| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Jason Spaceman" |
| Date: |
17 Jul 2006 06:06:43 PM |
| Object: |
In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing 58 counts of
federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to answer 58
federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in employee-related taxes.
Hovind?s wife, Jo Hovind, is a co-defendant in 44 of the charges.
------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.pensacolanewsjournal.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060717/NEWS01/60717021
or http://tinyurl.com/ktmo6
J. Spaceman
--
My email address (notreally@jspaceman.homelinux.org) is fake. Email sent to it
will only get caught in my spam tarpit.
.
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| User: "wbarwell" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
17 Jul 2006 10:52:05 PM |
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Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing 58
counts of federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to
answer 58 federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in
employee-related taxes.
Don't tell me Jerko is into claiming federal income taxes
are optional, not mandated. Is he a tax avoider?
--
"Laughter is not a sin intrinsically, but it produces sin"
"Homilies - Adversus ebriosos et de resurrectione domini
nostri Jesu" - St. John Chrysostom
.
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| User: "johac" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
18 Jul 2006 01:28:15 AM |
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In article <12bomn35alas163@corp.supernews.com>,
wbarwell <wbarwell@mylinuxisp.com> wrote:
Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing 58
counts of federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to
answer 58 federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in
employee-related taxes.
Don't tell me Jerko is into claiming federal income taxes
are optional, not mandated. Is he a tax avoider?
From article:
"Hovind has said he is employed by God and has no income."
Sure.
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
Contact - Throw a .net over the .com
.
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| User: "Earle Jones" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
23 Jul 2006 06:49:50 PM |
|
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In article <jhachmann-0A70E4.23281517072006@news.giganews.com>,
johac <jhachmann@sbcglobal.com> wrote:
In article <12bomn35alas163@corp.supernews.com>,
wbarwell <wbarwell@mylinuxisp.com> wrote:
Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing 58
counts of federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to
answer 58 federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in
employee-related taxes.
Don't tell me Jerko is into claiming federal income taxes
are optional, not mandated. Is he a tax avoider?
From article:
"Hovind has said he is employed by God and has no income."
*
Then God should be arrested for breaking the minimum-wage law.
earle
*
.
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| User: "wbarwell" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
18 Jul 2006 08:05:47 AM |
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johac wrote:
In article <12bomn35alas163@corp.supernews.com>,
wbarwell <wbarwell@mylinuxisp.com> wrote:
Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing 58
counts of federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to
answer 58 federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in
employee-related taxes.
Don't tell me Jerko is into claiming federal income taxes
are optional, not mandated. Is he a tax avoider?
From article:
"Hovind has said he is employed by God and has no income."
Sure.
One then wonders, if he is not as mandated, withholding
taxes from his employees and if they are also tax avoiders
and legally facing problems created by this fool.
Long ago, I had an acquaintance who got into this
tax avoidance nonsense and the excuses he was prepared
to offer in court were slapped down in 5 minutes.
It took years for him to dig out from the fines, court costs,
IRS penalties and so on. The way this works in court is,
they are mandated to enforce the laws. Silly claims are
slapped down summarily and you are told, don't like it, appeal.
Appeals courts always side with the lower courts and never
accept the lame excuses. Appeal denied. Stepping into this
is sure failure, Hovind is doomed, I wonder if he has dragged
other people down with him?
--
"Laughter is not a sin intrinsically, but it produces sin"
"Homilies - Adversus ebriosos et de resurrectione domini
nostri Jesu" - St. John Chrysostom
.
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| User: "johac" |
|
| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
18 Jul 2006 11:49:24 PM |
|
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In article <12bpn58u99dgc5@corp.supernews.com>,
wbarwell <wbarwell@mylinuxisp.com> wrote:
johac wrote:
In article <12bomn35alas163@corp.supernews.com>,
wbarwell <wbarwell@mylinuxisp.com> wrote:
Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing 58
counts of federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to
answer 58 federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in
employee-related taxes.
