| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"words of truth" |
| Date: |
22 Dec 2005 11:36:08 PM |
| Object: |
Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
Once Upon a Time When America Had Christmas
A Rabbi laments the loss of Christmas.
Rabbi Aryeh Spero
http://www.orthodoxytoday.org/articles5/SperoChristmas.php
It's December 2030, and I'm shopping with my grandson in a mall in
Northern Virginia. We've purchased a gift for a relative.
"Gift wrap?" inquired the clerk.
"Yes, thanks."
"Happy Chanukah, Merry Kwanzaa, or Eid Greetings?"
I frowned. The clerk whispered, "Listen, I think there may still be a
few rolls of Christmas wrap in the back if you want..."
My grandson looked up at me and asked, "Why is the man whispering,
Grandpa?"
The clerk leaned over the counter: "The store's Diversity Regulations
stipulate that we're no longer permitted to offer anything saying
'Christmas.'"
"Grandpa," David asked, "when did the stores stop offering Christmas
paper?"
"I'm not exactly sure," I replied, "but I do remember that already back
in 2005 stores like Kohl's and Target no longer allowed their employees
to say 'Merry Christmas.' Now even schools are forbidden to print the
word 'Christmas' on their calendars in the December 25th box."
"But, Grandpa, the President still lights the National Fern!"
"Yes, David, and it was once the National Christmas Tree. But there
were these very powerful and well-moneyed groups such as the ACLU that
for over 50 years relentlessly tried to remove anything of Christmas
from American public life and social discourse. Then there was this
other group, the ADL, which claimed to be fighting bigotry, but really
appeared to be promoting bigotry against Christians and people with
political views the ADL didn't like. Anyway, by the time 2005 had
arrived, most American people no longer had the conviction and mettle
of the people who founded this nation in the 18th century."
"Why not, Grandpa?"
"Well, believe it or not, they simply were worn down by constantly
being called names like anti-Semite, Islamophobe, racist, or
homophobe."
"You mean, people 50 years ago were so scared that they'd allow their
country to be taken from them rather than be called a name? I thought
sticks and stones will break my bones, but names will never hurt me!"
"Well, there was another factor at work. Back then we called it
'political correctness.' If you spoke out against the ACLU, you were
called 'intolerant.' If you cherished our American freedoms and were
patriotic, you were 'reactionary.' If you were revolted by the
in-your-face perversions of the day, you were 'unsophisticated.' If you
believed in right and wrong, your thinking was 'un-nuanced.'
"Some of the people who stood up against the ACLU," I continued, "were
called Conservatives. In those days, you weren't welcomed in
'progressive' circles if you were a Conservative. You didn't get those
high-paying jobs in the media, Hollywood, or in the University. In
fact, if they knew you were Conservative, you could even lose your job
-- and, if you wanted to keep your job, you had to undergo diversity
training at Sensitivity Sessions and mouth the appropriate platitudes
and apologies, even against your own conscience."
"How did the ACLU control everybody?" David asked.
"You see, they insisted that any references to Christmas and
Christianity were 'offensive' to some people."
"Were the Christians trying to impose their religion on everybody?"
"Heavens, no, David. But when Christians wanted simply to express
themselves as other groups did, they were accused of having a hidden
agenda of 'Christianizing' America. Black 'pride,' Jewish 'pride,'
Islamic and Hispanic 'pride' were considered social goods and
'diversity,' but Christian expression was considered a symptom of
concealed anti-Semitism, racism, Islamophobia, and even American
imperialism!"
"Grandpa, how did you feel when someone wished you Merry Christmas?"
"I felt fine being on the receiving end of good wishes and that
person's desire to include me in his season of joy. Besides, it was the
gracious thing to do. Then along came the Left and they politicized
every harmless and gentle aspect of everyday life, rendering almost
anything any normal person said as somehow 'insensitive' to some person
or group. They took regular daily life which had been sweet and turned
it into a political brawl. They made fair-minded Americans
self-conscious of every word, and relations between people strained and
bitter. They busy-bodied into everything private and personal. And out
of a desire to be considered 'inclusive,' Christians allowed their
Christianity to be rubbed out from the public sphere."
"Just so they could be called 'nice' by a bunch of bullies, Grandpa?"
"Yes, because unbeknownst to our good-willed Christian friends, the
ACLU and its fanatical left-wing collaborators were zealously engaged
in a deliberate plan to expunge Christianity from America, all the
while pretending that their intent was simply to have a more inclusive
America and not offend non-Christians."
"So Grandpa, I guess American Christians were suckers."
"I'm afraid so."
As we walked around, I noticed how quiet and gloomy the store was, and
remembered back to the days when every department, resplendent with
colorful decorations and Christmas music, was almost bursting with
shoppers.
"Grandpa, if the ACLU and ADL were against religion, why did they want
religious symbols for Moslem-Americans and Jewish-Americans and
African-Americans?"
"Well, David, that's the dark little secret that only your Grandpa and
a few others knew. These people weren't anti-religious as much as they
were anti-Christian: anti- the majority religion that made America,
America. They weren't against Allah or African gods. They hated the
Christian God. Many simply despised Christians of Faith, hated them as
people."
"Isn't that hatred, too?"
"Yes, indeed, 100% bigotry. But the bigotries of the Left, and those of
minorities, were called 'tolerance.' Whatever they said, in those days,
was considered the moral high ground, the law. Whomever they supported,
even brutal dictators like Fidel Castro, was considered enlightened."
