| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"david ford" |
| Date: |
01 Mar 2006 09:17:21 PM |
| Object: |
Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
As you may know, I have come out in favor of exterminating all
sub-persons.
Sub-persons/ sub-humans are expendable.
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1139372980.005787.15450%40f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com
in praise of eugenics and terminating defective human life
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1138912784.946032.323570%40g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com
Kill/ death to [Darwin]"imbecile, maimed, and other useless members of
society"
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1135791290.639930.285730%40f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com
I would like to use German terminology. Is 'unter-personen' German for
'sub-persons'?
Haldane, J.B.S. 1928. _Possible Worlds and Other Papers_ (NY and
London: Harper and Brothers Publishers), 305pp. On 206, from the last
paragraph of the essay "Eugenics and Social Reform":
....if you desire to check the increase of any
population or section of a population, either
massacre it or....
.... Civilization stands in real danger from over-
production of 'undermen.'
///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Darwin: [Greg]"the careless, squalid, unaspiring Irishman multiplies
like rabbits"
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1135088486.532238.194930%40g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com
Darwin: "the New Zealander... compares his future fate with that of the
native rat now almost exterminated by the European rat"
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1135178729.788016.144250%40o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com
Hitler's actions make sense given his atheism and eugenic, social
Darwinist vision
http://groups.google.co.in/groups?selm=dford3-1134145559.645139.229550%40f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com
1940 Haldane on materialism
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=s0c890946imhfig6q7uq1cid7hhj68ppbs%404ax.com
Gould, John Maynard Smith, J.B.S. Haldane, and Richard Lewontin were
Marxists; 2004 R.J. Rummel's "The killing machine that is Marxism"
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-32gfjsF3l6o15U1%40individual.net
Hitler & Darwin URLs
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1140576033.123225.228290%40o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com
Reagan
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=1131387293.922571.147570%40f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com
Reality vs. worldview philosophy of materialism/ atheism
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-3813ksF5ggkc3U1%40individual.net
On the Origin of Life
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-39oh33F63riraU1%40individual.net
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
01 Mar 2006 10:16:54 PM |
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In <dford3-1141269441.235631.242980@e56g2000cwe.googlegroups.com>, "david
ford" <dford3@gl.umbc.edu> wrote:
As you may know, I have come out in favor of exterminating all
sub-persons.
Suicide is *not the answer David.
--
Mark K. Bilbo
--------------------------------------------------
I just love this...
"For those of us who grew up in Louisiana,
'The Wizard of Oz' was like a documentary.
Dorothy left Kansas and simply went to Mardi Gras."
http://makeashorterlink.com/?W2EA439BC
Um... didn't foresee what exactly?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?B5CA129BC
"Everything New Orleans"
http://www.nola.com
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| User: "david ford" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
02 Mar 2006 08:58:12 AM |
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Mark K. Bilbo wrote:
In <dford3-1141269441.235631.242980@e56g2000cwe.googlegroups.com>, "david
ford" <dford3@gl.umbc.edu> wrote:
As you may know, I have come out in favor of exterminating all
sub-persons.
Suicide is *not the answer David.
What then _is_ "the answer"/ solution?
Goebbels diary entry for 13 May 1943
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1120450591.444214.186670%40g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com
One might well ask why are there any Jews in the world order?
That would be exactly like asking why are there potato bugs?
Nature is dominated by the law of struggle. There will always
be parasites who will spur this struggle on and intensify the
process of selection between the strong and the weak. The
principle of struggle dominates also in human life. One must
merely know the laws of this struggle to be able to face it. ....
In nature life always takes measures against parasites; in the life
of nations that is not always the case. From this fact the Jewish
peril actually stems. There is therefore no other recourse left
for modern nations except to exterminate the Jew....
....we are forever members of the Aryan race. .... Aboriginal
man, the Fuehrer believes, did not know the lie....
The nations that have been the first to see through the Jew and
have been the first to fight him are going to take his place in the
domination of the world.
Draft 2 of a chronology of Darwinian thought and the march to the Final
Solution
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1122434358.640904.162640%40z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com
Hitler's actions make sense given his atheism and eugenic, social
Darwinist vision
http://groups.google.co.in/groups?selm=dford3-1134145559.645139.229550%40f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com
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| User: "Thurisaz, Germanic barbarian" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
01 Mar 2006 10:14:34 PM |
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Too dumb to consult a dictionary without help from others.
