| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"IKnowHimDoYou" |
| Date: |
10 Jun 2004 10:41:48 AM |
| Object: |
Evolution Baloney Detector |
Evolution Baloney Detector
With all this pseudo-science of evolution floating about one needs a good
baloney detector to provide us with the ablitity to separate evolution
baloney from logical reasoning and good investigative procedure. There
are several warnings of evolutionary baloney which, when detected, should
cause the flags to go up. These are(not necessarily in order):
1. Using selective evidence
2. Appeals to authority(so-called experts and highly educated sources)
3. Ad Hominem arguments(this is the tried and true thrust of evolution)
4. Straw man arguments("bait and switch" as with con men)
5. Begging the question
6. Lack of testablity
7. Vague terms and shifting definitions(a favorite)
8. Original sin(to believe what we want to believe-regardless)
9. Trustworthy experts(ex. never go to a physician who worships evolution)
10. Sagan's bluff(browbeating and ridicule)
11. Education or indoctrination?
Test the posts, writings and lectures for each of these baloney producers
and see how many you can find coming out of the evolution camp. This
should not be a very difficult exercise.
.
|
|
| User: "John Baker" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
10 Jun 2004 04:06:40 PM |
|
|
"IKnowHimDoYou" <IKnowHim@leavingsoon.com> wrote in message
news:IKnowHim-1006040841480001@pm6-08.kalama.com...
<cretinist drivel snipped due to utter lack of value>
IDontKnowShit, perhaps it might interest you to know that in true science,
you don't build your case by attacling the opposing position, especially
when you're firing blanks. You build it by presenting convincing, testable
objective evidence for your own position. Got any? Thought not.
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Desdinova" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
10 Jun 2004 05:37:56 PM |
|
|
"IKnowHimDoYou" <IKnowHim@leavingsoon.com> wrote in message
news:IKnowHim-1006040841480001@pm6-08.kalama.com...
Evolution Baloney Detector
With all this pseudo-science of evolution floating about one needs a good
baloney detector to provide us with the ablitity to separate evolution
baloney from logical reasoning and good investigative procedure. There
are several warnings of evolutionary baloney which, when detected, should
cause the flags to go up. These are(not necessarily in order):
1. Using selective evidence
2. Appeals to authority(so-called experts and highly educated sources)
3. Ad Hominem arguments(this is the tried and true thrust of evolution)
4. Straw man arguments("bait and switch" as with con men)
5. Begging the question
6. Lack of testablity
7. Vague terms and shifting definitions(a favorite)
8. Original sin(to believe what we want to believe-regardless)
9. Trustworthy experts(ex. never go to a physician who worships evolution)
10. Sagan's bluff(browbeating and ridicule)
11. Education or indoctrination?
Test the posts, writings and lectures for each of these baloney producers
and see how many you can find coming out of the evolution camp. This
should not be a very difficult exercise.
"Never trust gimmicky gadgets" - Doctor Who.
--
Desdinova
Remove nospam to e-mail
AA #2182 EAC Director of If I Told You I'd Have To Kill You
Theology is never any help;
it is searching in a dark cellar at midnight
for a black cat that isn't there.
-- Robert A. Heinlein
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "bogie" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
10 Jun 2004 12:02:14 PM |
|
|
"IKnowHimDoYou" <IKnowHim@leavingsoon.com> wrote in message
news:IKnowHim-1006040841480001@pm6-08.kalama.com...
Evolution Baloney Detector
With all this pseudo-science of evolution floating about one needs a good
baloney detector to provide us with the ablitity to separate evolution
baloney from logical reasoning and good investigative procedure. There
are several warnings of evolutionary baloney which, when detected, should
cause the flags to go up. These are(not necessarily in order):
1. Using selective evidence
2. Appeals to authority(so-called experts and highly educated sources)
3. Ad Hominem arguments(this is the tried and true thrust of evolution)
4. Straw man arguments("bait and switch" as with con men)
5. Begging the question
6. Lack of testablity
7. Vague terms and shifting definitions(a favorite)
8. Original sin(to believe what we want to believe-regardless)
9. Trustworthy experts(ex. never go to a physician who worships evolution)
10. Sagan's bluff(browbeating and ridicule)
11. Education or indoctrination?
Test the posts, writings and lectures for each of these baloney producers
and see how many you can find coming out of the evolution camp. This
should not be a very difficult exercise.
