| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Jason Spaceman" |
| Date: |
29 Nov 2004 04:18:56 AM |
| Object: |
Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
From the article:
-----------------------------------------------------
ACLU involvement in a Dover, Pennsylvania, case clearly shows their
desperation. Last month, the school board in this rural south-central
Pennsylvania community became the first in the nation to mandate the
teaching of “intelligent design,” which holds that the universe is so
complex that it must have been created by a higher power. The “higher
power” is unspecified, but that does not matter to the zealots at the
ACLU, who endorse ignorance because they believe that any mention or
reference to anything remotely like a Supreme Being is “an
establishment of religion” and therefore unconstitutional.
----------------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.mensnewsdaily.com/archive/p/patton/2004/patton112904.htm
J. Spaceman
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| User: "Danny Kodicek" |
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| Title: Re: Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
29 Nov 2004 04:59:41 AM |
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"Jason Spaceman" <notreally@jspaceman.homelinux.org> wrote in message
news:rkulq05227qfdg3vhmqjckj6gtog858g3t@4ax.com...
From the article:
-----------------------------------------------------
ACLU involvement in a Dover, Pennsylvania, case clearly shows their
desperation. Last month, the school board in this rural south-central
Pennsylvania community became the first in the nation to mandate the
teaching of "intelligent design," which holds that the universe is so
complex that it must have been created by a higher power. The "higher
power" is unspecified, but that does not matter to the zealots at the
ACLU, who endorse ignorance because they believe that any mention or
reference to anything remotely like a Supreme Being is "an
establishment of religion" and therefore unconstitutional.
----------------------------------------------------
Nice line here:
'Many a Christian fundamentalist has looked back on the Scopes trial as the
beginning of a long slide toward the secularism that pervades American
society today'
Er... right.
Danny
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| User: "Tukla Ratte" |
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| Title: Re: Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
29 Nov 2004 03:16:37 PM |
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Danny Kodicek wrote:
< snip >
Nice line here:
'Many a Christian fundamentalist has looked back on the Scopes trial as the
beginning of a long slide toward the secularism that pervades American
society today'
Er... right.
Didn't the fundies win that case?
--
Tukla, Eater of Theists, Squeaker of Chew Toys
Official Mascot of Alt.Atheism, aa 1347
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| User: "Danny Kodicek" |
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| Title: Re: Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
29 Nov 2004 03:39:52 PM |
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"Tukla Ratte" <tukla_ratte@tukla.net> wrote in message
news:311io8F33j1cpU1@uni-berlin.de...
Danny Kodicek wrote:
< snip >
Nice line here:
'Many a Christian fundamentalist has looked back on the Scopes trial as
the
beginning of a long slide toward the secularism that pervades American
society today'
Er... right.
Didn't the fundies win that case?
Well, according to the article it was something of a draw - I don't know
enough about it myself but you can read a brief summary at
http://www.talkorigins.org/origins/jargon/biofile_s.html. My comment was
more about the 'pervading secularism of American society'. Rather like the
common phrase 'the liberal press', it somewhat depends where you're standing
at the time...
Danny
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| User: "John Baker" |
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| Title: Re: Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
29 Nov 2004 06:21:43 PM |
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"Tukla Ratte" <tukla_ratte@tukla.net> wrote in message
news:311io8F33j1cpU1@uni-berlin.de...
Danny Kodicek wrote:
< snip >
Nice line here:
'Many a Christian fundamentalist has looked back on the Scopes trial as
the
beginning of a long slide toward the secularism that pervades American
society today'
Er... right.
Didn't the fundies win that case?
IIRC, Scopes was found guilty and fined $25.
--
Tukla, Eater of Theists, Squeaker of Chew Toys
Official Mascot of Alt.Atheism, aa 1347
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| User: "Double Felix" |
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| Title: Re: Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
30 Nov 2004 01:35:01 AM |
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In article <IbPqd.43$CG4.15@fe2.columbus.rr.com>,
"John Baker" <nunya@bizniz.net> wrote:
"Tukla Ratte" <tukla_ratte@tukla.net> wrote in message
news:311io8F33j1cpU1@uni-berlin.de...
