First amendment goes too far - school students in survey



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Topic: Religions > Atheism
User: "Meteorite Debris"
Date: 01 Feb 2005 02:07:01 AM
Object: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey
http://www.cnn.com/2005/EDUCATION/01/31/students.amendment.ap/index.ht
ml
http://tinyurl.com/3hwv2
Freedom of what?
First Amendment no big deal, students say
WASHINGTON (AP) -- The way many high school students see it,
government censorship of newspapers may not be a bad thing, and flag
burning is hardly protected free speech.
It turns out the First Amendment is a second-rate issue to many of
those nearing their own adult independence, according to a study of
high school attitudes released Monday.
The original amendment to the Constitution is the cornerstone of the
way of life in the United States, promising citizens the freedoms of
religion, speech, press and assembly.
Yet, when told of the exact text of the First Amendment, more than one
in three high school students said it goes "too far" in the rights it
guarantees. Only half of the students said newspapers should be
allowed to publish freely without government approval of stories.
"These results are not only disturbing; they are dangerous," said
Hodding Carter III, president of the John S. and James L. Knight
Foundation, which sponsored the $1 million study. "Ignorance about the
basics of this free society is a danger to our nation's future."
The students are even more restrictive in their views than their
elders, the study says.
When asked whether people should be allowed to express unpopular
views, 97 percent of teachers and 99 percent of school principals said
yes. Only 83 percent of students did.
The results reflected indifference, with almost three in four students
saying they took the First Amendment for granted or didn't know how
they felt about it. It was also clear that many students do not
understand what is protected by the bedrock of the Bill of Rights.
Three in four students said flag burning is illegal. It's not. About
half the students said the government can restrict any indecent
material on the Internet. It can't.
"Schools don't do enough to teach the First Amendment. Students often
don't know the rights it protects," Linda Puntney, executive director
of the Journalism Education Association, said in the report. "This all
comes at a time when there is decreasing passion for much of anything.
And, you have to be passionate about the First Amendment."
The partners in the project, including organizations of newspaper
editors and radio and television news directors, share a clear
advocacy for First Amendment issues.
Federal and state officials, meanwhile, have bemoaned a lack of
knowledge of U.S. civics and history among young people. Sen. Robert
Byrd, D-West Virginia, has even pushed through a mandate that schools
must teach about the Constitution on September 17, the date it was
signed in 1787.
The survey, conducted by researchers at the University of Connecticut,
is billed as the largest of its kind. More than 100,000 students,
nearly 8,000 teachers and more than 500 administrators at 544 public
and private high schools took part in early 2004.
The study suggests that students embrace First Amendment freedoms if
they are taught about them and given a chance to practice them, but
schools don't make the matter a priority.
Students who take part in school media activities, such as student
newspapers or TV production, are much more likely to support
expression of unpopular views, for example.
About nine in 10 principals said it is important for all students to
learn some journalism skills, but most administrators say a lack of
money limits their media offerings.
More than one in five schools offer no student media opportunities; of
the high schools that do not offer student newspapers, 40 percent have
eliminated them in the last five years.
"The last 15 years have not been a golden era for student media," said
Warren Watson, director of the J-Ideas project at Ball State
University in Indiana. "Programs are under siege or dying from
neglect. Many students do not get the opportunity to practice our
basic freedoms."
--
Ben Caradoc-Davies <ben@wintersun.org>
http://wintersun.org/
--
_______________________________________________
To unsubscribe from the EFA stop-censorship list:
email "unsubscribe [your password]" to stop-censorship-
request@lists.efa.org.au
(no quotes or brackets), or visit this web page:
http://lists.efa.org.au/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/stop-censorship
--
epicurus1*at*optusnet*dot*com*dot*au
apatriot #1, atheist #1417,
Chief EAC prophet
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~pk1956/
Apatriotism Yahoo Group
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/apatriotism
Sunday: A day given over by Americans to wishing that they themselves
were dead and in Heaven, and that their neighbors were dead and in
Hell.
-Mencken
.

User: "Lester Solnin"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 01 Feb 2005 04:46:55 AM
"Meteorite Debris" <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in message
news:MPG.1c6987d9c68e966c989ff7@news.optusnet.com.au...

http://www.cnn.com/2005/EDUCATION/01/31/students.amendment.ap/index.ht
ml

http://tinyurl.com/3hwv2

Freedom of what?

First Amendment no big deal, students say

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The way many high school students see it,
government censorship of newspapers may not be a bad thing, and flag
burning is hardly protected free speech.

It turns out the First Amendment is a second-rate issue to many of
those nearing their own adult independence, according to a study of
high school attitudes released Monday.

The original amendment to the Constitution is the cornerstone of the
way of life in the United States, promising citizens the freedoms of
religion, speech, press and assembly.

Yet, when told of the exact text of the First Amendment, more than one
in three high school students said it goes "too far" in the rights it
guarantees. Only half of the students said newspapers should be
allowed to publish freely without government approval of stories.

"These results are not only disturbing; they are dangerous," said
Hodding Carter III, president of the John S. and James L. Knight
Foundation, which sponsored the $1 million study. "Ignorance about the
basics of this free society is a danger to our nation's future."

The students are even more restrictive in their views than their
elders, the study says.

When asked whether people should be allowed to express unpopular
views, 97 percent of teachers and 99 percent of school principals said
yes. Only 83 percent of students did.

