| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"R. Paine" |
| Date: |
03 Dec 2004 11:08:09 AM |
| Object: |
civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
Islam is a religion defined by Qur'an, and Qur'an demands that Muslims go
and kill infidels: Christians, Jews and Atheists [1]. Correct me if I'm
wrong, but in view of this, how can Islam *not* be considered a terrorist
doctrine?
Other religious organizations encouraged violence in the past, but I know of
no other great religion that has it written in its defining document that
everyone not of their faith be hunted and killed in as many numbers as
possible.
I'm not prejudiced. And I'm against violence other than in self-defense. But
I'm getting sick and tired of hearing about "peaceful Islam" bullcrap.
There can be no such thing. The only "peace and harmony" that Qur'an
promotes is among Muslims, after they are done killing every one of us,
infidels.
Why was Aum Shinrikyo officially branded a terrorist religion, and Islam was
not? Do we have to wait until Islamists smuggle "dirty bomb" nuclear
devices into New York, London, Boston, D.C. and make them uninhabitable?
How can a religion, whose defining document demands killing everyone not of
their faith, not be considered a terrorist religion?
[1]
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=e8c7f505.0309270626.3fe32010%40posting.google.com
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| User: "amigo cabal" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
03 Dec 2004 07:51:54 PM |
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Yes it is! Israeli and American terrorism has cost hundred thousand lives
and Bush and Shaon have still not been shackled!
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| User: "Ike" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
03 Dec 2004 07:31:41 PM |
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"R. Paine" <i_dont@need_your_spam.net> wrote in message
news:9116247.FxRal0zdPF@yahoo.com...
Islam is a religion defined by Qur'an, and Qur'an demands that Muslims go
and kill infidels: Christians, Jews and Atheists [1]. Correct me if I'm
wrong, but in view of this, how can Islam *not* be considered a terrorist
doctrine?
Other religious organizations encouraged violence in the past, but I know
of
no other great religion that has it written in its defining document that
everyone not of their faith be hunted and killed in as many numbers as
possible.
What about the slaughter in the old testament by the Jews against their
neighbors, and the Christians using the Bible to justify war, as the new
Chosen People, now that Christ has made them the favored ones?
I'm not prejudiced. And I'm against violence other than in self-defense.
But
I'm getting sick and tired of hearing about "peaceful Islam" bullcrap.
There can be no such thing. The only "peace and harmony" that Qur'an
promotes is among Muslims, after they are done killing every one of us,
infidels.
They won't kill everyone, just the ones who fail to convert.
Why was Aum Shinrikyo officially branded a terrorist religion, and Islam
was
not? Do we have to wait until Islamists smuggle "dirty bomb" nuclear
devices into New York, London, Boston, D.C. and make them uninhabitable?
Once they do that we will kill all of them.
How can a religion, whose defining document demands killing everyone not
of
their faith, not be considered a terrorist religion?
Religion doesn't kill people. People kill people.
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| User: "R. Paine" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
03 Dec 2004 09:13:26 PM |
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Ike wrote:
Christians using the Bible to justify war
Can you quote the New Testament (the defining document of Christianity) and
show that it encourages any killing, let alone killing people simply
because they are not of your faith?
On the other hand, Qur'an says:
"""
[8.12] ... I will cast terror into the hearts of
those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off
every fingertip of them.
"""
You can find a lot more quotes at the link I provided
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=e8c7f505.0309270626.3fe32010%40posting.google.com
You can also easily check their validity, using the online Qur'an text.
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| User: "Ike" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
06 Dec 2004 09:34:14 AM |
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"R. Paine" <i_dont@need_your_spam.net> wrote in message
news:1331893.ykeZWs5A2J@yahoo.com...
Ike wrote:
Christians using the Bible to justify war
Can you quote the New Testament (the defining document of Christianity)
and
show that it encourages any killing, let alone killing people simply
because they are not of your faith?
On the other hand, Qur'an says:
"""
[8.12] ... I will cast terror into the hearts of
those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off
every fingertip of them.
"""
You can find a lot more quotes at the link I provided
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=e8c7f505.0309270626.3fe32010%40posting.google.com
You can also easily check their validity, using the online Qur'an text.
The New Testament may not, but Christians also use the Old Testament since
they compare themselves to the ancient Hebrews as God's new chosen people.
Or are you saying that if they use the Old Testament they are not *real*
Christians?
--
Freedom of thought entails no "Intellectual Property".
.
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| User: "maff" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
04 Dec 2004 03:37:48 AM |
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"R. Paine" <i_dont@need_your_spam.net> wrote in message news:<1331893.ykeZWs5A2J@yahoo.com>...
Ike wrote:
Christians using the Bible to justify war
Can you quote the New Testament (the defining document of Christianity) and
show that it encourages any killing, let alone killing people simply
because they are not of your faith?
Are you kidding? Why don't you tell that to the victims?
Christian atrocities
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&selm=18510aff.0411301229.5f1da429%40posting.google.com
http://snipurl.com/b0al
On the other hand, Qur'an says:
"""
[8.12] ... I will cast terror into the hearts of
those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off
every fingertip of them.
"""
You can find a lot more quotes at the link I provided
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=e8c7f505.0309270626.3fe32010%40posting.google.com
You can also easily check their validity, using the online Qur'an text.
.
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| User: "Dietrich" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
04 Dec 2004 07:21:05 AM |
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maff <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:18510aff.0412040137.597eab7e@posting.google.com...
"R. Paine" <i_dont@need_your_spam.net> wrote in message
news:<1331893.ykeZWs5A2J@yahoo.com>...
Ike wrote:
Christians using the Bible to justify war
Can you quote the New Testament (the defining document of Christianity)
and
show that it encourages any killing, let alone killing people simply
because they are not of your faith?
