| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"George Washington Hayduke" |
| Date: |
30 Oct 2004 04:30:08 PM |
| Object: |
"Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
I've been going through the top 100 banned or otherwise attacked
books from the American Library Association's web site and one of the
books I checked out was "Julie of the Wolves" since it is one of the
many on the list that aren't about sex or non-Christian occultism that
make me wonder what's in them that Christian extremists don't want
others to read.
"Julie of the Wolves" is another book like "The Goats" that contains
absolutely nothing that could even remotely be considered worth banning
or attacking.
The boko is divided into three parts: Julie on the tundra getting adopted
by a small pack of wolves -- 5 of them, contribulting to the wolves and
being fed by the wolves as part of their pack.
Part 2 has Julie's early life from the age of 4 to 12, after he mother
dies and she's packed up and taken to Seal Camp with her father. When
a "westernized" relative comes to the sod hut and says she has to go to
school and takes her away from her family after the father aranges her
marriage when she reaches 13 years old. She learns that he father has
disappeared on the ice, and at 13 she's married to a mentally dysfunctional
boy but they live apart and it's basically a symbolic marriage: she rarely
sees the kid off in the distance except for one day -- the day she walks
away and out into the tundra -- when the boy tries to mate her.
Part 3 is basically her travel with the wolf pack to the edge of the sea
where she learns that her father is living in the nearby village. She
goes to see him and finds that the Eskimo ways are dying out and her father
has taken up with a white woman. Worse: it may have been her father that
was flying the airplane that was used to shoot and kill the Alpha male of
the wolf pack that adopted her. She walks back toward the tundra and,
not getting very far, admits to herself that the Eskimo way of life is
no longer. In the end she turns around and heads back to her father and
the westernized white man's life.
There _may_ be three things about the book that Christian extremists
might hate about it... No, four:
1) The book is an accurate depiction of Eskimo life before Alaska
wasinvaded and taken over by the United States.
2) The girl is married at 13 and the boy she's married to attempts
to have sex with his wife once, prompting the girl to walk away.
3) In walking away, the girl is basically divorced.
4) The girl lives with the wolves and like the wolves, eating what they
do, using body language that they use, learning to jip and understand
some of the verbal language, and learning to recognize the speech of
the individual wolves in the pack.
What I'm finding about almost all of these banned books -- aside from
the obvious Stephen King and other "scary" books like Harry Potter and
Goosbumps -- is that the majority of the books are banned because they
speak a particular truth or tell some truthful story or accurate
depiction of real life.
"Go Ask Alice" and "Catcher in the Rye" along with others of the "true
life" genre are obvious targets for extremist Christians who don't want
people to realize that their fictionalized Perfect Christian Family
fantasies are utterly absurd and unevidenced in reality.
+--+
| Hezbollah endorses George W. Bush: http://www.hezbollah.ws/
| http://sf.irk.ru/www/ot3/otiii-gif.html -- Scientology crime syndicate
| "And his daughter drips semen relentlessly." - Molina
+--+
.
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| User: "Glenn Arnold" |
|
| Title: Confusion over the word "Banned" was Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
30 Oct 2004 10:24:16 PM |
|
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George Washington Hayduke wrote:
I've been going through the top 100 banned or otherwise attacked
books from the American Library Association's web site and one of the
books I checked out was "Julie of the Wolves" since it is one of the
many on the list that aren't about sex or non-Christian occultism that
make me wonder what's in them that Christian extremists don't want
others to read.
I went through this last year while I was taking a class in Children's
Literacy. Julie of the Wolves makes it onto banned book lists because
some parents aren't comfortable with the "mating" sequence for
elementary grade students. Some teachers have been known to read the
book to classes as young as 3rd grade.
Julie of the Wolves is "Banned" in the same way that PG-13 movies are. I
have never heard that it wasn't considered acceptable for a middle
school audience.
Glenn Arnold
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| User: "George Washington Hayduke" |
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| Title: Re: Confusion over the word "Banned" was Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
31 Oct 2004 11:25:26 AM |
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Glenn Arnold <oldnoah@att.net> wrote:
George Washington Hayduke wrote:
I've been going through the top 100 banned or otherwise attacked
books from the American Library Association's web site and one of the
books I checked out was "Julie of the Wolves" since it is one of the
many on the list that aren't about sex or non-Christian occultism that
make me wonder what's in them that Christian extremists don't want
others to read.
I went through this last year while I was taking a class in Children's
Literacy. Julie of the Wolves makes it onto banned book lists because
some parents aren't comfortable with the "mating" sequence for
elementary grade students. Some teachers have been known to read the
book to classes as young as 3rd grade.
Interesting. That must be it. Even the other animals in the story don't
mate, only Julie's husband mentions it.
+--+
| Hezbollah endorses George W. Bush: http://www.hezbollah.ws/
| http://sf.irk.ru/www/ot3/otiii-gif.html -- Scientology crime syndicate
| "And his daughter drips semen relentlessly." - Molina
+--+
.
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
30 Oct 2004 04:49:39 PM |
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In our last episode <10o8231mdun3167@corp.supernews.com>, George
Washington Hayduke lept out of the bushes shouting:
There _may_ be three things about the book that Christian extremists
might hate about it... No, four:
You may have missed the one I would immediately suspect. Though I haven't
read the book and can't say for sure this is involved, it would be my
prime suspect.
There is a strong undercurrent in the fundie mindset that no other culture
or way of life--particularly native--can *ever* be shown sympathetically.
You *must show it as some awful state of depravity, despair, devil
worshipping, or other such things because it is, after all, "godless." And
somewhere in there, some character has to be "saved" from their awful
people (returning to them, of course, as a "missionary").
Suggest this is racist or bigoted, they'll get *very upset...
(I wonder why)
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Being surprised at the fact that the universe
is fine tuned for life is akin to a puddle being
surprised at how well it fits its hole"
-- Douglas Adams
.
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| User: "George Washington Hayduke" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
31 Oct 2004 10:35:56 AM |
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"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In our last episode <10o8231mdun3167@corp.supernews.com>, George
Washington Hayduke lept out of the bushes shouting:
There _may_ be three things about the book that Christian extremists
might hate about it... No, four:
You may have missed the one I would immediately suspect. Though I haven't
read the book and can't say for sure this is involved, it would be my
prime suspect.
