| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"words of truth" |
| Date: |
07 Sep 2005 08:39:45 AM |
| Object: |
Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes
by Steve Sailer
UPI, April 22, 2003
The old saying "There are no atheists in foxholes" turns out to be
virtually correct, at least for the U.S. armed forces. About 0.1
percent of all American military personnel officially declare
themselves to be atheists.
That doesn't mean, however, that all service members belong to a
particular religious denomination. About 27 percent do not volunteer to
have a specific religious preference inscribed on their dog tags.
Congress prohibited the U.S. Census Bureau from inquiring about the
religious affiliations of the general populace, which means there are
no official statistics on the size of the various American faiths. The
military, however, does ask about religion since it employs nearly
3,000 chaplains to meet soldiers' religious needs. For example, a
Marine with a "C" stamped on his dog tag knows that if he is mortally
wounded in battle, the corps will attempt to find a Roman Catholic
chaplain to give him the last rites.
Overall, 44 percent of Americans in the volunteer military call
themselves Protestants and 24 percent say they are Catholics, according
to the Defense Manpower Data Center. The other major world religions
are not heavily represented: Muslims and Jews make up 0.3 percent each,
Buddhists 0.2 percent and Hindus 0.1 percent. The "other" category
numbered 5 percent.
The religious makeup of the armed forces is similar to that of the
general population. A 2000 Gallup Poll found that 56 percent of all
Americans consider themselves Protestant, 27 percent Catholic, 2
percent Jewish, 1 percent Orthodox, 1 percent Mormon, and 5 percent
"other." An additional 8 percent gave their religion as "none." That
doesn't mean, though, that 92 percent of the public is active in an
organized religion. About one of every three Americans said they did
not belong to a church or synagogue.
These Gallup figures tend to be higher for each religion than the
military's numbers because 8 percent of the public stated their
religion was "none," while 27 percent of the armed forces offered "no
preference." This does not necessarily mean, however, that men and
women in the services are more irreligious than the norm. There are
differences between telling a pollster you have no religion and telling
the military that you do not wish to specify a religion.
Among those who do state a religion, Protestants and Catholics both
appear to be about as well-represented in the military as in the
general population.
At 0.3 percent, Jews make up less of the services than they do of the
general population, where estimates of the proportion of Jews center
around 2 percent.
There are several reasons for this. For example, American Jews tend to
be older than the national average with a median age of 41, according
to the 2000 National Jewish Population Survey, compared to 35 for
Americans as a whole. So, fewer Jews are of military age.
Further, this study found that about half of all Jews have bachelor's
degrees, vs. 28 percent overall. While 95 percent of military officers
have college degrees, only about 3 percent of enlistees do, and 85
percent of them have never been to college. Therefore, the percentage
of Jews in the working class from which most enlistees are recruited is
well below the national average.
Muslims, who make up about 1 percent of the population, according to a
Center for Immigration Studies report by Daniel Pipes and Khalid
Dur=E1n, are somewhat more represented in the military on a per capita
basis than Jews, but are less represented than Christians.
Steve Sailer (www.iSteve.com) is a columnist for VDARE.com and the film
critic for The American Conservative.
=20
http://www.isteve.com/2003_Few_Atheists_In_U.S._Foxholes.htm
.
|
|
| User: "Elf M. Sternberg" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
07 Sep 2005 10:42:59 AM |
|
|
"words of truth" <wordsoftruth21@lycos.com> writes:
The old saying "There are no atheists in foxholes" turns out to be
virtually correct, at least for the U.S. armed forces.
On the contrary, there are no theists in foxholes. Foxholes are
populated by 100% atheists. The theists are standing up and getting
shot, sure that God will "do the right thing" with respect to guns,
grenades, and poison gas. Everyone who ever jumped into a foxhole,
regardless of what religion they claimed to subscribe to, is someone
who, for just that brief moment, did not believe in God; they did not
believe that the bullets would not hit them or that heaven existed to
receive them if one should.
Elf
--
Elf M. Sternberg, Immanentizing the Eschaton since 1988
http://www.drizzle.com/~elf/
"The apocalypse may be closer at hand than even John Derbyshire thinks:
what the hell is Elf Sternberg doing reading Derb's columns?"
-- Charles Murtaugh
.
|
|
|
| User: "Douglas Berry" |
|
| Title: AQOTM Nomination: (was: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes) |
07 Sep 2005 10:18:55 PM |
|
|
On 07 Sep 2005 08:42:59 -0700, "Elf M. Sternberg" <elf@drizzle.com>
drained his beer, leaned back in the alt.atheism beanbag and drunkenly
proclaimed the following
"words of truth" <wordsoftruth21@lycos.com> writes:
The old saying "There are no atheists in foxholes" turns out to be
virtually correct, at least for the U.S. armed forces.
On the contrary, there are no theists in foxholes. Foxholes are
populated by 100% atheists. The theists are standing up and getting
shot, sure that God will "do the right thing" with respect to guns,
grenades, and poison gas. Everyone who ever jumped into a foxhole,
regardless of what religion they claimed to subscribe to, is someone
who, for just that brief moment, did not believe in God; they did not
believe that the bullets would not hit them or that heaven existed to
receive them if one should.
