Religions > Atheism > Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design'
| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Jason Spaceman" |
| Date: |
03 Nov 2005 11:30:32 PM |
| Object: |
Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
From the article:
---------------------------------------
Republicans are creating legislation to have theory taught with evolution
By Mary Beth Schneider and Robert King
Indiana public schools would teach "intelligent design" along with evolution
under legislation that some Republican lawmakers are developing for the 2006
legislative session.
Intelligent design is the theory that a supernatural hand, and not just the
random process of natural selection, guided the development of life on Earth.
Recently, 36 of the 52 Republican state representatives, including House Speaker
Brian Bosma of Indianapolis, sent questionnaires to constituents asking, among
other issues, whether intelligent design should be given equal time in science
classes.
Rep. Bruce Borders, R-Jasonville, said he would file legislation mandating the
teaching of intelligent design if no other lawmaker did. "It's a passionate
issue for me, personally," Borders said.
The proposal comes a little more than a month after Bosma and a handful of other
House members met privately with Carl Baugh, host of the Trinity Broadcasting
Network show "Creationism in the 21st Century," to discuss bringing intelligent
design to public schools.
------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051103/NEWS02/511030467/1006/NEWS01
or http://tinyurl.com/8xd4o
J. Spaceman
--
My email address (notreally@jspaceman.homelinux.org) is fake. Email sent to it
will only get caught in my spam tarpit.
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| User: "Brett Aubrey" |
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| Title: Re: Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
04 Nov 2005 01:25:25 AM |
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"Jason Spaceman" <notreally@jspaceman.homelinux.org> wrote in message
news:LfqdnaZ8_6sFAPfeRVn-qg@rogers.com...
From the article:
---------------------------------------
Republicans are creating legislation to have theory taught with evolution
By Mary Beth Schneider and Robert King
Indiana public schools would teach "intelligent design" along with
evolution under legislation that some Republican lawmakers are
developing for the 2006 legislative session.
Intelligent design is the theory that a supernatural hand, and not just
the
random process of natural selection, guided the development of life on
Earth.
Ah... So now natural selection is random (sigh...).
Recently, 36 of the 52 Republican state representatives, including House
Speaker Brian Bosma of Indianapolis, sent questionnaires to constituents
asking, among other issues, whether intelligent design should be given
equal time in science classes.
Equal time? Can astrology be far behind?
Rep. Bruce Borders, R-Jasonville, said he would file legislation
mandating the teaching of intelligent design if no other lawmaker
did. "It's a passionate issue for me, personally," Borders said.
I guess he doesn't think much of the separation of church and state.
The proposal comes a little more than a month after Bosma and a
handful of other House members met privately with Carl Baugh,
host of the Trinity Broadcasting Network show "Creationism in the
21st Century," to discuss bringing intelligent design to public schools.
------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051103/NEWS02/511030467/1006/NEWS01
or http://tinyurl.com/8xd4o
J. Spaceman
--
My email address (notreally@jspaceman.homelinux.org) is fake. Email sent
to it
will only get caught in my spam tarpit.
.
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| User: "TomS" |
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| Title: Re: Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
04 Nov 2005 03:48:45 PM |
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"On Thu, 03 Nov 2005 18:30:32 -0500, in article
<LfqdnaZ8_6sFAPfeRVn-qg@rogers.com>, Jason Spaceman stated..."
From the article:
---------------------------------------
Republicans are creating legislation to have theory taught with evolution
By Mary Beth Schneider and Robert King
Indiana public schools would teach "intelligent design" along with evolution
under legislation that some Republican lawmakers are developing for the 2006
legislative session.
[...snip...]
This later story from the Indianapolis Star says that the
Republican Governor of Indiana (formerly director of the Office
of Management and Budget) is not enthusiastic about signing
such a bill, because he doesn't believe in dictating to the local
schools what they should teach.