"So Grandpa, if you knew what the real goals were of the ACLU and ADL,
why didn't you speak up, then?"
"I did, as did others, but so few would listen. If only they could have
realized that failure to act would bring about even greater curtailment
of their rights and complete demolition of our great American
civilization."
"Grandpa, who were the people who made up the ACLU?"
"Well, sadly some of our own wayward brethren who had long ago
abandoned belief in God, the Bible and our own Jewish religion. Having
no religious identity, they basically defined themselves as 'not being
Christian,' so they fought Christmas displays tooth and nail. Many felt
insecure even in their identity as Americans, so they waged war against
the Christianity underlying America."
"Who else belonged to the ACLU?"
"People who were raised Christian but rejected it and were therefore
embarrassed by it. And, of course, the ACLU had its atheists, too. They
despised America's Judeo-Christian ethos."
"Grandpa, we were taught in school that our country was founded on our
Judeo-Christian-Islamic heritage. And that our Founding Fathers were
guided greatly by the principles of the Holy Koran." "Yes, another
victory for liberalism: rewrite history and deny the facts, all in the
name of 'inclusion'."
"Grandpa, where is the ACLU located today?"
"Why, it's right there in Washington, D.C., across from the U.S.
Capitol."
"You mean that big white-marble building where the Supreme Court used
to be? The one with the statues of Mohammed and Ruth Bader Ginsburg?"
"Yes, David. You see, the country decided that since, in effect, the
ACLU and leftist judges determined almost every American law in the
last 50 years, as well as being the final word as to what is
Constitutional, we might as well dispense with the Supreme Court and
locate in that building America's real judicial, legal power: the
ACLU."
We took our packages and walked out of the store and were guided down
the escalator by Spanish and Arabic directions, though, unlike my
grandson, I focused on the smaller English subtitles.
We drove on Route 50 until we came to Falls Mosque, Virginia. I
remembered when the city had been renamed from the original Falls
Church when that section of Virginia was granted the right to no longer
live by American law but, instead, by its own shariah law now that 40%
of the people in that area were Islamic. The ACLU told us that in the
name of multiculturalism, not to do so would offend Islamic
sensibilities and honor.
However, I knew that such a step had been rooted in timidity. We had
become fraidy-cats, enfeebled, because 50 years of liberalism had made
us no longer believe in ourselves, who we were and what we stood for.
That had always been liberalism's goal.
Anyway, the rage among liberals had been to change all these historic
American names, as was being done by their mentors and idols in Eurabia
who guided us as to what was sophisticated. Londonstan, Parisabia, and
Berlindad, all were renamed cities in the greater Caliphate living
under the Religion of Peace.
My grandson interrupted my thoughts: "If the ACLU people hated America
so, why didn't they just leave?"
"Son, they were on a mission. They wanted to reshape America and make
it socialist, with themselves at the helm calling the shots, running
the show. They didn't love America as America, but they knew they would
love it completely when it became socialist. Besides, no one leaves
America. Look at those Hollywood gripers. The money is too good here.
The fame. The ease and the safety. Where else do you become a hero by
bashing your country? Why would they leave, their family is here?"
As we got out of our car near home, we spotted a small building with a
Cross. It was lit up and the distant sounds of a hymn could be heard in
the cold evening air.
"What's happening inside that building?"
"David, that is a church. A church is a place where Christians gather
privately to express their Christianity, now that public expression of
Christianity in America is forbidden."
"Grandpa, how many Christians were there in America back in 2005?"
"Well, I'd say about 260 million. Indeed 85% of the country was then
Christian."
"85%?" David exclaimed, amazed, bewildered.
"Incredible, right? Of course, half the Jews had no problem with
Christmas, and not all atheists were offended by Christmas trees -- but
it turned out that less than 10% of the country's population was able
to control the other 91%."
"And the Americans didn't fight for themselves at all?"
"Well, they had been bullied so long, son, they lost their fiber. The
others were afraid of a newspaper called The New York Times. And the
people themselves decided they had more important things to do than
defend their heritage."
"But, Grandpa, without traditions and heritage, you have nothing,
right? Why did they accept that everybody else's feelings were more
important than their feelings?"
"They had become intimidated by a foolish and destructive wind that ran
across the land. It was a suicidal ideology: liberalism. It taught that
the greatest virtue was national self-criticism. It resulted in people
hating their own great country, America. And thus a handful of
well-positioned, manipulative liberal elitists were able to bring down
an entire powerful country."
I thought back to what distorted times they had been, back in late
2005. While Christians were reviled and seen by liberals as the enemy,
jihadist terrorists were "understood" and their detention raised a cry
in their behalf for "compassion." Social and political energy was
channeled in two directions: overwhelming concern for the highest
degree of humane treatment for Islamic terrorists coupled with an all
out assault against Christians wanting merely to say Merry Christmas.
"You know, David," I continued, "I remember back when I was growing up
in America in the 1950s. The Christians had beautiful Christmas trees
covered with glittering lights lining the avenues in the snow, children
went from house to house singing Christmas carols, people gave presents
to each other wrapped in sparkly wrappings, strangers would extend
unexpected kindnesses and generosities to each other, and walking down
a street on a wintry night one might even come across a gentle nativity
scene that didn't hurt anybody. But that was America then, not now."
