Religions > Atheism > Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean
| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"stoney" |
| Date: |
31 Jul 2006 09:55:53 PM |
| Object: |
Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
http://www.tehrantimes.com/Description.asp?Da=7/30/2006&Cat=2&Num=4
July 30, 2006
Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean
BEIRUT (AFP) - The Mediterranean is threatened by its worst ever
environmental disaster after Israel's bombing of a power plant in
Lebanon sent thousands of tons of fuel gushing into the sea, the
environment minister charged on Saturday.
"Up until now 10,000-15,000 tons of heavy fuel oil have spilled out into
the sea," after Israel's bombing of the power station in Jiyeh two weeks
ago, Lebanese Environment Minister Yacub Sarraf told AFP. "It's without
doubt the biggest environmental catastrophe that the Mediterranean has
known and it risks having terrible consequences not only for our country
but for all the countries of the eastern Mediterranean."
Israeli forces bombed the tanks at the power station on July 14 and July
15, just days into their offensive on Lebanon which has seen blistering
air strikes across the country and a bloody ground incursion in the
south.
The leak from one of the tanks, which are located just 25 metres (80
feet) from the sea, has now stopped but another containing 25,000 tons
of fuel oil is still on fire and is in danger of exploding. Between
8,000-10,000 tons of fuel are on the shore and 5,000 on the open water.
"Until now, the worst ecological disasters have taken place in the
oceans and it's the first time that an oil spill has happened outside
the open sea," said Sarraf. "We can have no illusions."
Sarraf said that the cost of cleaning up Lebanon's once golden beaches
-- which until the bombardment were major attractions for locals and
tourists -- will cost between 45-50 million dollars and would not be
finished until next summer.
The spill is now affecting 70 kilometres (40 miles) of Lebanon's
220-kilometre-long (140 miles) coast, a third of its coastline. Beaches
and rocks are covered in a black sludge which has reached the famous
tourist town of Byblos, north of Beirut.
"If nothing is done, not only will currents flowing towards the north
mean that one third of Lebanon's coastline be hit, but also Cyprus,
Syria, Turkey, Greece and even Israel," Sarraf said.
"The fauna and the Mediterranean ecosystem risk suffering badly and
certain species are threatened with extinction," he warned.
Sarraf said that owing to the Israeli blockade of Lebanon's waters, it
was impossible to send ships to clear up the pollution.
"I have appealed to Britain, Italy, Spain, the United States, all the
countries which have already suffered oil slicks to ask for technical
assistance as we cannot act on our own," he said.
Kuwait has sent 40 tons of material that would allow the petrol to
thicken and also special carpets which absorb petroleum products. A
resident of Byblos, known worldwide for its seafood restaurants and
historic harbour, said "for the last four days, fish, crustaceans and
crabs have been coming in black, and they are dying as victims of this
oil slick." Fuad Hamdan, director of Friends of the Earth, Europe, and
founder of Greenpeace Lebanon, agreed that "it is certainly the worst
environmental disaster ever on the eastern Mediterranean coast."
Hamdan said the eastern Mediterranean coast from the Israeli port of
Haifa until Syria's Lattakiya was already heavily polluted from Israeli
industry, Lebanese sewage and industry from east Beirut and from Syria.
He advised people against eating fish from coastal areas. "Anyway it
will smell bad and put people off."
Besides the oil slick, the fire from the oil tanks has caused
atmospheric pollution which has already reached Beirut. "Now the toxic
cloud is stretching over a 30 kilometre distance," said Sarraf.
/end
--
Fundies and trolls are cordially invited to
shove a wooden cross up their arses and rotate
at a high rate of speed. I trust you'll
be 'blessed' with a plethora of splinters.
.
|
|
| User: "johac" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
01 Aug 2006 12:59:42 AM |
|
|
In article <8kgtc2d90qragdp49s9icgrdmdovm2spfb@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
http://www.tehrantimes.com/Description.asp?Da=7/30/2006&Cat=2&Num=4
July 30, 2006
Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean
BEIRUT (AFP) - The Mediterranean is threatened by its worst ever
environmental disaster after Israel's bombing of a power plant in
Lebanon sent thousands of tons of fuel gushing into the sea, the
environment minister charged on Saturday.
"Up until now 10,000-15,000 tons of heavy fuel oil have spilled out into
the sea," after Israel's bombing of the power station in Jiyeh two weeks
ago, Lebanese Environment Minister Yacub Sarraf told AFP. "It's without
doubt the biggest environmental catastrophe that the Mediterranean has
known and it risks having terrible consequences not only for our country
but for all the countries of the eastern Mediterranean."
Israeli forces bombed the tanks at the power station on July 14 and July
15, just days into their offensive on Lebanon which has seen blistering
air strikes across the country and a bloody ground incursion in the
south.
The leak from one of the tanks, which are located just 25 metres (80
feet) from the sea, has now stopped but another containing 25,000 tons
of fuel oil is still on fire and is in danger of exploding. Between
8,000-10,000 tons of fuel are on the shore and 5,000 on the open water.
"Until now, the worst ecological disasters have taken place in the
oceans and it's the first time that an oil spill has happened outside
the open sea," said Sarraf. "We can have no illusions."
Sarraf said that the cost of cleaning up Lebanon's once golden beaches
-- which until the bombardment were major attractions for locals and
tourists -- will cost between 45-50 million dollars and would not be
finished until next summer.
The spill is now affecting 70 kilometres (40 miles) of Lebanon's
220-kilometre-long (140 miles) coast, a third of its coastline. Beaches
and rocks are covered in a black sludge which has reached the famous
tourist town of Byblos, north of Beirut.
"If nothing is done, not only will currents flowing towards the north
mean that one third of Lebanon's coastline be hit, but also Cyprus,
Syria, Turkey, Greece and even Israel," Sarraf said.
"The fauna and the Mediterranean ecosystem risk suffering badly and
certain species are threatened with extinction," he warned.
Sarraf said that owing to the Israeli blockade of Lebanon's waters, it
was impossible to send ships to clear up the pollution.
"I have appealed to Britain, Italy, Spain, the United States, all the
countries which have already suffered oil slicks to ask for technical
assistance as we cannot act on our own," he said.
Kuwait has sent 40 tons of material that would allow the petrol to
thicken and also special carpets which absorb petroleum products. A
resident of Byblos, known worldwide for its seafood restaurants and
historic harbour, said "for the last four days, fish, crustaceans and
crabs have been coming in black, and they are dying as victims of this
oil slick." Fuad Hamdan, director of Friends of the Earth, Europe, and
founder of Greenpeace Lebanon, agreed that "it is certainly the worst
environmental disaster ever on the eastern Mediterranean coast."
Hamdan said the eastern Mediterranean coast from the Israeli port of
Haifa until Syria's Lattakiya was already heavily polluted from Israeli
industry, Lebanese sewage and industry from east Beirut and from Syria.
He advised people against eating fish from coastal areas. "Anyway it
will smell bad and put people off."
Besides the oil slick, the fire from the oil tanks has caused
atmospheric pollution which has already reached Beirut. "Now the toxic
cloud is stretching over a 30 kilometre distance," said Sarraf.
/end
So I presume that the fish, crustaceans, and crabs will be written off
as more collateral damage. One more reason why this war sucks.
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
Contact - Throw a .net over the .com
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
01 Aug 2006 06:33:34 AM |
|
|
johac <jhachmann@sbcglobal.com> wrote in news:jhachmann-
7A6837.22594231072006@news.giganews.com:
In article <8kgtc2d90qragdp49s9icgrdmdovm2spfb@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
http://www.tehrantimes.com/Description.asp?Da=7/30/2006&Cat=2&Num=4
I see Stoney is openly quoting enemy propaganda now.
July 30, 2006
Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean
Correction: *Iranian puppet Hezbollah* causes...
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
.
|
|
|
| User: "Sean C" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
01 Aug 2006 01:47:27 PM |
|
|
In article <Xns981256970449Bfstone69@66.150.105.47>, Fred Stone
<fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachmann@sbcglobal.com> wrote in news:jhachmann-
7A6837.22594231072006@news.giganews.com:
In article <8kgtc2d90qragdp49s9icgrdmdovm2spfb@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
http://www.tehrantimes.com/Description.asp?Da=7/30/2006&Cat=2&Num=4
I see Stoney is openly quoting enemy propaganda now.