Danny Kodicek wrote:
< snip >
Nice line here:
'Many a Christian fundamentalist has looked back on the Scopes trial as
the
beginning of a long slide toward the secularism that pervades American
society today'
Er... right.
Didn't the fundies win that case?
IIRC, Scopes was found guilty and fined $25.
$100 actually.
The jury asked the judge to set the fine, which was their mistake. The
law stated that the jury shall impose the sentence.
- Felix
--
Tukla, Eater of Theists, Squeaker of Chew Toys
Official Mascot of Alt.Atheism, aa 1347
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| User: "Alan Morgan" |
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| Title: Re: Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
29 Nov 2004 03:59:30 PM |
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In article <311io8F33j1cpU1@uni-berlin.de>,
Tukla Ratte <tukla_ratte@tukla.net> wrote:
Danny Kodicek wrote:
< snip >
Nice line here:
'Many a Christian fundamentalist has looked back on the Scopes trial as the
beginning of a long slide toward the secularism that pervades American
society today'
Er... right.
Didn't the fundies win that case?
Won the battle, lost the war. Scopes was found guilty and the ruling was
overturned on a technicality (having to do with the size of the fine).
Alan
--
Defendit numerus
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| User: "Robert Grumbine" |
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| Title: Re: Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
30 Nov 2004 07:34:26 AM |
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In article <cog6us$e0d$1@xenon.Stanford.EDU>,
Alan Morgan <amorgan@xenon.Stanford.EDU> wrote:
In article <311io8F33j1cpU1@uni-berlin.de>,
Tukla Ratte <tukla_ratte@tukla.net> wrote:
Danny Kodicek wrote:
< snip >
Nice line here:
'Many a Christian fundamentalist has looked back on the Scopes trial as the
beginning of a long slide toward the secularism that pervades American
society today'
Er... right.
Didn't the fundies win that case?
Won the battle, lost the war. Scopes was found guilty and the ruling was
overturned on a technicality (having to do with the size of the fine).
I suppose it depends on what you consider to be the war.
If the war was to impose a fine on Scopes for violating the law, then
the creationists lost the war. The judge imposed a $100 fine, when he
could only levy up to $50.
If the war was to try a case to set legal precedent, then both sides
lost the war. Because of the improper fine, the case could not be appealed
to the federal courts as would be necessary to set a broad legal precedent.
If the war was to overturn the state law against teaching evolution,
science lost. Teaching evolution remained illegal for another
40 or so years.
On the whole, I'd say the creationists won. They preserved their law
against teaching science. Scopes himself was never a concern to anybody
except insofar as he served as guinea pig to bring the case into a court.
--
Robert Grumbine http://www.radix.net/~bobg/ Science faqs and amateur activities notes and links.
Sagredo (Galileo Galilei) "You present these recondite matters with too much
evidence and ease; this great facility makes them less appreciated than they
would be had they been presented in a more abstruse manner." Two New Sciences
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| User: "AC" |
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| Title: Re: Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
29 Nov 2004 03:52:19 PM |
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On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 10:59:41 +0000 (UTC),
Danny Kodicek <usenet@well-spring.co.uk> wrote:
"Jason Spaceman" <notreally@jspaceman.homelinux.org> wrote in message
news:rkulq05227qfdg3vhmqjckj6gtog858g3t@4ax.com...
From the article:
-----------------------------------------------------
ACLU involvement in a Dover, Pennsylvania, case clearly shows their
desperation. Last month, the school board in this rural south-central
Pennsylvania community became the first in the nation to mandate the
teaching of "intelligent design," which holds that the universe is so
complex that it must have been created by a higher power. The "higher
power" is unspecified, but that does not matter to the zealots at the
ACLU, who endorse ignorance because they believe that any mention or
reference to anything remotely like a Supreme Being is "an
establishment of religion" and therefore unconstitutional.
----------------------------------------------------
Nice line here:
'Many a Christian fundamentalist has looked back on the Scopes trial as the
beginning of a long slide toward the secularism that pervades American
society today'
Er... right.
That's because they were taught the controversy of American history, where
Thomas Jefferson was a fine upstanding Christian, and not an evil deist
trying to overthrow Christianity by separating Church and State.
Education in America. If you can find McDonalds and plug in a lamp three
times without electrocuting yourself, your ready to roll!