Very, very true.
Seconds?
--
Douglas E. Berry Do the OBVIOUS thing to send e-mail
Atheist #2147, Atheist Vet #5
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as
when they do it from religious conviction."
Blaise Pascal (1623-1662), Pense'es, #894.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Elf M. Sternberg" |
|
| Title: Re: AQOTM Nomination: (was: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes) |
07 Sep 2005 11:18:04 PM |
|
|
Douglas Berry <penguin_boy@mindOBVIOUSspring.com> writes:
On the contrary, there are no theists in foxholes. Foxholes are
populated by 100% atheists. The theists are standing up and getting
shot, sure that God will "do the right thing" with respect to guns,
grenades, and poison gas. Everyone who ever jumped into a foxhole,
regardless of what religion they claimed to subscribe to, is someone
who, for just that brief moment, did not believe in God; they did not
believe that the bullets would not hit them or that heaven existed to
receive them if one should.
Very, very true.
Seconds?
I think some people have seen that rant before... :-)
Elf
--
Elf M. Sternberg, Immanentizing the Eschaton since 1988
http://www.halcyon.com/elf/
"You know how some people treat their body like a temple?
I treat mine like issa amusement park!" - Kei
.
|
|
|
| User: "Gregory Gadow" |
|
| Title: Re: AQOTM Nomination: (was: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes) |
08 Sep 2005 08:13:02 AM |
|
|
"Elf M. Sternberg" wrote:
Douglas Berry <penguin_boy@mindOBVIOUSspring.com> writes:
On the contrary, there are no theists in foxholes. Foxholes are
populated by 100% atheists. The theists are standing up and getting
shot, sure that God will "do the right thing" with respect to guns,
grenades, and poison gas. Everyone who ever jumped into a foxhole,
regardless of what religion they claimed to subscribe to, is someone
who, for just that brief moment, did not believe in God; they did not
believe that the bullets would not hit them or that heaven existed to
receive them if one should.
Very, very true.
Seconds?
I think some people have seen that rant before... :-)
And that makes you ineligible for AQOTM how?
--
Gregory Gadow
techbear@serv.net
http://www.serv.net/~techbear
"Without faith we might relapse into scientific or rational thinking,
which leads by a slippery slope toward constitutional democracy."
- Robert Anton Wilson
.
|
|
|
| User: "Elf M. Sternberg" |
|
| Title: Re: AQOTM Nomination: (was: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes) |
08 Sep 2005 09:05:38 AM |
|
|
Gregory Gadow <techbear@serv.net> writes:
"Elf M. Sternberg" wrote:
Douglas Berry <penguin_boy@mindOBVIOUSspring.com> writes:
On the contrary, there are no theists in foxholes. Foxholes are
populated by 100% atheists. The theists are standing up and getting
shot, sure that God will "do the right thing" with respect to guns,
grenades, and poison gas. Everyone who ever jumped into a foxhole,
regardless of what religion they claimed to subscribe to, is someone
who, for just that brief moment, did not believe in God; they did not
believe that the bullets would not hit them or that heaven existed to
receive them if one should.
Very, very true.
Seconds?
I think some people have seen that rant before... :-)
And that makes you ineligible for AQOTM how?
It's just that this particular paragraph, with very little
editing, was up for an AQOTM back in September of 2001. I lost that
time; I think it should stay that way.
--
Elf M. Sternberg, Immanentizing the Eschaton since 1988
http://www.halcyon.com/elf/
"You know how some people treat their body like a temple?
I treat mine like issa amusement park!" - Kei
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Uncle Vic" |
|
| Title: Re: AQOTM Nomination: (was: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes) |
07 Sep 2005 10:48:01 PM |
|
|
Once upon a time in alt.atheism, dear sweet Douglas Berry
(penguin_boy@mindOBVIOUSspring.com) made the light shine upon us with
this:
On 07 Sep 2005 08:42:59 -0700, "Elf M. Sternberg" <elf@drizzle.com>
drained his beer, leaned back in the alt.atheism beanbag and drunkenly
proclaimed the following
"words of truth" <wordsoftruth21@lycos.com> writes:
The old saying "There are no atheists in foxholes" turns out to be
virtually correct, at least for the U.S. armed forces.
On the contrary, there are no theists in foxholes. Foxholes
are
populated by 100% atheists. The theists are standing up and getting
shot, sure that God will "do the right thing" with respect to guns,
grenades, and poison gas. Everyone who ever jumped into a foxhole,
regardless of what religion they claimed to subscribe to, is someone
who, for just that brief moment, did not believe in God; they did not
believe that the bullets would not hit them or that heaven existed to
receive them if one should.
Very, very true.
Seconds?
Seconded.
