Evidences of God - Intelligence & the Mental Universe



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Topic: Religions > Atheism
User: "Accelerator"
Date: 14 Feb 2004 12:50:57 AM
Object: Evidences of God - Intelligence & the Mental Universe
IN RESPONSE TO:
((I fail to see how the fact that subatomic particles spontaneously
appear and disappear without cause leads to the inevitable development
of life and complex living organisms))
If we define intelligence as.. - the ability to solve problems and
recall information.. – then.. I would say.. that it is because the
particles themselves possess intelligence ( of a very simple kind.. of
course).
I see evidence that the entire universe is living.. and responsive..
the only difference between us and the most primary particles is a
difference of degree.
A very great difference.. to be sure.
Personally.. I don't believe quantum physics describes a totally
random development. Within the framework of my own understanding.. I
would think that particles.. like ourselves can remember & therefore
learn. This learning would lend itself to a gradual emerging
arrangement taking place.. from simple to complex.. and then back to
simple again. Knowledge would never have to be much greater than what
was needed.. it wouldn't surprise me at all to learn that even
particles has a sense of "feeling' with motivates their organization..
and evolutionary developemnet.
((Moreover the fact that subatomic particles spontaneously appear and
disappear without cause seems to me to lend credence to the
possibility of miracles))
If I remember rightly.. Jesus said that the only true miracle was when
the prophet Jonah spoke to the people.. and the people actually
listened.. and changed their behavior.
For Jesus.. the fact that they had ACTUALLY listened.. was a REAL
MIRACLE!
And Buddha.. basically says the same thing.
http://www.apocatastasis.net/Symbolism/DeafMen.html
Nope.. no miracles needed.. the particles borrow energy from a Primary
Field.. the existence of which has not yet been recognized by existing
physics.
Einstein did offer up a Grand Unified field Theory.. but it was
rejected.. out of merely convention.. it would seem.
I think it was probably spot on myself.
A simple idea really.. Einstein just added on an imaginary fifth
dimension along with space/time. We already have evidence of the
existence of an imaginary dimension.. in our head.. we exist there
both in our waking perceptive state.. and in our dreams. Our
mentalness lies at the very foundation of existence.
Presently.. conventional physics is just being blind towards the
obvious.
((If we're going to talk about reality, then there has to be some
method of getting the physical universe we see here and now, apart
from the initial "Big Bang" or whatever the beginning was.))
"The principle of vibration. NOTHING RESTS; EVERYTHING MOVES;
EVERYTHING VIBRATES. This principle explains that the difference
between manifestations of matter, energy, mind and spirit result from
varying rates of vibration."
Hermes Trismegistus
Simple.. the Primary Field with consists of imaginary.. (or potential)
energy.. like everything else.. has a state of momentum.. any change
of that momentum will produce a minute package of force.. in the form
of a particle/ wave. These manifest in the form of photons of borrowed
energy.. which may.. or may not become electrons.. the building blocks
of life.
The presence of photons in the Primary filed cause it to warp.. and
this is what we call "gravity".. a geometric path that offers the
least resistance.. towards which other particles will flow.
As we all know.. it's easier to go down hill than up.. but there is no
invisible "force" pulling us down.. there is just less resistance.
The particle has a problem.. which way does it go.. ? A path of least
resistance (which is the very opposite of force).. guide p[artless
towards one another .thereby creating a greater massive force.. which
in turn modifies the primary field even further… which in turn
modifies the force.. and that evolution in a nutshell.
((> In other words, as far as I am concerned there is an intelligence
at

work.))