--
Aaron Clausen
mightymartianca@hotmail.com
"My illness is due to my doctor's insistence that I drink milk, a
whitish fluid they force down helpless babies." - WC Fields
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| User: "sparkup" |
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| Title: Re: Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
29 Nov 2004 10:30:51 AM |
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"Jason Spaceman" <notreally@jspaceman.homelinux.org> wrote in message
news:rkulq05227qfdg3vhmqjckj6gtog858g3t@4ax.com...
From the article:
-----------------------------------------------------
ACLU involvement in a Dover, Pennsylvania, case clearly shows their
desperation. Last month, the school board in this rural south-central
Pennsylvania community became the first in the nation to mandate the
teaching of "intelligent design," which holds that the universe is so
complex that it must have been created by a higher power. The "higher
power" is unspecified, but that does not matter to the zealots at the
ACLU, who endorse ignorance because they believe that any mention or
reference to anything remotely like a Supreme Being is "an
establishment of religion" and therefore unconstitutional.
----------------------------------------------------
Also from the article:
"I believe in creationism. I believe that God created the earth and
everything on its face, including human beings. I think it takes a great
deal more faith to believe in Darwin's theory of random selection than it
does to believe that an all-powerful Supreme Being created all this with a
purpose in mind. "
TQOTM?
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| User: "Tukla Ratte" |
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| Title: Re: Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
29 Nov 2004 03:18:48 PM |
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sparkup wrote:
< snip >
I think it takes a great
deal more faith to believe in Darwin's theory of random selection
"Random selection"? What the hell is that?
than it
does to believe that an all-powerful Supreme Being created all this with a
purpose in mind. "
Sure, if you don't actually think about it.
TQOTM?
Doesn't qualify, I'm afraid.
--
Tukla, Eater of Theists, Squeaker of Chew Toys
Official Mascot of Alt.Atheism, aa 1347
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| User: "tim gueguen" |
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| Title: Re: Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
29 Nov 2004 04:47:41 PM |
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"Jason Spaceman" <notreally@jspaceman.homelinux.org> wrote in message
news:rkulq05227qfdg3vhmqjckj6gtog858g3t@4ax.com...
From the article:
-----------------------------------------------------
ACLU involvement in a Dover, Pennsylvania, case clearly shows their
desperation. Last month, the school board in this rural south-central
Pennsylvania community became the first in the nation to mandate the
teaching of "intelligent design," which holds that the universe is so
complex that it must have been created by a higher power. The "higher
power" is unspecified, but that does not matter to the zealots at the
ACLU, who endorse ignorance because they believe that any mention or
reference to anything remotely like a Supreme Being is "an
establishment of religion" and therefore unconstitutional.
----------------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.mensnewsdaily.com/archive/p/patton/2004/patton112904.htm
Looking at the rest of the site it seems they don't like gays, feminists, or
the inevitable "libruhs" either. Yet they like women in skimpy bathing
suits.
tim gueguen 101867
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| User: "EjP" |
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| Title: Re: Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
29 Nov 2004 05:15:18 PM |
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tim gueguen wrote:
"Jason Spaceman" <notreally@jspaceman.homelinux.org> wrote in message
news:rkulq05227qfdg3vhmqjckj6gtog858g3t@4ax.com...
From the article:
-----------------------------------------------------
ACLU involvement in a Dover, Pennsylvania, case clearly shows their
desperation. Last month, the school board in this rural south-central
Pennsylvania community became the first in the nation to mandate the
teaching of "intelligent design," which holds that the universe is so
complex that it must have been created by a higher power. The "higher
power" is unspecified, but that does not matter to the zealots at the
ACLU, who endorse ignorance because they believe that any mention or
reference to anything remotely like a Supreme Being is "an
establishment of religion" and therefore unconstitutional.
----------------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.mensnewsdaily.com/archive/p/patton/2004/patton112904.htm
Looking at the rest of the site it seems they don't like gays, feminists, or
the inevitable "libruhs" either. Yet they like women in skimpy bathing
suits.
You make them sound so shallow, but don't forget they also take
on such important topics as how to avoid paying child support.