Do you know who invented the idea of a Baloney Detection kit? Do you know
that it was an atheist?
The probability is that you picked this up from some plagiarizing
creationist drone's website or book, but I'd like to challenge you to
investigate the root origins of it. Pick up "The Demon Haunted World" by
Carl Sagan. When you've finished reading it, check back in and tell us what
you learned.
--
================================================
bogie
"Dance like it hurts. Love like you need money.
Work when people are watching."
~Dogbert
================================================
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Phÿltêr" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
11 Jun 2004 10:17:35 AM |
|
|
(IKnowHimDoYou) astounded us with: news:IKnowHim-
1006040841480001@pm6-08.kalama.com:
Evolution Baloney Detector
After reading all the responses to your post, if you're still here tomorrow,
you are either denser than lead, or have the hide of a blue whale, or both.
You have demonstrated what a complete cockhead you are, and do not recognise
when your "arguments from ignorance" are smashed to pieces.
May you live forever.
--
Phÿltêr
AA#1938
Denizen of Darkness #44 & AFJC Antipodean Attaché
http://afjc.clickhalah.com/forum/index.php
Change "freeway" to "hotmail" to respond
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Llanzlan Klazmon The 15th" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
10 Jun 2004 08:32:10 PM |
|
|
(IKnowHimDoYou) wrote in
news:IKnowHim-1006040841480001@pm6-08.kalama.com:
Religion Baloney Detector
With all this pseudo-science of creationism floating about one needs a
good baloney detector to provide us with the ablitity to separate
creation baloney from logical reasoning and good investigative
procedure. There are several warnings of creationist baloney which,
when detected, should cause the flags to go up. These are(not
necessarily in order):
1. Using selective evidence
Evidence for gods. None.
2. Appeals to authority(so-called experts and highly educated sources)
Like priests, theologians and pastors and experts with degrees from
diploma mills rather than real universities. Ok check.
3. Ad Hominem arguments(this is the tried and true thrust of
religion) 4
The other guys are evil.
.. Straw man arguments("bait and switch" as with con men)
This is really the same as point 2 - so same answer but you could add
tellevangilists.
5. Begging the question
That's what happens when you assert a god exists without supporting
evidence.
6. Lack of testablity
Sounds like christianity.
7. Vague terms and shifting definitions(a favorite)
It's called apologetics as applied to study of the buybull.
8. Original sin(to believe what we want to believe-regardless)
Well you could certainly count this against most of the christian cults.
9. Trustworthy experts(ex. never go to a priest who worships
god)
Yeah it pays to be wary of people with delusions.
10. Fallwell's bluff(browbeating and ridicule)
Ok.
11. Education or indoctrination?
In case of Sunday school the answer is self evident.
Test the posts, writings and lectures for each of these baloney
producers and see how many you can find coming out of the religionist
camp. This should not be a very difficult exercise.
Hey thanks. This is good technique for refuting all the theists bleaters
that stumble into a.a. You deserve some sort of hall of fame award for
this.
Klazmon.
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Kermit" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
10 Jun 2004 10:36:17 PM |
|
|
(IKnowHimDoYou) wrote in message news:<IKnowHim-1006040841480001@pm6-08.kalama.com>...
Evolution Baloney Detector
With all this pseudo-science of evolution floating about one needs a good
baloney detector to provide us with the ablitity to separate evolution
baloney from logical reasoning and good investigative procedure. There
are several warnings of evolutionary baloney which, when detected, should
cause the flags to go up. These are(not necessarily in order):
1. Using selective evidence
You have any?
