| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"loose cannon" |
| Date: |
16 Jun 2005 12:27:35 AM |
| Object: |
Internationalize Jerusalem |
The time has come to once again address the issue of Jerusalem. Despite
the current goodwill amongst Israeli's and Palestinians, the final
status of Jerusalem is far too important to all the peoples of the
world to allow only these two entities to determine. The UN should
immediately convene and debate whether it is in everyones best
interests for this holiest of cities to be nationalized, beholden to no
one nation or people. The members of the Security Council could arrange
security concerns and deal with any nation that refuses to abide by the
UN's decision.
.
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| User: "Alan Stein" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
17 Jun 2005 08:20:55 PM |
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reneg*de@anglic*n.org (The +Revd) writes:
On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 20:45:21 GMT, "Adam Helberg"
<sendspamhere@yahee.com> wrote:
"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:MNjse.3012$Pa5.2566@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
Swearing allegiance does not mean one will respect one's pledge.
It's not foolproof but it helps.
It doesn't help jews. Jews have divided loyalties.
Ah. The old dual loyalty libel.
It's amazing how, in a nation of immigrants, where just about everyone
feels something special for the country their ancestors came from, the
Jews are singled out for also feeling some connection to the country
their ancestors came from.
Good thing we have thick skins from always being subject to double
standards.
--
Alan Stein
Al Qaeda and the PLO -- Two of a kind.
.
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| User: "Malcolm" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
18 Jun 2005 03:50:37 AM |
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"Alan Stein" <a.stein@snet.net> wrote
It doesn't help jews. Jews have divided loyalties.
Ah. The old dual loyalty libel.
It's amazing how, in a nation of immigrants, where just about everyone
feels something special for the country their ancestors came from, the
Jews are singled out for also feeling some connection to the country
their ancestors came from.
Good thing we have thick skins from always being subject to double
standards.
In Britian it is very rarely suggested that Jews have a dual loyalty. In
fact a lot of the most vociferous anti-Israel campaigners are Jews.
It used to be quite common to allege that Catholics had dual loyalty, and
even today there are a few positions which cannot be held by Catholics.
Nowadays that idea is largely confined to Northern Ireland.
Muslims are also increasingly accused of dual loyalty. However on the Iraq
war, left wing trendies as well as Muslims are very very opposed, so it is
not seen as exlusively an Islamic issue.
.
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| User: "Ariadne" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
19 Jun 2005 03:13:07 PM |
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Malcolm wrote:
"Alan Stein" <a.stein@snet.net> wrote
It doesn't help jews. Jews have divided loyalties.
Ah. The old dual loyalty libel.
It's amazing how, in a nation of immigrants, where just about everyone
feels something special for the country their ancestors came from, the
Jews are singled out for also feeling some connection to the country
their ancestors came from.
Good thing we have thick skins from always being subject to double
standards.
In Britian it is very rarely suggested that Jews have a dual loyalty. In
fact a lot of the most vociferous anti-Israel campaigners are Jews.
It used to be quite common to allege that Catholics had dual loyalty, and
even today there are a few positions which cannot be held by Catholics.
Nowadays that idea is largely confined to Northern Ireland.
Muslims are also increasingly accused of dual loyalty. However on the Iraq
war, left wing trendies as well as Muslims are very very opposed, so it is
not seen as exlusively an Islamic issue.
But what about the "No war for Israel"
antisemites?
.
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| User: "Malcolm" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
20 Jun 2005 01:42:10 AM |
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"Ariadne" <ariadne@mac.hush.com> wrote
But what about the "No war for Israel"
antisemites?
In Britain, you will very occasionally see "No more Jew wars" written on a
wall.
The people who write this are expressing the opinion that the Second World
War was caused by the Jews for the purpose of establishing the state of
Israel, and that the Iraq war is being fought for similar motives.
Even amongst the far right they are in a small minority. Most far right
people dislike Muslims, and instinctively support British troops in action.
They may not be overly fond of Jews, but see them as a lesser evil.
You will also see a much greater number of professionally printed posters
saying things like "Palestinian food weekend" or "no blood for oil", or "end
the occupation". These are put up by an alliance of left wingers and Muslim
groups.
It's very much a marriage of convenience. The left wingers are mainly
motivated by a desire to get rid of capitalism and Christian sexual
morality. Saying that Islam is of equal value to Christianity, that the
alliance with America is morally wrong, that Christians are racists, and so
on, is extremely convenient. They are also happy to exploit Jews in a
similar fashion.
The Muslims don't especially want to reduce Christian influence, except in
as far as increasing their own influence entails that, but they want to see
the end of Israel. They don't have strong opinions on racism per se, but
don't like being on the receiving end. They see themselves as losers in the
competition caused by free markets. Their views on sexuality are
diametrically opposed to those of the left-wingers.
These posters tend to avoid the cruder type of anti-Semitism. It is also
very common to include a sympathetic Jewish speaker at an anti-war or
pro-Palestinian meeting.
Seeing the issue through the filter of anti-Semitism awareness gives you a
very distorted idea of what is happening. A few of the traditional libels
against the Jews are being resurrected, but that isn't the important flow of
events. Jews are slowly being dragged in to a lot of issues that have no
obvious relationship to them, but everything to do with world economic
inequalities, secularisation in Europe, race and immigration, and the
shortage of oil.
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| User: "Mickey" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
20 Jun 2005 05:20:02 AM |
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"Malcolm" <regniztar@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:d95og1$3ov$1@nwrdmz02.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com...
"Ariadne" <ariadne@mac.hush.com> wrote
But what about the "No war for Israel"
antisemites?
In Britain, you will very occasionally see "No more Jew wars" written on a
wall.
So there are assholes in UK as well..... wonderful
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| User: "Malcolm" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
20 Jun 2005 05:43:49 PM |
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"Mickey" <mickeyb@comcast.net> wrote
"Malcolm" <regniztar@btinternet.com> wrote
In Britain, you will very occasionally see "No more Jew wars" written on
a
wall.