There is a strong undercurrent in the fundie mindset that no other culture
or way of life--particularly native--can *ever* be shown sympathetically.
You *must show it as some awful state of depravity, despair, devil
worshipping, or other such things because it is, after all, "godless." And
somewhere in there, some character has to be "saved" from their awful
people (returning to them, of course, as a "missionary").
Suggest this is racist or bigoted, they'll get *very upset...
(I wonder why)
That may be it, true. Julie is a pen pal with a girl in San Diego and
Julie daydreams about visiting her friend and seeing wall-to-wall carpet,
televisions, cars, and things she's never seen but only heard of though
the letters her pen pal writes.
When the airplane is used to attack and kill the Alpha in the pack, she
sees the westernization -- the Americanization -- of the Eskimo as an evil
thing though it's not specifically stated as such in the book. She equates
Eskimo life with living, American life with killing so maybe that's it.
+--+
| Hezbollah endorses George W. Bush: http://www.hezbollah.ws/
| http://sf.irk.ru/www/ot3/otiii-gif.html -- Scientology crime syndicate
| "And his daughter drips semen relentlessly." - Molina
+--+
.
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
31 Oct 2004 04:36:30 PM |
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In our last episode <10oa4vjeveuhn9b@corp.supernews.com>, George
Washington Hayduke lept out of the bushes shouting:
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In our last episode <10o8231mdun3167@corp.supernews.com>, George
Washington Hayduke lept out of the bushes shouting:
There _may_ be three things about the book that Christian extremists
might hate about it... No, four:
You may have missed the one I would immediately suspect. Though I haven't
read the book and can't say for sure this is involved, it would be my
prime suspect.
There is a strong undercurrent in the fundie mindset that no other
culture or way of life--particularly native--can *ever* be shown
sympathetically. You *must show it as some awful state of depravity,
despair, devil worshipping, or other such things because it is, after
all, "godless." And somewhere in there, some character has to be "saved"
from their awful people (returning to them, of course, as a
"missionary"). Suggest this is racist or bigoted, they'll get *very
upset... (I wonder why)
That may be it, true. Julie is a pen pal with a girl in San Diego and
Julie daydreams about visiting her friend and seeing wall-to-wall carpet,
televisions, cars, and things she's never seen but only heard of though
the letters her pen pal writes.
When the airplane is used to attack and kill the Alpha in the pack, she
sees the westernization -- the Americanization -- of the Eskimo as an evil
thing though it's not specifically stated as such in the book. She
equates Eskimo life with living, American life with killing so maybe
that's it.
I would strongly suspect that is part of it. Maybe even the major part.
Even if they *claim it's something else.
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Being surprised at the fact that the universe
is fine tuned for life is akin to a puddle being
surprised at how well it fits its hole"
-- Douglas Adams
.
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| User: "Glenn Arnold" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
01 Nov 2004 03:41:20 PM |
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Mark K. Bilbo wrote:
In our last episode <10oa4vjeveuhn9b@corp.supernews.com>, George
Washington Hayduke lept out of the bushes shouting:
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In our last episode <10o8231mdun3167@corp.supernews.com>, George
Washington Hayduke lept out of the bushes shouting:
There _may_ be three things about the book that Christian extremists
might hate about it... No, four:
You may have missed the one I would immediately suspect. Though I haven't
read the book and can't say for sure this is involved, it would be my
prime suspect.
There is a strong undercurrent in the fundie mindset that no other
culture or way of life--particularly native--can *ever* be shown
sympathetically. You *must show it as some awful state of depravity,
despair, devil worshipping, or other such things because it is, after
all, "godless." And somewhere in there, some character has to be "saved"
from their awful people (returning to them, of course, as a
"missionary"). Suggest this is racist or bigoted, they'll get *very
upset... (I wonder why)
That may be it, true. Julie is a pen pal with a girl in San Diego and
Julie daydreams about visiting her friend and seeing wall-to-wall carpet,
televisions, cars, and things she's never seen but only heard of though
the letters her pen pal writes.
When the airplane is used to attack and kill the Alpha in the pack, she
sees the westernization -- the Americanization -- of the Eskimo as an evil
thing though it's not specifically stated as such in the book. She
equates Eskimo life with living, American life with killing so maybe
that's it.
I would strongly suspect that is part of it. Maybe even the major part.
Even if they *claim it's something else.
Challenged in Mexico, Mo. (1982) because of the book's "socialist,
communist, evolutionary, and anti-family themes." Challenged in
Littleton, Colo. (1989) school libraries because "the subject matter was
better suited to older students, not sixth graders." Challenged at the
Erie Elementary School in Chandler, Ariz. (1994) because the book
includes a passage that some parents found inappropriate in which a man
forcibly kisses his wife. Challenged in the classrooms and school
libraries in Palmdale, Calif. (1995) because the book describes a rape.
Removed from the sixth-grade curriculum of the New Brighton Area School
District in Pulaski Township, Pa. (1996) because of a graphic marital
rape scene. Challenged at the Hanson Lane Elementary School in Ramona,
Calif. (1996) because the award-winning book includes an attempted rape
of a 13-year-old girl.
Aside from the first one here, these are basically challenges due to the
one scene where Julie's husband (in an arranged marriage) attempts to
"mate with her" because his friends have teased him. The attempt is
unsuccessful, but he does knock her down and climb on top of her.
As I said earlier, most of the challenges that I was aware of were from
parents that felt the subject matter was inappropriate for the age group.
Glenn Arnold
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| User: "George Washington Hayduke" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
01 Nov 2004 10:13:05 PM |
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Glenn Arnold <oldnoah@att.net> wrote:
Challenged in Mexico, Mo. (1982) because of the book's "socialist,
communist, evolutionary, and anti-family themes." Challenged in
Littleton, Colo. (1989) school libraries because "the subject matter was
better suited to older students, not sixth graders." Challenged at the
Erie Elementary School in Chandler, Ariz. (1994) because the book
Hell, where did you find all this?! I'd love to check out some of the
other books that are "challenged" to find out what people had problems
with.
"How to eat fried worms" would be good to look up.
includes a passage that some parents found inappropriate in which a man
forcibly kisses his wife. Challenged in the classrooms and school
libraries in Palmdale, Calif. (1995) because the book describes a rape.