Words are only good if they lead to action, I thought. Nothing happens
unless the people venture boldly into public debates and the streets
and face down those who are trying to destroy them and put their
heritage and children in harm's way. Where had the activists been? We
were too fine to get out in the streets, too gentlemanly to call things
the way they were, too preoccupied with appearing 'compassionate' to
stop the leftists and jihadists. Maybe our good-willed friends simply
never realized that some of America's greatest foes were citizens
within our own borders.
I put my arm around my young grandson. "My America is gone now. How
wonderful it was. It was heaven on earth. We could have taken to the
streets. We could have stood together and risen up, one citizen at a
time, defying every challenge in every forum, and fighting for our
freedoms on the front-lines of every village and town."
"So what happened, Grandpa? How did we lose America?"
"I'll tell you: our soldiers on the battlefield overseas were brave,
but we folks at home had no guts."
Rabbi Aryeh Spero, president of Caucus for America, is a pulpit rabbi
and radio talk show host and can be reached at
www.caucusforamerica.com.
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| User: "Dale" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
23 Dec 2005 12:45:41 AM |
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"words of truth" <wordsoftruth@hoshmail.com> wrote in message
news:1135316167.975077.270260@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Once Upon a Time When America Had Christmas
A Rabbi laments the loss of Christmas.
Rabbi Aryeh Spero
So who knew a rabbi could be such a drama queen?
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
23 Dec 2005 03:56:42 AM |
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Never heard of it...
We drove on Route 50 until we came to Falls Mosque, Virginia. I
remembered when the city had been renamed from the original Falls
Church when that section of Virginia was granted the right to no longer
live by American law but, instead, by its own shariah law now that 40%
of the people in that area were Islamic. The ACLU told us that in the
name of multiculturalism, not to do so would offend Islamic
sensibilities and honor.
.
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
23 Dec 2005 01:18:04 AM |
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Please be honest and stop masking the truth in this terrible nonsense.
No one's stopping anyone from having Christmas, saying Merry Christmas,
or anything of the sort. The "red" media has gotten all you people in
such a stupid uproar over nothing. First of all it is our Government's
*Constitutional Responsibility* to be religiously neutral. People like
the ACLU fight to ensure this for right to everyone! Secondly,
commercial busniess obviously want to cater to the broadest number of
clients as possible and not leave anyone out, so of course they say
Happy Holidays rather than something more specific.
Maybe you all should stop being so selfish. When you tell someone Happy
__fill_in_the_blank__ aren't you doing it for them? So if you know
their Jewish shouldn't you say Happy Hanukkah for their sake --not your
own sake! So when you don't know what they are dosen't it make sense to
be *nice* and use the neutral phrase Happy Holidays?
I think you all have forgotten who Christmas is all about.
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| User: "Toby" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
23 Dec 2005 02:03:02 AM |
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<transfire@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1135322284.791697.39240@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Please be honest and stop masking the truth in this terrible nonsense.
No one's stopping anyone from having Christmas, saying Merry Christmas,
or anything of the sort. The "red" media has gotten all you people in
such a stupid uproar over nothing. First of all it is our Government's
*Constitutional Responsibility* to be religiously neutral. People like
the ACLU fight to ensure this for right to everyone! Secondly,
commercial busniess obviously want to cater to the broadest number of
clients as possible and not leave anyone out, so of course they say
Happy Holidays rather than something more specific.
Maybe you all should stop being so selfish. When you tell someone Happy
__fill_in_the_blank__ aren't you doing it for them? So if you know
their Jewish shouldn't you say Happy Hanukkah for their sake --not your
own sake! So when you don't know what they are dosen't it make sense to
be *nice* and use the neutral phrase Happy Holidays?
I think you all have forgotten who Christmas is all about.
I agree with you, but why waste your energy replying to this troll?
Toby
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| User: "wbarwell" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
23 Dec 2005 08:58:23 AM |
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Toby wrote:
<transfire@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1135322284.791697.39240@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Please be honest and stop masking the truth in this terrible
nonsense. No one's stopping anyone from having Christmas, saying
Merry Christmas, or anything of the sort. The "red" media has
gotten all you people in such a stupid uproar over nothing. First
of all it is our Government's *Constitutional Responsibility* to be
religiously neutral. People like the ACLU fight to ensure this for
right to everyone! Secondly, commercial busniess obviously want to
cater to the broadest number of clients as possible and not leave
anyone out, so of course they say Happy Holidays rather than
something more specific.
Maybe you all should stop being so selfish. When you tell someone
Happy __fill_in_the_blank__ aren't you doing it for them? So if you
know their Jewish shouldn't you say Happy Hanukkah for their sake
--not your own sake! So when you don't know what they are dosen't
it make sense to be *nice* and use the neutral phrase Happy
Holidays?
I think you all have forgotten who Christmas is all about.
I agree with you, but why waste your energy replying to this troll?
December 25th was about the Soltice Season and Saturnalia, Mithra and
other religions.
The Romam Emperor Aurelian combined them all into one big week long
Holiday. Later the damned christians stole that holiday, and later
outlawed all other religions.
So happy damned Saturnalia!