The results reflected indifference, with almost three in four students
saying they took the First Amendment for granted or didn't know how
they felt about it. It was also clear that many students do not
understand what is protected by the bedrock of the Bill of Rights.

Three in four students said flag burning is illegal. It's not. About
half the students said the government can restrict any indecent
material on the Internet. It can't.

"Schools don't do enough to teach the First Amendment. Students often
don't know the rights it protects," Linda Puntney, executive director
of the Journalism Education Association, said in the report. "This all
comes at a time when there is decreasing passion for much of anything.
And, you have to be passionate about the First Amendment."

The partners in the project, including organizations of newspaper
editors and radio and television news directors, share a clear
advocacy for First Amendment issues.

Federal and state officials, meanwhile, have bemoaned a lack of
knowledge of U.S. civics and history among young people. Sen. Robert
Byrd, D-West Virginia, has even pushed through a mandate that schools
must teach about the Constitution on September 17, the date it was
signed in 1787.

The survey, conducted by researchers at the University of Connecticut,
is billed as the largest of its kind. More than 100,000 students,
nearly 8,000 teachers and more than 500 administrators at 544 public
and private high schools took part in early 2004.

The study suggests that students embrace First Amendment freedoms if
they are taught about them and given a chance to practice them, but
schools don't make the matter a priority.

Students who take part in school media activities, such as student
newspapers or TV production, are much more likely to support
expression of unpopular views, for example.

About nine in 10 principals said it is important for all students to
learn some journalism skills, but most administrators say a lack of
money limits their media offerings.

More than one in five schools offer no student media opportunities; of
the high schools that do not offer student newspapers, 40 percent have
eliminated them in the last five years.

"The last 15 years have not been a golden era for student media," said
Warren Watson, director of the J-Ideas project at Ball State
University in Indiana. "Programs are under siege or dying from
neglect. Many students do not get the opportunity to practice our
basic freedoms."

I don't know if you heard but there are 30 states teaching sex education

using wrong and propragated infornation. I wonder what states are a bunch of
morons!!
Les

--
Ben Caradoc-Davies <ben@wintersun.org>
http://wintersun.org/
--
_______________________________________________
To unsubscribe from the EFA stop-censorship list:
email "unsubscribe [your password]" to stop-censorship-
request@lists.efa.org.au
(no quotes or brackets), or visit this web page:
http://lists.efa.org.au/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/stop-censorship
--
epicurus1*at*optusnet*dot*com*dot*au
apatriot #1, atheist #1417,
Chief EAC prophet
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~pk1956/

Apatriotism Yahoo Group
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/apatriotism

Sunday: A day given over by Americans to wishing that they themselves
were dead and in Heaven, and that their neighbors were dead and in
Hell.

-Mencken

.

User: "johac"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 01 Feb 2005 06:19:42 AM
In article <MPG.1c6987d9c68e966c989ff7@news.optusnet.com.au>,
Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/EDUCATION/01/31/students.amendment.ap/index.ht
ml

http://tinyurl.com/3hwv2

Freedom of what?

First Amendment no big deal, students say

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The way many high school students see it,
government censorship of newspapers may not be a bad thing, and flag
burning is hardly protected free speech.

It turns out the First Amendment is a second-rate issue to many of
those nearing their own adult independence, according to a study of
high school attitudes released Monday.

The original amendment to the Constitution is the cornerstone of the
way of life in the United States, promising citizens the freedoms of
religion, speech, press and assembly.

Yet, when told of the exact text of the First Amendment, more than one
in three high school students said it goes "too far" in the rights it
guarantees. Only half of the students said newspapers should be
allowed to publish freely without government approval of stories.

"These results are not only disturbing; they are dangerous," said
Hodding Carter III, president of the John S. and James L. Knight
Foundation, which sponsored the $1 million study. "Ignorance about the
basics of this free society is a danger to our nation's future."

No kidding!


The students are even more restrictive in their views than their
elders, the study says.

When asked whether people should be allowed to express unpopular
views, 97 percent of teachers and 99 percent of school principals said
yes. Only 83 percent of students did.

The results reflected indifference, with almost three in four students
saying they took the First Amendment for granted or didn't know how
they felt about it. It was also clear that many students do not
understand what is protected by the bedrock of the Bill of Rights.

Three in four students said flag burning is illegal. It's not. About
half the students said the government can restrict any indecent
material on the Internet. It can't.

"Schools don't do enough to teach the First Amendment. Students often
don't know the rights it protects," Linda Puntney, executive director
of the Journalism Education Association, said in the report. "This all
comes at a time when there is decreasing passion for much of anything.
And, you have to be passionate about the First Amendment."

The partners in the project, including organizations of newspaper
editors and radio and television news directors, share a clear
advocacy for First Amendment issues.

Federal and state officials, meanwhile, have bemoaned a lack of
knowledge of U.S. civics and history among young people. Sen. Robert
Byrd, D-West Virginia, has even pushed through a mandate that schools
must teach about the Constitution on September 17, the date it was
signed in 1787.

The survey, conducted by researchers at the University of Connecticut,
is billed as the largest of its kind. More than 100,000 students,
nearly 8,000 teachers and more than 500 administrators at 544 public
and private high schools took part in early 2004.