Yes.. intelligence begins to emerge right from the very beginning.. I
guess we might call it quantum intelligence.. because it is only
relevant at that level.. it qualifies and shapes the emerging forces.
We can se evidence for it at work in the Theory of Gia.. the planet
itself does have a kind of intelligence.. that's for sure.
We return to the primary state of existence every night when we become
unconscious.
Cut open the brain and we find nothing of ourselves.. we see only the
biological mechanism..
Our thoughts.. our feelings.. memories.. dreams are all invisible
data.. they don't exist.. not in the special dimension.. anyway.
Go out beyond the expanding universe and we find nothing there also.
The enigmatic question now posed.. is.. what is the connection.. ?
-
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"ALL IS MIND.. THE UNIVERSE IS MENTAL..
THIS PRINCIPLE EXPLAINS THE TRUE NATURE OF ENERGY POWER AND MATTER."
Hermes Trismegistus
http://www.apocatastasis.net/God/PrimaryFieldTheory.html
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I saw that the Universe was not composed of dead matter, but is, on
the contrary, was a Living Presence:
I became conscious in myself of Eternal Life.
It was not a conviction that I myself would have Eternal Life, but a
consciousness that I possessed Eternal Life.
Then: I saw that all men are Immortal;
That the Cosmic Order is such that without any preadventure all things
work together for the good of all;
That the Foundation Principle of the World is what we call Love, and
that the happiness of all, is in the long run, absolutely certain."
Richard Bucke
*
.

User: "Mark K. Bilbo"

Title: Re: Evidences of God - Intelligence & the Mental Universe 14 Feb 2004 01:25:14 PM
And so upon Fri, 13 Feb 2004 22:50:57 -0800 didst Accelerator speak
thusly:

"ALL IS MIND.. THE UNIVERSE IS MENTAL..

Or at least you appear to be...
<say hi to the other kooks in the killfile>
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
"There is no system but GNU, and Linux is one of its kernels."
.

User: "Josef Balluch"

Title: Re: Evidences of God - Intelligence & the Mental Universe 14 Feb 2004 08:40:13 AM
In a message sent 'round the world, Accelerator poured fuel on the fire
with the following:
....

If we define intelligence as.. - the ability to solve problems and
recall information.. – then.. I would say.. that it is because the
particles themselves possess intelligence ( of a very simple kind.. of
course).

I see evidence that the entire universe is living.. and responsive..
the only difference between us and the most primary particles is a
difference of degree.

A very great difference.. to be sure.

Personally.. I don't believe quantum physics describes a totally
random development. Within the framework of my own understanding.. I
would think that particles.. like ourselves can remember & therefore
learn. This learning would lend itself to a gradual emerging
arrangement taking place.. from simple to complex.. and then back to
simple again.

Uh huh.
The parts are intelligent, the whole is composed of the parts, so the
whole is intelligent.
Given that a more massive item is generally composed of more "parts", it
will be more intelligent than a less massive item. This means that a
cement truck would be more intelligent than you.
Interestingly enough, I am inclined to agree.
....

Nope.. no miracles needed.. the particles borrow energy from a Primary
Field.. the existence of which has not yet been recognized by existing
physics.

Yup. Science is always SO far behind.
....

Presently.. conventional physics is just being blind towards the
obvious.

Scandalous, isn't it?
....

As we all know.. it's easier to go down hill than up.. but there is no
invisible "force" pulling us down.. there is just less resistance.

The particle has a problem.. which way does it go.. ?

Shouldn't be a problem for an intelligent, problem solving particle.

A path of least
resistance (which is the very opposite of force).. guide p[artless
towards one another .thereby creating a greater massive force.. which
in turn modifies the primary field even further… which in turn
modifies the force.. and that evolution in a nutshell.

Darwin would have been proud!
[ snip ]
Regards,
Josef
A mystic is someone who wants to understand the universe, but is too
lazy to study physics.
.
User: "raven1"

Title: aa AQOTN nomination! 14 Feb 2004 11:01:28 AM
On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 09:40:13 -0500, Josef Balluch
<josef.balluch@sympatico.can> wrote:
A pithy little gem here:

A mystic is someone who wants to understand the universe, but is too
lazy to study physics.

Seconds?
.
User: "Mark K. Bilbo"

Title: Re: aa AQOTN nomination! 14 Feb 2004 01:25:37 PM
And so upon Sat, 14 Feb 2004 17:01:28 +0000 didst raven1 speak thusly:

On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 09:40:13 -0500, Josef Balluch
<josef.balluch@sympatico.can> wrote:

A pithy little gem here:

A mystic is someone who wants to understand the universe, but is too
lazy to study physics.


Seconds?

