| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Fredric L. Rice" |
| Date: |
12 Mar 2006 02:43:45 PM |
| Object: |
Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11, Survey Finds---
Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11, Survey Finds ---
· Majority says Islam has most violent followers
· Analysts blame politicians and media coverage
by Suzanne Goldenberg
More than half of Americans believe there are more violent extremists
within Islam than in any other religion and that the faith encourages
violence against non-Muslims, according to a Washington Post-ABC News poll
yesterday.
Negative feelings towards Islam are much more pronounced now than in
the immediate aftermath of the September 11 2001 terror attacks, the survey
found.
A majority, 58%, of those interviewed now believe that Islam has more
violent followers than any other religion. The poll of 1,000 was conducted
by phone last week and has a three-point error margin. Since January 2002
the proportion of those who believe mainstream Islam promotes violence
against non-believers has risen from 14% to 32%.
Analysts blame the surge on a confluence of factors: the proposed
takeover of US ports operations by a Dubai firm (now abandoned); the wars
in Iraq and Afghanistan; the election of Hamas in the Palestinian
territories; and, above all, the riotous protests across the Muslim world
against Danish cartoons depicting the prophet Muhammad. "The coverage of
the controversy over the cartoons showed that sort of violent extremist in
a way that a lot of Americans found troubling," said Carroll Dougherty of
the Pew Research Centre for the People and the Press.
American attitudes towards Islam were not out of step with Europe, Mr
Dougherty said, adding that there was more tolerance in the US towards the
use of headscarves than in countries such as Germany or France, where there
is strong support for a ban.
But nearly half of Americans, 46%, said they held unfavourable
attitudes towards Islam - compared with 24% in January 2002. The Post
quoted analysts as saying that the demonisation of Islam by politicians and
the media during the past four years had led to an erosion of tolerance.
In the immediate aftermath of September 11 2001, George Bush made a
number of statements disassociating Islam and the general Arab and Muslim
population in America from al-Qaida. He also visited a mosque, a symbolic
gesture that helped build a more positive image of Islam.
"It seems counter-intuitive, but from the president on down there was
a very strong message from Washington that this was not representative of
Islam," Mr Dougherty said. "In the intervening years there has been an
absence of this sort of positive message."
James Zogby, president of the Washington-based Arab American
Institute, told the Post he was not surprised by the poll's results.
Politicians, authors and media commentators have demonised the Arab world
since 2001, he said.
"The intensity has not abated and remains a vein that's very near the
surface, ready to be tapped at any moment," Mr Zogby said. "Members of
Congress have been exploiting this over the ports issue. Radio commentators
have been talking about it non-stop."
Guardian Unlimited © Guardian Newspapers Limited 2006
###
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines06/0310-07.htm
Islamophobia, caused by the Bush Administration's propaganda machine for
five years is the exact reason Bush's Port scandal was shot down by
Americans.
---
"I, for one, welcome our new alien overlords." - Kent Brockman
---
"The country is on a high state of alert. For all I know, you could be al-Qaida."
-- Quote from the Advantage Sales and Marketing, Inc. (949)797-2900
.
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| User: "Rick" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
12 Mar 2006 03:47:28 PM |
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Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <12191opkvs7tnfa@corp.supernews.com>...
Islamophobia Worse
Or perhaps the perception of Islam is simply more accurate and well-informed
after the cartoon incident.
in America Now Than after 9/11, Survey Finds---
Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11, Survey Finds ---
· Majority says Islam has most violent followers
· Analysts blame politicians and media coverage
by Suzanne Goldenberg
More than half of Americans believe there are more violent extremists
within Islam than in any other religion and that the faith encourages
violence against non-Muslims, according to a Washington Post-ABC News poll
yesterday.
Negative feelings towards Islam are much more pronounced now than in
the immediate aftermath of the September 11 2001 terror attacks, the survey
found.
A majority, 58%, of those interviewed now believe that Islam has more
violent followers than any other religion.
Some guys pees in a bottle with a crucifix, and a few Religious Right
leaders send out some fund-raising letters. A Danish paper prints some
offensive cartoons, and riots break out across the planet and some embassies
get burned down. And those who can see the difference are Islamophobes?
That's the sort of nonsense only an intellectual could believe ($1 to G.
Orwell).
The poll of 1,000 was conducted
by phone last week and has a three-point error margin. Since January 2002
the proportion of those who believe mainstream Islam promotes violence
against non-believers has risen from 14% to 32%.
Analysts blame the surge on a confluence of factors: the proposed
takeover of US ports operations by a Dubai firm (now abandoned); the wars
in Iraq and Afghanistan; the election of Hamas in the Palestinian
territories; and, above all, the riotous protests across the Muslim world
against Danish cartoons depicting the prophet Muhammad. "The coverage of
the controversy over the cartoons showed that sort of violent extremist in
a way that a lot of Americans found troubling," said Carroll Dougherty of
the Pew Research Centre for the People and the Press.
American attitudes towards Islam were not out of step with Europe, Mr
Dougherty said, adding that there was more tolerance in the US towards the
use of headscarves than in countries such as Germany or France, where there
is strong support for a ban.
And we Americans are supposed to be the backwards, ignorant, intolerant
folks.
But nearly half of Americans, 46%, said they held unfavourable
attitudes towards Islam - compared with 24% in January 2002. The Post
quoted analysts as saying that the demonisation of Islam by politicians and
the media during the past four years had led to an erosion of tolerance.
Sounds like they were apologists rather than analysts.
In the immediate aftermath of September 11 2001, George Bush made a
number of statements disassociating Islam and the general Arab and Muslim
population in America from al-Qaida. He also visited a mosque, a symbolic
gesture that helped build a more positive image of Islam.
"It seems counter-intuitive, but from the president on down there was
a very strong message from Washington that this was not representative of
Islam," Mr Dougherty said. "In the intervening years there has been an
absence of this sort of positive message."
James Zogby, president of the Washington-based Arab American
Institute, told the Post he was not surprised by the poll's results.
Politicians, authors and media commentators have demonised the Arab world
since 2001, he said.
"The intensity has not abated and remains a vein that's very near the
surface, ready to be tapped at any moment," Mr Zogby said. "Members of
Congress have been exploiting this over the ports issue. Radio commentators
have been talking about it non-stop."
Guardian Unlimited © Guardian Newspapers Limited 2006
###
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines06/0310-07.htm
Islamophobia, caused by the Bush Administration's propaganda machine for
five years is the exact reason Bush's Port scandal was shot down by
Americans.
It takes a special kind of intellectual to believe that.