So there are assholes in UK as well..... wonderful
I'd like to be able to report that there are no anti-Semites whatsoever in
Britain. Unfortunately I'd be lying if I did so.
However I think that as a Jew you will find less hostility in Britain than
almost anywhere else, including the United States.
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| User: "Mickey" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
20 Jun 2005 06:24:59 PM |
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"Malcolm" <regniztar@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:d97gr4$fh1$1@nwrdmz02.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com...
"Mickey" <mickeyb@comcast.net> wrote
"Malcolm" <regniztar@btinternet.com> wrote
In Britain, you will very occasionally see "No more Jew wars" written
on
a
wall.
So there are assholes in UK as well..... wonderful
I'd like to be able to report that there are no anti-Semites whatsoever in
Britain. Unfortunately I'd be lying if I did so.
However I think that as a Jew you will find less hostility in Britain than
almost anywhere else, including the United States.
I've been to England and Ireland. The former I had no problem in, the latter
I had no end of problems in.
Mickey
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| User: "The +Revd" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
17 Jun 2005 11:33:39 PM |
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On Sat, 18 Jun 2005 01:20:55 GMT, Alan Stein <a.stein@snet.net> wrote:
reneg*de@anglic*n.org (The +Revd) writes:
On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 20:45:21 GMT, "Adam Helberg"
<sendspamhere@yahee.com> wrote:
"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:MNjse.3012$Pa5.2566@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
Swearing allegiance does not mean one will respect one's pledge.
It's not foolproof but it helps.
It doesn't help jews. Jews have divided loyalties.
Ah. The old dual loyalty libel.
It's not a libel. It's a fact.
It's amazing how, in a nation of immigrants, where just about everyone
feels something special for the country their ancestors came from, the
Jews are singled out for also feeling some connection to the country
their ancestors came from.
Jew loyalty to 'Israel' transcends whatever feelings other immigrants
have for their countries of origin. It exceeds their loyalty to their
host countries.
Good thing we have thick skins from always being subject to double
standards.
You deserve it.
.
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| User: "øéòéï áøúåïý/Riain Barton" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
17 Jun 2005 10:58:54 PM |
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The thing is they made this claim when we did not have Israel and they
make it now that we have Israel, and yet they want to us to give away
Israel!!!
Proof that what they really want is to see everyone of us DEAD.
"Alan Stein" <> wrote in message
news:m1slzgqx1b.fsf@iQuark.local...
: reneg*de@anglic*n.org (The +Revd) writes:
:
: > On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 20:45:21 GMT, "Adam Helberg"
: > <sendspamhere@yahee.com> wrote:
: >
: > >
: > >"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
: > >news:MNjse.3012$Pa5.2566@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
: > >> Swearing allegiance does not mean one will respect one's pledge.
: > >
: > >It's not foolproof but it helps.
: >
: > It doesn't help jews. Jews have divided loyalties.
:
: Ah. The old dual loyalty libel.
:
: It's amazing how, in a nation of immigrants, where just about everyone
: feels something special for the country their ancestors came from, the
: Jews are singled out for also feeling some connection to the country
: their ancestors came from.
:
: Good thing we have thick skins from always being subject to double
: standards.
:
:
: --
: Alan Stein
:
: Al Qaeda and the PLO -- Two of a kind.
.
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| User: "Ben Cramer" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
17 Jun 2005 11:21:43 PM |
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"øéòéï áøúåïý/Riain Barton" <riain@zion.org.il> wrote in message
news:hSMse.105966$8S5.14720@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
The thing is they made this claim when we did not have Israel and they
make it now that we have Israel, and yet they want to us to give away
Israel!!!
Proof that what they really want is to see everyone of us DEAD.
So? What's the problem already?
.
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| User: "The +Revd" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
17 Jun 2005 11:34:06 PM |
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On Sat, 18 Jun 2005 06:58:54 +0300, "øéòéï áøúåïý/Riain Barton"
<riain@zion.org.il> wrote:
The thing is they made this claim when we did not have Israel and they
make it now that we have Israel, and yet they want to us to give away
Israel!!!
Proof that what they really want is to see everyone of us DEAD.
You don't have 'Israel'. You're a bent Irish fairy.
"Alan Stein" < > wrote in message
news:m1slzgqx1b.fsf@iQuark.local...
: reneg*de@anglic*n.org (The +Revd) writes:
:
: > On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 20:45:21 GMT, "Adam Helberg"
: > <sendspamhere@yahee.com> wrote:
: >
: > >
: > >"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
: > >news:MNjse.3012$Pa5.2566@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
: > >> Swearing allegiance does not mean one will respect one's pledge.
: > >
: > >It's not foolproof but it helps.
: >
: > It doesn't help jews. Jews have divided loyalties.
:
: Ah. The old dual loyalty libel.
:
: It's amazing how, in a nation of immigrants, where just about everyone
: feels something special for the country their ancestors came from, the
: Jews are singled out for also feeling some connection to the country
: their ancestors came from.
:
: Good thing we have thick skins from always being subject to double
: standards.
:
:
: --
: Alan Stein
:
: Al Qaeda and the PLO -- Two of a kind.
.
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| User: "The +Revd" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
16 Jun 2005 11:39:33 PM |
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On Thu, 16 Jun 2005 17:32:01 GMT, "cindys" <cstein1@rochester.rr.com>
wrote:
"øéòéï áøúåïý/Riain Barton" <riain@zion.org.il> wrote in message
news:qhise.102522$8S5.86617@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
Wrong you idiot.
Israeli-Arabs are the Arabs who are Israeli citizens and CHOOSE to live
within the State of Israel.
They are not the same as "Palestinian-Arabs" who CHOSE to leave their
land hoping that their fellow Arabs would destroy Israel and all Jews!
-------
Truth be told, the Israeli-Arabs are not such great supporters of Israel
either, and the majority of them would be really pleased to see Israel
destroyed (despite the fact that they are living in a 1st world country
which their Arab brethren would turn into a 3rd world country in a matter of
months).
'Israel' is a Third World country.
.
