| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"maff" |
| Date: |
12 Oct 2004 02:51:51 AM |
| Object: |
Christopher Reeve |
Life and death of a hero
http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,3604,1325013,00.html
Paralysed from the neck down after a riding accident, Christopher
Reeve became a tireless campaigner for stem cell research. Some
accused him of offering false hope. But it is his courage and strength
of will that will be remembered, says Oliver Burkeman
Tuesday October 12, 2004
The Guardian
You were well advised to leave your pity at the door of Christopher
Reeve's airy, sun-filled home, hidden amid the rolling meadows and
white wooden barns of upstate New York. What struck you first, as he
was steered into the room, was his commanding height: his throne-like
wheelchair lifted his broad-shouldered bulk off the ground; sitting
down, you found yourself tilting your head upwards to look at him.
Oliver Burkeman
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=18510aff.0410020030.4c6c439%40posting.google.com
Christopher Reeve
http://news.google.com/news?q=%20%22Christopher%20Reeve%22&num=100&hl=en&lr=&sa=N&tab=gn
http://www.google.com/search?q=%22Christopher+Reeve%22&num=100&hl=en&lr=&tab=nw&ie=UTF-8&sa=N
http://www.google.com/search?q=%22Christopher+Reeve%22&num=100&hl=en&lr=&output=search&cat=gwd/Top
http://groups.google.com/groups?as_epq=Christopher%20Reeve&safe=images&as_scoring=d&lr=&num=100&hl=en
stem cells OR cell
http://news.google.com/news?num=100&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=stem+cells+OR+cell&sa=N&tab=gn
http://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=stem+cells+OR+cell&sa=N&tab=nw
http://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=stem+cells+OR+cell&sa=N&tab=wd&cat=gwd%2FTop
http://groups.google.com/groups?as_q=stem%20&as_oq=cells%20cell&safe=images&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&as_scoring=d&lr=&num=100&hl=en
Enemies of Science & Knowledge
http://tinyurl.com/9nb0
and thread
A Blueprint for the Future
http://tinyurl.com/9vga
.
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| User: "Cotton Eyed Joe" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
12 Oct 2004 06:56:40 AM |
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"maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:18510aff.0410112357.74dacfb@posting.google.com...
Life and death of a hero
http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,3604,1325013,00.html
Paralysed from the neck down after a riding accident, Christopher
Reeve became a tireless campaigner for stem cell research. Some
accused him of offering false hope. But it is his courage and strength
of will that will be remembered, says Oliver Burkeman
I am not sure what makes him a hero. He wasn't into spinal cord injury
research until he himself was injured.
.
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| User: "Therion Ware" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
12 Oct 2004 08:01:52 AM |
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On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 11:56:40 +0000 (UTC) in talk.origins, Cotton Eyed
Joe ("Cotton Eyed Joe" <mdginzo@bellsout.SPAMnet>) said, directing the
reply to talk.origins
"maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:18510aff.0410112357.74dacfb@posting.google.com...
Life and death of a hero
http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,3604,1325013,00.html
Paralysed from the neck down after a riding accident, Christopher
Reeve became a tireless campaigner for stem cell research. Some
accused him of offering false hope. But it is his courage and strength
of will that will be remembered, says Oliver Burkeman
I am not sure what makes him a hero. He wasn't into spinal cord injury
research until he himself was injured.
"Needs must when the Devil drives," so they tell me.
--
"Do Unto Others As You Would Have Them Do Unto You."
- Attrib: Pauline Reage.
Inexpensive VHS & other video to CD/DVD conversion?
See: <http://www.Video2CD.com>. 35.00 gets your video on DVD.
all posts to this email address are automatically deleted without being read.
** atheist poster child #1 ** #442.
.
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| User: "nobody" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
12 Oct 2004 11:56:52 AM |
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"Christopher A. Lee" <calee@optonline.net> wrote:
"Cotton Eyed Joe" <mdginzo@bellsout.SPAMnet> wrote:
I am not sure what makes him a hero. He wasn't into spinal cord injury
research until he himself was injured.
It is how he coped, what he made of himself after it. And having been
injured he became a very effective spokesman. I doubt you or I would
have been.
True. But only because nobody would listen to a nobody.
.
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| User: "Dick C" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
12 Oct 2004 09:07:31 AM |
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Cotton Eyed Joe wrote in talk.origins
"maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:18510aff.0410112357.74dacfb@posting.google.com...
Life and death of a hero
http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,3604,1325013,00.html
Paralysed from the neck down after a riding accident, Christopher
Reeve became a tireless campaigner for stem cell research. Some
accused him of offering false hope. But it is his courage and strength
of will that will be remembered, says Oliver Burkeman
I am not sure what makes him a hero. He wasn't into spinal cord injury
research until he himself was injured.
