| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"J McCoy" |
| Date: |
10 Nov 2004 02:16:09 AM |
| Object: |
Christianity and Lifestyles |
It just occured to me to bring this topic up since it does have some
validity in the discussion of origins. Namely, what is the purpose
and result of a world view?
Three days a week I work at this grocery store. It's one of my jobs.
And I work with a couple of Christians. They are hard workers and
have something in common. Both were into the drug scene at one time,
both have had obnoxious lifestyles, and both saw their lives going in
the wrong direction. One of the guys has a half brother who isn't a
Christian and he was a pain to work with. He gets fired quite often.
But I find that working with two Christians if quite inspiring. I
don't find them contentious, backstabbing and difficult to work with
as with the other two workers who aren't Christians yet backstab, make
claims that nobody but them are the hard workers , and yet actually
accomplish little compared to the two Christians.
One of the non-Christians is quite obnoxious. Even when you try to
compliment the guy he is rude and sneers it down.
The two Christians had an non-Christian past which was steadily
leading them down the tubes. I also knew a Pastor who had a claw
tattoo and was into the party scene and going in the wrong direction.
There are quite a few other examples I could put out that have
affected my life directly.
I fail to see the point in teaching evolution and skepticism when it
hasn't done any good that I could point to. I know in my life I try
to be helpful to others and do the right thing. In return I often get
treated harshly.
What is the point of teaching evolution when it ultimately doesn't
benefit mankind? If teaching evolution doesn't benefit mankind in a
positive way then it must not be true.
But you ask any Christian what positive things they can point to in
the lives of those who used to be skeptics and they will tell you
about all the good that they have seen.
One of the reasons I converted to Christianity has to do with the fact
that it intellectually gave me reasons to believe, but the second
thing was that High School kids acted like animals and Christianity
gave me reasons to believe in a way of life that was better. I became
a Christian in high school. And no wonder.
JM
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| User: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Harri_Hirvel=E4?=" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity and Lifestyles |
10 Nov 2004 04:13:17 AM |
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On 10.11.2004 10:16 J McCoy kirjoitti:<br>
I fail to see the point in teaching evolution and skepticism when it
hasn't done any good that I could point to. I know in my life I try
to be helpful to others and do the right thing. In return I often get
treated harshly.
Evolution is part of science curriculum, but what do you have in mind
speaking of "teaching skepticism?" While it would make a good class, I
cannot think I ever heard about anyone teaching it.
Skepticism does good things daily: buing a second had car, reading an
email stating "You've already won 500000 dollars!"
Being helpful is human, and there is much more to humanity. You seem a
decent man wishing to help and do the right thing. If that includes
lending money for a friend, helping a strange woman in subway with her
baby carriage... etc. That's the way I try to do the right thing too.
Somehow I get the feel that your "doing the right thing" includes
spreading the gospel or something like that. Of course, anyone should
not treat you harshly for that, but you must understand that spreading
the gospel is "doing the right thing" from the point of view of a very
small bunch of people.
Hari
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| User: "Klaus Hellnick" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity and Lifestyles |
10 Nov 2004 06:41:33 AM |
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Harri Hirvelä wrote:
On 10.11.2004 10:16 J McCoy kirjoitti:<br>
I fail to see the point in teaching evolution and skepticism when it
hasn't done any good that I could point to. I know in my life I try
to be helpful to others and do the right thing. In return I often get
treated harshly.
Evolution is part of science curriculum, but what do you have in mind
speaking of "teaching skepticism?" While it would make a good class, I
cannot think I ever heard about anyone teaching it.
Skepticism does good things daily: buing a second had car, reading an
email stating "You've already won 500000 dollars!"
Being helpful is human, and there is much more to humanity. You seem a
decent man wishing to help and do the right thing. If that includes
lending money for a friend, helping a strange woman in subway with her
baby carriage... etc. That's the way I try to do the right thing too.
Somehow I get the feel that your "doing the right thing" includes
spreading the gospel or something like that. Of course, anyone should
not treat you harshly for that, but you must understand that spreading
the gospel is "doing the right thing" from the point of view of a very
small bunch of people.
Hari
Harri, you really do not know Mr. McCoy. This post, seeming very
reasonable, is quite atypical. Please read some of his other posts to
see what he is really like.
Klaus
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| User: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Harri_Hirvel=E4?=" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity and Lifestyles |
10 Nov 2004 11:18:48 AM |
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On 10.11.2004 14:41 Klaus Hellnick kirjoitti:<br>
Harri, you really do not know Mr. McCoy. This post, seeming very
reasonable, is quite atypical. Please read some of his other posts to
see what he is really like.
Klaus
Klaus,
Thanks for update!
