| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Monist" |
| Date: |
31 Dec 2003 08:45:51 AM |
| Object: |
Iran and the earthquake |
The recent earthquake in Iran should remind us to be careful not to allow our
secular society to slip back into becoming a religious one.. Here the loss of
40,000 human beings is accepted as God's will, while we would be enraged if our
government depended on prayer instead of well designed buildings to protect us
from the whims of nature. San Francisco has been subject to earthquakes of
greater magnitude without anywhere near this level of casualties . A secular
society would never tolerate a loss of such magnitude.
South America, too, is potentially every bit as rich as is this
continent, but along with science, the explorers also imported Catholicism, so
poverty and cruelty have been more prevalent in their culture. Birth Control is
frowned upon and idealogy is blindly worshipped- at least until late.
Cheers
Monist
===========================================
This is not a dress rehearsal. This is the only
world you will ever know and this is the only
life you will ever have. Seize the Day.
.
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: Iran and the earthquake |
31 Dec 2003 09:50:46 AM |
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And so upon Wed, 31 Dec 2003 14:45:51 +0000 didst Monist speak thusly:
The recent earthquake in Iran should remind us to be careful not to
allow our secular society to slip back into becoming a religious one..
Here the loss of 40,000 human beings is accepted as God's will, while we
would be enraged if our government depended on prayer instead of well
designed buildings to protect us from the whims of nature. San Francisco
has been subject to earthquakes of greater magnitude without anywhere
near this level of casualties . A secular society would never tolerate a
loss of such magnitude.
Yes. So much for "god" protecting anybody.
Bam has a population of about 90,000. The official (but still rising)
death toll is around 20,000 (with an estimated 50,000 wounded).
That's about 22% of the population. Or even if you use the figures for the
district which includes Bam (about 200,000 inhabitants), that's still
about 10%.
The 1994 Northridge quake in LA County killed 60 people. The quake was a
6.7 verses a 6.6 for the Bam quake. The area within LA County the quake
affected has a population of about 3 million. That's 0.002% deaths.
Northridge, alone, has a population comparable to Bam. Even if all the
deaths from the '94 quake were concentrated solely in Northridge (they
weren't, this is for sake argument), that yields about 333 *TIMES* more
deaths in Bam. For every death in Northridge, 333 died in Bam.
The '89 Santa Cruz quake hit in a county of about 230,000 (San Francisco
was, of course, affected also but the quake was centered in Santa Cruz
county). There were about 63 deaths in a 7.1 magnitude quake. Assuming all
those deaths in Santa Cruz county alone (they weren't) still only reaches
a death rate of 0.027%. The overall region affected has a population of
about 2.6 (and change) million. A death rate of 0.0024% approximately.
A death rate around the Bam numbers (let's take the lower of the two at
10%) would have meant 300,000 deaths in the Northridge quake and 260,000
in the Santa Cruz quake. Or more as both quakes were stronger than the Bam
quake.
Hm... god's will eh?
Apparently these "god" things will lots of death. And those awful,
horrible secular humanist types "will" lots of people to survive.
Or maybe these god things are "willing" we should stop believe in them and
do our science homework...
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
"There is no system but GNU, and Linux is one of its kernels."
.
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| User: "Clayton the Transitional Fossil Wannabe" |
|
| Title: Re: Iran and the earthquake |
31 Dec 2003 06:47:44 PM |
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"Mark K. Bilbo" <noem@il.huh> wrote in message
news:pan.2003.12.31.15.50.45.510451@il.huh...
And so upon Wed, 31 Dec 2003 14:45:51 +0000 didst Monist speak thusly:
The recent earthquake in Iran should remind us to be careful not to
allow our secular society to slip back into becoming a religious one..
Here the loss of 40,000 human beings is accepted as God's will, while we
would be enraged if our government depended on prayer instead of well
designed buildings to protect us from the whims of nature. San Francisco
has been subject to earthquakes of greater magnitude without anywhere
near this level of casualties . A secular society would never tolerate a
loss of such magnitude.