By the way dumbford, adding some fancy words will not magically transform
your standard lies into truth. I know that's hard for you to understand
with your three working brain cells, especially considering that you
routinely believe in magic, but well... that's the facts.
--
"To his friend a man a friend shall prove, and gifts with gifts requite;
But men shall mocking with mockery answer, and fraud with falsehood meet."
(The Poetic Edda)
Must have been written with fundies in mind...
Why I am not a christian:
http://www.carcosa.de/nojebus/nojebus
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| User: "david ford" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
02 Mar 2006 08:53:10 AM |
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Thurisaz, Germanic barbarian wrote:
Too dumb to consult a dictionary without help from others.
By the way dumbford, adding some fancy words will not magically transform
your standard lies into truth. I know that's hard for you to understand
with your three working brain cells, especially considering that you
routinely believe in magic, but well... that's the facts.
"you [df] routinely believe in magic"
I hardly consider belief in spontaneous generation, blindwatchmaking,
and mental spoon-bending to be belief in "magic."
http://www.google.com/groups?selm=b1c67abe.0401291120.41a6d843%40posting.google.com
On the Origin of Life
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-39oh33F63riraU1%40individual.net
Timeline of Materialism, Spontaneous Generation, and Blindwatchmaking
Views
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-348jecF47mfcjU1%40individual.net
Reality supports the worldview philosophy of materialism/ atheism
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-3813ksF5ggkc3U1%40individual.net
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| User: "Thurisaz, Germanic barbarian" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
02 Mar 2006 12:23:44 PM |
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david ford wrote:
I hardly consider belief in spontaneous generation, blindwatchmaking,
and mental spoon-bending to be belief in "magic."
And it isn't. That's obviously why you believe in the ludicrous claims like
"Darwin laid the foundation for hitler" or in babblical cretinism. This
***** is 100 % certified free of facts, pure nonsense.
--
"To his friend a man a friend shall prove, and gifts with gifts requite;
But men shall mocking with mockery answer, and fraud with falsehood meet."
(The Poetic Edda)
Must have been written with fundies in mind...
Why I am not a christian:
http://www.carcosa.de/nojebus/nojebus
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| User: "david ford" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
02 Mar 2006 05:46:05 PM |
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Thurisaz, Germanic barbarian wrote:
david ford wrote:
I hardly consider belief in spontaneous generation, blindwatchmaking,
and mental spoon-bending to be belief in "magic."
And it isn't. That's obviously why you believe in the ludicrous claims like
"Darwin laid the foundation for hitler" or in babblical cretinism. This
***** is 100 % certified free of facts, pure nonsense.
Do you see any Simpson remarks below you consider "nonsense"?
materialism
Simpson, George Gaylord. 1949. _The Meaning of
Evolution: A Study of the History of Life and of Its
Significance for Man_ (New Haven: Yale University Press),
364pp., from the chapter "Epilogue and Summary" on 344:
Man is the result of a purposeless materialistic process
that did not have him in mind. He was not planned. He
is a state of matter, a form of life, a sort of animal, and a
species of the Order Primates, akin nearly or remotely to
all of life and indeed to all that is material.
On 343:
Although many details remain to be worked out, it is
already evident that all the objective phenomena of the
history of life can be explained by purely materialistic
factors.
spontaneous generation
Simpson, George Gaylord. 1949. _The Meaning of Evolution: A Study of
the History of Life and of Its Significance for Man_ (New Haven, CT:
Yale University Press), 364pp. On 340:
Studies on other bases demonstrate not only the possibility but
also the probability that life arose from the inorganic
spontaneously, that is, without supernatural intervention and by
the operation of material processes, themselves of unknown origin,
sometime during the first half billion years or so of the earth's
existence in about its presence condition.
spontaneous generation
Simpson, George Gaylord. 1960. "The World into Which Darwin Led Us"
_Science_ 131: 966-74. On 969:
The consensus is that life did arise naturally from the nonliving
and that even the first living things were not specially created.