Don't tell me Jerko is into claiming federal income taxes
are optional, not mandated. Is he a tax avoider?
From article:
"Hovind has said he is employed by God and has no income."
Sure.
One then wonders, if he is not as mandated, withholding
taxes from his employees and if they are also tax avoiders
and legally facing problems created by this fool.
Long ago, I had an acquaintance who got into this
tax avoidance nonsense and the excuses he was prepared
to offer in court were slapped down in 5 minutes.
It took years for him to dig out from the fines, court costs,
IRS penalties and so on. The way this works in court is,
they are mandated to enforce the laws. Silly claims are
slapped down summarily and you are told, don't like it, appeal.
Appeals courts always side with the lower courts and never
accept the lame excuses. Appeal denied. Stepping into this
is sure failure, Hovind is doomed, I wonder if he has dragged
other people down with him?
Don't mess with the IRS. Not that I have much sympathy for his
followers, but I wonder how many wide eyed innocents were dragged in
because they trusted 'Dr. Dino'?
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
Contact - Throw a .net over the .com
.
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| User: "wbarwell" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
19 Jul 2006 02:05:44 AM |
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johac wrote:
In article <12bpn58u99dgc5@corp.supernews.com>,
wbarwell <wbarwell@mylinuxisp.com> wrote:
johac wrote:
In article <12bomn35alas163@corp.supernews.com>,
wbarwell <wbarwell@mylinuxisp.com> wrote:
Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing
58 counts of federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to
answer 58 federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in
employee-related taxes.
Don't tell me Jerko is into claiming federal income taxes
are optional, not mandated. Is he a tax avoider?
From article:
"Hovind has said he is employed by God and has no income."
Sure.
One then wonders, if he is not as mandated, withholding
taxes from his employees and if they are also tax avoiders
and legally facing problems created by this fool.
Long ago, I had an acquaintance who got into this
tax avoidance nonsense and the excuses he was prepared
to offer in court were slapped down in 5 minutes.
It took years for him to dig out from the fines, court costs,
IRS penalties and so on. The way this works in court is,
they are mandated to enforce the laws. Silly claims are
slapped down summarily and you are told, don't like it, appeal.
Appeals courts always side with the lower courts and never
accept the lame excuses. Appeal denied. Stepping into this
is sure failure, Hovind is doomed, I wonder if he has dragged
other people down with him?
Don't mess with the IRS. Not that I have much sympathy for his
followers, but I wonder how many wide eyed innocents were dragged in
because they trusted 'Dr. Dino'?
Its not the IRS you have to worry about, its the courts.
Then once all appeals are done then you get to worry about
the IRS.
If you are a ringleader, and Hovind may be, its go to jail
court stuff you have to worry about.
The IRS will be waiting when you get out.
--
"Laughter is not a sin intrinsically, but it produces sin"
"Homilies - Adversus ebriosos et de resurrectione domini
nostri Jesu" - St. John Chrysostom
.
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| User: "johac" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
19 Jul 2006 11:52:54 PM |
|
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In article <12brmdt8cgf0a8e@corp.supernews.com>,
wbarwell <wbarwell@mylinuxisp.com> wrote:
johac wrote:
In article <12bpn58u99dgc5@corp.supernews.com>,
wbarwell <wbarwell@mylinuxisp.com> wrote:
johac wrote:
In article <12bomn35alas163@corp.supernews.com>,
wbarwell <wbarwell@mylinuxisp.com> wrote:
Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing
58 counts of federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to
answer 58 federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in
employee-related taxes.
Don't tell me Jerko is into claiming federal income taxes
are optional, not mandated. Is he a tax avoider?
From article:
"Hovind has said he is employed by God and has no income."
Sure.
One then wonders, if he is not as mandated, withholding
taxes from his employees and if they are also tax avoiders
and legally facing problems created by this fool.
