"quibbler" <quibbler247@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1efa5ea23e8d32c7989a32@news.readfreenews.net...

It's summer so I decided that I'd take a poetry class through continuing
ed, just for fun. At least three or four people in the class seems
strongly religious and bring up god and religion in their poems on a
regular basis. So I responded in kind by putting atheist themes into my
poems.

Now, all of a sudden, people are coping this attitude with me. One
person insisted that she was "offended" by the atheistic theme of one of
my poems. Let's see, if she's offended by my expression of atheism, has
it it really not occurred to she that I could equally take offense at her
expression of theism? I wonder if she can even spell double standard.
And her poems really fucking suck too. But that's a different issue.

Another woman, who has written two poems about ID creationism, claimed
that my poem mocking creationism "made her feel uncomfortable" and that,
"this is supposed to be a poetry class, not a biology class". Oh, that's
a good one. But (1) it's pretty obvious that in a poetry writing class,
we can still write on any topic we wish and (2) she's the one who
repeatedly brought up creationism in the first place. Besides,
creationism is pseudoscience, not biology.

Then there's this one theist dumbass who wrote his first about going to
prison. In his second poem, a four line piece of *****, he said that in
his final hour he would say a prayer that would take away all his fears.
Since we have to discuss the poems and I'm trying to give the guy
feedback, I decided to see if he could be more specific and asked him,
"What kind of prayer did you have in mind that would take away all your
mortal fears?" The stupid ***** got all defensive and came back with
the moronic rejoinder, "I don't know because I haven't died yet <hee
hee>". Well gee, if that's the case then he doesn't know what the *****
he will or won't do "in his final hour", since it hasn't happened yet
either. I was like, "Dude, I'm just trying to get you put in a detail
like 'The Lord's Prayer'. Chill the ***** out." I weep for the trees
that have to die, so that this theist moron can scribble a few lines of
nonsense on them and inaccurately label it a "poem".

And then there's this slutty chick who is always writing about how she
would be in hell if god hadn't "shown her the way". Gee, if god's so
great, why did he make hell in the first place? He's only allegedly
offering to rescue you from the peril that he created, and he does it
based upon whether you kiss his *****, rather than whether you deserve the
punishment.
Maybe her ***** does belong in hell, in which case god is being unjust by
not putting here there. Of course, they try to paint it as gawd being
"merciful". But how merciful is it to the victims to let a serial killer
go unpunished because he claims to convert to xianity?

The funniest thing about this last chick was that on the first day of
class I showed up with a few poems. She stared over at my papers and
said, "What are those?". "Poems", I told her. "But we didn't have an
assignment yet," she said. Of course not, class hadn't even started. "I
wrote them for fun", I offer helpfully. And I swear to the non-existent
being, her jaw visibly dropped and she blurted out, "You mean you
actually write for FUN!" It wasn't what I'd call a good omen for the
class. But, over all, I've enjoyed it thus far and find annoying the
xians to be a very entertaining bonus. The double standard these folks
use is particularly fun to point out.


--
Quibbler (quibbler247atyahoo.com)
"It is fashionable to wax apocalyptic about the
threat to humanity posed by the AIDS virus, 'mad cow'
disease, and many others, but I think a case can be
made that faith is one of the world's great evils,
comparable to the smallpox virus but harder to
eradicate." -- Richard Dawkins

Christians have somehow copped an attitude that they are 'good' and that
anyone who disagrees with them, at least in principle, are less 'good' than
they are. It's an elitist attitude. They are self-assured that 'God' exists,
so they are equally self-assured that 'Intelligent Design' *has* to be the
way to go. Who cares what the 'real' scientists have to say about all that.
The arrogant dodo heads.

And then there comes that 'sensitivity' that were supposed to bend over
backwards not to 'offend'. But just give em' half a chance and see just how
demeaning they can get when it comes to atheists and atheism. Wow! They
could care less about *our* thoughtful disbelief and 'sensitive' natures.

I must confess that I should stop right here. Due to the way I am being
treated by 'Christians' out here at the present time, my ever increasing
hatred of Christians may possibly cloud my mind to the point that I may say
things that are a bit 'over the top'. But as it stands I absolutely hate
them and am finding it harder and harder to say anything nice about em'. The
sadistic fucks! The *hypocritical* and immoral sadistic fucks! ***** on the
ignorant bastards! What sick fucks they truly are.

Greywolf

"quibbler" <quibbler247@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1efa5ea23e8d32c7989a32@news.readfreenews.net...