The conclusion has, indeed, really become inescapable, for the
first steps in that process have already been repeated in several
laboratories. There is concerted study from geochemical,
biochemical, and microbiological approaches. At a recent meeting
in Chicago, a highly distinguished international panel of experts
was polled. All considered the experimental production of life in
the laboratory imminent....
spontaneous generation
Simpson, George Gaylord. 1964. "The Nonprevalence of Humanoids"
_Science_ 143: 769-75. On 771:
There are wide differences of opinion as to the particular course
followed [in the origin of life], but here again there is near
unanimity on the essential points. Virtually all biochemists agree
that life on earth arose spontaneously from nonliving matter and
that it would almost inevitably arise on sufficiently similar young
planets elsewhere. That confidence is based on chemical
experience.
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
1985 A.G. Cairns-Smith, 1986 Andrew Scott, 1999 Freeman Dyson
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-33bltcF3rgbovU1%40individual.net
some 1915-1999 doses of reality
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-33arf3F3vjdggU1%40individual.net
Timeline of Materialism, Spontaneous Generation, and Blindwatchmaking
Views
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-348jecF47mfcjU1%40individual.net
On the Origin of Life
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-39oh33F63riraU1%40individual.net
Reality vs. worldview philosophy of materialism/ atheism
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-3813ksF5ggkc3U1%40individual.net
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| User: "Thurisaz, Germanic barbarian" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
02 Mar 2006 10:13:20 PM |
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dumbford babbled:
Do you see any Simpson remarks below you consider "nonsense"?
I'm talking to you, not your collection of moronic out-of-context quotes. If
you have a point to make, make it yourself. Your ***** quotes are
amusing, and useful to anyone who wants to prove the state of utter
braindeath you fundie bastards commit yourself to, but they will not make
you win any argument.
Of course, we all know that you have no arguments beside your *****
quotes (in other words, you cannot convince anyone who isn't either fully
brainwashed or braindead), so you can just as well get lost. Remember, you
admitted that you have no idea what your own "scripture" says, as you just
confessed.
You lost. Live with it.
--
"To his friend a man a friend shall prove, and gifts with gifts requite;
But men shall mocking with mockery answer, and fraud with falsehood meet."
(The Poetic Edda)
Must have been written with fundies in mind...
Why I am not a christian:
http://www.carcosa.de/nojebus/nojebus
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| User: "Rick" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
02 Mar 2006 03:34:12 PM |
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david ford wrote in message ...
As you may know, I have come out in favor of exterminating all
sub-persons.
[snip]
Unter-personen is German for "Frederic L. Rice." But I wouldn't recommend
exterminating him. He's kinda fun to play with.
- Rick
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| User: "Dave" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
01 Mar 2006 09:33:37 PM |
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david ford wrote:
As you may know, I have come out in favor of exterminating all
sub-persons.
Start with yourself.
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| User: "david ford" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
01 Mar 2006 10:07:20 PM |
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Dave wrote:
david ford wrote:
As you may know, I have come out in favor of exterminating all
sub-persons.
Start with yourself.
I'm not one of the sub-persons.
As for the Irish....
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Darwin: [Greg]"the careless, squalid, unaspiring Irishman multiplies
like rabbits"
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1135088486.532238.194930%40g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com
1871 Darwin: [CD]"the civilised races of man"-- e.g. [CD]"the
Caucasian"-- [CD]"will almost certainly exterminate and replace
throughout the world the savage races"-- e.g. [CD]"the negro or
Australian," as in Australian aborigine-- with the end result being
[CD]"man in a more civilised state, as we may hope, than the Caucasian"
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=b1c67abe.0407060404.711490be%40posting.google.com
Darwin: "the New Zealander... compares his future fate with that of the
native rat now almost exterminated by the European rat"
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1135178729.788016.144250%40o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com
is Darwin, or Hitler, today's most-famous Darwinist?
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1138681336.761356.170100%40z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com
historical background to rise and fall of the Synthetic Euphoria; 1936
A. Franklin Shull
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=b1c67abe.0403271329.1e569adf%40posting.google.com
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| User: "kathryn" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
02 Mar 2006 08:21:11 AM |
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"david ford" <dford3@gl.umbc.edu> wrote in message
news:dford3-1141272440.045077.292940@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Dave wrote:
david ford wrote:
As you may know, I have come out in favor of exterminating all
sub-persons.
Start with yourself.
I'm not one of the sub-persons.
your actions say otherwise
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| User: "david ford" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
02 Mar 2006 08:48:02 AM |
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kathryn wrote:
"david ford" <dford3@gl.umbc.edu> wrote in message
news:dford3-1141272440.045077.292940@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Dave wrote:
david ford wrote:
As you may know, I have come out in favor of exterminating all
sub-persons.