"The festival of the Kalends is celebrated everywhere as far as the
limits of the Roman Empire extend... The impulse to spend seizes
everyone.... People are not only generous towards themselves, but
also towards their fellow-men. A stream of presents pours itself out
on all sides.... The Kalends festival banishes all that is connected
with toil, and allows men to give themselves up to undisturbed
enjoyment. From the minds of young people it removes two kinds of
dread: the dread of the schoolmaster and the dread of the stern
pedagogue.... Another great quality of the festival is that it
teaches men not to hold too fast to their money, but to part with it
and let it pass into other hands."--Libanius
--
Wassail, Happy Holidays, Merry Solstice, Happy
Saturnalia, mull the wine and pass the eggnog.
Cheerful Charlie
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| User: "Lörd Phÿltêr" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
23 Dec 2005 10:00:06 PM |
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wbarwell <wbarwell@mylinuxisp.com> astounded us with: news:11qo429m2q5f1c0
@corp.supernews.com:
Toby wrote:
<transfire@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1135322284.791697.39240@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Please be honest and stop masking the truth in this terrible
nonsense. No one's stopping anyone from having Christmas, saying
Merry Christmas, or anything of the sort. The "red" media has
gotten all you people in such a stupid uproar over nothing. First
of all it is our Government's *Constitutional Responsibility* to be
religiously neutral. People like the ACLU fight to ensure this for
right to everyone! Secondly, commercial busniess obviously want to
cater to the broadest number of clients as possible and not leave
anyone out, so of course they say Happy Holidays rather than
something more specific.
Maybe you all should stop being so selfish. When you tell someone
Happy __fill_in_the_blank__ aren't you doing it for them? So if you
know their Jewish shouldn't you say Happy Hanukkah for their sake
--not your own sake! So when you don't know what they are dosen't
it make sense to be *nice* and use the neutral phrase Happy
Holidays?
I think you all have forgotten who Christmas is all about.
I agree with you, but why waste your energy replying to this troll?
December 25th was about the Soltice Season and Saturnalia, Mithra and
other religions.
The Romam Emperor Aurelian combined them all into one big week long
Holiday. Later the damned christians stole that holiday, and later
outlawed all other religions.
So happy damned Saturnalia!
Now William, let's not let the facts get in the way of the pissing &
moaning of a poor martyred christian!!
--
Lörd Phÿltêr
Alt.Atheism #1938
Denizen of Darkness #44 & AFJC Antipodean Attaché
http://www.jesusneverexisted.com
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| User: "wbarwell" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
24 Dec 2005 04:34:25 PM |
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Lörd Phÿltêr wrote:
wbarwell <wbarwell@mylinuxisp.com> astounded us with:
news:11qo429m2q5f1c0 @corp.supernews.com:
Toby wrote:
<transfire@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1135322284.791697.39240@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Please be honest and stop masking the truth in this terrible
nonsense. No one's stopping anyone from having Christmas, saying
Merry Christmas, or anything of the sort. The "red" media has
gotten all you people in such a stupid uproar over nothing. First
of all it is our Government's *Constitutional Responsibility* to
be religiously neutral. People like the ACLU fight to ensure this
for right to everyone! Secondly, commercial busniess obviously
want to cater to the broadest number of clients as possible and
not leave anyone out, so of course they say Happy Holidays rather
than something more specific.
Maybe you all should stop being so selfish. When you tell someone
Happy __fill_in_the_blank__ aren't you doing it for them? So if
you know their Jewish shouldn't you say Happy Hanukkah for their
sake --not your own sake! So when you don't know what they are
dosen't it make sense to be *nice* and use the neutral phrase
Happy Holidays?
I think you all have forgotten who Christmas is all about.
I agree with you, but why waste your energy replying to this
troll?
December 25th was about the Soltice Season and Saturnalia, Mithra
and other religions.
The Romam Emperor Aurelian combined them all into one big week long
Holiday. Later the damned christians stole that holiday, and later
outlawed all other religions.
So happy damned Saturnalia!
Now William, let's not let the facts get in the way of the pissing &
moaning of a poor martyred christian!!
The funny thing is, here in Early America, the damned xians tried to
ban Christmas all together! So it got picked up, brushed off,
and became a commercial holiday with Santa and elves and toys
thanks to the fact that the religious fools hated the holiday.
Only after Prince Albert, consort of Queen Victoria had
a German style Christmas tree did Christmas as we know it take off.
And these whiny, moaning pissbuckets have been trying ever since Santa
Claus became a hit to convince us it was Christian
and religous all along. No, Happy Holidays! Real Christians go
to church and endure a dour and long sermons, no pagan trees or
greenery, no candy no toys.
Its the Puritan way.
--
Wassail, Happy Holidays, Merry Solstice, Happy
Saturnalia, mull the wine and pass the eggnog.
Cheerful Charlie
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| User: "Robert J. Kolker" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
23 Dec 2005 09:16:34 AM |
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wbarwell wrote:
December 25th was about the Soltice Season and Saturnalia, Mithra and
other religions.
The Romam Emperor Aurelian combined them all into one big week long
Holiday. Later the damned christians stole that holiday, and later
outlawed all other religions.
Jesus (if he existed) was born in August. He was also born in the year 7
b.c.e. assuming that the "star of Bethlemham" was a convergence of the
major planets.
The point of the solstice is to make the beginning of longer days. For
unto us a Sun is born.
So happy damned Saturnalia!
And a swinging solstice to you, too.
Bob Kolker
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| User: "wbarwell" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
23 Dec 2005 12:10:29 PM |
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Robert J. Kolker wrote:
wbarwell wrote:
December 25th was about the Soltice Season and Saturnalia, Mithra
and other religions.