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| User: "øéòéï áøúåïý/Riain Barton" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
16 Jun 2005 05:56:38 PM |
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Well, I can only speak about the ones I knew in Israel.
"cindys" <cstein1@rochester.rr.com> wrote in message
news:lIise.77374$HT1.34079@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
:
: "øéòéï áøúåïý/Riain Barton" <riain@zion.org.il> wrote in message
: news:qhise.102522$8S5.86617@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
: > Wrong you idiot.
: >
: > Israeli-Arabs are the Arabs who are Israeli citizens and CHOOSE to
live
: > within the State of Israel.
: >
: > They are not the same as "Palestinian-Arabs" who CHOSE to leave
their
: > land hoping that their fellow Arabs would destroy Israel and all
Jews!
: >
: -------
: Truth be told, the Israeli-Arabs are not such great supporters of
Israel
: either, and the majority of them would be really pleased to see Israel
: destroyed (despite the fact that they are living in a 1st world
country
: which their Arab brethren would turn into a 3rd world country in a
matter of
: months).
: Best regards,
: ---Cindy S.
:
:
.
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| User: "JokingYou" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
16 Jun 2005 11:25:30 AM |
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"cindys" <cstein1@rochester.rr.com> wrote in message
news:rkgse.13615$g5.3573@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:H5gse.2634$NU5.853@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...
"loose cannon" <looseaint@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1118899654.984675.82140@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
The time has come to once again address the issue of Jerusalem. Despite
the current goodwill amongst Israeli's and Palestinians, the final
status of Jerusalem is far too important to all the peoples of the
world to allow only these two entities to determine. The UN should
immediately convene and debate whether it is in everyones best
interests for this holiest of cities to be nationalized, beholden to no
one nation or people. The members of the Security Council could arrange
security concerns and deal with any nation that refuses to abide by the
UN's decision.
However, the Palestinians or rather Israeli-Arabs have displayed no good
will. Israeli-Arabs are only using the peace process to further their
goal
of destroying Israel.
-----------
They're not Israeli Arabs. The Israeli Arabs all live in Israel. Most of
the
so-called "Palestinians" (sic) are Jordanian Arabs. Yassir Arafat,
however,
was a full-blooded Egyptian.
Best regards,
---Cindy S.
I refer to them as Israeli-Arabs only because they are Arabs who live in
Israel and there is no such thing as a a Palestinian people.
.
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| User: "cindys" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
16 Jun 2005 11:34:24 AM |
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"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:_Jhse.29472$J12.15195@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com...
"cindys" <cstein1@rochester.rr.com> wrote in message
news:rkgse.13615$g5.3573@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:H5gse.2634$NU5.853@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...
"loose cannon" <looseaint@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1118899654.984675.82140@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
The time has come to once again address the issue of Jerusalem.
Despite
the current goodwill amongst Israeli's and Palestinians, the final
status of Jerusalem is far too important to all the peoples of the
world to allow only these two entities to determine. The UN should
immediately convene and debate whether it is in everyones best
interests for this holiest of cities to be nationalized, beholden to
no
one nation or people. The members of the Security Council could
arrange
security concerns and deal with any nation that refuses to abide by
the
UN's decision.
However, the Palestinians or rather Israeli-Arabs have displayed no
good
will. Israeli-Arabs are only using the peace process to further their
goal
of destroying Israel.
-----------
They're not Israeli Arabs. The Israeli Arabs all live in Israel. Most of
the
so-called "Palestinians" (sic) are Jordanian Arabs. Yassir Arafat,
however,
was a full-blooded Egyptian.
Best regards,
---Cindy S.
I refer to them as Israeli-Arabs only because they are Arabs who live in
Israel and there is no such thing as a a Palestinian people.
----------
I would agree that the Arabs who live in Israel proper with Israeli
citizenship are Israeli Arabs. I thought you were using the expression
Israeli-Arabs to refer to the Jordanian Arabs aka *Palestinians* (sic) who
live in the West Bank.
Best regards,
---Cindy S.
.
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| User: "Mickey" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
16 Jun 2005 11:40:36 AM |
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"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:_Jhse.29472$J12.15195@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com...
"cindys" <cstein1@rochester.rr.com> wrote in message
news:rkgse.13615$g5.3573@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:H5gse.2634$NU5.853@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...
"loose cannon" <looseaint@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1118899654.984675.82140@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
The time has come to once again address the issue of Jerusalem.
Despite
the current goodwill amongst Israeli's and Palestinians, the final
status of Jerusalem is far too important to all the peoples of the
world to allow only these two entities to determine. The UN should
immediately convene and debate whether it is in everyones best
interests for this holiest of cities to be nationalized, beholden to
no
one nation or people. The members of the Security Council could
arrange
security concerns and deal with any nation that refuses to abide by
the
UN's decision.
However, the Palestinians or rather Israeli-Arabs have displayed no
good
will. Israeli-Arabs are only using the peace process to further their
goal
of destroying Israel.
-----------
They're not Israeli Arabs. The Israeli Arabs all live in Israel. Most of
the
so-called "Palestinians" (sic) are Jordanian Arabs. Yassir Arafat,
however,
was a full-blooded Egyptian.
Best regards,
---Cindy S.
I refer to them as Israeli-Arabs only because they are Arabs who live in
Israel and there is no such thing as a a Palestinian people.
Squatters works for me.
Mickey
.
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| User: "=?iso-8859-1?B?qmu9/KRqqmumbg==?=" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
16 Jun 2005 11:40:09 AM |
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JokingYou wrote:
I refer to them as Israeli-Arabs only because they are Arabs who live in
Israel and there is no such thing as a a Palestinian people.
Me say 'America' Me do not mean the American people, most of whom are
distant and ignorant of what is going on in the world, and of what its
government and army are doing in the world.
America regime has always taken a position of aggression, of
occupation, and of supporting Israel with weapons, airplanes, tanks,
money, as well as political support, and unlimited protection.
"Warning there are Jewish & Hindu forgers and trolls amongst us,
proceed with caution"
.