But it may be a serious issue for the Speaker of the House
of Representatives, who will not yet commit himself as to whether
this will be a priority issue in 2006.
<http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051104/NEWS02/511040542>
--
---Tom S. <http://talkreason.org/articles/chickegg.cfm>
"It is not too much to say that every indication of Design in the Kosmos is so
much evidence against the Omnipotence of the Designer. ... The evidences ... of
Natural Theology distinctly imply that the author of the Kosmos worked under
limitations..." John Stuart Mill, "Theism", Part II
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| User: "DaveJr" |
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| Title: Re: Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
04 Nov 2005 12:33:00 AM |
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Recently, 36 of the 52 Republican state representatives, including House
Speaker
Brian Bosma of Indianapolis, sent questionnaires to constituents asking,
among
other issues, whether intelligent design should be given equal time in
science
classes.
Rep. Bruce Borders, R-Jasonville, said he would file legislation mandating
the
teaching of intelligent design if no other lawmaker did. "It's a
passionate
issue for me, personally," Borders said.
The proposal comes a little more than a month after Bosma and a handful of
other
House members met privately with Carl Baugh, host of the Trinity
Broadcasting
Network show "Creationism in the 21st Century," to discuss bringing
intelligent
design to public schools.
Perhaps we should also teach 2+2=5 in math classes. Start big mathmatics
debates. Perhaps algebra students should base thier answers on a 'hunch'
or 'gut feeling' Then we would have christian friendly formulas that might
look something like... y = 'guess'(hunch) divided by the square root of an
assumption.
Thats christian logic for ya. Have fun in science class.
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| User: "Deadrat" |
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| Title: Re: Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
04 Nov 2005 04:25:05 AM |
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"DaveJr" <davesbrain@qwest.net> wrote in message news:G0yaf.52$Gh2.1396@news.uswest.net...
Recently, 36 of the 52 Republican state representatives, including House
Speaker
Brian Bosma of Indianapolis, sent questionnaires to constituents asking,
among
other issues, whether intelligent design should be given equal time in
science
classes.
Rep. Bruce Borders, R-Jasonville, said he would file legislation mandating
the
teaching of intelligent design if no other lawmaker did. "It's a
passionate
issue for me, personally," Borders said.
The proposal comes a little more than a month after Bosma and a handful of
other
House members met privately with Carl Baugh, host of the Trinity
Broadcasting
Network show "Creationism in the 21st Century," to discuss bringing
intelligent
design to public schools.
Perhaps we should also teach 2+2=5 in math classes. Start big mathmatics
debates. Perhaps algebra students should base thier answers on a 'hunch'
or 'gut feeling' Then we would have christian friendly formulas that might
look something like... y = 'guess'(hunch) divided by the square root of an
assumption.
Indiana? Don't they have to report that pi == 3 bill out of committee first?
Deadrat
Thats christian logic for ya. Have fun in science class.
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| User: "Earle Jones" |
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| Title: Re: Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
07 Nov 2005 09:01:41 PM |
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In article <G0yaf.52$Gh2.1396@news.uswest.net>,
"DaveJr" <davesbrain@qwest.net> wrote:
Recently, 36 of the 52 Republican state representatives, including House
Speaker
Brian Bosma of Indianapolis, sent questionnaires to constituents asking,
among
other issues, whether intelligent design should be given equal time in
science
classes.
Rep. Bruce Borders, R-Jasonville, said he would file legislation mandating
the
teaching of intelligent design if no other lawmaker did. "It's a
passionate
issue for me, personally," Borders said.
The proposal comes a little more than a month after Bosma and a handful of
other
House members met privately with Carl Baugh, host of the Trinity
Broadcasting
Network show "Creationism in the 21st Century," to discuss bringing
intelligent
design to public schools.
Perhaps we should also teach 2+2=5 in math classes. Start big mathmatics
debates. Perhaps algebra students should base thier answers on a 'hunch'
or 'gut feeling' Then we would have christian friendly formulas that might
look something like... y = 'guess'(hunch) divided by the square root of an
assumption.