But it doesn't describe a rape. I read the thing and don't see the
ripping of the clothes and such as an attenmpted rape. It would class
as an assault but it didn't even go far enough to merit a demand for
sex since the dullard husband uttered a complaint rather than any
demands.
Maybe I see the sentences through an atheists' eyes.
Removed from the sixth-grade curriculum of the New Brighton Area School
District in Pulaski Township, Pa. (1996) because of a graphic marital
rape scene. Challenged at the Hanson Lane Elementary School in Ramona,
Calif. (1996) because the award-winning book includes an attempted rape
of a 13-year-old girl.
<groan> And it doesn't even describe an _attempted_ rape. Maybe I should
get the book again and type in the sentences.
Aside from the first one here, these are basically challenges due to the
one scene where Julie's husband (in an arranged marriage) attempts to
"mate with her" because his friends have teased him. The attempt is
unsuccessful, but he does knock her down and climb on top of her.
As I said earlier, most of the challenges that I was aware of were from
parents that felt the subject matter was inappropriate for the age group.
Glenn Arnold
Thanks, Glenn.
+--+
| Hezbollah endorses George W. Bush: http://www.hezbollah.ws/
| http://sf.irk.ru/www/ot3/otiii-gif.html -- Scientology crime syndicate
| "And his daughter drips semen relentlessly." - Molina
+--+
.
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| User: "Glenn Arnold" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
02 Nov 2004 06:27:59 PM |
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George Washington Hayduke wrote:
Glenn Arnold <oldnoah@att.net> wrote:
Challenged in Mexico, Mo. (1982) because of the book's "socialist,
communist, evolutionary, and anti-family themes." Challenged in
Littleton, Colo. (1989) school libraries because "the subject matter was
better suited to older students, not sixth graders." Challenged at the
Erie Elementary School in Chandler, Ariz. (1994) because the book
Hell, where did you find all this?! I'd love to check out some of the
other books that are "challenged" to find out what people had problems
with.
"How to eat fried worms" would be good to look up.
How To Eat Fried Worms
AUTHOR: Thomas Rockwell
ISBN: 0440445450
Plot Summary: A kids book about two boys that make a silly bet about
eating 15 worms in 15 days.
Complaints: Inappropriate to age
http://solonor.com/bannedbooks/archives/001816.html
Note: Solonor is sarcastic.
Glenn Arnold
.
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| User: "Robibnikoff" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
02 Nov 2004 06:33:54 PM |
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"Glenn Arnold" <oldnoah@att.net> wrote in message
news:4188260D.1000901@att.net...
George Washington Hayduke wrote:
Glenn Arnold <oldnoah@att.net> wrote:
Challenged in Mexico, Mo. (1982) because of the book's "socialist,
communist, evolutionary, and anti-family themes." Challenged in
Littleton, Colo. (1989) school libraries because "the subject matter was
better suited to older students, not sixth graders." Challenged at the
Erie Elementary School in Chandler, Ariz. (1994) because the book
Hell, where did you find all this?! I'd love to check out some of the
other books that are "challenged" to find out what people had problems
with.
"How to eat fried worms" would be good to look up.
How To Eat Fried Worms
AUTHOR: Thomas Rockwell
ISBN: 0440445450
Plot Summary: A kids book about two boys that make a silly bet about
eating 15 worms in 15 days.
Complaints: Inappropriate to age
http://solonor.com/bannedbooks/archives/001816.html
Note: Solonor is sarcastic.
Glenn Arnold
One thing I'm curious about. If christians have a problem with "Julie of
the Wolves", then explain this:
http://www.christianbook.com/Christian/Books/product/?item_no=21943&p=1010575
Hmmmmmm............
--
__________
Robyn
Resident Witchypoo
#1557
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| User: "Harry F. Leopold" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
03 Nov 2004 06:09:23 AM |
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On Tue, 2 Nov 2004 18:33:54 -0600, Robibnikoff wrote
(in article <2uqnbjF2cde9hU8@uni-berlin.de>):
"Glenn Arnold" <oldnoah@att.net> wrote in message
news:4188260D.1000901@att.net...
George Washington Hayduke wrote:
Glenn Arnold <oldnoah@att.net> wrote:
Challenged in Mexico, Mo. (1982) because of the book's "socialist,
communist, evolutionary, and anti-family themes." Challenged in
Littleton, Colo. (1989) school libraries because "the subject matter was
better suited to older students, not sixth graders." Challenged at the
Erie Elementary School in Chandler, Ariz. (1994) because the book
Hell, where did you find all this?! I'd love to check out some of the
other books that are "challenged" to find out what people had problems
with.
"How to eat fried worms" would be good to look up.
How To Eat Fried Worms
AUTHOR: Thomas Rockwell
ISBN: 0440445450
Plot Summary: A kids book about two boys that make a silly bet about
eating 15 worms in 15 days.
Complaints: Inappropriate to age
http://solonor.com/bannedbooks/archives/001816.html
Note: Solonor is sarcastic.
Glenn Arnold
One thing I'm curious about. If christians have a problem with "Julie of
the Wolves", then explain this:
http://www.christianbook.com/Christian/Books/product/?item_no=21943&p=1010575
Hmmmmmm............
Well obviously they aren't REAL Christians, of course.
--
Harry F. Leopold
aa #2076
AA/Vet #4
The Prints of Darkness
(remove gene to email)
"The space time you are trying to reach has been disconnected..." Stony
.
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| User: "Robibnikoff" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
03 Nov 2004 06:36:09 AM |
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"Harry F. Leopold" <hleopold@coxyx.net> wrote in message
news:0001HW.BDAE269300E54BA3F02845B0@news.central.cox.net...
On Tue, 2 Nov 2004 18:33:54 -0600, Robibnikoff wrote
(in article <2uqnbjF2cde9hU8@uni-berlin.de>):
snip
One thing I'm curious about. If christians have a problem with "Julie of
the Wolves", then explain this:
http://www.christianbook.com/Christian/Books/product/?item_no=21943&p=1010575
Hmmmmmm............
Well obviously they aren't REAL Christians, of course.
Are those bagpipes I hear? :)
--
__________
Robyn
Resident Witchypoo
#1557
.
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| User: "Harry F. Leopold" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
04 Nov 2004 11:00:18 AM |
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On Wed, 3 Nov 2004 06:36:09 -0600, Robibnikoff wrote
(in article <2us1lqF2dllklU9@uni-berlin.de>):
"Harry F. Leopold" <hleopold@coxyx.net> wrote in message
news:0001HW.BDAE269300E54BA3F02845B0@news.central.cox.net...