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| User: "cindys" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
16 Jun 2005 12:28:15 PM |
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"ªk½ü¤jªk¦n" <jdyoung17@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1118940009.894028.141960@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
JokingYou wrote:
I refer to them as Israeli-Arabs only because they are Arabs who live in
Israel and there is no such thing as a a Palestinian people.
Me say 'America' Me do not mean the American people, most of whom are
distant and ignorant of what is going on in the world, and of what its
government and army are doing in the world.
America regime has always taken a position of aggression, of
occupation, and of supporting Israel with weapons, airplanes, tanks,
money, as well as political support, and unlimited protection.
"Warning there are Jewish & Hindu forgers and trolls amongst us,
proceed with caution"
----------
Another moron hath spoken.
Best regards,
---Cindy S.
.
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| User: "øéòéï áøúåïý/Riain Barton" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
16 Jun 2005 05:58:10 PM |
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*plonk*
"?k½?¤j?k¦n" <jdyoung17@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1118940009.894028.141960@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
: JokingYou wrote:
: >
: > I refer to them as Israeli-Arabs only because they are Arabs who
live in
: > Israel and there is no such thing as a a Palestinian people.
: >
:
: Me say 'America' Me do not mean the American people, most of whom are
: distant and ignorant of what is going on in the world, and of what its
: government and army are doing in the world.
:
: America regime has always taken a position of aggression, of
: occupation, and of supporting Israel with weapons, airplanes, tanks,
: money, as well as political support, and unlimited protection.
:
: "Warning there are Jewish & Hindu forgers and trolls amongst us,
: proceed with caution"
:
.
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| User: "WJ20K" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
17 Jun 2005 12:05:23 PM |
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cindys wrote:
"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:H5gse.2634$NU5.853@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...
"loose cannon" <looseaint@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1118899654.984675.82140@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
The time has come to once again address the issue of Jerusalem. Despite
the current goodwill amongst Israeli's and Palestinians, the final
status of Jerusalem is far too important to all the peoples of the
world to allow only these two entities to determine. The UN should
immediately convene and debate whether it is in everyones best
interests for this holiest of cities to be nationalized, beholden to no
one nation or people. The members of the Security Council could arrange
security concerns and deal with any nation that refuses to abide by the
UN's decision.
However, the Palestinians or rather Israeli-Arabs have displayed no good
will. Israeli-Arabs are only using the peace process to further their
goal
of destroying Israel.
-----------
They're not Israeli Arabs. The Israeli Arabs all live in Israel. Most of the
so-called "Palestinians" (sic) are Jordanian Arabs. Yassir Arafat, however,
was a full-blooded Egyptian.
Best regards,
---Cindy S.
On what basis do you say that Arafat is a full blooded Egyptian? Are
you trying to insult Egyptians?
[WJ20K]
.
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| User: "Mickey" |
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| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
17 Jun 2005 12:37:09 PM |
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"WJ20K" <webjunk20000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1119027923.492044.191750@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
cindys wrote:
"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:H5gse.2634$NU5.853@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...
"loose cannon" <looseaint@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1118899654.984675.82140@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
The time has come to once again address the issue of Jerusalem.
Despite
the current goodwill amongst Israeli's and Palestinians, the final
status of Jerusalem is far too important to all the peoples of the
world to allow only these two entities to determine. The UN should
immediately convene and debate whether it is in everyones best
interests for this holiest of cities to be nationalized, beholden to
no
one nation or people. The members of the Security Council could
arrange
security concerns and deal with any nation that refuses to abide by
the
UN's decision.
However, the Palestinians or rather Israeli-Arabs have displayed no
good
will. Israeli-Arabs are only using the peace process to further their
goal
of destroying Israel.
-----------
They're not Israeli Arabs. The Israeli Arabs all live in Israel. Most of
the
so-called "Palestinians" (sic) are Jordanian Arabs. Yassir Arafat,
however,
was a full-blooded Egyptian.
Best regards,
---Cindy S.
On what basis do you say that Arafat is a full blooded Egyptian? Are
you trying to insult Egyptians?
Are you being intentionally dense? Arafat was an Egyptian because his
parents were, as were his grandparents and their parents.
Mickey
.
|
|
|
| User: "Deborah Sharavi" |
|
| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
17 Jun 2005 01:10:39 PM |
|
|
cindys wrote:
They're not Israeli Arabs. The Israeli Arabs all live in Israel. Most of
the
so-called "Palestinians" (sic) are Jordanian Arabs. Yassir Arafat,
however,
was a full-blooded Egyptian.
Best regards,
---Cindy S.
"WJ20K" <webjunk20000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1119027923.492044.191750@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
On what basis do you say that Arafat is a full blooded Egyptian? Are
you trying to insult Egyptians?
Mickey wrote:
Are you being intentionally dense? Arafat was an Egyptian because his
parents were, as were his grandparents and their parents.
Mickey
Give him some basis for the fact that Arafat was Egyptian:
His Palestinian biographer, Dr Said K Aburish, stated he was Egyptian,
as did biographer Alan Hart, and offered the evidence in "Arafat: From
Freedom Fighter to Dictator".
"Mohammed Abdel Rahman was his first name; Abdel Raouf his father's
name; Arafat his grandfather's; Al Qudua is the name of his family; and
Al Husseini is the name of the clan to which the Al Quduas belonged."
Aburish, p 7. "The young Arafat sought to establish his Palestinian
credentials and promote his eventual claim to leadership [and] could
not afford to admit any facts which might reduce his Palestinian
identity...Arafat insistently perpetuated the legend that he had been
born in Jerusalem and was related to the important Husseini clan of
that city." Aburish, p 8. He was "unrelated to the real Husseini
notables of Jerusalem." Aburish, p 9. Arafat was educated in Cairo, and
attended the University of Cairo, where he joined the Muslim
Brotherhood, membership in which was open only to Egyptians.