Harri
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| User: "agray" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity and Lifestyles |
10 Nov 2004 03:11:10 PM |
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Harri Hirvelä wrote:
On 10.11.2004 10:16 J McCoy kirjoitti:<br>
I fail to see the point in teaching evolution and skepticism when it
hasn't done any good that I could point to. I know in my life I try
to be helpful to others and do the right thing. In return I often get
treated harshly.
Evolution is part of science curriculum, but what do you have in mind
speaking of "teaching skepticism?" While it would make a good class, I
cannot think I ever heard about anyone teaching it.
Actually, when I was in 3rd, 4th and 5th grades (1973,4,5), we did cover
"truth in advertising" and a few other related subjects. We'd put together
a scrapbook with examples cut from advertisements, of about 15 or so
different tricks advertisers use, from "weasel words" (yes, we used that
term) to using mythological symbols (Hermes as the FTD Florist guy, "Midas"
mufflers, etc.) to why big city banks all have huge marble pillars, etc.
They even had us looking at liquor ads with a magnifying glass, trying to
see if there really were air-brushed symbols in the ice and/or pouring
liquids (it was the 70's, after all...). (we didn't really find any, btw)
It definitely laid the foundation for a life of skepticism. Until recently
I figured it was standard curriculum for all kids. It sure as heck should
be.
--
"By this logic, teaching anti-discrimination against ethnic minorities is
going to turn white people black." --OrangeSFO on rec.gambling.poker
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| User: "Meteorite Debris" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity and Lifestyles |
10 Nov 2004 05:59:05 PM |
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On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 08:16:09 +0000 (UTC) the ET form known as J
McCoy<mccoy@sunset.net> sent a radio signal across the vast expanse of
deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.
What is the point of teaching evolution when it ultimately doesn't
benefit mankind? If teaching evolution doesn't benefit mankind in a
positive way then it must not be true.
Continental drift does not benefit humans either. Therefore it does
not happen.
--
epicurus1*at*optusnet*dot*com*dot*au
apatriot #1, atheist #1417,
Chief EAC prophet
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~pk1956/
Apatriotism Yahoo Group
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/apatriotism
"Properly read, the Bible is the most potent force for atheism ever
conceived." - Isaac Asimov
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| User: "Robert Weldon" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity and Lifestyles |
10 Nov 2004 07:49:37 PM |
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"Meteorite Debris" <abuse@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1bfd4448e94dc43a989f41@news.optusnet.com.au...
On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 08:16:09 +0000 (UTC) the ET form known as J
McCoy<mccoy@sunset.net> sent a radio signal across the vast expanse of
deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.
What is the point of teaching evolution when it ultimately doesn't
benefit mankind? If teaching evolution doesn't benefit mankind in a
positive way then it must not be true.
Continental drift does not benefit humans either. Therefore it does
not happen.
Yes it does, it's just a really, really, really slow garbage disposal
system.
--
epicurus1*at*optusnet*dot*com*dot*au
apatriot #1, atheist #1417,
Chief EAC prophet
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~pk1956/
Apatriotism Yahoo Group
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/apatriotism
"Properly read, the Bible is the most potent force for atheism ever
conceived." - Isaac Asimov
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| User: "John Wilkins" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity and Lifestyles |
10 Nov 2004 09:31:54 PM |
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Robert Weldon <rweldon.spamblock@jrpspamblock.ca> wrote:
"Meteorite Debris" <abuse@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1bfd4448e94dc43a989f41@news.optusnet.com.au...
On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 08:16:09 +0000 (UTC) the ET form known as J
McCoy<mccoy@sunset.net> sent a radio signal across the vast expanse of
deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.
What is the point of teaching evolution when it ultimately doesn't
benefit mankind? If teaching evolution doesn't benefit mankind in a
positive way then it must not be true.
Continental drift does not benefit humans either. Therefore it does
not happen.
Yes it does, it's just a really, really, really slow garbage disposal
system.
Maybe we should bury nucular waste at the edges of a subduction zone...
--
John S. Wilkins
web: www.wilkins.id.au blog: evolvethought.blogspot.com
God cheats
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| User: "Richard Forrest" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity and Lifestyles |
11 Nov 2004 02:33:08 AM |
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Meteorite Debris <abuse@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<MPG.1bfd4448e94dc43a989f41@news.optusnet.com.au>...
On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 08:16:09 +0000 (UTC) the ET form known as J
McCoy<mccoy@sunset.net> sent a radio signal across the vast expanse of
deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.
What is the point of teaching evolution when it ultimately doesn't
benefit mankind? If teaching evolution doesn't benefit mankind in a
positive way then it must not be true.