Second!
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
"There is no system but GNU, and Linux is one of its kernels."
.
User: "*nemo*"

Title: Re: aa AQOTN nomination! 14 Feb 2004 05:06:13 PM
In article <pan.2004.02.14.19.25.37.103168@hoo.com-amikchi>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <y@hoo.com-amikchi> wrote:

And so upon Sat, 14 Feb 2004 17:01:28 +0000 didst raven1 speak thusly:

On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 09:40:13 -0500, Josef Balluch
<josef.balluch@sympatico.can> wrote:

A pithy little gem here:

A mystic is someone who wants to understand the universe, but is too
lazy to study physics.


Seconds?


Second!

Recorded
--
Nemo - EAC Commissioner for Bible Belt Underwater Operations.
Atheist #1331 (the Palindrome of doom!)
BAAWA Knight! - One of those warm Southern Knights, y'all!
Charter member, SMASH!!
http://home.earthlink.net/~jehdjh/Relpg.html
Draco Dormiens Nunquam Titillandus
Quotemeister since March 2002
.

User: "SMChristenson"

Title: Re: aa AQOTN nomination! 14 Feb 2004 03:33:45 PM
On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 13:25:37 -0600, Mark K. Bilbo wrote:

And so upon Sat, 14 Feb 2004 17:01:28 +0000 didst raven1 speak thusly:

On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 09:40:13 -0500, Josef Balluch
<josef.balluch@sympatico.can> wrote:

A pithy little gem here:

A mystic is someone who wants to understand the universe, but is too
lazy to study physics.


Seconds?


Second!

Very nice.
.




User: "W.Syme"

Title: Re: Evidences of God - Intelligence & the Mental Universe 14 Feb 2004 12:43:11 AM
On 13 Feb 2004 22:50:57 -0800,
(Accelerator)
wrote:

IN RESPONSE TO:
((I fail to see how the fact that subatomic particles spontaneously
appear and disappear without cause leads to the inevitable development
of life and complex living organisms))

If we define intelligence as.. - the ability to solve problems and
recall information.. – then.. I would say.. that it is because the
particles themselves possess intelligence ( of a very simple kind.. of
course).

I see evidence that the entire universe is living.. and responsive..
the only difference between us and the most primary particles is a
difference of degree.

A very great difference.. to be sure.

Personally.. I don't believe quantum physics describes a totally
random development. Within the framework of my own understanding.. I
would think that particles.. like ourselves can remember & therefore
learn. This learning would lend itself to a gradual emerging
arrangement taking place.. from simple to complex.. and then back to
simple again. Knowledge would never have to be much greater than what
was needed.. it wouldn't surprise me at all to learn that even
particles has a sense of "feeling' with motivates their organization..
and evolutionary developemnet.

((Moreover the fact that subatomic particles spontaneously appear and
disappear without cause seems to me to lend credence to the
possibility of miracles))

If I remember rightly.. Jesus said that the only true miracle was when
the prophet Jonah spoke to the people.. and the people actually
listened.. and changed their behavior.

For Jesus.. the fact that they had ACTUALLY listened.. was a REAL
MIRACLE!

And Buddha.. basically says the same thing.

http://www.apocatastasis.net/Symbolism/DeafMen.html


Nope.. no miracles needed.. the particles borrow energy from a Primary
Field.. the existence of which has not yet been recognized by existing
physics.

Einstein did offer up a Grand Unified field Theory.. but it was
rejected.. out of merely convention.. it would seem.

I think it was probably spot on myself.

A simple idea really.. Einstein just added on an imaginary fifth
dimension along with space/time. We already have evidence of the
existence of an imaginary dimension.. in our head.. we exist there
both in our waking perceptive state.. and in our dreams. Our
mentalness lies at the very foundation of existence.

Presently.. conventional physics is just being blind towards the
obvious.


((If we're going to talk about reality, then there has to be some
method of getting the physical universe we see here and now, apart
from the initial "Big Bang" or whatever the beginning was.))

"The principle of vibration. NOTHING RESTS; EVERYTHING MOVES;
EVERYTHING VIBRATES. This principle explains that the difference
between manifestations of matter, energy, mind and spirit result from
varying rates of vibration."

