| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Dio" |
| Date: |
04 Oct 2003 08:32:59 PM |
| Object: |
Has our universe a cause? |
Hello boys,
could be there a creator who created our universe? I mean like an
hypothesis.
If that could be probable; what is this creator?
How can you imagine, suppose it?
Like a man? Like a super man? Like what?
Is it material, immaterial, made of atoms or strange particles.
Could be there a creator? Yes or not?
If you say that there could be a creator, you are an agnostic. If you say
that there couldn't be a creator you are a strong atheist.
Bye bye
.
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| User: "ricky" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
05 Oct 2003 12:38:36 PM |
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"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:fxKfb.167766$hE5.5649036@news1.tin.it...
**Has our universe a cause?**
No, because the definition of the word "universe" doesn't accept a cause. If
X is the cause of universe, X should be a part of the universe.
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| User: "MarcRW" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
05 Oct 2003 02:04:37 PM |
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"ricky" <ricky@5625785623.com> wrote in message
news:wGYfb.170830$hE5.5764281@news1.tin.it...
"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:fxKfb.167766$hE5.5649036@news1.tin.it...
**Has our universe a cause?**
No, because the definition of the word "universe" doesn't accept a cause.
If
X is the cause of universe, X should be a part of the universe.
I'd edit that ever so slightly. "If X *IS*, then X is part of the
universe."
If god *is*, then god is one element of {things that are}, or the universe.
If god is not part of the universe, then god is not one of {things that
are}. Therefore god is not.
In short, if god exists, he is one of us, an inhabitant of the universe, a
part of reality. There is nowhere else.
Marc
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| User: "Mark Richardson" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
07 Oct 2003 12:59:36 AM |
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On Sun, 05 Oct 2003 17:38:36 GMT, "ricky" <ricky@5625785623.com>
wrote:
"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:fxKfb.167766$hE5.5649036@news1.tin.it...
**Has our universe a cause?**
No, because the definition of the word "universe" doesn't accept a cause. If
X is the cause of universe, X should be a part of the universe.
Careful.
Depends on the definition of universe.
I would say:
By definition "existence" doesn't accept a cause. If
X is the cause of existence, X should be a part of existence.
Now the question is begged:
Is the universe the entirety of existence OR is the universe the
entirety of space time and matter(energy) that we are physically
connected to?
(Is the universe our local "bubble" of space time?)
It is logically possible that our universe ( causally connected local
space time) is NOT the entirety of existence.
There is another word Cosmos - which means the entirety of physical
existence - There are at least two logical possibilities - the Cosmos
*may* contain an infinite number of universes OR our universe may
itself be the entire Cosmos.
Modern cosmologists are leaning more and more towards the view that
our universe is just one in an infinite Cosmos.
Mark.
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| User: "Woden" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
04 Oct 2003 09:15:41 PM |
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"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> wrote in
news:fxKfb.167766$hE5.5649036@news1.tin.it:
Hello boys,
Ah, so you're a misogynist too. Don't the girls around here count?
could be there a creator who created our universe? I mean like an
hypothesis.
Could you find any evidence of any creator? Did you find any need that the
universe had to have been created?
If that could be probable; what is this creator?
What would you like it to be? I mean as long as we're making things up.
How can you imagine, suppose it?
Hey, humans are gifted with lots of imagination.
Like a man? Like a super man? Like what?
Ah, you want to make the creator in your own image. How very egotistical
of you.
Is it material, immaterial, made of atoms or strange particles.
How could we know? If such a creator did exist, it would exist outside the
bounds of space, time, energy and matter that make up our universe.
Could be there a creator? Yes or not?
Don't see any need or evidence of one. But how can we deny the remote
possibility of things we have no concept of. Specifically, how could we
conceive of anything outside the confines of space and time that form our
universe?
If you say that there could be a creator, you are an agnostic. If you say
that there couldn't be a creator you are a strong atheist.
Why does it matter what label you attach to us?
--
Woden
"religion is a socio-political institution for the control of
people's thoughts, lives, and actions; based on
ancient myths and superstitions perpetrated through
generations of subtle yet pervasive brainwashing."