On Tue, 2 Nov 2004 18:33:54 -0600, Robibnikoff wrote
(in article <2uqnbjF2cde9hU8@uni-berlin.de>):
snip
One thing I'm curious about. If christians have a problem with "Julie of
the Wolves", then explain this:
http://www.christianbook.com/Christian/Books/product/?item_no=21943&p=10105
75
Hmmmmmm............
Well obviously they aren't REAL Christians, of course.
Are those bagpipes I hear? :)
Why, yes, those are bagpipes you hear. Amazing hearing you have my dear
witchypoo.
--
Harry F. Leopold
aa #2076
AA/Vet #4
The Prints of Darkness
(remove gene to email)
³Damn! I never expected to see this place be armpit-deep in wombats. Kinda
cute as long as you don't move or breath. ;-)³
.
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| User: "stoney" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
06 Nov 2004 09:52:29 AM |
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On Thu, 4 Nov 2004 11:00:18 -0600, Harry F. Leopold
<hleopold@coxyx.net> wrote:
On Wed, 3 Nov 2004 06:36:09 -0600, Robibnikoff wrote
(in article <2us1lqF2dllklU9@uni-berlin.de>):
"Harry F. Leopold" <hleopold@coxyx.net> wrote in message
news:0001HW.BDAE269300E54BA3F02845B0@news.central.cox.net...
On Tue, 2 Nov 2004 18:33:54 -0600, Robibnikoff wrote
(in article <2uqnbjF2cde9hU8@uni-berlin.de>):
snip
One thing I'm curious about. If christians have a problem with "Julie of
the Wolves", then explain this:
http://www.christianbook.com/Christian/Books/product/?item_no=21943&p=10105
75
Hmmmmmm............
Well obviously they aren't REAL Christians, of course.
Are those bagpipes I hear? :)
Why, yes, those are bagpipes you hear. Amazing hearing you have my dear
witchypoo.
And they're not playing; "Amazing Grace"....
--
Contempt of Congress meter reading-offscale.
Hello, theocracy with a fundamentalist US Supreme
Court who will ensure church and state are joined
at the hip like clergy and altar boys.
America 1776-Jan 2001 RIP
.
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| User: "Harry F. Leopold" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
07 Nov 2004 03:19:03 PM |
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On Sat, 6 Nov 2004 09:52:29 -0600, stoney wrote
(in article <cpspo0tg34jvhnljs89b66j4gta5fspikf@4ax.com>):
On Thu, 4 Nov 2004 11:00:18 -0600, Harry F. Leopold
<hleopold@coxyx.net> wrote:
On Wed, 3 Nov 2004 06:36:09 -0600, Robibnikoff wrote
(in article <2us1lqF2dllklU9@uni-berlin.de>):
"Harry F. Leopold" <hleopold@coxyx.net> wrote in message
news:0001HW.BDAE269300E54BA3F02845B0@news.central.cox.net...
On Tue, 2 Nov 2004 18:33:54 -0600, Robibnikoff wrote
(in article <2uqnbjF2cde9hU8@uni-berlin.de>):
snip
One thing I'm curious about. If christians have a problem with "Julie of
the Wolves", then explain this:
http://www.christianbook.com/Christian/Books/product/?item_no=21943&p=101
05
75
Hmmmmmm............
Well obviously they aren't REAL Christians, of course.
Are those bagpipes I hear? :)
Why, yes, those are bagpipes you hear. Amazing hearing you have my dear
witchypoo.
And they're not playing; "Amazing Grace"....
Damned right they aren't.
--
Harry F. Leopold
aa #2076
AA/Vet #4
The Prints of Darkness
(remove gene to email)
"God hates figs."
.
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| User: "stoney" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
03 Nov 2004 02:25:03 PM |
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On Tue, 2 Nov 2004 19:33:54 -0500, "Robibnikoff"
<witchypoo@broomstick.com> wrote:
"Glenn Arnold" <oldnoah@att.net> wrote in message
news:4188260D.1000901@att.net...
George Washington Hayduke wrote:
Glenn Arnold <oldnoah@att.net> wrote:
Challenged in Mexico, Mo. (1982) because of the book's "socialist,
communist, evolutionary, and anti-family themes." Challenged in
Littleton, Colo. (1989) school libraries because "the subject matter was
better suited to older students, not sixth graders." Challenged at the
Erie Elementary School in Chandler, Ariz. (1994) because the book
Hell, where did you find all this?! I'd love to check out some of the
other books that are "challenged" to find out what people had problems
with.
"How to eat fried worms" would be good to look up.
How To Eat Fried Worms
AUTHOR: Thomas Rockwell
ISBN: 0440445450
Plot Summary: A kids book about two boys that make a silly bet about
eating 15 worms in 15 days.
Complaints: Inappropriate to age
http://solonor.com/bannedbooks/archives/001816.html
Note: Solonor is sarcastic.
Glenn Arnold
One thing I'm curious about. If christians have a problem with "Julie of
the Wolves", then explain this:
http://www.christianbook.com/Christian/Books/product/?item_no=21943&p=1010575
Hmmmmmm............
Its sectual thing.
--
Contempt of Congress meter reading-offscale.
Vote for Bush. Why vote for the lesser of two evils?
No matter the candidates the superstition industry wins.
'Jesus' is a sock-puppet Christians utilize to add 'authority' to
whatever action they intend on taking. -Stoney
And Duty Imp and Rapscallion
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| User: "Glenn Arnold" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
03 Nov 2004 04:21:32 PM |
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Robibnikoff wrote:
"Glenn Arnold" <oldnoah@att.net> wrote in message
news:4188260D.1000901@att.net...
George Washington Hayduke wrote:
Glenn Arnold <oldnoah@att.net> wrote:
Challenged in Mexico, Mo. (1982) because of the book's "socialist,
communist, evolutionary, and anti-family themes." Challenged in
Littleton, Colo. (1989) school libraries because "the subject matter was
better suited to older students, not sixth graders." Challenged at the
Erie Elementary School in Chandler, Ariz. (1994) because the book
Hell, where did you find all this?! I'd love to check out some of the
other books that are "challenged" to find out what people had problems
with.
"How to eat fried worms" would be good to look up.
