Religions > Atheism > Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher
| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Sound of Trumpet" |
| Date: |
05 Oct 2006 05:30:04 PM |
| Object: |
Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
http://www.cathnews.com/news/411/131.php
Atheist supports Ratzinger crusade against secularism
Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger has enlisted in his defence of Christianity
against secular Europe, the German philosopher J=FCrgen Habermas, who
said in an essay published this month that "Christianity, and nothing
else, is the ultimate foundation of liberty, conscience, human rights,
and democracy, the benchmarks of Western civilisation".
Habermas, who defines himself as "a methodical atheist", is a member of
the Frankfurt School of philosophy. His most recent essay - A Time of
Transition - was published in Italy this month.
Sandro Magister, the Vatican affairs writer for the Italian news
magazine l'Espresso quotes Habermas' confession that he is is
"enchanted by the seriousness and consistency" of the theology of St.
Thomas Aquinas, "the opposite of the feeble thinking that pervades
current theology".
Habermas says: "Thomas represents a spiritual figure who was able to
prove his authenticity with his own resources. That contemporary
religious leadership lacks an equally solid terrain seems to me an
incontrovertible truth. In the general level;ing of society by the
media everything seems to lose seriousness, even institutionalised
Christianity. But theology would lose its identity if it sought to
uncouple itself from the dogmatic nucleus of religion, and thus from
the religious language in which the community's practices of prayer,
confession, and faith are made concrete."
On relations with other civilisations, Habermas maintains that
"recognising our Judaeo-Christian roots more clearly not only does not
impair intercultural understanding, it is what makes it possible."
Magister said that last month, Cardinal Ratzinger "summoned to the
field as his ally 'the philosopher considered in the world of the
German language as the purest secularist'". He said Ratzinger alluded
to Habermas during a public discussion in Rome with another secularist
intellectual, Ernesto Galli Della Loggia, a professor at the university
of Perugia.
SOURCE
The Church Is Under Siege. But Habermas, the Atheist, Is Coming to its
Defense (L'espresso/www.chiesa 22/11/04)
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
11 Oct 2006 04:38:55 AM |
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Tuco Ramirez wrote:
I knew there would be at least one genius
who would misunderstand.
LOL of course.
That is why prison time, firebombings, beatings, murder soon follow
public discussions.
accept the political realities for what they are --or do not.
[ proposed mathemtical solutions deleted]
The point is that the order of magnitude of
what has been claimed is
total *****.
Perhaps not as much as it might seem to you.
let's leave aside western europe entirely and look at the four
Einsatzgruppen in the east.
and their Baltic and Slavic underlings.
what might be a general figure in those areas ...?
Granted, the Soviet Union had 44 years to present bodies ; i am simply
going by the records the Germans maintained THEMSELVES.
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| User: "Tuco Ramirez" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
11 Oct 2006 10:34:44 AM |
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Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
I knew there would be at least one genius
who would misunderstand.
LOL of course.
That is why prison time, firebombings, beatings, murder soon follow
public discussions.
accept the political realities for what they are --or do not.
[ proposed mathemtical solutions deleted]
The point is that the order of magnitude of
what has been claimed is
total *****.
Perhaps not as much as it might seem to you.
Like I said to my mathematically-challenged friend, I don't claim that
the figures I used are exact and I used figures with round numbers to
keep it simple (from my previous experience with him I have learned
that he regards mathematics to be something "strange and useless"); as
you can see from the results, even the "round number" version of events
was too complicated for my commie friend to digest.
let's leave aside western europe entirely and look at the four
Einsatzgruppen in the east.
and their Baltic and Slavic underlings.
what might be a general figure in those areas ...?
90%-95% of the total.
Granted, the Soviet Union had 44 years to present bodies ; i am simply
going by the records the Germans maintained THEMSELVES.
At some point I knew this; remind me what did the german records say?
Just to get it clear, I am not talking about people killed during the
fighting that occurs during a war, but about the murder of prisoners.
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| User: "Tuco Ramirez" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
11 Oct 2006 10:39:42 AM |
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Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
I knew there would be at least one genius
who would misunderstand.
LOL of course.
That is why prison time, firebombings, beatings, murder soon follow
public discussions.
accept the political realities for what they are --or do not.
[ proposed mathemtical solutions deleted]
The point is that the order of magnitude of
what has been claimed is
total *****.
Perhaps not as much as it might seem to you.
Like I said to my mathematically-challenged friend, I don't claim that
the figures I used are exact and I used figures with round numbers to
keep it simple (from my previous experience with him I have learned
that he regards mathematics to be something "strange and useless"); as
you can see from the results, even the "round number" version of events
was too complicated for my commie friend to digest.
let's leave aside western europe entirely and look at the four
Einsatzgruppen in the east.
and their Baltic and Slavic underlings.
what might be a general figure in those areas ...?
90%-95% of the total.
Granted, the Soviet Union had 44 years to present bodies ; i am simply
going by the records the Germans maintained THEMSELVES.
At some point I knew this; remind me what did the german records say?
Just to get it clear, I am not talking about people killed during the
fighting that occurs during a war, but about the murder of prisoners.
.
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
12 Oct 2006 05:32:13 AM |
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Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
let's leave aside western europe entirely and look at the four
Einsatzgruppen in the east.
and their Baltic and Slavic underlings.
what might be a general figure in those areas ...?
90%-95% of the total.
Granted, the Soviet Union had 44 years to present bodies ; i am simply
going by the records the Germans maintained THEMSELVES.
At some point I knew this; remind me what did the german records say?
Just to get it clear, I am not talking about people killed during the
fighting that occurs during a war,
i.e. partisans out of uniform
but about the murder of prisoners.
these lists in the east were very important to justify the effective
rate of the four special sections, which were informally attached to
Wermacht units at "Army" level.
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| User: "Tuco Ramirez" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
12 Oct 2006 04:07:46 PM |
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Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
let's leave aside western europe entirely and look at the four
Einsatzgruppen in the east.
and their Baltic and Slavic underlings.
what might be a general figure in those areas ...?
90%-95% of the total.
Granted, the Soviet Union had 44 years to present bodies ; i am simply
going by the records the Germans maintained THEMSELVES.
At some point I knew this; remind me what did the german records say?
Just to get it clear, I am not talking about people killed during the
fighting that occurs during a war,
i.e. partisans out of uniform
If you are a fighter, it is reasonable to expect that the enemy will
fight back, don't you think?
It is also reasonable to expect WORSE treatment than if you wear a
uniform which properly identifies you as a combatant, don't you think?