Thats christian logic for ya. Have fun in science class.
*
Actually 2 + 2 does equal 5, for large values of 2.
earle
*
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| User: "Andrew Arensburger" |
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| Title: Re: Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
08 Nov 2005 04:27:18 PM |
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In talk.origins Earle Jones <earle.jones@comcast.net> wrote:
Actually 2 + 2 does equal 5, for large values of 2.
...or sufficiently-small values of 5. Or sufficiently-vague
values of "=".
--
Andrew Arensburger, Systems guy University of Maryland
arensb.no-bloody-spam@umd.edu Office of Information Technology
Old soldiers never die; young ones do it for them.
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| User: "libertad" |
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| Title: Re: Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
04 Nov 2005 12:01:58 AM |
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And the bandwagon rolls on...
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| User: "Joe Vanderbilt" |
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| Title: Re: Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
04 Nov 2005 02:42:30 AM |
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Jason Spaceman <notreally@jspaceman.homelinux.org> wrote:
From the article:
.....
Recently, 36 of the 52 Republican state representatives, including House
Speaker
Brian Bosma of Indianapolis, sent questionnaires to constituents asking, among
other issues, whether intelligent design should be given equal time in science
classes.
Right, because science is a democracy. Whatever idea gets the most votes must
be the truth. :P
More wasted taxpayer dollars.
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| User: "Rev Dr Lenny Flank" |
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| Title: Re: Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
04 Nov 2005 03:48:10 AM |
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Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
The proposal comes a little more than a month after Bosma and a handful of other
House members met privately with Carl Baugh, host of the Trinity Broadcasting
Network show "Creationism in the 21st Century," to discuss bringing intelligent
design to public schools.
But ID isn't creationism. No sirree, Bob.
Golly, they sure are making this easy for us, aren't they . . . . . .
I used to think that IDers were a conspiratorial clique. Now I realize
that they are all just terminally stupid.
================================================
Lenny Flank
"There are no loose threads in the web of life"
Creation "Science" Debunked:
http://www.geocities.com/lflank
DebunkCreation email list:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DebunkCreation/
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| User: "Ron O" |
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| Title: Re: Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
04 Nov 2005 12:20:36 AM |
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Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
---------------------------------------
Republicans are creating legislation to have theory taught with evolution
By Mary Beth Schneider and Robert King
Indiana public schools would teach "intelligent design" along with evolution
under legislation that some Republican lawmakers are developing for the 2006
legislative session.
Intelligent design is the theory that a supernatural hand, and not just the
random process of natural selection, guided the development of life on Earth.
Recently, 36 of the 52 Republican state representatives, including House Speaker
Brian Bosma of Indianapolis, sent questionnaires to constituents asking, among
other issues, whether intelligent design should be given equal time in science
classes.
Rep. Bruce Borders, R-Jasonville, said he would file legislation mandating the
teaching of intelligent design if no other lawmaker did. "It's a passionate
issue for me, personally," Borders said.
The proposal comes a little more than a month after Bosma and a handful of other
House members met privately with Carl Baugh, host of the Trinity Broadcasting
Network show "Creationism in the 21st Century," to discuss bringing intelligent
design to public schools.
------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051103/NEWS02/511030467/1006/NEWS01
or http://tinyurl.com/8xd4o
J. Spaceman
Just remember that if this fiasco ever gets to court these rubes will
have to explain to the judge why they had to consult a scientific
creationist of the type that was found to be bogus over 20 years ago
during the Arkansas trial on teaching the replacement creationist scam
of Intelligent design. Science education is really what these guys are
worried about, and there are invisible pink elephants messing with
their minds to make them do these stupid things. They can't be doing
it of their own volition, right?