Not to disparage Mr. Reeves, but I really hate applying the word
hero to most of the people it is used for. Mr. Reeves did not
perform a courageous act. He was injured, and he coped as best he
could. Many people that catch the media's attention are called
brave and heroic, when all they do is manage to cope with life
and the setbacks we all encounter. Lets' face it, I am a cancer
survivor, it was tough, but not heroic. Reeves had it tough, yes,
but that does not make him a hero. He was a media icon.
--
***** #1349
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
~Benjamin Franklin
Home Page: dickcr.iwarp.com
email:
.
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| User: "Bob Pease" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
12 Oct 2004 10:46:59 AM |
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"***** C" <foo.dickcr@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:Xns9580496F7DAdickcrcomcastnet@216.196.97.136...
Cotton Eyed Joe wrote in talk.origins
"maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:18510aff.0410112357.74dacfb@posting.google.com...
Life and death of a hero
http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,3604,1325013,00.html
Paralysed from the neck down after a riding accident, Christopher
Reeve became a tireless campaigner for stem cell research. Some
accused him of offering false hope. But it is his courage and strength
of will that will be remembered, says Oliver Burkeman
I am not sure what makes him a hero. He wasn't into spinal cord injury
research until he himself was injured.
Not to disparage Mr. Reeves, but I really hate applying the word
hero to most of the people it is used for. Mr. Reeves did not
perform a courageous act. He was injured, and he coped as best he
could. Many people that catch the media's attention are called
brave and heroic, when all they do is manage to cope with life
and the setbacks we all encounter. Lets' face it, I am a cancer
survivor, it was tough, but not heroic. Reeves had it tough, yes,
but that does not make him a hero. He was a media icon.
When faced with a choice of feeling "Oh!. Poor ME" or trying to cope and
hang in and try to give others a reason not to have mental suffering and
gloom and misery because of a disabling accident, Reeve was able to show
optimism, and, more importantly, to be in a visible position to spread
optimism.
I feel lucky that I have had a good and long life, even if I'm old fat poor
and nuts now, I still have it pretty good!!!
RIP Super dude!!
Bob Pease
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.740 / Virus Database: 494 - Release Date: 8/16/04
.
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| User: "Dick C" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
12 Oct 2004 01:25:02 PM |
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Bob Pease wrote in talk.origins
"***** C" <foo. > wrote in message
news:Xns9580496F7DAdickcrcomcastnet@216.196.97.136...
Not to disparage Mr. Reeves, but I really hate applying the word
hero to most of the people it is used for. Mr. Reeves did not
perform a courageous act. He was injured, and he coped as best he
could. Many people that catch the media's attention are called
brave and heroic, when all they do is manage to cope with life
and the setbacks we all encounter. Lets' face it, I am a cancer
survivor, it was tough, but not heroic. Reeves had it tough, yes,
but that does not make him a hero. He was a media icon.
When faced with a choice of feeling "Oh!. Poor ME" or trying to cope and
hang in and try to give others a reason not to have mental suffering and
gloom and misery because of a disabling accident, Reeve was able to show
optimism, and, more importantly, to be in a visible position to spread
optimism.
I feel lucky that I have had a good and long life, even if I'm old fat
poor and nuts now, I still have it pretty good!!!
RIP Super dude!!
I agree with this entirely. I just have a problem with the label hero
is all. He is really only called a hero because he was a movie star
who suffered a tremendous accident, and in the process of his coping
he was able to act as a spokesman for research. There are thousands
of people who suffer equal or greater injury every year, and they do
the same things he does, but are not labeled heroes by the media.
--
***** #1349
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." ~Benjamin Franklin
Home Page: dickcr.iwarp.com
email:
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| User: "RainLover" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
14 Oct 2004 08:50:52 AM |
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On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 18:25:02 +0000 (UTC), ***** C
<foo.dickcr@comcast.net> wrote:
Bob Pease wrote in talk.origins
"***** C" <foo.dickcr@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:Xns9580496F7DAdickcrcomcastnet@216.196.97.136...
Not to disparage Mr. Reeves, but I really hate applying the word
hero to most of the people it is used for. Mr. Reeves did not
perform a courageous act. He was injured, and he coped as best he
could. Many people that catch the media's attention are called
brave and heroic, when all they do is manage to cope with life
and the setbacks we all encounter. Lets' face it, I am a cancer
survivor, it was tough, but not heroic. Reeves had it tough, yes,
but that does not make him a hero. He was a media icon.
When faced with a choice of feeling "Oh!. Poor ME" or trying to cope and
hang in and try to give others a reason not to have mental suffering and
gloom and misery because of a disabling accident, Reeve was able to show
optimism, and, more importantly, to be in a visible position to spread
optimism.
I feel lucky that I have had a good and long life, even if I'm old fat
poor and nuts now, I still have it pretty good!!!
RIP Super dude!!