2. Appeals to authority(so-called experts and highly educated sources)
Using highly educated experts in the debated field is not a logical
fallacy. The fallacy of Appeal to Authority is when one debater refers
to say, Einstein for an opinion on religion. He was an expert on
physics, not religion, and it has been noted that experts in religion
often disagree, so refering to them is of dubious value except in a
narrow field (a rabbi in orthodox Judaism, perhaps, for questions in
that area).
3. Ad Hominem arguments(this is the tried and true thrust of evolution)
It's true. When we hear the same false claims from the same person
twenty time in a week, after they have been answered, then some of us
lose our patience. Alas, we are not perfect.
4. Straw man arguments("bait and switch" as with con men)
You mean like claiming evolution expects cats to give birth to
puppies? Let's avoid that sort of thing, shall we? What *is the
Scientific Theory of Creationisism?
5. Begging the question
Ooohh... Let's avoid that too. Shall I point you to references on some
of the supporting data? But I don't believe you've read the last few
dozen links we've offered you. Or, if you feel ready, we can discuss
radiochemistry, the twin nested hierarchies, the fossil record, tree
rings, the geological strata, vestigial organs, animal behavior,
cultural and physical anthropology, and history.
And you do realize, don't you, that using the bible (the source of the
Genesis story) to prove Creationism is begging the question?
6. Lack of testablity
Fortunately, evolutionary science makes testable predcitions all the
time. Here's a few: some organisms would have vestigial structures.
Animals which have related body structure indicating close relations
would have similar genetic structures, even in unrelated areas (such
as our inability to make vitamin C), tracing the route of HIV
infections would show a "family tree" of virus mutations, with humans
close in the chain showing viruses with the most similar genetic
structure; etc.
7. Vague terms and shifting definitions(a favorite)
What are kinds?
What is irreducible complexity?
What is the Theory of Creationism?
8. Original sin(to believe what we want to believe-regardless)
What evidence would it take to convince you that you are wrong re
Creationism? If you can't imagine any, then you are not making a
scientific assertion.
9. Trustworthy experts(ex. never go to a physician who worships evolution)
I don't know anyone who worships evolution. Do you worship God, or
not?
Do you have a quote from someone indicating that he worships
evolution?
Are you saying that one should go to medical doctors who do not
subscribe to mainstream theories?
10. Sagan's bluff(browbeating and ridicule)
You have a Sagan quote which you could reasonably call browbeating or
ridicule?
If you do, please keep track of the book and chapter when you let us
have it...
11. Education or indoctrination?
I give up! High school, Four years of science getting a BS in a
specific science, then four years or more getting a graduate degree,
then years in the field doing research and writing papers. Gosh. I
know that you wouldn't consider that an education. I wonder what you
would?
Your loathing of education is already well established. I wonder how
many other cultures produce so many people proud of their ignorance?
The Taliban, I think. Any others?
Test the posts, writings and lectures for each of these baloney producers
and see how many you can find coming out of the evolution camp. This
should not be a very difficult exercise.
May I suggest, instead:
http://www.carlsagan.com/revamp/carlsagan/baloney.html
Kermit
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "RetroProphet" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
10 Jun 2004 11:46:09 AM |
|
|
Evolution Baloney Detector
With all this pseudo-science of evolution floating about one needs a good
baloney detector to provide us with the ablitity to separate evolution
baloney from logical reasoning and good investigative procedure. There
are several warnings of evolutionary baloney which, when detected, should
cause the flags to go up. These are(not necessarily in order):
<snip>
11. Education or indoctrination?
With all the "logical reasoning and good investigative procedure"
that has been going on at the MANY centers of Creation Science
learning that have been operating for DECADES now, where's the
breakthrough science?
Valid breakthrough science has powers of persuasion that
cannot be denied. You don't need to say a prayer over it
in order for it to be adopted and built upon further.
Where's the breakthrough science that Creationists have
claimed that they will produce?
Sincere education and inquiry yields breakthrough results.