July 30, 2006
Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean
Correction: *Iranian puppet Hezbollah* causes...
Using American-made bombs dropped from Israeli aircraft? Damn, them
A-rabs is more crafty than we thought. I bet they attacked the USS
Liberty, as well.
--Sean C
.
|
|
|
| User: "Scott Richter" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
01 Aug 2006 09:23:38 PM |
|
|
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
It wasn't Israel that started the fighting this time around. So it's not
Israel that's responsible for the destruction when they bomb the *****
out of Hezbollah positions.
Yes, they are. There were many different responses Israel could have
made to the kidnapping of two of its citizens; Israel chose "Shock and
Awe", I guess because they saw that it worked so well in Iraq...
You blame the US for all the destruction in Iraq, don't you?
The Iraqi people did nothing to the US, but we unilaterally declared war
on them and destroyed their country, all to catch one man (oh, and kill
his psycho kids--that was an unexpected bonus.)
Apparently, destroying entire nations in pursuit of a few individuals is
okay in your book. It's a page right out of the Nazi playbook; in that
sense, Israel and the US have become what they fought to defeat half a
century ago.
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
01 Aug 2006 09:11:47 PM |
|
|
(Scott Richter) wrote in
news:1hjentd.1q6qpr812krl6oN%:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
It wasn't Israel that started the fighting this time around. So it's
not Israel that's responsible for the destruction when they bomb the
***** out of Hezbollah positions.
Yes, they are. There were many different responses Israel could have
made to the kidnapping of two of its citizens; Israel chose "Shock and
Awe", I guess because they saw that it worked so well in Iraq...
I think the rockets coming over the border had something to do with it,
Scott.
You blame the US for all the destruction in Iraq, don't you?
The Iraqi people did nothing to the US, but we unilaterally declared
war on them and destroyed their country, all to catch one man (oh, and
kill his psycho kids--that was an unexpected bonus.)
Apparently, destroying entire nations in pursuit of a few individuals
is okay in your book. It's a page right out of the Nazi playbook; in
that sense, Israel and the US have become what they fought to defeat
half a century ago.
Yep, it's double-standard time again! Whooopeee!
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
.
|
|
|
| User: "Scott Richter" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
02 Aug 2006 09:32:24 AM |
|
|
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
Yep, it's double-standard time again! Whooopeee!
As near as I can tell, Fred only has one standard. Unfortunately, that
standard is "Might makes right"...
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
02 Aug 2006 10:03:23 AM |
|
|
(Scott Richter) wrote in
news:1hjfm63.18fb7fa6wivlsN%:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
Yep, it's double-standard time again! Whooopeee!
As near as I can tell, Fred only has one standard. Unfortunately, that
standard is "Might makes right"...
Scott is wrong, as usual, but even "Might makes right" is better than
Scott's standard of "America is always wrong".
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
.
|
|
|
| User: "Scott Richter" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
02 Aug 2006 08:47:00 PM |
|
|
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
As near as I can tell, Fred only has one standard. Unfortunately,
that standard is "Might makes right"...
Scott is wrong, as usual, but even "Might makes right" is better than
Scott's standard of "America is always wrong".
"America is always wrong"? Is that Ann Coulter diarrhea the best retort
you could come up with?
Next thing you know, you'll be calling people "nattering nabobs of
negativism"...
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Scott Richter" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
01 Aug 2006 10:45:58 PM |
|
|
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
It wasn't Israel that started the fighting this time around. So it's
not Israel that's responsible for the destruction when they bomb the
***** out of Hezbollah positions.
Yes, they are. There were many different responses Israel could have
made to the kidnapping of two of its citizens; Israel chose "Shock and
Awe", I guess because they saw that it worked so well in Iraq...
I think the rockets coming over the border had something to do with it,
Scott.
My, how short your memory. And how faulty, if you believe the Israelis
didn't unleash the first round of Shock and Awe. From CNN's web site:
Hezbollah militants cross into Israel, kill three Israeli soldiers and
kidnap two others in a bid to negotiate a prisoner exchange, a demand
rebuffed by Israel. Another five Israeli soldiers are killed after the
ambush. ISRAEL RESPONDS WITH A NAVAL BLOCKADE AND BY BOMBING HUNDREDS OF
TARGETS IN LEBANON, INCLUDING BEIRUT'S AIRPORT and Hezbollah's
headquarters in southern Beirut.
(emphasis added)
.
|
|
|
| User: "Matt Silberstein" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
01 Aug 2006 11:38:20 PM |
|
|
On Tue, 1 Aug 2006 20:45:58 -0700, in alt.atheism ,
scottrichter422@yahoo.com (Scott Richter) in
<1hjerz5.1d8u7o7b4ayzyN%scottrichter422@yahoo.com> wrote:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
It wasn't Israel that started the fighting this time around. So it's
not Israel that's responsible for the destruction when they bomb the
***** out of Hezbollah positions.
Yes, they are. There were many different responses Israel could have
made to the kidnapping of two of its citizens; Israel chose "Shock and
Awe", I guess because they saw that it worked so well in Iraq...
I think the rockets coming over the border had something to do with it,
Scott.
My, how short your memory. And how faulty, if you believe the Israelis
didn't unleash the first round of Shock and Awe. From CNN's web site:
Hezbollah militants cross into Israel, kill three Israeli soldiers and
kidnap two others in a bid to negotiate a prisoner exchange, a demand
rebuffed by Israel. Another five Israeli soldiers are killed after the
ambush. ISRAEL RESPONDS WITH A NAVAL BLOCKADE AND BY BOMBING HUNDREDS OF
TARGETS IN LEBANON, INCLUDING BEIRUT'S AIRPORT and Hezbollah's
headquarters in southern Beirut.
(emphasis added)
What is your problem? That Israel had more firepower to fight *back*?
Hezbollah has been firing rockets into Israel for years and building
up its supply. They are members of the Lebanese government and
attacked a sovereign nation. Would you prefer that Israel kidnap some
Lebanese or that they just allow the Hezbollah attacks.
--
Matt Silberstein
Do something today about the Darfur Genocide
http://www.beawitness.org
http://www.darfurgenocide.org
http://www.savedarfur.org
"Darfur: A Genocide We can Stop"
.
|
|
|
| User: "Scott Richter" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
02 Aug 2006 09:24:10 AM |
|
|
Matt Silberstein <RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nospam@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
It wasn't Israel that started the fighting this time around. So it's
not Israel that's responsible for the destruction when they bomb the
***** out of Hezbollah positions.
Yes, they are. There were many different responses Israel could have
made to the kidnapping of two of its citizens; Israel chose "Shock and
Awe", I guess because they saw that it worked so well in Iraq...
I think the rockets coming over the border had something to do with it,
Scott.
My, how short your memory. And how faulty, if you believe the Israelis
didn't unleash the first round of Shock and Awe. From CNN's web site:
Hezbollah militants cross into Israel, kill three Israeli soldiers and
kidnap two others in a bid to negotiate a prisoner exchange, a demand
rebuffed by Israel. Another five Israeli soldiers are killed after the
ambush. ISRAEL RESPONDS WITH A NAVAL BLOCKADE AND BY BOMBING HUNDREDS OF
TARGETS IN LEBANON, INCLUDING BEIRUT'S AIRPORT and Hezbollah's
headquarters in southern Beirut.
(emphasis added)
What is your problem? That Israel had more firepower to fight *back*?
Hezbollah has been firing rockets into Israel for years and building
up its supply. They are members of the Lebanese government and
attacked a sovereign nation. Would you prefer that Israel kidnap some
Lebanese or that they just allow the Hezbollah attacks.
I was simply making the point that Shock and Awe is a mistake. It was a
mistake for the US in Iraq and it is a mistake for Israel in Lebanon. It
may provide temporary relief, but the long term negative effects of
radicalizing an entire generation will come back to haunt the world for
years to come. Shock and Awe is the bluntest of weapons, and in both
cases, there were many other options available. Now there are few.
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "Voracious" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
02 Aug 2006 06:45:28 PM |
|
|
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On Tue, 1 Aug 2006 20:45:58 -0700, in alt.atheism ,
scottrichter422@yahoo.com (Scott Richter) in
<1hjerz5.1d8u7o7b4ayzyN%scottrichter422@yahoo.com> wrote:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
It wasn't Israel that started the fighting this time around. So it's
not Israel that's responsible for the destruction when they bomb the
***** out of Hezbollah positions.
Yes, they are. There were many different responses Israel could have
made to the kidnapping of two of its citizens; Israel chose "Shock and
Awe", I guess because they saw that it worked so well in Iraq...