I agree with this entirely. I just have a problem with the label hero
is all. He is really only called a hero because he was a movie star
who suffered a tremendous accident, and in the process of his coping
he was able to act as a spokesman for research. There are thousands
of people who suffer equal or greater injury every year, and they do
the same things he does, but are not labeled heroes by the media.
I don't need the fucking Media to label my heroes for me. Christopher
Reeves was a hero because he lived his life heroically. He didn't
awaken every morning just to get through the day (like most of US do);
he awoke fighting... fighting for his life, fighting for stem-cell
research, fighting to be an inspiration for others.
I don't give a damn if he didn't run into a burning building to save a
life or jump into icy water. Those things are unique situations and
most of us will never be confronted with that sort of choice.
Christopher Reeves is my hero. He's the hero of millions of people
for the simple reason that he showed us that even if you can't breath
on your own, can't eat without someong to feed you, and even if you
can't go to the bathroom without someone cleaning up after you - if
all you can do is wiggle a fucking finger after a year of hard work -
life is worth living and you can STILL make a difference.
What are YOU doing right now, gentle reader... yes, YOU, reading this?
What are your plans for the day?
I used to be a firefighter; but I was no 'hero'... I did my job and
LOVED doing it, as did all my brothers and sisters, but 'heroes?' ...
No.
I don't think I could Ever go through what Christopher Reeves went
through with such bravery and strength, all the while, inspiring
others to achieve more.
Have all of you been in these damn newsgroups for so long arguing the
same points over and over again that you've lost part of your
compassion?
James, Seattle, Washington, USA, Earth
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| User: "Dick C" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
14 Oct 2004 11:51:33 AM |
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RainLover wrote in talk.origins
Christopher Reeves is my hero. He's the hero of millions of people
for the simple reason that he showed us that even if you can't breath
on your own, can't eat without someong to feed you, and even if you
can't go to the bathroom without someone cleaning up after you - if
all you can do is wiggle a fucking finger after a year of hard work -
life is worth living and you can STILL make a difference.
And I still maintain that the word hero is the wrong word. He was
a role model, and excellent citizen. Someone to be honored for
his accomplishments in the face of great adversity. All of that and
more.
--
***** #1349
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
~Benjamin Franklin
Home Page: dickcr.iwarp.com
email:
.
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| User: "RainLover" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
15 Oct 2004 09:23:35 AM |
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On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 16:51:33 +0000 (UTC), ***** C
<foo.dickcr@comcast.net> wrote:
RainLover wrote in talk.origins
Christopher Reeves is my hero. He's the hero of millions of people
for the simple reason that he showed us that even if you can't breath
on your own, can't eat without someong to feed you, and even if you
can't go to the bathroom without someone cleaning up after you - if
all you can do is wiggle a fucking finger after a year of hard work -
life is worth living and you can STILL make a difference.
And I still maintain that the word hero is the wrong word. He was
a role model, and excellent citizen. Someone to be honored for
his accomplishments in the face of great adversity. All of that and
more.
HERO:
1. A man distinguished by exceptional courage and nobility and
strength.
2. The principal character in a play or movie or novel or poem.
3. Someone who fights for a cause.
4 - 6 are about greeks and #7 is a sandwich
Explain to me again why Christopher Reeves doesn't qualify as a hero
under number 1 and 3 (and a few times #2)....
James, Seattle
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| User: "Dick C" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
15 Oct 2004 02:47:58 PM |
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RainLover wrote in talk.origins
On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 16:51:33 +0000 (UTC), ***** C
<foo. > wrote:
RainLover wrote in talk.origins
Christopher Reeves is my hero. He's the hero of millions of people
for the simple reason that he showed us that even if you can't breath
on your own, can't eat without someong to feed you, and even if you
can't go to the bathroom without someone cleaning up after you - if
all you can do is wiggle a fucking finger after a year of hard work -
life is worth living and you can STILL make a difference.
And I still maintain that the word hero is the wrong word. He was
a role model, and excellent citizen. Someone to be honored for
his accomplishments in the face of great adversity. All of that and
more.
HERO:
1. A man distinguished by exceptional courage and nobility and
strength.
2. The principal character in a play or movie or novel or poem.
3. Someone who fights for a cause.
4 - 6 are about greeks and #7 is a sandwich
Explain to me again why Christopher Reeves doesn't qualify as a hero
under number 1 and 3 (and a few times #2)....
James, Seattle
Interesting how none of those defintions match what use to be the
normal usage of the word. And notice how those definitions are so
broad that they can be used for everyone on the planet. And that
is exactly the problem with these usages. The term is so overused,
and so generally applied that it is meaningless.
--
***** #1349
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
~Benjamin Franklin
Home Page: dickcr.iwarp.com
email:
.