Long ago, I had an acquaintance who got into this
tax avoidance nonsense and the excuses he was prepared
to offer in court were slapped down in 5 minutes.
It took years for him to dig out from the fines, court costs,
IRS penalties and so on. The way this works in court is,
they are mandated to enforce the laws. Silly claims are
slapped down summarily and you are told, don't like it, appeal.
Appeals courts always side with the lower courts and never
accept the lame excuses. Appeal denied. Stepping into this
is sure failure, Hovind is doomed, I wonder if he has dragged
other people down with him?
Don't mess with the IRS. Not that I have much sympathy for his
followers, but I wonder how many wide eyed innocents were dragged in
because they trusted 'Dr. Dino'?
Its not the IRS you have to worry about, its the courts.
Then once all appeals are done then you get to worry about
the IRS.
I see. The courts cook your goose and the IRS dines on it.
If you are a ringleader, and Hovind may be, its go to jail
court stuff you have to worry about.
The IRS will be waiting when you get out.
If he did con his followers into making false claims, he deserves jail
time. A lot of it.
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
Contact - Throw a .net over the .com
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
19 Jul 2006 03:42:53 PM |
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wbarwell wrote:
johac wrote:
In article <12bomn35alas163@corp.supernews.com>,
wbarwell <wbarwell@mylinuxisp.com> wrote:
Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing 58
counts of federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to
answer 58 federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in
employee-related taxes.
Don't tell me Jerko is into claiming federal income taxes
are optional, not mandated. Is he a tax avoider?
From article:
"Hovind has said he is employed by God and has no income."
Sure.
One then wonders, if he is not as mandated, withholding
taxes from his employees and if they are also tax avoiders
and legally facing problems created by this fool.
Long ago, I had an acquaintance who got into this
tax avoidance nonsense and the excuses he was prepared
to offer in court were slapped down in 5 minutes.
It took years for him to dig out from the fines, court costs,
IRS penalties and so on. The way this works in court is,
they are mandated to enforce the laws. Silly claims are
slapped down summarily and you are told, don't like it, appeal.
Appeals courts always side with the lower courts and never
accept the lame excuses. Appeal denied. Stepping into this
is sure failure, Hovind is doomed, I wonder if he has dragged
other people down with him?
Here's a list of "destroyed arguments" by an anti-federal-government
lawyer: http://home.hiwaay.net/~becraft/deadissues.htm. Sort of like
AiG's list of arguments creationists should not use
(http://www.answersingenesis.org/home/area/faq/dont_use.asp)
--
"Laughter is not a sin intrinsically, but it produces sin"
"Homilies - Adversus ebriosos et de resurrectione domini
nostri Jesu" - St. John Chrysostom
.
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| User: "Rev Dr Lenny Flank" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
18 Jul 2006 07:18:36 AM |
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wbarwell wrote:
Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing 58
counts of federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to
answer 58 federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in
employee-related taxes.
Don't tell me Jerko is into claiming federal income taxes
are optional, not mandated. Is he a tax avoider?
Yep. He has loony "patriot militia" connections right up to his
eyebrows. A la Timothy McVeigh.
================================================
Lenny Flank
"There are no loose threads in the web of life"
Creation "Science" Debunked:
http://www.geocities.com/lflank
DebunkCreation email list:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DebunkCreation/
.
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| User: "Desertphile" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
19 Jul 2006 03:36:21 PM |
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wbarwell wrote:
Jason Spaceman wrote:
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to
answer 58 federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in
employee-related taxes.
Don't tell me Jerko is into claiming federal income taxes
are optional, not mandated. Is he a tax avoider?
Naw. He claims he does not have any money, doesn't own any property,
and makes no income. He claims his gods own the property (and therefore
his gods should pay the taxes, I suppose). This is hardly the first
time a Fundamentalist Christian "rolled over" and betrayed his gods to
try to save his own hide. "God did it! God is the crook!"