--
Uncle Vic
aa#2011
Supervisor, EAC Department of little adhesive-backed "L" shaped
chrome-plastic doo-dads to add feet to Jesus fish department
http://home.comcast.net/~vickman/
Plonked by Raytard
.
|
|
|
| User: "*nemo*" |
|
| Title: Re: AQOTM Nomination: (was: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes) |
12 Sep 2005 08:05:09 PM |
|
|
In article <Xns96CAD3AC9BA8Fvicman@216.196.97.136>,
Uncle Vic <address@withheld.com> wrote:
Once upon a time in alt.atheism, dear sweet Douglas Berry
(penguin_boy@mindOBVIOUSspring.com) made the light shine upon us with
this:
On 07 Sep 2005 08:42:59 -0700, "Elf M. Sternberg" <elf@drizzle.com>
drained his beer, leaned back in the alt.atheism beanbag and drunkenly
proclaimed the following
"words of truth" <wordsoftruth21@lycos.com> writes:
The old saying "There are no atheists in foxholes" turns out to be
virtually correct, at least for the U.S. armed forces.
On the contrary, there are no theists in foxholes. Foxholes
are
populated by 100% atheists. The theists are standing up and getting
shot, sure that God will "do the right thing" with respect to guns,
grenades, and poison gas. Everyone who ever jumped into a foxhole,
regardless of what religion they claimed to subscribe to, is someone
who, for just that brief moment, did not believe in God; they did not
believe that the bullets would not hit them or that heaven existed to
receive them if one should.
Very, very true.
Seconds?
Seconded.
Recorded.
--
Nemo - EAC Commissioner for Bible Belt Underwater Operations.
Atheist #1331 (the Palindrome of doom!)
BAAWA Knight! - One of those warm Southern Knights, y'all!
Charter member, SMASH!!
http://home.earthlink.net/~jehdjh/Relpg.html
Draco Dormiens Nunquam Titillandus
Quotemeister since March 2002
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Uncle Vic" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
07 Sep 2005 03:07:17 PM |
|
|
on 07 Sep 2005 in alt.atheism, dear sweet Elf M. Sternberg
(elf@drizzle.com) made the light shine upon us with this:
"words of truth" <wordsoftruth21@lycos.com> writes:
The old saying "There are no atheists in foxholes" turns out to be
virtually correct, at least for the U.S. armed forces.
On the contrary, there are no theists in foxholes. Foxholes are
populated by 100% atheists. The theists are standing up and getting
shot, sure that God will "do the right thing" with respect to guns,
grenades, and poison gas. Everyone who ever jumped into a foxhole,
regardless of what religion they claimed to subscribe to, is someone
who, for just that brief moment, did not believe in God; they did not
believe that the bullets would not hit them or that heaven existed to
receive them if one should.
Bravo...
--
Uncle Vic
aa#2011
Supervisor, EAC Department of little adhesive-backed "L" shaped
chrome-plastic doo-dads to add feet to Jesus fish department
http://home.comcast.net/~vickman/
Plonked by Raytard
.
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Hotel Charlie One" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
08 Sep 2005 08:36:48 AM |
|
|
That doesn't mean, however, that all service members belong to a
particular religious denomination. About 27 percent do not
volunteer to have a specific religious preference inscribed on
their dog tags.
No kidding! When I went in the 70's I was handed a list of "official"
religions and told to state my religion. Atheism was not on the list.
Thus, I was officially declared to have not stated a preference.
--
Power corrupts
Absoulte power corrupts absolutely
All Gods claim absolute power
Draw your own conclusions
.
|
|
|
| User: "Robibnikoff" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
08 Sep 2005 10:23:40 AM |
|
|
"Hotel Charlie One" <Hotel_Charlie_One@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:Xns96CB4338B6C1Dcipciphc1@199.45.49.11...
That doesn't mean, however, that all service members belong to a
particular religious denomination. About 27 percent do not
volunteer to have a specific religious preference inscribed on
their dog tags.
No kidding! When I went in the 70's I was handed a list of "official"
religions and told to state my religion. Atheism was not on the list.
Thus, I was officially declared to have not stated a preference.
I remember when I went to get my tubes tied, as a joke I wrote down "Wicca"
as my religion. The nurse changed it to N/A!
--
------
Robyn
Resident Witchypoo
#1557
Science doesn't burn people at the stake for disagreeing - Vic Sagerquist
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Omega" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
12 Sep 2005 10:35:11 PM |
|
|
On Thu, 08 Sep 2005 13:36:48 GMT, Hotel Charlie One
<Hotel_Charlie_One@yahoo.com> wrote:
|> That doesn't mean, however, that all service members belong to a
|> particular religious denomination. About 27 percent do not
|> volunteer to have a specific religious preference inscribed on
|> their dog tags.
|
|No kidding! When I went in the 70's I was handed a list of "official"
|religions and told to state my religion. Atheism was not on the list.
|Thus, I was officially declared to have not stated a preference.
Had a friend who just wanted "Christian" with no denomination.
---
"If ye love wealth better than liberty ... servitude better than ... freedom,
go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsel or your arms ... May your
chains set lightly upon you. May posterity forget that ye were our countrymen."
- Samuel Adams
.
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Herb Martin" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
07 Sep 2005 06:21:37 PM |
|
|
And more people seem to read -- and even believe -- the
horoscope page than the front page.