It's summer so I decided that I'd take a poetry class through continuing
ed, just for fun. At least three or four people in the class seems
strongly religious and bring up god and religion in their poems on a
regular basis. So I responded in kind by putting atheist themes into my
poems.

Now, all of a sudden, people are coping this attitude with me. One
person insisted that she was "offended" by the atheistic theme of one of
my poems. Let's see, if she's offended by my expression of atheism, has
it it really not occurred to she that I could equally take offense at her
expression of theism? I wonder if she can even spell double standard.
And her poems really fucking suck too. But that's a different issue.

Another woman, who has written two poems about ID creationism, claimed
that my poem mocking creationism "made her feel uncomfortable" and that,
"this is supposed to be a poetry class, not a biology class". Oh, that's
a good one. But (1) it's pretty obvious that in a poetry writing class,
we can still write on any topic we wish and (2) she's the one who
repeatedly brought up creationism in the first place. Besides,
creationism is pseudoscience, not biology.

Then there's this one theist dumbass who wrote his first about going to
prison. In his second poem, a four line piece of *****, he said that in
his final hour he would say a prayer that would take away all his fears.
Since we have to discuss the poems and I'm trying to give the guy
feedback, I decided to see if he could be more specific and asked him,
"What kind of prayer did you have in mind that would take away all your
mortal fears?" The stupid ***** got all defensive and came back with
the moronic rejoinder, "I don't know because I haven't died yet <hee
hee>". Well gee, if that's the case then he doesn't know what the *****
he will or won't do "in his final hour", since it hasn't happened yet
either. I was like, "Dude, I'm just trying to get you put in a detail
like 'The Lord's Prayer'. Chill the ***** out." I weep for the trees
that have to die, so that this theist moron can scribble a few lines of
nonsense on them and inaccurately label it a "poem".

And then there's this slutty chick who is always writing about how she
would be in hell if god hadn't "shown her the way". Gee, if god's so
great, why did he make hell in the first place? He's only allegedly
offering to rescue you from the peril that he created, and he does it
based upon whether you kiss his *****, rather than whether you deserve the
punishment.
Maybe her ***** does belong in hell, in which case god is being unjust by
not putting here there. Of course, they try to paint it as gawd being
"merciful". But how merciful is it to the victims to let a serial killer
go unpunished because he claims to convert to xianity?

The funniest thing about this last chick was that on the first day of
class I showed up with a few poems. She stared over at my papers and
said, "What are those?". "Poems", I told her. "But we didn't have an
assignment yet," she said. Of course not, class hadn't even started. "I
wrote them for fun", I offer helpfully. And I swear to the non-existent
being, her jaw visibly dropped and she blurted out, "You mean you
actually write for FUN!" It wasn't what I'd call a good omen for the
class. But, over all, I've enjoyed it thus far and find annoying the
xians to be a very entertaining bonus. The double standard these folks
use is particularly fun to point out.


--
Quibbler (quibbler247atyahoo.com)
"It is fashionable to wax apocalyptic about the
threat to humanity posed by the AIDS virus, 'mad cow'
disease, and many others, but I think a case can be
made that faith is one of the world's great evils,
comparable to the smallpox virus but harder to
eradicate." -- Richard Dawkins

Christians have somehow copped an attitude that they are 'good' and that
anyone who disagrees with them, at least in principle, are less 'good' than
they are. It's an elitist attitude. They are self-assured that 'God' exists,
so they are equally self-assured that 'Intelligent Design' *has* to be the
way to go. Who cares what the 'real' scientists have to say about all that.
The arrogant dodo heads.

And then there comes that 'sensitivity' that were supposed to bend over
backwards not to 'offend'. But just give em' half a chance and see just how
demeaning they can get when it comes to atheists and atheism. Wow! They
could care less about *our* thoughtful disbelief and 'sensitive' natures.

I must confess that I should stop right here. Due to the way I am being
treated by 'Christians' out here at the present time, my ever increasing
hatred of Christians may possibly cloud my mind to the point that I may say
things that are a bit 'over the top'. But as it stands I absolutely hate
them and am finding it harder and harder to say anything nice about em'. The
sadistic fucks! The *hypocritical* and immoral sadistic fucks! ***** on the
ignorant bastards! What sick fucks they truly are.

Greywolf

Christians have somehow copped an attitude that they are 'good' and that
anyone who disagrees with them, at least in principle, are less 'good' than
they are.

It's an elitist attitude.

They are self-assured that 'God' exists,
so they are equally self-assured that 'Intelligent Design' *has* to be the
way to go. Who cares what the 'real' scientists have to say about all that.
The arrogant dodo heads.

