"Al Klein" <rukbat@pern.invalid> wrote in message
news:umoui3t5781htu7t28c7alp420oo4f1mbv@4ax.com...

On Sun, 4 Nov 2007 23:23:15 -0500, "rockymt" <rockymt@porchlight.ca>
wrote:

There is a big difference between "over active imaginations" and the
presence of the Living God in the heart of believers

Objective evidence that your "living god" objectively exists? (We're
not interested in your opinion, just objective evidence.)

Why does a god have to be a created material object in order to exist?

Our Christian "God is love" (1 John 4:8,16) become fully manifested in Jesus
Christ giving His life for us sinners on the cross of Calvary. We
therefore know our God and have seen Him. (Jesus in John 14:6-10)
Atheists don't know our God and therefore cannot see Him, (Jesus in
John 3:3)

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

"Al Klein" <rukbat@pern.invalid> wrote in message
news:umoui3t5781htu7t28c7alp420oo4f1mbv@4ax.com...

On Sun, 4 Nov 2007 23:23:15 -0500, "rockymt" <rockymt@porchlight.ca>
wrote:

There is a big difference between "over active imaginations" and the
presence of the Living God in the heart of believers

Objective evidence that your "living god" objectively exists? (We're
not interested in your opinion, just objective evidence.)

Why does a god have to be a created material object in order to exist?
Our Christian "God is love" (1 John 4:8,16) become fully manifested in Jesus
Christ giving His life for us sinners on the cross of Calvary. We
therefore know our God and have seen Him. (Jesus in John 14:6-10)
Atheists don't know our God and therefore cannot see Him, (Jesus in
John 3:3)

Why

"Bill M" <wmech@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:qfnXi.65114$c9.27528@bignews8.bellsouth.net...

There is NO objective verifiable evidence for the existence of ANY gods.
Lots of opinions but NO evidence! God beliefs are no more sound or
realistic than beliefs in Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy



Evidence of gods;



There is NO objective verifiable evidence any gods have ever spoken to any
sane men. There is only the 'subjective opinions' of errant men.



There is NO objective verifiable evidence any gods have ever appeared to
any sane men. There is only the 'subjective opinions' of errant men.



Why does this all powerful god creator never communicate with us? Why does
he never authenticate his very existence?



There is NO objective verifiable evidence that any Heavens, Hells, Gods,
Spirits, Angels or Saints actually exist except in the imaginations of
man.



There is a wealth of objective verifiable material evidence that NO gods
actually exist.



Why does this all powerful creator, all loving and caring intelligent
designer, create Plagues, Tsunamis, Tornadoes, Volcanic Eruptions, Floods,
Wars, Earth Quakes, Cancers and hundreds of debilitating diseases and
serious body malfunctions? There are 12,000 known diseases that affect and
punish mankind indiscriminately. Why does he permit millions of both young
and old to starve to death or die of miserable diseases? Why punish
millions of INNOCENT CHILDREN in this horrible way?


Why does this all powerful and caring god permit totally "innocent
children" to die at birth? Or worse, be born lacking eyesight, a fully
developed brain, deaf and dumb, missing limbs etc.? Why are some born
idiots and others with super intelligence? Why are some born into wealth
and others pauper poor? Why does he permit over 2,000,000 innocent
children to die of starvation every year? Why are his human creations
designed to deteriorate into a miserable and devastating old age
regardless of their religious affiliation?



God supposedly created the world like it is, to punish man for Adam and
Eve's 'original sin'. Why does he also punish supposedly innocent children
and animals with thousands of diseases, birth defects, starvation and to
be eaten by other animals?



Why did this all powerful and loving creator create things like sharks,
jelly fish, octopus, lions, tigers, rhinoceros, wolves, poisonous snakes,
stinging and poisonous insects, poisonous plants etc.? Why did this caring
and benevolent god create animals (including man) that need to painfully
kill and eat other animals to survive?



World War I claimed 9,000,000 lives of people of many religious faiths.