Are you kidding? Why don't you tell that to the victims?
Christian atrocities
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&selm=18510aff.0411301229.5f1da429%
40posting.google.com
http://snipurl.com/b0al
The question was: "Can you quote the New Testament (the defining document of
Christianity) and show that it encourages any killing, let alone killing
people simply because they are not of your faith?"
You eluded that because as you may or may not know, there is none.
That is the first fundamental difference between Christianity and Islam.
The second fundamental difference is evolution, and one can not use the past
as an example when the present shows change. Trends. Killings of
non-Christians by Chrsitians for the sake of religion has virtually vanished
from the planet, especially over the past 200 years. The same can not be
said of Islam. The trend is the opposite.
On the other hand, Qur'an says:
"""
[8.12] ... I will cast terror into the hearts of
those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off
every fingertip of them.
"""
You can find a lot more quotes at the link I provided
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=e8c7f505.0309270626.3fe32010%40posting.
google.com
You can also easily check their validity, using the online Qur'an text.
.
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| User: "Ike" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
06 Dec 2004 09:34:15 AM |
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"Dietrich" <dd44825@euromail.com> wrote in message
news:31drtlF39kvimU1@uni-berlin.de...
maff <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:18510aff.0412040137.597eab7e@posting.google.com...
"R. Paine" <i_dont@need_your_spam.net> wrote in message
news:<1331893.ykeZWs5A2J@yahoo.com>...
Ike wrote:
Christians using the Bible to justify war
Can you quote the New Testament (the defining document of
Christianity)
and
show that it encourages any killing, let alone killing people simply
because they are not of your faith?
Are you kidding? Why don't you tell that to the victims?
Christian atrocities
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&selm=18510aff.0411301229.5f1da429%
40posting.google.com
http://snipurl.com/b0al
The question was: "Can you quote the New Testament (the defining document
of
Christianity) and show that it encourages any killing, let alone killing
people simply because they are not of your faith?"
You eluded that because as you may or may not know, there is none.
That is the first fundamental difference between Christianity and Islam.
The second fundamental difference is evolution, and one can not use the
past
as an example when the present shows change. Trends. Killings of
non-Christians by Chrsitians for the sake of religion has virtually
vanished
from the planet, especially over the past 200 years. The same can not be
said of Islam. The trend is the opposite.
Then you are saying that all the killing that Christians do in war is not
killing for the sake of religion. How about Hitler? He was a Christian. How
about the collateral damage in Iraq where the U.S. killed civilians with
aircraft dropping bombs. How about the Vietnam War? It was against communism
mainly on the theory that communism was atheist.
--
Freedom of thought entails no "Intellectual Property".
.
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| User: "maff" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
05 Dec 2004 03:44:23 AM |
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"Dietrich" <dd44825@euromail.com> wrote in message news:<31drtlF39kvimU1@uni-berlin.de>...
maff <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:18510aff.0412040137.597eab7e@posting.google.com...
"R. Paine" <i_dont@need_your_spam.net> wrote in message
news:<1331893.ykeZWs5A2J@yahoo.com>...
Ike wrote:
Christians using the Bible to justify war
Can you quote the New Testament (the defining document of Christianity)
and
show that it encourages any killing, let alone killing people simply
because they are not of your faith?
Are you kidding? Why don't you tell that to the victims?
Christian atrocities
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&selm=18510aff.0411301229.5f1da429%
40posting.google.com
http://snipurl.com/b0al
The question was: "Can you quote the New Testament (the defining document of
Christianity) and show that it encourages any killing, let alone killing
people simply because they are not of your faith?"
You eluded that because as you may or may not know, there is none.
That is the first fundamental difference between Christianity and Islam.
The second fundamental difference is evolution, and one can not use the past
as an example when the present shows change. Trends. Killings of
non-Christians by Chrsitians for the sake of religion has virtually vanished
from the planet, especially over the past 200 years. The same can not be
said of Islam. The trend is the opposite.
"The folkish-minded man, in particular, has the sacred duty, each in
his own denomination, of making people stop just talking superficially
of God's will, and actually fulfill God's will, and not let God's word
be desecrated.
For God's will gave men their form, their essence, and their
abilities. Anyone who destroys His work is declaring war on the Lord's
creation, the divine will. Therefore, let every man be active, each in
his own denomination if you please, and let every man take it as his
first and most sacred duty to oppose anyone who in his activity by
word or deed steps outside the confines of his religious community and
tries to butt into the other."
.... Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will
of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am
fighting for the work of the Lord."
- Adolf Hitler, "Mein Kampf"
"Three years later he informed General Gerhart Engel: "I am now as
before a Catholic and will always remain so." He never left the
church, and the church never left him. Great literature was banned by
his church, but his miserable Mien Kampf never appeared on the Index
of Forbidden Books. "
http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/james_haught/holy.html
"My feeling as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a
fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded
only by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and
summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest
not as a sufferer but as a fighter.
In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the
passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and
seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and
adders. How terrific was his fight against the Jewish poison."
Today, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more
profoundly than ever before the fact that it was for this that He had
to shed his blood upon the Cross."
As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I
have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice..."
And if there is anything which could demonstrate that we are acting
rightly, it is the distress that daily grows. For as a Christian I
have also a duty to my own people. And when I look on my people I see
them work and work and toil and labor, and at the end of the week they
have only for their wages wretchedness and misery."
When I go out in the morning and see these men standing in their
queues and look into their pinched faces, then I believe I would be no
Christian, but a very devil, if I felt no pity for them, if I did not,
as did our Lord two thousand years ago, turn against those by whom
today this poor people are plundered and exploited."