I must confess that I should stop right here. Due to the way I am being
treated by 'Christians' out here at the present time, my ever increasing
hatred of Christians may possibly cloud my mind to the point that I may say
things that are a bit 'over the top'.

Ok, I'm going to post some non-religious poems that I've been writing in
the last month or so for poetry class, as I promised in a previous
thread. Most are just rhyming couplets with a little internal rhyming.
I have some more free verse, but I'll probably post that later. As I
mentioned, I do want to see if some publications would be interested in
reprinting these, so I don't want them entirely in the public domain.
If any of you all have recommendations for where I might try to get some
of them published, I'd be interested to hear it.
(BTW, I've got lots more, some in various stages of construction).

Sorry the post is so long, but I didn't want to post everything
separately.


I thought I'd start out with some shorter, simpler ones. Here's
one is called "Damn that Scam".

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Damn that fever-brained scam.
That evil artifice
That mind-control device
Known as Jesus Christ.
God and religion
Is nothing short of mental circumcision.
Pre-frontal lobe incision

Theology's a bogus apology
The defense of nonsense
How do you keep an idiot in suspense
<pause>
Its lies lack the power to convince.

The beasts known as priests
Have their brains soaked in Fraud
A professional class of liars for Gawd
Contortionists who twist their sacred Texts
Obscuring defects
And interpreting out of context
They'll manufacture any excuse
To justify divine abuse
They'll make up any lie, on the fly,
To defend holy writ.
They think it's clever.
I think it's *****.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Here is one that's just a short series
of modified Nietzsche quotes:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

"Herr Nietzsche Sprach"

'God is dead and only the ignorant weep'
Bleating like a flock of forlorn sheep.
Standing vigil for two thousand lonely years
In the vain hope their shepherd reappears.
Their simple, trusting nature being thus,
They'd worship the shadow of a corpse without a fuss.
Faith never moved a mountain o'er
Though it's made some where there were none before.
For faith means not wanting to know what's true.
Is the fruit of knowledge such a toxic brew?
A casual cajole with a lunatic's soul
Shows that faith proves nothing on the whole.
Except that convictions are a more dangerous foes of truth than lies
For they prevent competing views to rise.
Mr. Nietzsche had a potent flair
To see through a matter and to lay the truth bare.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


This is a longer one that talks about theocratic republicanism and the
way that their professed political agendas often completely
contradiction the teachings of xianity. It's a somewhat long one (over
500 words with around 100 rhymes in it).


++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Je$u$ Wants a Tax Cut

Jesus wants a tax cut.
Ma friends, can I hear an Amen!
And if we raise the minimum wage,
It would crucify Him all over again.
Yes, Jesus wants a tax cut
For every millionaire
Of the poor and the lame
'Tis a terrible shame
Now let's bow our heads, and pretend to care.

Here I thought that He taught
A camel could more easily ply
The passage through a needle's eye
Than for the rich to beg or buy
A little piece of that heavenly pie.
(Then again, perhaps they can wheedle
Tiny camels or giant needles)

Now don't get me wrong.
As I've followed along
Your salvation sounds reasonably priced.
But from my perspective,
While it seems effective,
The God that you worship is Mammon, not Christ.

Onward Xian Soldiers, fighting for the God of high-priced oil
Make no mistake as they ride terror's wake.
Their virtue is theft over honest toil.
And if Gentle Jebus demands
That you die in the sand
Your cheerful compliance to his command,
Earns you a ticket to the Promised Land.

Your sacraments, are dollars and cents
See how "In God We Trust" encrusts all our money, by accident.
And, which God would that Be,
Enshrined on the altar of our Currency?
To whom shall we render
All that's legal and tender?
How much will real estate be worth,
When the meek finally do inherit the Earth?
And when did the bible decree,
"Buy tawdry wares in remembrance of Me"?
Is red and green ink the wine we must drink
When we imbibe the blood of this Lord?
Does it wash clean our debts
Or is it just a safe bet
That seems easy enough to afford.

Preachers may play the game
of trying to claim
I must hate Jesus
Because I label theo-crazy egregious
I'd just rather not let you breed confusion
Between the bible and the constitution
Despite facile semantic tricks,
It's clear that church and state don't mix
The First Amendment says that religion's our own decision,
While the First Commandment locks our choice in mental prison
We're free to preach the bible or slam it
Before you were, I am, Goddamnit
Yes, I can take his name in vain
And work on Sabbath or abstain
And no my rights don't come from Gawd.
There's no freedom behind a church facade