Of course with many newspapers there may be more truth
by accident on the horoscope page.
--
Herb Martin
.
|
|
|
| User: "dapra" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
07 Sep 2005 06:33:36 PM |
|
|
Herb Martin wrote:
And more people seem to read -- and even believe -- the
horoscope page than the front page.
Of course with many newspapers there may be more truth
by accident on the horoscope page.
One just has to pick the right paper at the right time and you can get
the horoscope, you want.
The front pages are more difficult. Some times they do tell the truth.
But when?
.
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Josef Balluch" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
07 Sep 2005 06:09:48 PM |
|
|
In a message sent 'round the world, words of truth poured fuel on the
fire with the following:
Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes
Does it matter?
by Steve Sailer
UPI, April 22, 2003
As stated in the article:
The religious makeup of the armed forces is similar to that of the
general population.
Thus there is no indication that atheists in the American military are
prone to conversion.
....
Regards,
Josef
The deeper the experience of an absence of meaning - in other words,
of absurdity - the more energetically meaning is sought.
-- Václav Havel
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Douglas Berry" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
07 Sep 2005 10:21:39 PM |
|
|
On 7 Sep 2005 06:39:45 -0700, "words of truth"
<wordsoftruth21@lycos.com> drained his beer, leaned back in the
alt.atheism beanbag and drunkenly proclaimed the following
That doesn't mean, however, that all service members belong to a
particular religious denomination. About 27 percent do not volunteer to
have a specific religious preference inscribed on their dog tags.
What you fail to point out is that getting "atheist" listed as your
religious preference is a ***** and a half. It took me three years of
standing on desks.
The default for anyone who does not consider themselves a member of a
religion is NO REL PREF.
--
Douglas E. Berry Do the OBVIOUS thing to send e-mail
Atheist #2147, Atheist Vet #5
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as
when they do it from religious conviction."
Blaise Pascal (1623-1662), Pense'es, #894.
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "thomas p" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
07 Sep 2005 12:28:46 PM |
|
|
On 7 Sep 2005 06:39:45 -0700, "words of truth"
<wordsoftruth21@lycos.com> wrote:
Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes
And?
snip
Thomas P.
"Life must be lived forwards but understood backwards"
(Kierkegaard)
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Johnny Bravo" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
07 Sep 2005 11:17:25 PM |
|
|
On 7 Sep 2005 06:39:45 -0700, "words of truth"
<wordsoftruth21@lycos.com> wrote:
The old saying "There are no atheists in foxholes" turns out to be
virtually correct, at least for the U.S. armed forces. About 0.1
percent of all American military personnel officially declare
themselves to be atheists.
Having been through it myself I know why. They wouldn't let me put
Atheist on my dogtags in 1989. Despite my telling the guy filling out
the dogtag form that I was an Atheist I got a Protestant dogtag. My
complaint about the mistake went unanswered and frankly I had much
better things to do with my time (like tech school) than worry about
what the statistics looked like or what they would say over my bloody
corpse should I be killed on active duty since I would be in no
condition to care.
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Omega" |
|
| Title: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
12 Sep 2005 10:24:15 PM |
|
|
On 7 Sep 2005 06:39:45 -0700, "words of truth" <wordsoftruth21@lycos.com> wrote:
Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes
by Steve Sailer
UPI, April 22, 2003
The old saying "There are no atheists in foxholes" turns out to be
virtually correct, at least for the U.S. armed forces. About 0.1
percent of all American military personnel officially declare
themselves to be atheists.
That doesn't mean, however, that all service members belong to a
particular religious denomination. About 27 percent do not volunteer to
have a specific religious preference inscribed on their dog tags.
Congress prohibited the U.S. Census Bureau from inquiring about the
religious affiliations of the general populace, which means there are
no official statistics on the size of the various American faiths. The
military, however, does ask about religion since it employs nearly
3,000 chaplains to meet soldiers' religious needs. For example, a
Marine with a "C" stamped on his dog tag knows that if he is mortally
wounded in battle, the corps will attempt to find a Roman Catholic
chaplain to give him the last rites.
Overall, 44 percent of Americans in the volunteer military call
themselves Protestants and 24 percent say they are Catholics, according
to the Defense Manpower Data Center. The other major world religions
are not heavily represented: Muslims and Jews make up 0.3 percent each,
Buddhists 0.2 percent and Hindus 0.1 percent. The "other" category
numbered 5 percent.
The religious makeup of the armed forces is similar to that of the
general population. A 2000 Gallup Poll found that 56 percent of all
Americans consider themselves Protestant, 27 percent Catholic, 2
percent Jewish, 1 percent Orthodox, 1 percent Mormon, and 5 percent
"other." An additional 8 percent gave their religion as "none." That
doesn't mean, though, that 92 percent of the public is active in an
organized religion. About one of every three Americans said they did
not belong to a church or synagogue.
These Gallup figures tend to be higher for each religion than the
military's numbers because 8 percent of the public stated their
religion was "none," while 27 percent of the armed forces offered "no
preference." This does not necessarily mean, however, that men and
women in the services are more irreligious than the norm. There are
differences between telling a pollster you have no religion and telling
the military that you do not wish to specify a religion.