Wouldn't it be great if you could take off your soldiers' uniform (or
never wear one) and expect the enemy to not shoot at you because "you
are not a soldier"!!
but about the murder of prisoners.
these lists in the east were very important to justify the effective
rate of the four special sections, which were informally attached to
Wermacht units at "Army" level.
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
13 Oct 2006 01:58:38 AM |
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Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
let's leave aside western europe entirely and look at the four
Einsatzgruppen in the east.
and their Baltic and Slavic underlings.
what might be a general figure in those areas ...?
90%-95% of the total.
Granted, the Soviet Union had 44 years to present bodies ; i am simply
going by the records the Germans maintained THEMSELVES.
At some point I knew this; remind me what did the german records say?
Just to get it clear, I am not talking about people killed during the
fighting that occurs during a war,
i.e. partisans out of uniform
If you are a fighter, it is reasonable to expect that the enemy will
fight back, don't you think?
It is also reasonable to expect WORSE treatment than if you wear a
uniform which properly identifies you as a combatant, don't you think?
you are presuming and preaching to the choir ; i think combatants
should wear uniforms including partisans when engaged.
on the other hand, in reference to your defense of executing partisans,
as with the chicken and egg, such leaves partisans little choice in the
matter when discussing what to do with surrending uniformed soldiers
when the following day the same uniformed soldiers would not only shoot
them but also unarmed non-combatants "in reprisal."
Wouldn't it be great if you could take off your soldiers' uniform (or
never wear one) and expect the enemy to not shoot at you because "you
are not a soldier"!!
thank you for teaching me.
in fact, when the SS (in fact the most infamous division) were burning
Warsaw to the ground they decided to salute the officers of their enemy
all out of uniform and treated them as infantry POWs.
uniforms are important but when one raises the stakes one must be
prepared to have the cards.
the SS wisely decided to exempt Polish combatants since the entire
population was in 'Total War' and had not surrendered in 1939.
but about the murder of prisoners.
these lists in the east were very important to justify the effective
rate of the four special sections, which were informally attached to
Wermacht units at "Army" level.
No comment on Ohlendorf, Nebe, Stahlecker, and "what's his name"
.... ? What is the meaning of `Judenfrei` ?
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| User: "Tuco Ramirez" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
13 Oct 2006 03:04:20 AM |
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Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
let's leave aside western europe entirely and look at the four
Einsatzgruppen in the east.
and their Baltic and Slavic underlings.
what might be a general figure in those areas ...?
90%-95% of the total.
Granted, the Soviet Union had 44 years to present bodies ; i am simply
going by the records the Germans maintained THEMSELVES.
At some point I knew this; remind me what did the german records say?
Just to get it clear, I am not talking about people killed during the
fighting that occurs during a war,
i.e. partisans out of uniform
If you are a fighter, it is reasonable to expect that the enemy will
fight back, don't you think?
It is also reasonable to expect WORSE treatment than if you wear a
uniform which properly identifies you as a combatant, don't you think?
you are presuming and preaching to the choir ; i think combatants
should wear uniforms including partisans when engaged.
and when not engaged. Either you are a combatant or you are not.
If you want the rights or privileges (whatever you prefer) of a
uniformed soldier, then you must behave like one. Geneva Convention.
on the other hand, in reference to your defense of executing partisans,
as with the chicken and egg, such leaves partisans little choice in the
matter when discussing what to do with surrending uniformed soldiers
I don't think partisans were doing any capturing of soldiers. In any
case, excecution of non-uniformed combatants was done by ALL sides.
For example, I recall at least one case during WWII when a german spy
ring (let's assume that they were all guilty for the sake of argument)
was broken and all of them were killed. They weren't even in the act
of shooting anyboy or sabotaging anything.
when the following day the same uniformed soldiers would not only shoot
them but also unarmed non-combatants "in reprisal."
For pursposes of the tally of murdered ones, I consider the shooting of
non-combatants to be murder. The shooting of non-uniformed combatants
was well know and was standard practice on all sides, so that I
wouldn't consider murder. The shooting of captured uniformed soldiers
I would consider murder.
You said my little calculation was wrong. So how many people do you
calculate to have been murdered by my definition, and by your
definition?
Wouldn't it be great if you could take off your soldiers' uniform (or
never wear one) and expect the enemy to not shoot at you because "you
are not a soldier"!!
thank you for teaching me.
in fact, when the SS (in fact the most infamous division) were burning
Warsaw to the ground they decided to salute the officers of their enemy
all out of uniform and treated them as infantry POWs.
What do you mean "salute the officers of their enemy all out of
uniform"?
uniforms are important but when one raises the stakes one must be
prepared to have the cards.
the SS wisely decided to exempt Polish combatants since the entire
population was in 'Total War' and had not surrendered in 1939.
but about the murder of prisoners.
these lists in the east were very important to justify the effective
rate of the four special sections, which were informally attached to
Wermacht units at "Army" level.
No comment on Ohlendorf, Nebe, Stahlecker, and "what's his name"
... ? What is the meaning of `Judenfrei` ?
Since these units were graded on the numbers killed, don't you think
that they would pad the numbers?
Now, when we are done analizing the murders committed by the germans,
we can go and analize those perpetrated by the english, french and
americans in WWII and other "conflicts", and the opression of other
peoples. You might not like what you read.
.
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
13 Oct 2006 06:45:50 AM |
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Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
you are presuming and preaching to the choir ; i think combatants
should wear uniforms including partisans when engaged.
and when not engaged. Either you are a combatant or you are not.
If you want the rights or privileges (whatever you prefer) of a
uniformed soldier, then you must behave like one.
Geneva Convention.
soldiers are not always in uniform.
when one decides they can be killed while sitting in cafes in civilian
clothing then one raises the stakes.
however, compare Germans in Vichy or even occupied France to those in
the east.
on the other hand, in reference to your defense of executing partisans,
as with the chicken and egg, such leaves partisans little choice in the
matter when discussing what to do with surrending uniformed soldiers
For pursposes of the tally of murdered ones, I consider the shooting of
non-combatants to be murder. The shooting of non-uniformed combatants
was well know and was standard practice on all sides, so that I
wouldn't consider murder. The shooting of captured uniformed soldiers
I would consider murder.