Ron Okimoto
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| User: "Andrew Arensburger" |
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| Title: Re: Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
04 Nov 2005 06:40:28 PM |
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In talk.origins Ron O <rokimoto@cox.net> wrote:
Science education is really what these guys are
worried about, and there are invisible pink elephants messing with
their minds to make them do these stupid things. They can't be doing
it of their own volition, right?
Invisible pink elephants? That's just silly.
No, it's the Flying Spaghetti Monster and his noodly appendage.
--
Andrew Arensburger, Systems guy University of Maryland
arensb.no-bloody-spam@umd.edu Office of Information Technology
Not quite, HAL. The engineers have figured out a kludge.
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| User: "Ron O" |
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| Title: Re: Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
05 Nov 2005 11:10:50 AM |
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Andrew Arensburger wrote:
In talk.origins Ron O <rokimoto@cox.net> wrote:
Science education is really what these guys are
worried about, and there are invisible pink elephants messing with
their minds to make them do these stupid things. They can't be doing
it of their own volition, right?
Invisible pink elephants? That's just silly.
No, it's the Flying Spaghetti Monster and his noodly appendage.
--
Andrew Arensburger, Systems guy University of Maryland
arensb.no-bloody-spam@umd.edu Office of Information Technology
Not quite, HAL. The engineers have figured out a kludge.
Fat chance, have you ever seen flying spaghetti? You can't say that
about invisible pink elephants can you? The reason that the pink
elephants are invisible is that you can see them, but they get into
your brain and block out the relevant signals. I'll stick to my
version before I believe in spaghetti that can defy gravity.;-)
Ron Okimoto
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| User: "Matt Giwer" |
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| Title: Re: Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
04 Nov 2005 08:04:02 AM |
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Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
---------------------------------------
Republicans are creating legislation to have theory taught with evolution
By Mary Beth Schneider and Robert King
Indiana public schools would teach "intelligent design" along with evolution
under legislation that some Republican lawmakers are developing for the 2006
legislative session.
Intelligent design is the theory that a supernatural hand, and not just the
random process of natural selection, guided the development of life on Earth.
Recently, 36 of the 52 Republican state representatives, including House Speaker
Brian Bosma of Indianapolis, sent questionnaires to constituents asking, among
other issues, whether intelligent design should be given equal time in science
classes.
Rep. Bruce Borders, R-Jasonville, said he would file legislation mandating the
teaching of intelligent design if no other lawmaker did. "It's a passionate
issue for me, personally," Borders said.
The proposal comes a little more than a month after Bosma and a handful of other
House members met privately with Carl Baugh, host of the Trinity Broadcasting
Network show "Creationism in the 21st Century," to discuss bringing intelligent
design to public schools.
------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051103/NEWS02/511030467/1006/NEWS01
or http://tinyurl.com/8xd4o
Christians destroyed Greek learning with similar government edicts. Christianity knows no
boundaries when it comes to intolerance.
--
Bush denies torturing prisoners and opposes any law prohibiting it.
Is this supposed to make sense?
-- The Iron Webmaster, 3521
nizkor http://www.giwersworld.org/nizkook/nizkook.phtml
environmentalism http://www.giwersworld.org/environment/aehb.phtml a9
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| User: "Matt Giwer" |
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| Title: Re: Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
04 Nov 2005 07:44:21 AM |
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Jason Spaceman wrote:
From the article:
---------------------------------------
Republicans are creating legislation to have theory taught with evolution
By Mary Beth Schneider and Robert King
Indiana public schools would teach "intelligent design" along with evolution
under legislation that some Republican lawmakers are developing for the 2006
legislative session.
Intelligent design is the theory that a supernatural hand, and not just the
random process of natural selection, guided the development of life on Earth.
Recently, 36 of the 52 Republican state representatives, including House Speaker
Brian Bosma of Indianapolis, sent questionnaires to constituents asking, among
other issues, whether intelligent design should be given equal time in science
classes.