- Rick
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| User: "Fredric L. Rice" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
13 Mar 2006 08:36:34 PM |
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"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <12191opkvs7tnfa@corp.supernews.com>...
Islamophobia Worse
Or perhaps the perception of Islam is simply more
accurate and well-informed after the cartoon incident.
That's rather doubtful. Many people still think Christianity is
some how a "religion of love."
---
"I, for one, welcome our new alien overlords." - Kent Brockman
---
"The country is on a high state of alert. For all I know, you could be al-Qaida."
-- Quote from the Advantage Sales and Marketing, Inc. (949)797-2900
.
|
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| User: "Rick" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
13 Mar 2006 11:39:25 PM |
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Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121caq7mu8nlpe1@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <12191opkvs7tnfa@corp.supernews.com>...
Islamophobia Worse
Or perhaps the perception of Islam is simply more
accurate and well-informed after the cartoon incident.
That's rather doubtful. Many people still think Christianity is
some how a "religion of love."
Great non sequitur, Fred. And thanks for snipping the part where I compare
Christianity and Islam:
**********************************
Some guy pees in a bottle with a crucifix, and a few Religious Right
leaders send out some fund-raising letters. A Danish paper prints some
offensive cartoons, and riots break out across the planet and some embassies
get burned down. And those who can see the difference are Islamophobes?
That's the sort of nonsense only an intellectual could believe ($1 to G.
Orwell).
**********************************
Here's some more info to enlighten you as to the differences:
http://www.secularislam.org/articles/wtc.htm
....
However, to pretend that Islam has nothing to do with Terrorist Tuesday is
to wilfully ignore the obvious and to forever misinterpret events. Without
Islam the long-term strategy and individual acts of violence by Usama bin
Laden and his followers make little sense. The West needs to understand them
in order to be able to deal with them and avoid past mistakes. We are
confronted with Islamic terrorists and must take seriously the Islamic
component. Westerners in general, and Americans in particular, do not
understand the passionate, religious, and anti-western convictions of
Islamic terrorists. These God-intoxicated fanatics blindly throw away their
lives in return for the Paradise of Seventy Two Virgins offered Muslim
martyrs killed in the Holy War against all infidels.
....
There may be moderate Muslims, but Islam itself is not moderate. There is no
difference between Islam and Islamic fundamentalism: at most there is a
difference of degree but not of kind. All the tenets of Islamic
fundamentalism are derived from the Qur’an, the Sunna, and the Hadith –
Islamic fundamentalism is a totalitarian construct derived by Muslim jurists
from the fundamental and defining texts of Islam. The fundamentalists, with
greater logic and coherence than so-called moderate or liberal Muslims, have
made Islam the basis of a radical utopian ideology that aims to replace
capitalism and democracy as the reigning world system. Islamism accounts for
the anti-American hatred to be found in places far from the Arab-Israeli
conflict, like Nigeria and Afghanistan, demonstrating that the Middle East
conflict cannot legitimately be used to explain this phenomenon called
Islamism. A Palestinian involved in the WTC bombings would be seen as a
martyr to the Palestinian cause, but even more as a martyr to Islam.
“Ah, but Islamic fundamentalism is like any other kind of fundamentalism,
one must not demonise it. It is the result of political, social grievances.
It must be explained in terms of economics and not religion,” continue the
apologists of Islam.
There are enormous differences between Islamic fundamentalism and any other
kind of modern fundamentalism. It is true that Hindu, Jewish, and Christian
fundamentalists have been responsible for acts of violence, but these have
been confined to particular countries and regions. Islamic fundamentalism
has global aspirations: the submission of the entire world to the
all-embracing Shari’a, Islamic Law, a fascist system of dictates designed to
control every single act of all individuals. Nor do Hindus or Jews seek to
convert the world to their religion. Christians do indulge in proselytism
but no longer use acts of violence or international terrorism to achieve
their aims.
****************************
I've posted some of that before, and I'm sure there will be many
opportunities to post it again.
- Rick
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| User: "Fredric L. Rice" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
14 Mar 2006 08:28:20 PM |
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"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121caq7mu8nlpe1@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <12191opkvs7tnfa@corp.supernews.com>...
Islamophobia Worse
Or perhaps the perception of Islam is simply more
accurate and well-informed after the cartoon incident.
That's rather doubtful. Many people still think Christianity is
some how a "religion of love."
Great non sequitur, Fred.
You're stating -- in public -- that your reasoning facilities are
failing. If that's not embarrassing, you'll probably never correct
the problem, I'm sure. As it stands, a great many people still manage
to persist in the delusion that Christianity is some how "life
affirming" despite all evidence that it's profoundly, historically
deadly. And despite the fact that Christian baby killers invaded
an innocent country three years ago.
---
The Bush Regime: "A bunch of mindless jerks who'll be
the first against the wall when the revolution comes."
.
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| User: "Rick" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
14 Mar 2006 11:58:59 PM |
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Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121eummngf9ai9f@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121caq7mu8nlpe1@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <12191opkvs7tnfa@corp.supernews.com>...
Islamophobia Worse
Or perhaps the perception of Islam is simply more
accurate and well-informed after the cartoon incident.
That's rather doubtful. Many people still think Christianity is
some how a "religion of love."
Great non sequitur, Fred.
You're stating -- in public -- that your reasoning facilities are
failing. If that's not embarrassing, you'll probably never correct
the problem, I'm sure. As it stands, a great many people still manage
to persist in the delusion that Christianity is some how "life
affirming" despite all evidence that it's profoundly, historically
deadly. And despite the fact that Christian baby killers invaded
an innocent country three years ago.
Once again you're ignoring the point of the article and my responses, and
have failed to demonstrate where my reasoning facilities are failing.
- Rick
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| User: "Fredric L. Rice" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
15 Mar 2006 08:23:04 PM |
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"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121eummngf9ai9f@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121caq7mu8nlpe1@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <12191opkvs7tnfa@corp.supernews.com>...
Islamophobia Worse
Or perhaps the perception of Islam is simply more
accurate and well-informed after the cartoon incident.
That's rather doubtful. Many people still think Christianity is
some how a "religion of love."
Great non sequitur, Fred.
You're stating -- in public -- that your reasoning facilities are
failing. If that's not embarrassing, you'll probably never correct
the problem, I'm sure. As it stands, a great many people still manage
to persist in the delusion that Christianity is some how "life
affirming" despite all evidence that it's profoundly, historically
deadly. And despite the fact that Christian baby killers invaded
an innocent country three years ago.
Once again you're ignoring the point of the article and my responses, and
have failed to demonstrate where my reasoning facilities are failing.