The Romam Emperor Aurelian combined them all into one big week long
Holiday. Later the damned christians stole that holiday, and later
outlawed all other religions.
Jesus (if he existed) was born in August. He was also born in the
year 7 b.c.e. assuming that the "star of Bethlemham" was a
convergence of the major planets.
There was no star of Bethlehem, it was a rank tall tale
made up by Luke. Matthew and Luke uterly contradict each
other on the infant narrative tall tales.
Since nobody remembered anything about Jesus, they filled
in that blank by making it all up. Both made up different
tall tales which most people for 1900 years are too stupid
to have noticed.
The point of the solstice is to make the beginning of longer days.
For unto us a Sun is born.
So happy damned Saturnalia!
And a swinging solstice to you, too.
Bob Kolker
--
Wassail, Happy Holidays, Merry Solstice, Happy
Saturnalia, mull the wine and pass the eggnog.
Cheerful Charlie
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
23 Dec 2005 03:40:34 PM |
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wbarwell wrote:
December 25th was about the Soltice Season and Saturnalia, Mithra and
other religions.
The Romam Emperor Aurelian combined them all into one big week long
Holiday. Later the damned christians stole that holiday, and later
outlawed all other religions.
Hearsay is a bad guide to facts. There is little or no evidence in the
historical record to support any of this.
All the best,
Roger Pearse
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| User: "wbarwell" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
24 Dec 2005 05:06:57 PM |
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wrote:
wbarwell wrote:
December 25th was about the Soltice Season and Saturnalia, Mithra
and other religions.
The Romam Emperor Aurelian combined them all into one big week long
Holiday. Later the damned christians stole that holiday, and later
outlawed all other religions.
Hearsay is a bad guide to facts. There is little or no evidence in
the historical record to support any of this.
All the best,
Roger Pearse
http://www.griffithobs.org/IPS%20Planetarian/IPSChristmasErrors.html
December 25th is an interesting date that has astronomical
connections, but it is not the date of the Saturnalia.
The Saturnalia was originally a harvest festival roughly equivalent to
our American Thanksgiving. It began with a public sacrifice at the
temple of Saturn and was followed by feasting. Although originally a
one-day festival celebrated on December 17 and followed by two days
of general holiday, it grew to eventually encompass seven days
(Augustus limited it to three for the sake of business, but it grew
back to five). It was a popular holiday when gifts were exchanged,
schools closed, and slaves were given special considerations. At no
time, however, did the holiday extend to include the 25th.
December 25th became a major holiday in the Roman world in 275 A.D.
when Emperor Aurelian proclaimed the date as "Dies Natali Invictus"
or "Dies Natalis Solis Invicti" -- the Birthdy of the Unconquerable
Sun -- and with the followers of Mithra dedicated a temple to the sun
in Roman's Campus Martius. Christmas originated at a time when the
sun cult was particularly strong in Rome, and traces many of its
customs to sun worship.
The earliest Christians had no reason to keep a low profile on the
25th because it was not until Aurelian that meaningful celebrations
took place on that date When Christmas began to be celebrated in the
4th century Christianity was legal and there was no reason to hide.
Avoiding the Saturnalia would have been comparable to a modern
religious sect avoiding Thanksgiving. When Christianity finally
became the dominant religion in the empire, older pagan holidays and
ancient customs were given new meanings. An obvious example is Easter
which is celebrated with rabbits and eggs--springtime symbols of
fertility. Early church fathers found it impossible to stamp out
popular pagan practices and compromised by Christianizing them.
Mexico provides interesting examples of how the native Indian
festivals acquired a thin veneer of Catholicism. Christmas is
celebrated at the time it is to give Christian meaning to previously
existing pagan celebrations.
The exact date is important astronomically. December 25th is the date
of the winter solstice in the Julian calendar (January 6th is the
date of the solstice in the Egyptian calendar, still a day of
celebration in many countries). The Julian calendar lost one day in
128 years, and Christmas had slipped to December 22nd by the time of
the Council of Nicae in 325 A.D. By 1582 it had slipped to December
12th. When Pope Gregory reformed the calendar he restored the date of
the solstice to the time of the Council of Nicae, the first great
Christian gathering, rather than to the time of the birth of Christ
or to the time of the founding of the Julian calendar. That is why
the holiday remains on the 25th-the day of the sun's rebirth as
proclaimed by Aurelain-although the solstice now falls on the 22nd.
In our annual Christmas show at the Griffith Observatory we like to
explore the astronomical and preChristian origins of many modern
Christmas customs.
http://www.mideastweb.org/jesusbirthdate.htm
Mithras - The Persian god of light Mithras, whose birthday was
celebrated at the solstice, became popular in the Roman empire after
the fall of the Republic. Some assert that many Christian traditions
can be traced to Mithras.
As Christian numbers increased and their customs prevailed, their
celebrations took on a Christian content. But the early church
actually did not celebrate the birth of Christ in December until
Telesphorus, Bishop of Rome from 125 to 136 AD, declared that Church
services should be held during this time to celebrate "The Nativity
of our Lord and Savior." However, nobody was quite sure in which
month Christ was born. Nativity was often held in September, which
was during the Jewish Rosh Hashanah (New Year). In the year 274 AD,
the Roman emperor Aurelian proclaimed December 25 as "Natalis Solis
Invicti," the festival of the birth of the invincible sun. In 320 AD,
Pope Julius I specified the 25th of December as the official date of
the birth of Jesus Christ.
