now, and every part of our beings evolved as a
| result of random genetic mutations filtered through 'survival of the
| fittest' or the more PC 'natural selection' Now some things are
| obviously useful; the eyes, as you mentioned, and the opposable thumbs.
| Some traits however; such as homosexuality or, to be fair, belief in
| the supernatural, are patently useless and even detrimental to our
| survival. Yet, these traits continue to be 'passed down'.
Then obviously such traits aren't "patently useless" are they?
[snip]
---------------------------------------------------------------
jnorthau@yourpantsyahoo.com.au : Remove your pants to reply
---------------------------------------------------------------
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| User: "Bonnie Bitch" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
07 Mar 2006 04:26:36 AM |
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On 6 Mar 2006 23:20:17 -0800, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of "Hugh
Betcha" <gemond@canada.com>
Yeah.. but the penguins split up- oh, never mind.
Yeah, Roy and Silo split up, just like over half of all christstain
marriages. Unlike the christstains, though, they waited to divorce
until the kid was out of the house.
And Silo and Scrappy have yet to exhibit any mating behavior.
Zookeepers have confirmed that neither Scrappy nor Silo has seen an
episode of Will & Grace or The 700 Club.
Neither have I, to be honest.
Well, for once you're in great company. Penguins are very sensitive,
discriminating creatures.
Besides, Silo and Roy's marriage lasted 3105 times longer than Britney
Spears' first bout with "holy matrimony" did.
Nothing 'holy' about that.
And yet, how many of you christstains complained about it, as
vociferously as you gripe about same-sex marriage?
How many of you christstains, who keep insisting that matrimony is
some holy, ah-boogah-boogah cultic rite, are condemning drive-thru
wedding chapels as nastily as you condemn gay people for daring to
want to get legally married?
How many of you christstains, who moan and wail (with obligatory
gnashing teeth) about the alleged destruction of marriage by people
who, by and large, aren't even allowed to get married, can bother
yourselves with addressing your own divorces, which divorce rate tops
50% in the US?
Now, let's talk about Wendell and Cass, two male African black-footed
penguins, which species mates for life.
MORE gay penguins?! What is it with those birds?
Homosexuality occurs in practically every species on the planet, from
aardvarks to zebras.
SUGGESTED READING:
Bagemihl, Bruce "Biological Exuberance: Animal Homosexuality and
Natural Diversity"
Stonewall Inn Editions (April 1, 2000)
ISBN: 031225377X
cf also
Karsch-Haack, Ferdinand "Liebe auf Sozialität? Eine begründete
Zurückweisung" (1905)
<snippitysnipsnipsnip>
And, by your own admission just now, your "creator" made homosexuals
just as they are, which sort of kills the rest of your spurious,
specious rationalizations.
Actually, I was trying to support the 'creator' theory...
Too bad you shredded it with your own words, though.
And you misspelled "fantasy speculation."
The "Goddidit" excuse, in whatever form it currently masquerades as,
is not science. It's religion.
It's you that
is making the assumptions.
Except for my making none, but do continue.
I don't really think gay people are 'genetic
defects' or 'aberrations'; my use of those terms was a backhanded dig
at you...
Your aim sucks. Put the mirror down.
Now, honey, *that* was a dig, but with the <forehand crack>.
at least I now when you are insulting me;
What was your first clue? I know -- it was when I began a sentence
with "you are" and ended with a predicate involving an aspersion,
possibly followed by an adjective clause just to clear up any
ambiguity.
I don't need it
explained. Anyhow, back to the matter at hand.
Okay, Darwin Darling, explain to me how traits that don't exist as
genes are passed down by people who don't procreate.
Wow. Your ignorance of biology is astounding. Catholic education, I
presume?
At any rate -- I hope you did your vocabulary homework, because I'm
not backtracking for you.
First off, Darwin is so 150 years ago. He started the whole mess,
which we now affectionately call "modern biology," but thanks to the
lovely follow-up work of people like Mendel and the guys who
discovered DNA, our knowledge has not only increased but has also
superceded Darwin.
Secondly, we need to do some extra vocab work, with some not
previously assigned terms, not that you bothered to look up the
assigned terms anyway.