- Adolf Hitler, "My New Order"
PIUS XII
Eugenio Pacelli, Pope 1939 - 1958
"His Holiness, Pius XII, the best anti-democrat in the world," as he
was in 1950 (!) proudly titled by Ecclesia, official organ of the
Spanish Catholic Action in an attempt to pay him the greatest tribute
a Catholic paper could pay, earlier in his career, as we have seen,
had helped Hitler to come to power in Germany. His policy as a pope
was faithful to his predecessor. When the Spanish republic was finally
defeated by Catholic troops under Franco, would-be dictator of Spain,
the pope sent a special message to the victors:
"With great joy we address you, dearest sons of Catholic Spain,
to express our paternal congratulations for the gift of peace and
victory with which God has chosen to crown the Christian heroism of
your faith
... We give you, our dear sons of Catholic Spain, our apostolic
benediction." [4/17/1939]
Church property and all medieval (!) privileges of the Church were
restored. No other religion was allowed. Protestants and ex-Catholics
were sent to concentration camps for refusing to attend divine
service. Freethinkers, democrats, Socialists and Communists were
deprived of civil rights,imprisoned, or shot.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Pius XI, in his own words a "man with no love for democracy," helped
to bring Mussolini's Fascist Party to power in Italy and in 1926
solemnly declared: "Mussolini is a man sent by Divine Providence."
[MC247] In 1935 Fascist Italy attacked and invaded Abyssinia. Since
the population of Italy lacked enthusiasm for this aggression, the
pope hastened to declare a new crusade. For example the Archbishop of
Tarent, holding a Holy Mass on a submarine, declared: "The war against
Abyssinia should be viewed as a Holy War, as a crusade," which also
opened "Ethiopia, the land of infidels and schismatics, to the
catholic Faith."
The pope's emissary in Germany, Papal Nuncio Eugenio Pacelli, the
future Pope Pius XII, helped to demolish the young Weimar republic.
After the liberal democratic Catholic leader Erzberger had been
assassinated, the Pope's exertions became directed to the support of
all Right-Wing movements in Germany, via the influence of the Catholic
Centre Party. On march 23, 1933, the German Reichstag met, and the
Catholic Party, led by its Catholic leaders, former chancellor Brüning
and prelate Mgr. Kaas, personal friend of Pacelli, voted for Catholic
Hitler. After this, having received, directly from the Vatican, orders
to disband, the Catholic Party dissolved. Preached Pacelli to the
German Catholics:
"...it is all the more necessary that the Catholics, deprived of
diplomatic representation, should find in the diplomatic pacts between
the Holy See and the National Socialist Government guarantees which
can assure them ... the maintenance of their position in the life of
the nation."
Mgr. Kaas, leader of the dissolved Catholic Party, put it even more
bluntly: Catholics must support Hitler, he said. They should not have
any fears about it. For Hitler's ideals were "noble ideals."
Furthermore, "Hitler knows well how to guide the ship." In this way
the first successful democracy on german soil had been destroyed.
[MC250-252]
Hitler and 1,700 years of Christian anti-semitism
http://cnn.co.uk/WORLD/9803/16/vatican.holocaust/index.html
http://www.hearnow.org/caljp.html
http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/anti-semitism/Luther_on_Jews.html
http://www.cdn-friends-icej.ca/antiholo.html
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/Subject=Holocaust%2C%20Jewish%20%281939-1945%29/
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/Subject=Jews/
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/Subject=Holocaust/
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/Subject=Christianity%20and%20antisemitism/
On the other hand, Qur'an says:
"""
[8.12] ... I will cast terror into the hearts of
those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off
every fingertip of them.
"""
You can find a lot more quotes at the link I provided
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=e8c7f505.0309270626.3fe32010%40posting.
google.com
You can also easily check their validity, using the online Qur'an text.
.
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| User: "maff" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
04 Dec 2004 03:18:54 PM |
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"Dietrich" <dd44825@euromail.com> wrote in message news:<31drtlF39kvimU1@uni-berlin.de>...
maff <maff91@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:18510aff.0412040137.597eab7e@posting.google.com...
"R. Paine" <i_dont@need_your_spam.net> wrote in message
news:<1331893.ykeZWs5A2J@yahoo.com>...
Ike wrote:
Christians using the Bible to justify war
Can you quote the New Testament (the defining document of Christianity)
and
show that it encourages any killing, let alone killing people simply
because they are not of your faith?
Are you kidding? Why don't you tell that to the victims?
Christian atrocities
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&selm=18510aff.0411301229.5f1da429%
40posting.google.com
http://snipurl.com/b0al
The question was: "Can you quote the New Testament (the defining document of
Christianity) and show that it encourages any killing, let alone killing
people simply because they are not of your faith?"
You eluded that because as you may or may not know, there is none.
That is the first fundamental difference between Christianity and Islam.
The second fundamental difference is evolution, and one can not use the past
as an example when the present shows change. Trends. Killings of
non-Christians by Chrsitians for the sake of religion has virtually vanished
from the planet, especially over the past 200 years. The same can not be
said of Islam. The trend is the opposite.
Try http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF8&selm=36717622.38996%40news.ala.net
Why do you think there was a Civil War? Le's face it. Confederates and
Bible Belt fundamentalists are degenerates. Iraq is only the latest
episode.
A Century Of U.S. Military Interventions: From Wounded Knee to
Afghanistan
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&selm=18510aff.0406222349.4826f37b%40posting.google.com
Constitution of the Confederate States of America
http://americancivilwar.com/documents/confederate_constitution.html
March 11,1861
We, the people of the Confederate States, each State acting in its
sovereign and independent character, in order to form a permanent
federal government, establish justice, insure domestic tranquillity,
and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our
posterity~invoking the favor and guidance of Almighty God~do ordain
and establish this Constitution for the Confederate States of America.
On the other hand, Qur'an says:
"""
[8.12] ... I will cast terror into the hearts of
those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off
every fingertip of them.