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| User: "RainLover" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
15 Oct 2004 03:33:09 PM |
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On Fri, 15 Oct 2004 19:47:58 +0000 (UTC), ***** C
<foo.dickcr@comcast.net> wrote:
RainLover wrote in talk.origins
On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 16:51:33 +0000 (UTC), ***** C
<foo.dickcr@comcast.net> wrote:
RainLover wrote in talk.origins
Christopher Reeves is my hero. He's the hero of millions of people
for the simple reason that he showed us that even if you can't breath
on your own, can't eat without someong to feed you, and even if you
can't go to the bathroom without someone cleaning up after you - if
all you can do is wiggle a fucking finger after a year of hard work -
life is worth living and you can STILL make a difference.
And I still maintain that the word hero is the wrong word. He was
a role model, and excellent citizen. Someone to be honored for
his accomplishments in the face of great adversity. All of that and
more.
HERO:
1. A man distinguished by exceptional courage and nobility and
strength.
2. The principal character in a play or movie or novel or poem.
3. Someone who fights for a cause.
4 - 6 are about greeks and #7 is a sandwich
Explain to me again why Christopher Reeves doesn't qualify as a hero
under number 1 and 3 (and a few times #2)....
James, Seattle
Interesting how none of those defintions match what use to be the
normal usage of the word. And notice how those definitions are so
broad that they can be used for everyone on the planet. And that
is exactly the problem with these usages. The term is so overused,
and so generally applied that it is meaningless.
And for you? A "hero" MUST risk his life? (and only 'his' since it
would always be a 'he' in what USED to be the 'normal' usage of the
word hero)
If someone here has a subscription to the Oxford Dictionary (
http://www.oed.com/ ) I'm sure they'll look up all the meanings of
Hero for you until you find the ONLY one that means hero in your
mind.
I agree with others here... Firefighters and policemen are NOT heroes,
althought they, like everyone else are capable of heroic actions.
There are many jobs that are very much needed and MUCH more dangerous
than fighting a fire or performing a police action and they are never
considered 'heroes' for doing their job.... (I'm speaking as an
ex-firefighter.)
I do NOT think the word Hero is really overused these days.... I think
we may HEAR of more heroes because of the age we live in, but they've
always existed.
I don't think one person's hero needs to be EVERYONE'S hero... it
would be ridiculous to think that anyway.
Maybe in YOUR perspective there are no heroes in the world anymore...
maybe they were for another age and another time, but that wouldn't
make you correct... only cynical.
James, Seattle
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| User: "Walter Bushell" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
15 Oct 2004 11:20:34 PM |
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In article <skc0n0tdgjbpujbj9q13ebr7s28l867fu1@4ax.com>,
RainLover <SP-AMB-LOCKrainlover@raincity.com> wrote:
<snip>
I agree with others here... Firefighters and policemen are NOT heroes,
althought they, like everyone else are capable of heroic actions.
There are many jobs that are very much needed and MUCH more dangerous
than fighting a fire or performing a police action and they are never
considered 'heroes' for doing their job.... (I'm speaking as an
ex-firefighter.)
<snip>
being President of the United States is one such job. Look at the death
rate, and it ages almost everybody who has the role, except for those
who are too stupid to realize what they are doing.
--
Guns don't kill people; automobiles kill people.
.
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| User: "fencingsax" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
16 Oct 2004 11:10:12 AM |
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Walter Bushell <proto@panix.com> wrote in message news:<proto-B4B031.00283316102004@reader1.panix.com>...
In article <skc0n0tdgjbpujbj9q13ebr7s28l867fu1@4ax.com>,
RainLover <SP-AMB-LOCKrainlover@raincity.com> wrote:
<snip>
I agree with others here... Firefighters and policemen are NOT heroes,
althought they, like everyone else are capable of heroic actions.
There are many jobs that are very much needed and MUCH more dangerous
than fighting a fire or performing a police action and they are never
considered 'heroes' for doing their job.... (I'm speaking as an
ex-firefighter.)
<snip>
being President of the United States is one such job. Look at the death
rate, and it ages almost everybody who has the role, except for those
who are too stupid to realize what they are doing.
Isn't the Presidential death rate about 1 in 10? 3 assasinated, 1
died of pneumonia [sic]?
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| User: "Cotton Eyed Joe" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
18 Oct 2004 10:22:45 PM |
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(fencingsax) wrote in message
Isn't the Presidential death rate about 1 in 10? 3 assasinated, 1
died of pneumonia [sic]?
For a president elected in a year ending in zero the death rate while
in office is about 87%. It would be 100% except that Reagan survived
Bush's er...I mean Hinckley's assassination attempt.
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| User: "Oghier Ghislain" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
16 Oct 2004 10:24:06 AM |
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Walter Bushell <proto@panix.com> wrote in message news:<proto-B4B031.00283316102004@reader1.panix.com>...