I think the rockets coming over the border had something to do with it,
Scott.
My, how short your memory. And how faulty, if you believe the Israelis
didn't unleash the first round of Shock and Awe. From CNN's web site:
Hezbollah militants cross into Israel, kill three Israeli soldiers and
kidnap two others in a bid to negotiate a prisoner exchange, a demand
rebuffed by Israel. Another five Israeli soldiers are killed after the
ambush. ISRAEL RESPONDS WITH A NAVAL BLOCKADE AND BY BOMBING HUNDREDS OF
TARGETS IN LEBANON, INCLUDING BEIRUT'S AIRPORT and Hezbollah's
headquarters in southern Beirut.
(emphasis added)
What is your problem? That Israel had more firepower to fight *back*?
Hezbollah has been firing rockets into Israel for years and building
up its supply. They are members of the Lebanese government and
attacked a sovereign nation. Would you prefer that Israel kidnap some
Lebanese or that they just allow the Hezbollah attacks.
The problem is Israel attacking facilities that had nothing to do with
Hizbollah. The Beirut International Airport wasn't a Hizbollah base, the
bombed Lebanese army base wasn't Hizbollah property, and the fuel dumps
weren't Hizbollah's either. Israel just goes ahead and slaughters
hundreds of innocent Lebanese citizens in an unwarranted assault for a
relatively minor offense.
Don't get started on how kidnapping and killing enemy soldiers isn't a
minor issue to be resolved through talks. After all, Hizbollah is the
*only* regional force to oust and defeat the IDF!
Voracious
.
|
|
|
| User: "Matt Silberstein" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
02 Aug 2006 09:24:37 PM |
|
|
On Wed, 02 Aug 2006 23:45:28 GMT, in alt.atheism , Voracious
<null@void.org> in <sOaAg.4094$uo6.1861@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com>
wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On Tue, 1 Aug 2006 20:45:58 -0700, in alt.atheism ,
scottrichter422@yahoo.com (Scott Richter) in
<1hjerz5.1d8u7o7b4ayzyN%scottrichter422@yahoo.com> wrote:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
It wasn't Israel that started the fighting this time around. So it's
not Israel that's responsible for the destruction when they bomb the
***** out of Hezbollah positions.
Yes, they are. There were many different responses Israel could have
made to the kidnapping of two of its citizens; Israel chose "Shock and
Awe", I guess because they saw that it worked so well in Iraq...
I think the rockets coming over the border had something to do with it,
Scott.
My, how short your memory. And how faulty, if you believe the Israelis
didn't unleash the first round of Shock and Awe. From CNN's web site:
Hezbollah militants cross into Israel, kill three Israeli soldiers and
kidnap two others in a bid to negotiate a prisoner exchange, a demand
rebuffed by Israel. Another five Israeli soldiers are killed after the
ambush. ISRAEL RESPONDS WITH A NAVAL BLOCKADE AND BY BOMBING HUNDREDS OF
TARGETS IN LEBANON, INCLUDING BEIRUT'S AIRPORT and Hezbollah's
headquarters in southern Beirut.
(emphasis added)
What is your problem? That Israel had more firepower to fight *back*?
Hezbollah has been firing rockets into Israel for years and building
up its supply. They are members of the Lebanese government and
attacked a sovereign nation. Would you prefer that Israel kidnap some
Lebanese or that they just allow the Hezbollah attacks.
The problem is Israel attacking facilities that had nothing to do with
Hizbollah. The Beirut International Airport wasn't a Hizbollah base, the
bombed Lebanese army base wasn't Hizbollah property, and the fuel dumps
weren't Hizbollah's either. Israel just goes ahead and slaughters
hundreds of innocent Lebanese citizens in an unwarranted assault for a
relatively minor offense.
Israel went after facilities that were or could be used to support
Hezbollah.
Don't get started on how kidnapping and killing enemy soldiers isn't a
minor issue to be resolved through talks.
How about the daily rocket attacks that were occurring before the
kidnapping? And how is a cross border attack by the force of a
sovereign nation to another sovereign nation (remember, Hezbollah is
part of the Lebanese government and the government has stated they
won't stop or disarm Hezbollah) a minor thing? What countries treat
attacks on their soldiers as a minor thing subject to talks? Or
constant attacks on their citizens by a group dedicated to destroying
them?
After all, Hizbollah is the
*only* regional force to oust and defeat the IDF!
Israel gave up territory and that is treated as a weakness on the part
of Israel, not a step towards peace. So what should Israel do? You
don't want them to fight back and giving in will just lead to more
demands. Hezbollah will continue to hide behind women and children and
continue to indiscriminately fire rockets at Israel. Should all the
Jews leave and, if so, where should they go?
--
Matt Silberstein
Do something today about the Darfur Genocide
http://www.beawitness.org
http://www.darfurgenocide.org
http://www.savedarfur.org
"Darfur: A Genocide We can Stop"
.
|
|
|
| User: "Voracious" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
03 Aug 2006 07:43:08 PM |
|
|
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On Wed, 02 Aug 2006 23:45:28 GMT, in alt.atheism , Voracious
<null@void.org> in <sOaAg.4094$uo6.1861@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com>
wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On Tue, 1 Aug 2006 20:45:58 -0700, in alt.atheism ,
scottrichter422@yahoo.com (Scott Richter) in
<1hjerz5.1d8u7o7b4ayzyN%scottrichter422@yahoo.com> wrote:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
It wasn't Israel that started the fighting this time around. So it's
not Israel that's responsible for the destruction when they bomb the
***** out of Hezbollah positions.
Yes, they are. There were many different responses Israel could have
made to the kidnapping of two of its citizens; Israel chose "Shock and
Awe", I guess because they saw that it worked so well in Iraq...
I think the rockets coming over the border had something to do with it,
Scott.
My, how short your memory. And how faulty, if you believe the Israelis
didn't unleash the first round of Shock and Awe. From CNN's web site:
Hezbollah militants cross into Israel, kill three Israeli soldiers and
kidnap two others in a bid to negotiate a prisoner exchange, a demand
rebuffed by Israel. Another five Israeli soldiers are killed after the
ambush. ISRAEL RESPONDS WITH A NAVAL BLOCKADE AND BY BOMBING HUNDREDS OF
TARGETS IN LEBANON, INCLUDING BEIRUT'S AIRPORT and Hezbollah's
headquarters in southern Beirut.
(emphasis added)
What is your problem? That Israel had more firepower to fight *back*?
Hezbollah has been firing rockets into Israel for years and building
up its supply. They are members of the Lebanese government and
attacked a sovereign nation. Would you prefer that Israel kidnap some
Lebanese or that they just allow the Hezbollah attacks.
The problem is Israel attacking facilities that had nothing to do with
Hizbollah. The Beirut International Airport wasn't a Hizbollah base, the
bombed Lebanese army base wasn't Hizbollah property, and the fuel dumps
weren't Hizbollah's either. Israel just goes ahead and slaughters
hundreds of innocent Lebanese citizens in an unwarranted assault for a
relatively minor offense.
Israel went after facilities that were or could be used to support
Hezbollah.
Don't get started on how kidnapping and killing enemy soldiers isn't a
minor issue to be resolved through talks.
How about the daily rocket attacks that were occurring before the
kidnapping? And how is a cross border attack by the force of a
sovereign nation to another sovereign nation (remember, Hezbollah is
part of the Lebanese government and the government has stated they
won't stop or disarm Hezbollah) a minor thing? What countries treat
attacks on their soldiers as a minor thing subject to talks? Or
constant attacks on their citizens by a group dedicated to destroying
them?
After all, Hizbollah is the
*only* regional force to oust and defeat the IDF!
Israel gave up territory and that is treated as a weakness on the part
of Israel, not a step towards peace. So what should Israel do? You
don't want them to fight back and giving in will just lead to more
demands. Hezbollah will continue to hide behind women and children and
continue to indiscriminately fire rockets at Israel. Should all the
Jews leave and, if so, where should they go?
They can all jump off of Mt Meggido with boulders tied around them!