Continental drift does not benefit humans either. Therefore it does
not happen.
It would do if my plans for the tectonic electrical generator are
realised.
If you connect two very, very robust anchors located on either side of
spreading tectonic plates by a very, very high ratio gear box to a
shaft driving an electric generator, you could produce electricity
from the relative movements of the two plates. Of course there may be
a few minor technical problems. (By the way, I'm British, and that has
certain implications in terms of the use of irony).
I see this as the solution to all the worlds energy problems. Of
course we will slow down the rate of drift of tectonic plates which
will make the disposal of radioactive waste by burying it in
subduction zones less viable. By as we will no longer need nuclear
power stations, it won't be a problem.
RF
--
epicurus1*at*optusnet*dot*com*dot*au
apatriot #1, atheist #1417,
Chief EAC prophet
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~pk1956/
Apatriotism Yahoo Group
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/apatriotism
"Properly read, the Bible is the most potent force for atheism ever
conceived." - Isaac Asimov
.
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| User: "AC" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity and Lifestyles |
10 Nov 2004 10:14:27 AM |
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On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 08:16:09 +0000 (UTC),
J McCoy <mccoy@sunset.net> wrote:
<snip>
I fail to see the point in teaching evolution and skepticism when it
hasn't done any good that I could point to. I know in my life I try
to be helpful to others and do the right thing. In return I often get
treated harshly.
That's because your ignorant. Skepticism allows us to weed out crapola like
faith healing, miracle cures, etc. Evolution, of course, is of an enormous
importance in understanding biological systems. Just ask anybody studying
influenza variants.
What has not done the world any good is the lies people like you tell, the
self-proud ignorance you hold, and your unwillingness to even try to
understand a major scientific theory.
What is the point of teaching evolution when it ultimately doesn't
benefit mankind? If teaching evolution doesn't benefit mankind in a
positive way then it must not be true.
You really have no idea how to apply logic. I can only imagine what sort of
a school system produced you. Even if evolution had no benefit to humanity
(which is, of course, nonsense), that has no reflection on whether it
happens or not.
You are getting dull, repetitive and silly. If you truly believe the crap
you right, then you may very well be one of the most ignorant posters on
Usenet.
<snip>
--
Aaron Clausen
mightymartianca@hotmail.com
"My illness is due to my doctor's insistence that I drink milk, a
whitish fluid they force down helpless babies." - WC Fields
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| User: "raven1" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity and Lifestyles |
10 Nov 2004 04:27:22 AM |
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On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 08:16:09 +0000 (UTC), (J McCoy)
wrote:
What is the point of teaching evolution when it ultimately doesn't
benefit mankind?
This is irrelevant to the truth or falsity of evolution. That you
can't comprehend that speaks volumes.
If teaching evolution doesn't benefit mankind in a
positive way then it must not be true.
Non Sequitur. That you can't comprehend that either also speaks
volumes.
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| User: "Mark VandeWettering" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity and Lifestyles |
10 Nov 2004 09:59:31 PM |
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["Followup-To:" header set to talk.origins.]
On 2004-11-10, J McCoy <mccoy@sunset.net> wrote:
It just occured to me to bring this topic up since it does have some
validity in the discussion of origins. Namely, what is the purpose
and result of a world view?
This would seem to be an iffy if not an outright fallacious premise.
Three days a week I work at this grocery store. It's one of my jobs.
Color me surprised.
And I work with a couple of Christians. They are hard workers and
have something in common. Both were into the drug scene at one time,
both have had obnoxious lifestyles, and both saw their lives going in
the wrong direction. One of the guys has a half brother who isn't a
Christian and he was a pain to work with. He gets fired quite often.
I bet you they are still both obnoxious.
But I find that working with two Christians if quite inspiring. I
don't find them contentious, backstabbing and difficult to work with
as with the other two workers who aren't Christians yet backstab, make
claims that nobody but them are the hard workers , and yet actually
accomplish little compared to the two Christians.
One of the non-Christians is quite obnoxious. Even when you try to
compliment the guy he is rude and sneers it down.
The two Christians had an non-Christian past which was steadily
leading them down the tubes. I also knew a Pastor who had a claw
tattoo and was into the party scene and going in the wrong direction.
There are quite a few other examples I could put out that have
affected my life directly.
Whoopdie freakin' do.
I fail to see the point in teaching evolution and skepticism when it
hasn't done any good that I could point to.
Luckily for the world, it is mostly unconcerned with what you think of it.
I know in my life I try to be helpful to others and do the right
thing. In return I often get treated harshly.
When people lie, they are often treated harshly.
What is the point of teaching evolution when it ultimately doesn't
benefit mankind?