.
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| User: "Ernest Major" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
19 Jul 2006 03:55:51 PM |
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In message <1153341381.167651.52540@s13g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
Desertphile <desertphile@hotmail.com> writes
wbarwell wrote:
Jason Spaceman wrote:
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to
answer 58 federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in
employee-related taxes.
Don't tell me Jerko is into claiming federal income taxes
are optional, not mandated. Is he a tax avoider?
Naw. He claims he does not have any money, doesn't own any property,
and makes no income. He claims his gods own the property (and therefore
his gods should pay the taxes, I suppose). This is hardly the first
time a Fundamentalist Christian "rolled over" and betrayed his gods to
try to save his own hide. "God did it! God is the crook!"
I suppose one could ask him, why, as God's business manager in respect
of these properties and businesses, he hasn't paid due taxes on God's
behalf.
--
aiias Ernest Major
--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.1/389 - Release Date: 14/07/2006
.
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| User: "Desertphile" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
19 Jul 2006 03:27:12 PM |
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Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing 58 counts of
federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to answer 58
federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in employee-related taxes.
Hovind's wife, Jo Hovind, is a co-defendant in 44 of the charges.
"The Fruits of Creationism."
I bet Rev Hovind insists at his trial that he *STILL* does not know
what he is being charged with and why.
.
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| User: "AC" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
27 Jul 2006 12:24:45 AM |
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On Wed, 19 Jul 2006 17:32:15 -0500,
bullpup <bullpup@bellsouth.net> wrote:
"Desertphile" <desertphile@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1153340832.234857.277300@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing 58
counts of
federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to
answer 58
federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in employee-related
taxes.
Hovind's wife, Jo Hovind, is a co-defendant in 44 of the charges.
"The Fruits of Creationism."
I bet Rev Hovind insists at his trial that he *STILL* does not know
what he is being charged with and why.
He might be able to convince the judge he's a "clinical moron", but I doubt
it.
Oh, I dunno. He's got me convinced!
--
Aaron Clausen
mightymartianca@gmail.com
.
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| User: "wf3h" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
17 Jul 2006 06:57:43 PM |
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Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing 58 counts of
federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to answer 58
federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in employee-related taxes.
Hovind?s wife, Jo Hovind, is a co-defendant in 44 of the charges.
wonder how long it's gonna be before the christianist fanatics starting
screaming "PERSECUTION" even though the govt is dominated by
fundamentalists...
.
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| User: "Rev Dr Lenny Flank" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
17 Jul 2006 07:12:33 PM |
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Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing 58 counts of
federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to answer 58
federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in employee-related taxes.
Hovind?s wife, Jo Hovind, is a co-defendant in 44 of the charges.
------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.pensacolanewsjournal.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060717/NEWS01/60717021
or http://tinyurl.com/ktmo6
Maybe the Thomas More Law Center will offer to give him a world-class
defense.
For free.
(snicker) (giggle)
================================================
Lenny Flank
"There are no loose threads in the web of life"
Creation "Science" Debunked:
http://www.geocities.com/lflank
DebunkCreation email list:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DebunkCreation/
.
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| User: "Dr.GH" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
17 Jul 2006 06:40:02 PM |
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Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing 58 counts of
federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to answer 58
federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in employee-related taxes.
Hovind?s wife, Jo Hovind, is a co-defendant in 44 of the charges.
------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.pensacolanewsjournal.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060717/NEWS01/60717021
or http://tinyurl.com/ktmo6
So, Hovind is restricted to that jurisdiction until September??? That
would be cool.
.
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| User: "A.Carlson" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
17 Jul 2006 07:12:59 PM |
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On 17 Jul 2006 16:40:02 -0700, "Dr.GH" <garyhard@earthlink.net> wrote:
Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing 58 counts of
federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to answer 58
federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in employee-related taxes.