Arafat's birth certificate registered his birth in Cairo. His father
was a Cairene merchant with business links in Khan Yunis, who traveled
on an American passport. (Arafat travelled to Moscow several times on
his Egyptian passport.) The Qudwa family (Arafat's real name) had
owned property in Cairo for generations, which his father initiated
several actions in the Egyptian courts to regain. Arafat, however,
claimed his father had forged the Cairene birth certificate so he could
attend school for free. After their mother's death, his father
remarried twice. Arafat was raised by his sister, Imam, who said he was
"not like other children in playing or in his feelings... He gathered
the Arab kids of the district, formed them into groups and made them
march and drill. He carried a stick and he used to beat those who did
not obey his commands."
Among his numerous claims, Arafat claimed to have been commissioned in
the Egyptian army; to have fought in Gaza in 1948, to have served in
the Suez campaign IN 1956, the year he earned his BA from the U of
Cairo. He also claimed to have been born in Jerusalem, and, as a boy,
to have played soccer with Jews in the plaza before the Western Wall.
[Get that? In the plaza before the Western Wall when he was a boy?]
When Nasser cracked down on the Brotherhood, Arafat was expelled from
Egypt, along with other lower-ranking members. He then went to Kuwait,
where he either worked in the public works department as an engineer,
and founded his own contracting business; or else he ran a car-theft
ring. While in Kuwait, he co-founded the Fatah, dedicated to the
destruction of Israel, with, among others, Abu Sitta, who now operates
the Palestine Remembered site.
Most sources on Arafat are highly contradictory, due to the numerous
lies Arafat told about himself and his past over the course of his
too-long life.
See brief bio, Yasir Arafat: 1929 - 2004
http://www.honestreporting.com/articles/45884734/critiques/Yassir_Arafat_1929-2004.asp
Deborah
.
|
|
|
| User: "WJ20K" |
|
| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
18 Jun 2005 12:14:05 AM |
|
|
Coming from someone who posts cooking recipes, using dead children from
this conflict, on the net it is rather interesting to note that the
same person states " Most sources on Arafat are highly contradictory,
due to the numerous lies Arafat told about himself and his past over
the course of his too-long life." How someone like that believes they
are able to determine what are lies, what is myth and what is reality
is highly questionable. There is also a slew of 'evidence' that all
show Palestinian heritage for each and every one of the ones which
point away. Let us not forget that this is something that is in the
interest of Israeli's to emphasize, just like Palestinians emphasize
the most Jews in Israel have no recent roots in the place, this silly
game is played by both. On a similar note one can also claim that what
is in the Torah about a god having given some land to some people, is
at best a myth perpeturated throughout the ages, or at worst a lie to
try to seize land from others. NO ONE can prove it one way or the
other. But does that stop people from acting according to those
beliefs as if they are facts? Of course not because they are accepted
as facts against all logic. A prime reason this silly conflict goes on
and on.
[WJ20K]
Deborah Sharavi wrote:
cindys wrote:
They're not Israeli Arabs. The Israeli Arabs all live in Israel. Most of
the
so-called "Palestinians" (sic) are Jordanian Arabs. Yassir Arafat,
however,
was a full-blooded Egyptian.
Best regards,
---Cindy S.
"WJ20K" <webjunk20000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1119027923.492044.191750@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
On what basis do you say that Arafat is a full blooded Egyptian? Are
you trying to insult Egyptians?
Mickey wrote:
Are you being intentionally dense? Arafat was an Egyptian because his
parents were, as were his grandparents and their parents.
Mickey
Give him some basis for the fact that Arafat was Egyptian:
His Palestinian biographer, Dr Said K Aburish, stated he was Egyptian,
as did biographer Alan Hart, and offered the evidence in "Arafat: From
Freedom Fighter to Dictator".
"Mohammed Abdel Rahman was his first name; Abdel Raouf his father's
name; Arafat his grandfather's; Al Qudua is the name of his family; and
Al Husseini is the name of the clan to which the Al Quduas belonged."
Aburish, p 7. "The young Arafat sought to establish his Palestinian
credentials and promote his eventual claim to leadership [and] could
not afford to admit any facts which might reduce his Palestinian
identity...Arafat insistently perpetuated the legend that he had been
born in Jerusalem and was related to the important Husseini clan of
that city." Aburish, p 8. He was "unrelated to the real Husseini
notables of Jerusalem." Aburish, p 9. Arafat was educated in Cairo, and
attended the University of Cairo, where he joined the Muslim
Brotherhood, membership in which was open only to Egyptians.
Arafat's birth certificate registered his birth in Cairo. His father
was a Cairene merchant with business links in Khan Yunis, who traveled
on an American passport. (Arafat travelled to Moscow several times on
his Egyptian passport.) The Qudwa family (Arafat's real name) had
owned property in Cairo for generations, which his father initiated
several actions in the Egyptian courts to regain. Arafat, however,
claimed his father had forged the Cairene birth certificate so he could
attend school for free. After their mother's death, his father
remarried twice. Arafat was raised by his sister, Imam, who said he was
"not like other children in playing or in his feelings... He gathered
the Arab kids of the district, formed them into groups and made them
march and drill. He carried a stick and he used to beat those who did
not obey his commands."
Among his numerous claims, Arafat claimed to have been commissioned in
the Egyptian army; to have fought in Gaza in 1948, to have served in
the Suez campaign IN 1956, the year he earned his BA from the U of
Cairo. He also claimed to have been born in Jerusalem, and, as a boy,
to have played soccer with Jews in the plaza before the Western Wall.
[Get that? In the plaza before the Western Wall when he was a boy?]
When Nasser cracked down on the Brotherhood, Arafat was expelled from
Egypt, along with other lower-ranking members. He then went to Kuwait,
where he either worked in the public works department as an engineer,
and founded his own contracting business; or else he ran a car-theft
ring. While in Kuwait, he co-founded the Fatah, dedicated to the
destruction of Israel, with, among others, Abu Sitta, who now operates
the Palestine Remembered site.
Most sources on Arafat are highly contradictory, due to the numerous
lies Arafat told about himself and his past over the course of his
too-long life.