How To Eat Fried Worms
AUTHOR: Thomas Rockwell
ISBN: 0440445450
Plot Summary: A kids book about two boys that make a silly bet about
eating 15 worms in 15 days.
Complaints: Inappropriate to age
http://solonor.com/bannedbooks/archives/001816.html
Note: Solonor is sarcastic.
Glenn Arnold
One thing I'm curious about. If christians have a problem with "Julie of
the Wolves", then explain this:
http://www.christianbook.com/Christian/Books/product/?item_no=21943&p=1010575
Hmmmmmm............
Robyn,
I have been trying to clarify this. Just because a book is "banned"
doesn't mean it's a "Christian" thing. Julie of the Wolves is on the
banned book lists because the scene in which her "husband" attempts to
mate with her is often questioned for a particular grade level. The
challenges usually suggest that the book *IS* appropriate for older
students.
As a teacher, I would be a little uncomfortable reading that passage to
third graders, but I have no problem at all asigning it to a sixth grade
class. Some people feel it's too mature even for that. That's just a
matter of comfort level.
The "socialist, communist, evolutionary, and anti-family themes"
challenge comes from clear out of the blue. It's only one challenge out
of many. But the rest of them have to do with age appropriateness, not
Christianity.
Glenn Arnold
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| User: "Glenn Arnold" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
02 Nov 2004 06:16:47 PM |
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George Washington Hayduke wrote:
Glenn Arnold <oldnoah@att.net> wrote:
Challenged in Mexico, Mo. (1982) because of the book's "socialist,
communist, evolutionary, and anti-family themes." Challenged in
Littleton, Colo. (1989) school libraries because "the subject matter was
better suited to older students, not sixth graders." Challenged at the
Erie Elementary School in Chandler, Ariz. (1994) because the book
Hell, where did you find all this?! I'd love to check out some of the
other books that are "challenged" to find out what people had problems
with.
I just did a Google search. As I said before, I had actually gone
through this in a class on teaching elementary school English Language
Arts, so I knew what the major complaint was. What I found before was
that Julie of the wolves had been read to children as low as third
grade, and that parents were uncomfortable with the "mating" scene. I
think it's perfectly appropriate for 6th grade, but you can never tell
what some people will think. The "socialist, communist, evolutionary,
and anti-family themes," has me really wondering though. Where the hell
did that come from?
"How to eat fried worms" would be good to look up.
includes a passage that some parents found inappropriate in which a man
forcibly kisses his wife. Challenged in the classrooms and school
libraries in Palmdale, Calif. (1995) because the book describes a rape.
But it doesn't describe a rape. I read the thing and don't see the
ripping of the clothes and such as an attenmpted rape. It would class
as an assault but it didn't even go far enough to merit a demand for
sex since the dullard husband uttered a complaint rather than any
demands.
Maybe I see the sentences through an atheists' eyes.
Removed from the sixth-grade curriculum of the New Brighton Area School
District in Pulaski Township, Pa. (1996) because of a graphic marital
rape scene. Challenged at the Hanson Lane Elementary School in Ramona,
Calif. (1996) because the award-winning book includes an attempted rape
of a 13-year-old girl.
<groan> And it doesn't even describe an _attempted_ rape. Maybe I should
get the book again and type in the sentences.
I would say attempted rape is a reasonable description. Not because it
was a full scale rape, but simply because it is descriptive of the
attempt to have unwanted sex. I don't agree with the phrase "graphic
marital rape scene."
Glenn Arnold
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| User: "Rev. Karl E. Taylor" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
30 Oct 2004 05:10:15 PM |
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Mark K. Bilbo wrote:
In our last episode <10o8231mdun3167@corp.supernews.com>, George
Washington Hayduke lept out of the bushes shouting:
There _may_ be three things about the book that Christian extremists
might hate about it... No, four:
You may have missed the one I would immediately suspect. Though I haven't
read the book and can't say for sure this is involved, it would be my
prime suspect.
There is a strong undercurrent in the fundie mindset that no other culture
or way of life--particularly native--can *ever* be shown sympathetically.
You *must show it as some awful state of depravity, despair, devil
worshipping, or other such things because it is, after all, "godless." And
somewhere in there, some character has to be "saved" from their awful
people (returning to them, of course, as a "missionary").
Suggest this is racist or bigoted, they'll get *very upset...
(I wonder why)
I think it's even easier then that Mark.
Show a religion, any religion other then the xtian religion in any
positive way in the US, and you are begging for trouble.
Censorship knows no bounds, and is the tool of the theocrat. Silence
all other voices, so your's has no competition, and then hammer the
point home, loud and long.
Of course, the same holds true in Iran, or Saudi Arabia, show any
religion there, other then Islam, in a kind light, and guess what you
get? Of course, they are just a bit more extreme about it right now.
Head lopping and tongue splittings and all that. But our own fundies
are just as wicked in what they do to try and control what you see,
hear, read, and say.
The only difference right now, is the fundies use the courts and
boycotts. But there are some, that would just love to see us practice
the Arab punishments as their own form of censorship. Granted, and
fortunately, there are very few of them, but they are there, none the less.
--
There are none more ignorant and useless,
than they that seek answers on their knees,
with their eyes closed.
____________________________________________________________________
Rev. Karl E. Taylor
A.A #1143 PLONKED by Bob
Apostle of Dr. Lao EAC: Virgin Conversion Unit Director
____________________________________________________________________
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| User: "George Washington Hayduke" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
31 Oct 2004 10:35:58 AM |
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"Rev. Karl E. Taylor" <ktayloraz@getnet.net> wrote:
Show a religion, any religion other then the xtian religion in any
positive way in the US, and you are begging for trouble.
Julie works in a "Mission" in one of the small towns after she's forced
to leave Seal Beach and though it doesn't say it's a Christian church,
it's implied. And the man who actually helps Eskimos stop drinking to
excess is a Christian, a positive image, I would expect.
Censorship knows no bounds, and is the tool of the theocrat. Silence
all other voices, so your's has no competition, and then hammer the
point home, loud and long.
It looks to me like the attacks are against a truthful depiction of
life's realities.