Start with yourself.
I'm not one of the sub-persons.
your actions say otherwise
What are the "actions" of sub-persons?
Excessive breeding?
Dying out?
Darwin: [Greg]"the careless, squalid, unaspiring Irishman multiplies
like rabbits"
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1135088486.532238.194930%40g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com
Darwin: "the New Zealander... compares his future fate with that of the
native rat now almost exterminated by the European rat"
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1135178729.788016.144250%40o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com
1871 Darwin: [CD]"the civilised races of man"-- e.g. [CD]"the
Caucasian"-- [CD]"will almost certainly exterminate and replace
throughout the world the savage races"-- e.g. [CD]"the negro or
Australian," as in Australian aborigine-- with the end result being
[CD]"man in a more civilised state, as we may hope, than the Caucasian"
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=b1c67abe.0407060404.711490be%40posting.google.com
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| User: "Dave" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
02 Mar 2006 07:30:10 AM |
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david ford wrote:
Dave wrote:
david ford wrote:
As you may know, I have come out in favor of exterminating all
sub-persons.
Start with yourself.
I'm not one of the sub-persons.
Prove it.
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| User: "david ford" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
02 Mar 2006 08:44:41 AM |
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Dave wrote:
david ford wrote:
Dave wrote:
david ford wrote:
As you may know, I have come out in favor of exterminating all
sub-persons.
Start with yourself.
I'm not one of the sub-persons.
Prove it.
No. And I'm not going to "prove" that [Darwin]"the lower races of man"
_are_ sub-persons.
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Darwin: big "supra-orbital ridges... characteristic of the lower races
of man"
http://www.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1137443730.121635.125640%40z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com
Buchner, Ludwig. 1872. _Der Mensch und seine Stellung in der Natur_,
2nd edition (Leipzig), 147. Cited in
Weikart, Richard. 2004. _From Darwin to Hitler: Evolutionary Ethics,
Eugenics, and Racism in Germany_ (USA: Palgrave Macmillan), 312pp.,
191. About Weikart's book:
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=b1c67abe.0407030531.19253d93%40posting.google.com
The white or Caucasian human species is ordained
to take dominion of the earth, while the lowest
human races, like Americans, Australians, Alfuren,
Hottentots, and such others, are proceeding toward
their destruction with huge steps.
1871 Darwin: [CD]"the civilised races of man"-- e.g. [CD]"the
Caucasian"-- [CD]"will almost certainly exterminate and replace
throughout the world the savage races"-- e.g. [CD]"the negro or
Australian," as in Australian aborigine-- with the end result being
[CD]"man in a more civilised state, as we may hope, than the Caucasian"
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=b1c67abe.0407060404.711490be%40posting.google.com
1874 Darwin: "mongrel population of Negroes and Portuguese....
population of mingled Polynesian and English blood....
population of Polynesians and Negritos crossed in all degrees....
a much crossed race of Portuguese and Indians, with a mixture of the
blood of other races"
http://groups.google.co.in/groups?selm=dford3-1136494819.673310.232510%40g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com
1923 Holmes; parallel between Hitler and [Darwin]"the inferior vitality
of mulattoes is spoken of in a trustworthy work*(5) as a well-known
phenomenon"
http://groups.google.co.in/groups?selm=dford3-1133927305.339964.266320%40o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com
1859 Darwin vs. the Judeo-Christian conception of the unity of man
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1120016676.023811.113660%40g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com
Hitler & Darwin URLs
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1140576033.123225.228290%40o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com
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| User: "Olrik" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
02 Mar 2006 10:57:50 PM |
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david ford wrote:
Dave wrote:
david ford wrote:
As you may know, I have come out in favor of exterminating all
sub-persons.
Start with yourself.
I'm not one of the sub-persons.
That's not for you to say. I declare you a "sub-person". Off with your head.
As for the Irish....
--
Olrik
aa #1981
Qualified SMASH member
EAC Chief Food Inspector, Bacon Division
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| User: "Thurisaz the Einherjer" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
01 Mar 2006 10:31:37 PM |
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david ford wrote:
I'm not one of the sub-persons.
"Thou shalt not bear false witness"
Makes dumbford a "subperson" clearly, according to the standards proposed in
its own wholly babble.
--
Romans 2:24 revised:
"For the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles through you
cretinists, as it is written on aig."