Voracious
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "maff" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
03 Aug 2006 03:26:26 AM |
|
|
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On Wed, 02 Aug 2006 23:45:28 GMT, in alt.atheism , Voracious
<null@void.org> in <sOaAg.4094$uo6.1861@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com>
wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On Tue, 1 Aug 2006 20:45:58 -0700, in alt.atheism ,
scottrichter422@yahoo.com (Scott Richter) in
<1hjerz5.1d8u7o7b4ayzyN%scottrichter422@yahoo.com> wrote:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
It wasn't Israel that started the fighting this time around. So it=
's
not Israel that's responsible for the destruction when they bomb t=
he
***** out of Hezbollah positions.
Yes, they are. There were many different responses Israel could have
made to the kidnapping of two of its citizens; Israel chose "Shock =
and
Awe", I guess because they saw that it worked so well in Iraq...
I think the rockets coming over the border had something to do with =
it,
Scott.
My, how short your memory. And how faulty, if you believe the Israelis
didn't unleash the first round of Shock and Awe. From CNN's web site:
Hezbollah militants cross into Israel, kill three Israeli soldiers and
kidnap two others in a bid to negotiate a prisoner exchange, a demand
rebuffed by Israel. Another five Israeli soldiers are killed after the
ambush. ISRAEL RESPONDS WITH A NAVAL BLOCKADE AND BY BOMBING HUNDREDS=
OF
TARGETS IN LEBANON, INCLUDING BEIRUT'S AIRPORT and Hezbollah's
headquarters in southern Beirut.
(emphasis added)
What is your problem? That Israel had more firepower to fight *back*?
Hezbollah has been firing rockets into Israel for years and building
up its supply. They are members of the Lebanese government and
attacked a sovereign nation. Would you prefer that Israel kidnap some
Lebanese or that they just allow the Hezbollah attacks.
The problem is Israel attacking facilities that had nothing to do with
Hizbollah. The Beirut International Airport wasn't a Hizbollah base, the
bombed Lebanese army base wasn't Hizbollah property, and the fuel dumps
weren't Hizbollah's either. Israel just goes ahead and slaughters
hundreds of innocent Lebanese citizens in an unwarranted assault for a
relatively minor offense.
Israel went after facilities that were or could be used to support
Hezbollah.
You mean like destroying electricity supplies, water treatment
facilities, hospitals, bridges, etc?
Don't get started on how kidnapping and killing enemy soldiers isn't a
minor issue to be resolved through talks.
How about the daily rocket attacks that were occurring before the
kidnapping? And how is a cross border attack by the force of a
sovereign nation to another sovereign nation (remember, Hezbollah is
part of the Lebanese government and the government has stated they
won't stop or disarm Hezbollah) a minor thing? What countries treat
attacks on their soldiers as a minor thing subject to talks? Or
constant attacks on their citizens by a group dedicated to destroying
them?
Not even Israeli newpapers were reporting such attacks. Where do you
get your news?
After all, Hizbollah is the
*only* regional force to oust and defeat the IDF!
Israel gave up territory and that is treated as a weakness on the part
of Israel, not a step towards peace. So what should Israel do? You
don't want them to fight back and giving in will just lead to more
demands. Hezbollah will continue to hide behind women and children and
continue to indiscriminately fire rockets at Israel. Should all the
Jews leave and, if so, where should they go?
Why are you using the logic of a child abuser who was a victim of child
abuse?
"The Jewish bandits are despicable cowards who hide behind women and
children." - SS-Gruppenf=FChrer J=FCrgen Stroop on the resistance in the
Warsaw Ghetto, 1943.
--
Matt Silberstein
Do something today about the Darfur Genocide
http://www.beawitness.org
http://www.darfurgenocide.org
http://www.savedarfur.org
=20
"Darfur: A Genocide We can Stop"
.
|
|
|
| User: "Matt Silberstein" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
03 Aug 2006 07:00:36 AM |
|
|
On 3 Aug 2006 01:26:26 -0700, in alt.atheism , "maff"
<maff91@yahoo.com> in
<1154593585.981943.8630@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On Wed, 02 Aug 2006 23:45:28 GMT, in alt.atheism , Voracious
<null@void.org> in <sOaAg.4094$uo6.1861@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com>
wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On Tue, 1 Aug 2006 20:45:58 -0700, in alt.atheism ,
scottrichter422@yahoo.com (Scott Richter) in
<1hjerz5.1d8u7o7b4ayzyN%scottrichter422@yahoo.com> wrote:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
It wasn't Israel that started the fighting this time around. So it's
not Israel that's responsible for the destruction when they bomb the
***** out of Hezbollah positions.
Yes, they are. There were many different responses Israel could have
made to the kidnapping of two of its citizens; Israel chose "Shock and
Awe", I guess because they saw that it worked so well in Iraq...
I think the rockets coming over the border had something to do with it,
Scott.
My, how short your memory. And how faulty, if you believe the Israelis
didn't unleash the first round of Shock and Awe. From CNN's web site:
Hezbollah militants cross into Israel, kill three Israeli soldiers and
kidnap two others in a bid to negotiate a prisoner exchange, a demand
rebuffed by Israel. Another five Israeli soldiers are killed after the
ambush. ISRAEL RESPONDS WITH A NAVAL BLOCKADE AND BY BOMBING HUNDREDS OF
TARGETS IN LEBANON, INCLUDING BEIRUT'S AIRPORT and Hezbollah's
headquarters in southern Beirut.
(emphasis added)
What is your problem? That Israel had more firepower to fight *back*?
Hezbollah has been firing rockets into Israel for years and building
up its supply. They are members of the Lebanese government and
attacked a sovereign nation. Would you prefer that Israel kidnap some
Lebanese or that they just allow the Hezbollah attacks.
The problem is Israel attacking facilities that had nothing to do with
Hizbollah. The Beirut International Airport wasn't a Hizbollah base, the
bombed Lebanese army base wasn't Hizbollah property, and the fuel dumps
weren't Hizbollah's either. Israel just goes ahead and slaughters
hundreds of innocent Lebanese citizens in an unwarranted assault for a
relatively minor offense.
Israel went after facilities that were or could be used to support
Hezbollah.
You mean like destroying electricity supplies, water treatment
facilities, hospitals, bridges, etc?
Electrical supplies in a war? Sure. Bridges? Absolutely. As for
"hospitals", the various terrorists groups, Hezbollah included have a
long history of calling something a "hospital" and using it as a
military base. It is too late to listen to their whining about such
things. If they don't like that they can stop hiding behind them.
Don't get started on how kidnapping and killing enemy soldiers isn't a
minor issue to be resolved through talks.
How about the daily rocket attacks that were occurring before the
kidnapping? And how is a cross border attack by the force of a
sovereign nation to another sovereign nation (remember, Hezbollah is
part of the Lebanese government and the government has stated they
won't stop or disarm Hezbollah) a minor thing? What countries treat
attacks on their soldiers as a minor thing subject to talks? Or
constant attacks on their citizens by a group dedicated to destroying
them?
Not even Israeli newpapers were reporting such attacks. Where do you
get your news?
Yes, they did report such. Hezbollah and Hamas have been using rockets
constantly. Not at the rate they are now, but enough to cause
problems.
After all, Hizbollah is the
*only* regional force to oust and defeat the IDF!
Israel gave up territory and that is treated as a weakness on the part
of Israel, not a step towards peace. So what should Israel do? You
don't want them to fight back and giving in will just lead to more
demands. Hezbollah will continue to hide behind women and children and
continue to indiscriminately fire rockets at Israel. Should all the
Jews leave and, if so, where should they go?
Why are you using the logic of a child abuser who was a victim of child
abuse?
Nice ad hom, do you have a real response?
"The Jewish bandits are despicable cowards who hide behind women and
children." - SS-Gruppenführer Jürgen Stroop on the resistance in the
Warsaw Ghetto, 1943.
Gee, and you have called me a war criminal as well. Of course facts
are not something you bother with.
--
Matt Silberstein
Do something today about the Darfur Genocide
http://www.beawitness.org
http://www.darfurgenocide.org
http://www.savedarfur.org
"Darfur: A Genocide We can Stop"
.
|
|
|
| User: "Scott Richter" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
03 Aug 2006 09:32:23 AM |
|
|
Matt Silberstein <RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nospam@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
"The Jewish bandits are despicable cowards who hide behind women and
children." - SS-Gruppenführer Jürgen Stroop on the resistance in the
Warsaw Ghetto, 1943.