.
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| User: "Dio" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
05 Oct 2003 07:15:02 AM |
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Woden
CUT
How could we know? If such a creator did exist, it would exist outside the
bounds of space, time, energy and matter that make up our universe.
Could you explain what is "outside the bounds of space, time, energy and
matter that make up our universe" ?
Thank you boys and girls and ladies and gentlemen
Bye bye
.
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| User: "Woden" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
05 Oct 2003 07:43:29 AM |
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"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> wrote in
news:aXTfb.228255$R32.7353107@news2.tin.it:
Woden
CUT
How could we know? If such a creator did exist, it would exist
outside the bounds of space, time, energy and matter that make up our
universe.
Could you explain what is "outside the bounds of space, time, energy
and matter that make up our universe" ?
Thank you boys and girls and ladies and gentlemen
Bye bye
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time the
universe started, how could any creator have existed within the bounds of
space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to have been created?
--
Woden
"religion is a socio-political institution for the control of
people's thoughts, lives, and actions; based on
ancient myths and superstitions perpetrated through
generations of subtle yet pervasive brainwashing."
.
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| User: "Don Kresch" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
05 Oct 2003 10:17:14 AM |
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In alt.atheism on Sun, 05 Oct 2003 12:43:29 -0000, Woden
<woden@charter.net> let us all know that:
"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> wrote in
news:aXTfb.228255$R32.7353107@news2.tin.it:
Woden
CUT
How could we know? If such a creator did exist, it would exist
outside the bounds of space, time, energy and matter that make up our
universe.
Could you explain what is "outside the bounds of space, time, energy
and matter that make up our universe" ?
Thank you boys and girls and ladies and gentlemen
Bye bye
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time the
universe started, how could any creator have existed within the bounds of
space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to have been created?
How could it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are the bounds of *existence*?
Don
---
aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde
Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert.
"No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another"
Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man"
.
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| User: "Jeff Young" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
06 Oct 2003 08:57:24 AM |
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Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:<med0ovgbb8p6fqo2shef94b2d92hd3td0i@4ax.com>...
In alt.atheism on Sun, 05 Oct 2003 12:43:29 -0000, Woden
<woden@charter.net> let us all know that:
"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> wrote in
news:aXTfb.228255$R32.7353107@news2.tin.it:
Woden
CUT
How could we know? If such a creator did exist, it would exist
outside the bounds of space, time, energy and matter that make up our
universe.
Could you explain what is "outside the bounds of space, time, energy
and matter that make up our universe" ?
Thank you boys and girls and ladies and gentlemen
Bye bye
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time the
universe started, how could any creator have existed within the bounds of
space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to have been created?
How could it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are the bounds of *existence*?
Why couldn't it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are not the bounds of existence?
Jeff
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| User: "John Hattan" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
06 Oct 2003 11:21:25 AM |
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(Jeff Young) wrote:
Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:<med0ovgbb8p6fqo2shef94b2d92hd3td0i@4ax.com>...
In alt.atheism on Sun, 05 Oct 2003 12:43:29 -0000, Woden
<woden@charter.net> let us all know that:
"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> wrote in
news:aXTfb.228255$R32.7353107@news2.tin.it:
Woden
CUT
How could we know? If such a creator did exist, it would exist
outside the bounds of space, time, energy and matter that make up our
universe.
Could you explain what is "outside the bounds of space, time, energy
and matter that make up our universe" ?
Thank you boys and girls and ladies and gentlemen
Bye bye
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time the
universe started, how could any creator have existed within the bounds of
space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to have been created?
How could it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are the bounds of *existence*?
Why couldn't it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are not the bounds of existence?
I assume you are referring to the invisible immaterial extrauniversal
extratemporal monkey that's sitting on your monitor right now, correct?