Hovind?s wife, Jo Hovind, is a co-defendant in 44 of the charges.
------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.pensacolanewsjournal.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060717/NEWS01/60717021
or http://tinyurl.com/ktmo6
So, Hovind is restricted to that jurisdiction until September??? That
would be cool.
As much as I disagree with this liar's message and methods, I wonder
if he could successfully argue that his livelihood requires him to
travel. I noticed on his website that he already has a few upcoming
play dates scheduled. Furthermore, if you were to argue that his
'lectures' are essentially sermons (I would certainly argue that - it
certainly isn't science) then there may be a free exercise issue
involved here as well.
It wouldn't surprise me if he were to go ahead and go through with his
scheduled outings and essentially 'dare' the authorities to arrest him
for spreading the word. Such an event would certainly embellish his
claim of martyrdom and further muddy the issues involved in a lot of
peoples eyes.
.
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| User: "Mike Dworetsky" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
18 Jul 2006 03:07:28 AM |
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"A.Carlson" <amcarls@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:tb9ob2dm2u4d29j1u29nk8gaqnv64e92u7@4ax.com...
On 17 Jul 2006 16:40:02 -0700, "Dr.GH" <garyhard@earthlink.net> wrote:
Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
-----------------------------------------
Dino land owner faces trial
Michael Stewart
@PensacolaNewsJournal.com
A Sept. 5 trial date has been set for a Pensacola evangelist facing 58
counts of
federal charges.
Kent Hovind will appear berfore U.S. District Court Casey Rodgers to
answer 58
federal charges, including failing to pay $473,818 in employee-related
taxes.
Hovind?s wife, Jo Hovind, is a co-defendant in 44 of the charges.
------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.pensacolanewsjournal.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060717/NEWS01/60717021
or http://tinyurl.com/ktmo6
So, Hovind is restricted to that jurisdiction until September??? That
would be cool.
As much as I disagree with this liar's message and methods, I wonder
if he could successfully argue that his livelihood requires him to
travel. I noticed on his website that he already has a few upcoming
Surely he couldn't claim that without damaging his case, since his argument
is allegedly that it is "God's income", not his.
play dates scheduled. Furthermore, if you were to argue that his
'lectures' are essentially sermons (I would certainly argue that - it
certainly isn't science) then there may be a free exercise issue
involved here as well.
It wouldn't surprise me if he were to go ahead and go through with his
scheduled outings and essentially 'dare' the authorities to arrest him
for spreading the word. Such an event would certainly embellish his
claim of martyrdom and further muddy the issues involved in a lot of
peoples eyes.
--
Mike Dworetsky
(Remove "pants" spamblock to send e-mail)
.
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| User: "Cyde Weys" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
17 Jul 2006 07:20:35 PM |
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Sayeth A.Carlson:
On 17 Jul 2006 16:40:02 -0700, "Dr.GH" <garyhard@earthlink.net> wrote:
So, Hovind is restricted to that jurisdiction until September??? That
would be cool.
As much as I disagree with this liar's message and methods, I wonder
if he could successfully argue that his livelihood requires him to
travel. I noticed on his website that he already has a few upcoming
play dates scheduled. Furthermore, if you were to argue that his
'lectures' are essentially sermons (I would certainly argue that - it
certainly isn't science) then there may be a free exercise issue
involved here as well.
It's not a free exercise issue whatsoever. When you break the law you lose
some of your freedoms, period. Hell, your argument would basically say
that we would never be able to send a priest to jail because his free
exercise to preach or whatever would be curtailed.
Committing crimes can supersede all of your "fundamental freedoms", and in
some states, even your right to live. Florida puts people to death; I
really don't think they're going to have any qualms about telling a man he
can't leave the jurisdiction while a case with FIFTY-EIGHT Federal charges
is pending.
--
~ Cyde Weys ~
Sub veste quisque nudus est.