You once again failed to state your acceptance of Christianity and
its bloody, inhuman history for some mysterious reason. You're not
anti-Christian, are you? Is that why you deny all of Christianity?
---
The Bush Regime: "A bunch of mindless jerks who'll be
the first against the wall when the revolution comes."
---
SCOTT MCCLELLAN - arrested for lewd behavior after witnesses report him
masturbating in a movie theatre during "Brokeback Mountain."
.
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| User: "Rick" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
16 Mar 2006 02:55:23 AM |
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Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121hioq9t0dl40c@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121eummngf9ai9f@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121caq7mu8nlpe1@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message
<12191opkvs7tnfa@corp.supernews.com>...
Islamophobia Worse
Or perhaps the perception of Islam is simply more
accurate and well-informed after the cartoon incident.
That's rather doubtful. Many people still think Christianity is
some how a "religion of love."
Great non sequitur, Fred.
You're stating -- in public -- that your reasoning facilities are
failing. If that's not embarrassing, you'll probably never correct
the problem, I'm sure. As it stands, a great many people still manage
to persist in the delusion that Christianity is some how "life
affirming" despite all evidence that it's profoundly, historically
deadly. And despite the fact that Christian baby killers invaded
an innocent country three years ago.
Once again you're ignoring the point of the article and my responses, and
have failed to demonstrate where my reasoning facilities are failing.
You once again failed to state your acceptance of Christianity and
its bloody, inhuman history for some mysterious reason. You're not
anti-Christian, are you? Is that why you deny all of Christianity?
You've failed to explain how all your hatred of Christianity is relevant.
- Rick
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| User: "Fredric L. Rice" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
16 Mar 2006 09:36:27 PM |
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"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121hioq9t0dl40c@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121eummngf9ai9f@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121caq7mu8nlpe1@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message
<12191opkvs7tnfa@corp.supernews.com>...
Islamophobia Worse
Or perhaps the perception of Islam is simply more
accurate and well-informed after the cartoon incident.
That's rather doubtful. Many people still think Christianity is
some how a "religion of love."
Great non sequitur, Fred.
You're stating -- in public -- that your reasoning facilities are
failing. If that's not embarrassing, you'll probably never correct
the problem, I'm sure. As it stands, a great many people still manage
to persist in the delusion that Christianity is some how "life
affirming" despite all evidence that it's profoundly, historically
deadly. And despite the fact that Christian baby killers invaded
an innocent country three years ago.
Once again you're ignoring the point of the article and my responses, and
have failed to demonstrate where my reasoning facilities are failing.
You once again failed to state your acceptance of Christianity and
its bloody, inhuman history for some mysterious reason. You're not
anti-Christian, are you? Is that why you deny all of Christianity?
You've failed to explain how all your hatred of Christianity is relevant.
Woops! Trying to pretend that accurately describing the history of
the Christanic death cult is some how "hate" doesn't mean you don't
get to ignore the death cult's history.
---
The Bush Regime: "A bunch of mindless jerks who'll be
the first against the wall when the revolution comes."
---
SCOTT MCCLELLAN - arrested for lewd behavior after witnesses report him
masturbating in a movie theatre during "Brokeback Mountain."
.
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| User: "Rick" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
16 Mar 2006 09:59:24 PM |
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Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121kbebia3g316f@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121hioq9t0dl40c@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121eummngf9ai9f@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message
<121caq7mu8nlpe1@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message
<12191opkvs7tnfa@corp.supernews.com>...
Islamophobia Worse
Or perhaps the perception of Islam is simply more
accurate and well-informed after the cartoon incident.
That's rather doubtful. Many people still think Christianity is
some how a "religion of love."
Great non sequitur, Fred.
You're stating -- in public -- that your reasoning facilities are
failing. If that's not embarrassing, you'll probably never correct
the problem, I'm sure. As it stands, a great many people still manage
to persist in the delusion that Christianity is some how "life
affirming" despite all evidence that it's profoundly, historically
deadly. And despite the fact that Christian baby killers invaded
an innocent country three years ago.
Once again you're ignoring the point of the article and my responses,
and
have failed to demonstrate where my reasoning facilities are failing.
You once again failed to state your acceptance of Christianity and
its bloody, inhuman history for some mysterious reason. You're not
anti-Christian, are you? Is that why you deny all of Christianity?
You've failed to explain how all your hatred of Christianity is relevant.
Woops! Trying to pretend that accurately describing the history of
the Christanic death cult is some how "hate" doesn't mean you don't
get to ignore the death cult's history.
I've never ignored it, Fred.
Fred, your arguments on USENET are like a one-legged dog trying to run after
a car.
- Rick
.
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| User: "Fredric L. Rice" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
19 Mar 2006 12:21:49 PM |
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"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121kbebia3g316f@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121hioq9t0dl40c@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121eummngf9ai9f@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message
<121caq7mu8nlpe1@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message
<12191opkvs7tnfa@corp.supernews.com>...
Islamophobia Worse
Or perhaps the perception of Islam is simply more
accurate and well-informed after the cartoon incident.
That's rather doubtful. Many people still think Christianity is
some how a "religion of love."
Great non sequitur, Fred.
You're stating -- in public -- that your reasoning facilities are
failing. If that's not embarrassing, you'll probably never correct
the problem, I'm sure. As it stands, a great many people still manage
to persist in the delusion that Christianity is some how "life
affirming" despite all evidence that it's profoundly, historically
deadly. And despite the fact that Christian baby killers invaded
an innocent country three years ago.
Once again you're ignoring the point of the article and my responses, and
have failed to demonstrate where my reasoning facilities are failing.
You once again failed to state your acceptance of Christianity and
its bloody, inhuman history for some mysterious reason. You're not
anti-Christian, are you? Is that why you deny all of Christianity?
You've failed to explain how all your hatred of Christianity is relevant.
Woops! Trying to pretend that accurately describing the history of
the Christanic death cult is some how "hate" doesn't mean you don't
get to ignore the death cult's history.
I've never ignored it, Fred.
Sure you have. You just try to pretend that Christianity's history
isn't _Christian_. You deny Christ and all of Christainity just
because you want to pretend you don't like what Christianity is all
about.
---
The Bush Regime: "A bunch of mindless jerks who'll be
the first against the wall when the revolution comes."
---
SCOTT MCCLELLAN - arrested for lewd behavior after witnesses report him
masturbating in a movie theatre during "Brokeback Mountain."
.