---
John Hattan Grand High UberPope - First Church of Shatnerology
john@thecodezone.com http://www.shatnerology.com
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| User: "Don Kresch" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
06 Oct 2003 01:44:57 PM |
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In alt.atheism on Mon, 06 Oct 2003 11:21:25 -0500, John Hattan
<john@thecodezone.com> let us all know that:
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:<med0ovgbb8p6fqo2shef94b2d92hd3td0i@4ax.com>...
In alt.atheism on Sun, 05 Oct 2003 12:43:29 -0000, Woden
<woden@charter.net> let us all know that:
"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> wrote in
news:aXTfb.228255$R32.7353107@news2.tin.it:
Woden
CUT
How could we know? If such a creator did exist, it would exist
outside the bounds of space, time, energy and matter that make up our
universe.
Could you explain what is "outside the bounds of space, time, energy
and matter that make up our universe" ?
Thank you boys and girls and ladies and gentlemen
Bye bye
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time the
universe started, how could any creator have existed within the bounds of
space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to have been created?
How could it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are the bounds of *existence*?
Why couldn't it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are not the bounds of existence?
I assume you are referring to the invisible immaterial extrauniversal
extratemporal monkey that's sitting on your monitor right now, correct?
If Jeffy the Contrary Monkey still around? Hasn't he gotten tired
of his childish little game, especially considering that he's been in
my killfile for something like 4 or 5 years?
Don
---
aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde
Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert.
"No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another"
Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man"
.
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| User: "Jeff Young" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
07 Oct 2003 04:11:50 PM |
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Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:<7vd3ovgca94h45ab42g2fr4n7b305481ih@4ax.com>...
In alt.atheism on Mon, 06 Oct 2003 11:21:25 -0500, John Hattan
<john@thecodezone.com> let us all know that:
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:<med0ovgbb8p6fqo2shef94b2d92hd3td0i@4ax.com>...
In alt.atheism on Sun, 05 Oct 2003 12:43:29 -0000, Woden
<woden@charter.net> let us all know that:
"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> wrote in
news:aXTfb.228255$R32.7353107@news2.tin.it:
Woden
CUT
How could we know? If such a creator did exist, it would exist
outside the bounds of space, time, energy and matter that make up our
universe.
Could you explain what is "outside the bounds of space, time, energy
and matter that make up our universe" ?
Thank you boys and girls and ladies and gentlemen
Bye bye
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time the
universe started, how could any creator have existed within the bounds of
space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to have been created?
How could it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are the bounds of *existence*?
Why couldn't it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are not the bounds of existence?
I assume you are referring to the invisible immaterial extrauniversal
extratemporal monkey that's sitting on your monitor right now, correct?
If Jeffy the Contrary Monkey still around?
Aren't I still around?
Hasn't he gotten tired
of his childish little game,
It's not a game, childish or otherwise, so why should I tire of it?
especially considering that he's been in
my killfile for something like 4 or 5 years?
Why would your killfiling of me for something like 4 or 5 years make
me tire of arguing in alt.atheism?
You're not making much sense, as usual.
Jeff
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| User: "John Hattan" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
07 Oct 2003 05:59:51 PM |
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(Jeff Young) wrote:
You're not making much sense, as usual.
Prove it.
---
John Hattan Grand High UberPope - First Church of Shatnerology
john@thecodezone.com http://www.shatnerology.com
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| User: "Jeff Young" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
08 Oct 2003 09:50:54 AM |
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John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<iah6ovc9ml761sc6uc28elnaek93lsmaig@4ax.com>...
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
You're not making much sense, as usual.
Prove it.
<Kresch writes:>
If Jeffy the Contrary Monkey still around? Hasn't he gotten tired
of his childish little game, especially considering that he's been in
my killfile for something like 4 or 5 years?
<end quote>
Nonsense item #1: First sentence is not grammatical as written.
Nonsense item #2: Presumption that I would get tired because Kresch
put me in his killfile. At best a complete non sequitur. More likely
Kresch thinks he or his killfile have some magical powers. Nonsense.
Nonsense item #3: "Contrary Monkey". Evidently referring to me by
some nonsensical label. Nice rhetoric, but the term makes no sense
(is undefined) as it stands.
Q.E.D.