The study suggests that students embrace First Amendment freedoms if
they are taught about them and given a chance to practice them, but
schools don't make the matter a priority.

Students who take part in school media activities, such as student
newspapers or TV production, are much more likely to support
expression of unpopular views, for example.

About nine in 10 principals said it is important for all students to
learn some journalism skills, but most administrators say a lack of
money limits their media offerings.

More than one in five schools offer no student media opportunities; of
the high schools that do not offer student newspapers, 40 percent have
eliminated them in the last five years.

"The last 15 years have not been a golden era for student media," said
Warren Watson, director of the J-Ideas project at Ball State
University in Indiana. "Programs are under siege or dying from
neglect. Many students do not get the opportunity to practice our
basic freedoms."


--
Ben Caradoc-Davies <ben@wintersun.org>
http://wintersun.org/
--
_______________________________________________
To unsubscribe from the EFA stop-censorship list:
email "unsubscribe [your password]" to stop-censorship-
request@lists.efa.org.au
(no quotes or brackets), or visit this web page:
http://lists.efa.org.au/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/stop-censorship

I recall that some years ago., someone rewrote the 'Bill of Rights', the
first ten amendments of the US Constitution, in more contemporary
language and asked some average Americans what they thought of it. A
disturbing number thought that it was a Communist inspired document.
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
Intelligent Design has as much to do with science as reality
television has to do with reality. - Barry Lynn on CNN 12/25/04
.

User: "Mark K. Bilbo"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 01 Feb 2005 02:51:54 PM
In our last episode <MPG.1c6987d9c68e966c989ff7@news.optusnet.com.au>,
Meteorite Debris lumbered into the room and mumbled:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/EDUCATION/01/31/students.amendment.ap/index.ht ml

http://tinyurl.com/3hwv2

Freedom of what?

First Amendment no big deal, students say

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The way many high school students see it, government
censorship of newspapers may not be a bad thing, and flag burning is
hardly protected free speech.

It turns out the First Amendment is a second-rate issue to many of those
nearing their own adult independence, according to a study of high school
attitudes released Monday.

The original amendment to the Constitution is the cornerstone of the way
of life in the United States, promising citizens the freedoms of religion,
speech, press and assembly.

Yet, when told of the exact text of the First Amendment, more than one in
three high school students said it goes "too far" in the rights it
guarantees. Only half of the students said newspapers should be allowed to
publish freely without government approval of stories.

"These results are not only disturbing; they are dangerous," said Hodding
Carter III, president of the John S. and James L. Knight Foundation, which
sponsored the $1 million study. "Ignorance about the basics of this free
society is a danger to our nation's future."

The students are even more restrictive in their views than their elders,
the study says.

<snip>
Meaning the system is functioning as expected.
We've been turning our schools into mini-police states for sometime now.
While I wouldn't try to claim some "conspiracy" to indoctrinate the kids
into a surveillance society, there really are a number of people out there
with that intent. A lot of folks, under the guise of "safety," are going
along with it.
I've seen elementary kids wearing ID badges. Regimented school uniforms
are becoming widespread. Cameras are being put in everywhere. The reasons
for each are always "safety" but they add up to indoctrination into a
surveillance society.
Kids are hauled off all the time for "hacking" the computers. We had a
girl in a local school hauled off for bringing jello to school. It "looked
like" jello shots. School newspapers are increasingly being clamped down
on if not just shut down. Expressing "radical" opinions can mean the
teacher calls the FBI.
It's not "ignorance." It's the result of our policies...
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Religion is regarded by the common people as true,
by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."
-- Seneca the Younger
.
User: "Meteorite Debris"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 01 Feb 2005 10:35:18 PM
On Tue, 01 Feb 2005 08:51:54 -0600 the ET form known as Mark K.
Bilbo<alt-atheism@org.webmaster> sent a radio signal across the vast
expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.

Meaning the system is functioning as expected.

We've been turning our schools into mini-police states for sometime now.
While I wouldn't try to claim some "conspiracy" to indoctrinate the kids
into a surveillance society, there really are a number of people out there
with that intent. A lot of folks, under the guise of "safety," are going
along with it.

I've seen elementary kids wearing ID badges. Regimented school uniforms
are becoming widespread. Cameras are being put in everywhere. The reasons
for each are always "safety" but they add up to indoctrination into a
surveillance society.

Kids are hauled off all the time for "hacking" the computers. We had a
girl in a local school hauled off for bringing jello to school. It "looked
like" jello shots. School newspapers are increasingly being clamped down
on if not just shut down. Expressing "radical" opinions can mean the
teacher calls the FBI.

It's not "ignorance." It's the result of our policies...

Yes I despair of moving towards a fascist government. A similar
stories in most western countries but some more than others.
--
epicurus1*at*optusnet*dot*com*dot*au
apatriot #1, atheist #1417,
Chief EAC prophet
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~pk1956/
Apatriotism Yahoo Group
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/apatriotism
Sunday: A day given over by Americans to wishing that they themselves
were dead and in Heaven, and that their neighbors were dead and in
Hell.
-Mencken
.

User: "stoney"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 03 Feb 2005 04:22:06 PM
On Tue, 01 Feb 2005 08:51:54 -0600, "Mark K. Bilbo"
<alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:

In our last episode <MPG.1c6987d9c68e966c989ff7@news.optusnet.com.au>,
Meteorite Debris lumbered into the room and mumbled:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/EDUCATION/01/31/students.amendment.ap/index.ht ml

http://tinyurl.com/3hwv2

Freedom of what?