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| User: "jwk" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
13 Mar 2006 10:13:44 AM |
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Fredric L. Rice wrote:
Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11, Survey Finds---
Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11, Survey Finds ---
=B7 Majority says Islam has most violent followers
=B7 Analysts blame politicians and media coverage
by Suzanne Goldenberg
More than half of Americans believe there are more violent extremis=
ts
within Islam than in any other religion and that the faith encourages
violence against non-Muslims, according to a Washington Post-ABC News poll
yesterday.
Negative feelings towards Islam are much more pronounced now than in
the immediate aftermath of the September 11 2001 terror attacks, the surv=
ey
found.
A majority, 58%, of those interviewed now believe that Islam has mo=
re
violent followers than any other religion. The poll of 1,000 was conducted
by phone last week and has a three-point error margin. Since January 2002
the proportion of those who believe mainstream Islam promotes violence
against non-believers has risen from 14% to 32%.
Analysts blame the surge on a confluence of factors:
I notice they don't give the fact that scary muslims are on TV every
night threatening to kill and maime over a cartoon as a factor. They
don't mention the bombings and kidnappings as a factor. Jihad? Not
mentioned. WTC? Nope. How strange.
jwk
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| User: "Eric Brze" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
13 Mar 2006 12:56:38 PM |
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On 13 Mar 2006 08:13:44 -0800, "jwk" <jwkinraleigh@yahoo.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote:
Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11, Survey Finds---
Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11, Survey Finds ---
$)A!$ Majority says Islam has most violent followers
$)A!$ Analysts blame politicians and media coverage
by Suzanne Goldenberg
More than half of Americans believe there are more violent extremists
within Islam than in any other religion and that the faith encourages
violence against non-Muslims, according to a Washington Post-ABC News poll
yesterday.
Negative feelings towards Islam are much more pronounced now than in
the immediate aftermath of the September 11 2001 terror attacks, the survey
found.
A majority, 58%, of those interviewed now believe that Islam has more
violent followers than any other religion. The poll of 1,000 was conducted
by phone last week and has a three-point error margin. Since January 2002
the proportion of those who believe mainstream Islam promotes violence
against non-believers has risen from 14% to 32%.
Analysts blame the surge on a confluence of factors:
I notice they don't give the fact that scary muslims are on TV every
night threatening to kill and maime over a cartoon as a factor. They
don't mention the bombings and kidnappings as a factor. Jihad? Not
mentioned. WTC? Nope. How strange.
jwk
Islam is hijacked by Islamic fundamentalists. Judaism is hijacked by
Zionists. Thanks to modern democracy, Christianity is not entirely
hijacked by the Christian fundamentalists yet, even though it's pretty
much in its last breath already. Once the religions of God have
completely fallen into the hands of the devil, it will be the end of
it for all...
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| User: "808" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
13 Mar 2006 04:27:24 AM |
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On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 20:43:45 GMT, (Fredric L.
Rice) wrote:
<snip>
"Islamophobia"? Isn't that the fear of Islam? Who wouldn't fear a
religion that engenders violence against those that offend against it?
.
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| User: "DanielSan" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
13 Mar 2006 08:32:50 AM |
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808 wrote:
On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 20:43:45 GMT, (Fredric L.
Rice) wrote:
<snip>
"Islamophobia"? Isn't that the fear of Islam? Who wouldn't fear a
religion that engenders violence against those that offend against it?
Interesting premise, 808. Let's investigate that claim.
Current Muslim Population: 800 million - 1.4 billion Muslims.
If Islam is a religion that engenders violence againce those that offend
against it, that would be 800 million - 1.4 billion terrorists. The
planet would be destroyed.
No. Islam is not any more a violent religion than Christianity.
Oh, and there are about 500,000 to 1 million Muslims inside the United
States. Makes me wonder why there isn't more violence... unless you're
a bigoted *****.
--
****************************************************
* DanielSan -- alt.atheism #2226 *
*--------------------------------------------------*
* "In every country and in every age, the priest *
* has been hostile to liberty. He is always in *
* alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in *
* return for protection to his own." *
* --Jefferson (in a letter to H. Spafford, 1814) *
****************************************************
--
*** Free account sponsored by SecureIX.com ***
*** Encrypt your Internet usage with a free VPN account from http://www.SecureIX.com ***
.
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| User: "Rick" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
13 Mar 2006 11:49:37 PM |
|
|
DanielSan wrote in message
<44158390$0$20689$6d36acad@titian.nntpserver.com>...
808 wrote:
On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 20:43:45 GMT, (Fredric L.
Rice) wrote:
<snip>
"Islamophobia"? Isn't that the fear of Islam? Who wouldn't fear a
religion that engenders violence against those that offend against it?
Interesting premise, 808. Let's investigate that claim.
Current Muslim Population: 800 million - 1.4 billion Muslims.
If Islam is a religion that engenders violence againce those that offend
against it, that would be 800 million - 1.4 billion terrorists. The
planet would be destroyed.
No. Islam is not any more a violent religion than Christianity.
Complete and utter nonsense. Let me repost what I've written in response to
Fred:
....
Some guy pees in a bottle with a crucifix, and a few Religious Right
leaders send out some fund-raising letters. A Danish paper prints some
offensive cartoons, and riots break out across the planet and some embassies
get burned down. And those who can see the difference are Islamophobes?
That's the sort of nonsense only an intellectual could believe ($1 to G.
Orwell).
....
Here's some more info to enlighten you as to the differences:
http://www.secularislam.org/articles/wtc.htm
....
However, to pretend that Islam has nothing to do with Terrorist Tuesday is
to wilfully ignore the obvious and to forever misinterpret events. Without
Islam the long-term strategy and individual acts of violence by Usama bin
Laden and his followers make little sense. The West needs to understand them
in order to be able to deal with them and avoid past mistakes. We are
confronted with Islamic terrorists and must take seriously the Islamic
component. Westerners in general, and Americans in particular, do not
understand the passionate, religious, and anti-western convictions of
Islamic terrorists. These God-intoxicated fanatics blindly throw away their
lives in return for the Paradise of Seventy Two Virgins offered Muslim
martyrs killed in the Holy War against all infidels.
....
There may be moderate Muslims, but Islam itself is not moderate. There is no
difference between Islam and Islamic fundamentalism: at most there is a
difference of degree but not of kind. All the tenets of Islamic
fundamentalism are derived from the Qur’an, the Sunna, and the Hadith –
Islamic fundamentalism is a totalitarian construct derived by Muslim jurists
from the fundamental and defining texts of Islam. The fundamentalists, with
greater logic and coherence than so-called moderate or liberal Muslims, have
made Islam the basis of a radical utopian ideology that aims to replace
capitalism and democracy as the reigning world system. Islamism accounts for
the anti-American hatred to be found in places far from the Arab-Israeli
conflict, like Nigeria and Afghanistan, demonstrating that the Middle East
conflict cannot legitimately be used to explain this phenomenon called
Islamism. A Palestinian involved in the WTC bombings would be seen as a
martyr to the Palestinian cause, but even more as a martyr to Islam.