+--+
| Hezbollah endorses George W. Bush: http://www.hezbollah.ws/
| http://sf.irk.ru/www/ot3/otiii-gif.html -- Scientology crime syndicate
| "And his daughter drips semen relentlessly." - Molina
+--+
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
30 Oct 2004 06:51:02 PM |
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In our last episode <a3gd52-7mu1.ln1@dhcpdns2.ddsoho.com>, Rev. Karl E.
Taylor lept out of the bushes shouting:
Mark K. Bilbo wrote:
In our last episode <10o8231mdun3167@corp.supernews.com>, George
Washington Hayduke lept out of the bushes shouting:
There _may_ be three things about the book that Christian extremists
might hate about it... No, four:
You may have missed the one I would immediately suspect. Though I
haven't read the book and can't say for sure this is involved, it would
be my prime suspect.
There is a strong undercurrent in the fundie mindset that no other
culture or way of life--particularly native--can *ever* be shown
sympathetically. You *must show it as some awful state of depravity,
despair, devil worshipping, or other such things because it is, after
all, "godless." And somewhere in there, some character has to be "saved"
from their awful people (returning to them, of course, as a
"missionary").
Suggest this is racist or bigoted, they'll get *very upset...
(I wonder why)
I think it's even easier then that Mark.
Show a religion, any religion other then the xtian religion in any
positive way in the US, and you are begging for trouble.
Censorship knows no bounds, and is the tool of the theocrat. Silence all
other voices, so your's has no competition, and then hammer the point
home, loud and long.
Of course, the same holds true in Iran, or Saudi Arabia, show any religion
there, other then Islam, in a kind light, and guess what you get? Of
course, they are just a bit more extreme about it right now. Head lopping
and tongue splittings and all that. But our own fundies are just as
wicked in what they do to try and control what you see, hear, read, and
say.
The only difference right now, is the fundies use the courts and boycotts.
But there are some, that would just love to see us practice the Arab
punishments as their own form of censorship. Granted, and fortunately,
there are very few of them, but they are there, none the less.
Yes but the book does not apparently deal with religion. At least not from
the (admittedly brief) description in George's post. You don't have to
deal directly or at all with the subject of religion to arouse the ire of
fundamentalists. *Particularly in any area involving American natives.
Now, I haven't read the book but I'm going on this from the description
offered:
She walks back toward the tundra and, not getting very far, admits to
herself that the Eskimo way of life is no longer. In the end she turns
around and heads back to her father and the westernized white man's life.
I'm betting--even not having read the book--how that's played.
The issue a lot of fundamentalists (not to mention a lot of US Americans
in general) would react to is that any sympathetic portrayal of a native
facing the reality of the genocide raises *very uncomfortable questions.
But particularly for fundamentalists. Despite the rationalizations that
those were "Not Real Christians," somewhere in those reptilian brains,
they know *damn well something very bad happened here, the aftermath is
still going on, and it damn well was perpetrated by Christians.
Suggesting that what was lost may have had value is to suggest they are
the spiritual descendants of people who committed genocide. And that will
not be tolerated. You don't have to go within ten miles of the issue of
religion...
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Being surprised at the fact that the universe
is fine tuned for life is akin to a puddle being
surprised at how well it fits its hole"
-- Douglas Adams
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| User: "George Washington Hayduke" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
31 Oct 2004 10:41:09 AM |
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"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In our last episode <a3gd52-7mu1.ln1@dhcpdns2.ddsoho.com>, Rev. Karl E.
Taylor lept out of the bushes shouting:
The only difference right now, is the fundies use the courts and boycotts.
But there are some, that would just love to see us practice the Arab
punishments as their own form of censorship. Granted, and fortunately,
there are very few of them, but they are there, none the less.
Yes but the book does not apparently deal with religion. At least not from
the (admittedly brief) description in George's post.
I'm Fredric Rice. And you're right: there's no religion whatsoever in the
book aside from the mention of a "Mission" where Julie helps out (without
being paid) and aside from the man who is helping jobless Eskimos with
their drinking problems (which itself is mentioned only once.)
Perhaps some Christians think that the Eskimo way of life is religious
since it's life-centric and opposes the focus upon death like Christianity.
Now, I haven't read the book but I'm going on this from the description
offered:
She walks back toward the tundra and, not getting very far, admits to
herself that the Eskimo way of life is no longer. In the end she turns
around and heads back to her father and the westernized white man's life.
I'm betting--even not having read the book--how that's played.
In the book, the last sentence reads that she "points her feet toward
Kunukan" which is the name of her father who is living a mis of Eskimo and
Westernized life in the town. She is walking toward Western culture and
(since she's walking away from the tundra) walking away with her Eskimo
life.
The author, by the way, also wrote "My Side of the Mountain" which was
attacked in the 1970's, if I'm not mistaken.
The issue a lot of fundamentalists (not to mention a lot of US Americans
in general) would react to is that any sympathetic portrayal of a native
facing the reality of the genocide raises *very uncomfortable questions.
But particularly for fundamentalists. Despite the rationalizations that
those were "Not Real Christians," somewhere in those reptilian brains,
they know *damn well something very bad happened here, the aftermath is
still going on, and it damn well was perpetrated by Christians.
Or if not genocide, what looks to be a _deliberate_ destruction of the
Eskimo way of life. And with Christians, that deliberate destruction
has always started with sending Christian missionaries first.
Suggesting that what was lost may have had value is to suggest they are
the spiritual descendants of people who committed genocide. And that will
not be tolerated. You don't have to go within ten miles of the issue of
religion...
See, I read the thing and didn't see any objectionable stuff. Other
non-Christians are able to pick out likely problems Christians would have
with such stuff.
+--+
| Hezbollah endorses George W. Bush: http://www.hezbollah.ws/
| http://sf.irk.ru/www/ot3/otiii-gif.html -- Scientology crime syndicate
| "And his daughter drips semen relentlessly." - Molina
+--+
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
31 Oct 2004 04:51:31 PM |
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In our last episode <10oa59cstoptred@corp.supernews.com>, George
Washington Hayduke lept out of the bushes shouting:
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In our last episode <a3gd52-7mu1.ln1@dhcpdns2.ddsoho.com>, Rev. Karl E.
Taylor lept out of the bushes shouting:
The only difference right now, is the fundies use the courts and
boycotts.
But there are some, that would just love to see us practice the Arab
punishments as their own form of censorship. Granted, and fortunately,
there are very few of them, but they are there, none the less.
Yes but the book does not apparently deal with religion. At least not
from the (admittedly brief) description in George's post.