"""
You can find a lot more quotes at the link I provided
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=e8c7f505.0309270626.3fe32010%40posting.
google.com
You can also easily check their validity, using the online Qur'an text.
.
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| User: "amigo cabal" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
04 Dec 2004 09:32:51 PM |
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The question was: "Can you quote the New Testament (the defining document
of
Christianity) and show that it encourages any killing, let alone killing
people simply because they are not of your faith?"
WOW, THAT ONE IS REAAAAALY HARD TO PROVE! HOW MANY PAGES OF BIBLE DO NOT
TALK ABOUT KILLING I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW!
You eluded that because as you may or may not know, there is none.
That is the first fundamental difference between Christianity and Islam.
The second fundamental difference is evolution, and one can not use the
past
as an example when the present shows change. Trends. Killings of
non-Christians by Chrsitians for the sake of religion has virtually
vanished
from the planet, especially over the past 200 years. The same can not be
said of Islam. The trend is the opposite.
WELL JEWISH COMMISSARS MURDERED 100 MILLION RUSSIANS FOR BEING CHRISTIAN.
SIMPLE POSSESSION OF A BIBLE WAS ENOUGH TO GET YOUR BALLS CUT OFF BY
COMMISSAR YAGODA. 97% OF ALL SECRET SERVICE AGENTS IN SOVIET UNION WERE
JEWS!
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| User: "Dietrich" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
05 Dec 2004 06:30:22 AM |
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amigo cabal <pinkspider123@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:Djvsd.3995$714.728@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
The question was: "Can you quote the New Testament (the defining
document
of
Christianity) and show that it encourages any killing, let alone killing
people simply because they are not of your faith?"
WOW, THAT ONE IS REAAAAALY HARD TO PROVE! HOW MANY PAGES OF BIBLE DO NOT
TALK ABOUT KILLING I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW!
Please let us know, Muslim. How many pages of the New Testament encourage
killing, and specifically the killing of those not of the Christain faith?
You call posted and verifiable such verses of the Koran "LIES". You now
sarcastically claim, in discussing Christianity, that verses extolling the
virtues of murder are "REAAAAALY HARD TO PROVE!".
THEN PROVE IT.
PROVE THAT IT IS YOU WHO IS NOT IN FACT THE LIAR.
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| User: "Rafael Leyre" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
05 Dec 2004 10:43:53 AM |
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"R. Paine" <i_dont@need_your_spam.net> wrote in message news:<1331893.ykeZWs5A2J@yahoo.com>...
Ike wrote:
Christians using the Bible to justify war
Can you quote the New Testament (the defining document of Christianity) and
show that it encourages any killing, let alone killing people simply
because they are not of your faith?
[..]
[Matt 5:17] Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the
prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
[Matt 10:34] Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came
not to send peace, but a sword.
I fully agree that the danger of Islam is seriously under-estimated,
and that it is ludicrous to say today that Islam means peace.
Defining a religion by its books is too simple: there are many other
aspects. Muslims were more peacefull a century ago, and the Quran has
not changed.
I don't think it is correct to separate the New Testament from the
Christian bible when convenient. Christians killed American Indians,
black slaves, colonial natives and - never forget Kain - other
Christians, wile waving bibles that contained both Testaments.
It seems that religions use or forget their holy books as it fits them
best.
Rafael Leyre
http://www.essayvtm.netfirms.com
(An Essay on Violence, Tradition and Modernity)
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| User: "M. Ranjit Mathews" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
05 Dec 2004 07:55:46 PM |
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(Rafael Leyre) wrote ...
I fully agree that the danger of Islam is seriously under-estimated,
and that it is ludicrous to say today that Islam means peace.
Sendero Luminoso ("Shining Path") means "the way that shines". Should
it be ludicrous that it means this? Given the meanings of the words
"sendero" and "luminoso" in Spanish, that's what it does mean.
Likewise if "peace" is what the word "Islam" means, should that be
ludicrous?
Defining a religion by its books is too simple: there are many other
aspects. Muslims were more peacefull a century ago, and the Quran has
not changed.
.... and many non-Islamist Muslims are more peaceful than Islamists
with their Qurans not being different.
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| User: "Roger Paine" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
05 Dec 2004 08:57:19 PM |
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M. Ranjit Mathews wrote:
Rafael_Leyre@yahoo.com (Rafael Leyre) wrote ...
I fully agree that the danger of Islam is seriously under-estimated,
and that it is ludicrous to say today that Islam means peace.
Sendero Luminoso ("Shining Path") means "the way that shines". Should
it be ludicrous that it means this? Given the meanings of the words
"sendero" and "luminoso" in Spanish, that's what it does mean.
Likewise if "peace" is what the word "Islam" means, should that be
ludicrous?
"islam" means "submission" (to Allah). Any peace promoted in Islam is among
Muslims ("believers") only. Here's what Islam has in store for everyone
else:
[8.12] ... I will cast terror into the hearts of
those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off
every fingertip of them.
- Qur'an, http://www.hti.umich.edu/k/koran/
Defining a religion by its books is too simple: there are many other
aspects.
If you don't like what's written in Qur'an, you are free to denounce Islam,
and stop being Muslim.
Muslims were more peacefull a century ago, and the Quran has
not changed.
They had less contact with the outside world, no airliners to crash, no
dirty nukes to detonate.
... and many non-Islamist Muslims are more peaceful than Islamists
with their Qurans not being different.
Non-Islamist Muslim?! A Muslim who has nothing to do with "the faith,
doctrine, or cause of Islam" (as defined in Webster)? Care to give us more
insightful "facts" ?
.