LOL Then the Allied forces were murderers, and quite stupid murderers
as well,
shooting and hacking to death uniformed soldiers who were resting from
the eastern front
or shooting Panzer personnel simply because the uniforms were black LOL
it is a wonder they did not shoot the Polish 22nd Rifles whose emblem
was a swastika
You might be interested in this for entertainment:
IN WHICH WORLD WAR II ARMY SHOULD YOU HAVE FOUGHT ?
http://quizfarm.com/test.php?q_id=194168
You said my little calculation was wrong.
i do not recall saying those words.
So how many people do you
calculate to have been murdered by my definition, and by your
definition?
Our criteria are similar.
i do not wish to include the execution of Soviet Commissars attached to
field units as murder, but to be consistent i must.
Stalin had already broken Jewish power in the Soviet Union but
apparently a majority of the commissars encoutnered were Jews.
including those murders the number is quite high.
are you asking me for a number of Jewish dead in the east ...?
What do you mean "salute the officers of their enemy all out of
uniform"?
i must refer you to photographs and history of warsaw "uprising" August
1944.
Since these units were graded on the numbers killed, don't you think
that they would pad the numbers?
Now, when we are done analizing the murders committed by the germans,
we can go and analize those perpetrated by the english, french and
americans in WWII and other "conflicts", and the opression of other
peoples. You might not like what you read.
LOL you are beginning to sound like a "born again"
Keep it in perspective: Anglo-Americans are self righteous murdering
butchers, Soviet UNion murdering raping butchers, Germans in the east
arrogant murdering butchers.
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| User: "Tuco Ramirez" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
13 Oct 2006 10:52:05 AM |
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Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
you are presuming and preaching to the choir ; i think combatants
should wear uniforms including partisans when engaged.
and when not engaged. Either you are a combatant or you are not.
If you want the rights or privileges (whatever you prefer) of a
uniformed soldier, then you must behave like one.
Geneva Convention.
soldiers are not always in uniform.
And what happened when they were captured out of uniform, and I don't
mean when they were surprised sleeping or takling a bath?
when one decides they can be killed while sitting in cafes in civilian
clothing then one raises the stakes.
however, compare Germans in Vichy or even occupied France to those in
the east.
Who's "one"?
Are you trying to make a point here?
on the other hand, in reference to your defense of executing partisans,
as with the chicken and egg, such leaves partisans little choice in the
matter when discussing what to do with surrending uniformed soldiers
For pursposes of the tally of murdered ones, I consider the shooting of
non-combatants to be murder. The shooting of non-uniformed combatants
was well know and was standard practice on all sides, so that I
wouldn't consider murder. The shooting of captured uniformed soldiers
I would consider murder.
LOL Then the Allied forces were murderers, and quite stupid murderers
as well,
The allied forces did plenty of murdering too. How did you determined
the stupidity level?
shooting and hacking to death uniformed soldiers who were resting from
the eastern front
If they were prisoners, then they were murdered.
or shooting Panzer personnel simply because the uniforms were black LOL
You realize a war was going on, don't you?
it is a wonder they did not shoot the Polish 22nd Rifles whose emblem
was a swastika
You might be interested in this for entertainment:
IN WHICH WORLD WAR II ARMY SHOULD YOU HAVE FOUGHT ?
http://quizfarm.com/test.php?q_id=194168
If those highly civilized europeans want to kill each other, who's poor
Tuco to decide who's right? I say let them kill each other.
You said my little calculation was wrong.
i do not recall saying those words.
You didn't say it was right, so give up your number.
So how many people do you
calculate to have been murdered by my definition, and by your
definition?
Our criteria are similar.
i do not wish to include the execution of Soviet Commissars attached to
field units as murder, but to be consistent i must.
Stalin had already broken Jewish power in the Soviet Union but
apparently a majority of the commissars encoutnered were Jews.
They weren't being killed because they were jewish, but because they
were commies.
including those murders the number is quite high.
are you asking me for a number of Jewish dead in the east ...?
I am asking you for a number of people murdered. In my world nobody is
"chosen" and they get no special treatment. I suppose that makes me
"anti-semitic".
What do you mean "salute the officers of their enemy all out of
uniform"?
i must refer you to photographs and history of warsaw "uprising" August
1944.
If you want to be understood, you need to write complete sentences. If
what you meant is that the polish offficers weren't wearing their
uniforms when they were saluted, and subsequently treated like
soldiers, then I say the german probably didn't have the obligation to
do that (I am no expert on the Geneva Convention), but could do it if
they wanted to.
Since these units were graded on the numbers killed, don't you think
that they would pad the numbers?
No reply to this?
Now, when we are done analizing the murders committed by the germans,
we can go and analize those perpetrated by the english, french and
americans in WWII and other "conflicts", and the opression of other
peoples. You might not like what you read.
LOL you are beginning to sound like a "born again"
How?
Keep it in perspective: Anglo-Americans are self righteous murdering
butchers, Soviet UNion murdering raping butchers, Germans in the east
arrogant murdering butchers.
I know this and I am assuming you are american or english. There is
something in the english and therefore the american gene pool that
provides them with that self-righteousness. Only an american or
englishman can attack another country for no valid reason and claim
self defense. The germans make no pretense.
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
16 Oct 2006 06:53:50 AM |
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Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
You might be interested in this for entertainment:
IN WHICH WORLD WAR II ARMY SHOULD YOU HAVE FOUGHT ?
http://quizfarm.com/test.php?q_id=194168
incidentally my result was overwhelmingly Finland. > 80 percent
italy poland soviet union were around 70-66
germany 44
united states and britain were at the bottom
entertainment in any case
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
16 Oct 2006 06:51:12 AM |
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Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
you are presuming and preaching to the choir ; i think combatants
should wear uniforms including partisans when engaged.
and when not engaged. Either you are a combatant or you are not.
If you want the rights or privileges (whatever you prefer) of a
uniformed soldier, then you must behave like one.
Geneva Convention.
soldiers are not always in uniform.
And what happened when they were captured out of uniform,
and I don't
mean when they were surprised sleeping
or takling a bath?
are you asking for examples ? they vary from culture to culture,
conflict to conflict, "theatre to theatre"
if one is asking me for a "ruling" i gave my opinion and what is
acceptable to this person
The allied forces did plenty of murdering too. How did you determined
the stupidity level?
for MANY reasons, among which they did not even know basics like
uniform identification, epaulette markings etc
eg. shooting Panzer personnel because they heard a story that
Totenkopfverbande wore black
shooting and hacking to death uniformed soldiers who were resting from
the eastern front
If they were prisoners, then they were murdered.
"You better believe it"
and quite savagely. one example on film is the Wiking division who
were recuperating after fighting on the Russian front.
they were resting at Dachau on the day the Americans arrived
or shooting Panzer personnel simply because the uniforms were black LOL
You realize a war was going on, don't you?