Yes. So much for "god" protecting anybody.
Bam has a population of about 90,000. The official (but still rising)
death toll is around 20,000 (with an estimated 50,000 wounded).
On the news they said it was closing in on 30 000 with the probability of it
going close to 50 000 with over 100 000 injured.
That's about 22% of the population. Or even if you use the figures for the
district which includes Bam (about 200,000 inhabitants), that's still
about 10%.
The 1994 Northridge quake in LA County killed 60 people. The quake was a
6.7 verses a 6.6 for the Bam quake. The area within LA County the quake
affected has a population of about 3 million. That's 0.002% deaths.
Northridge, alone, has a population comparable to Bam. Even if all the
deaths from the '94 quake were concentrated solely in Northridge (they
weren't, this is for sake argument), that yields about 333 *TIMES* more
deaths in Bam. For every death in Northridge, 333 died in Bam.
The '89 Santa Cruz quake hit in a county of about 230,000 (San Francisco
was, of course, affected also but the quake was centered in Santa Cruz
county). There were about 63 deaths in a 7.1 magnitude quake. Assuming all
those deaths in Santa Cruz county alone (they weren't) still only reaches
a death rate of 0.027%. The overall region affected has a population of
about 2.6 (and change) million. A death rate of 0.0024% approximately.
A death rate around the Bam numbers (let's take the lower of the two at
10%) would have meant 300,000 deaths in the Northridge quake and 260,000
in the Santa Cruz quake. Or more as both quakes were stronger than the Bam
quake.
Hm... god's will eh?
Apparently these "god" things will lots of death. And those awful,
horrible secular humanist types "will" lots of people to survive.
Or maybe these god things are "willing" we should stop believe in them and
do our science homework...
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
"There is no system but GNU, and Linux is one of its kernels."
.
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| User: "Amananon" |
|
| Title: Re: Iran and the earthquake |
01 Jan 2004 12:08:31 PM |
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Apparently these "god" things will lots of death. And those awful,
horrible secular humanist types "will" lots of people to survive.
A good point: us vs. god. If a very sick patient gets better, it's a
"miricle" to a believing doctor, but a "success" to a non-believing
one. Non-believers give credit to their own actions. How many people
do stupid things (not the least of which is terrorism) believing they
are in god's hands, and He wouldn't let them suffer? A non-believing
world might be a more responsible one in that sense.
"Friends, I agree with you in Providence; but I believe in the
Providence of the most men, the largest purse, and the longest
cannon." --Abraham Lincoln
"Mark K. Bilbo" <noem@il.huh> wrote in message news:<pan.2003.12.31.15.50.45.510451@il.huh>...
And so upon Wed, 31 Dec 2003 14:45:51 +0000 didst Monist speak thusly:
The recent earthquake in Iran should remind us to be careful not to
allow our secular society to slip back into becoming a religious one..
Here the loss of 40,000 human beings is accepted as God's will, while we
would be enraged if our government depended on prayer instead of well
designed buildings to protect us from the whims of nature. San Francisco
has been subject to earthquakes of greater magnitude without anywhere
near this level of casualties . A secular society would never tolerate a
loss of such magnitude.
Yes. So much for "god" protecting anybody.
Bam has a population of about 90,000. The official (but still rising)
death toll is around 20,000 (with an estimated 50,000 wounded).
That's about 22% of the population. Or even if you use the figures for the
district which includes Bam (about 200,000 inhabitants), that's still
about 10%.
The 1994 Northridge quake in LA County killed 60 people. The quake was a
6.7 verses a 6.6 for the Bam quake. The area within LA County the quake
affected has a population of about 3 million. That's 0.002% deaths.
Northridge, alone, has a population comparable to Bam. Even if all the
deaths from the '94 quake were concentrated solely in Northridge (they
weren't, this is for sake argument), that yields about 333 *TIMES* more
deaths in Bam. For every death in Northridge, 333 died in Bam.