“Ah, but Islamic fundamentalism is like any other kind of fundamentalism,
one must not demonise it. It is the result of political, social grievances.
It must be explained in terms of economics and not religion,” continue the
apologists of Islam.
There are enormous differences between Islamic fundamentalism and any other
kind of modern fundamentalism. It is true that Hindu, Jewish, and Christian
fundamentalists have been responsible for acts of violence, but these have
been confined to particular countries and regions. Islamic fundamentalism
has global aspirations: the submission of the entire world to the
all-embracing Shari’a, Islamic Law, a fascist system of dictates designed to
control every single act of all individuals. Nor do Hindus or Jews seek to
convert the world to their religion. Christians do indulge in proselytism
but no longer use acts of violence or international terrorism to achieve
their aims.
****************************
Your position may not be outright bigotry, more likely willful ignorance.
- Rick
.
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| User: "Fredric L. Rice" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
14 Mar 2006 08:28:22 PM |
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"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
DanielSan wrote in message
<44158390$0$20689$6d36acad@titian.nntpserver.com>...
808 wrote:
On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 20:43:45 GMT, (Fredric L. Rice) wrote:
<snip>
"Islamophobia"? Isn't that the fear of Islam? Who wouldn't fear a
religion that engenders violence against those that offend against it?
Interesting premise, 808. Let's investigate that claim.
Current Muslim Population: 800 million - 1.4 billion Muslims.
If Islam is a religion that engenders violence againce those that offend
against it, that would be 800 million - 1.4 billion terrorists. The
planet would be destroyed.
No. Islam is not any more a violent religion than Christianity.
Complete and utter nonsense.
You _are_ aware of the Christian death cult's history and recent
atrocities, right, rightard? You'll need to start explaining how
you reconcile Christianity, its history, and its core ideology of
hate with your notions.
---
The Bush Regime: "A bunch of mindless jerks who'll be
the first against the wall when the revolution comes."
.
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| User: "Rick" |
|
| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
14 Mar 2006 11:56:33 PM |
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Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121eumo42m3a5a4@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
DanielSan wrote in message
<44158390$0$20689$6d36acad@titian.nntpserver.com>...
808 wrote:
On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 20:43:45 GMT, (Fredric L.
Rice) wrote:
<snip>
"Islamophobia"? Isn't that the fear of Islam? Who wouldn't fear a
religion that engenders violence against those that offend against it?
Interesting premise, 808. Let's investigate that claim.
Current Muslim Population: 800 million - 1.4 billion Muslims.
If Islam is a religion that engenders violence againce those that offend
against it, that would be 800 million - 1.4 billion terrorists. The
planet would be destroyed.
No. Islam is not any more a violent religion than Christianity.
Complete and utter nonsense.
You _are_ aware of the Christian death cult's history and recent
atrocities, right, rightard? You'll need to start explaining how
you reconcile Christianity, its history, and its core ideology of
hate with your notions.
It's you and your fellow travelers who ignore the whole of history and
current events. Go back to the original article and explain where I'm wrong.
- Rick
.
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| User: "Fredric L. Rice" |
|
| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
15 Mar 2006 08:23:02 PM |
|
|
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121eumo42m3a5a4@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
DanielSan wrote in message
<44158390$0$20689$6d36acad@titian.nntpserver.com>...
808 wrote:
On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 20:43:45 GMT, (Fredric L. Rice) wrote:
<snip>
"Islamophobia"? Isn't that the fear of Islam? Who wouldn't fear a
religion that engenders violence against those that offend against it?
Interesting premise, 808. Let's investigate that claim.
Current Muslim Population: 800 million - 1.4 billion Muslims.
If Islam is a religion that engenders violence againce those that offend
against it, that would be 800 million - 1.4 billion terrorists. The
planet would be destroyed.
No. Islam is not any more a violent religion than Christianity.
Complete and utter nonsense.
You _are_ aware of the Christian death cult's history and recent
atrocities, right, rightard? You'll need to start explaining how
you reconcile Christianity, its history, and its core ideology of
hate with your notions.
It's you and your fellow travelers who ignore the whole of history and
current events.
You didn't answer the question for some very mysterious reason. Looks
like you're trying to deny all of Christianity and everything it stands
for -- even before the ***** crowed once.
---
The Bush Regime: "A bunch of mindless jerks who'll be
the first against the wall when the revolution comes."
---
SCOTT MCCLELLAN - arrested for lewd behavior after witnesses report him
masturbating in a movie theatre during "Brokeback Mountain."
.
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| User: "Rick" |
|
| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
16 Mar 2006 02:53:39 AM |
|
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Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121hiooqi4iac0b@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
Fredric L. Rice wrote in message <121eumo42m3a5a4@corp.supernews.com>...
"Rick" <pl1_alpha_geek@juNOSPAM.com> wrote:
DanielSan wrote in message
<44158390$0$20689$6d36acad@titian.nntpserver.com>...
808 wrote:
On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 20:43:45 GMT, (Fredric L.
Rice) wrote:
<snip>
"Islamophobia"? Isn't that the fear of Islam? Who wouldn't fear a
religion that engenders violence against those that offend against
it?
Interesting premise, 808. Let's investigate that claim.
Current Muslim Population: 800 million - 1.4 billion Muslims.
If Islam is a religion that engenders violence againce those that
offend
against it, that would be 800 million - 1.4 billion terrorists. The
planet would be destroyed.
No. Islam is not any more a violent religion than Christianity.
Complete and utter nonsense.
You _are_ aware of the Christian death cult's history and recent
atrocities, right, rightard? You'll need to start explaining how
you reconcile Christianity, its history, and its core ideology of
hate with your notions.
It's you and your fellow travelers who ignore the whole of history and
current events.
You didn't answer the question for some very mysterious reason. Looks
like you're trying to deny all of Christianity and everything it stands
for -- even before the ***** crowed once.
I hear Peter Shickele's Irrelevancy Alarm going off, Fred. Nothing you
mentioned has anything to do with the current status of Islam around the
world.
- Rick
- Rick
.
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| User: "DanielSan" |
|
| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
14 Mar 2006 12:00:04 AM |
|
|
Rick wrote:
DanielSan wrote in message
<44158390$0$20689$6d36acad@titian.nntpserver.com>...
