| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Sound of Trumpet" |
| Date: |
03 Jan 2007 07:05:00 AM |
| Object: |
Half Of Russian Muslims Have Abandoned Islam |
http://powerandcontrol.blogspot.com/2006/12/muslims-abandoning-islam.html
Friday, December 29, 2006
"Muslims" Abandoning Islam?
Reader Paul sent me this interesting item on the decline in belief
among Muslims in Russia.
This latest research deals a severe blow to plans by Russian Muslim
leaders to wrench concessions from the Kremlin. These Muslim leaders
are pushing for the creation of a new high-ranking position in the
government just for so-called `Muslim Affairs', and they are also
trying to have Islamic law officially accepted in those areas of the
country where ethnic Muslims dominate.
So-called `ethnic' Muslims --- people traditionally seen as Muslims,
such as Tatars, Bashkirs, Chechens, and Ingush --- account for about 15
percent of the total Russian population, or 20 million people. The fact
that only 6 percent of the total Russian population, about 9 million
people, claimed to be Muslim means that more than half of `ethnic'
Muslims have abandoned the Mohammedan cult practiced by their
forefathers.
This is also a very good example whereby Muslim leaders deny any
freedom of choice to `their' peoeple. They claim as their own anyone
born into an ethnic group that is perceived to be `Muslim', and under
no circumstance will they let go of these people. According to Muslim
leaders: once a Muslim, always a Muslim. Islam is all about violence,
coercion and the absence of freedom.
The VTsIOM poll is very encouraging news. True, more and more mosques
are opening in Russia, but not many people are attending them. Indeed,
many Tatars and Bashkirs have become Orthodox Christian; or simply do
not have any religious affiliation. Islam in Russia, however, remains
most virulent in the North Caucasus among the Chechens and Inghush,
whose inclination toward violence and terrorism is well-known.
This is very encouraging news if true. It may be that our real hope in
this war is not the "moderate" muslim but the former muslim.
What we need now is a survey team to go in and find out how this
happened. Is it a local phenomenon or can it be replicated?
Clayton Cramer thinks that Islam may have been a proxy for nationalism
in those regions. With the Soviets gone no need for nationalism as a
resistance movement, thus the decline of Islam. Certainly a testable
thesis. If it is true it means that it is of limited application
because our current problem is with transnational Islam.
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| User: "Mud Slide Slim" |
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| Title: Re: Half Of Russian Muslims Have Abandoned Islam |
03 Jan 2007 09:25:23 AM |
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"Sound of Trumpet" <sound_of_trumpet@myway.com> wrote in message
news:1167829500.914266.326420@s34g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
http://powerandcontrol.blogspot.com/2006/12/muslims-abandoning-islam.html
Friday, December 29, 2006
"Muslims" Abandoning Islam?
Maybe they just discovered bacon 'n eggs?
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| User: "3003 Dead" |
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| Title: Re: Half Of Russian Muslims Have Abandoned Islam |
03 Jan 2007 09:58:58 AM |
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On Wed, 3 Jan 2007 10:25:23 -0500, "Mud Slide Slim"
<BlueHorizon@OhCanaduh.ca> wrote:
"Sound of Trumpet" <sound_of_trumpet@myway.com> wrote in message
news:1167829500.914266.326420@s34g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
http://powerandcontrol.blogspot.com/2006/12/muslims-abandoning-islam.html
Friday, December 29, 2006
"Muslims" Abandoning Islam?
Maybe they just discovered bacon 'n eggs?
In the free market paradise of Russia?
--
"Keeping us up here eats away at families. The Democrats could care less about families -- that's what this says."
-- Rep. Jack Kingston (R-GA), quoted by the Washington Post, in response to incoming-Majority Leader Steny Hoyer's (D-MD) plan to increase the House's work schedule from three days a week to five.
Putsch: leading America to asymetric warfare since 2001
Not dead, in jail, or a slave? Thank a liberal!
Pay your taxes so the rich don't have to.
For the finest in liberal/leftist commentary,
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a.a. #2211 -- Bryan Zepp Jamieson
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| User: "James A. Donald" |
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| Title: Re: Half Of Russian Muslims Have Abandoned Islam |
03 Jan 2007 03:25:08 PM |
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On 3 Jan 2007 05:05:00 -0800, "Sound of Trumpet"
The VTsIOM poll is very encouraging news. True, more
and more mosques are opening in Russia, but not many
people are attending them. Indeed, many Tatars and
Bashkirs have become Orthodox Christian; or simply do
not have any religious affiliation. Islam in Russia,
however, remains most virulent in the North Caucasus
among the Chechens and Inghush, whose inclination
toward violence and terrorism is well-known. This is
very encouraging news if true. It may be that our real
hope in this war is not the "moderate" muslim but the
former muslim.
Islam is a real downer religion. At its best, it makes
the Puritans look like a christmas wassail. At its
worst, it merges puritanism with fascism. None of the
Islamic festivals are fun. For example the major
festival is to go without food or water for a long time.
The shia have a festival where you slash yourself with
big knives. And, of course, there is that fun fun
ceremony, "stoning the devil", a symbolic human
sacrifice. Christianity has a symbolic cannibalistic
human sacrifice, communion, but I doubt that any
Christians have ever been accidentally eaten during
communion. Most years, a hundred or so Muslims are
accidentally killed during stoning the devil.
Anywhere Islam cannot be backed by violence it declines,
wherever it must compete on equal terms with
Christianity, it declines more severely than
Christianity declines.
But do not celebrate too soon. There are worse belief
systems than Islam.