First Amendment no big deal, students say

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The way many high school students see it, government
censorship of newspapers may not be a bad thing, and flag burning is
hardly protected free speech.

It turns out the First Amendment is a second-rate issue to many of those
nearing their own adult independence, according to a study of high school
attitudes released Monday.

The original amendment to the Constitution is the cornerstone of the way
of life in the United States, promising citizens the freedoms of religion,
speech, press and assembly.

Yet, when told of the exact text of the First Amendment, more than one in
three high school students said it goes "too far" in the rights it
guarantees. Only half of the students said newspapers should be allowed to
publish freely without government approval of stories.

"These results are not only disturbing; they are dangerous," said Hodding
Carter III, president of the John S. and James L. Knight Foundation, which
sponsored the $1 million study. "Ignorance about the basics of this free
society is a danger to our nation's future."

The students are even more restrictive in their views than their elders,
the study says.


<snip>

Meaning the system is functioning as expected.

We've been turning our schools into mini-police states for sometime now.
While I wouldn't try to claim some "conspiracy" to indoctrinate the kids
into a surveillance society, there really are a number of people out there
with that intent. A lot of folks, under the guise of "safety," are going
along with it.

I've seen elementary kids wearing ID badges. Regimented school uniforms
are becoming widespread. Cameras are being put in everywhere. The reasons
for each are always "safety" but they add up to indoctrination into a
surveillance society.

Kids are hauled off all the time for "hacking" the computers. We had a
girl in a local school hauled off for bringing jello to school. It "looked
like" jello shots. School newspapers are increasingly being clamped down
on if not just shut down. Expressing "radical" opinions can mean the
teacher calls the FBI.

It's not "ignorance." It's the result of our policies...

Exactly. The reprecussions and ramifications of a policy to deal with
a 'problem' often are worse than the 'disease.'
--
Contempt of Congress meter reading-offscale.
Hello, theocracy with a fundamentalist US Supreme
Court who will ensure church and state are joined
at the hip like clergy and altar boys.
America 1776-Jan 2001 RIP
.


User: "Fred Stone"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 01 Feb 2005 03:05:35 PM
Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6987d9c68e966c989ff7@news.optusnet.com.au:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/EDUCATION/01/31/students.amendment.ap/index.ht
ml

http://tinyurl.com/3hwv2

Freedom of what?

First Amendment no big deal, students say

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The way many high school students see it,
government censorship of newspapers may not be a bad thing, and flag
burning is hardly protected free speech.

It turns out the First Amendment is a second-rate issue to many of
those nearing their own adult independence, according to a study of
high school attitudes released Monday.

The original amendment to the Constitution is the cornerstone of the
way of life in the United States, promising citizens the freedoms of
religion, speech, press and assembly.

Yet, when told of the exact text of the First Amendment, more than one
in three high school students said it goes "too far" in the rights it
guarantees. Only half of the students said newspapers should be
allowed to publish freely without government approval of stories.

Given the media's shameful performances in the last few years, maybe
it's what they need, since they obviously can't be trusted to report the
truth by themselves.
CBS News.
New York Times.
USA Today.
How many scandals does it take before an industry can no longer be
trusted?
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Where am I to go, now that I've gone too far?
.
User: "jwk"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 02 Feb 2005 04:11:50 PM
Fred Stone wrote:

Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6987d9c68e966c989ff7@news.optusnet.com.au:


http://www.cnn.com/2005/EDUCATION/01/31/students.amendment.ap/index.ht

ml

http://tinyurl.com/3hwv2

Freedom of what?

First Amendment no big deal, students say

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The way many high school students see it,
government censorship of newspapers may not be a bad thing, and

flag

burning is hardly protected free speech.

It turns out the First Amendment is a second-rate issue to many of
those nearing their own adult independence, according to a study of
high school attitudes released Monday.

The original amendment to the Constitution is the cornerstone of

the

way of life in the United States, promising citizens the freedoms

of

religion, speech, press and assembly.

Yet, when told of the exact text of the First Amendment, more than

one

in three high school students said it goes "too far" in the rights

it

guarantees. Only half of the students said newspapers should be
allowed to publish freely without government approval of stories.


Given the media's shameful performances in the last few years, maybe
it's what they need, since they obviously can't be trusted to report

the

truth by themselves.

CBS News.
New York Times.
USA Today.

How many scandals does it take before an industry can no longer be
trusted?

Typical, short-sighted Republican speak. Go ahead Fred, make it legal
for the government to tell the press what they can print. Do you
recall the line-item veto? As soon as you get *this beaut passed,
we'll get a Democratic controlled government and you will (once again)
be crying foul about something your own boys passed being used against
you. (Bill O'Reiley will be the first to go. The Limpballs.)
jwk
.

User: "Meteorite Debris"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 01 Feb 2005 10:31:36 PM
On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:05:35 +0000 (UTC) the ET form known as Fred
Stone<fstone69@earthling.com> sent a radio signal across the vast
expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.

Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6987d9c68e966c989ff7@news.optusnet.com.au:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/EDUCATION/01/31/students.amendment.ap/index.ht
ml

http://tinyurl.com/3hwv2

Freedom of what?