Incoherent
Retransmit message.
it is a wonder they did not shoot the Polish 22nd Rifles whose emblem
was a swastika
You might be interested in this for entertainment:
IN WHICH WORLD WAR II ARMY SHOULD YOU HAVE FOUGHT ?
http://quizfarm.com/test.php?q_id=194168
If those highly civilized europeans want to kill each other, who's poor
Tuco to decide who's right? I say let them kill each other.
and Tuco is not far from the truth !
You said my little calculation was wrong.
i do not recall saying those words.
You didn't say it was right, so give up your number.
some historians have dedicated to their entire lives to this question
and to this day cannot answer it.
compared to them i have no confidence to give an estimate.
the confusion is aggravated by the mass migrations of refugees in the
east in both directions depending on which army was advancing.
They weren't being killed because they were
jewish, but because they
were commies.
Yes, indeed. But since they were Jews i assume they can be counted in
a Jewish war dead total.
this is already getting complicated.
including those murders the number is quite high.
are you asking me for a number of Jewish dead in the east ...?
I am asking you for a number of people murdered. In my world nobody is
"chosen" and they get no special treatment. I suppose that makes me
"anti-semitic".
i wouldn't go that far yet but your tone of voice seems slightly
emotional about the subject.
My advice would be to continue reading, look into Himmler and everyone
connected with him.
Read the speech he gave at Posen. Look into the Maison Rouge
strasbourg meeting of industrialists.
Look into Fritz Thyssen. Delve deeply into these things because it is
not simply the false dialectic "Gaskammern" thesis "No mass murders of
Jews simply because they were Jews" antithesis.
If you want to be understood, you need to write complete sentences.
i do not wish to be understood by anyone who does not already have a
certain level of knowledge, correct.
If
what you meant is that the polish offficers weren't wearing their
uniforms when they were saluted, and subsequently treated like
soldiers, then I say the german probably didn't have the obligation to
do that (I am no expert on the Geneva Convention), but could do it if
they wanted to.
i think you need more time investigating these things.
and perhaps need to learn something of the languages of these countries
involved also.
Since these units were graded on the numbers killed, don't you think
that they would pad the numbers?
No reply to this?
i think you have discovered some facts and are now approaching things
from the other side and for a time this is healthy.
but eventually you should continue to dig and look into these people
and who was doing which task and what they believed they were trying to
accomplish.
'Judenfrei' was not debatable.
I know this and I am assuming you are
american or english.
assume away.
There is
something in the english and therefore the american gene pool that
provides them with that self-righteousness. Only an american or
englishman can attack another country for no valid reason and claim
self defense. The germans make no pretense.
as a matter of fact, Anglo Americans are generally Germanic.
which is a culture not a "gene pool" although you are correct it arise
from a specific 'race.'
as for the Henry Luce "American Century" this is in similar spirit to
19th century "Kulturkampf"
"Germanic" peoples enjoy creating a universal morality which they then
proceed to impose on neighboring nations.
This doesn't expain Anglo American or Germanic wars but it does explain
the propaganda successfully launched on Germanic peoples.
They are "dumb" and getting "dumber" as we go along, since they at this
stage cannot even retain a working knowledge of their own culture.
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| User: "Tuco Ramirez" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
16 Oct 2006 12:59:22 PM |
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Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
you are presuming and preaching to the choir ; i think combatants
should wear uniforms including partisans when engaged.
and when not engaged. Either you are a combatant or you are not.
If you want the rights or privileges (whatever you prefer) of a
uniformed soldier, then you must behave like one.
Geneva Convention.
soldiers are not always in uniform.
And what happened when they were captured out of uniform,
and I don't
mean when they were surprised sleeping
or takling a bath?
are you asking for examples ? they vary from culture to culture,
conflict to conflict, "theatre to theatre"
if one is asking me for a "ruling" i gave my opinion and what is
acceptable to this person
The allied forces did plenty of murdering too. How did you determined
the stupidity level?
for MANY reasons, among which they did not even know basics like
uniform identification, epaulette markings etc
eg. shooting Panzer personnel because they heard a story that
Totenkopfverbande wore black
And how is the shooting of Panzer personnel "murder"?
shooting and hacking to death uniformed soldiers who were resting from
the eastern front
If they were prisoners, then they were murdered.
"You better believe it"
and quite savagely. one example on film is the Wiking division who
were recuperating after fighting on the Russian front.
they were resting at Dachau on the day the Americans arrived
Why do you consider resting soldiers to be captured soldiers?
or shooting Panzer personnel simply because the uniforms were black LOL
You realize a war was going on, don't you?
Incoherent
Retransmit message.
Incoherent? This coming from somebody whose ambiguous writings need to
be "studied" to get some understanding of what he wrote. A little
advice: If the subject is simple, but your writings on the subject are
untintelligible, its means you are an idiot.
it is a wonder they did not shoot the Polish 22nd Rifles whose emblem
was a swastika
You might be interested in this for entertainment:
IN WHICH WORLD WAR II ARMY SHOULD YOU HAVE FOUGHT ?
http://quizfarm.com/test.php?q_id=194168
If those highly civilized europeans want to kill each other, who's poor
Tuco to decide who's right? I say let them kill each other.
and Tuco is not far from the truth !
You said my little calculation was wrong.
i do not recall saying those words.
You didn't say it was right, so give up your number.
some historians have dedicated to their entire lives to this question
and to this day cannot answer it.
compared to them i have no confidence to give an estimate.
the confusion is aggravated by the mass migrations of refugees in the
east in both directions depending on which army was advancing.
You have no confidence! Well get some, and then we can continue.
They weren't being killed because they were
jewish, but because they
were commies.
Yes, indeed. But since they were Jews i assume they can be counted in
a Jewish war dead total.
this is already getting complicated.
I already told you my jew friend. I don't consider you "special" or
"chosen". Understand?
including those murders the number is quite high.
are you asking me for a number of Jewish dead in the east ...?
I am asking you for a number of people murdered. In my world nobody is
"chosen" and they get no special treatment. I suppose that makes me
"anti-semitic".
i wouldn't go that far yet but your tone of voice seems slightly
emotional about the subject.
You can divine tone of voice from the written word? I am impressed!
My advice would be to continue reading, look into Himmler and everyone
connected with him.
Read the speech he gave at Posen. Look into the Maison Rouge
strasbourg meeting of industrialists.