Why I am not a christian:
http://www.carcosa.de/nojebus/nojebus
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| User: "david ford" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
02 Mar 2006 08:37:34 AM |
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Robert J. Kolker wrote:
Thurisaz the Einherjer wrote:
david ford wrote:
I'm not one of the sub-persons.
"Thou shalt not bear false witness"
False witness means lying under oath.
Did Clinton engage in "false witness"?
Democrat Sex Harassment & Coverup Guidelines; Willey; Jones; Lewinsky
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=Pine.SGI.3.96A.990129001746.1045886D-100000%40umbc9.umbc.edu
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| User: "AC" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
02 Mar 2006 03:22:51 PM |
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On 2 Mar 2006 06:37:34 -0800,
david ford <dford3@gl.umbc.edu> wrote:
Robert J. Kolker wrote:
Thurisaz the Einherjer wrote:
david ford wrote:
I'm not one of the sub-persons.
"Thou shalt not bear false witness"
False witness means lying under oath.
Did Clinton engage in "false witness"?
Very definitely, but that has nothing to do with topic at hand. Do you
think your immoral behavior is excused because a politician lied? Yes or no
will do.
--
Aaron Clausen
mightymartianca@hotmail.com
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| User: "david ford" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
02 Mar 2006 07:25:33 PM |
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AC wrote:
On 2 Mar 2006 david ford:
Robert J. Kolker wrote:
Thurisaz the Einherjer wrote:
david ford wrote:
I'm not one of the sub-persons.
"Thou shalt not bear false witness"
False witness means lying under oath.
Did Clinton engage in "false witness"?
Very definitely, but that has nothing to do with topic at hand.
What is the "topic at hand"?
Do you think your immoral behavior is excused because a politician lied? Yes or no
will do.
"your [df's] immoral behavior"
What "immoral behavior"? I haven't eaten beef in a while. Eating beef
is immoral.
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| User: "AC" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
03 Mar 2006 05:29:48 PM |
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On 2 Mar 2006 17:25:33 -0800,
david ford <dford3@gl.umbc.edu> wrote:
AC wrote:
On 2 Mar 2006 david ford:
Robert J. Kolker wrote:
Thurisaz the Einherjer wrote:
david ford wrote:
I'm not one of the sub-persons.
"Thou shalt not bear false witness"
False witness means lying under oath.
Did Clinton engage in "false witness"?
Very definitely, but that has nothing to do with topic at hand.
What is the "topic at hand"?
I thought we were talking about certain Nazi racial theories. I can't
imagine what Clinton has to do with that.
Do you think your immoral behavior is excused because a politician lied? Yes or no
will do.
"your [df's] immoral behavior"
What "immoral behavior"? I haven't eaten beef in a while. Eating beef
is immoral.
You really aren't very funny, David.
Your immoral behavior is your bearing false witness. For that, according to
a popular Western religion, you will burn for eternity. Perhaps then you
might get the chance to ask Hitler about his religiuos beliefs.
--
Aaron Clausen
mightymartianca@hotmail.com
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| User: "stew dean" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
03 Mar 2006 02:04:28 AM |
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david ford wrote:
AC wrote:
Do you think your immoral behavior is excused because a politician lied? Yes or no
will do.
"your [df's] immoral behavior"
What "immoral behavior"? I haven't eaten beef in a while. Eating beef
is immoral.
David, I am a vegetarian. I consider this a responsible act given what
I know and, being an omnivore, I have that choice with no negative
affects on my health.
Now you are saying that eating beef is immoral. I'd love to know your
reasons as I strongly doubt your reasons for not eating beef are
anything like mine. I've seen you claim it is 'speciesism' or something
like that - that realy make me laugh as that makes all carnivores evil
which I think is a load of rubbish.
So - without using quotes or links which I will ignore as always - why
do think eating meat is immoral? Let's see if you can give a straight
answer.
Stew Dean
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| User: "david ford" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
03 Mar 2006 12:22:13 PM |
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stew dean wrote:
david ford wrote:
AC wrote:
Do you think your immoral behavior is excused because a politician lied? Yes or no
will do.
"your [df's] immoral behavior"
What "immoral behavior"? I haven't eaten beef in a while. Eating beef
is immoral.
David, I am a vegetarian.
Do you eat eggs?
I consider this a responsible act given what
I know and, being an omnivore, I have that choice with no negative
affects on my health.