In 325 AD, Constantine the Great, the first Christian Roman emperor,
decreed that the birth would be celebrated on 25 December. He also
introduced Sunday as a holy day in a new 7-day week, and introduced
Easter. In 354 AD, Bishop Liberius of Rome officially ordered his
churches to celebrate the birth of Jesus on 25 December.
--
Wassail, Happy Holidays, Merry Solstice, Happy
Saturnalia, mull the wine and pass the eggnog.
Cheerful Charlie
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
23 Dec 2005 09:05:59 AM |
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Toby wrote:
I agree with you, but why waste your energy replying to this troll?
The "War against Christmas" frenzy is too funny to ignore. I wonder
where these people are and what they do most of the time. How do
they get through life without going on welfare or entering mental
hospitals?
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| User: "Toby" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
23 Dec 2005 05:44:06 PM |
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<jxrodri@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1135350359.819591.129050@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
Toby wrote:
I agree with you, but why waste your energy replying to this troll?
The "War against Christmas" frenzy is too funny to ignore. I wonder
where these people are and what they do most of the time. How do
they get through life without going on welfare or entering mental
hospitals?
Yes, it's true. Stores boycotted for decorations saying "Happy Holidays"
instead of "Merry Christmas"? It's amazing...
Toby
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| User: "Robert J. Kolker" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
23 Dec 2005 09:17:13 AM |
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wrote:
Toby wrote:
I agree with you, but why waste your energy replying to this troll?
The "War against Christmas" frenzy is too funny to ignore. I wonder
where these people are and what they do most of the time. How do
they get through life without going on welfare or entering mental
hospitals?
Bah! Humbug!
Bob Kolker
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| User: "" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
27 Dec 2005 12:08:35 PM |
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words of truth wrote:
Once Upon a Time When America Had Christmas
A Rabbi laments the loss of Christmas.
Rabbi Aryeh Spero
http://www.orthodoxytoday.org/articles5/SperoChristmas.php
It's December 2030, and I'm shopping with my grandson in a mall in
Northern Virginia. We've purchased a gift for a relative.
"Gift wrap?" inquired the clerk.
"Yes, thanks."
"Happy Chanukah, Merry Kwanzaa, or Eid Greetings?"
I frowned. The clerk whispered, "Listen, I think there may still be a
few rolls of Christmas wrap in the back if you want..."
My grandson looked up at me and asked, "Why is the man whispering,
Grandpa?"
The clerk leaned over the counter: "The store's Diversity Regulations
stipulate that we're no longer permitted to offer anything saying
'Christmas.'"
Diversity is about *inclusion*, not *exclusion*. Banning
Christmas would *reduce* diversity.
"Grandpa," David asked, "when did the stores stop offering Christmas
paper?"
"I'm not exactly sure," I replied, "but I do remember that already back
in 2005 stores like Kohl's and Target no longer allowed their employees
to say 'Merry Christmas.' Now even schools are forbidden to print the
word 'Christmas' on their calendars in the December 25th box."
There is a difference between a generic "Happy Holidays" and
giving specific greeting recognition to all holidays *except*
Christmas. Also, Kohl's and Target are private entities with freedom of
speech. The public schools are a different issue.
"But, Grandpa, the President still lights the National Fern!"
"Yes, David, and it was once the National Christmas Tree. But there
were these very powerful and well-moneyed groups such as the ACLU that
for over 50 years relentlessly tried to remove anything of Christmas
from American public life and social discourse. Then there was this
ACLU tries to remove Christmas (or any other religious holiday of
*any* relgion) from *government-sponsored* activities. I have never
heard of the ACLU trying to restrict non-governmental entities from
freely expressing their religious preferences....
other group, the ADL, which claimed to be fighting bigotry, but really
appeared to be promoting bigotry against Christians and people with
political views the ADL didn't like. Anyway, by the time 2005 had
ADL has nothing against Christians per se. Yes, they are bigoted
against political beliefs which defame Jews, such as denying the
Holocaust happened, as well they should be! This is the *purpose* of
the *Anti-Defamation* League!!!!
arrived, most American people no longer had the conviction and mettle
of the people who founded this nation in the 18th century."
"Why not, Grandpa?"
"Well, believe it or not, they simply were worn down by constantly
being called names like anti-Semite, Islamophobe, racist, or
homophobe."
"You mean, people 50 years ago were so scared that they'd allow their
country to be taken from them rather than be called a name? I thought
sticks and stones will break my bones, but names will never hurt me!"
"Well, there was another factor at work. Back then we called it
'political correctness.' If you spoke out against the ACLU, you were
called 'intolerant.' If you cherished our American freedoms and were
patriotic, you were 'reactionary.' If you were revolted by the
If you cherished freedon, you'd *support* the ACLU!!!!
in-your-face perversions of the day, you were 'unsophisticated.' If you
believed in right and wrong, your thinking was 'un-nuanced.'
America was founded on the idea that people should mind their own
business. Live and let live. So what if some people are "perverted" as
long as it isn't violating your right not to be? People have different
beliefs about what is right and wrong. Except for actions that violate
other people's rights, so-called "wrong" behaviour is really nobody's
business to criticize.