Lots of things which happen to be true don't benefit mankind.
But of course, knowledge of evolution does benefit mankind.
If teaching evolution doesn't benefit mankind in a
positive way then it must not be true.
Can you identify which fallacy this is?
But you ask any Christian what positive things they can point to in
the lives of those who used to be skeptics and they will tell you
about all the good that they have seen.
The funny thing is you could probably ask atheists about the
positive affect that atheism has had in their lives, and they will
probably describe just as many good things.
One of the reasons I converted to Christianity has to do with the fact
that it intellectually gave me reasons to believe, but the second
thing was that High School kids acted like animals and Christianity
gave me reasons to believe in a way of life that was better. I became
a Christian in high school. And no wonder.
I don't wonder at all.
JM
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| User: "Phÿltêr" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity and Lifestyles |
10 Nov 2004 04:53:07 AM |
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[posted and mailed]
mccoy@sunset.net (J McCoy) astounded us with:
news:3f355ee.0411100026.5883b50b@posting.google.com:
What is the point of teaching evolution when it ultimately doesn't
benefit mankind? If teaching evolution doesn't benefit mankind in a
positive way then it must not be true.
This is proof positive that you are a moron. How did I arrive at this
conclusion? Work it out.....Oh, and a caveat, you'll have to crack a few
books without "The Holy Bible" written on the front.
--
Phÿltêr
AA#1938
Denizen of Darkness #44 & AFJC Antipodean Attaché
http://forums.clickhalah.com/index.php
Remove "s" to respond
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| User: "raven1" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity and Lifestyles |
10 Nov 2004 08:35:28 AM |
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On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 10:53:07 +0000 (UTC), "Phÿltêr"
<"Phltêr"@hsotmail.com> wrote:
[posted and mailed]
mccoy@sunset.net (J McCoy) astounded us with:
news:3f355ee.0411100026.5883b50b@posting.google.com:
What is the point of teaching evolution when it ultimately doesn't
benefit mankind? If teaching evolution doesn't benefit mankind in a
positive way then it must not be true.
This is proof positive that you are a moron. How did I arrive at this
conclusion? Work it out.....Oh, and a caveat, you'll have to crack a few
books without "The Holy Bible" written on the front.
.
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| User: "raven1" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity and Lifestyles |
10 Nov 2004 08:38:19 AM |
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On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 10:53:07 +0000 (UTC), "Phÿltêr"
<"Phltêr"@hsotmail.com> wrote:
[posted and mailed]
mccoy@sunset.net (J McCoy) astounded us with:
news:3f355ee.0411100026.5883b50b@posting.google.com:
What is the point of teaching evolution when it ultimately doesn't
benefit mankind? If teaching evolution doesn't benefit mankind in a
positive way then it must not be true.
This is proof positive that you are a moron. How did I arrive at this
conclusion? Work it out.....Oh, and a caveat, you'll have to crack a few
books without "The Holy Bible" written on the front.
Actually, McNameless rarely invokes the Bible; he's clearly unfamiliar
with that commandment against bearing false witness.
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| User: "Christopher A. Lee" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity and Lifestyles |
10 Nov 2004 09:29:26 AM |
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On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 14:38:19 +0000 (UTC), raven1
<quoththeraven@nevermore.com> wrote:
On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 10:53:07 +0000 (UTC), "Phÿltêr"
<"Phltêr"@hsotmail.com> wrote:
[posted and mailed]
mccoy@sunset.net (J McCoy) astounded us with:
news:3f355ee.0411100026.5883b50b@posting.google.com:
What is the point of teaching evolution when it ultimately doesn't
benefit mankind? If teaching evolution doesn't benefit mankind in a
positive way then it must not be true.
This is proof positive that you are a moron. How did I arrive at this
conclusion? Work it out.....Oh, and a caveat, you'll have to crack a few
books without "The Holy Bible" written on the front.
Actually, McNameless rarely invokes the Bible; he's clearly unfamiliar
with that commandment against bearing false witness.
As are most net.Christians who cross-post to alt.atheism.
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| User: "Hank" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity and Lifestyles |
10 Nov 2004 01:45:50 PM |
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"Christopher A. Lee" wrote:
On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 14:38:19 +0000 (UTC), raven1
<quoththeraven@nevermore.com> wrote:
<snip>
Actually, McNameless rarely invokes the Bible; he's clearly unfamiliar
with that commandment against bearing false witness.
As are most net.Christians who cross-post to alt.atheism.
They cross-post to alt.atheism to reinforce the fundy propaganda that
all Evilutionists are atheists.
--
Assimilate a pitiful little species like you? I think not! - Q of Borg
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