First Amendment no big deal, students say

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The way many high school students see it,
government censorship of newspapers may not be a bad thing, and flag
burning is hardly protected free speech.

It turns out the First Amendment is a second-rate issue to many of
those nearing their own adult independence, according to a study of
high school attitudes released Monday.

The original amendment to the Constitution is the cornerstone of the
way of life in the United States, promising citizens the freedoms of
religion, speech, press and assembly.

Yet, when told of the exact text of the First Amendment, more than one
in three high school students said it goes "too far" in the rights it
guarantees. Only half of the students said newspapers should be
allowed to publish freely without government approval of stories.


Given the media's shameful performances in the last few years, maybe
it's what they need, since they obviously can't be trusted to report the
truth by themselves.

Here Fred shows disdain for free speech.

CBS News.
New York Times.
USA Today.

How many scandals does it take before an industry can no longer be
trusted?

But George Monbiot has written that only SOME inaccuracies matter.
Those about reporting WMDs and not reporting Bush lies don't matter.

--
epicurus1*at*optusnet*dot*com*dot*au
apatriot #1, atheist #1417,
Chief EAC prophet
http://members.optusnet.com.au/~pk1956/
Apatriotism Yahoo Group
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/apatriotism
Sunday: A day given over by Americans to wishing that they themselves
were dead and in Heaven, and that their neighbors were dead and in
Hell.
-Mencken
.
User: "Fred Stone"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 02 Feb 2005 04:04:36 AM
Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6aa7485a359def989fff@news.optusnet.com.au:

On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:05:35 +0000 (UTC) the ET form known as Fred
Stone<fstone69@earthling.com> sent a radio signal across the vast
expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.

Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6987d9c68e966c989ff7@news.optusnet.com.au:


http://www.cnn.com/2005/EDUCATION/01/31/students.amendment.ap/index.

ht ml

http://tinyurl.com/3hwv2

Freedom of what?

First Amendment no big deal, students say

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The way many high school students see it,
government censorship of newspapers may not be a bad thing, and
flag burning is hardly protected free speech.

It turns out the First Amendment is a second-rate issue to many of
those nearing their own adult independence, according to a study of
high school attitudes released Monday.

The original amendment to the Constitution is the cornerstone of
the way of life in the United States, promising citizens the
freedoms of religion, speech, press and assembly.

Yet, when told of the exact text of the First Amendment, more than
one in three high school students said it goes "too far" in the
rights it guarantees. Only half of the students said newspapers
should be allowed to publish freely without government approval of
stories.


Given the media's shameful performances in the last few years, maybe
it's what they need, since they obviously can't be trusted to report
the truth by themselves.


Here Fred shows disdain for free speech.

Free speech is one thing. The freedom to make up falsehoods is not
guaranteed in the Constitution.

CBS News.
New York Times.
USA Today.

How many scandals does it take before an industry can no longer be
trusted?


But George Monbiot has written that only SOME inaccuracies matter.
Those about reporting WMDs and not reporting Bush lies don't matter.

George Monbiot should know all about not caring about inaccuracies.
Funny how all those WMD stories and "Bush lies" have gotten plenty of
press then.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Where am I to go, now that I've gone too far?
.
User: "jwk"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 02 Feb 2005 04:15:09 PM
Fred Stone wrote:

Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6aa7485a359def989fff@news.optusnet.com.au:

On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:05:35 +0000 (UTC) the ET form known as Fred
Stone<fstone69@earthling.com> sent a radio signal across the vast
expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.

Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6987d9c68e966c989ff7@news.optusnet.com.au:


http://www.cnn.com/2005/EDUCATION/01/31/students.amendment.ap/index.

ht ml

http://tinyurl.com/3hwv2

Freedom of what?

First Amendment no big deal, students say

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The way many high school students see it,
government censorship of newspapers may not be a bad thing, and
flag burning is hardly protected free speech.

It turns out the First Amendment is a second-rate issue to many

of

those nearing their own adult independence, according to a study

of

high school attitudes released Monday.

The original amendment to the Constitution is the cornerstone of
the way of life in the United States, promising citizens the
freedoms of religion, speech, press and assembly.

Yet, when told of the exact text of the First Amendment, more

than

one in three high school students said it goes "too far" in the
rights it guarantees. Only half of the students said newspapers
should be allowed to publish freely without government approval

of

stories.


Given the media's shameful performances in the last few years,

maybe

it's what they need, since they obviously can't be trusted to

report

the truth by themselves.


Here Fred shows disdain for free speech.


Free speech is one thing. The freedom to make up falsehoods is not
guaranteed in the Constitution.

Neither is it prohibited. Any right not prohibited in the Constution
is defacto granted. American Government 101. If this were not so,
Bushy would be in jail for lying about WMDs now wouldn't he.
jwk
.
User: "Fred Stone"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 02 Feb 2005 07:56:11 PM
"jwk" <jwkinraleigh@yahoo.com> wrote in news:1107360909.367920.113940
@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com:


Fred Stone wrote:

Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6aa7485a359def989fff@news.optusnet.com.au:

On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:05:35 +0000 (UTC) the ET form known as Fred
Stone<fstone69@earthling.com> sent a radio signal across the vast
expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.

Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6987d9c68e966c989ff7@news.optusnet.com.au:


http://www.cnn.com/2005/EDUCATION/01/31/students.amendment.ap/index.

ht ml

http://tinyurl.com/3hwv2

Freedom of what?

First Amendment no big deal, students say

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The way many high school students see it,
government censorship of newspapers may not be a bad thing, and
flag burning is hardly protected free speech.

It turns out the First Amendment is a second-rate issue to many

of

those nearing their own adult independence, according to a study

of

high school attitudes released Monday.

The original amendment to the Constitution is the cornerstone of
the way of life in the United States, promising citizens the
freedoms of religion, speech, press and assembly.

Yet, when told of the exact text of the First Amendment, more

than

one in three high school students said it goes "too far" in the
rights it guarantees. Only half of the students said newspapers
should be allowed to publish freely without government approval

of

stories.


Given the media's shameful performances in the last few years,

maybe

it's what they need, since they obviously can't be trusted to

report

the truth by themselves.


Here Fred shows disdain for free speech.


Free speech is one thing. The freedom to make up falsehoods is not
guaranteed in the Constitution.


Neither is it prohibited. Any right not prohibited in the Constution
is defacto granted. American Government 101. If this were not so,
Bushy would be in jail for lying about WMDs now wouldn't he.

That's why we have laws against libel and slander, right?
And nobody has proved that Bush deliberately lied.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Where am I to go, now that I've gone too far?
.

User: "Al Klein"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 03 Feb 2005 02:16:08 AM
On 2 Feb 2005 08:15:09 -0800, "jwk" <jwkinraleigh@yahoo.com> said in
alt.atheism:

Neither is it prohibited. Any right not prohibited in the Constution
is defacto granted. American Government 101. If this were not so,
Bushy would be in jail for lying about WMDs now wouldn't he.

Nah - according to Phred not only are they there, but we found them.
--
"I cannot conceive of a God who rewards and punishes his creatures, or has a will of the
type of which we are conscious in ourselves. An individual who should survive his
physical death is also beyond my comprehension,...; such notions are for the fears or
absurd egoism of feeble souls."
- Albert Einstein
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
.


User: "BTR1701"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 02 Feb 2005 12:50:52 PM
In article <Xns95F0EACBC4510fstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6aa7485a359def989fff@news.optusnet.com.au:

On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:05:35 +0000 (UTC) the ET form known as Fred
Stone<fstone69@earthling.com> sent a radio signal across the vast
expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.

Given the media's shameful performances in the last few years, maybe
it's what they need, since they obviously can't be trusted to report
the truth by themselves.


Here Fred shows disdain for free speech.

Free speech is one thing. The freedom to make up falsehoods is not
guaranteed in the Constitution.

Actually, it is. It's up to the public to use their brains and separate
truth from untruth. It's not the government's job to set up a "ministry
of truth" to hold the people's hand and make sure they're never fooled.
.
User: "Fred Stone"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 02 Feb 2005 01:39:46 PM
BTR1701 <btr1702@ix.netcom.com> wrote in
news:btr1702-FD06BF.07505202022005@news.giganews.com:

In article <Xns95F0EACBC4510fstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6aa7485a359def989fff@news.optusnet.com.au:

On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:05:35 +0000 (UTC) the ET form known as Fred
Stone<fstone69@earthling.com> sent a radio signal across the vast
expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.


Given the media's shameful performances in the last few years,
maybe it's what they need, since they obviously can't be trusted
to report the truth by themselves.


Here Fred shows disdain for free speech.


Free speech is one thing. The freedom to make up falsehoods is not
guaranteed in the Constitution.


Actually, it is. It's up to the public to use their brains and
separate truth from untruth.

The Democratic party is evidence that the public is not always informed
enough to do that.
That's why we have laws about libel and slander.

It's not the government's job to set up a
"ministry of truth" to hold the people's hand and make sure they're
never fooled.

--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Where am I to go, now that I've gone too far?
.
User: "BTR1701"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 02 Feb 2005 03:24:17 PM
In article <Xns95F15827CE2EBfstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

BTR1701 <btr1702@ix.netcom.com> wrote in
news:btr1702-FD06BF.07505202022005@news.giganews.com:

In article <Xns95F0EACBC4510fstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6aa7485a359def989fff@news.optusnet.com.au:

On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:05:35 +0000 (UTC) the ET form known as Fred
Stone<fstone69@earthling.com> sent a radio signal across the vast
expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.


Given the media's shameful performances in the last few years,
maybe it's what they need, since they obviously can't be trusted
to report the truth by themselves.


Here Fred shows disdain for free speech.


Free speech is one thing. The freedom to make up falsehoods is not
guaranteed in the Constitution.


Actually, it is. It's up to the public to use their brains and
separate truth from untruth.


The Democratic party is evidence that the public is not always informed
enough to do that.

That's why we have laws about libel and slander.

As a conservative/libertarian, the last thing I want is the government
imposing restrictions on anyone's speech.
.
User: "Fred Stone"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 02 Feb 2005 07:54:28 PM
BTR1701 <btr1702@ix.netcom.com> wrote in
news:btr1702-939B72.10241702022005@news.giganews.com:

In article <Xns95F15827CE2EBfstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

BTR1701 <btr1702@ix.netcom.com> wrote in
news:btr1702-FD06BF.07505202022005@news.giganews.com:

In article <Xns95F0EACBC4510fstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6aa7485a359def989fff@news.optusnet.com.au:

On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:05:35 +0000 (UTC) the ET form known as
Fred Stone<fstone69@earthling.com> sent a radio signal across
the vast expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.