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| User: "Dick C" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
17 Jul 2006 10:48:26 PM |
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Cyde Weys wrote in talk.origins
Sayeth A.Carlson:
On 17 Jul 2006 16:40:02 -0700, "Dr.GH" <garyhard@earthlink.net> wrote:
So, Hovind is restricted to that jurisdiction until September??? That
would be cool.
As much as I disagree with this liar's message and methods, I wonder
if he could successfully argue that his livelihood requires him to
travel. I noticed on his website that he already has a few upcoming
play dates scheduled. Furthermore, if you were to argue that his
'lectures' are essentially sermons (I would certainly argue that - it
certainly isn't science) then there may be a free exercise issue
involved here as well.
It's not a free exercise issue whatsoever. When you break the law you
lose some of your freedoms, period. Hell, your argument would basically
say that we would never be able to send a priest to jail because his
free exercise to preach or whatever would be curtailed.
Wrong. Hovind has not been found guilty of anything. He is only accused of
breaking the law. Until he is convicted in court of a felony he still has
all of his civil rights. He can vote, he can do all sorts of things. None
of his rights should be curtailed, except as a condition of gaining his
freedom.
As far as the last goes, this is 2006, not 1856 when someone could travel
2 or 300 miles and nobody would know him. Today we are able to track and
find people all over the country. If this were a city, county or state
charge requiring him to remain within the jurisdiction would make sense
as there are issues with extradition. However, since this is a federal
crime, and Hovind travels all over the country in practice of his vocation,
and since he has to post a very large bond, I see no reason to keep him
restricted to a small area. If he chooses to disappear, he can do it no
matter if he is restricted locally or nationally.
Plus, we can put gps devices on people and track their movements thus
letting us know where they are any time we need to know.
I do not see any reason to restrict him.
Committing crimes can supersede all of your "fundamental freedoms", and
in some states, even your right to live. Florida puts people to death;
I really don't think they're going to have any qualms about telling a
man he can't leave the jurisdiction while a case with FIFTY-EIGHT
Federal charges is pending.
However, being accused of a crime is not the same as being convicted of
the crime. And the charges and court have nothing to do with Florida,
except that is where the case was brought up.
--
***** #1349
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
~Benjamin Franklin
Home Page: dickcr.iwarp.com
email:
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| User: "Ferrous Patella" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
17 Jul 2006 11:40:00 PM |
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In article <Xns9803D3C4EC691dickcrcomcastnet@216.196.97.136>,
***** C <foo.dickcr@comcast.net> wrote:
Cyde Weys wrote in talk.origins
Sayeth A.Carlson:
On 17 Jul 2006 16:40:02 -0700, "Dr.GH" <garyhard@earthlink.net> wrote:
So, Hovind is restricted to that jurisdiction until September??? That
would be cool.
As much as I disagree with this liar's message and methods, I wonder
if he could successfully argue that his livelihood requires him to
travel. I noticed on his website that he already has a few upcoming
play dates scheduled. Furthermore, if you were to argue that his
'lectures' are essentially sermons (I would certainly argue that - it
certainly isn't science) then there may be a free exercise issue
involved here as well.
It's not a free exercise issue whatsoever. When you break the law you
lose some of your freedoms, period. Hell, your argument would basically
say that we would never be able to send a priest to jail because his
free exercise to preach or whatever would be curtailed.
Wrong. Hovind has not been found guilty of anything. He is only accused of
breaking the law. Until he is convicted in court of a felony he still has
all of his civil rights. He can vote, he can do all sorts of things. None
of his rights should be curtailed, except as a condition of gaining his
freedom.
As far as the last goes, this is 2006, not 1856 when someone could travel
2 or 300 miles and nobody would know him. Today we are able to track and
find people all over the country. If this were a city, county or state
charge requiring him to remain within the jurisdiction would make sense
as there are issues with extradition. However, since this is a federal
crime, and Hovind travels all over the country in practice of his vocation,
and since he has to post a very large bond, I see no reason to keep him
restricted to a small area. If he chooses to disappear, he can do it no
matter if he is restricted locally or nationally.