Now you are saying that eating beef is immoral. I'd love to know your
reasons as I strongly doubt your reasons for not eating beef are
anything like mine. I've seen you claim it is 'speciesism' or something
like that - that realy make me laugh as that makes all carnivores evil
which I think is a load of rubbish.
So - without using quotes or links which I will ignore as always - why
do think eating meat is immoral? Let's see if you can give a straight
answer.
It's my feeling that eating beef is immoral.
It's also my feeling that killing sub-persons is moral.
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Sub-persons/ sub-humans are expendable.
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dford3-1139372980.005787.15450%40f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com
[Humanist Manifesto II, at
<http://www.americanhumanist.org/about/manifesto2.html]"THIRD: We
affirm that moral values derive their source from human experience.
Ethics is autonomous and situational needing no theological or
ideological sanction. Ethics stems from human need and interest."
[Humanist Manifesto III, at
<http://www.americanhumanist.org/3/HumandItsAspirations.htm]"The
lifestance of Humanism-- guided by reason, inspired by compassion, and
informed by experience-- encourages us to live life well and fully. It
evolved through the ages and continues to develop through the efforts
of thoughtful people who recognize that values and ideals, however
carefully wrought, are subject to change as our knowledge and
understandings advance."
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| User: "stew dean" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
03 Mar 2006 05:10:00 PM |
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david ford wrote:
stew dean wrote:
david ford wrote:
AC wrote:
Do you think your immoral behavior is excused because a politician lied? Yes or no
will do.
"your [df's] immoral behavior"
What "immoral behavior"? I haven't eaten beef in a while. Eating beef
is immoral.
David, I am a vegetarian.
Do you eat eggs?
Me: 'I am a vegetarian'
You: 'Do you eat eggs?'
What falls within the standard veggie diet? If I ate no animal products
at all what would I be?
I consider this a responsible act given what
I know and, being an omnivore, I have that choice with no negative
affects on my health.
Now you are saying that eating beef is immoral. I'd love to know your
reasons as I strongly doubt your reasons for not eating beef are
anything like mine. I've seen you claim it is 'speciesism' or something
like that - that realy make me laugh as that makes all carnivores evil
which I think is a load of rubbish.
So - without using quotes or links which I will ignore as always - why
do think eating meat is immoral? Let's see if you can give a straight
answer.
It's my feeling that eating beef is immoral.
Why?
Stew Dean
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| User: "David Jensen" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
03 Mar 2006 05:27:26 PM |
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On 3 Mar 2006 15:10:00 -0800, in talk.origins
"stew dean" <stewdean@gmail.com> wrote in
<1141427400.352033.58910@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>:
david ford wrote:
stew dean wrote:
david ford wrote:
AC wrote:
Do you think your immoral behavior is excused because a politician lied? Yes or no
will do.
"your [df's] immoral behavior"
What "immoral behavior"? I haven't eaten beef in a while. Eating beef
is immoral.
David, I am a vegetarian.
Do you eat eggs?
Me: 'I am a vegetarian'
You: 'Do you eat eggs?'
What falls within the standard veggie diet? If I ate no animal products
at all what would I be?
Vegan.
I consider this a responsible act given what
I know and, being an omnivore, I have that choice with no negative
affects on my health.
Now you are saying that eating beef is immoral. I'd love to know your
reasons as I strongly doubt your reasons for not eating beef are
anything like mine. I've seen you claim it is 'speciesism' or something
like that - that realy make me laugh as that makes all carnivores evil
which I think is a load of rubbish.
So - without using quotes or links which I will ignore as always - why
do think eating meat is immoral? Let's see if you can give a straight
answer.
It's my feeling that eating beef is immoral.
Why?
Cause cattle are smarter than he is.
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| User: "Ben Cramer" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
03 Mar 2006 07:26:48 PM |
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"David Jensen" <david@dajensen-family.com> wrote in message
news:h5kh02hqdgs0niirmg52jpb0dapfrbm8ve@4ax.com...
On 3 Mar 2006 15:10:00 -0800, in talk.origins
"stew dean" <stewdean@gmail.com> wrote in
<1141427400.352033.58910@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>:
david ford wrote:
stew dean wrote:
david ford wrote:
AC wrote:
Do you think your immoral behavior is excused because a
politician lied? Yes or no
will do.