"Some of the people who stood up against the ACLU," I continued, "were
called Conservatives. In those days, you weren't welcomed in
'progressive' circles if you were a Conservative. You didn't get those
high-paying jobs in the media, Hollywood, or in the University. In
fact, if they knew you were Conservative, you could even lose your job
-- and, if you wanted to keep your job, you had to undergo diversity
training at Sensitivity Sessions and mouth the appropriate platitudes
and apologies, even against your own conscience."
Since you Conservatives value entrapeneurship, why not start your
own businesses that welcome your kind? No law against that....
"How did the ACLU control everybody?" David asked.
"You see, they insisted that any references to Christmas and
Christianity were 'offensive' to some people."
References to just about *anything* are offensive to *somebody*.
There is nothing wrong with offending people, even if you are a
Christian. However, the government has no business promoting *or*
interfering with *any* religion. To turn around a phrase the Right
often uses: you don't want *equal* rights, you want *special* rights to
shove Christianity down people's throats.
"Were the Christians trying to impose their religion on everybody?"
"Heavens, no, David. But when Christians wanted simply to express
When they want to use the government to make things illegal
because they consider them a sin (abortion is the biggest example),
that is imposing their religion on everybody.
themselves as other groups did, they were accused of having a hidden
agenda of 'Christianizing' America. Black 'pride,' Jewish 'pride,'
Islamic and Hispanic 'pride' were considered social goods and
I agree with you that group-affiliation "pride" is stupid. The
only thing anyone has any business being proud of is his individual
accomplishments.
'diversity,' but Christian expression was considered a symptom of
concealed anti-Semitism, racism, Islamophobia, and even American
imperialism!"
And *sometimes* it is, usually when it's mixed with politics.
"Grandpa, how did you feel when someone wished you Merry Christmas?"
"I felt fine being on the receiving end of good wishes and that
person's desire to include me in his season of joy. Besides, it was the
gracious thing to do. Then along came the Left and they politicized
every harmless and gentle aspect of everyday life, rendering almost
anything any normal person said as somehow 'insensitive' to some person
or group. They took regular daily life which had been sweet and turned
it into a political brawl. They made fair-minded Americans
self-conscious of every word, and relations between people strained and
bitter. They busy-bodied into everything private and personal. And out
of a desire to be considered 'inclusive,' Christians allowed their
Christianity to be rubbed out from the public sphere."
If by "public" you mean *government-sponsored*, then *no* religion
or even atheist assertions belong there. Government should be
*neutral*.
"Just so they could be called 'nice' by a bunch of bullies, Grandpa?"
"Yes, because unbeknownst to our good-willed Christian friends, the
ACLU and its fanatical left-wing collaborators were zealously engaged
in a deliberate plan to expunge Christianity from America, all the
This is B.S. Seperation of Church and State benefits the Church
as well as the State.
while pretending that their intent was simply to have a more inclusive
America and not offend non-Christians."
"So Grandpa, I guess American Christians were suckers."
"I'm afraid so."
As we walked around, I noticed how quiet and gloomy the store was, and
remembered back to the days when every department, resplendent with
colorful decorations and Christmas music, was almost bursting with
shoppers.
"Grandpa, if the ACLU and ADL were against religion, why did they want
religious symbols for Moslem-Americans and Jewish-Americans and
African-Americans?"
"Well, David, that's the dark little secret that only your Grandpa and
a few others knew. These people weren't anti-religious as much as they
were anti-Christian: anti- the majority religion that made America,
America. They weren't against Allah or African gods. They hated the
Christian God. Many simply despised Christians of Faith, hated them as
people."
"Isn't that hatred, too?"
"Yes, indeed, 100% bigotry. But the bigotries of the Left, and those of
minorities, were called 'tolerance.' Whatever they said, in those days,
was considered the moral high ground, the law. Whomever they supported,
even brutal dictators like Fidel Castro, was considered enlightened."
"So Grandpa, if you knew what the real goals were of the ACLU and ADL,
why didn't you speak up, then?"
"I did, as did others, but so few would listen. If only they could have
realized that failure to act would bring about even greater curtailment
of their rights and complete demolition of our great American
civilization."
"Grandpa, who were the people who made up the ACLU?"
"Well, sadly some of our own wayward brethren who had long ago
abandoned belief in God, the Bible and our own Jewish religion. Having
no religious identity, they basically defined themselves as 'not being
Christian,' so they fought Christmas displays tooth and nail. Many felt
insecure even in their identity as Americans, so they waged war against
the Christianity underlying America."
"Who else belonged to the ACLU?"
"People who were raised Christian but rejected it and were therefore
embarrassed by it. And, of course, the ACLU had its atheists, too. They
despised America's Judeo-Christian ethos."
"Grandpa, we were taught in school that our country was founded on our
Judeo-Christian-Islamic heritage. And that our Founding Fathers were
guided greatly by the principles of the Holy Koran." "Yes, another
victory for liberalism: rewrite history and deny the facts, all in the
name of 'inclusion'."
"Grandpa, where is the ACLU located today?"
"Why, it's right there in Washington, D.C., across from the U.S.
Capitol."
"You mean that big white-marble building where the Supreme Court used
to be? The one with the statues of Mohammed and Ruth Bader Ginsburg?"
"Yes, David. You see, the country decided that since, in effect, the
ACLU and leftist judges determined almost every American law in the
last 50 years, as well as being the final word as to what is
Constitutional, we might as well dispense with the Supreme Court and
locate in that building America's real judicial, legal power: the
ACLU."