And speaking of vanity
Let's end this Christ-insanity
Of leaders claiming to speak for god.
Can't we all agree that's a sign of illness or fraud?
Even Jesus said beware
Of hypo-christians who love to pray in the public square.
They say "gawd bless America" all the time.
Did she sneeze? Oh please, for want of rhyme.
And yet the thing I find most sublime
Is that I'm free to think and speak my mind
Without things theological intertwined.
We still live in a land that's supposed to be free,
So even if we can't always agree
We should still reject fundamentalist hegemony.
Demand your release
From the thought police
And seek your "truths" in quiet peace.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Here's another one called "Givin' 'Em Hell".
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
"Givin' 'em Hell"

I've read the morbid tales of hell.
That horrendous, sordid jail.
That scorched torture chamber, of sadistic blackmail.
Of infinite cruelty for finite crimes,
To even conceive it most surely begrimes
The person proposing this state of affairs.
No offense could merit those endless nightmares.
Even Saddam Hussein would turn up his nose
At the types of torments you Christians propose.
The idea that it could be even remotely fair
For a single misdeed to send you there
Is depravity beyond compare.
How could your God of "LOVE" not care?

He'd burn Hitler along with unbaptized kids?
Is there nothing his moral code forbids?
If he made hell then he should burn in it.
It's the worst crime of all time
Ain't no polite way to spin it.
The only difference between God and the Devil
Seems to Be the relative power level.
Arrogant, petty and forever ready
To include humans in their bitter feud.
Like parent who without remorse
Manipulate their children in a messy divorce.

I don't want to hear your crap any more.
So step outside and settle the score.
And don't let your ***** get hit by the door.
I'm disgusted with the whole damn thing.
All the chaos that religions bring.
So much so that I no longer care.
For I'm not a child that you can scare,
With your fire and brimstone, don't even dare.
Your biblical bogeymen don't have a prayer.
And if there's an afterlife, the way I will prepare
Is doing the best that I'm aware.

Frankly, I think it's all in your head.
How could there be life when you're already dead?
I haven't got it all figured out,
But I find I have more faith in doubt,
Than I ever derived by being devout.

I see Gawd as a product that was thought up
By lying scribes and priests to bribe and fleece
The wooly tribes of gullible sheep who cringe and weep,
And seek salvation on the cheap.
You think Pastor Toddlerboff even gives a bleep?
The Church's concern is to earn a return
On the ill-gotten gains that it still retains.
So, no, I don't think they have a clue
What Jesus would or would not do.
I don't believe I came into this world in sin
Or inherited the guilt of other men.
I don't feel a need to be forgiven
When my only mortal sin is livin'.
The only way that I know how
And if that gores a sacred cow
I hope you're hungry for some hamburgers now.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Here are a few more:
This is one about so-called "intelligent design". It's called "Blindly
Designed".
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Blindly Designed

If we were designed,
Our watchmaker was blind
And he doesn't strike me as particularly kind.
Sometimes I suspect He was out of his mind.
Did He really think
That we should eat and drink
Through the same hardware
That we use for air?
Why not just use separate pipes?
Surely that would reduce our gripes.
Of course it would be slightly more complex
But isn't that what an ID creationist expects?
And it really would be quite minor
For a lofty intelligent designer.
And as a bonus, I have a hunch
That in a time crunch
We could start saying Grace
Whilst swallowing lunch.

Of course there is a darker side as well
All those diseases He designed aren't so super swell
And I suspect they're none to popular with his clientele
In the end, I'm afraid we must invariably conclude
That our intelligent designer has a rotten attitude

Perhaps His own design could use refinement
His moral compass seems to need some realignment
So let's send Him back wherever He was made
And see if we can get the next upgrade
This one has a God-complex, it seems
Forever taking things to their extremes.
P.S. we'd also like some modern dialects
The King James Version has a tendency to perplex.

Then again, perhaps a design
That would be more benign
Would be one we let Nature define
Without the massive ego of a God
That had no need for humans to applaud
It would go relatively slow, I know
But given time, it still will grow
And form us free of charge
Yes, radically free and livin' large
Immersed in an amazingly diverse
Sprawling, enthralling material universe

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Here's a slightly more detailed one about "intelligent design"

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
ID Idiocy

Intelligent Design Theory is none of those labels.
ID idiocy is a modern day fable
That seeks to enable pseudo-science
Through an unholy alliance
With political correctness and blind biblical compliance.

Instead of saying storks bring babies, Intelligent Stork Theory says the
source
(of course) Is a super-smart but invisible, bird-like force
That guides infants along an aerial course
It flies unseen to the ob-gyn
And drops the kid into the hands of the delivering physician.
We could make up excuses all day long
To explain why this "alternative" theory is never wrong.
But why would people supply
A steady stream of obvious lies
And try to deny the objective facts
Unless they thought their religion was under scientific attack?