808 wrote:
On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 20:43:45 GMT, (Fredric L.
Rice) wrote:
<snip>
"Islamophobia"? Isn't that the fear of Islam? Who wouldn't fear a
religion that engenders violence against those that offend against it?
Interesting premise, 808. Let's investigate that claim.
Current Muslim Population: 800 million - 1.4 billion Muslims.
If Islam is a religion that engenders violence againce those that offend
against it, that would be 800 million - 1.4 billion terrorists. The
planet would be destroyed.
No. Islam is not any more a violent religion than Christianity.
Complete and utter nonsense. Let me repost what I've written in response to
Fred:
....
Some guy pees in a bottle with a crucifix, and a few Religious Right
leaders send out some fund-raising letters.
If you're gay, you're tied to a fence and pistol-whipped and left for dead.
A Danish paper prints some
offensive cartoons, and riots break out across the planet and some embassies
get burned down.
If you're Jewish, your tongue is pulled out, you are *stretched* out
over a period of time until your arms and legs dislocate. It's called
The Inquisition or The Crusades.
And those who can see the difference are Islamophobes?
Nah, just those that stereotype those that are Islamic with violence.
That's the sort of nonsense only an intellectual could believe ($1 to G.
Orwell).
Yes, we can see that you hate intellectuals. Too smart for you?
....
Here's some more info to enlighten you as to the differences:
http://www.secularislam.org/articles/wtc.htm
....
However, to pretend that Islam has nothing to do with Terrorist Tuesday is
to wilfully ignore the obvious and to forever misinterpret events.
Just like to pretend that Christianity has nothing to do with the
execution of the Jews is to wilfully ignore the obvious and to forever
misinterpret the events.
Face facts, Rick. Christianity is no more and no less violent than
Islam. Both are amoral. It is the followers that distort the religion
to suit their agenda that are immoral.
Torquemada, Osama bin Laden, Pat Robertson, Adolf Hitler. All
practice(d) distorted versions of their own religions. To stereotype
ALL on the acts of comparatively minor amounts of people is to do the
selfsame distorting that you accuse others of doing.
It's stereotyping and it's what Osama is guilty of. And it is what
you're guilty of.
--
****************************************************
* DanielSan -- alt.atheism #2226 *
*--------------------------------------------------*
* "Torture has never been a reliable means of *
* extracting information.... One wonders why it *
* is still practiced." --Jean-Luc Picard *
****************************************************
--
*** Free account sponsored by SecureIX.com ***
*** Encrypt your Internet usage with a free VPN account from http://www.SecureIX.com ***
.
|
|
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| User: "Rick" |
|
| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
14 Mar 2006 03:08:06 AM |
|
|
DanielSan wrote in message
<44165cf1$0$28294$6d36acad@titian.nntpserver.com>...
Rick wrote:
DanielSan wrote in message
<44158390$0$20689$6d36acad@titian.nntpserver.com>...
808 wrote:
On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 20:43:45 GMT, (Fredric L.
Rice) wrote:
<snip>
"Islamophobia"? Isn't that the fear of Islam? Who wouldn't fear a
religion that engenders violence against those that offend against it?
Interesting premise, 808. Let's investigate that claim.
Current Muslim Population: 800 million - 1.4 billion Muslims.
If Islam is a religion that engenders violence againce those that offend
against it, that would be 800 million - 1.4 billion terrorists. The
planet would be destroyed.
No. Islam is not any more a violent religion than Christianity.
Complete and utter nonsense. Let me repost what I've written in response
to
Fred:
....
Some guy pees in a bottle with a crucifix, and a few Religious Right
leaders send out some fund-raising letters.
If you're gay, you're tied to a fence and pistol-whipped and left for dead.
How many orders of magnitude greater is the violence committed in the name
of Islam? I have never once said Christians do not committ any violence or
that they are perfect. I'm claiming that your claims of equivalence are
blatantly dishonest. Do you understand the difference between anecdotes and
data? It appears you don't.
A Danish paper prints some
offensive cartoons, and riots break out across the planet and some
embassies
get burned down.
If you're Jewish, your tongue is pulled out, you are *stretched* out
over a period of time until your arms and legs dislocate. It's called
The Inquisition or The Crusades.
Good grief! How many times are you going to go way back in history? You and
your ilk are so intellectually dishonest. Do you even have a clue as to what
happened before the Crusades? You act as though Human history began with the
Crusades. That's dishonest.
And those who can see the difference are Islamophobes?
Nah, just those that stereotype those that are Islamic with violence.
*I* am not stereotyping. I am looking at the facts - the *whole* picture.
*You* are looking at selected anecdotes and old history.
That's the sort of nonsense only an intellectual could believe ($1 to G.
Orwell).
Yes, we can see that you hate intellectuals. Too smart for you?
Complete and total nonsense. Why are you so dishonest? I have nothing but
the deepest contempt for people who are pretend intellectuals. You appear to
fit into that catagory.
....
Here's some more info to enlighten you as to the differences:
http://www.secularislam.org/articles/wtc.htm
....
However, to pretend that Islam has nothing to do with Terrorist Tuesday
is
to wilfully ignore the obvious and to forever misinterpret events.
Just like to pretend that Christianity has nothing to do with the
execution of the Jews is to wilfully ignore the obvious and to forever
misinterpret the events.
I have not pretended anything. You are delusional.
Face facts, Rick. Christianity is no more and no less violent than
Islam. Both are amoral. It is the followers that distort the religion
to suit their agenda that are immoral.
Total *****. You and your ilk disgust me.
Torquemada, Osama bin Laden, Pat Robertson, Adolf Hitler. All
practice(d) distorted versions of their own religions. To stereotype
ALL
Now you've descended into the kind of blatant lying that is too common among
atheists, especially you. I said absolutely nothing at all about ALL
Muslims. For example, I said nothing about my ex-brother-in-law, who are
Lebanese Muslims. They happened to be about as meek and mild mannered as
anyone I've met.
n the acts of comparatively minor amounts of people is to do the
selfsame distorting that you accuse others of doing.
Not at all comparatively minor compared to Current Christianity. Any claim
to hte conmtrary is a blatant lie.
It's stereotyping and it's what Osama is guilty of. And it is what
you're guilty of.
How can you be such a liar? I'm looking at facts. I don't think you've
actually paid on bit of attention to what I've said.
I think it's worth reposting what I posted earlier to keep this all in
perspective regarding the original subject:
***************
Some guy pees in a bottle with a crucifix, and a few Religious Right
leaders send out some fund-raising letters. A Danish paper prints some
offensive cartoons, and riots break out across the planet and some embassies
get burned down. And those who can see the difference are Islamophobes?