Rep. Bruce Borders, R-Jasonville, said he would file legislation mandating the
teaching of intelligent design if no other lawmaker did. "It's a passionate
issue for me, personally," Borders said.
The proposal comes a little more than a month after Bosma and a handful of other
House members met privately with Carl Baugh, host of the Trinity Broadcasting
Network show "Creationism in the 21st Century," to discuss bringing intelligent
design to public schools.
------------------------------------------
Read it at
http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051103/NEWS02/511030467/1006/NEWS01
or http://tinyurl.com/8xd4o
Recently, 36 of the 52 Republican state representatives, including House Speaker Brian Bosma of
Indianapolis, sent questionnaires to constituents asking, among other issues, whether intelligent
design should be given equal time in science classes.
Rep. Bruce Borders, R-Jasonville, said he would file legislation mandating the teaching of
intelligent design if no other lawmaker did.
"It's a passionate issue for me, personally," Borders said.
The proposal comes a little more than a month after Bosma and a handful of other House members met
privately with Carl Baugh, host of the Trinity Broadcasting Network show "Creationism in the 21st
Century," to discuss bringing intelligent design to public schools.
Baugh was in town as the guest of Zion Unity Missionary Baptist Church, a small Indianapolis church
whose pastor, the Rev. Fredrick W. Boyd Jr., is an acquaintance of Baugh's. Baugh is founder and
director of the Creation Evidence Museum in Glen Rose, Texas.
Boyd said Bosma and the lawmakers already were pursuing the idea, but they wanted to hear Baugh's
thoughts on how to create the legislation.
Similar initiatives are being discussed in legislatures nationwide. The National Conference of State
Legislatures said 11 legislatures have debated intelligent design this year. None has enacted a law,
and in most cases bills died in committee.
In Pennsylvania, the issue is being played out in federal court, where the parents of 11 students
are suing a school district for requiring that intelligent design be taught as an alternative to
evolution.
Bosma could not be reached for comment Wednesday. Tony Samuel, press secretary for House
Republicans, said making this issue part of the caucus agenda has not been discussed.
Superintendent of Public Instruction Suellen Reed also could not be reached. Jane Jankowski, press
secretary for Gov. Mitch Daniels, said he was not available for a comment.
While Republicans are leading the effort to implement intelligent design, some Democrats support it
as well.
"Evolution was designed by God," said Rep. Jerry Denbo, D-French Lick. "I really think that should
be taught -- that there is a master. We didn't just come about by accident."
Rep. Tim Harris, R-Marion, also believes evolution and intelligent design should be taught.
"It takes just as much faith to believe in the evolution hypothesis as it does what we are now
calling intelligent design," he said.
Next year's session must end, by law, on March 14. No starting date has been established in the
House, but lawmakers are expected to return in early January.
Rep. Ed Mahern, D-Indianapolis, said a short session leaves little time to debate intelligent design
when so many other education issues need attention.
"It's one more instance where we are not concentrating on what we need to be concerned about --
higher test scores, keeping kids in school longer and promoting early childhood education," Mahern said.
Besides, he said, "Indianapolis doesn't need to be deciding things that should be decided at the
local level."
But Rep. Cindy Noe, R-Indianapolis, said this issue needs to be decided at the state level.
"There's absolutely nothing wrong with having the broader discussion," she said.
Frank Bush, executive director of the Indiana School Boards Association, said the legislature should
defer to the State Board of Education on this issue.
"The legislature has been willing to dictate concepts, but they generally don't get quite as deep as
what should be taught in math class, or English class," he said.
Besides, he said, if intelligent design were added to the curriculum, something else would have to go.
So far, this debate seems limited to the House, not the Senate, also controlled by Republicans.
Senate President Pro Tempore Robert Garton, R-Columbus, is lukewarm to the idea. He said he needed
more information before he makes up his mind, especially since this involves dictating what is
taught in school.