Jeff
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| User: "John Hattan" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
08 Oct 2003 12:04:20 PM |
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(Jeff Young) wrote:
John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<iah6ovc9ml761sc6uc28elnaek93lsmaig@4ax.com>...
(Jeff Young) wrote:
You're not making much sense, as usual.
Prove it.
<Kresch writes:>
If Jeffy the Contrary Monkey still around? Hasn't he gotten tired
of his childish little game, especially considering that he's been in
my killfile for something like 4 or 5 years?
<end quote>
Nonsense item #1: First sentence is not grammatical as written.
A one character typo does not necessarily render an entire point
nonsense.
Item #1 crashes and burns.
Nonsense item #2: Presumption that I would get tired because Kresch
put me in his killfile. At best a complete non sequitur. More likely
Kresch thinks he or his killfile have some magical powers. Nonsense.
The point was quite clear. You never seem to tire of your "shout
strawman at everything that moves" game, and your posts look exactly the
same now as five years ago, verified by Kresh who can seldom see your
posts because you've been in his killfile for years.
Item #2 gasps and dies.
Nonsense item #3: "Contrary Monkey". Evidently referring to me by
some nonsensical label. Nice rhetoric, but the term makes no sense
(is undefined) as it stands.
You do enjoy contradiction and you share more common traits with monkeys
than with most other animals.
Item #3 implodes and annihilates itself, leaving only a few photons as
evidence of its existence.
---
John Hattan Grand High UberPope - First Church of Shatnerology
john@thecodezone.com http://www.shatnerology.com
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| User: "Jeff Young" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
09 Oct 2003 09:03:05 AM |
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John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<5dg8ov8j65q84kj88539oljfnld5ss3kso@4ax.com>...
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<iah6ovc9ml761sc6uc28elnaek93lsmaig@4ax.com>...
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
You're not making much sense, as usual.
Prove it.
<Kresch writes:>
If Jeffy the Contrary Monkey still around? Hasn't he gotten tired
of his childish little game, especially considering that he's been in
my killfile for something like 4 or 5 years?
<end quote>
Nonsense item #1: First sentence is not grammatical as written.
Neoprene.
Phosgene.
Nonsense item #2: Presumption that I would get tired because Kresch
put me in his killfile. At best a complete non sequitur. More likely
Kresch thinks he or his killfile have some magical powers. Nonsense.
Styrofoam.
Superglue.
Nonsense item #3: "Contrary Monkey". Evidently referring to me by
some nonsensical label. Nice rhetoric, but the term makes no sense
(is undefined) as it stands.
Nylon.
Rayon.
Jeff
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| User: "John Hattan" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
09 Oct 2003 04:44:26 PM |
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(Jeff Young) wrote:
John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<5dg8ov8j65q84kj88539oljfnld5ss3kso@4ax.com>...
(Jeff Young) wrote:
John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<iah6ovc9ml761sc6uc28elnaek93lsmaig@4ax.com>...
(Jeff Young) wrote:
You're not making much sense, as usual.
Prove it.
<Kresch writes:>
If Jeffy the Contrary Monkey still around? Hasn't he gotten tired
of his childish little game, especially considering that he's been in
my killfile for something like 4 or 5 years?
<end quote>
Nonsense item #1: First sentence is not grammatical as written.
Neoprene.
Phosgene.
plonkene.
---
John Hattan Grand High UberPope - First Church of Shatnerology
john@thecodezone.com http://www.shatnerology.com
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| User: "Jeff Young" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
10 Oct 2003 09:30:51 AM |
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John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<bllbovok0dvtue7dh3unadc2iun9i5pdr4@4ax.com>...
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<5dg8ov8j65q84kj88539oljfnld5ss3kso@4ax.com>...
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<iah6ovc9ml761sc6uc28elnaek93lsmaig@4ax.com>...
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
You're not making much sense, as usual.
Prove it.
<Kresch writes:>
If Jeffy the Contrary Monkey still around? Hasn't he gotten tired
of his childish little game, especially considering that he's been in
my killfile for something like 4 or 5 years?