That's the sort of nonsense only an intellectual could believe ($1 to G.
Orwell).
***************
You've never given an adequate rebuttal of this. And I'm sure you won't,
because there is none. You also never responded to what Ibn Warraq wrote. Do
you think he's some sort of deluded right-wing Christian? He has as little
regard for Isalm as you do for Christianity. The difference is that he is
not dishonest about the profound differences. You've got your head buried in
the sand and refuse to acknowledge the truth. You can't be reasoned with.
You are impervious to facts. Just like last summer with that documentary on
the New Jersey election.
- Rick, waiting to see what dishonesty and lies DanielSan will respond with.
.
|
|
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| User: "DanielSan" |
|
| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
14 Mar 2006 07:50:30 AM |
|
|
Rick wrote:
DanielSan wrote in message
<44165cf1$0$28294$6d36acad@titian.nntpserver.com>...
Rick wrote:
DanielSan wrote in message
<44158390$0$20689$6d36acad@titian.nntpserver.com>...
808 wrote:
On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 20:43:45 GMT, (Fredric L.
Rice) wrote:
<snip>
"Islamophobia"? Isn't that the fear of Islam? Who wouldn't fear a
religion that engenders violence against those that offend against it?
Interesting premise, 808. Let's investigate that claim.
Current Muslim Population: 800 million - 1.4 billion Muslims.
If Islam is a religion that engenders violence againce those that offend
against it, that would be 800 million - 1.4 billion terrorists. The
planet would be destroyed.
No. Islam is not any more a violent religion than Christianity.
Complete and utter nonsense. Let me repost what I've written in response
to
Fred:
....
Some guy pees in a bottle with a crucifix, and a few Religious Right
leaders send out some fund-raising letters.
If you're gay, you're tied to a fence and pistol-whipped and left for dead.
How many orders of magnitude greater is the violence committed in the name
of Islam?
Fallacy of equivocation. Fallacy of moving the goalposts. I was simply
naming one instance where violence was committed in the name of
Christianity.
I have never once said Christians do not committ any violence or
that they are perfect. I'm claiming that your claims of equivalence are
blatantly dishonest. Do you understand the difference between anecdotes and
data? It appears you don't.
I do. But, if you would look at *ALL* the data, you'd see that
Christians are more violent than Muslims.
A Danish paper prints some
offensive cartoons, and riots break out across the planet and some
embassies
get burned down.
If you're Jewish, your tongue is pulled out, you are *stretched* out
over a period of time until your arms and legs dislocate. It's called
The Inquisition or The Crusades.
Good grief! How many times are you going to go way back in history?
So, it didn't happen, eh? How long in the past can you go until their
acts become null and void?
You and
your ilk
....I have no ilk... Are you trying to stereotype again?
are so intellectually dishonest. Do you even have a clue as to what
happened before the Crusades? You act as though Human history began with the
Crusades. That's dishonest.
Oh, really? Then, if I'm so intellectually dishonest, then why don't
you *TELL* me what happened before the Crusades. And tell me what
happened before the Inquisition, too.
And those who can see the difference are Islamophobes?
Nah, just those that stereotype those that are Islamic with violence.
*I* am not stereotyping. I am looking at the facts - the *whole* picture.
*You* are looking at selected anecdotes and old history.
Oh, you're looking at the *whole* picture, eh? Per-capita, who is the
most violent? You must include all religions.
That's the sort of nonsense only an intellectual could believe ($1 to G.
Orwell).
Yes, we can see that you hate intellectuals. Too smart for you?
Complete and total nonsense. Why are you so dishonest?
I'm not. I'm reading your words.
I have nothing but
the deepest contempt for people who are pretend intellectuals. You appear to
fit into that catagory.
Now you're moving the goalposts again. You said, "That's the sort of
nonsense only an intellectual could believe." Your hatred for
intellectuals is very telling.
....
Here's some more info to enlighten you as to the differences:
http://www.secularislam.org/articles/wtc.htm
....
However, to pretend that Islam has nothing to do with Terrorist Tuesday
is
to wilfully ignore the obvious and to forever misinterpret events.
Just like to pretend that Christianity has nothing to do with the
execution of the Jews is to wilfully ignore the obvious and to forever
misinterpret the events.
I have not pretended anything. You are delusional.
Yet, it happened "so long ago" that it doesn't count, right?
Face facts, Rick. Christianity is no more and no less violent than
Islam. Both are amoral. It is the followers that distort the religion
to suit their agenda that are immoral.
Total *****. You and your ilk disgust me.
Again, I have no "ilk." To try to attach anyone to me is disgusting. I
am an island and no one speaks for me or with me other than me. If
others are willing to agree with me, that's great. If they're willing
to disagree with me, that's great. Agreeing with me does not
automatically make them "my ilk."
However, since you lack the available data to prove your case, you
resort to ad hominem attacks against me instead of attacking my message.
Torquemada, Osama bin Laden, Pat Robertson, Adolf Hitler. All
practice(d) distorted versions of their own religions. To stereotype
ALL
Now you've descended into the kind of blatant lying that is too common among
atheists, especially you. I said absolutely nothing at all about ALL
Muslims. For example, I said nothing about my ex-brother-in-law, who are
Lebanese Muslims. They happened to be about as meek and mild mannered as
anyone I've met.
Therefore, do not call Muslims violent. I do not call Christians
violent, even though some of the most violent leaders were
self-described Christians.
I do not lie. I attack all forms of stereotyping.
n the acts of comparatively minor amounts of people is to do the
selfsame distorting that you accuse others of doing.
Not at all comparatively minor compared to Current Christianity. Any claim
to hte conmtrary is a blatant lie.
Really? Got data to prove it?
It's stereotyping and it's what Osama is guilty of. And it is what
you're guilty of.
How can you be such a liar? I'm looking at facts.
Which facts?
I don't think you've
actually paid on bit of attention to what I've said.
Not really. I've nothing but spew from you without data.
I think it's worth reposting what I posted earlier to keep this all in
perspective regarding the original subject:
***************
Some guy pees in a bottle with a crucifix, and a few Religious Right
leaders send out some fund-raising letters. A Danish paper prints some
offensive cartoons, and riots break out across the planet and some embassies
get burned down. And those who can see the difference are Islamophobes?
That's the sort of nonsense only an intellectual could believe ($1 to G.
Orwell).
Apples to oranges.
***************
You've never given an adequate rebuttal of this. And I'm sure you won't,
because there is none.