Look into Fritz Thyssen. Delve deeply into these things because it is
not simply the false dialectic "Gaskammern" thesis "No mass murders of
Jews simply because they were Jews" antithesis.
Where did I say that no jews were killed because they were jews? Don't
get emotional now jew boy?
If you want to be understood, you need to write complete sentences.
i do not wish to be understood by anyone who does not already have a
certain level of knowledge, correct.
What about those who about a certain knowledge of the english language,
correct.
If
what you meant is that the polish offficers weren't wearing their
uniforms when they were saluted, and subsequently treated like
soldiers, then I say the german probably didn't have the obligation to
do that (I am no expert on the Geneva Convention), but could do it if
they wanted to.
i think you need more time investigating these things.
and perhaps need to learn something of the languages of these countries
involved also.
You should follow your advice. Those cliff notes you have been reading
aren't enough.
Since these units were graded on the numbers killed, don't you think
that they would pad the numbers?
No reply to this?
i think you have discovered some facts and are now approaching things
from the other side and for a time this is healthy.
but eventually you should continue to dig and look into these people
and who was doing which task and what they believed they were trying to
accomplish.
'Judenfrei' was not debatable.
I know this and I am assuming you are
american or english.
assume away.
There is
something in the english and therefore the american gene pool that
provides them with that self-righteousness. Only an american or
englishman can attack another country for no valid reason and claim
self defense. The germans make no pretense.
as a matter of fact, Anglo Americans are generally Germanic.
which is a culture not a "gene pool" although you are correct it arise
from a specific 'race.'
They are not the same thing; you could say they are "cousins" or
"brothers".
as for the Henry Luce "American Century" this is in similar spirit to
19th century "Kulturkampf"
"Germanic" peoples enjoy creating a universal morality which they then
proceed to impose on neighboring nations.
What about your people? What does "your people" enjoy creating?
This doesn't expain Anglo American or Germanic wars but it does explain
the propaganda successfully launched on Germanic peoples.
They are "dumb" and getting "dumber" as we go along, since they at this
stage cannot even retain a working knowledge of their own culture.
.
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
18 Oct 2006 07:35:44 AM |
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Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
you are presuming and preaching to the choir ; i think combatants
should wear uniforms including partisans when engaged.
and when not engaged. Either you are a combatant or you are not.
If you want the rights or privileges (whatever you prefer) of a
uniformed soldier, then you must behave like one.
Geneva Convention.
soldiers are not always in uniform.
And what happened when they were captured out of uniform,
and I don't
mean when they were surprised sleeping
or takling a bath?
are you asking for examples ? they vary from culture to culture,
conflict to conflict, "theatre to theatre"
if one is asking me for a "ruling" i gave my opinion and what is
acceptable to this person
The allied forces did plenty of murdering too. How did you determined
the stupidity level?
for MANY reasons, among which they did not even know basics like
uniform identification, epaulette markings etc
eg. shooting Panzer personnel because they heard a story that
Totenkopfverbande wore black
And how is the shooting of Panzer personnel "murder"?
shooting and hacking to death uniformed soldiers who were resting from
the eastern front
If they were prisoners, then they were murdered.
"You better believe it"
and quite savagely. one example on film is the Wiking division who
were recuperating after fighting on the Russian front.
they were resting at Dachau on the day the Americans arrived
Why do you consider resting soldiers to be captured soldiers?
or shooting Panzer personnel simply because the uniforms were black LOL
You realize a war was going on, don't you?
Incoherent
Retransmit message.
Incoherent? This coming from somebody whose ambiguous writings need to
be "studied" to get some understanding of what he wrote. A little
advice: If the subject is simple, but your writings on the subject are
untintelligible, its means you are an idiot.
it is a wonder they did not shoot the Polish 22nd Rifles whose emblem
was a swastika
You might be interested in this for entertainment:
IN WHICH WORLD WAR II ARMY SHOULD YOU HAVE FOUGHT ?
http://quizfarm.com/test.php?q_id=194168
If those highly civilized europeans want to kill each other, who's poor
Tuco to decide who's right? I say let them kill each other.
and Tuco is not far from the truth !
You said my little calculation was wrong.
i do not recall saying those words.
You didn't say it was right, so give up your number.
some historians have dedicated to their entire lives to this question
and to this day cannot answer it.
compared to them i have no confidence to give an estimate.
the confusion is aggravated by the mass migrations of refugees in the
east in both directions depending on which army was advancing.
You have no confidence! Well get some, and then we can continue.
They weren't being killed because they were
jewish, but because they
were commies.
Yes, indeed. But since they were Jews i assume they can be counted in
a Jewish war dead total.
this is already getting complicated.
I already told you my jew friend. I don't consider you "special" or
"chosen". Understand?
including those murders the number is quite high.
are you asking me for a number of Jewish dead in the east ...?
I am asking you for a number of people murdered. In my world nobody is
"chosen" and they get no special treatment. I suppose that makes me
"anti-semitic".
i wouldn't go that far yet but your tone of voice seems slightly
emotional about the subject.
You can divine tone of voice from the written word? I am impressed!
My advice would be to continue reading, look into Himmler and everyone
connected with him.
Read the speech he gave at Posen. Look into the Maison Rouge
strasbourg meeting of industrialists.
Look into Fritz Thyssen. Delve deeply into these things because it is
not simply the false dialectic "Gaskammern" thesis "No mass murders of
Jews simply because they were Jews" antithesis.
Where did I say that no jews were killed because they were jews? Don't
get emotional now jew boy?
If you want to be understood, you need to write complete sentences.
i do not wish to be understood by anyone who does not already have a
certain level of knowledge, correct.
What about those who about a certain knowledge of the english language,
correct.
If
what you meant is that the polish offficers weren't wearing their
uniforms when they were saluted, and subsequently treated like
soldiers, then I say the german probably didn't have the obligation to
do that (I am no expert on the Geneva Convention), but could do it if
they wanted to.
i think you need more time investigating these things.
and perhaps need to learn something of the languages of these countries
involved also.
You should follow your advice. Those cliff notes you have been reading
aren't enough.
Since these units were graded on the numbers killed, don't you think
that they would pad the numbers?
No reply to this?
i think you have discovered some facts and are now approaching things
from the other side and for a time this is healthy.
but eventually you should continue to dig and look into these people
and who was doing which task and what they believed they were trying to
accomplish.
'Judenfrei' was not debatable.
I know this and I am assuming you are
american or english.
assume away.