Gee, and you have called me a war criminal as well.
Explicit attacks on civilian targets could be considered war crimes,
however, no one is accusing you of being a war criminal just for
supporting these acts, so you don't need to hire an attorney just yet...
Of course facts are not something you bother with.
You mean facts like calling you a war criminal?
.
|
|
|
| User: "Matt Silberstein" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
03 Aug 2006 11:28:56 AM |
|
|
On Thu, 3 Aug 2006 07:32:23 -0700, in alt.atheism ,
scottrichter422@yahoo.com (Scott Richter) in
<1hjhgdj.u9d2a1qy6azeN%scottrichter422@yahoo.com> wrote:
Matt Silberstein <RemoveThisPrefixmatts2nospam@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
"The Jewish bandits are despicable cowards who hide behind women and
children." - SS-Gruppenführer Jürgen Stroop on the resistance in the
Warsaw Ghetto, 1943.
Gee, and you have called me a war criminal as well.
Explicit attacks on civilian targets could be considered war crimes,
however, no one is accusing you of being a war criminal just for
supporting these acts, so you don't need to hire an attorney just yet...
Ah, but Maff has actually accused me of being a war criminal and said
I was to go on trial in the Hague. It has been a very surreal
experience. IIRC I am a war criminal because of what Sharon supposedly
did in Lebanon. It was not all that clear to me what my crime was
(particularly since I objected to what Sharon did), but I still look
forward to a free trip to Belgium: beer, mussels and fries, and
chocolate. Yumm!
Of course facts are not something you bother with.
You mean facts like calling you a war criminal?
Sort of. Maff is fine when it comes to copy and pasting, he does not
do as well when he has to compose his own material.
--
Matt Silberstein
Do something today about the Darfur Genocide
http://www.beawitness.org
http://www.darfurgenocide.org
http://www.savedarfur.org
"Darfur: A Genocide We can Stop"
.
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "maff" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
04 Aug 2006 03:11:03 AM |
|
|
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On 3 Aug 2006 01:26:26 -0700, in alt.atheism , "maff"
<maff91@yahoo.com> in
<1154593585.981943.8630@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On Wed, 02 Aug 2006 23:45:28 GMT, in alt.atheism , Voracious
<null@void.org> in <sOaAg.4094$uo6.1861@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com>
wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On Tue, 1 Aug 2006 20:45:58 -0700, in alt.atheism ,
scottrichter422@yahoo.com (Scott Richter) in
<1hjerz5.1d8u7o7b4ayzyN%scottrichter422@yahoo.com> wrote:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
It wasn't Israel that started the fighting this time around. So=
it's
not Israel that's responsible for the destruction when they bom=
b the
***** out of Hezbollah positions.
Yes, they are. There were many different responses Israel could =
have
made to the kidnapping of two of its citizens; Israel chose "Sho=
ck and
Awe", I guess because they saw that it worked so well in Iraq...
I think the rockets coming over the border had something to do wi=
th it,
Scott.
My, how short your memory. And how faulty, if you believe the Isra=
elis
didn't unleash the first round of Shock and Awe. From CNN's web si=
te:
Hezbollah militants cross into Israel, kill three Israeli soldiers=
and
kidnap two others in a bid to negotiate a prisoner exchange, a dem=
and
rebuffed by Israel. Another five Israeli soldiers are killed after=
the
ambush. ISRAEL RESPONDS WITH A NAVAL BLOCKADE AND BY BOMBING HUNDR=
EDS OF
TARGETS IN LEBANON, INCLUDING BEIRUT'S AIRPORT and Hezbollah's
headquarters in southern Beirut.
(emphasis added)
What is your problem? That Israel had more firepower to fight *back=
*?
Hezbollah has been firing rockets into Israel for years and building
up its supply. They are members of the Lebanese government and
attacked a sovereign nation. Would you prefer that Israel kidnap so=
me
Lebanese or that they just allow the Hezbollah attacks.
The problem is Israel attacking facilities that had nothing to do with
Hizbollah. The Beirut International Airport wasn't a Hizbollah base, =
the
bombed Lebanese army base wasn't Hizbollah property, and the fuel dum=
ps
weren't Hizbollah's either. Israel just goes ahead and slaughters
hundreds of innocent Lebanese citizens in an unwarranted assault for a
relatively minor offense.
Israel went after facilities that were or could be used to support
Hezbollah.
You mean like destroying electricity supplies, water treatment
facilities, hospitals, bridges, etc?
Electrical supplies in a war? Sure. Bridges? Absolutely. As for
"hospitals", the various terrorists groups, Hezbollah included have a
long history of calling something a "hospital" and using it as a
military base. It is too late to listen to their whining about such
things. If they don't like that they can stop hiding behind them.
So are you saying that you agree electricity supplies, hospitals, etc
in Israel are legitimate targets?
Don't get started on how kidnapping and killing enemy soldiers isn't a
minor issue to be resolved through talks.
How about the daily rocket attacks that were occurring before the
kidnapping? And how is a cross border attack by the force of a
sovereign nation to another sovereign nation (remember, Hezbollah is
part of the Lebanese government and the government has stated they
won't stop or disarm Hezbollah) a minor thing? What countries treat
attacks on their soldiers as a minor thing subject to talks? Or
constant attacks on their citizens by a group dedicated to destroying
them?
Not even Israeli newpapers were reporting such attacks. Where do you
get your news?
Yes, they did report such. Hezbollah and Hamas have been using rockets
constantly. Not at the rate they are now, but enough to cause
problems.
But Israel didn't seem to have nuch problem with kidnapping Israeli
sldiers before.
After all, Hizbollah is the
*only* regional force to oust and defeat the IDF!
Israel gave up territory and that is treated as a weakness on the part
of Israel, not a step towards peace. So what should Israel do? You
don't want them to fight back and giving in will just lead to more
demands. Hezbollah will continue to hide behind women and children and
continue to indiscriminately fire rockets at Israel. Should all the
Jews leave and, if so, where should they go?
Why are you using the logic of a child abuser who was a victim of child
abuse?
Nice ad hom, do you have a real response?
So you agree that you're the unrepetant Nazi Stroop-Silberstein?
"The Jewish bandits are despicable cowards who hide behind women and
children." - SS-Gruppenf=FChrer J=FCrgen Stroop on the resistance in the
Warsaw Ghetto, 1943.
Gee, and you have called me a war criminal as well. Of course facts
are not something you bother with.
That's good. Then you can be be shot summarily with no need for the
courts.
--
Matt Silberstein
Do something today about the Darfur Genocide
http://www.beawitness.org
http://www.darfurgenocide.org
http://www.savedarfur.org
=20
"Darfur: A Genocide We can Stop"
.
|
|
|
| User: "Matt Silberstein" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
10 Aug 2006 04:44:54 PM |
|
|
On 4 Aug 2006 01:11:03 -0700, in alt.atheism , "maff"
<maff91@yahoo.com> in
<1154679062.991307.29620@s13g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On 3 Aug 2006 01:26:26 -0700, in alt.atheism , "maff"
<maff91@yahoo.com> in
<1154593585.981943.8630@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On Wed, 02 Aug 2006 23:45:28 GMT, in alt.atheism , Voracious
<null@void.org> in <sOaAg.4094$uo6.1861@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com>
wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On Tue, 1 Aug 2006 20:45:58 -0700, in alt.atheism ,
scottrichter422@yahoo.com (Scott Richter) in
<1hjerz5.1d8u7o7b4ayzyN%scottrichter422@yahoo.com> wrote:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
It wasn't Israel that started the fighting this time around. So it's
not Israel that's responsible for the destruction when they bomb the
***** out of Hezbollah positions.
Yes, they are. There were many different responses Israel could have
made to the kidnapping of two of its citizens; Israel chose "Shock and
Awe", I guess because they saw that it worked so well in Iraq...
I think the rockets coming over the border had something to do with it,
Scott.
My, how short your memory. And how faulty, if you believe the Israelis
didn't unleash the first round of Shock and Awe. From CNN's web site:
Hezbollah militants cross into Israel, kill three Israeli soldiers and
kidnap two others in a bid to negotiate a prisoner exchange, a demand
rebuffed by Israel. Another five Israeli soldiers are killed after the
ambush. ISRAEL RESPONDS WITH A NAVAL BLOCKADE AND BY BOMBING HUNDREDS OF
TARGETS IN LEBANON, INCLUDING BEIRUT'S AIRPORT and Hezbollah's
headquarters in southern Beirut.