Indoctrination never does.
Now there's a baloney detector what is a baloney detector.
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "John Popelish" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
10 Jun 2004 11:46:21 AM |
|
|
IKnowHimDoYou wrote:
Evolution Baloney Detector
With all this pseudo-science of evolution floating about one needs a good
baloney detector to provide us with the ablitity to separate evolution
baloney from logical reasoning and good investigative procedure. There
are several warnings of evolutionary baloney which, when detected, should
cause the flags to go up. These are(not necessarily in order):
1. Using selective evidence
2. Appeals to authority(so-called experts and highly educated sources)
3. Ad Hominem arguments(this is the tried and true thrust of evolution)
4. Straw man arguments("bait and switch" as with con men)
5. Begging the question
6. Lack of testablity
7. Vague terms and shifting definitions(a favorite)
8. Original sin(to believe what we want to believe-regardless)
9. Trustworthy experts(ex. never go to a physician who worships evolution)
10. Sagan's bluff(browbeating and ridicule)
11. Education or indoctrination?
Test the posts, writings and lectures for each of these baloney producers
and see how many you can find coming out of the evolution camp. This
should not be a very difficult exercise.
These are all good.
Try applying them to your religious superstitions.
Don't be surprised when your future posts are critiqued by the use of
this list.
--
John Popelish
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "GODS CREATOR!" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
10 Jun 2004 01:54:39 PM |
|
|
IKnowHimDoYou wrote:
Evolution Baloney Detector
With all this pseudo-science of evolution floating about one needs a good
baloney detector to provide us with the ablitity to separate evolution
baloney from logical reasoning and good investigative procedure. There
are several warnings of evolutionary baloney which, when detected, should
cause the flags to go up.
........
....... snipper ....
......
Thus Spake God's Creator; (I don't forgive *****!)
You don't have to defend your *CREATION* thingy.
Every one knows *YOUR* God was ....... *CREATED* !!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
GOD'S CREATOR.... (my only sin!)
Wise men face the unknown, and boldly looks for it's reality!
Others... fall on their hands and knees, and start mumbling...
Today's Religions News:
http://fullcoverage.yahoo.com/Full_Coverage/World/Religion_News/
Today's Religion Industry:
http://www.refdesk.com/factrel.html
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Josef Balluch" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
10 Jun 2004 06:23:31 PM |
|
|
In a message sent 'round the world, IKnowHimDoYou poured fuel on the
fire with the following:
Evolution Baloney Detector
With all this pseudo-science of evolution floating about one needs a good
baloney detector to provide us with the ablitity to separate evolution
baloney from logical reasoning and good investigative procedure.
Simple. All creationist bumph is baloney.
There
are several warnings of evolutionary baloney which, when detected, should
cause the flags to go up. These are(not necessarily in order):
1. Using selective evidence
2. Appeals to authority(so-called experts and highly educated sources)
3. Ad Hominem arguments(this is the tried and true thrust of evolution)
4. Straw man arguments("bait and switch" as with con men)
5. Begging the question
6. Lack of testablity
7. Vague terms and shifting definitions(a favorite)
8. Original sin(to believe what we want to believe-regardless)
9. Trustworthy experts(ex. never go to a physician who worships evolution)
10. Sagan's bluff(browbeating and ridicule)
11. Education or indoctrination?
Now you've done it. There isn't an irony meter left in the galaxy.
....
Regards,
Josef
Every man is a damn fool for at least five minutes every day. Wisdom
consists in not exceeding the limit.