The '89 Santa Cruz quake hit in a county of about 230,000 (San Francisco
was, of course, affected also but the quake was centered in Santa Cruz
county). There were about 63 deaths in a 7.1 magnitude quake. Assuming all
those deaths in Santa Cruz county alone (they weren't) still only reaches
a death rate of 0.027%. The overall region affected has a population of
about 2.6 (and change) million. A death rate of 0.0024% approximately.
A death rate around the Bam numbers (let's take the lower of the two at
10%) would have meant 300,000 deaths in the Northridge quake and 260,000
in the Santa Cruz quake. Or more as both quakes were stronger than the Bam
quake.
Hm... god's will eh?
Apparently these "god" things will lots of death. And those awful,
horrible secular humanist types "will" lots of people to survive.
Or maybe these god things are "willing" we should stop believe in them and
do our science homework...
.
|
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
|
| Title: Re: Iran and the earthquake |
01 Jan 2004 09:31:42 PM |
|
|
And so upon Thu, 01 Jan 2004 10:08:31 -0800 didst Amananon speak thusly:
Apparently these "god" things will lots of death. And those awful,
horrible secular humanist types "will" lots of people to survive.
A good point: us vs. god. If a very sick patient gets better, it's a
"miricle" to a believing doctor, but a "success" to a non-believing
one. Non-believers give credit to their own actions. How many people
do stupid things (not the least of which is terrorism) believing they
are in god's hands, and He wouldn't let them suffer? A non-believing
world might be a more responsible one in that sense.
I've thought for some time that one of the bad side effects of a belief in
an afterlife is violence.
Death *should scare us...
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
"There is no system but GNU, and Linux is one of its kernels."
.
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| User: "Amananon" |
|
| Title: Re: Iran and the earthquake |
02 Jan 2004 03:26:07 PM |
|
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I've thought for some time that one of the bad side effects of a belief in
an afterlife is violence.
That is, especially if the creator rewards such violence with eternal
paradise.
The way I see it, the point of responsibility in religious works is
presumably threatening people with eternal torture (afterlife) if they
don't behave correctly. What is correct for any given religion is not
always spelled out clearly, though, and if so it sometimes values the
glory of the believer's diety rather than peace; as such it is often
the opinion of prophets who themselves are often delerious in a trance
by which delerium presumably they receive prophecy. Then, it's up to
officials to decide what in the heap of lisping utterances and madness
(scripture thus submitted) to keep and what to discard. Therefore,
some material that's on the edge of discarding (or of insanity) may
have been kept (i.e., in the Bible)-- perhaps most of it-- for various
merits or redeeming qualities in spite of some dubious content.
Divine Madness:
http://216.239.37.99/search?q=cache:jtaPjr-ztfIJ:www.artdsm.com/religiondetoxification/step5of7.html+step5of7&hl=en&ie=UTF-8
Excerpt:
"The Quran uses the word 'majnoon' to describe mad persons as well as
prophets."
Interesting site [notice that it has changed and the above excerpt
only exists temporarily in Google's cache]:
http://www.artdsm.com/religiondetoxification/notice_of_intent.html
----------------------------------------
"Mark K. Bilbo" <noem@il.huh> wrote in message news:<pan.2004.01.02.03.31.42.416753@il.huh>...
And so upon Thu, 01 Jan 2004 10:08:31 -0800 didst Amananon speak thusly:
Apparently these "god" things will lots of death. And those awful,
horrible secular humanist types "will" lots of people to survive.
A good point: us vs. god. If a very sick patient gets better, it's a
"miricle" to a believing doctor, but a "success" to a non-believing
one. Non-believers give credit to their own actions. How many people
do stupid things (not the least of which is terrorism) believing they
are in god's hands, and He wouldn't let them suffer? A non-believing
world might be a more responsible one in that sense.
I've thought for some time that one of the bad side effects of a belief in
an afterlife is violence.
Death *should scare us...
.
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