See brief bio, Yasir Arafat: 1929 - 2004
http://www.honestreporting.com/articles/45884734/critiques/Yassir_Arafat_1929-2004.asp
Deborah
.
|
|
|
| User: "JokingYou" |
|
| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
18 Jun 2005 09:46:57 AM |
|
|
"WJ20K" <webjunk20000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1119071645.009095.16290@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Coming from someone who posts cooking recipes, using dead children from
this conflict, on the net it is rather interesting to note that the
same person states " Most sources on Arafat are highly contradictory,
due to the numerous lies Arafat told about himself and his past over
the course of his too-long life." How someone like that believes they
are able to determine what are lies, what is myth and what is reality
is highly questionable. There is also a slew of 'evidence' that all
show Palestinian heritage for each and every one of the ones which
point away. Let us not forget that this is something that is in the
interest of Israeli's to emphasize, just like Palestinians emphasize
the most Jews in Israel have no recent roots in the place, this silly
game is played by both. On a similar note one can also claim that what
is in the Torah about a god having given some land to some people, is
at best a myth perpeturated throughout the ages, or at worst a lie to
try to seize land from others. NO ONE can prove it one way or the
other. But does that stop people from acting according to those
beliefs as if they are facts? Of course not because they are accepted
as facts against all logic. A prime reason this silly conflict goes on
and on.
[WJ20K]
That is a erroneous point as Muslims (as stated in the Quran) as well as
Jews believe the land was given to the Israelites. What is in dispute is
the lineage of present day settlers of Israel whoMuslims do not believe are
decendents of the Israelites of old or that Ishmael is a decendent of
Arbaham and the Arabs are also entitled to the land as dictated by the
Abrahamic covenent.
Deborah Sharavi wrote:
cindys wrote:
They're not Israeli Arabs. The Israeli Arabs all live in Israel. Most
of
the
so-called "Palestinians" (sic) are Jordanian Arabs. Yassir Arafat,
however,
was a full-blooded Egyptian.
Best regards,
---Cindy S.
"WJ20K" <webjunk20000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1119027923.492044.191750@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
On what basis do you say that Arafat is a full blooded Egyptian? Are
you trying to insult Egyptians?
Mickey wrote:
Are you being intentionally dense? Arafat was an Egyptian because his
parents were, as were his grandparents and their parents.
Mickey
Give him some basis for the fact that Arafat was Egyptian:
His Palestinian biographer, Dr Said K Aburish, stated he was Egyptian,
as did biographer Alan Hart, and offered the evidence in "Arafat: From
Freedom Fighter to Dictator".
"Mohammed Abdel Rahman was his first name; Abdel Raouf his father's
name; Arafat his grandfather's; Al Qudua is the name of his family; and
Al Husseini is the name of the clan to which the Al Quduas belonged."
Aburish, p 7. "The young Arafat sought to establish his Palestinian
credentials and promote his eventual claim to leadership [and] could
not afford to admit any facts which might reduce his Palestinian
identity...Arafat insistently perpetuated the legend that he had been
born in Jerusalem and was related to the important Husseini clan of
that city." Aburish, p 8. He was "unrelated to the real Husseini
notables of Jerusalem." Aburish, p 9. Arafat was educated in Cairo, and
attended the University of Cairo, where he joined the Muslim
Brotherhood, membership in which was open only to Egyptians.
Arafat's birth certificate registered his birth in Cairo. His father
was a Cairene merchant with business links in Khan Yunis, who traveled
on an American passport. (Arafat travelled to Moscow several times on
his Egyptian passport.) The Qudwa family (Arafat's real name) had
owned property in Cairo for generations, which his father initiated
several actions in the Egyptian courts to regain. Arafat, however,
claimed his father had forged the Cairene birth certificate so he could
attend school for free. After their mother's death, his father
remarried twice. Arafat was raised by his sister, Imam, who said he was
"not like other children in playing or in his feelings... He gathered
the Arab kids of the district, formed them into groups and made them
march and drill. He carried a stick and he used to beat those who did
not obey his commands."
Among his numerous claims, Arafat claimed to have been commissioned in
the Egyptian army; to have fought in Gaza in 1948, to have served in
the Suez campaign IN 1956, the year he earned his BA from the U of
Cairo. He also claimed to have been born in Jerusalem, and, as a boy,
to have played soccer with Jews in the plaza before the Western Wall.
[Get that? In the plaza before the Western Wall when he was a boy?]
When Nasser cracked down on the Brotherhood, Arafat was expelled from
Egypt, along with other lower-ranking members. He then went to Kuwait,
where he either worked in the public works department as an engineer,
and founded his own contracting business; or else he ran a car-theft
ring. While in Kuwait, he co-founded the Fatah, dedicated to the
destruction of Israel, with, among others, Abu Sitta, who now operates
the Palestine Remembered site.
Most sources on Arafat are highly contradictory, due to the numerous
lies Arafat told about himself and his past over the course of his
too-long life.
See brief bio, Yasir Arafat: 1929 - 2004
http://www.honestreporting.com/articles/45884734/critiques/Yassir_Arafat_1929-2004.asp
Deborah
.
|
|
|
| User: "Mickey" |
|
| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
18 Jun 2005 09:55:08 AM |
|
|
"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:BtWse.30465$J12.23598@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com...
"WJ20K" <webjunk20000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1119071645.009095.16290@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Coming from someone who posts cooking recipes, using dead children from
this conflict, on the net it is rather interesting to note that the
same person states " Most sources on Arafat are highly contradictory,
due to the numerous lies Arafat told about himself and his past over
the course of his too-long life." How someone like that believes they
are able to determine what are lies, what is myth and what is reality
is highly questionable. There is also a slew of 'evidence' that all
show Palestinian heritage for each and every one of the ones which
point away. Let us not forget that this is something that is in the
interest of Israeli's to emphasize, just like Palestinians emphasize
the most Jews in Israel have no recent roots in the place, this silly
game is played by both. On a similar note one can also claim that what
is in the Torah about a god having given some land to some people, is
at best a myth perpeturated throughout the ages, or at worst a lie to
try to seize land from others. NO ONE can prove it one way or the
other. But does that stop people from acting according to those
beliefs as if they are facts? Of course not because they are accepted
as facts against all logic. A prime reason this silly conflict goes on
and on.
