On 28 Sep 2006 22:46:12 GMT, Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote
the following in alt.atheism:

Carl Wilson <carl_w@swbell.net> wrote in
news:5qhoh2le8b91i0v196m1pgi6gttrro2p0h@4ax.com:

On 27 Sep 2006 23:34:47 GMT, Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com>
wrote the following in alt.atheism:

Carl Wilson <carl_w@swbell.net> wrote in
news:o53mh2969gnecgcltj739barktc76n038v@4ax.com:

On 27 Sep 2006 22:28:47 GMT, Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com>
wrote the following in alt.atheism:

"Michelle Malkin" <hypatiab7@comcast.net> wrote in
news:7ZSdnWpK74YyY4fYnZ2dnUVZ_rKdnZ2d@comcast.com:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=70wOzCkWN5g

I think I worship this man. I wonder what kind of
'mysterious' accident BushCo is planning for him.

You people will believe anything.

Like statements that the war in Iraq has made us safer from
terrorism, for example?

http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/i/msnbc/sections/news/060926

_Declassified_NIE

_Key_Judgments.pdf

Did you actually *read* what you just cited, Carl?

Did you?

What part of

"United States-led counter terrorism efforts have seriously damaged
the leadership of al-Qa’ida and disrupted its operations; however,
we judge that al-Qa’ida will continue to pose the greatest threat to
the Homeland and US interests abroad by a single terrorist
organization. We also assess that the global jihadist movement—which
includes al-Qa’ida, affiliated and independent terrorist groups, and
emerging networks and cells—is spreading and adapting to counter
terrorism efforts."

or

"Although we cannot measure the extent of the spread with precision,
a large body of all-source reporting indicates that activists
identifying themselves as jihadists, although a small percentage of
Muslims, are increasing in both number and geographic dispersion.

"If this trend continues, threats to US interests at home and abroad
will become more diverse, leading to increasing attacks worldwide."


or

"We assess that the Iraq jihad is shaping a new generation of
terrorist leaders and operatives; perceived jihadist success there
would inspire more fighters to continue the struggle elsewhere.
The Iraq conflict has become the "cause celebre" for jihadists,
breeding a deep resentment of US involvement in the Muslim world and
cultivating supporters for the global jihadist movement."

Now if you see a section in any part of the released material that
says we are safer, feel free to point it out.

Nice of you to cut off your quotes where you did.

"Greater pluralism and more responsive political systems in Muslim
majority nations would alleviate some of the grievances jihadists
exploit. Over time, such progress, together with sustained,
multifaceted programs targeting the vulnerabilities of the jihadist
movement and continued pressure on al-Qa’ida, could erode support for
the jihadists."

Note the word "could" in the last sentence. In other words Fred, it's
something that *might* happen, not *has* happened.

Notice that " The Iraq conflict HAS (caps mine) become the "cause
celebre" for jihadists, breeding a deep resentment of US involvement
in the Muslim world and cultivating supporters for the global jihadist
movement." contains no such speculation.

"Should jihadists leaving Iraq perceive themselves,
and be perceived, to have failed, we judge fewer fighters will be
inspired to carry on the fight."

Again, notice the word "should". More peculation on what *might*
happen.

--- In other words, Bush has the right ideas, and success in Iraq is
the only way to ensure that we *don't* create another breeding ground
for terrorism in the mideast.

Only a real true believer could take "The Iraq conflict has become the
"cause celebre" for jihadists, breeding a deep resentment of US
involvement in the Muslim world and cultivating supporters for the
global jihadist movement." into "we're winning the war!"

And yes, we can feel safer, because we can now *know* what the threat
is instead of being in the fucking *dark* hoping that it will leave us
alone if we all pretend hard enough.

The only one pretending here is you Fred. Pretending that "The Iraq
conflict has become the "cause celebre" for jihadists, breeding a deep
resentment of US involvement in the Muslim world and cultivating
supporters for the global jihadist movement." really means that "we
are safer".

On 28 Sep 2006 22:46:12 GMT, Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote
the following in alt.atheism:

Carl Wilson <carl_w@swbell.net> wrote in
news:5qhoh2le8b91i0v196m1pgi6gttrro2p0h@4ax.com:

On 27 Sep 2006 23:34:47 GMT, Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote
the following in alt.atheism:

Carl Wilson <carl_w@swbell.net> wrote in
news:o53mh2969gnecgcltj739barktc76n038v@4ax.com:

On 27 Sep 2006 22:28:47 GMT, Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com>
wrote the following in alt.atheism:

"Michelle Malkin" <hypatiab7@comcast.net> wrote in
news:7ZSdnWpK74YyY4fYnZ2dnUVZ_rKdnZ2d@comcast.com:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=70wOzCkWN5g

I think I worship this man. I wonder what kind of
'mysterious' accident BushCo is planning for him.

You people will believe anything.