Genotype -- the genetic constitution of an organism, as distinct from
its phenotype
Phenotype -- the total characteristics displayed by an organism
resulting from interaction between the genotype and the environment.
Traits -- qualitative, expressed characteristics attributed to
phenotype
Allele -- Any one of a series of two or more different genes that
occupy the same position (locus) on a chromosome.
homozygote -- A true breeding organism because the alleles for a
particular characteristic on each chromosome are identical, therefore
produce the same phenotypical result.
heterozygote -- A diploid cell that possesses two different alleles of
for the same gene.
Recessive -- An allele or mutation that is only expressed
phenotypically when it is present in the homozygous form.
Dominant -- A gene is said to be dominant if it expresses its
phenotype even in the presence of a recessive gene.
Traits require genotype (DNA), but the expression of the trait, and
even the trait itself, also has an environmental factor to be
considered when viewing the trait.
That alone renders your assertion above as ignorant crap.
But let's continue --
Traits -- let's take the trait of being left-handed.
Two right-handed parents can produce an offspring who is left-handed.
Done stammering yet? Good. Here's how.
The offspring gets his/her DNA from the parents.
One of the parents had a recessive gene for left-handedness.
Now, we've got the left-handedness gene present when the right-handed
gene is dominant, making the LH gene recessive.
That's the genotype, which has obscured the recessive LH gene.
BUT -- we have an environment to consider. And that would be the womb,
where the offspring develops. IF the right series of hormones is
introduced to the developing, pre-natal offspring, those hormones can
make the recessive LH gene activate and override the RH gene.
Voila! One left-handed child from two left-handed parents.
Now, here's the fun part -- the offspring got the LH gene from the
mother, who happens to have a left-handed brother.
The left-handed brother never had offspring. And yet, the LH gene was
still passed down to the sister's offspring.
And that, in a nutshell, is how genes and expressed traits of an
individual can be and are passed down, even if the individual does not
procreate.
Now, I realize you have a HUGE problem with science, facts, and
reality, favoring to denigrate that which can be observed, tested for,
and replicated. And you will probably dismiss this cogent explanation
as something with which you needn't bother, or worse (smart money says
worse). But that's how biology works, more or less.
We're assuming
that evolution is real now,
No assumption required.
If evolution did not occur, you would be a clone of your father.
Remember -- evolution is the change in genetic characteristics of a
given population over time.
Left-handed offspring from right-handed parents proves this, as do
highly intelligent parents producing offspring with Down's Syndrome
and any produced offspring with physical/mental characteristics not
expressed by the parents.
and every part of our beings evolved
Whoa! You keep denying evolution. Your use of the word "evolve" is
hypocritical, at least.
as a
result of random genetic mutations filtered through 'survival of the
fittest' or the more PC 'natural selection'
There's nothing PC or even connotative/pejorative about natural
selection (genotype environment interactions occurring at the
phenotypic level leading to differential reproductive success of
individuals and hence to modification of the gene pool of a
population).
It's the observable phenomenon that actually occurs.
Oh, and "survival of the fittest" was abandoned about 100 years ago,
post Mendel.
The idea of "survival" is that organisms best equipped to deal with
the environment (cf phenotype) tend to live long enough to reproduce.
Therefore, those genes tend to be passed on dominantly, and typically
show up as the phenotype.
Now some things are
obviously useful; the eyes, as you mentioned, and the opposable thumbs.
Every musician I know would be beyond screwed without opposable
thumbs, so yeah -- great idea! Let's all thank our common mammalian
ancestors for breeding that trait into the species.
Oh, and I mentioned the eyes as a slam against christstain
creationism. After all, only a raving dipshit would design a
wide-angle lens with a frikkin' blind spot.
Some traits however; such as homosexuality or, to be fair, belief in
the supernatural, are patently useless and even detrimental to our
survival.
IF (and it's a BIG OLE IF) belief in the supernatural is indeed a
genetic attribute, passed down dominantly through reproduction and
manifested in the phenotype, then there is, most likely, a genetic
benefit for that phenotype. Perhaps less risk of gum disease, because
it sure tends to rob one of intelligence and critical thinking skills.