Among those who do state a religion, Protestants and Catholics both
appear to be about as well-represented in the military as in the
general population.
At 0.3 percent, Jews make up less of the services than they do of the
general population, where estimates of the proportion of Jews center
around 2 percent.
There are several reasons for this. For example, American Jews tend to
be older than the national average with a median age of 41, according
to the 2000 National Jewish Population Survey, compared to 35 for
Americans as a whole. So, fewer Jews are of military age.
Further, this study found that about half of all Jews have bachelor's
degrees, vs. 28 percent overall. While 95 percent of military officers
have college degrees, only about 3 percent of enlistees do, and 85
percent of them have never been to college. Therefore, the percentage
of Jews in the working class from which most enlistees are recruited is
well below the national average.
Muslims, who make up about 1 percent of the population, according to a
Center for Immigration Studies report by Daniel Pipes and Khalid
Durán, are somewhat more represented in the military on a per capita
basis than Jews, but are less represented than Christians.
Steve Sailer (www.iSteve.com) is a columnist for VDARE.com and the film
critic for The American Conservative.
http://www.isteve.com/2003_Few_Atheists_In_U.S._Foxholes.htm
----------------------------------------
I have pointed this same factoid out a few times. Everyone seems to want to not
believe that the military is far more conservative on social issues than the
general public. And far more religious. Does not mean that they are
Christians, let alone evangelicals, but just religious. Had a new LT who was
Hindu. Damned good officer.
---
"If ye love wealth better than liberty ... servitude better than ... freedom,
go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsel or your arms ... May your
chains set lightly upon you. May posterity forget that ye were our countrymen."
- Samuel Adams
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Therion Ware" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
07 Sep 2005 08:58:12 AM |
|
|
On the auspictious date of 7 Sep 2005 06:39:45 -0700, words of truth
said unto the multitude in message-id
<1126100385.557543.97650@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>:
Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes
I'd be interested to see these stats organised by rank.
by Steve Sailer
UPI, April 22, 2003
The old saying "There are no atheists in foxholes" turns out to be
virtually correct, at least for the U.S. armed forces. About 0.1
percent of all American military personnel officially declare
themselves to be atheists.
That doesn't mean, however, that all service members belong to a
particular religious denomination. About 27 percent do not volunteer to
have a specific religious preference inscribed on their dog tags.
Congress prohibited the U.S. Census Bureau from inquiring about the
religious affiliations of the general populace, which means there are
no official statistics on the size of the various American faiths. The
military, however, does ask about religion since it employs nearly
3,000 chaplains to meet soldiers' religious needs. For example, a
Marine with a "C" stamped on his dog tag knows that if he is mortally
wounded in battle, the corps will attempt to find a Roman Catholic
chaplain to give him the last rites.
Overall, 44 percent of Americans in the volunteer military call
themselves Protestants and 24 percent say they are Catholics, according
to the Defense Manpower Data Center. The other major world religions
are not heavily represented: Muslims and Jews make up 0.3 percent each,
Buddhists 0.2 percent and Hindus 0.1 percent. The "other" category
numbered 5 percent.
The religious makeup of the armed forces is similar to that of the
general population. A 2000 Gallup Poll found that 56 percent of all
Americans consider themselves Protestant, 27 percent Catholic, 2
percent Jewish, 1 percent Orthodox, 1 percent Mormon, and 5 percent
"other." An additional 8 percent gave their religion as "none." That
doesn't mean, though, that 92 percent of the public is active in an
organized religion. About one of every three Americans said they did
not belong to a church or synagogue.
These Gallup figures tend to be higher for each religion than the
military's numbers because 8 percent of the public stated their
religion was "none," while 27 percent of the armed forces offered "no
preference." This does not necessarily mean, however, that men and
women in the services are more irreligious than the norm. There are
differences between telling a pollster you have no religion and telling
the military that you do not wish to specify a religion.
Among those who do state a religion, Protestants and Catholics both
appear to be about as well-represented in the military as in the
general population.
At 0.3 percent, Jews make up less of the services than they do of the
general population, where estimates of the proportion of Jews center
around 2 percent.
There are several reasons for this. For example, American Jews tend to
be older than the national average with a median age of 41, according
to the 2000 National Jewish Population Survey, compared to 35 for
Americans as a whole. So, fewer Jews are of military age.
Further, this study found that about half of all Jews have bachelor's
degrees, vs. 28 percent overall. While 95 percent of military officers
have college degrees, only about 3 percent of enlistees do, and 85
percent of them have never been to college. Therefore, the percentage
of Jews in the working class from which most enlistees are recruited is
well below the national average.
Muslims, who make up about 1 percent of the population, according to a
Center for Immigration Studies report by Daniel Pipes and Khalid
Durán, are somewhat more represented in the military on a per capita
basis than Jews, but are less represented than Christians.