There is
something in the english and therefore the american gene pool that
provides them with that self-righteousness. Only an american or
englishman can attack another country for no valid reason and claim
self defense. The germans make no pretense.
as a matter of fact, Anglo Americans are generally Germanic.
which is a culture not a "gene pool" although you are correct it arise
from a specific 'race.'
They are not the same thing; you could say they are "cousins" or
"brothers".
as for the Henry Luce "American Century" this is in similar spirit to
19th century "Kulturkampf"
"Germanic" peoples enjoy creating a universal morality which they then
proceed to impose on neighboring nations.
What about your people? What does "your people" enjoy creating?
This doesn't expain Anglo American or Germanic wars but it does explain
the propaganda successfully launched on Germanic peoples.
They are "dumb" and getting "dumber" as we go along, since they at this
stage cannot even retain a working knowledge of their own culture.
Ah, another emotional ignoramus.
and an ignorant Jew hating ignoramus.
i can't claim to be surprised.
.
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| User: "Tuco Ramirez" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
18 Oct 2006 11:46:18 AM |
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Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
you are presuming and preaching to the choir ; i think combatants
should wear uniforms including partisans when engaged.
and when not engaged. Either you are a combatant or you are not.
If you want the rights or privileges (whatever you prefer) of a
uniformed soldier, then you must behave like one.
Geneva Convention.
soldiers are not always in uniform.
And what happened when they were captured out of uniform,
and I don't
mean when they were surprised sleeping
or takling a bath?
are you asking for examples ? they vary from culture to culture,
conflict to conflict, "theatre to theatre"
if one is asking me for a "ruling" i gave my opinion and what is
acceptable to this person
The allied forces did plenty of murdering too. How did you determined
the stupidity level?
for MANY reasons, among which they did not even know basics like
uniform identification, epaulette markings etc
eg. shooting Panzer personnel because they heard a story that
Totenkopfverbande wore black
And how is the shooting of Panzer personnel "murder"?
shooting and hacking to death uniformed soldiers who were resting from
the eastern front
If they were prisoners, then they were murdered.
"You better believe it"
and quite savagely. one example on film is the Wiking division who
were recuperating after fighting on the Russian front.
they were resting at Dachau on the day the Americans arrived
Why do you consider resting soldiers to be captured soldiers?
or shooting Panzer personnel simply because the uniforms were black LOL
You realize a war was going on, don't you?
Incoherent
Retransmit message.
Incoherent? This coming from somebody whose ambiguous writings need to
be "studied" to get some understanding of what he wrote. A little
advice: If the subject is simple, but your writings on the subject are
untintelligible, its means you are an idiot.
it is a wonder they did not shoot the Polish 22nd Rifles whose emblem
was a swastika
You might be interested in this for entertainment:
IN WHICH WORLD WAR II ARMY SHOULD YOU HAVE FOUGHT ?
http://quizfarm.com/test.php?q_id=194168
If those highly civilized europeans want to kill each other, who's poor
Tuco to decide who's right? I say let them kill each other.
and Tuco is not far from the truth !
You said my little calculation was wrong.
i do not recall saying those words.
You didn't say it was right, so give up your number.
some historians have dedicated to their entire lives to this question
and to this day cannot answer it.
compared to them i have no confidence to give an estimate.
the confusion is aggravated by the mass migrations of refugees in the
east in both directions depending on which army was advancing.
You have no confidence! Well get some, and then we can continue.
They weren't being killed because they were
jewish, but because they
were commies.
Yes, indeed. But since they were Jews i assume they can be counted in
a Jewish war dead total.
this is already getting complicated.
I already told you my jew friend. I don't consider you "special" or
"chosen". Understand?
including those murders the number is quite high.
are you asking me for a number of Jewish dead in the east ...?
I am asking you for a number of people murdered. In my world nobody is
"chosen" and they get no special treatment. I suppose that makes me
"anti-semitic".
i wouldn't go that far yet but your tone of voice seems slightly
emotional about the subject.
You can divine tone of voice from the written word? I am impressed!
My advice would be to continue reading, look into Himmler and everyone
connected with him.
Read the speech he gave at Posen. Look into the Maison Rouge
strasbourg meeting of industrialists.
Look into Fritz Thyssen. Delve deeply into these things because it is
not simply the false dialectic "Gaskammern" thesis "No mass murders of
Jews simply because they were Jews" antithesis.
Where did I say that no jews were killed because they were jews? Don't
get emotional now jew boy?
If you want to be understood, you need to write complete sentences.
i do not wish to be understood by anyone who does not already have a
certain level of knowledge, correct.
What about those who about a certain knowledge of the english language,
correct.
If
what you meant is that the polish offficers weren't wearing their
uniforms when they were saluted, and subsequently treated like
soldiers, then I say the german probably didn't have the obligation to
do that (I am no expert on the Geneva Convention), but could do it if
they wanted to.
i think you need more time investigating these things.
and perhaps need to learn something of the languages of these countries
involved also.
You should follow your advice. Those cliff notes you have been reading
aren't enough.
Since these units were graded on the numbers killed, don't you think
that they would pad the numbers?
No reply to this?
i think you have discovered some facts and are now approaching things
from the other side and for a time this is healthy.
but eventually you should continue to dig and look into these people
and who was doing which task and what they believed they were trying to
accomplish.
'Judenfrei' was not debatable.
I know this and I am assuming you are
american or english.
assume away.
There is
something in the english and therefore the american gene pool that
provides them with that self-righteousness. Only an american or
englishman can attack another country for no valid reason and claim
self defense. The germans make no pretense.
as a matter of fact, Anglo Americans are generally Germanic.
which is a culture not a "gene pool" although you are correct it arise
from a specific 'race.'
They are not the same thing; you could say they are "cousins" or
"brothers".
as for the Henry Luce "American Century" this is in similar spirit to
19th century "Kulturkampf"
"Germanic" peoples enjoy creating a universal morality which they then
proceed to impose on neighboring nations.
What about your people? What does "your people" enjoy creating?
This doesn't expain Anglo American or Germanic wars but it does explain
the propaganda successfully launched on Germanic peoples.
They are "dumb" and getting "dumber" as we go along, since they at this
stage cannot even retain a working knowledge of their own culture.
Ah, another emotional ignoramus.
and an ignorant Jew hating ignoramus.
You were happy to join the party when the whipping boys were the
germans! Does that make you a German hating ignoramus? You are just
another hypocritical *****.
i can't claim to be surprised.
.
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
19 Oct 2006 01:15:12 AM |
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Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Ah, another emotional ignoramus.
and an ignorant Jew hating ignoramus.