"your [df's] immoral behavior"
What "immoral behavior"? I haven't eaten beef in a while. Eating
beef
is immoral.
David, I am a vegetarian.
Do you eat eggs?
Me: 'I am a vegetarian'
You: 'Do you eat eggs?'
What falls within the standard veggie diet? If I ate no animal products
at all what would I be?
Vegan.
Nope. Stupid.
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| User: "stew dean" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
04 Mar 2006 02:48:35 AM |
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Ben Cramer wrote:
"David Jensen" <david@dajensen-family.com> wrote in message
news:h5kh02hqdgs0niirmg52jpb0dapfrbm8ve@4ax.com...
On 3 Mar 2006 15:10:00 -0800, in talk.origins
"stew dean" <stewdean@gmail.com> wrote in
<1141427400.352033.58910@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>:
david ford wrote:
stew dean wrote:
david ford wrote:
AC wrote:
Do you think your immoral behavior is excused because a
politician lied? Yes or no
will do.
"your [df's] immoral behavior"
What "immoral behavior"? I haven't eaten beef in a while. Eating
beef
is immoral.
David, I am a vegetarian.
Do you eat eggs?
Me: 'I am a vegetarian'
You: 'Do you eat eggs?'
What falls within the standard veggie diet? If I ate no animal products
at all what would I be?
Vegan.
Nope. Stupid.
David was right Ben. It is Vegan - and no it's not stupid, it's
difficult and time consuming but not stupid.
Stew Dean
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| User: "Ben Cramer" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
04 Mar 2006 04:22:17 AM |
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"stew dean" <stewdean@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1141462115.289079.286900@p10g2000cwp.googlegroups.com...
Ben Cramer wrote:
"David Jensen" <david@dajensen-family.com> wrote in message
news:h5kh02hqdgs0niirmg52jpb0dapfrbm8ve@4ax.com...
On 3 Mar 2006 15:10:00 -0800, in talk.origins
"stew dean" <stewdean@gmail.com> wrote in
<1141427400.352033.58910@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>:
david ford wrote:
stew dean wrote:
david ford wrote:
AC wrote:
Do you think your immoral behavior is excused because a
politician lied? Yes or no
will do.
"your [df's] immoral behavior"
What "immoral behavior"? I haven't eaten beef in a while.
Eating
beef
is immoral.
David, I am a vegetarian.
Do you eat eggs?
Me: 'I am a vegetarian'
You: 'Do you eat eggs?'
What falls within the standard veggie diet? If I ate no animal products
at all what would I be?
Vegan.
Nope. Stupid.
David was right Ben. It is Vegan - and no it's not stupid, it's
difficult and time consuming but not stupid.
Stew Dean
If you want to die early, it's stupid. Most true vegans are anaemic, and
have very poor immune systems.
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| User: "stew dean" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
04 Mar 2006 04:41:14 AM |
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Ben Cramer wrote:
"stew dean" <stewdean@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1141462115.289079.286900@p10g2000cwp.googlegroups.com...
Ben Cramer wrote:
"David Jensen" <david@dajensen-family.com> wrote in message
news:h5kh02hqdgs0niirmg52jpb0dapfrbm8ve@4ax.com...
On 3 Mar 2006 15:10:00 -0800, in talk.origins
"stew dean" <stewdean@gmail.com> wrote in
<1141427400.352033.58910@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>:
david ford wrote:
stew dean wrote:
david ford wrote:
AC wrote:
Do you think your immoral behavior is excused because a
politician lied? Yes or no
will do.
"your [df's] immoral behavior"
What "immoral behavior"? I haven't eaten beef in a while.
Eating
beef
is immoral.
David, I am a vegetarian.
Do you eat eggs?
Me: 'I am a vegetarian'
You: 'Do you eat eggs?'
What falls within the standard veggie diet? If I ate no animal products
at all what would I be?
Vegan.
Nope. Stupid.
David was right Ben. It is Vegan - and no it's not stupid, it's
difficult and time consuming but not stupid.
Stew Dean
If you want to die early, it's stupid. Most true vegans are anaemic, and
have very poor immune systems.
I said being vegan is difficult - it is totaly possible to be a non
anaemic vegan. I'm a vegetarian and know that there's nothing I'm
missing in my diet.