Steve Sailer (www.iSteve.com) is a columnist for VDARE.com and the film
critic for The American Conservative.
http://www.isteve.com/2003_Few_Atheists_In_U.S._Foxholes.htm
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Hamish McNugget" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
07 Sep 2005 02:57:01 PM |
|
|
Recently, words of truth shared the following :
Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes
by Steve Sailer
UPI, April 22, 2003
The old saying "There are no atheists in foxholes" turns out to be
virtually correct, at least for the U.S. armed forces. About 0.1
percent of all American military personnel officially declare
themselves to be atheists.
From personal experience I can give that the reason for this. the
military does everything in its power to prevent its members being
identified as atheists. When you start boot camp and you fill out that
blank that says religion for your service record (and your dog tags) and
you write down 'no religion/atheist', they enter it into your record as
'no preference'. I fought for years to get someone willing to change it
to atheist. It took seven years to have atheist printed on my dog tags.
This was only after I gained access to the machine that makes the tags
and printed them myself. The command refused to put anything other than
no preference.
That doesn't mean, however, that all service members belong to a
particular religious denomination. About 27 percent do not volunteer to
have a specific religious preference inscribed on their dog tags.
see above. The military refuses to honor its members wishes.
Congress prohibited the U.S. Census Bureau from inquiring about the
religious affiliations of the general populace, which means there are
no official statistics on the size of the various American faiths. The
military, however, does ask about religion since it employs nearly
3,000 chaplains
Could it be "job security' for the chaplains to keep the pressure on
the military to refuse to recognize the large number of athiests that
serve their country?
to meet soldiers' religious needs. For example, a
Marine with a "C" stamped on his dog tag knows that if he is mortally
wounded in battle, the corps will attempt to find a Roman Catholic
chaplain to give him the last rites.
Overall, 44 percent of Americans in the volunteer military call
themselves Protestants and 24 percent say they are Catholics, according
to the Defense Manpower Data Center. The other major world religions
are not heavily represented: Muslims and Jews make up 0.3 percent each,
Buddhists 0.2 percent and Hindus 0.1 percent. The "other" category
numbered 5 percent.
One thing I know for sure. The commands I served at had church/service
attendance of lower than 10%.
--
'Hamish'
aa #2134 a-vet #20
Mercenary Chef
.
|
|
|
| User: "t1gercat" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
07 Sep 2005 05:18:34 PM |
|
|
Hamish McNugget wrote:
Recently, words of truth shared the following :
Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes
by Steve Sailer
UPI, April 22, 2003
The old saying "There are no atheists in foxholes" turns out to be
virtually correct, at least for the U.S. armed forces. About 0.1
percent of all American military personnel officially declare
themselves to be atheists.
From personal experience I can give that the reason for this. the
military does everything in its power to prevent its members being
identified as atheists. When you start boot camp and you fill out that
blank that says religion for your service record (and your dog tags) and
you write down 'no religion/atheist', they enter it into your record as
'no preference'. I fought for years to get someone willing to change it
to atheist. It took seven years to have atheist printed on my dog tags.
This was only after I gained access to the machine that makes the tags
and printed them myself. The command refused to put anything other than
no preference.
It was worse years ago when I was in the military. I don't think you
were given the "no preference" choice. I think they stamped Protestant,
Catholic or Jewish on the tag. If you were a Hindu, Buddhist, Moslem,
otr atheist forget it.
That doesn't mean, however, that all service members belong to a
particular religious denomination. About 27 percent do not volunteer to
have a specific religious preference inscribed on their dog tags.
see above. The military refuses to honor its members wishes.
Congress prohibited the U.S. Census Bureau from inquiring about the
religious affiliations of the general populace, which means there are
no official statistics on the size of the various American faiths. The
military, however, does ask about religion since it employs nearly
3,000 chaplains
Could it be "job security' for the chaplains to keep the pressure on
the military to refuse to recognize the large number of athiests that
serve their country?
Chaplains are all wierd. I never met one that wasn't either a devoted
command bootlicker or just an all around screwball (or both). Perhaps
they have their uses -- I don't know. I never saw one do anything
useful.
Why does the military tolerate them anyway? It would seem to me that
if a person is ordained and is crazy enough to think he or she has a
divine inspiration to minister to soldiers or sailors, he or she could
do that without joining the service. The Government could just have the
prospective chaplain sign a waiver, rent him some small office space,
and allow him a room to conduct services (or have the members of their
congregation build a chapel -- similar to the tradition that has
officers build officer clubs). If it were really necessary to put them
in uniform, shouldn't they be perpetual privates, E-1s? Why are they
officers? It would seem to me that a private or seaman would be closer
to his or her flock and, if they were permanenetly stuck at E-1, it
would weed out all but the most holy and pure among them, leaving those
who were not interested in advancement but in spiritual growth.
Besides, you'd have one more man for firewatch, for latrine cleaning,
for sand raking, for rock painting and for *****-burning, making him a
useful adjunct to the company.
Wexford
.
|
|
|
| User: "HawkCW4" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
10 Sep 2005 12:42:06 PM |
|
|
t1gercat wrote:
Hamish McNugget wrote:
Recently, words of truth shared the following :
Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes
by Steve Sailer
UPI, April 22, 2003
The old saying "There are no atheists in foxholes" turns out to be
virtually correct, at least for the U.S. armed forces. About 0.1
percent of all American military personnel officially declare
themselves to be atheists.