World II indiscriminately claimed over 20,000,000 lives of people of all
ages and religious faiths, plus a vast destruction of property and more
millions maimed for life.

The recent Asian Tsunami has claimed the lives of 200,000 men, women and
children of all religious persuasions. Over 100,000 of these were totally
INNOCENT children!

There were three major epidemics of the Bubonic Plaque - in the 6th, 14th.
and 17th centuries. The death toll was over 137 million men, women and
totally innocent children.

The influenza of 1918-1919 killed at least 25 million men, women and
innocent children indiscriminately.



Diseases like malaria, AIDS, tuberculosis, etc. maim and kill millions
indiscriminately every year. More millions die of starvation and
malnutrition.

These indiscriminately afflicted the young and old, atheists and those of
all religious persuasions.



Meanwhile MAN, not god, has developed defenses and cures for hundreds of
serious diseases. Man has learned to create shelter, heat and cooling,
purify water, world wide electronic communications, power and
transportation systems including flying through the air.

Man has created a wonderful medical and drug system and improved housing
and food production. The result of MAN'S inventiveness has

DOUBLED the average life span. None of this was created by any gods.


Perhaps your loving and caring god is actually a cruel, heartless, mean
and torturing tyrant. If he treats us so cruelly during life, why do you
think he will let us enjoy peace and eternal happiness in his Heaven? And
why does he keep all this a secret by preventing communication with our
dead parents, siblings and friends? (Or this god?)



There are thousands of different religious and god beliefs but NO
OBJECTIVE VERIFIABLE EVIDENCE for the actual existence of ANY of these
gods. ALL god beliefs are based on the unsubstantiated 'opinions and
claims' of errant men.



If there is a god that created the Universe, he is obviously not an
all-caring and benevolent god. Nor is he an "Intelligent Designer". The
objective evidence is if there is a god creator, he has NO concern about
the welfare of the creatures on Earth.



The objective evidence is that no gods created man but quite the opposite;
that man created gods!



I challenge god believers to supply ANY objective verifiable evidence that
their god actually exists except in their over active imaginations.





<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><><><><>.............................

There is a big difference between "over active imaginations" and the
presence of the Living God in the heart of believers



"What He has done for others, He could do for you; it is no secret what God
can do"
Word from Rev. Thomas Dorsey



So many lives have been changed by the power of the Good News, which is the
Resurrection power.
You say, " prove it" or "come up with some hard evidence." DON'T NEED TO
NOR CAN I : revelation and truth are
revealed to the heart. Within my inner man( my spirit man) I know it to be
so. I know that I know that I know. This is that miracle of the re-birth.
Flesh gives birth to flesh (natural birth - understood and explained by
natural science)...spirit gives birth to spirit~~ cannot be understood by
science, therefore it requires no scientific proof or evidence to those who
are born again from above. You must be born again, from above, to believe,
and understand ... you have to become like a little child. So let me
emphasize "become" ( with a child-like trust in; being teachable as a child
is) to begin to understand the mysteries of the Kingdom of Heaven, otherwise
it is foolishness, much like it is to those perishing in their sins.


"You may ask me how I know my God is real;
you may doubt the things I say and doubt the way I feel;
but I know He's real today, He'll always be;
I can feel His hand in mine,
and that is good enough for me."
Words : Mossy Lister


rockymt

There is a big difference between "over active imaginations" and the
presence of the Living God in the heart of believers

"What He has done for others, He could do for you; it is no secret
what God can do"
Word from Rev. Thomas Dorsey

So many lives have been changed by the power of the Good News, which
is the Resurrection power.

You say, " prove it" or "come up with some hard evidence." DON'T NEED
TO NOR CAN I : revelation and truth are
revealed to the heart.

There is NO objective verifiable evidence for the existence of ANY gods.
Lots of opinions but NO evidence! God beliefs are no more sound or realistic
than beliefs in Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy

Evidence of gods;

There is NO objective verifiable evidence any gods have ever spoken to any
sane men. There is only the 'subjective opinions' of errant men.