Stew Dean
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| User: "Martin Hutton" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
04 Mar 2006 09:50:44 AM |
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stew dean wrote:
Ben Cramer wrote:
"stew dean" <stewdean@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1141462115.289079.286900@p10g2000cwp.googlegroups.com...
Ben Cramer wrote:
"David Jensen" <david@dajensen-family.com> wrote in message
news:h5kh02hqdgs0niirmg52jpb0dapfrbm8ve@4ax.com...
On 3 Mar 2006 15:10:00 -0800, in talk.origins
"stew dean" <stewdean@gmail.com> wrote in
<1141427400.352033.58910@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>:
[snip]
If I ate no animal products
at all what would I be?
Vegan.
Nope. Stupid.
David was right Ben. It is Vegan - and no it's not stupid, it's
difficult and time consuming but not stupid.
Stew Dean
If you want to die early, it's stupid. Most true vegans are anaemic, and
have very poor immune systems.
I said being vegan is difficult - it is totaly possible to be a non
anaemic vegan.
Back in the macrobiotic heyday several of my friends went
from plain vegetarian to vegan. They considered the pallid
skin and extra sick days a sign of health. I went back to an
omnivoran diet.
I'm a vegetarian and know that there's nothing I'm
missing in my diet.
Steak w/baked potato and salad, fish 'n' chips, spring lamb with early
potatoes and petit pois, lobster and drawn butter, buffalo wings, sushi
....the list is endless.
OH...you meant nutrients; RDA and stuff like that. Never mind. ;-)
--
Martin Hutton
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| User: "stew dean" |
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| Title: Re: Is 'unter-personen' German for 'sub-persons'? |
04 Mar 2006 10:35:09 AM |
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Martin Hutton wrote:
stew dean wrote:
Ben Cramer wrote:
"stew dean" <stewdean@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1141462115.289079.286900@p10g2000cwp.googlegroups.com...
Ben Cramer wrote:
"David Jensen" <david@dajensen-family.com> wrote in message
news:h5kh02hqdgs0niirmg52jpb0dapfrbm8ve@4ax.com...
On 3 Mar 2006 15:10:00 -0800, in talk.origins
"stew dean" <stewdean@gmail.com> wrote in
<1141427400.352033.58910@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>:
[snip]
If I ate no animal products
at all what would I be?
Vegan.
Nope. Stupid.
David was right Ben. It is Vegan - and no it's not stupid, it's
difficult and time consuming but not stupid.
Stew Dean
If you want to die early, it's stupid. Most true vegans are anaemic, and
have very poor immune systems.
I said being vegan is difficult - it is totaly possible to be a non
anaemic vegan.
Back in the macrobiotic heyday several of my friends went
from plain vegetarian to vegan. They considered the pallid
skin and extra sick days a sign of health. I went back to an
omnivoran diet.
Sounds like they where just in it for the fad. The worst possible
reason to go veggie or vegan (or take up any kind of diet really).
I'm a vegetarian and know that there's nothing I'm
missing in my diet.
Steak w/baked potato and salad, fish 'n' chips, spring lamb with early
potatoes and petit pois, lobster and drawn butter, buffalo wings, sushi
...the list is endless.
OH...you meant nutrients; RDA and stuff like that. Never mind. ;-)
To be serious for qute a few words, I'm usualy a very non preachy
veggie - occasional folks ask me 'do you mind me eating meat infront of
you' and I always am slightly suprised and really don't mind. The main
reason for being veggie is the amount of resources it take to produce
and the general high environmental cost of meat eating. If you're
someone who sees driving an SUV or large truck as a right then this
won't sway you, you're used to a high impact lifestyle - you can do
your own homework on that.
The second lesser reason is health - not so much the dietry issues as
the fothcoming desease issues. I grew up around farms and farmers and
have a respect for well produced meat (no really) and the pressure of
modern economics is to cut corners, pile on the marketing and sell low
quality, high risk meat at the highest mark up. I feel if you're going
to eat meat you're much better off finding a local butcher, stearing
clear of processed meat (okay maybe a few of the buthers own sausages)
and avoiding the large mall based stores and especialy fast food
chains. That way you'll have higher quality meat, that's fresher,
tastes better, and has a much lower chance of carrying unexpected
extras. I'd just like to see more folks to be educated into where their
food comes from.
Okay - that's enough of that - that's what I'd be like if I was preachy
but, hey, in a place like this it's kinda expected.
Take it easy and buy fresh and local :)
Stew Dean
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