Plus, we can put gps devices on people and track their movements thus
letting us know where they are any time we need to know.
I do not see any reason to restrict him.
Wrong. Thee issue with his travel deals with his passport and
international travel. He claims he needs it to preach/perform/lecture in
Africa IIRC.
Committing crimes can supersede all of your "fundamental freedoms", and
in some states, even your right to live. Florida puts people to death;
I really don't think they're going to have any qualms about telling a
man he can't leave the jurisdiction while a case with FIFTY-EIGHT
Federal charges is pending.
However, being accused of a crime is not the same as being convicted of
the crime. And the charges and court have nothing to do with Florida,
except that is where the case was brought up.
--
Ferrous Patella
T.A., Philosophy Lab
University of Ediacara
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
18 Jul 2006 06:16:53 AM |
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Ferrous Patella <ferrous@comcast.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Ferrous Patella
Iron kneecap?
--
Elroy Willis
www.elroysemporium.com
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| User: "Peter Schmied" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
19 Jul 2006 08:49:19 AM |
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Elroy Willis wrote:
Ferrous Patella <ferrous@comcast.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Ferrous Patella
Iron kneecap?
I don't get it as well.
If this is meant to be a pun on "irony" alone
"Genu" would have been a better choice (com-
pared to "Patella").
(being a non-native English speaker I don't see
anything funny in "irony cap" and as other com-
ments in this thread suggest - only the "irony"
part seems to be relevant)
PS
.
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| User: "Harry F. Leopold" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
19 Jul 2006 01:54:17 PM |
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On Wed, 19 Jul 2006 08:49:19 -0500, Peter Schmied wrote
(in article <e9lek0$kpf$1@online.de>):
Elroy Willis wrote:
Ferrous Patella <ferrous@comcast.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Ferrous Patella
Iron kneecap?
I don't get it as well.
If this is meant to be a pun on "irony" alone
"Genu" would have been a better choice (com-
pared to "Patella").
(being a non-native English speaker I don't see
anything funny in "irony cap" and as other com-
ments in this thread suggest - only the "irony"
part seems to be relevant)
It could be a play on "thinking cap." At least it works for me.
--
Harry F. Leopold
aa #2076
AA/Vet #4
The Prints of Darkness
(remove gene to email)
³It's all very simple : you believe in a god, I don't. Theists first invented
the concept of god or gods, and the sceptical people said : "Huh?". It's been
downhill from there. ;-)³ - Olrik
.
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| User: "Peter Schmied" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
20 Jul 2006 03:00:11 AM |
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Harry F. Leopold wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2006 08:49:19 -0500, Peter Schmied wrote
(in article <e9lek0$kpf$1@online.de>):
Elroy Willis wrote:
Ferrous Patella <ferrous@comcast.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Ferrous Patella
Iron kneecap?
I don't get it as well.
If this is meant to be a pun on "irony" alone
"Genu" would have been a better choice (com-
pared to "Patella").
(being a non-native English speaker I don't see
anything funny in "irony cap" and as other com-
ments in this thread suggest - only the "irony"
part seems to be relevant)
It could be a play on "thinking cap." At least it works for me.
That makes sense. Thank you.
PS
.
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| User: "Harry F. Leopold" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
20 Jul 2006 10:23:45 AM |
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On Thu, 20 Jul 2006 03:00:11 -0500, Peter Schmied wrote
(in article <e9nd8h$mv6$1@online.de>):
Harry F. Leopold wrote:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2006 08:49:19 -0500, Peter Schmied wrote
(in article <e9lek0$kpf$1@online.de>):
Elroy Willis wrote:
Ferrous Patella <ferrous@comcast.net> wrote in alt.atheism
Ferrous Patella
Iron kneecap?