[WJ20K]
That is a erroneous point as Muslims (as stated in the Quran) as well as
Jews believe the land was given to the Israelites. What is in dispute is
the lineage of present day settlers of Israel whoMuslims do not believe
are
decendents of the Israelites of old or that Ishmael is a decendent of
Arbaham and the Arabs are also entitled to the land as dictated by the
Abrahamic covenent.
As my family's lineage can be traced back in Tiberias to a time prior to the
birth of their prophet, that point is also moot.
Mickey
.
|
|
|
| User: "WJ20K" |
|
| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
19 Jun 2005 04:28:10 AM |
|
|
Mickey wrote:
"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:BtWse.30465$J12.23598@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com...
"WJ20K" <webjunk20000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1119071645.009095.16290@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Coming from someone who posts cooking recipes, using dead children from
this conflict, on the net it is rather interesting to note that the
same person states " Most sources on Arafat are highly contradictory,
due to the numerous lies Arafat told about himself and his past over
the course of his too-long life." How someone like that believes they
are able to determine what are lies, what is myth and what is reality
is highly questionable. There is also a slew of 'evidence' that all
show Palestinian heritage for each and every one of the ones which
point away. Let us not forget that this is something that is in the
interest of Israeli's to emphasize, just like Palestinians emphasize
the most Jews in Israel have no recent roots in the place, this silly
game is played by both. On a similar note one can also claim that what
is in the Torah about a god having given some land to some people, is
at best a myth perpeturated throughout the ages, or at worst a lie to
try to seize land from others. NO ONE can prove it one way or the
other. But does that stop people from acting according to those
beliefs as if they are facts? Of course not because they are accepted
as facts against all logic. A prime reason this silly conflict goes on
and on.
[WJ20K]
That is a erroneous point as Muslims (as stated in the Quran) as well as
Jews believe the land was given to the Israelites. What is in dispute is
the lineage of present day settlers of Israel whoMuslims do not believe
are
decendents of the Israelites of old or that Ishmael is a decendent of
Arbaham and the Arabs are also entitled to the land as dictated by the
Abrahamic covenent.
As my family's lineage can be traced back in Tiberias to a time prior to the
birth of their prophet, that point is also moot.
Mickey
Talking about such silly matters as lineage, who came first etc.
totally misses the point and is always employed by those who do not
want to look at the true causes of the conflict today.
[WJ20K]
.
|
|
|
| User: "Mickey" |
|
| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
19 Jun 2005 08:15:12 AM |
|
|
"WJ20K" <webjunk20000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1119173289.975852.205820@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
Mickey wrote:
"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:BtWse.30465$J12.23598@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com...
"WJ20K" <webjunk20000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1119071645.009095.16290@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Coming from someone who posts cooking recipes, using dead children
from
this conflict, on the net it is rather interesting to note that the
same person states " Most sources on Arafat are highly
contradictory,
due to the numerous lies Arafat told about himself and his past over
the course of his too-long life." How someone like that believes
they
are able to determine what are lies, what is myth and what is
reality
is highly questionable. There is also a slew of 'evidence' that all
show Palestinian heritage for each and every one of the ones which
point away. Let us not forget that this is something that is in the
interest of Israeli's to emphasize, just like Palestinians emphasize
the most Jews in Israel have no recent roots in the place, this
silly
game is played by both. On a similar note one can also claim that
what
is in the Torah about a god having given some land to some people,
is
at best a myth perpeturated throughout the ages, or at worst a lie
to
try to seize land from others. NO ONE can prove it one way or the
other. But does that stop people from acting according to those
beliefs as if they are facts? Of course not because they are
accepted
as facts against all logic. A prime reason this silly conflict goes
on
and on.
[WJ20K]
That is a erroneous point as Muslims (as stated in the Quran) as well
as
Jews believe the land was given to the Israelites. What is in dispute
is
the lineage of present day settlers of Israel whoMuslims do not
believe
are
decendents of the Israelites of old or that Ishmael is a decendent of
Arbaham and the Arabs are also entitled to the land as dictated by the
Abrahamic covenent.
As my family's lineage can be traced back in Tiberias to a time prior to
the
birth of their prophet, that point is also moot.
Mickey
Talking about such silly matters as lineage, who came first etc.
totally misses the point and is always employed by those who do not
want to look at the true causes of the conflict today.
Wrong. Yours is the response of those who wish to steal our land and deny
our rights. My family has been there BEFORE there were Arabs, BEFORE there
was a prophet (***** be upon him), before there was a Jesus. No one, I repeat
for the hearing impaired, NO ONE, has a right to our land except us. Your
balthering to the contrary changes that not one whit.
Mickey
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "JokingYou" |
|
| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
19 Jun 2005 09:43:02 AM |
|
|
"WJ20K" <webjunk20000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1119173289.975852.205820@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
Mickey wrote:
"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:BtWse.30465$J12.23598@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com...
"WJ20K" <webjunk20000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1119071645.009095.16290@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Coming from someone who posts cooking recipes, using dead children
from
this conflict, on the net it is rather interesting to note that the
same person states " Most sources on Arafat are highly contradictory,
due to the numerous lies Arafat told about himself and his past over
the course of his too-long life." How someone like that believes
they
are able to determine what are lies, what is myth and what is reality
is highly questionable. There is also a slew of 'evidence' that all
show Palestinian heritage for each and every one of the ones which
point away. Let us not forget that this is something that is in the
interest of Israeli's to emphasize, just like Palestinians emphasize
the most Jews in Israel have no recent roots in the place, this silly
game is played by both. On a similar note one can also claim that
what
is in the Torah about a god having given some land to some people, is
at best a myth perpeturated throughout the ages, or at worst a lie to
try to seize land from others. NO ONE can prove it one way or the
other. But does that stop people from acting according to those
beliefs as if they are facts? Of course not because they are
accepted
as facts against all logic. A prime reason this silly conflict goes
on
and on.