In article <skc0n0tdgjbpujbj9q13ebr7s28l867fu1@4ax.com>,
RainLover <SP-AMB-LOCKrainlover@raincity.com> wrote:
<snip>
I agree with others here... Firefighters and policemen are NOT heroes,
althought they, like everyone else are capable of heroic actions.
There are many jobs that are very much needed and MUCH more dangerous
than fighting a fire or performing a police action and they are never
considered 'heroes' for doing their job.... (I'm speaking as an
ex-firefighter.)
<snip>
being President of the United States is one such job. Look at the death
rate, and it ages almost everybody who has the role, except for those
who are too stupid to realize what they are doing.
Well, average age upon entering office has to be taken into account
(55 years old). And the average President serves some 5 years, and so
is typically 60 at the end of their service. Also, the fact that the
life expectancy in the United States was notably lower when many of
these men served than it is now. Still, when 19% (8 of 42) of all who
have served as President die in office, that's not a good ratio. Nor
is 4 out of 42 being murdered, 5 out of 42 being shot, 6 out of 42
being shot while either serving or campaigning (Teddy Roosevelt in
1912), and several others having attempts on their life of some sort
(Clinton, Ford, Truman, FDR, Jackson ... and there are probably more).
Still, the benefits of the perceived action must also be factored in.
If I'm offered $1,000,000 to run into a building and save a child, and
I thereby perform that action, am I heroic? I think not, merely
someone weighing the odds and taking a chance to gain something for
myself. Similarly, to be President, one generally has a ton of drive
to achieve great power. If someone accepts possibly shaving a few
years off one's life in order to hold the single most powerful
position in the world, to enjoy the trappings and fame and place in
history by holding the post of Washington and Jefferson and Lincoln,
I'm hard pressed to consider that person heroic for doing so.
OG
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| User: "Tedd Jacobs" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
12 Oct 2004 09:39:03 AM |
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"***** C" wrote...
Cotton Eyed Joe wrote in talk.origins
"maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:18510aff.0410112357.74dacfb@posting.google.com...
Life and death of a hero
http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,3604,1325013,00.html
Paralysed from the neck down after a riding accident, Christopher
Reeve became a tireless campaigner for stem cell research. Some
accused him of offering false hope. But it is his courage and strength
of will that will be remembered, says Oliver Burkeman
I am not sure what makes him a hero. He wasn't into spinal cord injury
research until he himself was injured.
Not to disparage Mr. Reeves, but I really hate applying the word
hero to most of the people it is used for. Mr. Reeves did not
perform a courageous act. He was injured, and he coped as best he
could. Many people that catch the media's attention are called
brave and heroic, when all they do is manage to cope with life
and the setbacks we all encounter. Lets' face it, I am a cancer
survivor, it was tough, but not heroic. Reeves had it tough, yes,
but that does not make him a hero. He was a media icon.
to some he may have been a hero. we should not bereave that, our opinions
withstanding, from those who were closer to him. he coped. we all cope.
the fact that we dont put a gun to our collective heads when we encounter
semingly unsurmountable setback makes each of us a hero to someone in
someway.
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| User: "Cotton Eyed Joe" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
15 Oct 2004 01:18:29 AM |
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"Tedd Jacobs" <Jacobs@mail.boisestate.edu> wrote in message news:<ckgqls03os@enews1.newsguy.com>...
"***** C" wrote...
Cotton Eyed Joe wrote in talk.origins
"maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:18510aff.0410112357.74dacfb@posting.google.com...
Life and death of a hero
http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,3604,1325013,00.html
Paralysed from the neck down after a riding accident, Christopher
Reeve became a tireless campaigner for stem cell research. Some
accused him of offering false hope. But it is his courage and strength
of will that will be remembered, says Oliver Burkeman
I am not sure what makes him a hero. He wasn't into spinal cord injury
research until he himself was injured.
Not to disparage Mr. Reeves, but I really hate applying the word
hero to most of the people it is used for. Mr. Reeves did not
perform a courageous act. He was injured, and he coped as best he
could. Many people that catch the media's attention are called
brave and heroic, when all they do is manage to cope with life
and the setbacks we all encounter. Lets' face it, I am a cancer
survivor, it was tough, but not heroic. Reeves had it tough, yes,
but that does not make him a hero. He was a media icon.
to some he may have been a hero. we should not bereave that, our opinions
withstanding, from those who were closer to him. he coped. we all cope.
the fact that we dont put a gun to our collective heads when we encounter
semingly unsurmountable setback makes each of us a hero to someone in
someway.
That just pretty much waters down the term "hero" to the point that it
has virtually no meaning.
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| User: "Tedd Jacobs" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
15 Oct 2004 01:29:26 AM |
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"Cotton Eyed Joe" wrote...
"Tedd Jacobs" <Jacobs@mail.boisestate.edu> wrote in message
news:<ckgqls03os@enews1.newsguy.com>...