Like statements that the war in Iraq has made us safer from
terrorism, for example?

http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/i/msnbc/sections/news/060926

_Declassified_NIE

_Key_Judgments.pdf

Did you actually *read* what you just cited, Carl?

Did you?

What part of

"United States-led counter terrorism efforts have seriously damaged
the leadership of al-Qa’ida and disrupted its operations; however, we
judge that al-Qa’ida will continue to pose the greatest threat to the
Homeland and US interests abroad by a single terrorist
organization. We also assess that the global jihadist movement—which
includes al-Qa’ida, affiliated and independent terrorist groups, and
emerging networks and cells—is spreading and adapting to counter
terrorism efforts."

or

"Although we cannot measure the extent of the spread with precision, a
large body of all-source reporting indicates that activists
identifying themselves as jihadists, although a small percentage of
Muslims, are increasing in both number and geographic dispersion.

"If this trend continues, threats to US interests at home and abroad
will become more diverse, leading to increasing attacks worldwide."


or

"We assess that the Iraq jihad is shaping a new generation of
terrorist leaders and operatives; perceived jihadist success there
would inspire more fighters to continue the struggle elsewhere.
The Iraq conflict has become the "cause celebre" for jihadists,
breeding a deep resentment of US involvement in the Muslim world and
cultivating supporters for the global jihadist movement."

Now if you see a section in any part of the released material that
says we are safer, feel free to point it out.

Nice of you to cut off your quotes where you did.

"Greater pluralism and more responsive political systems in Muslim
majority nations would alleviate some of the grievances jihadists
exploit. Over time, such progress, together with sustained, multifaceted
programs targeting the vulnerabilities of the jihadist movement and
continued pressure on al-Qa’ida, could erode support for the jihadists."

Note the word "could" in the last sentence. In other words Fred, it's
something that *might* happen, not *has* happened.

Notice that " The Iraq conflict HAS (caps mine) become the "cause
celebre" for jihadists, breeding a deep resentment of US involvement
in the Muslim world and cultivating supporters for the global jihadist
movement." contains no such speculation.

"Should jihadists leaving Iraq perceive themselves,
and be perceived, to have failed, we judge fewer fighters will be
inspired to carry on the fight."

Again, notice the word "should". More peculation on what *might*
happen.

--- In other words, Bush has the right ideas, and success in Iraq is the
only way to ensure that we *don't* create another breeding ground for
terrorism in the mideast.

Only a real true believer could take "The Iraq conflict has become the
"cause celebre" for jihadists, breeding a deep resentment of US
involvement in the Muslim world and cultivating supporters for the
global jihadist movement." into "we're winning the war!"

And yes, we can feel safer, because we can now *know* what the threat is
instead of being in the fucking *dark* hoping that it will leave us alone
if we all pretend hard enough.

The only one pretending here is you Fred. Pretending that "The Iraq
conflict has become the "cause celebre" for jihadists, breeding a deep
resentment of US involvement in the Muslim world and cultivating
supporters for the global jihadist movement." really means that "we
are safer".

---
aa #1665
aa Veteran #22
"If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise
of fighting a foreign enemy." ~ James Madison

Carl Wilson <carl_w@swbell.net> wrote in
news:35ooh25v0h15gc1d6ka7gnhlaibbbvgp9k@4ax.com:

On 28 Sep 2006 22:47:01 GMT, Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote
the following in alt.atheism:

Carl Wilson <carl_w@swbell.net> wrote in
news:jbioh2d8oc670ofdc3dacmf2o8rsgbjsbk@4ax.com:

On 28 Sep 2006 00:04:02 -0500,

On Wed, 27 Sep 2006 23:40:24 GMT, Carl Wilson <carl_w@swbell.net>
wrote:

On Wed, 27 Sep 2006 18:46:06 -0400, "Michelle Malkin"
<hypatiab7@comcast.net> wrote the following in alt.atheism:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=70wOzCkWN5g

I think I worship this man. I wonder what kind of
'mysterious' accident BushCo is planning for him.

Damn good clip!

Here's an article you might find interesting.

"A little-discussed provision of the legislation President Bush

wants

from Congress would preclude anyone from ever being held

accountable

for possible violations of the law in the treatment of detainees.

No

one could be held liable, criminally or civilly, retroactive to

1997.

"It's sort of like issuing a preemptive pardon to everyone in the
Bush administration, even though no one has yet been charged with

any

crime."


Full article at:
http://desmoinesregister.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?

AID=/20060925/OPINI

ON03/609250306/1035/OPINION

Yup - blatent admission that they are violating the law and want

their

pet congress to give them free reign to do so.

Let the Fascism begin!

You mean it hasn't already?

You haven't been dragged out and shot yet, have you?

People living in 1944 Germany could have said the same thing you just
said Fred. It would have been as much of an non sequitur then as it is
now.

You know anybody who has? I rest my case.