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| User: "doc" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
06 Dec 2004 01:23:29 AM |
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Why some think Islam is a thread is answered here.In order to learn
about a religion one listens to the scholars of that religion not
people of another religion who may be against it.
http://www.islamtomorrow.com/definition.asp
http://www.irfi.org/about_irfi.htm
http://www.alrehman-alrahim.com/alquran.html
Ans. Because Islam poses a threat to those how have brutalized the
humanity for the sake of their peace in their own land. Because Islam
tends to expose people who have tried to dominate their own ideas in
the world by Nuking cities with innocent civilians, Napalm bomb
burning villages in Vietnam dominating the world by force and hidden
or open evil conspiracies, killing innocent people for land, money and
power and blaming blind revengers for terrorism, having control in
most believed news media, manipulating and distorting things to brain
wash the innocent public.
Distorting Islam's concept is easy. There are many examples Muslims
can give by relating above mentioned events and Bible or accuse Jesus
and marry for a lot of things based on fact that she was a virgin who
gave birth to a son etc and proof another religions terrorist. But
that will only cause frustration and agony amounts those Christians
who live in peace with Muslims and this will start an un wanted hatred
and hostility which may lead to war.
For example You will find many trying to give Islam a bad name
supported by the fact that there are some militants who go outside
Islam and kill non military people. Which is punishable in Islam even
it is by accident during war. They will use Quranic verses telling
Muslims to fight and kill non Muslims, but will not tell they are to
fight for self defense.
Quran which is an unchanged book protected by God himself says
2.190. Fight against those who fight against you in the way of
Allah,
but do not transgress, for Allah does not love transgressors.
2.192. Then if they desist, know well that Allah is Ever-Forgiving,
Most Compassionate.
2.193. Keep on fighting against them until mischief ends and the way
prescribed by Allah prevails. But if they desist, then know that
hostility is only against the wrong-doers.
[004:135] O ye who believe! stand out firmly for justice, as
witnesses to God, even as against yourselves, or your parents, or your
kin, and whether it be (against) rich or poor: for God can best
protect both. Follow not the lusts (of your hearts), lest ye swerve,
and if ye distort (justice) or decline to do justice, verily God is
well- acquainted with all that ye do.
In order to learn about a religion one listens to the scholars of that
religion not people of another religion.
If you really believe in what ever you believe in? You must browse the
sites of the other side too or your believe is based on false
speculations and it cannot be called a believe.
Some sits about Islam:
http://www.islamtomorrow.com/definition.asp
http://www.irfi.org/about_irfi.htm
http://www.alrehman-alrahim.com/alquran.html
http://www.islam101.com/quran/yusufAli/
http://saifur.tripod.com/biblecon.html
http://www.submission.org/life.html
http://www.harunyahya.com/
You will also find some major strategies on much larger scale against
Islam :
http://www.iraqbodycount.net/
http://www.tvnewslies.org/html/bush_s_brain_dvd_video.html
http://www.web-light.nl/VISIE/extremedeformities.html
http://www.ettnet.se/~stefan-a/hiroshima/atomswe1.htm
http://www.michaelmoore.com/index_main.php
http://members.aol.com/erichuf/ThePainfulDeceptionsVideo.html
http://www.robert-fisk.com/iraqwarvictims_mar2003.htm
.
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| User: "wbarwell" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
06 Dec 2004 01:33:55 PM |
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doc wrote:
Why some think Islam is a thread is answered here.In order to learn
about a religion one listens to the scholars of that religion not
people of another religion who may be against it.
No, you look at history. What did Islam do until it sank into
senesence and is peaceful because it lacks ability to any longer force
itself on people?
Its an long and ugly history.
Today Islam is peaceful in that it is no longer capable of militarily
challenging anybody. and has to pretend to be peaceful for Western
consumption, though their own not for Western consumption religous rantings
are often quite violent and nasty.
Its like a man who can no longer get it up crowing about his sexual
abstinence as a moral virtue, not as inability to be immoral anymore
in his dotage.
The nasty verses of the Quran that lead to centuries of oppression,
slavery, attacks, wars, jihad, and genocides are still there, to be
brushed off and used again if Islam ever had a chance to militarily
impose itself on others.
Look at the Sudan for examples of what happens if you are a
weak neighbor living next door to an Islamic neighbor.
Do you hear all those peaceful Islamic Mullahs loudly
berating the Sudanese? No?
Not like say the campign organized in the West to sink
South African apartheid.
This book is an everlasting source of infection and moral disease waiting
to break out again when times are more suitable to resuming
jihad, slavery and conquest as was Islam's habit for 800 years until
the Russians finally kicked Ottoman Turkish *****. Or until Napolean kicked
the doors of an effete and ineffectual Islamic civilization in in Egypt.
Ask India about Islam, or the Bangladeshis who can tell you of the 1970's
and what their Islamic brothers did to them then. Or look at the Taliban
who destroyed entire provinces of Afghanistan.
This is the real Islam, typical over the centuries, and history shows us
unrestrained by superior military might, Islam is not and never has been
peaceful.
It took wholesale invasion and defeat of Algeria and North Africa by the
French in 1835 to end Islamic slavery and piracy in the Mediterranian once
and for all. Not to mention US kicking Tripolitanian butt.
Where Islam has even minor military power you always get jihad, slavery and
war.
And always will until they purge this evil book of evil verses which is not
going to happen.
http://www.islamtomorrow.com/definition.asp
http://www.irfi.org/about_irfi.htm
http://www.alrehman-alrahim.com/alquran.html
Ans. Because Islam poses a threat to those how have brutalized the
humanity for the sake of their peace in their own land. Because Islam
tends to expose people who have tried to dominate their own ideas in
the world by Nuking cities with innocent civilians, Napalm bomb
burning villages in Vietnam dominating the world by force and hidden
or open evil conspiracies, killing innocent people for land, money and
power and blaming blind revengers for terrorism, having control in
most believed news media, manipulating and distorting things to brain
wash the innocent public.