"***** C" wrote...
Cotton Eyed Joe wrote in talk.origins
"maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:18510aff.0410112357.74dacfb@posting.google.com...
Life and death of a hero
http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,3604,1325013,00.html
Paralysed from the neck down after a riding accident, Christopher
Reeve became a tireless campaigner for stem cell research. Some
accused him of offering false hope. But it is his courage and
strength
of will that will be remembered, says Oliver Burkeman
I am not sure what makes him a hero. He wasn't into spinal cord
injury
research until he himself was injured.
Not to disparage Mr. Reeves, but I really hate applying the word
hero to most of the people it is used for. Mr. Reeves did not
perform a courageous act. He was injured, and he coped as best he
could. Many people that catch the media's attention are called
brave and heroic, when all they do is manage to cope with life
and the setbacks we all encounter. Lets' face it, I am a cancer
survivor, it was tough, but not heroic. Reeves had it tough, yes,
but that does not make him a hero. He was a media icon.
to some he may have been a hero. we should not bereave that, our
opinions
withstanding, from those who were closer to him. he coped. we all cope.
the fact that we dont put a gun to our collective heads when we encounter
semingly unsurmountable setback makes each of us a hero to someone in
someway.
That just pretty much waters down the term "hero" to the point that it
has virtually no meaning.
tell your kid that. i'm sure you are a hero to him/her.
.
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| User: "Cotton Eyed Joe" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
15 Oct 2004 09:54:54 AM |
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"Tedd Jacobs" <Jacobs@mail.boisestate.edu> wrote in message news:<cknr3901tkj@enews1.newsguy.com>...
"Cotton Eyed Joe" wrote...
"Tedd Jacobs" <Jacobs@mail.boisestate.edu> wrote in message
news:<ckgqls03os@enews1.newsguy.com>...
"***** C" wrote...
Cotton Eyed Joe wrote in talk.origins
"maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:18510aff.0410112357.74dacfb@posting.google.com...
Life and death of a hero
http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,3604,1325013,00.html
Paralysed from the neck down after a riding accident, Christopher
Reeve became a tireless campaigner for stem cell research. Some
accused him of offering false hope. But it is his courage and
strength
of will that will be remembered, says Oliver Burkeman
I am not sure what makes him a hero. He wasn't into spinal cord
injury
research until he himself was injured.
Not to disparage Mr. Reeves, but I really hate applying the word
hero to most of the people it is used for. Mr. Reeves did not
perform a courageous act. He was injured, and he coped as best he
could. Many people that catch the media's attention are called
brave and heroic, when all they do is manage to cope with life
and the setbacks we all encounter. Lets' face it, I am a cancer
survivor, it was tough, but not heroic. Reeves had it tough, yes,
but that does not make him a hero. He was a media icon.
to some he may have been a hero. we should not bereave that, our
opinions
withstanding, from those who were closer to him. he coped. we all cope.
the fact that we dont put a gun to our collective heads when we encounter
semingly unsurmountable setback makes each of us a hero to someone in
someway.
That just pretty much waters down the term "hero" to the point that it
has virtually no meaning.
tell your kid that. i'm sure you are a hero to him/her.
Sure. To my cat I might also be a hero. And I am sure that to someone
in someway Ted Bundy, Adolph Hitler and Torquemada are all heroes for
what they are most infamous for.
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| User: "Tedd Jacobs" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
15 Oct 2004 10:37:28 AM |
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"Cotton Eyed Joe" <mdginzo@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:a2e37f63.0410150701.1312f41e@posting.google.com...
"Tedd Jacobs" <Jacobs@mail.boisestate.edu> wrote in message
news:<cknr3901tkj@enews1.newsguy.com>...
"Cotton Eyed Joe" wrote...
"Tedd Jacobs" <Jacobs@mail.boisestate.edu> wrote in message
news:<ckgqls03os@enews1.newsguy.com>...
"***** C" wrote...
Cotton Eyed Joe wrote in talk.origins
"maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:18510aff.0410112357.74dacfb@posting.google.com...
Life and death of a hero
http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,3604,1325013,00.html
Paralysed from the neck down after a riding accident, Christopher
Reeve became a tireless campaigner for stem cell research. Some
accused him of offering false hope. But it is his courage and
strength
of will that will be remembered, says Oliver Burkeman
I am not sure what makes him a hero. He wasn't into spinal cord
injury
research until he himself was injured.
Not to disparage Mr. Reeves, but I really hate applying the word
hero to most of the people it is used for. Mr. Reeves did not
perform a courageous act. He was injured, and he coped as best he
could. Many people that catch the media's attention are called
brave and heroic, when all they do is manage to cope with life
and the setbacks we all encounter. Lets' face it, I am a cancer
survivor, it was tough, but not heroic. Reeves had it tough, yes,
but that does not make him a hero. He was a media icon.
to some he may have been a hero. we should not bereave that, our
opinions
withstanding, from those who were closer to him. he coped. we all
cope.
the fact that we dont put a gun to our collective heads when we
encounter
semingly unsurmountable setback makes each of us a hero to someone in
someway.