Actually, I did. Because urinating on a crucifix and printing offensive
cartoons of Mohammed are not equivalent.
You also never responded to what Ibn Warraq wrote.
Ibn Warraq speaks for Ibn Warraq. Nothing more. But, what is currently
happening to Ibn Warraq is very telling: Absolutely nothing. Wow. He
writes books critical of Islam, even diving into the realm of the
polemical and nothing has happened to him.
For some reason, there was not the backlash against him as there were
with the Danish cartoons.
Do
you think he's some sort of deluded right-wing Christian?
No. Why do you believe that folks who have nothing but ignominy against
Muslims MUST be a right-wing Chrisitan?
He has as little
regard for Isalm as you do for Christianity.
I have little regard for all religions, not just Islam or Christianity.
The difference is that he is
not dishonest about the profound differences. You've got your head buried in
the sand and refuse to acknowledge the truth. You can't be reasoned with.
Not without access to all the available data.
You are impervious to facts.
Facts? What facts?
Just like last summer with that documentary on
the New Jersey election.
I see. So, when I compared Street Fight and Fahrenheit 9/11 to
facetiously pull out the anti-liberal numbnuts, I succeeded in my
attempts. Street Fight and Fahrenheit 9/11 have both the same amount of
truth.
When I said, "It was nothing but a bunch of lies like Fahrenheit 9/11
was a bunch of lies," I seem to have did my job. You're still talking
about it nearly a year later.
- Rick, waiting to see what dishonesty and lies DanielSan will respond with.
....this coming from the person who calls *ME* impervious to facts.
--
****************************************************
* DanielSan -- alt.atheism #2226 *
*--------------------------------------------------*
* "Torture has never been a reliable means of *
* extracting information.... One wonders why it *
* is still practiced." --Jean-Luc Picard *
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| User: "Rick" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
14 Mar 2006 12:34:40 PM |
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DanielSan wrote in message
<4416cb26$0$9162$6d36acad@titian.nntpserver.com>...
Once again you are being completely dishonest, doing precisely what you
claim I'm doing. You refuse to acknowledge what I am saying and are arguing
aginst things I never said. And you repeatedly are misrepresenting what I'm
saying. You seem to think I'm some sort of Dittohead or Freeper calling all
Muslims terrorists and using terms like Raghead, Towelhead, or Sand *****.
You continually ignore what i am saying. I am responding to WHAT YOU HAVE
SAID. You constantly refuse to acknowledge the whole course of history, as
well as the current status of both religions as they relate to worldwide
politics. It si YOU who are changing the goalposts. This is so typical of
you and so many others whose constant rallying cry is "The Christians Are
Terrorists Too!" or "Remember the Christian Terrorists!" anytime someone
points out fundamental differences in the religions. Not one thing you said
has anything to do with the subject at hand, that is, the changin
perceptions of Islam since the cartoon incident. It's been interesting to
see some people here, who usually spew the usual irrational equivalence
crap, getting a few clues as to the nature of Islam. You hadn't been posting
here for a while, so maybe you missed it. This is turning out to be as
pointless as it was arguing with you last summer over those two
documentaries. Your only evidence regarding the PBS documentary was one
anonymous comment in the IMBD database. I don't know how you can live with
such intellectual dishonesty.
- Rick
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| User: "jwk" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
13 Mar 2006 10:10:54 AM |
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DanielSan wrote:
808 wrote:
On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 20:43:45 GMT, (Fredric L.
Rice) wrote:
<snip>
"Islamophobia"? Isn't that the fear of Islam? Who wouldn't fear a
religion that engenders violence against those that offend against it?
Interesting premise, 808. Let's investigate that claim.
Current Muslim Population: 800 million - 1.4 billion Muslims.
If Islam is a religion that engenders violence againce those that offend
against it, that would be 800 million - 1.4 billion terrorists. The
planet would be destroyed.
No. Islam is not any more a violent religion than Christianity.
Maybe not, but they sure try harder. I hear a ton of Christian idiots
bitching and moaning and even threatening violence, but they seem to be
mostly talk. I'll take their nasty talk over the reality of muslim
hate any day. People who encourage their children to blow themselves
up scare me. Highly educated American-born muslims who decide to drive
a big SUV through a bunch of college students (without a really well
defined reason, no less) scare me. And seeing so-called "moderate"
muslims condemning other muslims for comdemning rioting over cartoons,
tells me you are wrong and they are just plain nuts.
jwk
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| User: "DanielSan" |
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| Title: Re: Islamophobia Worse in America Now Than after 9/11 |
13 Mar 2006 07:57:14 PM |
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jwk wrote:
DanielSan wrote:
808 wrote:
On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 20:43:45 GMT, (Fredric L.
Rice) wrote:
<snip>
"Islamophobia"? Isn't that the fear of Islam? Who wouldn't fear a
religion that engenders violence against those that offend against it?
Interesting premise, 808. Let's investigate that claim.
Current Muslim Population: 800 million - 1.4 billion Muslims.
If Islam is a religion that engenders violence againce those that offend
against it, that would be 800 million - 1.4 billion terrorists. The
planet would be destroyed.
No. Islam is not any more a violent religion than Christianity.
Maybe not, but they sure try harder.
Not really. Adolf "I believe today that my conduct is in accordance
with the will of the Almighty Creator" Hitler executed more than any
Muslim.
I hear a ton of Christian idiots
bitching and moaning and even threatening violence, but they seem to be
mostly talk.
Yes. But not all are "mostly talk." Some actually put their words into
action.
I'll take their nasty talk over the reality of muslim
hate any day.
Actually, "their nasty talk" is the reality of Christian hate.
People who encourage their children to blow themselves
up scare me.
....or pistol-whip folks tied to a fence, or subject people to
"Palestinian Hangings," or murder millions of Jews, or subject Jews to
torture for not being "Catholic," and so forth.
Highly educated American-born muslims who decide to drive
a big SUV through a bunch of college students (without a really well
defined reason, no less) scare me.
American-born Christians do it, too. Plus, they steal tanks.
And seeing so-called "moderate"
muslims condemning other muslims for comdemning rioting over cartoons,
tells me you are wrong and they are just plain nuts.
Um, only 0.00000002% of Muslims are "violent.
jerk
Fixed your nick for ya.
--
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* DanielSan -- alt.atheism #2226 *
*--------------------------------------------------*
* "In every country and in every age, the priest *
* has been hostile to liberty. He is always in *
* alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in *
* return for protection to his own." *
* --Jefferson (in a letter to H. Spafford, 1814) *
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