<end quote>
Nonsense item #1: First sentence is not grammatical as written.
Neoprene.
Phosgene.
Martin Sheen.
Blue Jean.
Jeff
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| User: "Brian F. King" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
08 Oct 2003 01:26:36 PM |
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(Jeff Young) wrote:
John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote:
(Jeff Young) wrote:
You're not making much sense, as usual.
Prove it.
<Kresch writes:>
If Jeffy the Contrary Monkey still around? Hasn't he gotten tired
of his childish little game, especially considering that he's been in
my killfile for something like 4 or 5 years?
<end quote>
Nonsense item #1: First sentence is not grammatical as written.
Nonsense item #2: Presumption that I would get tired because Kresch
put me in his killfile. At best a complete non sequitur. More likely
Kresch thinks he or his killfile have some magical powers. Nonsense.
Nonsense item #3: "Contrary Monkey". Evidently referring to me by
some nonsensical label. Nice rhetoric, but the term makes no sense
(is undefined) as it stands.
Let me guess...
You're trying to overload the irony meters again.
Q.E.D.
Jeff
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| User: "stoney" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
10 Oct 2003 12:01:21 AM |
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On 8 Oct 2003 11:26:36 -0700, (Brian F. King),
Message ID: <6215668a.0310081026.ab48428@posting.google.com> wrote in
alt.atheism;
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote:
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
You're not making much sense, as usual.
Prove it.
<Kresch writes:>
If Jeffy the Contrary Monkey still around? Hasn't he gotten tired
of his childish little game, especially considering that he's been in
my killfile for something like 4 or 5 years?
<end quote>
Nonsense item #1: First sentence is not grammatical as written.
Nonsense item #2: Presumption that I would get tired because Kresch
put me in his killfile. At best a complete non sequitur. More likely
Kresch thinks he or his killfile have some magical powers. Nonsense.
Nonsense item #3: "Contrary Monkey". Evidently referring to me by
some nonsensical label. Nice rhetoric, but the term makes no sense
(is undefined) as it stands.
Let me guess...
You're trying to overload the irony meters again.
Jeffy doesn't need to try-it comes naturally.
Stoney
"Designated Rascal and Rapscallion
and
SCAMPERMEISTER!"
When in doubt, SCAMPER about!
When things are fair, SCAMPER everywhere!
When things are rough, can't SCAMPER enough!
/end humour alert
alt.atheism military veteran #11
{so much for the 'no atheists in foxholes' rubbish}
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| User: "John Hattan" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
06 Oct 2003 02:39:31 PM |
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Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote:
In alt.atheism on Mon, 06 Oct 2003 11:21:25 -0500, John Hattan
<john@thecodezone.com> let us all know that:
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:<med0ovgbb8p6fqo2shef94b2d92hd3td0i@4ax.com>...
In alt.atheism on Sun, 05 Oct 2003 12:43:29 -0000, Woden
<woden@charter.net> let us all know that:
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time the
universe started, how could any creator have existed within the bounds of
space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to have been created?
How could it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are the bounds of *existence*?
Why couldn't it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are not the bounds of existence?
I assume you are referring to the invisible immaterial extrauniversal
extratemporal monkey that's sitting on your monitor right now, correct?
If Jeffy the Contrary Monkey still around? Hasn't he gotten tired
of his childish little game, especially considering that he's been in
my killfile for something like 4 or 5 years?
I was surprised he was able to push out an entire sentence without
shouting "strawman" at something random. I'll likely killfile him in a
post or two when he once again shows his boundless dumbassitude.
---
John Hattan Grand High UberPope - First Church of Shatnerology
john@thecodezone.com http://www.shatnerology.com
.
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| User: "Wayne Delia" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
07 Oct 2003 09:02:30 PM |
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John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<c5h3ovkap8mu1f7thbhlgq6ns9p7or3e13@4ax.com>...
Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote:
In alt.atheism on Mon, 06 Oct 2003 11:21:25 -0500, John Hattan
<john@thecodezone.com> let us all know that:
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:<med0ovgbb8p6fqo2shef94b2d92hd3td0i@4ax.com>...