That just pretty much waters down the term "hero" to the point that it
has virtually no meaning.
tell your kid that. i'm sure you are a hero to him/her.
Sure. To my cat I might also be a hero. And I am sure that to someone
in someway Ted Bundy, Adolph Hitler and Torquemada are all heroes for
what they are most infamous for.
and you are in a position to demean what someone elses view of a hero is?
.
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| User: "Tedd Jacobs" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
15 Oct 2004 03:57:42 PM |
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[attachements purged]
"Cotton Eyed Joe" wrote...
"Tedd Jacobs" <Jacobs@mail.boisestate.edu> wrote in message >
and you are in a position to demean what someone elses view of a hero is?
About as much as I am in a position to demean what someone's opinion of
"infamous" is. This discussion was about what our personal opinion of
what
a hero was. You have your right to an opinion. I am just pointing out
that
when anyone can be a hero for anything they do then the word has no
meaning.
so to see if i have this correct: i.) opinions provide entitlement to
bereave others of theirs. ii.) personal or individualized meanings demean
the totality of an abstract concept.
.
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| User: "Cotton Eyed Joe" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
17 Oct 2004 08:54:52 PM |
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"Tedd Jacobs" <Jacobs@mail.boisestate.edu> wrote in message
so to see if i have this correct: i.) opinions provide entitlement to
bereave others of theirs. ii.) personal or individualized meanings demean
the totality of an abstract concept.
No. But one can have a personal definition or opinion of a word that
renders that word meaningless. If one can be hero at any time for
anything they do then the word "hero" means nothing. If I blow out a
match and my son calls me a firefighter and you decide that makes me,
in fact, a firefighter, then my that opinion the word firefighter has
very little meaning.
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| User: "Tedd Jacobs" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
17 Oct 2004 10:44:23 PM |
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"Cotton Eyed Joe" <mdginzo@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:a2e37f63.0410171802.2205d83b@posting.google.com...
"Tedd Jacobs" <Jacobs@mail.boisestate.edu> wrote in message
so to see if i have this correct: i.) opinions provide entitlement to
bereave others of theirs. ii.) personal or individualized meanings
demean
the totality of an abstract concept.
No. But one can have a personal definition or opinion of a word that
renders that word meaningless. If one can be hero at any time for
anything they do then the word "hero" means nothing. If I blow out a
match and my son calls me a firefighter and you decide that makes me,
in fact, a firefighter, then my that opinion the word firefighter has
very little meaning.
that was for the sake of argument. i dont believe for a minute that you'd
think you son's opinion of you has very little meaning, irregardless. you
dont strike me as that type. ;-)
.
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| User: "Cotton Eyed Joe" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
18 Oct 2004 10:20:15 PM |
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"Tedd Jacobs" <Jacobs@mail.boisestate.edu> wrote in message news:<ckvef301pch@enews4.newsguy.com>...
"Cotton Eyed Joe" <mdginzo@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:a2e37f63.0410171802.2205d83b@posting.google.com...
"Tedd Jacobs" <Jacobs@mail.boisestate.edu> wrote in message
so to see if i have this correct: i.) opinions provide entitlement to
bereave others of theirs. ii.) personal or individualized meanings
demean
the totality of an abstract concept.
No. But one can have a personal definition or opinion of a word that
renders that word meaningless. If one can be hero at any time for
anything they do then the word "hero" means nothing. If I blow out a
match and my son calls me a firefighter and you decide that makes me,
in fact, a firefighter, then my that opinion the word firefighter has
very little meaning.
that was for the sake of argument. i dont believe for a minute that you'd
think you son's opinion of you has very little meaning, irregardless. you
dont strike me as that type. ;-)
It has a 4-year-old's meaning, I suppose. I guess you can spend your
life seeing the world like a child does if you like.
.
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| User: "Cotton Eyed Joe" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
17 Oct 2004 08:52:21 PM |
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"Tedd Jacobs" <Jacobs@mail.boisestate.edu> wrote in message news:<ckpe0n0nc9@enews2.newsguy.com>...
[attachements purged]
"Cotton Eyed Joe" wrote...
"Tedd Jacobs" <Jacobs@mail.boisestate.edu> wrote in message >
and you are in a position to demean what someone elses view of a hero is?
About as much as I am in a position to demean what someone's opinion of
"infamous" is. This discussion was about what our personal opinion of
what
a hero was. You have your right to an opinion. I am just pointing out
that
when anyone can be a hero for anything they do then the word has no
meaning.
so to see if i have this correct: i.) opinions provide entitlement to
bereave others of theirs. ii.) personal or individualized meanings demean
the totality of an abstract concept.