You were happy to join the party when the whipping boys were the
germans! Does that make you a German hating ignoramus? You are just
another hypocritical *****.
Who says i hate any group of people ?
i have tried but found that to be impossible.
and for your information i am not a Jew.
Nor a German.
.
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| User: "Tuco Ramirez" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
20 Oct 2006 10:27:46 PM |
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Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Ah, another emotional ignoramus.
and an ignorant Jew hating ignoramus.
You were happy to join the party when the whipping boys were the
germans! Does that make you a German hating ignoramus? You are just
another hypocritical *****.
Who says i hate any group of people ?
Do you read what you write?
i have tried but found that to be impossible.
and for your information i am not a Jew.
Nor a German.
.
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
21 Oct 2006 02:20:44 AM |
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|
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Ah, another emotional ignoramus.
and an ignorant Jew hating ignoramus.
You were happy to join the party when the whipping boys were the
germans! Does that make you a German hating ignoramus? You are just
another hypocritical *****.
Who says i hate any group of people ?
Do you read what you write?
perhaps the problem is your comprehension level.
i have tried but found that to be impossible.
and for your information i am not a Jew.
Nor a German.
.
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
19 Oct 2006 01:22:17 AM |
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Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Ah, another emotional ignoramus.
and an ignorant Jew hating ignoramus.
You were happy to join the party when the whipping boys were the
germans! Does that make you a German hating ignoramus? You are just
another hypocritical *****.
This also indicates that you did not understand the examples of
atrocities i listed.
i would guess you know nothing about Malmedy either.
most people don't.
.
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| User: "Tuco Ramirez" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
20 Oct 2006 10:40:41 PM |
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Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Ah, another emotional ignoramus.
and an ignorant Jew hating ignoramus.
You were happy to join the party when the whipping boys were the
germans! Does that make you a German hating ignoramus? You are just
another hypocritical *****.
This also indicates that you did not understand the examples of
atrocities i listed.
Really? What didn't I understand? Vagueness is no substitute for
depth or intelligence; if you have something to say, go ahead and say
it. Have you no balls? Hell, you haven't even dared to answer the
orginal question regarding the 12 million dead figure. Given that you
are well read on the subject, you should have an opinion, unless you
are a complete moron, or have no balls. If you are in one of the
"free" european countries where expressing any opinion other than
complete acceptance of the "truth" will land you in jail, then I
understand.
i would guess you know nothing about Malmedy either.
I don't know every fact of WWII, so what?
Most of what have known at some point I have forgotten, but the general
idea of what was going on is still clear.
Do you think the English, Americans, French and Russians didn't murder
anybody?
most people don't.
.
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
21 Oct 2006 02:27:03 AM |
|
|
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Ah, another emotional ignoramus.
and an ignorant Jew hating ignoramus.
You were happy to join the party when the whipping boys were the
germans! Does that make you a German hating ignoramus? You are just
another hypocritical *****.
This also indicates that you did not understand the examples of
atrocities i listed.
Really? What didn't I understand? Vagueness is no substitute for
depth or intelligence; if you have something to say, go ahead and say
it. Have you no balls? Hell, you haven't even dared to answer the
orginal question regarding the 12 million dead figure. Given that you
are well read on the subject, you should have an opinion, unless you
are a complete moron, or have no balls.
and here is where your reasoning is utterly insane.
YOU have the problem with the question --not i.
so handle the problem yourself. i do not live in the cultural sewer
known as the West.
and i often laugh at the westerners whining and crying over this issue.
what a joke.
If you are in one of the
"free" european countries where expressing any opinion other than
complete acceptance of the "truth" will land you in jail, then I
understand.
as a matter of fact it matters not where one lives, one can be
prosecuted for one's views.
i would guess you know nothing about Malmedy either.
I don't know every fact of WWII, so what?
so dis-engage yourself from the more demanding inquiries if you lack
knowledge of the less ambiguous circumstances.
Most of what have known at some point I have forgotten, but the general
idea of what was going on is still clear.
Do you think the English, Americans, French and Russians didn't murder
anybody?
i have been saying so all along and you missed it.
.
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| User: "Tuco Ramirez" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
21 Oct 2006 12:26:00 PM |
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|
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Ah, another emotional ignoramus.
and an ignorant Jew hating ignoramus.
You were happy to join the party when the whipping boys were the
germans! Does that make you a German hating ignoramus? You are just
another hypocritical *****.
This also indicates that you did not understand the examples of
atrocities i listed.
Really? What didn't I understand? Vagueness is no substitute for
depth or intelligence; if you have something to say, go ahead and say
it. Have you no balls? Hell, you haven't even dared to answer the
orginal question regarding the 12 million dead figure. Given that you
are well read on the subject, you should have an opinion, unless you
are a complete moron, or have no balls.
and here is where your reasoning is utterly insane.
YOU have the problem with the question --not i.
so handle the problem yourself. i do not live in the cultural sewer
known as the West.
and i often laugh at the westerners whining and crying over this issue.
what a joke.
If you are in one of the
"free" european countries where expressing any opinion other than
complete acceptance of the "truth" will land you in jail, then I
understand.
as a matter of fact it matters not where one lives, one can be
prosecuted for one's views.
Depends on the views.
Do you really believe that all countries have the same set of laws?
What have you been smoking?
i would guess you know nothing about Malmedy either.
I don't know every fact of WWII, so what?
so dis-engage yourself from the more demanding inquiries if you lack
knowledge of the less ambiguous circumstances.
If you don't like my inquiries, then that would be your problem, not
mine.
Most of what have known at some point I have forgotten, but the general
idea of what was going on is still clear.
Do you think the English, Americans, French and Russians didn't murder
anybody?
i have been saying so all along and you missed it.
In your imagination perhaps.
.
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
|
| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
22 Oct 2006 05:10:04 AM |
|
|
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Ah, another emotional ignoramus.
and an ignorant Jew hating ignoramus.
You were happy to join the party when the whipping boys were the
germans! Does that make you a German hating ignoramus? You are just
another hypocritical *****.
This also indicates that you did not understand the examples of
atrocities i listed.
Really? What didn't I understand? Vagueness is no substitute for
depth or intelligence; if you have something to say, go ahead and say
it. Have you no balls? Hell, you haven't even dared to answer the
orginal question regarding the 12 million dead figure. Given that you
are well read on the subject, you should have an opinion, unless you
are a complete moron, or have no balls.
and here is where your reasoning is utterly insane.