I'm Fredric Rice.
<gasp>
Hey, great disguise! <G>
And you're right: there's no religion whatsoever in the
book aside from the mention of a "Mission" where Julie helps out (without
being paid) and aside from the man who is helping jobless Eskimos with
their drinking problems (which itself is mentioned only once.)
Perhaps some Christians think that the Eskimo way of life is religious
since it's life-centric and opposes the focus upon death like
Christianity.
Now, I haven't read the book but I'm going on this from the description
offered:
She walks back toward the tundra and, not getting very far, admits to
herself that the Eskimo way of life is no longer. In the end she turns
around and heads back to her father and the westernized white man's
life.
I'm betting--even not having read the book--how that's played.
In the book, the last sentence reads that she "points her feet toward
Kunukan" which is the name of her father who is living a mis of Eskimo and
Westernized life in the town. She is walking toward Western culture and
(since she's walking away from the tundra) walking away with her Eskimo
life.
And does it engender feelings of loss when you read it? I'm betting it
does.
The author, by the way, also wrote "My Side of the Mountain" which was
attacked in the 1970's, if I'm not mistaken.
The issue a lot of fundamentalists (not to mention a lot of US Americans
in general) would react to is that any sympathetic portrayal of a native
facing the reality of the genocide raises *very uncomfortable questions.
But particularly for fundamentalists. Despite the rationalizations that
those were "Not Real Christians," somewhere in those reptilian brains,
they know *damn well something very bad happened here, the aftermath is
still going on, and it damn well was perpetrated by Christians.
Or if not genocide, what looks to be a _deliberate_ destruction of the
Eskimo way of life. And with Christians, that deliberate destruction has
always started with sending Christian missionaries first.
One thing to keep in mind is that the *actual meaning of genocide is
destruction of a nation. It's more than systematic extermination though
that's one form of genocide.
Here we go:
"genocide: Any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in
whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as
such: killing members of the group; causing serious bodily or mental harm
to members of the group; deliberately inflicting on the group conditions
of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in
part; imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group; and
forcibly transferring children of the group to another group."
(Source: Rome Statute of the International Criminal Court, Art.6.)"
The US, for quite obvious reasons, rejected this definition and, to this
day, stubbornly insists that "genocide" means *only the systematic
extermination of people. We also prefer to shift the meaning away from
national to racial.
What was perpetrated here was genocide. It was the systematic destruction
of nations. The killing (largely) stopped when resistance collapsed but
the *genocide continued. Including such acts as:
"...deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to
bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part; imposing
measures intended to prevent births within the group; and forcibly
transferring children of the group to another group."
As recently as Teddy Roosevelt, it was acceptable to openly state as he
did that the intent was to "break up the tribal masses." It has only been
in fairly recent history that the US in dealings with the nations is no
longer overtly genocidal in intent. At least it is no longer *stated
openly as the goal.
Christians openly participated in genocidal acts. Including "...forcibly
transferring children of the group to another group." I, myself, would
include the destruction of social systems which the Christians worked
*very hard at as bringing about many of the conditions we see today on
reservations which then fits "...deliberately inflicting on the group conditions
of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in
part..."
Suggesting that what was lost may have had value is to suggest they are
the spiritual descendants of people who committed genocide. And that will
not be tolerated. You don't have to go within ten miles of the issue of
religion...
See, I read the thing and didn't see any objectionable stuff. Other
non-Christians are able to pick out likely problems Christians would have
with such stuff.
Well, you also probably don't believe your culture and nation to be
"blessed by god" and innately superior, justifiably displacing all others.
Fundamentalists worship their culture and nation as much or more than this
"god" thing they talk about so much...
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Being surprised at the fact that the universe
is fine tuned for life is akin to a puddle being
surprised at how well it fits its hole"
-- Douglas Adams
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| User: "George Washington Hayduke" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
01 Nov 2004 10:13:04 PM |
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"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In our last episode <10oa59cstoptred@corp.supernews.com>, George
Washington Hayduke lept out of the bushes shouting:
I'm Fredric Rice.
<gasp>
Hey, great disguise! <G>
<heh> Well, George Washington Hayduke is a character in Edward Abbey's
"The Monkey Wrench Gang" and "Hayduke Lives." I picked a name that I felt
a lot of atheists, humanists, environmentalists, free thinkers et al.
would recognize as a literary reference.
In the book, the last sentence reads that she "points her feet toward
Kunukan" which is the name of her father who is living a mis of Eskimo and
Westernized life in the town. She is walking toward Western culture and
(since she's walking away from the tundra) walking away with her Eskimo
life.
And does it engender feelings of loss when you read it? I'm betting it does.
Absolutely. While Julie is living on the tundra, it's a hard scrable
but it's peaceful and fairly healthy. Even in the Eskimo village of the
Seal Camp, day-to-day existence was divided into work, sleep, eat, play,
and much of work consisted of sewing clothes with bone needles for the
tourists.
Or if not genocide, what looks to be a _deliberate_ destruction of the
Eskimo way of life. And with Christians, that deliberate destruction has
always started with sending Christian missionaries first.
One thing to keep in mind is that the *actual meaning of genocide is
destruction of a nation. It's more than systematic extermination though
that's one form of genocide.
Here we go:
"genocide: Any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in
whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as
....cuts...
The US, for quite obvious reasons, rejected this definition and, to this
day, stubbornly insists that "genocide" means *only the systematic
extermination of people. We also prefer to shift the meaning away from
national to racial.
There's also the question of whether the destruction of a people's way
of life is intended and deliberate. When Christianity invades a people
and tries to change the people's gods, that's deliberate.
....cuts...
Yep, excellent summation of the whole thing.
See, I read the book and didn't look at it the way other atheists have.
I recognized the deliberate subplanting of the Eskimo way of life but I
didn't think that would be a reason why the book would be attacked.
There's a couple of sentences that cover Julie's 13-year-old husband
walking in and demanding to mate which doesn't get very far.
+--+
| Hezbollah endorses George W. Bush: http://www.hezbollah.ws/
| http://sf.irk.ru/www/ot3/otiii-gif.html -- Scientology crime syndicate
| "And his daughter drips semen relentlessly." - Molina
+--+
.