I have no idea. All I am saying is that the way you define "hero"
makes the word virtually meaningless.
.
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| User: "keith" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
15 Oct 2004 12:46:19 PM |
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***** C <foo.dickcr@comcast.net> wrote in message news:<Xns9580496F7DAdickcrcomcastnet@216.196.97.136>...
Cotton Eyed Joe wrote in talk.origins
"maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:18510aff.0410112357.74dacfb@posting.google.com...
Life and death of a hero
http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,3604,1325013,00.html
Paralysed from the neck down after a riding accident, Christopher
Reeve became a tireless campaigner for stem cell research. Some
accused him of offering false hope. But it is his courage and strength
of will that will be remembered, says Oliver Burkeman
I am not sure what makes him a hero. He wasn't into spinal cord injury
research until he himself was injured.
Not to disparage Mr. Reeves, but I really hate applying the word
hero to most of the people it is used for. Mr. Reeves did not
perform a courageous act. He was injured, and he coped as best he
could. Many people that catch the media's attention are called
brave and heroic, when all they do is manage to cope with life
and the setbacks we all encounter. Lets' face it, I am a cancer
survivor, it was tough, but not heroic. Reeves had it tough, yes,
but that does not make him a hero. He was a media icon.
I don't agree. I don't know how you acted during your cancer, but I
presume you coped well, and coping well during suffering is heroic I'd
say. That's why people are so willing to apply the word to folks who
*do* cope well.
keith
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| User: "Dick C" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
15 Oct 2004 02:53:35 PM |
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keith wrote in talk.origins
***** C <foo. > wrote in message
news:<Xns9580496F7DAdickcrcomcastnet@216.196.97.136>...
Cotton Eyed Joe wrote in talk.origins
"maff" <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:18510aff.0410112357.74dacfb@posting.google.com...
Life and death of a hero
http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,3604,1325013,00.html
Paralysed from the neck down after a riding accident, Christopher
Reeve became a tireless campaigner for stem cell research. Some
accused him of offering false hope. But it is his courage and
strength of will that will be remembered, says Oliver Burkeman
I am not sure what makes him a hero. He wasn't into spinal cord
injury research until he himself was injured.
Not to disparage Mr. Reeves, but I really hate applying the word
hero to most of the people it is used for. Mr. Reeves did not
perform a courageous act. He was injured, and he coped as best he
could. Many people that catch the media's attention are called
brave and heroic, when all they do is manage to cope with life
and the setbacks we all encounter. Lets' face it, I am a cancer
survivor, it was tough, but not heroic. Reeves had it tough, yes,
but that does not make him a hero. He was a media icon.
I don't agree. I don't know how you acted during your cancer, but I
presume you coped well, and coping well during suffering is heroic I'd
say. That's why people are so willing to apply the word to folks who
*do* cope well.
Surprisingly enough, I don't think I have ever met someone who did not
cope well. Of course, many of them would have died. But I do not
consider what I did heroic. I think it is probably normal, for the
most part.
There should be a special term for people like Christopher Reeves.
He was someone special, for what he did, and how he used his fame
and his condition to push for more research and more public awareness
of the the problems.
--
***** #1349
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
~Benjamin Franklin
Home Page: dickcr.iwarp.com
email:
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| User: "nobody" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
13 Oct 2004 05:42:03 AM |
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(R. Tang) wrote:
You DO realize that there's a fair amount of risk involved
whenever he had to travel?
Same goes for me. In fact, I take a fair amount of risk just driving
to work every morning to feed my family and myself. Does that make me
a hero?
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| User: "R. Tang" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
13 Oct 2004 11:15:15 AM |
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In article <ur1qm0d2dnnbosh97vc8rppjotu055kgis@4ax.com>,
nobody <nobody@here.com> wrote:
gwangung@u.washington.edu (R. Tang) wrote:
You DO realize that there's a fair amount of risk involved
whenever he had to travel?
Same goes for me.
No, it doesn't.
--
-
-Roger Tang, gwangung@u.washington.edu, Artistic Director PC Theatre
- Editor, Asian American Theatre Revue [NEW URL][Yes, it IS new]
- http://www.aatrevue.com
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| User: "John Wilkins" |
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| Title: Re: Christopher Reeve |
13 Oct 2004 06:05:06 PM |
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nobody <nobody@here.com> wrote:
gwangung@u.washington.edu (R. Tang) wrote:
You DO realize that there's a fair amount of risk involved
whenever he had to travel?
Same goes for me. In fact, I take a fair amount of risk just driving
to work every morning to feed my family and myself. Does that make me
a hero?
Proportionally to the risk to yourself, yes. Me, I am 0.001% of a hero.
--
John S. Wilkins
web: www.wilkins.id.au blog: evolvethought.blogspot.com
God cheats
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