Hermes Trismegistus


Simple.. the Primary Field with consists of imaginary.. (or potential)
energy.. like everything else.. has a state of momentum.. any change
of that momentum will produce a minute package of force.. in the form
of a particle/ wave. These manifest in the form of photons of borrowed
energy.. which may.. or may not become electrons.. the building blocks
of life.

The presence of photons in the Primary filed cause it to warp.. and
this is what we call "gravity".. a geometric path that offers the
least resistance.. towards which other particles will flow.

As we all know.. it's easier to go down hill than up.. but there is no
invisible "force" pulling us down.. there is just less resistance.

The particle has a problem.. which way does it go.. ? A path of least
resistance (which is the very opposite of force).. guide p[artless
towards one another .thereby creating a greater massive force.. which
in turn modifies the primary field even further… which in turn
modifies the force.. and that evolution in a nutshell.

((> In other words, as far as I am concerned there is an intelligence
at

work.))


Yes.. intelligence begins to emerge right from the very beginning.. I
guess we might call it quantum intelligence.. because it is only
relevant at that level.. it qualifies and shapes the emerging forces.

We can se evidence for it at work in the Theory of Gia.. the planet
itself does have a kind of intelligence.. that's for sure.

We return to the primary state of existence every night when we become
unconscious.

Cut open the brain and we find nothing of ourselves.. we see only the
biological mechanism..

Our thoughts.. our feelings.. memories.. dreams are all invisible
data.. they don't exist.. not in the special dimension.. anyway.

Go out beyond the expanding universe and we find nothing there also.

The enigmatic question now posed.. is.. what is the connection.. ?
-
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

"ALL IS MIND.. THE UNIVERSE IS MENTAL..

THIS PRINCIPLE EXPLAINS THE TRUE NATURE OF ENERGY POWER AND MATTER."

Hermes Trismegistus

http://www.apocatastasis.net/God/PrimaryFieldTheory.html

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

"I saw that the Universe was not composed of dead matter, but is, on
the contrary, was a Living Presence:

I became conscious in myself of Eternal Life.

It was not a conviction that I myself would have Eternal Life, but a
consciousness that I possessed Eternal Life.

Then: I saw that all men are Immortal;

That the Cosmic Order is such that without any preadventure all things
work together for the good of all;

That the Foundation Principle of the World is what we call Love, and
that the happiness of all, is in the long run, absolutely certain."

Richard Bucke


*

So now mythical creatures are supported by "strong evidence" that's
really only recognised by yourself. Well, I'm convinced.
.

User: "W.Syme"

Title: Re: Evidences of God - Intelligence & the Mental Universe 14 Feb 2004 01:24:40 PM
On 13 Feb 2004 22:50:57 -0800,
(Accelerator)
wrote:

IN RESPONSE TO:
((I fail to see how the fact that subatomic particles spontaneously
appear and disappear without cause leads to the inevitable development
of life and complex living organisms))

Is that all you can throw at us? Hardly impressive. Another case of:
"God exists because...because...because.....I-I-I tell you so!"
.

User: "SMChristenson"

Title: Re: Evidences of God - Intelligence & the Mental Universe 14 Feb 2004 10:46:23 AM
On Fri, 13 Feb 2004 22:50:57 -0800, Accelerator wrote:

((Moreover the fact that subatomic particles spontaneously appear and
disappear without cause seems to me to lend credence to the
possibility of miracles))

I'll respond to this point. Two things:
1. What it shows is that we still don't know what the universe _is_. It
is now thought that the matter and energy we observe is the minority of
the composition of the universe. That's where we get into speculations
about "dark energy", "dark matter", string theory and the like. This is
all going to be very tentative until we can get repeatable experiments
that can solidify some consensus on particular theories. And it would be
nice to get theories on the micro- and macro- levels that support each
other.
2. Well, it would be amusing, but it would still be a "miracle". It
would take trillions of particles spontaneously appearing in the same
place to push a feather so the probability of an effect in the macro
world are astronomical. You think the chances of getting cancer from
nitrates or cosmic rays is low.....
On the latter point, however, I believe futurists have speculated on
whether the Cassini effect could be used for propulsion. Be a heck of a
machine shop to machine an engine to that precision though. :)
.


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