Indianapolis school officials said they haven't heard from parents who want intelligent design added
to the curriculum.
"There has been no interest or discussion by our parents with the administration regarding the
intelligent design concept," said Willie Giles, Indianapolis Public Schools associate superintendent.
High schools now must offer biology lessons linked to evolution under the state's academic standard.
New science and health textbooks were adopted by the state's 293 school district's last year and
won't be reviewed again until 2010.
"If there's a curriculum change midstream in that cycle, there's cost implications," said Tom
Langdoc, Wayne Township Schools director of school and community relations.
Lawmakers who back the issue said teaching intelligent design would not violate the constitutional
separation of church and state.
But Fran Quigley, executive director of the Indiana Civil Liberties Union, said it likely would
oppose this bill on those grounds.
The Rev. Kevin Armstrong, senior pastor at North United Methodist Church in Indianapolis, said it
would concern him if intelligent design were all that is taught. And he doesn't find evolution to be
incompatible with the Bible's creation story.
"I believe the creation story is a faith story, that it represents the truth of a creator and not
necessarily the truth of precisely how creation took place," Armstrong said.
Call Star reporter Mary Beth Schneider at (317) 444-2772.
Star reporters Michele McNeil and Kim Hooper contributed to this story.
Copyright 2005 IndyStar.com. All rights reserved
--
A difference between Vietnam and Iraq is we made certain to
have Christian dictators rule over the Bhuddist country.
-- The Iron Webmaster, 3518
nizkor http://www.giwersworld.org/nizkook/nizkook.phtml
Lawful to bomb Israelis http://www.giwersworld.org/israel/bombings.phtml a11
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| User: "Cyde Weys" |
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| Title: Re: Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
04 Nov 2005 12:00:55 AM |
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Jason Spaceman wrote:
Indiana public schools would teach "intelligent design" along with evolution
under legislation that some Republican lawmakers are developing for the 2006
legislative session.
Intelligent design is the theory that a supernatural hand, and not just the
random process of natural selection, guided the development of life on Earth.
Recently, 36 of the 52 Republican state representatives, including House Speaker
Brian Bosma of Indianapolis, sent questionnaires to constituents asking, among
other issues, whether intelligent design should be given equal time in science
classes.
Rep. Bruce Borders, R-Jasonville, said he would file legislation mandating the
teaching of intelligent design if no other lawmaker did. "It's a passionate
issue for me, personally," Borders said.
Cyde says:
Maybe these jokers should wait until they see how much Dover's little
foray into ID is going to cost them before bringing down the same upon
their state. Don't they realize that it's absolutely free for the ACLU
to file a case that they win, and the only one who ends up paying is
the state?
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Indiana: GOP lawmakers want schools to teach 'intelligent design' |
08 Nov 2005 03:34:09 PM |
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Cyde Weys wrote:
Jason Spaceman wrote:
Indiana public schools would teach "intelligent design" along with evolution
under legislation that some Republican lawmakers are developing for the 2006
legislative session.
Intelligent design is the theory that a supernatural hand, and not just the
random process of natural selection, guided the development of life on Earth.
Recently, 36 of the 52 Republican state representatives, including House Speaker
Brian Bosma of Indianapolis, sent questionnaires to constituents asking, among
other issues, whether intelligent design should be given equal time in science
classes.
Rep. Bruce Borders, R-Jasonville, said he would file legislation mandating the
teaching of intelligent design if no other lawmaker did. "It's a passionate
issue for me, personally," Borders said.
Cyde says:
Maybe these jokers should wait until they see how much Dover's little
foray into ID is going to cost them before bringing down the same upon
their state. Don't they realize that it's absolutely free for the ACLU
to file a case that they win, and the only one who ends up paying is
the state?
I wonder what would happen if Bush have its way getting ultra
conservative jusdges into the Supreme Court and a case like this
reaches it?
R.
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