(emphasis added)
What is your problem? That Israel had more firepower to fight *back*?
Hezbollah has been firing rockets into Israel for years and building
up its supply. They are members of the Lebanese government and
attacked a sovereign nation. Would you prefer that Israel kidnap some
Lebanese or that they just allow the Hezbollah attacks.
The problem is Israel attacking facilities that had nothing to do with
Hizbollah. The Beirut International Airport wasn't a Hizbollah base, the
bombed Lebanese army base wasn't Hizbollah property, and the fuel dumps
weren't Hizbollah's either. Israel just goes ahead and slaughters
hundreds of innocent Lebanese citizens in an unwarranted assault for a
relatively minor offense.
Israel went after facilities that were or could be used to support
Hezbollah.
You mean like destroying electricity supplies, water treatment
facilities, hospitals, bridges, etc?
Electrical supplies in a war? Sure. Bridges? Absolutely. As for
"hospitals", the various terrorists groups, Hezbollah included have a
long history of calling something a "hospital" and using it as a
military base. It is too late to listen to their whining about such
things. If they don't like that they can stop hiding behind them.
So are you saying that you agree electricity supplies, hospitals, etc
in Israel are legitimate targets?
Electric supplies? Possibly. Fake hospitals used as military sites?
Sure.
Don't get started on how kidnapping and killing enemy soldiers isn't a
minor issue to be resolved through talks.
How about the daily rocket attacks that were occurring before the
kidnapping? And how is a cross border attack by the force of a
sovereign nation to another sovereign nation (remember, Hezbollah is
part of the Lebanese government and the government has stated they
won't stop or disarm Hezbollah) a minor thing? What countries treat
attacks on their soldiers as a minor thing subject to talks? Or
constant attacks on their citizens by a group dedicated to destroying
them?
Not even Israeli newpapers were reporting such attacks. Where do you
get your news?
Yes, they did report such. Hezbollah and Hamas have been using rockets
constantly. Not at the rate they are now, but enough to cause
problems.
But Israel didn't seem to have nuch problem with kidnapping Israeli
sldiers before.
Huh?
After all, Hizbollah is the
*only* regional force to oust and defeat the IDF!
Israel gave up territory and that is treated as a weakness on the part
of Israel, not a step towards peace. So what should Israel do? You
don't want them to fight back and giving in will just lead to more
demands. Hezbollah will continue to hide behind women and children and
continue to indiscriminately fire rockets at Israel. Should all the
Jews leave and, if so, where should they go?
Why are you using the logic of a child abuser who was a victim of child
abuse?
Nice ad hom, do you have a real response?
So you agree that you're the unrepetant Nazi Stroop-Silberstein?
Something like that.
"The Jewish bandits are despicable cowards who hide behind women and
children." - SS-Gruppenführer Jürgen Stroop on the resistance in the
Warsaw Ghetto, 1943.
Gee, and you have called me a war criminal as well. Of course facts
are not something you bother with.
That's good. Then you can be be shot summarily with no need for the
courts.
There you have it: no need for trials in Maff world, summary execution
is the way to go. I hope that Scott saw this.
--
Matt Silberstein
Do something today about the Darfur Genocide
http://www.beawitness.org
http://www.darfurgenocide.org
http://www.savedarfur.org
"Darfur: A Genocide We can Stop"
.
|
|
|
| User: "Matt Silberstein" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
14 Aug 2006 03:19:18 PM |
|
|
On 11 Aug 2006 01:12:35 -0700, in alt.atheism , "maff"
<maff91@yahoo.com> in
<1155283954.976188.55150@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On 4 Aug 2006 01:11:03 -0700, in alt.atheism , "maff"
<maff91@yahoo.com> in
<1154679062.991307.29620@s13g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On 3 Aug 2006 01:26:26 -0700, in alt.atheism , "maff"
<maff91@yahoo.com> in
<1154593585.981943.8630@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On Wed, 02 Aug 2006 23:45:28 GMT, in alt.atheism , Voracious
<null@void.org> in <sOaAg.4094$uo6.1861@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com>
wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On Tue, 1 Aug 2006 20:45:58 -0700, in alt.atheism ,
scottrichter422@yahoo.com (Scott Richter) in
<1hjerz5.1d8u7o7b4ayzyN%scottrichter422@yahoo.com> wrote:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
It wasn't Israel that started the fighting this time around. So it's
not Israel that's responsible for the destruction when they bomb the
***** out of Hezbollah positions.
Yes, they are. There were many different responses Israel could have
made to the kidnapping of two of its citizens; Israel chose "Shock and
Awe", I guess because they saw that it worked so well in Iraq...
I think the rockets coming over the border had something to do with it,
Scott.
My, how short your memory. And how faulty, if you believe the Israelis
didn't unleash the first round of Shock and Awe. From CNN's web site:
Hezbollah militants cross into Israel, kill three Israeli soldiers and
kidnap two others in a bid to negotiate a prisoner exchange, a demand
rebuffed by Israel. Another five Israeli soldiers are killed after the
ambush. ISRAEL RESPONDS WITH A NAVAL BLOCKADE AND BY BOMBING HUNDREDS OF
TARGETS IN LEBANON, INCLUDING BEIRUT'S AIRPORT and Hezbollah's
headquarters in southern Beirut.
(emphasis added)
What is your problem? That Israel had more firepower to fight *back*?
Hezbollah has been firing rockets into Israel for years and building
up its supply. They are members of the Lebanese government and
attacked a sovereign nation. Would you prefer that Israel kidnap some
Lebanese or that they just allow the Hezbollah attacks.
The problem is Israel attacking facilities that had nothing to do with
Hizbollah. The Beirut International Airport wasn't a Hizbollah base, the
bombed Lebanese army base wasn't Hizbollah property, and the fuel dumps
weren't Hizbollah's either. Israel just goes ahead and slaughters
hundreds of innocent Lebanese citizens in an unwarranted assault for a
relatively minor offense.
Israel went after facilities that were or could be used to support
Hezbollah.
You mean like destroying electricity supplies, water treatment
facilities, hospitals, bridges, etc?
Electrical supplies in a war? Sure. Bridges? Absolutely. As for
"hospitals", the various terrorists groups, Hezbollah included have a
long history of calling something a "hospital" and using it as a
military base. It is too late to listen to their whining about such
things. If they don't like that they can stop hiding behind them.
So are you saying that you agree electricity supplies, hospitals, etc
in Israel are legitimate targets?
Electric supplies? Possibly. Fake hospitals used as military sites?
Sure.
Is that what your grandpa, SS-Gruppenführer Jürgen Stroop, also said
in his defense?
Actually Maff you cowardly ignorant bigoted slime my family was killed
by the SS. Not that facts get in your way.
Don't get started on how kidnapping and killing enemy soldiers isn't a
minor issue to be resolved through talks.
How about the daily rocket attacks that were occurring before the
kidnapping? And how is a cross border attack by the force of a
sovereign nation to another sovereign nation (remember, Hezbollah is
part of the Lebanese government and the government has stated they
won't stop or disarm Hezbollah) a minor thing? What countries treat
attacks on their soldiers as a minor thing subject to talks? Or
constant attacks on their citizens by a group dedicated to destroying
them?
Not even Israeli newpapers were reporting such attacks. Where do you
get your news?
Yes, they did report such. Hezbollah and Hamas have been using rockets
constantly. Not at the rate they are now, but enough to cause
problems.
But Israel didn't seem to have nuch problem with kidnapping Israeli
sldiers before.
Huh?
Israel responded to an unprovoked attack by Hizbullah, right? Wrong
http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1839281,00.html
Like I would believe the Guardian and their selective reporting.
The assault on Lebanon was premeditated - the soldiers' capture simply
provided the excuse. It was also unnecessary
The kidnapping was unnecessary. As was the rockets that Hezbollah has
been firing into Israel. The Guardian somehow forgot to mention that
bit, that Hezbollah has been attacking Israel long before this war
started.
After all, Hizbollah is the
*only* regional force to oust and defeat the IDF!
Israel gave up territory and that is treated as a weakness on the part
of Israel, not a step towards peace. So what should Israel do? You
don't want them to fight back and giving in will just lead to more
demands. Hezbollah will continue to hide behind women and children and
continue to indiscriminately fire rockets at Israel. Should all the
Jews leave and, if so, where should they go?