[WJ20K]
That is a erroneous point as Muslims (as stated in the Quran) as well
as
Jews believe the land was given to the Israelites. What is in dispute
is
the lineage of present day settlers of Israel whoMuslims do not believe
are
decendents of the Israelites of old or that Ishmael is a decendent of
Arbaham and the Arabs are also entitled to the land as dictated by the
Abrahamic covenent.
As my family's lineage can be traced back in Tiberias to a time prior to
the
birth of their prophet, that point is also moot.
Mickey
Talking about such silly matters as lineage, who came first etc.
totally misses the point and is always employed by those who do not
want to look at the true causes of the conflict today.
[WJ20K]
Tracing lineage is only helpful to the ego of the perrson doing the tracing.
It nevers takes into consideration the very likelihood of an early visit by
the milkman.
.
|
|
|
| User: "WJ20K" |
|
| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
19 Jun 2005 01:05:30 PM |
|
|
JokingYou wrote:
"WJ20K" <webjunk20000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1119173289.975852.205820@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
Mickey wrote:
"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:BtWse.30465$J12.23598@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com...
"WJ20K" <webjunk20000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1119071645.009095.16290@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Coming from someone who posts cooking recipes, using dead children
from
this conflict, on the net it is rather interesting to note that the
same person states " Most sources on Arafat are highly contradictory,
due to the numerous lies Arafat told about himself and his past over
the course of his too-long life." How someone like that believes
they
are able to determine what are lies, what is myth and what is reality
is highly questionable. There is also a slew of 'evidence' that all
show Palestinian heritage for each and every one of the ones which
point away. Let us not forget that this is something that is in the
interest of Israeli's to emphasize, just like Palestinians emphasize
the most Jews in Israel have no recent roots in the place, this silly
game is played by both. On a similar note one can also claim that
what
is in the Torah about a god having given some land to some people, is
at best a myth perpeturated throughout the ages, or at worst a lie to
try to seize land from others. NO ONE can prove it one way or the
other. But does that stop people from acting according to those
beliefs as if they are facts? Of course not because they are
accepted
as facts against all logic. A prime reason this silly conflict goes
on
and on.
[WJ20K]
That is a erroneous point as Muslims (as stated in the Quran) as well
as
Jews believe the land was given to the Israelites. What is in dispute
is
the lineage of present day settlers of Israel whoMuslims do not believe
are
decendents of the Israelites of old or that Ishmael is a decendent of
Arbaham and the Arabs are also entitled to the land as dictated by the
Abrahamic covenent.
As my family's lineage can be traced back in Tiberias to a time prior to
the
birth of their prophet, that point is also moot.
Mickey
Talking about such silly matters as lineage, who came first etc.
totally misses the point and is always employed by those who do not
want to look at the true causes of the conflict today.
[WJ20K]
Tracing lineage is only helpful to the ego of the perrson doing the tracing.
Can only agree with you on that. Same goes to those who trace history
too far to determine events today.
[WJ20K]
It nevers takes into consideration the very likelihood of an early visit by
the milkman.
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "øéòéï áøúåïý/Riain Barton" |
|
| Title: Re: Internationalize Jerusalem |
19 Jun 2005 03:41:08 PM |
|
|
Which is why Jewish lineage is through WOMEN only!
"JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:Wvfte.30806$J12.2279@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com...
:
: "WJ20K" <webjunk20000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
: news:1119173289.975852.205820@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
: >
: >
: > Mickey wrote:
: >> "JokingYou" <jeffile@pacbell.net> wrote in message
: >> news:BtWse.30465$J12.23598@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com...
: >> >
: >> > "WJ20K" <webjunk20000@yahoo.com> wrote in message
: >> > news:1119071645.009095.16290@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
: >> > > Coming from someone who posts cooking recipes, using dead
children
: >> > > from
: >> > > this conflict, on the net it is rather interesting to note that
the
: >> > > same person states " Most sources on Arafat are highly
contradictory,
: >> > > due to the numerous lies Arafat told about himself and his past
over
: >> > > the course of his too-long life." How someone like that
believes
: >> > > they
: >> > > are able to determine what are lies, what is myth and what is
reality
: >> > > is highly questionable. There is also a slew of 'evidence'
that all
: >> > > show Palestinian heritage for each and every one of the ones
which
: >> > > point away. Let us not forget that this is something that is
in the
: >> > > interest of Israeli's to emphasize, just like Palestinians
emphasize
: >> > > the most Jews in Israel have no recent roots in the place, this
silly
: >> > > game is played by both. On a similar note one can also claim
that
: >> > > what
: >> > > is in the Torah about a god having given some land to some
people, is
: >> > > at best a myth perpeturated throughout the ages, or at worst a
lie to
: >> > > try to seize land from others. NO ONE can prove it one way or
the
: >> > > other. But does that stop people from acting according to
those
: >> > > beliefs as if they are facts? Of course not because they are
: >> > > accepted
: >> > > as facts against all logic. A prime reason this silly conflict
goes
: >> > > on
: >> > > and on.
: >> > > [WJ20K]
: >> > >
: >> > That is a erroneous point as Muslims (as stated in the Quran) as
well
: >> > as
: >> > Jews believe the land was given to the Israelites. What is in
dispute
: >> > is
: >> > the lineage of present day settlers of Israel whoMuslims do not
believe
: >> are
: >> > decendents of the Israelites of old or that Ishmael is a
decendent of
: >> > Arbaham and the Arabs are also entitled to the land as dictated
by the
: >> > Abrahamic covenent.
: >>
: >> As my family's lineage can be traced back in Tiberias to a time
prior to
: >> the
: >> birth of their prophet, that point is also moot.
: >>
: >> Mickey
: >
: > Talking about such silly matters as lineage, who came first etc.
: > totally misses the point and is always employed by those who do not
: > want to look at the true causes of the conflict today.
: > [WJ20K]
:
: Tracing lineage is only helpful to the ego of the perrson doing the
tracing.
: It nevers takes into consideration the very likelihood of an early
visit by
: the milkman.
: >
:
:
.
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