In alt.atheism on Sun, 05 Oct 2003 12:43:29 -0000, Woden
<woden@charter.net> let us all know that:
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time the
universe started, how could any creator have existed within the bounds of
space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to have been created?
How could it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are the bounds of *existence*?
Why couldn't it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are not the bounds of existence?
I assume you are referring to the invisible immaterial extrauniversal
extratemporal monkey that's sitting on your monitor right now, correct?
If Jeffy the Contrary Monkey still around? Hasn't he gotten tired
of his childish little game, especially considering that he's been in
my killfile for something like 4 or 5 years?
I was surprised he was able to push out an entire sentence without
shouting "strawman" at something random. I'll likely killfile him in a
post or two when he once again shows his boundless dumbassitude.
How can dumbassitude be boundless? Thermodynamic analysis indicates
that it... wait a second... oh, it's Jeffy the Fallacy-Boy. Yes, his
dumbassitude is boundless, and it's the main reason why God invented
killfiles.
Wayne Delia, via groups.google.com
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| User: "Jeff Young" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
07 Oct 2003 04:05:44 PM |
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John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<ai53ov45nb1o0u1ldbquifioqlunid75vo@4ax.com>...
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:<med0ovgbb8p6fqo2shef94b2d92hd3td0i@4ax.com>...
In alt.atheism on Sun, 05 Oct 2003 12:43:29 -0000, Woden
<woden@charter.net> let us all know that:
"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> wrote in
news:aXTfb.228255$R32.7353107@news2.tin.it:
Woden
CUT
How could we know? If such a creator did exist, it would exist
outside the bounds of space, time, energy and matter that make up our
universe.
Could you explain what is "outside the bounds of space, time, energy
and matter that make up our universe" ?
Thank you boys and girls and ladies and gentlemen
Bye bye
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time the
universe started, how could any creator have existed within the bounds of
space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to have been created?
How could it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are the bounds of *existence*?
Why couldn't it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are not the bounds of existence?
I assume you are referring to the invisible immaterial extrauniversal
extratemporal monkey that's sitting on your monitor right now, correct?
Incorrect. Simply to what are and are not the bounds of existence.
Do try to follow along without immediately presuming your way into
outright fallacy. (Strawman, Ignoratio Elenchi, and Argument by
Ridicule, namely.)
Jeff
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| User: "John Hattan" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
07 Oct 2003 05:58:59 PM |
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(Jeff Young) wrote:
John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<ai53ov45nb1o0u1ldbquifioqlunid75vo@4ax.com>...
(Jeff Young) wrote:
Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:<med0ovgbb8p6fqo2shef94b2d92hd3td0i@4ax.com>...
In alt.atheism on Sun, 05 Oct 2003 12:43:29 -0000, Woden
<woden@charter.net> let us all know that:
"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> wrote in
news:aXTfb.228255$R32.7353107@news2.tin.it:
Woden
CUT
How could we know? If such a creator did exist, it would exist
outside the bounds of space, time, energy and matter that make up our
universe.
Could you explain what is "outside the bounds of space, time, energy
and matter that make up our universe" ?
Thank you boys and girls and ladies and gentlemen
Bye bye
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time the
universe started, how could any creator have existed within the bounds of
space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to have been created?
How could it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are the bounds of *existence*?
Why couldn't it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are not the bounds of existence?
I assume you are referring to the invisible immaterial extrauniversal
extratemporal monkey that's sitting on your monitor right now, correct?
Incorrect. Simply to what are and are not the bounds of existence.
Incorrect. You were actually stating what you thought were *not* the
bounds of existence. Learn to read your own words.
---
John Hattan Grand High UberPope - First Church of Shatnerology
john@thecodezone.com http://www.shatnerology.com
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| User: "Jeff Young" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
08 Oct 2003 09:38:42 AM |
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John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<h4h6ovo9makqrhdku3i5vjjtkseb8d1ai9@4ax.com>...