Now, wouldn't you know it? I'm one of those big screaming
atheist-commie-pinko-homos who will tell anyone (even anti-gay bigots
named Hugh who are desperately seeking to rationalize their bigotry)
that IMO, homosexuality is not solely genetic.
Per the left-hand and twin concordance studies, and with the fact that
sexual orientation is determined by late childhood at the very latest,
it is most likely that homosexuality is manifested in phenotype as
outlined above for left-handedness.
Two hetero parents -- gay child. Recessive gene for homosexuality (or
recessive gene for potential to become homosexual phenotype upon
exposure to the right combo of hormones in utero) exposed to the right
combo of hormones in utero -- badabing! Gay child.
Of course, your assumption that gay parents never reproduce is
patently absurd. The additional truth to that is that gay parents
produce no more gay offspring than the rate at which heteros produce
gay offspring.
Yet, these traits continue to be 'passed down'.
Yup, and now you know how. More or less.
I strongly suggest that you do your own homework on the subject,
though, because my explanation is designed basically as a "biology for
non-biologists" schtick (more so for myself, using vocabulary I
already have).
As for the rest -- I do think, which is how I know your bifurcated
musing is crap.
I actually had to look up "bifurcated" Good one.
And it's still fallacious.
Look, I know you have HUGE issues with science and reality-based fact,
Hugh, but this is basic biology. Surely they were teaching biology at
your cult training center when you attended?
Since you want to be judgmental and rationalize your anti-gay bigotry
by a priori labeling homosexuality a "genetic defect," then trying to
justify it with your lackluster ignorance of biology, please suit
yourself.
You've failed to demonstrate an understanding of the subject any higher
than elementary school yourself, you know. Saying : "I'm right and
you're an idiot." doesn't actually require any expertise.
Except for when I explained the subject matter in detail, for your
benefit.
Besides, anyone who didn't sleep through basic biology knows, at least
in passing, how genes from a non-reproducing organism can be passed
down to succeeding generations.
Wanna hear the saga of my family WRT music? It's a hoot, lemme tell
ya.
IF, by some remote chance, you do want to have a real discussion, then
you have to do three things:
1. Give up the anti-gay crap.
I'm far from anti-gay.
Yeahyeahyeah, sure you are, as long as we don't get married, raise
kids, show any PDA, talk about our lives like heteros do, refer to our
lives with any adjectives even remotely positive, and keep our mouths
shut when the christstains bleat "fags are going to hell," or even
whisper that being gay isn't some sort of heinous genetic
defect/mental illness.
Beyond that, you're just fine and dandy.
So far, it's my desire to lump gays in with the
rest of us human beings and not put them on some sort of pedestal that
pisses you off.
Hugh, you so need to check that bag of ***** you're carrying
around.
2. Abandon the whacko a priori assumptions.
Okay, you first.
I made none to abandon. Oh, and that was a really lame special case of
fallacy of presupposition, commonly referred to by its acronym
IKYABWAI.
3. Familiarize yourself with the following terms, in the context of
biology:
DNA, RNA, heredity, dominant, recessive, trait, double dominant,
congenital, genetic, flaw, benefit, and purpose.
Also, "reoccur" is not a word. The word you were grasping for is
"recur."
Ooooh. A spelling flame...
Of course, you avoided the fact that you didn't for your homework and
still have no ideas what the terms being used in discussion mean.
But hey -- maybe if you focus on your made-up word long enough, you'll
forget about your embarrassment concerning the above terms. Maybe.
Possibly.
thou hast fatally wounded me... ahhh ....
the rest is silence...
*exeunt*
Suit yourself, Hughie.
If you can manage to do that, then we can discuss, as equals.
Until then, I am under no obligation to even entertain your
rationalized crap, let alone provide you with an education.
Naw, you can't help yourself; you HAVE to have the last word.
P-K-Hugh.
Too bad that civilized conversation is beneath you, as you just
admitted. You could have learned something, just like I did when I
went back and reviewed basic biology.
.
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| User: "Hugh Betcha" |
|
| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
09 Mar 2006 08:01:24 PM |
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|
Bonnie ***** wrote:
On 6 Mar 2006 23:20:17 -0800, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of "Hugh
Betcha" <gemond@canada.com>
Yeah.. but the penguins split up- oh, never mind.