-- Elbert Hubbard
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Alberich" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
10 Jun 2004 12:15:46 PM |
|
|
On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 08:41:48 -0700,
(IKnowHimDoYou) wrote:
Evolution Baloney Detector
With all this pseudo-science of evolution floating about one needs a good
baloney detector to provide us with the ablitity to separate evolution
baloney from logical reasoning and good investigative procedure. There
are several warnings of evolutionary baloney which, when detected, should
cause the flags to go up. These are(not necessarily in order):
1. Using selective evidence
2. Appeals to authority(so-called experts and highly educated sources)
3. Ad Hominem arguments(this is the tried and true thrust of evolution)
4. Straw man arguments("bait and switch" as with con men)
5. Begging the question
6. Lack of testablity
7. Vague terms and shifting definitions(a favorite)
8. Original sin(to believe what we want to believe-regardless)
9. Trustworthy experts(ex. never go to a physician who worships evolution)
10. Sagan's bluff(browbeating and ridicule)
11. Education or indoctrination?
Test the posts, writings and lectures for each of these baloney producers
and see how many you can find coming out of the evolution camp. This
should not be a very difficult exercise.
Creationism Baloney Detector
1. Lack of any evidence whatsoever.
2. No scientifically recognized authority.
3. Ad hominem arguments
4. Straw man arguments (a la, "I haven't seen a mosquito turn into a
man, so it ain't true.")
5. Begging the question ("God created the world and all the "kinds" in
it. I know this because the Bible tells me so. And I believe the
Bible because I believe in God.")
6. Complete lack of testability (as opposed to evolution, which is
easily tested.)
7. Vague terms ("kinds") and undefined terms (exactly what is the
difference between "microevolution" and "macroevolution" in a
creationist's eyes? Good luck getting an answer!)
8. Trickster God Theory: God is allpowerful, and chooses to spend his
time planting false fossils and creating apparent phylogenies that
aren't real...for what reason???
9. No experts by any reasonably scientifically literate standard.
10. Hitler's Bluff ("We who believe are superior to those who aren't,
and all that matters is that we know it.")
11. No question of education/Too severe indoctrination.
Alberich
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "LP" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
10 Jun 2004 11:32:12 AM |
|
|
On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 08:41:48 -0700,
(IKnowHimDoYou) wrote:
Evolution Baloney Detector
With all this pseudo-science of evolution floating about one needs a good
baloney detector to provide us with the ablitity to separate evolution
baloney from logical reasoning and good investigative procedure. There
are several warnings of evolutionary baloney which, when detected, should
cause the flags to go up. These are(not necessarily in order):
1. Using selective evidence
2. Appeals to authority(so-called experts and highly educated sources)
3. Ad Hominem arguments(this is the tried and true thrust of evolution)
4. Straw man arguments("bait and switch" as with con men)
5. Begging the question
6. Lack of testablity
7. Vague terms and shifting definitions(a favorite)
8. Original sin(to believe what we want to believe-regardless)
9. Trustworthy experts(ex. never go to a physician who worships evolution)
10. Sagan's bluff(browbeating and ridicule)
11. Education or indoctrination?
Test the posts, writings and lectures for each of these baloney producers
and see how many you can find coming out of the evolution camp. This
should not be a very difficult exercise.
Well I tried it. but the needle snapped immediately in the direction
of creationist literature
.
|
|
|
| User: "John Baker" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
10 Jun 2004 03:58:36 PM |
|
|
"LP" <whirl_pool@nospam.hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:ot2hc01l5l2vaku0cs6ce0nog1i2velltu@4ax.com...
On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 08:41:48 -0700,
(IKnowHimDoYou) wrote:
Evolution Baloney Detector
With all this pseudo-science of evolution floating about one needs a good
baloney detector to provide us with the ablitity to separate evolution
baloney from logical reasoning and good investigative procedure. There
are several warnings of evolutionary baloney which, when detected, should
cause the flags to go up. These are(not necessarily in order):
1. Using selective evidence
2. Appeals to authority(so-called experts and highly educated sources)
3. Ad Hominem arguments(this is the tried and true thrust of evolution)
4. Straw man arguments("bait and switch" as with con men)
5. Begging the question
6. Lack of testablity
7. Vague terms and shifting definitions(a favorite)
8. Original sin(to believe what we want to believe-regardless)
9. Trustworthy experts(ex. never go to a physician who worships
evolution)
10. Sagan's bluff(browbeating and ridicule)
11. Education or indoctrination?
Test the posts, writings and lectures for each of these baloney producers
and see how many you can find coming out of the evolution camp. This
should not be a very difficult exercise.