Why are you using the logic of a child abuser who was a victim of child
abuse?
Nice ad hom, do you have a real response?
So you agree that you're the unrepetant Nazi Stroop-Silberstein?
Something like that.
So you want to be executed just like your grandpa Stroop?
My family was executed in the camps. No, I will not go that way.
"The Jewish bandits are despicable cowards who hide behind women and
children." - SS-Gruppenführer Jürgen Stroop on the resistance in the
Warsaw Ghetto, 1943.
Gee, and you have called me a war criminal as well. Of course facts
are not something you bother with.
That's good. Then you can be be shot summarily with no need for the
courts.
There you have it: no need for trials in Maff world, summary execution
is the way to go. I hope that Scott saw this.
That's what happens in the real world. Didn't you know what happened to
Mussolini?
Something you seem to approve of. Or even the summary execution of
anyone you happen to dislike.
--
Matt Silberstein
Do something today about the Darfur Genocide
http://www.beawitness.org
http://www.darfurgenocide.org
http://www.savedarfur.org
"Darfur: A Genocide We can Stop"
.
|
|
|
| User: "maff" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
15 Aug 2006 07:13:04 AM |
|
|
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On 11 Aug 2006 01:12:35 -0700, in alt.atheism , "maff"
<maff91@yahoo.com> in
<1155283954.976188.55150@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On 4 Aug 2006 01:11:03 -0700, in alt.atheism , "maff"
<maff91@yahoo.com> in
<1154679062.991307.29620@s13g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On 3 Aug 2006 01:26:26 -0700, in alt.atheism , "maff"
<maff91@yahoo.com> in
<1154593585.981943.8630@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On Wed, 02 Aug 2006 23:45:28 GMT, in alt.atheism , Voracious
<null@void.org> in <sOaAg.4094$uo6.1861@newssvr13.news.prodigy.c=
om>
wrote:
Matt Silberstein wrote:
On Tue, 1 Aug 2006 20:45:58 -0700, in alt.atheism ,
scottrichter422@yahoo.com (Scott Richter) in
<1hjerz5.1d8u7o7b4ayzyN%scottrichter422@yahoo.com> wrote:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
It wasn't Israel that started the fighting this time arou=
nd. So it's
not Israel that's responsible for the destruction when th=
ey bomb the
***** out of Hezbollah positions.
Yes, they are. There were many different responses Israel =
could have
made to the kidnapping of two of its citizens; Israel chos=
e "Shock and
Awe", I guess because they saw that it worked so well in I=
raq...
I think the rockets coming over the border had something to=
do with it,
Scott.
My, how short your memory. And how faulty, if you believe th=
e Israelis
didn't unleash the first round of Shock and Awe. From CNN's =
web site:
Hezbollah militants cross into Israel, kill three Israeli so=
ldiers and
kidnap two others in a bid to negotiate a prisoner exchange,=
a demand
rebuffed by Israel. Another five Israeli soldiers are killed=
after the
ambush. ISRAEL RESPONDS WITH A NAVAL BLOCKADE AND BY BOMBING=
HUNDREDS OF
TARGETS IN LEBANON, INCLUDING BEIRUT'S AIRPORT and Hezbollah=
's
headquarters in southern Beirut.
(emphasis added)
What is your problem? That Israel had more firepower to fight=
*back*?
Hezbollah has been firing rockets into Israel for years and b=
uilding
up its supply. They are members of the Lebanese government and
attacked a sovereign nation. Would you prefer that Israel kid=
nap some
Lebanese or that they just allow the Hezbollah attacks.
The problem is Israel attacking facilities that had nothing to =
do with
Hizbollah. The Beirut International Airport wasn't a Hizbollah =
base, the
bombed Lebanese army base wasn't Hizbollah property, and the fu=
el dumps
weren't Hizbollah's either. Israel just goes ahead and slaughte=
rs
hundreds of innocent Lebanese citizens in an unwarranted assaul=
t for a
relatively minor offense.
Israel went after facilities that were or could be used to suppo=
rt
Hezbollah.
You mean like destroying electricity supplies, water treatment
facilities, hospitals, bridges, etc?
Electrical supplies in a war? Sure. Bridges? Absolutely. As for
"hospitals", the various terrorists groups, Hezbollah included have=
a
long history of calling something a "hospital" and using it as a
military base. It is too late to listen to their whining about such
things. If they don't like that they can stop hiding behind them.
So are you saying that you agree electricity supplies, hospitals, etc
in Israel are legitimate targets?
Electric supplies? Possibly. Fake hospitals used as military sites?
Sure.
Is that what your grandpa, SS-Gruppenf=FChrer J=FCrgen Stroop, also said
in his defense?
Actually Maff you cowardly ignorant bigoted slime my family was killed
by the SS. Not that facts get in your way.
But what you say tallies with your Grandpa Stroop.
Don't get started on how kidnapping and killing enemy soldiers =
isn't a
minor issue to be resolved through talks.
How about the daily rocket attacks that were occurring before the
kidnapping? And how is a cross border attack by the force of a
sovereign nation to another sovereign nation (remember, Hezbolla=
h is
part of the Lebanese government and the government has stated th=
ey
won't stop or disarm Hezbollah) a minor thing? What countries tr=
eat
attacks on their soldiers as a minor thing subject to talks? Or
constant attacks on their citizens by a group dedicated to destr=
oying
them?
Not even Israeli newpapers were reporting such attacks. Where do y=
ou
get your news?
Yes, they did report such. Hezbollah and Hamas have been using rock=
ets
constantly. Not at the rate they are now, but enough to cause
problems.
But Israel didn't seem to have nuch problem with kidnapping Israeli
sldiers before.
Huh?
Israel responded to an unprovoked attack by Hizbullah, right? Wrong
http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1839281,00.html
Like I would believe the Guardian and their selective reporting.
You can always verify the news reports since 2000 in all mainstream
newspapers (of course youn exclude Guardian, if you wish).
The assault on Lebanon was premeditated - the soldiers' capture simply
provided the excuse. It was also unnecessary
The kidnapping was unnecessary. As was the rockets that Hezbollah has
been firing into Israel. The Guardian somehow forgot to mention that
bit, that Hezbollah has been attacking Israel long before this war
started.
That's what Monbiot also said. He also says Israel attacked Hezbollah.
After all, Hizbollah is the
*only* regional force to oust and defeat the IDF!
Israel gave up territory and that is treated as a weakness on th=
e part
of Israel, not a step towards peace. So what should Israel do? Y=
ou
don't want them to fight back and giving in will just lead to mo=
re
demands. Hezbollah will continue to hide behind women and childr=
en and
continue to indiscriminately fire rockets at Israel. Should all =
the
Jews leave and, if so, where should they go?
Why are you using the logic of a child abuser who was a victim of =
child
abuse?
Nice ad hom, do you have a real response?
So you agree that you're the unrepetant Nazi Stroop-Silberstein?
Something like that.
So you want to be executed just like your grandpa Stroop?
My family was executed in the camps. No, I will not go that way.
Nah. You're just saying it. You're just a fascist who took the name of
a holocaust victim.
"The Jewish bandits are despicable cowards who hide behind women a=
nd
children." - SS-Gruppenf=FChrer J=FCrgen Stroop on the resistance =
in the
Warsaw Ghetto, 1943.
Gee, and you have called me a war criminal as well. Of course facts
are not something you bother with.
That's good. Then you can be be shot summarily with no need for the
courts.
There you have it: no need for trials in Maff world, summary execution
is the way to go. I hope that Scott saw this.
That's what happens in the real world. Didn't you know what happened to
Mussolini?
Something you seem to approve of. Or even the summary execution of
anyone you happen to dislike.
In the fog of war, people don't think of the courts.
--
Matt Silberstein
Do something today about the Darfur Genocide
http://www.beawitness.org
http://www.darfurgenocide.org
http://www.savedarfur.org
=20
"Darfur: A Genocide We can Stop"
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Robert Kopp" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
01 Aug 2006 11:50:09 PM |
|
|
Fred Stone wrote:
scottrichter422@yahoo.com (Scott Richter) wrote in
news:1hjentd.1q6qpr812krl6oN%scottrichter422@yahoo.com:
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
It wasn't Israel that started the fighting this time around. So it's
not Israel that's responsible for the destruction when they bomb the
***** out of Hezbollah positions.
Yes, they are. There were many different responses Israel could have
made to the kidnapping of two of its citizens; Israel chose "Shock and
Awe", I guess because they saw that it worked so well in Iraq...