--
----------------------
We have the right to defend ourselves and our property, because
of the kind of animals that we are. True law derives from this
right, not from the arbitrary power of the omnipotent state.
http://www.jim.com/ James A. Donald
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| User: "brique" |
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| Title: Re: Half Of Russian Muslims Have Abandoned Islam |
13 Jan 2007 04:11:53 AM |
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James A. Donald <jamesd@echeque.com> wrote in message
news:n17op2dj4f3460hbt73magcr6sqdpqajqe@4ax.com...
On 3 Jan 2007 05:05:00 -0800, "Sound of Trumpet"
The VTsIOM poll is very encouraging news. True, more
and more mosques are opening in Russia, but not many
people are attending them. Indeed, many Tatars and
Bashkirs have become Orthodox Christian; or simply do
not have any religious affiliation. Islam in Russia,
however, remains most virulent in the North Caucasus
among the Chechens and Inghush, whose inclination
toward violence and terrorism is well-known. This is
very encouraging news if true. It may be that our real
hope in this war is not the "moderate" muslim but the
former muslim.
Islam is a real downer religion. At its best, it makes
the Puritans look like a christmas wassail. At its
worst, it merges puritanism with fascism. None of the
Islamic festivals are fun. For example the major
festival is to go without food or water for a long time.
So very different from the christian festival of Lent .. which was also a
period of fasting, or the catholic christian practice of fasting for 24
hours prior to taking communion, of not consuming meat on a Friday. Well,
christians mostly dont bother praticing any of the above anymore, but then,
Muslims dont fast for ramadam either, they fast during daylight hours only,
once darkness falls, so do the knives and forks upon dinner.
The shia have a festival where you slash yourself with
big knives.
And members of cultic christian groups self-mortify as part of their
worship. Opus Die even have a spiked garter to wear at all times, to remidn
themselves of the weakness of the flesh. One christian sect crucify a
volunteer to 'celebrate' Easter.
And, of course, there is that fun fun
ceremony, "stoning the devil", a symbolic human
sacrifice. Christianity has a symbolic cannibalistic
human sacrifice, communion, but I doubt that any
Christians have ever been accidentally eaten during
communion. Most years, a hundred or so Muslims are
accidentally killed during stoning the devil.
really James... and most years whacko christians get bitten by snakes during
their fporm of worship and large numbers get killed or maimed whislt being
'exorcised', particularily in the evangelical christian churches in Africa.
Anywhere Islam cannot be backed by violence it declines,
wherever it must compete on equal terms with
Christianity, it declines more severely than
Christianity declines.
But do not celebrate too soon. There are worse belief
systems than Islam.
What on earth could they be, james.... not those political systems which
call for the mass murder of millions for professing the wrong religion? You
know, the ones which demand the death of a persons entire family should they
'scare' you with 'scary words'. The same ones which consider bombing a place
of worship and slaughtering the entire congregation to be a 'moral act'.....
I hear they also consider nailing dissidents heads to walls to be a useful
tool for suppressing 'scary words'.....
Still, could be worse, at least they also claim to defend free speech.....
----------------------
We have the right to defend ourselves and our property, because
of the kind of animals that we are. True law derives from this
right, not from the arbitrary power of the omnipotent state.
http://www.jim.com/ James A. Donald
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| User: "Matt Silberstein" |
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| Title: Re: Half Of Russian Muslims Have Abandoned Islam |
14 Jan 2007 06:54:10 PM |
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On Thu, 04 Jan 2007 07:25:08 +1000, in alt.atheism , James A. Donald
<jamesd@echeque.com> in <n17op2dj4f3460hbt73magcr6sqdpqajqe@4ax.com>
wrote:
On 3 Jan 2007 05:05:00 -0800, "Sound of Trumpet"
The VTsIOM poll is very encouraging news. True, more
and more mosques are opening in Russia, but not many
people are attending them. Indeed, many Tatars and
Bashkirs have become Orthodox Christian; or simply do
not have any religious affiliation. Islam in Russia,
however, remains most virulent in the North Caucasus
among the Chechens and Inghush, whose inclination
toward violence and terrorism is well-known. This is
very encouraging news if true. It may be that our real
hope in this war is not the "moderate" muslim but the
former muslim.
Islam is a real downer religion. At its best, it makes
the Puritans look like a christmas wassail. At its
worst, it merges puritanism with fascism. None of the
Islamic festivals are fun.
Do you get this from discussion with Muslims or it just your view?
For example the major
festival is to go without food or water for a long time.
Yeah, during daylight hours. And then they joyously feast in the
evenings.
The shia have a festival where you slash yourself with
big knives.
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=christian+flagellation&btnG=Google+Search
And, of course, there is that fun fun
ceremony, "stoning the devil", a symbolic human
sacrifice.
I had no idea you were such a hedonist. I will try to remember it.
Christianity has a symbolic cannibalistic
human sacrifice, communion, but I doubt that any
Christians have ever been accidentally eaten during
communion.
But plenty have been killed in various religious rituals and
celebrations.
Most years, a hundred or so Muslims are
accidentally killed during stoning the devil.
Anywhere Islam cannot be backed by violence it declines,
wherever it must compete on equal terms with
Christianity, it declines more severely than
Christianity declines.
Can you back any of that up with some evidence?
But do not celebrate too soon. There are worse belief
systems than Islam.
Yours, for instance. That is, whatever belief system that sees Gandhi
as worse than Torquemada is worse than Islam.
--
Matt Silberstein
Do something today about the Darfur Genocide
http://www.beawitness.org
http://www.darfurgenocide.org
http://www.savedarfur.org
"Darfur: A Genocide We can Stop"
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