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| User: "nJb" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
10 Nov 2004 08:48:29 PM |
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George Washington Hayduke wrote:
<heh> Well, George Washington Hayduke is a character in Edward Abbey's
"The Monkey Wrench Gang" and "Hayduke Lives." I picked a name that I felt
a lot of atheists, humanists, environmentalists, free thinkers et al.
would recognize as a literary reference.
Heyduke lives!
Jack
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| User: "George W. Bush" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
10 Nov 2004 10:04:35 PM |
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nJb <NoNHL@all.com> wrote:
George Washington Hayduke wrote:
<heh> Well, George Washington Hayduke is a character in Edward Abbey's
"The Monkey Wrench Gang" and "Hayduke Lives." I picked a name that I felt
a lot of atheists, humanists, environmentalists, free thinkers et al.
would recognize as a literary reference.
Heyduke lives!
Unfortunately he's dead again. }:-} But I hear that Doc is
going to be making a comeback here shortly.
I'm George W. Bush, and I approve of this message.
.
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| User: "The Last Liberal" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
31 Oct 2004 06:35:03 PM |
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On Sun, 31 Oct 2004 16:41:09 GMT, (George
Washington Hayduke) wrote:
The author, by the way, also wrote "My Side of the Mountain" which was
attacked in the 1970's, if I'm not mistaken.
See also "On the Far Side of the Mountain" by the same author.
--
"Terrorism" isn't the enemy: George W Bush is!
http://lastliberal.org
Voting Republican makes baby Jesus cry!
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| User: "The Last Liberal" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
31 Oct 2004 06:36:54 PM |
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http://www.eduplace.com/tview/tviews/m/mysideofthemountain.html
My Side of the Mountain by Jean Craighead George
Reading Level: 6 Read Aloud Level: 6
Topic(s): adventure, growing up, nature/environment
TeacherView by Katy Smith
Grades taught: K,6
Pratt Elementary School
Pratt, West Virginia USA
The Review
Sam Gribley's great-grandfather owned land somewhere in the Catskill
Mountains. Although no one had lived there for several generations, it
was still in the Gribley family. Tired of living in the hustle and
bustle of New York City, teenage Sam runs away to the Catskills in
search of that land.
For over a year Sam lived alone in the woods. He had a penknife, a
ball of cord, an ax, and $40 when he left home. He also had flint and
steel, a purse for the ashes, and some tinder. He would use these
things as he began his odyssey in the forest. Sam realized that he
must first find shelter and food, which he would begin storing. He
cleared decay from an old tree trunk and made his home there. He found
food in the forest, in roots, berries, nuts, and small game. He became
a conservationist by using only what he needed. As his clothing needed
to be repaired and replaced, he used the skins of the animals he
killed for food. He relied upon his instincts and his ingenuity for
surviving in the Catskills, whether he encountered hunters, faced the
savage weather and temperatures, or needed to care for himself..
During this time he had very little contact with other people. He went
into town infrequently, and he tried to avoid most of the hikers and
sightseers he would encounter in the woods. His closest companion was
a falcon he trained and named Frightful. However, one day he learned
that someone was writing about a wild boy who lived in the Catskills,
based upon an encounter Sam had with a berry picker. As people went
into the woods searching for him, he became more cautious about whom
he met. He decided that he did want to be found, and he gave an
interview to a reporter. Eventually his parents found him, and they
moved to the Catskills.
--
"Terrorism" isn't the enemy: George W Bush is!
http://lastliberal.org
Voting Republican makes baby Jesus cry!
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| User: "B. Kildow" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
01 Nov 2004 08:49:35 AM |
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Mark K. Bilbo wrote:
In our last episode <10o8231mdun3167@corp.supernews.com>, George
Washington Hayduke lept out of the bushes shouting:
There _may_ be three things about the book that Christian extremists
might hate about it... No, four:
You may have missed the one I would immediately suspect. Though I haven't
read the book and can't say for sure this is involved, it would be my
prime suspect.
There is a strong undercurrent in the fundie mindset that no other culture
or way of life--particularly native--can *ever* be shown sympathetically.
You *must show it as some awful state of depravity, despair, devil
worshipping, or other such things because it is, after all, "godless." And
somewhere in there, some character has to be "saved" from their awful
people (returning to them, of course, as a "missionary").
Suggest this is racist or bigoted, they'll get *very upset...
(I wonder why)
I'm still trying to figure out why "Where's Waldo?" is #88 on that list...
BK
AA#1992
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| User: "George Washington Hayduke" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
01 Nov 2004 10:13:07 PM |
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"B. Kildow" <tracker99@spamenot.foxinternet.net> wrote:
I'm still trying to figure out why "Where's Waldo?" is #88 on that list...
You're supposed to be searching for Jesus.
I believe it was attacked because there was once a breast and
a nipple shown in one of the drawings in one of the books.
+--+
| Hezbollah endorses George W. Bush: http://www.hezbollah.ws/
| http://sf.irk.ru/www/ot3/otiii-gif.html -- Scientology crime syndicate
| "And his daughter drips semen relentlessly." - Molina
+--+
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: "Julie of the Wolves" attacked by Christians |
01 Nov 2004 09:13:18 AM |
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In our last episode <41864ba9$1_5@newsfeed.slurp.net>, B. Kildow lept out
of the bushes shouting:
Mark K. Bilbo wrote:
In our last episode <10o8231mdun3167@corp.supernews.com>, George
Washington Hayduke lept out of the bushes shouting:
There _may_ be three things about the book that Christian extremists
might hate about it... No, four:
You may have missed the one I would immediately suspect. Though I
haven't read the book and can't say for sure this is involved, it would
be my prime suspect.
There is a strong undercurrent in the fundie mindset that no other
culture or way of life--particularly native--can *ever* be shown
sympathetically. You *must show it as some awful state of depravity,
despair, devil worshipping, or other such things because it is, after
all, "godless." And somewhere in there, some character has to be "saved"
from their awful people (returning to them, of course, as a
"missionary").
Suggest this is racist or bigoted, they'll get *very upset...
(I wonder why)
I'm still trying to figure out why "Where's Waldo?" is #88 on that list...
They're still mad they couldn't find him?
--
Mark K. Bilbo - a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
Alt-atheism website at: http://www.alt-atheism.org
-----------------------------------------------------------
"Being surprised at the fact that the universe
is fine tuned for life is akin to a puddle being
surprised at how well it fits its hole"
-- Douglas Adams
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