YOU have the problem with the question --not i.
so handle the problem yourself. i do not live in the cultural sewer
known as the West.
and i often laugh at the westerners whining and crying over this issue.
what a joke.
If you are in one of the
"free" european countries where expressing any opinion other than
complete acceptance of the "truth" will land you in jail, then I
understand.
as a matter of fact it matters not where one lives, one can be
prosecuted for one's views.
Depends on the views.
Do you really believe that all countries have the same set of laws?
What have you been smoking?
you are not up to date, let's put it that way.
i would guess you know nothing about Malmedy either.
I don't know every fact of WWII, so what?
so dis-engage yourself from the more demanding inquiries if you lack
knowledge of the less ambiguous circumstances.
If you don't like my inquiries, then that would be your problem, not
mine.
i do not see any problem with your inquiry, i see a problem in your
attitude toward the inquiry.
Most of what have known at some point I have forgotten, but the general
idea of what was going on is still clear.
Do you think the English, Americans, French and Russians didn't murder
anybody?
i have been saying so all along and you missed it.
In your imagination perhaps.
you are ignorant and stupid.
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| User: "Matt Giwer" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience,Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
10 Oct 2006 10:33:30 PM |
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Free Lunch wrote:
On 10 Oct 2006 17:26:29 -0700, in alt.atheism
"Tuco Ramirez" <tucodrat@yahoo.com> wrote in
<1160526389.202403.187310@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com>:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Tuco Ramirez wrote:
Free Lunch wrote:
Most of the european regimes, where there is barely any freedom of
speech, and there are punitive tax laws are leftists, comrade. China
has million of political prisoners who are slaves, etc.
You clearly know nothing about the EU. In most ways, Europeans are more
free than Americans.
In most, if not all EU countries, if I go to a street corner and claim
that the so-called holocaust didn't happen, or even if I deviate in any
way from what "the truth" is supposed to be, I go to jail. Is that
your kind of freedom?
Indeed you would go to prison.
but in North America your life would suffer similar ruination.
Not necessarily. For example, if you are rich enough, you can enforce
your rights. If you are not, or you work in a jewish controlled
profession, then you would be fucked.
But in any case, this is about freedom, not just the freedom to doubt
the so-called holocaust.
The holocaust happened whether you admit that it happened or not. You
are free to lie about the holocaust in the US by denying it, but that
won't change the facts.
What kind of truth needs laws to protect it?
Fact is in EVERY case it is only lies which need the protection of law.
Millions of Jews, Roma, homosexuals and other
people who Hitler had a problem with were murdered. If you deny it, you
are merely joining forces with Hitler's hatred toward the rest of the
world.
So produce the physical evidence in support of those claims and you can go down
in history as the first person to do so.
You have to produce physical evidence of those millions. Mass graves, tons of
cremation remains, something that would pass for physical evidence in a simple
murder trial in the US.
It should be easy. Produce one autosy showing death by cyanide poisoning and
you will do more than anyone else in the world has ever done.
--
Consider Jews have said they will continue to try to murder Nasrallah, the
leader of Hezbollah, but he has not said he will try to murder the leader of
Israel. Who is the most civilized?
-- The Iron Webmaster, 3704
nizkor http://www.giwersworld.org/nizkook/nizkook.phtml
Iraqi democracy http://www.giwersworld.org/911/armless.phtml a3
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
11 Oct 2006 07:31:07 AM |
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Matt Giwer wrote:
It should be easy. Produce one autosy showing death by
cyanide poisoning and
you will do more than anyone else
in the world has ever done.
so if there were no `Gaskammern` then there were no mass killings of
Jews ...?
not to mention "medical experiments" ...?
what do we make of Himmler's speech in Posen ...?
what do we make of Ensatzgruppen rank and file handing over cases of
vodka to Balts and Slavs because they are getting sick to their stomach
and need proxy butchers ...?
what do we make of the lists with ITEMIZED totals of mass killings from
1941-1943 ...?
you should clarify your position unless you wish to remain a cartoon
character.
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| User: "Matt Giwer" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience,Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
11 Oct 2006 08:47:44 PM |
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Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Matt Giwer wrote:
It should be easy. Produce one autosy showing death by
cyanide poisoning and
you will do more than anyone else
in the world has ever done.
so if there were no `Gaskammern` then there were no mass killings of
Jews ...?
A question is not physical evidence.
not to mention "medical experiments" ...?
Like the ones for which four Israeli doctors were arrested for a couple days ago?
Like the near lethal doses of X-rays given to Sephardim children by Ashkenazi
doctors in Israel?
what do we make of Himmler's speech in Posen ...?
what do we make of Ensatzgruppen rank and file handing over cases of
vodka to Balts and Slavs because they are getting sick to their stomach
and need proxy butchers ...?
what do we make of the lists with ITEMIZED totals of mass killings from
1941-1943 ...?
you should clarify your position unless you wish to remain a cartoon
character.
Questions do not consitute physical evidence. Believers are required to produce
physical evidence.
--
Jews who do not condemn Israel are judged by Israel.
-- The Iron Webmaster, 3691
nizkor http://www.giwersworld.org/nizkook/nizkook.phtml
Mission Accomplished http://www.giwersworld.org/opinion/mission.phtml a12
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| User: "Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun]" |
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| Title: Re: Christianity Is The Ultimate Foundation Of Liberty, Conscience, Human Rights And Democracy, Says Top German Atheist Philosopher |
12 Oct 2006 05:36:06 AM |
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Matt Giwer wrote:
Ha SATAN [Sin Tet Nun] wrote:
Matt Giwer wrote:
It should be easy. Produce one autosy showing death by
cyanide poisoning and
you will do more than anyone else
in the world has ever done.
so if there were no `Gaskammern` then there were no mass killings of
Jews ...?
A question is not physical evidence.
Here's the answer: Germans did indeed use chemical fumes to kill
prisoners.
if it happened even once, your position is invalid.
not to mention "medical experiments" ...?
Like the ones for which four Israeli doctors
Fallacy: "Changing the Subject"
what do we make of Himmler's speech in Posen ...?
what do we make of Ensatzgruppen rank and file handing over cases of
vodka to Balts and Slavs because they are getting sick to their stomach
and need proxy butchers ...?
what do we make of the lists with ITEMIZED totals of mass killings from
1941-1943 ...?
you should clarify your position unless you wish to remain a cartoon
character.
Questions do not consitute physical evidence. Believers are required to produce
physical evidence.
You have demonstrated already in the other thread that YOU KNOW F.A.
ABOUT THE WAR. CASE CLOSED.
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