I think the rockets coming over the border had something to do with it,
Scott.
You see from the above how religion brings out the best in people? :)
Atheism rocks!
--
Robert T. Kopp
http://analytic.tripod.com
.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Fester" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
01 Aug 2006 06:42:20 AM |
|
|
johac wrote:
In article <8kgtc2d90qragdp49s9icgrdmdovm2spfb@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
http://www.tehrantimes.com/Description.asp?Da=7/30/2006&Cat=2&Num=4
July 30, 2006
Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean
BEIRUT (AFP) - The Mediterranean is threatened by its worst ever
environmental disaster after Israel's bombing of a power plant in
Lebanon sent thousands of tons of fuel gushing into the sea, the
environment minister charged on Saturday.
"Up until now 10,000-15,000 tons of heavy fuel oil have spilled out into
the sea," after Israel's bombing of the power station in Jiyeh two weeks
ago, Lebanese Environment Minister Yacub Sarraf told AFP. "It's without
doubt the biggest environmental catastrophe that the Mediterranean has
known and it risks having terrible consequences not only for our country
but for all the countries of the eastern Mediterranean."
Israeli forces bombed the tanks at the power station on July 14 and July
15, just days into their offensive on Lebanon which has seen blistering
air strikes across the country and a bloody ground incursion in the
south.
The leak from one of the tanks, which are located just 25 metres (80
feet) from the sea, has now stopped but another containing 25,000 tons
of fuel oil is still on fire and is in danger of exploding. Between
8,000-10,000 tons of fuel are on the shore and 5,000 on the open water.
"Until now, the worst ecological disasters have taken place in the
oceans and it's the first time that an oil spill has happened outside
the open sea," said Sarraf. "We can have no illusions."
Sarraf said that the cost of cleaning up Lebanon's once golden beaches
-- which until the bombardment were major attractions for locals and
tourists -- will cost between 45-50 million dollars and would not be
finished until next summer.
The spill is now affecting 70 kilometres (40 miles) of Lebanon's
220-kilometre-long (140 miles) coast, a third of its coastline. Beaches
and rocks are covered in a black sludge which has reached the famous
tourist town of Byblos, north of Beirut.
"If nothing is done, not only will currents flowing towards the north
mean that one third of Lebanon's coastline be hit, but also Cyprus,
Syria, Turkey, Greece and even Israel," Sarraf said.
"The fauna and the Mediterranean ecosystem risk suffering badly and
certain species are threatened with extinction," he warned.
Sarraf said that owing to the Israeli blockade of Lebanon's waters, it
was impossible to send ships to clear up the pollution.
"I have appealed to Britain, Italy, Spain, the United States, all the
countries which have already suffered oil slicks to ask for technical
assistance as we cannot act on our own," he said.
Kuwait has sent 40 tons of material that would allow the petrol to
thicken and also special carpets which absorb petroleum products. A
resident of Byblos, known worldwide for its seafood restaurants and
historic harbour, said "for the last four days, fish, crustaceans and
crabs have been coming in black, and they are dying as victims of this
oil slick." Fuad Hamdan, director of Friends of the Earth, Europe, and
founder of Greenpeace Lebanon, agreed that "it is certainly the worst
environmental disaster ever on the eastern Mediterranean coast."
Hamdan said the eastern Mediterranean coast from the Israeli port of
Haifa until Syria's Lattakiya was already heavily polluted from Israeli
industry, Lebanese sewage and industry from east Beirut and from Syria.
He advised people against eating fish from coastal areas. "Anyway it
will smell bad and put people off."
Besides the oil slick, the fire from the oil tanks has caused
atmospheric pollution which has already reached Beirut. "Now the toxic
cloud is stretching over a 30 kilometre distance," said Sarraf.
/end
So I presume that the fish, crustaceans, and crabs will be written off
as more collateral damage. One more reason why this war sucks.
All war sucks. The question is whether one values the crustaceans more
than one values the children being slaughtered by Katushas. I value the
children more than the lobsters, how about you?
--
<^}})<
/\/\
See why we must wage war on terror and against whom we must wage it:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6162397493278181614&q=Obsession%3A+What+The+War+on+Terror+Is+Really+About&hl=en
.
|
|
|
| User: "johac" |
|
| Title: Re: Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean |
01 Aug 2006 11:46:20 PM |
|
|
In article <w6Hzg.29187$so3.21677@southeast.rr.com>,
Fester <not@home.com> wrote:
johac wrote:
In article <8kgtc2d90qragdp49s9icgrdmdovm2spfb@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
http://www.tehrantimes.com/Description.asp?Da=7/30/2006&Cat=2&Num=4
July 30, 2006
Israel causes 'worst environmental disaster' in Mediterranean
BEIRUT (AFP) - The Mediterranean is threatened by its worst ever
environmental disaster after Israel's bombing of a power plant in
Lebanon sent thousands of tons of fuel gushing into the sea, the
environment minister charged on Saturday.
"Up until now 10,000-15,000 tons of heavy fuel oil have spilled out into
the sea," after Israel's bombing of the power station in Jiyeh two weeks
ago, Lebanese Environment Minister Yacub Sarraf told AFP. "It's without
doubt the biggest environmental catastrophe that the Mediterranean has
known and it risks having terrible consequences not only for our country
but for all the countries of the eastern Mediterranean."
Israeli forces bombed the tanks at the power station on July 14 and July
15, just days into their offensive on Lebanon which has seen blistering
air strikes across the country and a bloody ground incursion in the
south.
The leak from one of the tanks, which are located just 25 metres (80
feet) from the sea, has now stopped but another containing 25,000 tons
of fuel oil is still on fire and is in danger of exploding. Between
8,000-10,000 tons of fuel are on the shore and 5,000 on the open water.
"Until now, the worst ecological disasters have taken place in the
oceans and it's the first time that an oil spill has happened outside
the open sea," said Sarraf. "We can have no illusions."
Sarraf said that the cost of cleaning up Lebanon's once golden beaches
-- which until the bombardment were major attractions for locals and
tourists -- will cost between 45-50 million dollars and would not be
finished until next summer.
The spill is now affecting 70 kilometres (40 miles) of Lebanon's
220-kilometre-long (140 miles) coast, a third of its coastline. Beaches
and rocks are covered in a black sludge which has reached the famous
tourist town of Byblos, north of Beirut.
"If nothing is done, not only will currents flowing towards the north
mean that one third of Lebanon's coastline be hit, but also Cyprus,
Syria, Turkey, Greece and even Israel," Sarraf said.
"The fauna and the Mediterranean ecosystem risk suffering badly and
certain species are threatened with extinction," he warned.
Sarraf said that owing to the Israeli blockade of Lebanon's waters, it
was impossible to send ships to clear up the pollution.
"I have appealed to Britain, Italy, Spain, the United States, all the
countries which have already suffered oil slicks to ask for technical
assistance as we cannot act on our own," he said.
Kuwait has sent 40 tons of material that would allow the petrol to
thicken and also special carpets which absorb petroleum products. A
resident of Byblos, known worldwide for its seafood restaurants and
historic harbour, said "for the last four days, fish, crustaceans and
crabs have been coming in black, and they are dying as victims of this
oil slick." Fuad Hamdan, director of Friends of the Earth, Europe, and
founder of Greenpeace Lebanon, agreed that "it is certainly the worst
environmental disaster ever on the eastern Mediterranean coast."
Hamdan said the eastern Mediterranean coast from the Israeli port of
Haifa until Syria's Lattakiya was already heavily polluted from Israeli
industry, Lebanese sewage and industry from east Beirut and from Syria.
He advised people against eating fish from coastal areas. "Anyway it
will smell bad and put people off."
Besides the oil slick, the fire from the oil tanks has caused
atmospheric pollution which has already reached Beirut. "Now the toxic
cloud is stretching over a 30 kilometre distance," said Sarraf.
/end
So I presume that the fish, crustaceans, and crabs will be written off
as more collateral damage. One more reason why this war sucks.
All war sucks. The question is whether one values the crustaceans more
than one values the children being slaughtered by Katushas. I value the
children more than the lobsters, how about you?
I care about both as well as the Lebanese children being killed.
< | | | |