I don't get it as well.
If this is meant to be a pun on "irony" alone
"Genu" would have been a better choice (com-
pared to "Patella").
(being a non-native English speaker I don't see
anything funny in "irony cap" and as other com-
ments in this thread suggest - only the "irony"
part seems to be relevant)
It could be a play on "thinking cap." At least it works for me.
That makes sense. Thank you.
Yer welcome.
--
Harry F. Leopold
aa #2076
AA/Vet #4
The Prints of Darkness
(remove gene to email)
³It's all very simple : you believe in a god, I don't. Theists first invented
the concept of god or gods, and the sceptical people said : "Huh?". It's been
downhill from there. ;-)³ - Olrik
.
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
19 Jul 2006 01:01:15 PM |
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Peter Schmied wrote
Elroy Willis wrote:
Ferrous Patella wrote
Ferrous Patella
Iron kneecap?
I don't get it as well.
If this is meant to be a pun on "irony" alone
"Genu" would have been a better choice (com-
pared to "Patella").
Genu? <clickety click> Ah, the knee joint. Learned a new word
today... Genu Genu Genu...
(being a non-native English speaker I don't see
anything funny in "irony cap" and as other com-
ments in this thread suggest - only the "irony"
part seems to be relevant)
I thought maybe the guy might be a war hero when I first read the
name. Got one of his kneecaps shot off during a war and had it
replaced with an iron one, or had some iron shrapnel embedded in
one of his knees. Kinda like calling someone with shrapnel in their
butt "ironpants."
Is that ironic or what? :o)
--
Elroy Willis
www.elroysemporium.com
.
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| User: "Andrew Arensburger" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
19 Jul 2006 03:36:49 PM |
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In talk.origins Elroy Willis <elroywillis@swbell.net> wrote:
Genu? <clickety click> Ah, the knee joint. Learned a new word
today... Genu Genu Genu...
First you get down on your knees
Fiddle with your rosaries
Bow your head with great respect
And genuflect, genuflect, genuflect!
-- Tom Lehrer, "The Vatican Rag"
--
Andrew Arensburger, Systems guy University of Maryland
arensb.no-bloody-spam@umd.edu Office of Information Technology
There comes a moment in everyone's life, and I've had plenty of them.
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| User: "Andrew Arensburger" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
20 Jul 2006 11:26:00 AM |
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In talk.origins Elroy Willis <elroywillis@swbell.net> wrote:
Un homme est plus grand quand sur ses genoux.
Un hombre es mayor cuando sobre sus rodillas.
The question here is how did genu or genoux turn into rodillas
or vice versa?
I don't have a Spanish or French etymological dictionary
handy, but I suspect that "genou" and "rodilla" have different roots,
probably in Latin.
I do know that the French word for "kneecap" is "rotule",
which might be a clue.
--
Andrew Arensburger, Systems guy University of Maryland
arensb.no-bloody-spam@umd.edu Office of Information Technology
"Peut-on rire du malheur des autres? Ca dépend... Si le malheur des
autres est rigolo, oui." -- Geluck, Le Chat
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| User: "Elroy Willis" |
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| Title: Re: In the News: Hovind's trial date set |
20 Jul 2006 12:42:18 PM |
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Andrew Arensburger wrote in alt.atheism
In talk.origins Elroy Willis <elroywillis@swbell.net> wrote:
Un homme est plus grand quand sur ses genoux.
Un hombre es mayor cuando sobre sus rodillas.
The question here is how did genu or genoux turn into rodillas
or vice versa?
I don't have a Spanish or French etymological dictionary
handy, but I suspect that "genou" and "rodilla" have different roots,
probably in Latin.
I do know that the French word for "kneecap" is "rotule",
which might be a clue.
It looks like it might come from the Latin "rotula" which means a
small wheel.
--
Elroy Willis
www.elroysemporium.com
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