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<ai53ov45nb1o0u1ldbquifioqlunid75vo@4ax.com>...
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:<med0ovgbb8p6fqo2shef94b2d92hd3td0i@4ax.com>...
In alt.atheism on Sun, 05 Oct 2003 12:43:29 -0000, Woden
<woden@charter.net> let us all know that:
"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> wrote in
news:aXTfb.228255$R32.7353107@news2.tin.it:
Woden
CUT
How could we know? If such a creator did exist, it would exist
outside the bounds of space, time, energy and matter that make up our
universe.
Could you explain what is "outside the bounds of space, time, energy
and matter that make up our universe" ?
Thank you boys and girls and ladies and gentlemen
Bye bye
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time the
universe started, how could any creator have existed within the bounds of
space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to have been created?
How could it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are the bounds of *existence*?
Why couldn't it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are not the bounds of existence?
I assume you are referring to the invisible immaterial extrauniversal
extratemporal monkey that's sitting on your monitor right now, correct?
Incorrect. Simply to what are and are not the bounds of existence.
^^^^^^^^^^^
Incorrect.
?
You were actually stating what you thought were *not* the
bounds of existence.
Approximately correct.
Learn to read your own words.
Ohhhhhhh the irony! Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaaaaaaaaa!
Jeff
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| User: "John Hattan" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
08 Oct 2003 11:55:49 AM |
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(Jeff Young) wrote:
John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<h4h6ovo9makqrhdku3i5vjjtkseb8d1ai9@4ax.com>...
(Jeff Young) wrote:
John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<ai53ov45nb1o0u1ldbquifioqlunid75vo@4ax.com>...
(Jeff Young) wrote:
Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:<med0ovgbb8p6fqo2shef94b2d92hd3td0i@4ax.com>...
In alt.atheism on Sun, 05 Oct 2003 12:43:29 -0000, Woden
<woden@charter.net> let us all know that:
"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> wrote in
news:aXTfb.228255$R32.7353107@news2.tin.it:
Woden
CUT
How could we know? If such a creator did exist, it would exist
outside the bounds of space, time, energy and matter that make up our
universe.
Could you explain what is "outside the bounds of space, time, energy
and matter that make up our universe" ?
Thank you boys and girls and ladies and gentlemen
Bye bye
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time the
universe started, how could any creator have existed within the bounds of
space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to have been created?
How could it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are the bounds of *existence*?
Why couldn't it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are not the bounds of existence?
I assume you are referring to the invisible immaterial extrauniversal
extratemporal monkey that's sitting on your monitor right now, correct?
Incorrect. Simply to what are and are not the bounds of existence.
^^^^^^^^^^^
Incorrect.
?
You were actually stating what you thought were *not* the
bounds of existence.
Approximately correct.
By all means enlighten me as what *are* the bounds of existence that you
stated.
---
John Hattan Grand High UberPope - First Church of Shatnerology
john@thecodezone.com http://www.shatnerology.com
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| User: "Jeff Young" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
09 Oct 2003 09:08:36 AM |
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John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<rag8ovs84rgt2f3vfuav82lnu657cik27j@4ax.com>...
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<h4h6ovo9makqrhdku3i5vjjtkseb8d1ai9@4ax.com>...
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com> wrote in message news:<ai53ov45nb1o0u1ldbquifioqlunid75vo@4ax.com>...
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:<med0ovgbb8p6fqo2shef94b2d92hd3td0i@4ax.com>...
In alt.atheism on Sun, 05 Oct 2003 12:43:29 -0000, Woden
<woden@charter.net> let us all know that:
"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> wrote in
news:aXTfb.228255$R32.7353107@news2.tin.it:
Woden
CUT
How could we know? If such a creator did exist, it would exist
outside the bounds of space, time, energy and matter that make up our
universe.
Could you explain what is "outside the bounds of space, time, energy
and matter that make up our universe" ?
Thank you boys and girls and ladies and gentlemen
Bye bye
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time the
universe started, how could any creator have existed within the bounds of
space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to have been created?
How could it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are the bounds of *existence*?