ID is the fallacy that really complex things must be engineered.
That result seems more than a little weird.
For, with all due respect, your god-shaped "designer" is super complex
Do you think He just magically appeared?
Hey, maybe He evolved=3F
I guess that would get the problem solved.

Let's look at the implications of design.
Take the fused vertebrae at the base of our spine.
Why make it from multiple bones
When you could have used a single alone?

And are you saying that diseases were intelligently made
To kill and invade, disperse and pervade
Is bio-warfare your stock in trade?
Ah yes, what a gift, if you get my drift.
I hope the rest of creation won't get miffed

Do you think a complex river was designed to wobble and wind?
An aqueduct is simpler, yet more refined.
It has smoother surfaces and is better aligned.
Yet the complex system is the one that one finds
All over nature in myriad kinds.

I have a designer, it's called my genes
And no, they're not made on Calvin Klein's sewing machines
Life's no accident, I agree.
It's no accident that my genes made me.
They got their direction from natural selection.
Through ample mutations and larger aberrations
Species diverge and new features emerge.
It's no accident that chemicals combine.
But physics is the guide, not the divine.

The accident is not life, but what exactly arose.
For my life could have been quite different, I suppose.
What if my grandparents never got together.
It's like trying to predict the weather,
Fifty years in advance.
Of course there will be elements of chance.
But that doesn't mean that doesn't mean that evolution is but a role of
the dice,
For everything in nature has its price.
It's no accident what lives and what expires.
The best adaptation flourish as nature requires.

God may not play dice, but the dice can play god.
To puncture this illusion may seem impious and odd.
But a few generations of bacterial breeding
Can conquer a medicine that before was succeeding.

You've probably heard of the butterfly effect.
A tiny nudge can completely redirect
And change or rearrange, leading events astray.
In Chaos Theory order arises spontaneously.

There are no accidents, so some claim
But no two things in life are precisely the same.
Variation is the name of the game.

If there is a God there should be no accidents
So who are you really trying to convince?
(Yourself perhaps)

I love how creationists constantly spout.
About how they've got it all figured out.
What an amazing lack of humility
And overestimate of their own ability.
To tell me you know that every Atom (and Eve)
In the intricate weave
Of this vast universe was purposely designed
Is megalomania, classically defined.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
This one's fairly self explanatory and is called "Santa Claus Again"
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Santa Claus Again

Could you believe in Santa Claus again?
Like you did before you were ten.
Or the Easter Bunny
Or the Tooth Fairy
And what about the Virgin Mary
Hey! Wait a minute! That isn't fair!
Or so a pious clique of grown up kids declare

The point is there's no way to just flip a switch
And believe again without a hitch
I don't think I ever could
Not that I'd want to
Or think that I should

Percy Shelley pointed out
That you can't just will away your doubt
You're either persuaded or you're not
Your true convictions can't be bought

And surely, as William James proclaims
You can't fool God about your views
Or use Pascal's Wager as a ruse
Believing only because it let
You get to heaven on a bet

No, one surely needs something more
Like a booming voice from heaven, as in the days of yore
Or miracles and magic galore
Or ten million dollars in my Swiss bank account
Surely such a large amount
Would be too much evidence to discount

Seriously though, with all due respect
What would it take to get you to reject
Your own favorite creeds
Would even a trip in a time machine succeed?

So if I may suggest
It really may be best
To let people believe at their behest

And perhaps most importantly
Don't ring my fucking doorbell and preach to me.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Finally, this last short poem is a wee bit of what I call "Coz", short
for "Cosmology"
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Each Piece in Turn

You're a piece of the universe come alive
To walk around, to think, to strive
That's the thing that matters, not your deeds
Or the precise span of time that your life proceeds

Of course most folks refuse to see it that way
They think it must be consumed, like some dinner buffet
And that life only matters if they gain fame or "succeed"
Or cling to the precepts of some made up creed

In vain, I try to tell them it won't matter in the end
All the ways we preen and how furiously we pretend
For whatever the case, one day we will adjourn
And another piece will get its turn.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

On Wed, 14 Jun 2006 18:58:43 -0600, quibbler wrote:

It's summer so I decided that I'd take a poetry class through continuing
ed, just for fun. At least three or four people in the class seems
strongly religious and bring up god and religion in their poems on a
regular basis. So I responded in kind by putting atheist themes into my
poems.

Sounds like you will have an opportunity to do a little educating about
atheism. It should be fun.

--
MarkA
(still caught in the maze of twisty little passages, all different)