Yeah, Roy and Silo split up, just like over half of all christstain
marriages. Unlike the christstains, though, they waited to divorce
until the kid was out of the house.
And Silo and Scrappy have yet to exhibit any mating behavior.
Zookeepers have confirmed that neither Scrappy nor Silo has seen an
episode of Will & Grace or The 700 Club.
Neither have I, to be honest.
Well, for once you're in great company. Penguins are very sensitive,
discriminating creatures.
So are Irishmen ;)
Besides, Silo and Roy's marriage lasted 3105 times longer than Britney
Spears' first bout with "holy matrimony" did.
Nothing 'holy' about that.
And yet, how many of you christstains complained about it, as
vociferously as you gripe about same-sex marriage?
How many of you christstains, who keep insisting that matrimony is
some holy, ah-boogah-boogah cultic rite, are condemning drive-thru
wedding chapels as nastily as you condemn gay people for daring to
want to get legally married?
Well, yes, we (Catholics, anyway) consider marriage a sacrament.
How many of you christstains, who moan and wail (with obligatory
gnashing teeth) about the alleged destruction of marriage by people
who, by and large, aren't even allowed to get married, can bother
yourselves with addressing your own divorces, which divorce rate tops
50% in the US?
Okay, your point is well taken. The 'institution' is in a shambles; and
the frivolity with which people treat it has done far more damage than
some gay marriages ever will. The denominations that condemn gay
marriage the loudest also seem to be the ones that have denied the
sacramentality of marriage; allow divorces, remarriages and
contraception... yes, rather hypocritical. That said; I still don't
think homosexuals should be married. The 'state' has no business,
authority or right to be enacting laws that define 'marriage'.
<snip biology lesson, which left Hugh rather embarassed, considering
that he graduated with honours in biology; has a left handed daughter;
and carries that nasty gene for asthma susceptibility>
Too bad that civilized conversation is beneath you, as you just
admitted. You could have learned something, just like I did when I
went back and reviewed basic biology.
Alright, fine. The pinko-atheist-commie-homo is right about the
biology; okay? There. I said it. Sheesh. Now be nice.
.
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| User: "thomas p" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
10 Mar 2006 11:31:41 AM |
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On 9 Mar 2006 18:01:24 -0800, "Hugh Betcha" <gemond@canada.com> wrote:
Bonnie ***** wrote:
On 6 Mar 2006 23:20:17 -0800, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of "Hugh
Betcha" <gemond@canada.com>
snip
How many of you christstains, who moan and wail (with obligatory
gnashing teeth) about the alleged destruction of marriage by people
who, by and large, aren't even allowed to get married, can bother
yourselves with addressing your own divorces, which divorce rate tops
50% in the US?
Okay, your point is well taken. The 'institution' is in a shambles; and
the frivolity with which people treat it has done far more damage than
some gay marriages ever will. The denominations that condemn gay
marriage the loudest also seem to be the ones that have denied the
sacramentality of marriage; allow divorces, remarriages and
contraception... yes, rather hypocritical. That said; I still don't
think homosexuals should be married. The 'state' has no business,
authority or right to be enacting laws that define 'marriage'.
Of course it does. It is not only Christians or even theists who get
married. The rest of us are not subject to your concept of marriage.
Neither you or any church has the authority to determine what marriage
is for anybody but yourselves.
Thomas P.
"Life must be lived forwards but understood backwards"
(Kierkegaard)
.
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| User: "Bonnie Bitch" |
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| Title: Re: Children's Book Sparks Anti-Gay Complaints |
09 Mar 2006 08:46:30 PM |
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On 9 Mar 2006 18:01:24 -0800, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of "Hugh
Betcha" <gemond@canada.com>
Bonnie ***** wrote:
On 6 Mar 2006 23:20:17 -0800, the faaaaabulous supreme deity
Tlahuizcalpantecuhtli, Ruler of the heavens and host of fab parties,
opened the heavens and shone his light upon the wisdom of "Hugh
Betcha" <gemond@canada.com>
Yeah.. but the penguins split up- oh, never mind.
Yeah, Roy and Silo split up, just like over half of all christstain
marriages. Unlike the christstains, though, they waited to divorce
unti | | | | | | | | | | |