-E
tim gueguen 101867
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| User: "Victor Purinton" |
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| Title: Re: Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
29 Nov 2004 06:30:48 PM |
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Jason Spaceman <notreally@jspaceman.homelinux.org> wrote in message news:<rkulq05227qfdg3vhmqjckj6gtog858g3t@4ax.com>...
From the article:
-----------------------------------------------------
ACLU involvement in a Dover, Pennsylvania, case clearly shows their
desperation. Last month, the school board in this rural south-central
Pennsylvania community became the first in the nation to mandate the
teaching of ?intelligent design,? which holds that the universe is so
complex that it must have been created by a higher power. The ?higher
power? is unspecified, but that does not matter to the zealots at the
ACLU, who endorse ignorance because they believe that any mention or
reference to anything remotely like a Supreme Being is ?an
establishment of religion? and therefore unconstitutional.
----------------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.mensnewsdaily.com/archive/p/patton/2004/patton112904.htm
J. Spaceman
You know, I feel bad for these religious folks. They're beseiged by
scientific progress, and things are only going to get worse for them.
I'm sure many of them wish scientists would stop being so nosy.
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| User: "Lt. Kizhe Catson" |
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| Title: Re: Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
29 Nov 2004 11:12:28 AM |
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Jason Spaceman <notreally@jspaceman.homelinux.org> wrote in message news:<rkulq05227qfdg3vhmqjckj6gtog858g3t@4ax.com>...
From the article:
-----------------------------------------------------
ACLU involvement in a Dover, Pennsylvania, case clearly shows their
desperation. Last month, the school board in this rural south-central
Pennsylvania community became the first in the nation to mandate the
teaching of ?intelligent design,? which holds that the universe is so
complex that it must have been created by a higher power. The ?higher
power? is unspecified, but that does not matter to the zealots at the
ACLU, who endorse ignorance because they believe that any mention or
reference to anything remotely like a Supreme Being is ?an
establishment of religion? and therefore unconstitutional.
----------------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.mensnewsdaily.com/archive/p/patton/2004/patton112904.htm
You know, it's not often one reads a Creationist rant on a page with
banner ads featuring buxom women, and sponsored by something called
"pokerbabes.com". Every day, life gets a little wierder.....
-- Kizhe
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| User: "EjP" |
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| Title: Re: Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
29 Nov 2004 03:36:26 PM |
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Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------------------
ACLU involvement in a Dover, Pennsylvania, case clearly shows their
desperation. Last month, the school board in this rural south-central
Pennsylvania community became the first in the nation to mandate the
teaching of “intelligent design,” which holds that the universe is so
complex that it must have been created by a higher power. The “higher
power” is unspecified, but that does not matter to the zealots at the
ACLU, who endorse ignorance because they believe that any mention or
reference to anything remotely like a Supreme Being is “an
establishment of religion” and therefore unconstitutional.
----------------------------------------------------
Personally, I've never believed that this should fall under
the heading of separation of Church and State, but rather
under the general policy that stupid things should be kept
out of science classes whenever possible.
-E
Read it at
http://www.mensnewsdaily.com/archive/p/patton/2004/patton112904.htm
J. Spaceman
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| User: "Danny Kodicek" |
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| Title: Re: Commentary: ACLU Endorses Ignorance in Pennsylvania |
30 Nov 2004 08:51:40 AM |
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"EjP" <nospam@hackers.are.bad> wrote in message
news:cog5bd$j53$1@info4.fnal.gov...
Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------------------
ACLU involvement in a Dover, Pennsylvania, case clearly shows their
desperation. Last month, the school board in this rural south-central
Pennsylvania community became the first in the nation to mandate the
teaching of "intelligent design," which holds that the universe is so
complex that it must have been created by a higher power. The "higher
power" is unspecified, but that does not matter to the zealots at the
ACLU, who endorse ignorance because they believe that any mention or
reference to anything remotely like a Supreme Being is "an
establishment of religion" and therefore unconstitutional.
----------------------------------------------------
Personally, I've never believed that this should fall under
the heading of separation of Church and State, but rather
under the general policy that stupid things should be kept
out of science classes whenever possible.
Hear hear. (Should that be 'read read'?). Don't keep creationism out because
it's religious, keep it out because it's bollocks.
Danny
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