Why couldn't it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are not the bounds of existence?
I assume you are referring to the invisible immaterial extrauniversal
extratemporal monkey that's sitting on your monitor right now, correct?
Incorrect. Simply to what are and are not the bounds of existence.
^^^^^^^^^^^
Incorrect.
?
You were actually stating what you thought were *not* the
bounds of existence.
Approximately correct.
Chlorine.
Fluorine.
Jeff
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| User: "stoney" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
06 Oct 2003 08:39:06 PM |
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On Mon, 06 Oct 2003 11:21:25 -0500, John Hattan <john@thecodezone.com>,
Message ID: <ai53ov45nb1o0u1ldbquifioqlunid75vo@4ax.com> wrote in
alt.atheism;
jientho@aol.com (Jeff Young) wrote:
Don Kresch <ROT13.qxerfpu@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message news:<med0ovgbb8p6fqo2shef94b2d92hd3td0i@4ax.com>...
In alt.atheism on Sun, 05 Oct 2003 12:43:29 -0000, Woden
<woden@charter.net> let us all know that:
"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> wrote in
news:aXTfb.228255$R32.7353107@news2.tin.it:
Woden
CUT
How could we know? If such a creator did exist, it would exist
outside the bounds of space, time, energy and matter that make up our
universe.
Could you explain what is "outside the bounds of space, time, energy
and matter that make up our universe" ?
Thank you boys and girls and ladies and gentlemen
Bye bye
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time the
universe started, how could any creator have existed within the bounds of
space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to have been created?
How could it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are the bounds of *existence*?
Why couldn't it have existed outside of those bounds, since those
bounds are not the bounds of existence?
I assume you are referring to the invisible immaterial extrauniversal
extratemporal monkey that's sitting on your monitor right now, correct?
.....that's covering him in waste products.
Stoney
"Designated Rascal and Rapscallion
and
SCAMPERMEISTER!"
When in doubt, SCAMPER about!
When things are fair, SCAMPER everywhere!
When things are rough, can't SCAMPER enough!
/end humour alert
alt.atheism military veteran #11
{so much for the 'no atheists in foxholes' rubbish}
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| User: "Dio" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
05 Oct 2003 08:28:33 AM |
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Woden ha scritto nel messaggio ...
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time the
universe started, how could any creator have existed within the bounds of
space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to have been created?
Would you mind to tell me what is this theory that suppose a creator before
big bang?
Thank you
Bye bye
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| User: "Woden" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
05 Oct 2003 12:52:16 PM |
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"Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> wrote in
news:50Vfb.228654$R32.7368780@news2.tin.it:
Woden ha scritto nel messaggio ...
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time
the universe started, how could any creator have existed within the
bounds of space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to
have been created?
Would you mind to tell me what is this theory that suppose a creator
before big bang?
I know of no theory that supposes any creator. Only the fairy tales of
ancient religions.
--
Woden
"religion is a socio-political institution for the control of
people's thoughts, lives, and actions; based on
ancient myths and superstitions perpetrated through
generations of subtle yet pervasive brainwashing."
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| User: "Douglas Berry" |
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| Title: Re: Has our universe a cause? |
05 Oct 2003 02:53:09 PM |
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Lo, many moons past, on Sun, 05 Oct 2003 13:28:33 GMT, a stranger
called by some "Dio" <dadaismo@tin.it> came forth and told this tale
in alt.atheism
Woden ha scritto nel messaggio ...
Well, since space, time, energy, and matter formed/started at the time the
universe started, how could any creator have existed within the bounds of
space, time, energy, and matter and still caused them to have been created?
Would you mind to tell me what is this theory that suppose a creator before
big bang?
How in the name of Jerry Gracia is this supposed being supposed to
form the intent, and perform the act of creation if it does not exist?
And of course, the question immediately comes up "where did this
creator come from?"
--
Douglas Berry Do the OBVIOUS thing to send e-mail
Atheist #2147, Atheist Vet #5
Ezekiel 13:20 "Wherefore thus saith the
Lord GOD; Behold, I am against your pillows"
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