Given the media's shameful performances in the last few years,
maybe it's what they need, since they obviously can't be
trusted to report the truth by themselves.


Here Fred shows disdain for free speech.


Free speech is one thing. The freedom to make up falsehoods is not
guaranteed in the Constitution.


Actually, it is. It's up to the public to use their brains and
separate truth from untruth.


The Democratic party is evidence that the public is not always
informed enough to do that.

That's why we have laws about libel and slander.


As a conservative/libertarian, the last thing I want is the government
imposing restrictions on anyone's speech.

When the "news" lies to the public, isn't that false advertising?
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Where am I to go, now that I've gone too far?
.
User: "BTR1701"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 02 Feb 2005 10:47:05 PM
In article <Xns95F197B0F3C23fstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

BTR1701 <btr1702@ix.netcom.com> wrote in
news:btr1702-939B72.10241702022005@news.giganews.com:

In article <Xns95F15827CE2EBfstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

BTR1701 <btr1702@ix.netcom.com> wrote in
news:btr1702-FD06BF.07505202022005@news.giganews.com:

In article <Xns95F0EACBC4510fstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6aa7485a359def989fff@news.optusnet.com.au:

On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:05:35 +0000 (UTC) the ET form known as
Fred Stone<fstone69@earthling.com> sent a radio signal across
the vast expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.


Given the media's shameful performances in the last few years,
maybe it's what they need, since they obviously can't be
trusted to report the truth by themselves.


Here Fred shows disdain for free speech.


Free speech is one thing. The freedom to make up falsehoods is not
guaranteed in the Constitution.


Actually, it is. It's up to the public to use their brains and
separate truth from untruth.


The Democratic party is evidence that the public is not always
informed enough to do that.

That's why we have laws about libel and slander.


As a conservative/libertarian, the last thing I want is the government
imposing restrictions on anyone's speech.


When the "news" lies to the public, isn't that false advertising?

No, it's not advertising at all.
If it's actually a lie, then it's merely a false statement and there's
no law against lying to someone unless it's under oath.
.
User: "Fred Stone"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 03 Feb 2005 01:19:01 AM
BTR1701 <btr1702@ix.netcom.com> wrote in
news:btr1702-ACCD24.17470502022005@news.giganews.com:

In article <Xns95F197B0F3C23fstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

BTR1701 <btr1702@ix.netcom.com> wrote in
news:btr1702-939B72.10241702022005@news.giganews.com:

In article <Xns95F15827CE2EBfstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

BTR1701 <btr1702@ix.netcom.com> wrote in
news:btr1702-FD06BF.07505202022005@news.giganews.com:

In article <Xns95F0EACBC4510fstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6aa7485a359def989fff@news.optusnet.com.au:

On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:05:35 +0000 (UTC) the ET form known as
Fred Stone<fstone69@earthling.com> sent a radio signal across
the vast expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.


Given the media's shameful performances in the last few
years, maybe it's what they need, since they obviously can't
be trusted to report the truth by themselves.


Here Fred shows disdain for free speech.


Free speech is one thing. The freedom to make up falsehoods is
not guaranteed in the Constitution.


Actually, it is. It's up to the public to use their brains and
separate truth from untruth.


The Democratic party is evidence that the public is not always
informed enough to do that.

That's why we have laws about libel and slander.


As a conservative/libertarian, the last thing I want is the
government imposing restrictions on anyone's speech.


When the "news" lies to the public, isn't that false advertising?


No, it's not advertising at all.

The news media claims to be presenting the truth.

If it's actually a lie, then it's merely a false statement and there's
no law against lying to someone unless it's under oath.

Or it's libel or slander.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
Where am I to go, now that I've gone too far?
.
User: "BTR1701"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 03 Feb 2005 03:56:32 AM
In article <Xns95F1CEB471C33fstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

BTR1701 <btr1702@ix.netcom.com> wrote in
news:btr1702-ACCD24.17470502022005@news.giganews.com:

In article <Xns95F197B0F3C23fstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

BTR1701 <btr1702@ix.netcom.com> wrote in
news:btr1702-939B72.10241702022005@news.giganews.com:

In article <Xns95F15827CE2EBfstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

BTR1701 <btr1702@ix.netcom.com> wrote in
news:btr1702-FD06BF.07505202022005@news.giganews.com:

In article <Xns95F0EACBC4510fstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6aa7485a359def989fff@news.optusnet.com.au:

On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:05:35 +0000 (UTC) the ET form known as
Fred Stone<fstone69@earthling.com> sent a radio signal across
the vast expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.


Given the media's shameful performances in the last few
years, maybe it's what they need, since they obviously can't
be trusted to report the truth by themselves.


Here Fred shows disdain for free speech.


Free speech is one thing. The freedom to make up falsehoods is
not guaranteed in the Constitution.


Actually, it is. It's up to the public to use their brains and
separate truth from untruth.


The Democratic party is evidence that the public is not always
informed enough to do that.

That's why we have laws about libel and slander.


As a conservative/libertarian, the last thing I want is the
government imposing restrictions on anyone's speech.


When the "news" lies to the public, isn't that false advertising?