Distorting Islam's concept is easy. There are many examples Muslims
can give by relating above mentioned events and Bible or accuse Jesus
and marry for a lot of things based on fact that she was a virgin who
gave birth to a son etc and proof another religions terrorist. But
that will only cause frustration and agony amounts those Christians
who live in peace with Muslims and this will start an un wanted hatred
and hostility which may lead to war.
For example You will find many trying to give Islam a bad name
supported by the fact that there are some militants who go outside
Islam and kill non military people. Which is punishable in Islam even
it is by accident during war. They will use Quranic verses telling
Muslims to fight and kill non Muslims, but will not tell they are to
fight for self defense.
Quran which is an unchanged book protected by God himself says
2.190. Fight against those who fight against you in the way of
Allah,
but do not transgress, for Allah does not love transgressors.
2.192. Then if they desist, know well that Allah is Ever-Forgiving,
Most Compassionate.
2.193. Keep on fighting against them until mischief ends and the way
prescribed by Allah prevails. But if they desist, then know that
hostility is only against the wrong-doers.
[004:135] O ye who believe! stand out firmly for justice, as
witnesses to God, even as against yourselves, or your parents, or your
kin, and whether it be (against) rich or poor: for God can best
protect both. Follow not the lusts (of your hearts), lest ye swerve,
and if ye distort (justice) or decline to do justice, verily God is
well- acquainted with all that ye do.
In order to learn about a religion one listens to the scholars of that
religion not people of another religion.
If you really believe in what ever you believe in? You must browse the
sites of the other side too or your believe is based on false
speculations and it cannot be called a believe.
Some sits about Islam:
http://www.islamtomorrow.com/definition.asp
http://www.irfi.org/about_irfi.htm
http://www.alrehman-alrahim.com/alquran.html
http://www.islam101.com/quran/yusufAli/
http://saifur.tripod.com/biblecon.html
http://www.submission.org/life.html
http://www.harunyahya.com/
You will also find some major strategies on much larger scale against
Islam :
http://www.iraqbodycount.net/
http://www.tvnewslies.org/html/bush_s_brain_dvd_video.html
http://www.web-light.nl/VISIE/extremedeformities.html
http://www.ettnet.se/~stefan-a/hiroshima/atomswe1.htm
http://www.michaelmoore.com/index_main.php
http://members.aol.com/erichuf/ThePainfulDeceptionsVideo.html
http://www.robert-fisk.com/iraqwarvictims_mar2003.htm
--
Kerry - two medals a silver and bronze star.
Bush? Well they don't give medals
for going AWOL, missing your medical and
getting grounded or falling off of a bar stool.
Kerry - a hero, Bush - a zero
Cheerful Charlie
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| User: "R. Paine" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
03 Dec 2004 09:25:22 PM |
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Ike wrote:
Why was Aum Shinrikyo officially branded a terrorist religion, and Islam
was
not? Do we have to wait until Islamists smuggle "dirty bomb" nuclear
devices into New York, London, Boston, D.C. and make them uninhabitable?
Once they do that we will kill all of them.
I'm afraid it will not repair the damage.
.
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| User: "Ike" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
06 Dec 2004 09:34:16 AM |
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"R. Paine" <i_dont@need_your_spam.net> wrote in message
news:1170168.WkkeNHyJzV@yahoo.com...
Ike wrote:
Why was Aum Shinrikyo officially branded a terrorist religion, and
Islam
was
not? Do we have to wait until Islamists smuggle "dirty bomb" nuclear
devices into New York, London, Boston, D.C. and make them
uninhabitable?
Once they do that we will kill all of them.
I'm afraid it will not repair the damage.
On the contrary. It will make more damage. Your point is?
--
Freedom of thought entails no "Intellectual Property".
.
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| User: "amigo cabal" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
04 Dec 2004 09:36:12 PM |
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"R. Paine" <i_dont@need_your_spam.net> wrote in message
news:1170168.WkkeNHyJzV@yahoo.com...
Ike wrote:
Why was Aum Shinrikyo officially branded a terrorist religion, and Islam
was
not? Do we have to wait until Islamists smuggle "dirty bomb" nuclear
devices into New York, London, Boston, D.C. and make them uninhabitable?
Once they do that we will kill all of them.
I'm afraid it will not repair the damage.
SOMEONE MURDERED 5 MILLION VIETNAMESE IN THE MOST SAVAGE BOMBARDMENT KNOWN
TO MAN. DO YOU THINK THAT THIS ENTITY IS A TERRORIST?
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
03 Dec 2004 08:10:03 PM |
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In our last episode <9116247.FxRal0zdPF@yahoo.com>, R. Paine lept out of
the bushes shouting:
I'm not prejudiced.
Yes you are.
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Being surprised at the fact that the universe
is fine tuned for life is akin to a puddle being
surprised at how well it fits its hole"
-- Douglas Adams
.
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| User: "Jez" |
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| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
03 Dec 2004 11:38:45 AM |
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R. Paine wrote:
Islam is a religion defined by Qur'an, and Qur'an demands that Muslims go
and kill infidels: Christians, Jews and Atheists [1].
Where does it say this ? Quotes please.
Correct me if I'm
wrong, but in view of this, how can Islam *not* be considered a terrorist
doctrine?
Other religious organizations encouraged violence in the past, but I know of
no other great religion that has it written in its defining document that
everyone not of their faith be hunted and killed in as many numbers as
possible.
I'm not prejudiced. And I'm against violence other than in self-defense. But
I'm getting sick and tired of hearing about "peaceful Islam" bullcrap.
There can be no such thing. The only "peace and harmony" that Qur'an
promotes is among Muslims, after they are done killing every one of us,
infidels.