From personal experience I can give that the reason for this. the
military does everything in its power to prevent its members being
identified as atheists. When you start boot camp and you fill out that
blank that says religion for your service record (and your dog tags) and
you write down 'no religion/atheist', they enter it into your record as
'no preference'. I fought for years to get someone willing to change it
to atheist. It took seven years to have atheist printed on my dog tags.
This was only after I gained access to the machine that makes the tags
and printed them myself. The command refused to put anything other than
no preference.
It was worse years ago when I was in the military. I don't think you
were given the "no preference" choice. I think they stamped Protestant,
Catholic or Jewish on the tag. If you were a Hindu, Buddhist, Moslem,
otr atheist forget it.
I was a young enlistee in 1952, and when they asked my religion for the
tags, I told them and they stamped 'other' on them. What religion was I?
Ed
USA Ret
That doesn't mean, however, that all service members belong to a
particular religious denomination. About 27 percent do not volunteer to
have a specific religious preference inscribed on their dog tags.
see above. The military refuses to honor its members wishes.
Congress prohibited the U.S. Census Bureau from inquiring about the
religious affiliations of the general populace, which means there are
no official statistics on the size of the various American faiths. The
military, however, does ask about religion since it employs nearly
3,000 chaplains
Could it be "job security' for the chaplains to keep the pressure on
the military to refuse to recognize the large number of athiests that
serve their country?
Chaplains are all wierd. I never met one that wasn't either a devoted
command bootlicker or just an all around screwball (or both). Perhaps
they have their uses -- I don't know. I never saw one do anything
useful.
Why does the military tolerate them anyway? It would seem to me that
if a person is ordained and is crazy enough to think he or she has a
divine inspiration to minister to soldiers or sailors, he or she could
do that without joining the service. The Government could just have the
prospective chaplain sign a waiver, rent him some small office space,
and allow him a room to conduct services (or have the members of their
congregation build a chapel -- similar to the tradition that has
officers build officer clubs). If it were really necessary to put them
in uniform, shouldn't they be perpetual privates, E-1s? Why are they
officers? It would seem to me that a private or seaman would be closer
to his or her flock and, if they were permanenetly stuck at E-1, it
would weed out all but the most holy and pure among them, leaving those
who were not interested in advancement but in spiritual growth.
Besides, you'd have one more man for firewatch, for latrine cleaning,
for sand raking, for rock painting and for *****-burning, making him a
useful adjunct to the company.
Wexford
.
|
|
|
| User: "Herb Martin" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
10 Sep 2005 04:25:52 PM |
|
|
I was a young enlistee in 1952, and when they asked my religion for the
tags, I told them and they stamped 'other' on them. What religion was I?
Ed
USA Ret
"other"? Actually, I have no idea.
My dog tags read "Buddhist" (that was in the 70's), and no one
ever gave me grief about it -- in fact it allowed me to avoid
mandatory "pick a religious service to attend" type orders.
--
Herb Martin
.
|
|
|
| User: "HawkCW4" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
13 Sep 2005 05:53:21 PM |
|
|
Herb Martin wrote:
I was a young enlistee in 1952, and when they asked my religion for the
tags, I told them and they stamped 'other' on them. What religion was I?
Ed
USA Ret
"other"? Actually, I have no idea.
My dog tags read "Buddhist" (that was in the 70's), and no one
ever gave me grief about it -- in fact it allowed me to avoid
mandatory "pick a religious service to attend" type orders.
I was raised a Mormon. When I told them that, they put down 'other'.
Ed
USA Ret
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "HawkCW4" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
13 Sep 2005 05:56:28 PM |
|
|
Herb Martin wrote:
I was a young enlistee in 1952, and when they asked my religion for the
tags, I told them and they stamped 'other' on them. What religion was I?
Ed
USA Ret
"other"? Actually, I have no idea.
My dog tags read "Buddhist" (that was in the 70's), and no one
ever gave me grief about it -- in fact it allowed me to avoid
mandatory "pick a religious service to attend" type orders.
Just noticed who posted this. How you doin Herb? Don't see much of you
these days, and suppose you are on that other NG. I think I am about
ready to start my own NG, and you have to be me to get on it. I need
some peace and quiet. But then when I get some, (peace and quiet) I get
restless for something to do and here I am.
Ed
USA Ret
.
|
|
|
| User: "Herb Martin" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
17 Sep 2005 07:45:30 AM |
|
|
"HawkCW4" <HawkCW4@cox.net> wrote in message
news:wOIVe.92030$Ji4.21796@fed1read03...
Just noticed who posted this. How you doin Herb?
Twin grand-babies on the way, almost due. Our first
grandson is approaching 18 months and talking more -- can't
wait to have real conversations with my little buddy.
Don't see much of you
these days, and suppose you are on that other NG.