There is NO objective verifiable evidence any gods have ever appeared to any
sane men. There is only the 'subjective opinions' of errant men.

Why does this all powerful god creator never communicate with us? Why does
he never authenticate his very existence?

There is NO objective verifiable evidence that any Heavens, Hells, Gods,
Spirits, Angels or Saints actually exist except in the imaginations of man.

There is a wealth of objective verifiable material evidence that NO gods
actually exist.

Why does this all powerful creator, all loving and caring intelligent
designer, create Plagues, Tsunamis, Tornadoes, Volcanic Eruptions, Floods,
Wars, Earth Quakes, Cancers and hundreds of debilitating diseases and
serious body malfunctions? There are 12,000 known diseases that affect and
punish mankind indiscriminately. Why does he permit millions of both young
and old to starve to death or die of miserable diseases? Why punish millions
of INNOCENT CHILDREN in this horrible way?

Why does this all powerful and caring god permit totally "innocent children"
to die at birth? Or worse, be born lacking eyesight, a fully developed
brain, deaf and dumb, missing limbs etc.? Why are some born idiots and
others with super intelligence? Why are some born into wealth and others
pauper poor? Why does he permit over 2,000,000 innocent children to die of
starvation every year? Why are his human creations designed to deteriorate
into a miserable and devastating old age regardless of their religious
affiliation?

God supposedly created the world like it is, to punish man for Adam and Eve's
'original sin'. Why does he also punish supposedly innocent children and
animals with thousands of diseases, birth defects, starvation and to be
eaten by other animals?

Why did this all powerful and loving creator create things like sharks,
jelly fish, octopus, lions, tigers, rhinoceros, wolves, poisonous snakes,
stinging and poisonous insects, poisonous plants etc.? Why did this caring
and benevolent god create animals (including man) that need to painfully
kill and eat other animals to survive?

World War I claimed 9,000,000 lives of people of many religious faiths.

World II indiscriminately claimed over 20,000,000 lives of people of all
ages and religious faiths, plus a vast destruction of property and more
millions maimed for life.

The recent Asian Tsunami has claimed the lives of 200,000 men, women and
children of all religious persuasions. Over 100,000 of these were totally
INNOCENT children!

There were three major epidemics of the Bubonic Plaque - in the 6th, 14th.
and 17th centuries. The death toll was over 137 million men, women and
totally innocent children.

The influenza of 1918-1919 killed at least 25 million men, women and
innocent children indiscriminately.

Diseases like malaria, AIDS, tuberculosis, etc. maim and kill millions
indiscriminately every year. More millions die of starvation and
malnutrition.

These indiscriminately afflicted the young and old, atheists and those of
all religious persuasions.

Meanwhile MAN, not god, has developed defenses and cures for hundreds of
serious diseases. Man has learned to create shelter, heat and cooling,
purify water, world wide electronic communications, power and transportation
systems including flying through the air.

Man has created a wonderful medical and drug system and improved housing and
food production. The result of MAN'S inventiveness has

DOUBLED the average life span. None of this was created by any gods.

Perhaps your loving and caring god is actually a cruel, heartless, mean and
torturing tyrant. If he treats us so cruelly during life, why do you think
he will let us enjoy peace and eternal happiness in his Heaven? And why does
he keep all this a secret by preventing communication with our dead parents,
siblings and friends? (Or this god?)

There are thousands of different religious and god beliefs but NO OBJECTIVE
VERIFIABLE EVIDENCE for the actual existence of ANY of these gods. ALL god
beliefs are based on the unsubstantiated 'opinions and claims' of errant
men.

If there is a god that created the Universe, he is obviously not an
all-caring and benevolent god. Nor is he an "Intelligent Designer". The
objective evidence is if there is a god creator, he has NO concern about the
welfare of the creatures on Earth.

The objective evidence is that no gods created man but quite the opposite;
that man created gods!

I challenge god believers to supply ANY objective verifiable evidence that
their god actually exists except in their over active imaginations.