Why was Aum Shinrikyo officially branded a terrorist religion, and Islam was
not? Do we have to wait until Islamists smuggle "dirty bomb" nuclear
devices into New York, London, Boston, D.C. and make them uninhabitable?
How can a religion, whose defining document demands killing everyone not of
their faith, not be considered a terrorist religion?
[1]
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=e8c7f505.0309270626.3fe32010%40posting.google.com
--
Jez
'Realism is seductive because once you have accepted the reasonable
notion that you should base your actions on reality, you are too often
led to accept, without much questioning, someone else's version of what
that reality is. It is a crucial act of independent thinking to be
skeptical of someone else's description of reality.'-
Howard Zinn
Skype callto://hellward
NFS Porsche Unleashed, Hot Pursuit 2, Underground.
Yeowww
.
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| User: "amigo cabal" |
|
| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
03 Dec 2004 07:53:20 PM |
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"Jez" <iced_spear@NODAMNSPAMpipex.com> wrote in message
news:cLadnQcNMuICOS3cRVnyvQ@pipex.net...
R. Paine wrote:
Islam is a religion defined by Qur'an, and Qur'an demands that Muslims go
and kill infidels: Christians, Jews and Atheists [1].
Where does it say this ? Quotes please.
Correct me if I'm
wrong, but in view of this, how can Islam *not* be considered a terrorist
doctrine?
You are com,pletelu out of whack Try reading the Bible and Talmud for good
measure!
.
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| User: "DJ Nozem" |
|
| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
03 Dec 2004 01:03:07 PM |
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(NGs trimmed)
On Fri, 03 Dec 2004 17:38:45 +0000, Jez
<iced_spear@NODAMNSPAMpipex.com> wrote:
R. Paine wrote:
Islam is a religion defined by Qur'an, and Qur'an demands that Muslims go
and kill infidels: Christians, Jews and Atheists [1].
Where does it say this ? Quotes please.
Follow the [1].
As we are posting links, this is a good time to revisit Nolan Voyde's
brilliant "Islam & Christianity really same religion?" series.
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=39afc01b.1444104%40nntp.mindspring.com
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=39afc026.1454514%40nntp.mindspring.com
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=39afc02f.1464031%40nntp.mindspring.com
Correct me if I'm
wrong, but in view of this, how can Islam *not* be considered a terrorist
doctrine?
Other religious organizations encouraged violence in the past, but I know of
no other great religion that has it written in its defining document that
everyone not of their faith be hunted and killed in as many numbers as
possible.
I'm not prejudiced. And I'm against violence other than in self-defense. But
I'm getting sick and tired of hearing about "peaceful Islam" bullcrap.
There can be no such thing. The only "peace and harmony" that Qur'an
promotes is among Muslims, after they are done killing every one of us,
infidels.
Why was Aum Shinrikyo officially branded a terrorist religion, and Islam was
not? Do we have to wait until Islamists smuggle "dirty bomb" nuclear
devices into New York, London, Boston, D.C. and make them uninhabitable?
How can a religion, whose defining document demands killing everyone not of
their faith, not be considered a terrorist religion?
[1]
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=e8c7f505.0309270626.3fe32010%40posting.google.com
--
We give meaning to each other
.
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| User: "Jez" |
|
| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
03 Dec 2004 06:47:32 PM |
|
|
DJ Nozem wrote:
(NGs trimmed)
On Fri, 03 Dec 2004 17:38:45 +0000, Jez
<iced_spear@NODAMNSPAMpipex.com> wrote:
R. Paine wrote:
Islam is a religion defined by Qur'an, and Qur'an demands that Muslims go
and kill infidels: Christians, Jews and Atheists [1].
Where does it say this ? Quotes please.
Follow the [1].
As we are posting links, this is a good time to revisit Nolan Voyde's
brilliant "Islam & Christianity really same religion?" series.
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=39afc01b.1444104%40nntp.mindspring.com
Hehe...All religions come from ancient hallucinogen use anyway..so wtf.
They can all sod off...there is no God....
And BTW...thanks for trimming the x-posts...saved me the hassle !
(I usually forget to anyway)
:)
--
Jez
'Realism is seductive because once you have accepted the reasonable
notion that you should base your actions on reality, you are too often
led to accept, without much questioning, someone else's version of what
that reality is. It is a crucial act of independent thinking to be
skeptical of someone else's description of reality.'-
Howard Zinn
Skype callto://hellward
NFS Porsche Unleashed, Hot Pursuit 2, Underground.
Yeowww
.
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| User: "Dietrich" |
|
| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
03 Dec 2004 09:11:01 PM |
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|
Jez <iced_spear@NODAMNSPAMpipex.com> wrote in message
news:cLadnQcNMuICOS3cRVnyvQ@pipex.net...
R. Paine wrote:
Islam is a religion defined by Qur'an, and Qur'an demands that Muslims
go
and kill infidels: Christians, Jews and Atheists [1].
Where does it say this ? Quotes please.
Quran:
[2:89][The curse of Allah is on the unbelievers]
[3:28][Let not the believers take the unbelievers for friends]
[3:85][And whoever desires a religion other than Islam, it shall not be
accepted from him]
[3:118][Do not take for intimate friends from among others than your own
people]
[5.51][Do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends
of each other]
[9:14][Fight against the Jews and Christians! Allah shall punish Them, at
your hands]
[9.29][Fight those who do not believe in Allah]
[9:73][Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites! Be harsh with
them]
[9.123][Fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find
in you hardness]
[19:40][It is We Who will inherit the earth, and all beings thereon: to Us
will they all be returned]
[33.64][Allah has cursed the unbelievers and has prepared for them a burning
fire]
[41:27][We will certainly give the Unbelievers a taste of a severe Penalty]
[47.35][Be not slack so as to cry for peace and you have the upper hand]
[58:5][Those who resist Allah and His Messenger will be crumbled to dust, as
were those before them]
[66: 9][O Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites, and
be stern with them]
Correct me if I'm
wrong, but in view of this, how can Islam *not* be considered a
terrorist
doctrine?