No, it's not advertising at all.


The news media claims to be presenting the truth.

The cheating boyfriend claims to be presenting the truth to his girl,
also.
It's not a crime for him to do it and it's not a crime for the media to
do it.

If it's actually a lie, then it's merely a false statement and there's
no law against lying to someone unless it's under oath.

Or it's libel or slander.

Only if the falsehood pertains to a specific individual.
.
User: "Al Klein"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 03 Feb 2005 06:18:46 AM
On Wed, 02 Feb 2005 22:56:32 -0500, BTR1701 <btr1702@ix.netcom.com>
said in alt.atheism:

In article <Xns95F1CEB471C33fstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

Or it's libel or slander.

Only if the falsehood pertains to a specific individual.

I think "maliciously" and "knowingly" enter into it too.
--
"...I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do.
When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand
why I dismiss yours."
- Stephen F. Roberts
(random sig, produced by SigChanger)
rukbat at verizon dot net
.
User: "BTR1701"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 03 Feb 2005 11:59:29 AM
In article <4hg301hespm4s3ib3641ersjhkqjfce6if@4ax.com>,
Al Klein <rukbat@pern.invalid> wrote:

On Wed, 02 Feb 2005 22:56:32 -0500, BTR1701 <btr1702@ix.netcom.com>
said in alt.atheism:

In article <Xns95F1CEB471C33fstone69@205.188.138.161>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:


Or it's libel or slander.


Only if the falsehood pertains to a specific individual.


I think "maliciously" and "knowingly" enter into it too.

Malice is only an issue in defamation cases if the person is a public
figure.
.










User: "stoney"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 03 Feb 2005 04:26:01 PM
On Wed, 2 Feb 2005 09:01:36 +1030, Meteorite Debris
<abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote:

On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:05:35 +0000 (UTC) the ET form known as Fred
Stone<fstone69@earthling.com> sent a radio signal across the vast
expanse of deep space -._.--._.--._.--._.--._.--._.

Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6987d9c68e966c989ff7@news.optusnet.com.au:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/EDUCATION/01/31/students.amendment.ap/index.ht
ml

http://tinyurl.com/3hwv2

Freedom of what?

First Amendment no big deal, students say

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The way many high school students see it,
government censorship of newspapers may not be a bad thing, and flag
burning is hardly protected free speech.

It turns out the First Amendment is a second-rate issue to many of
those nearing their own adult independence, according to a study of
high school attitudes released Monday.

The original amendment to the Constitution is the cornerstone of the
way of life in the United States, promising citizens the freedoms of
religion, speech, press and assembly.

Yet, when told of the exact text of the First Amendment, more than one
in three high school students said it goes "too far" in the rights it
guarantees. Only half of the students said newspapers should be
allowed to publish freely without government approval of stories.


Given the media's shameful performances in the last few years, maybe
it's what they need, since they obviously can't be trusted to report the
truth by themselves.


Here Fred shows disdain for free speech.

Of course, the brain dead sychophant does. "Seigh Heil, Shrub;" Fred
shouts with joy, jackboots stomping on cue, and the gleaming eyes of
fanaticism glowing.

CBS News.
New York Times.
USA Today.

How many scandals does it take before an industry can no longer be
trusted?


But George Monbiot has written that only SOME inaccuracies matter.
Those about reporting WMDs and not reporting Bush lies don't matter.

Exactly. Fred is quite the asswipe.
--
Contempt of Congress meter reading-offscale.
Hello, theocracy with a fundamentalist US Supreme
Court who will ensure church and state are joined
at the hip like clergy and altar boys.
America 1776-Jan 2001 RIP
.


User: "stoney"

Title: Re: First amendment goes too far - school students in survey 03 Feb 2005 04:24:11 PM
On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:05:35 +0000 (UTC), Fred Stone
<fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:

Meteorite Debris <abuse@optusnet,com.au> wrote in
news:MPG.1c6987d9c68e966c989ff7@news.optusnet.com.au:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/EDUCATION/01/31/students.amendment.ap/index.ht
ml

http://tinyurl.com/3hwv2

Freedom of what?

First Amendment no big deal, students say

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The way many high school students see it,
government censorship of newspapers may not be a bad thing, and flag
burning is hardly protected free speech.

It turns out the First Amendment is a second-rate issue to many of
those nearing their own adult independence, according to a study of
high school attitudes released Monday.

The original amendment to the Constitution is the cornerstone of the
way of life in the United States, promising citizens the freedoms of
religion, speech, press and assembly.

Yet, when told of the exact text of the First Amendment, more than one
in three high school students said it goes "too far" in the rights it
guarantees. Only half of the students said newspapers should be
allowed to publish freely without government approval of stories.


Given the media's shameful performances in the last few years, maybe
it's what they need, since they obviously can't be trusted to report the
truth by themselves.

CBS News.
New York Times.
USA Today.

How many scandals does it take before an industry can no longer be
trusted?

If they don't 'play ball' they don't get access to the WH Press room.
I don't know, Fred. How many scandals does it take before you
determine the Shrub and the Rethugnican Party can no longer be
trusted?
--
Contempt of Congress meter reading-offscale.
Hello, theocracy with a fundamentalist US Supreme
Court who will ensure church and state are joined
at the hip like clergy and altar boys.
America 1776-Jan 2001 RIP
.



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