Just a combo of busy, teaching my Accelerated MCSE class this past
week (which for me, means 14 hour days totally devoted to the students,
and active use of the Outlook Express "Alt-M S Y" to block the idiot
senders and avoid getting sucked into their stupidity.)
Although, I am not sure what "that other newsgroup" is...?
I think I am about ready to start my own NG, and you have to be me to get
on it. I need some peace and quiet. But then when I get some, (peace and
quiet) I get restless for something to do and here I am.
Ed
USA Ret
Yes, and it we all would ignore the obvious idiots with nothing
useful to say, we could get on to arguing and discussing things
of interest to the actual newsgroups involved.
--
Herb Martin
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Mike P" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
13 Sep 2005 06:26:30 PM |
|
|
HawkCW4 wrote:
Herb Martin wrote:
I was a young enlistee in 1952, and when they asked my religion for
the tags, I told them and they stamped 'other' on them. What
religion was I?
Ed
USA Ret
"other"? Actually, I have no idea.
My dog tags read "Buddhist" (that was in the 70's), and no one
ever gave me grief about it -- in fact it allowed me to avoid
mandatory "pick a religious service to attend" type orders.
Just noticed who posted this. How you doin Herb? Don't see much of you
these days, and suppose you are on that other NG. I think I am about
ready to start my own NG, and you have to be me to get on it. I need
some peace and quiet. But then when I get some, (peace and quiet) I get
restless for something to do and here I am.
Ed
USA Ret
Herb is waiting for me and the Red Tide to go fishing again.
Mike
.
|
|
|
| User: "HawkCW4" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
15 Sep 2005 07:44:01 PM |
|
|
Mike P wrote:
HawkCW4 wrote:
Herb Martin wrote:
I was a young enlistee in 1952, and when they asked my religion for
the tags, I told them and they stamped 'other' on them. What
religion was I?
Ed
USA Ret
"other"? Actually, I have no idea.
My dog tags read "Buddhist" (that was in the 70's), and no one
ever gave me grief about it -- in fact it allowed me to avoid
mandatory "pick a religious service to attend" type orders.
Just noticed who posted this. How you doin Herb? Don't see much of
you these days, and suppose you are on that other NG. I think I am
about ready to start my own NG, and you have to be me to get on it. I
need some peace and quiet. But then when I get some, (peace and
quiet) I get restless for something to do and here I am.
Ed
USA Ret
Herb is waiting for me and the Red Tide to go fishing again.
Mike
Make sure he pops a top for me.
Ed
USA Ret
.
|
|
|
| User: "Mike P" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
15 Sep 2005 08:26:55 PM |
|
|
HawkCW4 wrote:
Mike P wrote:
HawkCW4 wrote:
Herb Martin wrote:
I was a young enlistee in 1952, and when they asked my religion for
the tags, I told them and they stamped 'other' on them. What
religion was I?
Ed
USA Ret
"other"? Actually, I have no idea.
My dog tags read "Buddhist" (that was in the 70's), and no one
ever gave me grief about it -- in fact it allowed me to avoid
mandatory "pick a religious service to attend" type orders.
Just noticed who posted this. How you doin Herb? Don't see much of
you these days, and suppose you are on that other NG. I think I am
about ready to start my own NG, and you have to be me to get on it.
I need some peace and quiet. But then when I get some, (peace and
quiet) I get restless for something to do and here I am.
Ed
USA Ret
Herb is waiting for me and the Red Tide to go fishing again.
Mike
Make sure he pops a top for me.
Ed
USA Ret
Unless it's a soda pop he won't anymore. I'm going to try the Sunshine
Skyway Bridge in a week or two just to see if anything has come back.
Here on the Islands everything is dead out about ten miles or more. Not
even a crab alive out there. The Red Tide has killed everything in the
water, and anything that has eaten the dead fish. Lots of Sea Birds
washing up, and we had a turtle wash up as well. I think it's been a
weird year everywhere. Watch out for a load of snow this year out in the
mountains back home. Make sure you have snow tires or chains. Can you
still use studs in the tires?
Mike
.
|
|
|
| User: "Herb Martin" |
|
| Title: Re: Few Atheists In U.S. Foxholes |
17 Sep 2005 07:50:56 AM |
|
|
"Mike P" <nospam-res1yj7x@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:zbpWe.7005$R9.2853@trnddc02...
Just noticed who posted this. How you doin Herb? Don't see much of
you these days, and suppose you are on that other NG. I think I am
about ready to start my own NG, and you have to be me to get on it. I
need some peace and quiet. But then when I get some, (peace and quiet)
I get restless for something to do and here I am.
Ed
USA Ret
Herb is waiting for me and the Red Tide to go fishing again.
Until I read you followup message(s) I had no idea waht the above
referenced. Still not real sure but the tide sounds bad.
Unless it's a soda pop he won't anymore. I'm going to try the Sunshine
Skyway Bridge in a week or two just to see if anything has come back.
How you would know that I (am on a long term diet and) seldom drink
anything but soda is interesting -- but since I used to live there at the
Sunshine Bridge perhaps you know me from long ago....
Of course, I was Jr. High and that was ages ago.
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|

|
Related Articles |
|
|