Other religious organizations encouraged violence in the past, but I
know of
no other great religion that has it written in its defining document
that
everyone not of their faith be hunted and killed in as many numbers as
possible.
I'm not prejudiced. And I'm against violence other than in self-defense.
But
I'm getting sick and tired of hearing about "peaceful Islam" bullcrap.
There can be no such thing. The only "peace and harmony" that Qur'an
promotes is among Muslims, after they are done killing every one of us,
infidels.
Why was Aum Shinrikyo officially branded a terrorist religion, and Islam
was
not? Do we have to wait until Islamists smuggle "dirty bomb" nuclear
devices into New York, London, Boston, D.C. and make them uninhabitable?
How can a religion, whose defining document demands killing everyone not
of
their faith, not be considered a terrorist religion?
[1]
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=e8c7f505.0309270626.3fe32010%40posting.
google.com
--
Jez
'Realism is seductive because once you have accepted the reasonable
notion that you should base your actions on reality, you are too often
led to accept, without much questioning, someone else's version of what
that reality is. It is a crucial act of independent thinking to be
skeptical of someone else's description of reality.'-
Howard Zinn
Skype callto://hellward
NFS Porsche Unleashed, Hot Pursuit 2, Underground.
Yeowww
.
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| User: "amigo cabal" |
|
| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
03 Dec 2004 09:15:09 PM |
|
|
"Dietrich" <dd44825@euromail.com> wrote in message
news:31co5pF38aefaU1@uni-berlin.de...
Jez <iced_spear@NODAMNSPAMpipex.com> wrote in message
news:cLadnQcNMuICOS3cRVnyvQ@pipex.net...
R. Paine wrote:
Islam is a religion defined by Qur'an, and Qur'an demands that Muslims
go
and kill infidels: Christians, Jews and Atheists [1].
Where does it say this ? Quotes please.
Quran:
[2:89][The curse of Allah is on the unbelievers]
AND SO IT IS! AFTER SLAUGHTERING 100,000 IRAQIS MAY THEY ALL PERISH!
.
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| User: "R. Paine" |
|
| Title: Re: civilized world is too tolerant of terrorists |
03 Dec 2004 10:20:58 PM |
|
|
Dietrich wrote:
Quran:
[2:89][The curse of Allah is on the unbelievers]
[3:28][Let not the believers take the unbelievers for friends]
[3:85][And whoever desires a religion other than Islam, it shall not be
accepted from him]
[3:118][Do not take for intimate friends from among others than your own
people]
[5.51][Do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are
[friends
of each other]
[9:14][Fight against the Jews and Christians! Allah shall punish Them, at
your hands]
[9.29][Fight those who do not believe in Allah]
[9:73][Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites! Be harsh with
them]
[9.123][Fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them
[find
in you hardness]
[19:40][It is We Who will inherit the earth, and all beings thereon: to Us
will they all be returned]
[33.64][Allah has cursed the unbelievers and has prepared for them a
[burning
fire]
[41:27][We will certainly give the Unbelievers a taste of a severe
[Penalty] 47.35][Be not slack so as to cry for peace and you have the
[upper hand] 58:5][Those who resist Allah and His Messenger will be
[crumbled to dust, as
were those before them]
[66: 9][O Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites, and
be stern with them]
Is there an organization that aims to raise public awareness of the Islamist
terrorist threat to our civilization? I don't think just bickering about it
on USENET is effective enough.
.
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| User: "amigo cabal" |
|
| Title: BEWARE OF JEWISH TERRORISTS! |
04 Dec 2004 09:26:13 PM |
|
|
Professional Demolition of World Trade Center Building 7
Larry Silverstein, the owner of the WTC complex, admitted on a September
2002 PBS documentary, 'America Rebuilds' that he and the NYFD decided to
'pull' WTC 7 on the day of the attack. The word 'pull' is industry jargon
for taking a building down with explosives.
We have attempted to call Larry Silverstein's office on several occasions.
Silverstein has never issued a retraction for his comments.
Photos taken moments before the collapse of WTC 7 show small office fires on
just two floors.
Firefighters were told to move away from the building moments before it
collapsed.
In February of 2002 Silverstein Properties won $861 million from Industrial
Risk Insurers to rebuild on the site of WTC 7. Silverstein Properties'
estimated investment in WTC 7 was $386 million. So: This building's collapse
resulted in a profit of about $500 million!
.
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| User: "Sunny" |
|
| Title: Re: BEWARE OF JEWISH TERRORISTS! |
04 Dec 2004 11:34:32 PM |
|
|
"amigo cabal" <pinkspider123@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:pdvsd.3991$714.1100@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
Professional Demolition of World Trade Center Building 7
*****, you are getting your twisted crap from here :
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/cutter.html
Are you suggesting that someone rigged demolitions in a few hours, that
usually take weeks to lay out ?
Stop taking your pills with red cordial.
.
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| User: "amigo cabal" |
|
| Title: Re: BEWARE OF JEWISH TERRORISTS! |
06 Dec 2004 05:55:38 PM |
|
|
"Sunny" <wombathouse@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:I5xsd.59419$K7.15993@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
"amigo cabal" <pinkspider123@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:pdvsd.3991$714.1100@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
Professional Demolition of World Trade Center Building 7
*****, you are getting your twisted crap from here :
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/cutter.html
Are you suggesting that someone rigged demolitions in a few hours, that
usually take weeks to lay out ?
Stop taking your pills with red cordial.
TELL THAT TO SOMEONE WHO WAS NOT A MILITARY SAPPER!
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