Well I tried it. but the needle snapped immediately in the direction
of creationist literature
Yep. Hit the peg so hard it bent.
.
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "MarkA" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
10 Jun 2004 12:19:02 PM |
|
|
On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 08:41:48 -0700, IKnowHimDoYou wrote:
Evolution Baloney Detector
With all this pseudo-science of evolution floating about one needs a
good baloney detector to provide us with the ablitity to separate
evolution baloney from logical reasoning and good investigative
procedure. There are several warnings of evolutionary baloney which,
when detected, should cause the flags to go up. These are(not
necessarily in order):
1. Using selective evidence
2. Appeals to authority(so-called experts and highly educated sources)
3. Ad Hominem arguments(this is the tried and true thrust of evolution)
4. Straw man arguments("bait and switch" as with con men) 5. Begging the
question
6. Lack of testablity
7. Vague terms and shifting definitions(a favorite) 8. Original sin(to
believe what we want to believe-regardless) 9. Trustworthy experts(ex.
never go to a physician who worships evolution) 10. Sagan's
bluff(browbeating and ridicule) 11. Education or indoctrination?
Test the posts, writings and lectures for each of these baloney
producers and see how many you can find coming out of the evolution
camp. This should not be a very difficult exercise.
Yes, scientists are very concerned with the reliability and integrity of
their work. That is why every scientific theory is scrutinized by peers
who have no emotional investment in the outcome.
FYI, the theory of evolution was subjected to such scrutiny over 100
fucking years ago, and passed, which is why scientists since then find
creationists so tedious: their objections are not based on science, but on
religion. Their methods are not directed toward finding the truth, but
toward winning a fight. They don't want school children to learn science,
but to flounder in ignorance.
In 400 years, scientists have improved the condition of humankind far more
than religion could in 4,000 years.
--
MarkA
(still caught in the maze of twisty little passages, all different)
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Vic Sagerquist" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
10 Jun 2004 07:48:06 PM |
|
|
One day in alt.atheism, Also Sprach IKnowHimDoYou:
I feel so sorry for people like IDontKnowShit, having to actually deny the
obvious to support their fantasies. What could be worse? Being born
without a *****?
--
Vic Sagerquist
aa#2011
Supervisor, EAC Department of little adhesive-backed "L" shaped
chrome-plastic doo-dads to add feet to Jesus fish department
______________
It's my funeral and I'll fry if I want to...
.
|
|
|
| User: "John Baker" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
11 Jun 2004 12:54:02 AM |
|
|
"Vic Sagerquist" <address@withheld.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9504B546CA833vicman@204.127.204.17...
One day in alt.atheism, Also Sprach IKnowHimDoYou:
I feel so sorry for people like IDontKnowShit, having to actually deny the
obvious to support their fantasies. What could be worse? Being born
without a *****?
Half the population are born without dicks and do just fine. The problem
with creationists is they're born without brains.
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "John Popelish" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
10 Jun 2004 08:12:44 PM |
|
|
Vic Sagerquist wrote:
One day in alt.atheism, Also Sprach IKnowHimDoYou:
I feel so sorry for people like IDontKnowShit, having to actually deny the
obvious to support their fantasies. What could be worse? Being born
without a *****?
Try again.
That cannot be so hard, considering half of those born
do not carry that burden but seem to be doing just fine.
--
John Popelish
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Pangur Ban" |
|
| Title: Re: Evolution Baloney Detector |
11 Jun 2004 06:17:06 AM |
|
|
Vic Sagerquist wrote:
One day in alt.atheism, Also Sprach IKnowHimDoYou:
I feel so sorry for people like IDontKnowShit, having to actually deny the
obvious to support their fantasies. What could be worse? Being born
without a *****?
What a misogynistic question!
Pangur
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Related Articles |
|
|