We took our packages and walked out of the store and were guided down
the escalator by Spanish and Arabic directions, though, unlike my
grandson, I focused on the smaller English subtitles.
This is descending into pure B.S.
We drove on Route 50 until we came to Falls Mosque, Virginia. I
remembered when the city had been renamed from the original Falls
Church when that section of Virginia was granted the right to no longer
live by American law but, instead, by its own shariah law now that 40%
of the people in that area were Islamic. The ACLU told us that in the
name of multiculturalism, not to do so would offend Islamic
sensibilities and honor.
The ACLU would not tolerate such a thing.
However, I knew that such a step had been rooted in timidity. We had
become fraidy-cats, enfeebled, because 50 years of liberalism had made
us no longer believe in ourselves, who we were and what we stood for.
That had always been liberalism's goal.
I suugest you study the history of liberalism.
Anyway, the rage among liberals had been to change all these historic
American names, as was being done by their mentors and idols in Eurabia
who guided us as to what was sophisticated. Londonstan, Parisabia, and
Berlindad, all were renamed cities in the greater Caliphate living
under the Religion of Peace.
True liberals would not want to live in a society like that.
Radical Islam is even more "illiberal" that Christianity.
My grandson interrupted my thoughts: "If the ACLU people hated America
so, why didn't they just leave?"
"Son, they were on a mission. They wanted to reshape America and make
it socialist, with themselves at the helm calling the shots, running
the show. They didn't love America as America, but they knew they would
love it completely when it became socialist. Besides, no one leaves
Socialism has nothing to do with the kind of dystopia described
here. Have you even read anything by Karl Marx?:
America. Look at those Hollywood gripers. The money is too good here.
The fame. The ease and the safety. Where else do you become a hero by
bashing your country? Why would they leave, their family is here?"
As we got out of our car near home, we spotted a small building with a
Cross. It was lit up and the distant sounds of a hymn could be heard in
the cold evening air.
"What's happening inside that building?"
"David, that is a church. A church is a place where Christians gather
privately to express their Christianity, now that public expression of
Christianity in America is forbidden."
"Grandpa, how many Christians were there in America back in 2005?"
"Well, I'd say about 260 million. Indeed 85% of the country was then
Christian."
"85%?" David exclaimed, amazed, bewildered.
"Incredible, right? Of course, half the Jews had no problem with
Christmas, and not all atheists were offended by Christmas trees -- but
it turned out that less than 10% of the country's population was able
to control the other 91%."
"And the Americans didn't fight for themselves at all?"
"Well, they had been bullied so long, son, they lost their fiber. The
others were afraid of a newspaper called The New York Times. And the
people themselves decided they had more important things to do than
defend their heritage."
"But, Grandpa, without traditions and heritage, you have nothing,
right? Why did they accept that everybody else's feelings were more
important than their feelings?"
"They had become intimidated by a foolish and destructive wind that ran
across the land. It was a suicidal ideology: liberalism. It taught that
the greatest virtue was national self-criticism. It resulted in people
hating their own great country, America. And thus a handful of
well-positioned, manipulative liberal elitists were able to bring down
an entire powerful country."
I thought back to what distorted times they had been, back in late
2005. While Christians were reviled and seen by liberals as the enemy,
jihadist terrorists were "understood" and their detention raised a cry
in their behalf for "compassion." Social and political energy was
channeled in two directions: overwhelming concern for the highest
degree of humane treatment for Islamic terrorists coupled with an all
out assault against Christians wanting merely to say Merry Christmas.
"You know, David," I continued, "I remember back when I was growing up
in America in the 1950s. The Christians had beautiful Christmas trees
covered with glittering lights lining the avenues in the snow, children
went from house to house singing Christmas carols, people gave presents
to each other wrapped in sparkly wrappings, strangers would extend
unexpected kindnesses and generosities to each other, and walking down
a street on a wintry night one might even come across a gentle nativity
scene that didn't hurt anybody. But that was America then, not now."
Words are only good if they lead to action, I thought. Nothing happens
unless the people venture boldly into public debates and the streets
and face down those who are trying to destroy them and put their
heritage and children in harm's way. Where had the activists been? We
were too fine to get out in the streets, too gentlemanly to call things
the way they were, too preoccupied with appearing 'compassionate' to
stop the leftists and jihadists. Maybe our good-willed friends simply
never realized that some of America's greatest foes were citizens
within our own borders.
I put my arm around my young grandson. "My America is gone now. How
wonderful it was. It was heaven on earth. We could have taken to the
streets. We could have stood together and risen up, one citizen at a
time, defying every challenge in every forum, and fighting for our
freedoms on the front-lines of every village and town."
"So what happened, Grandpa? How did we lose America?"
"I'll tell you: our soldiers on the battlefield overseas were brave,
but we folks at home had no guts."
Rabbi Aryeh Spero, president of Caucus for America, is a pulpit rabbi
and radio talk show host and can be reached at
www.caucusforamerica.com.
This is totally stupid.
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
27 Dec 2005 02:12:19 PM |
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In <1135706915.887365.12150@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
personal@eunuchatanorgy.com wrote:
words of truth wrote:
Once Upon a Time When America Had Christmas
A Rabbi laments the loss of Christmas.
Rabbi Aryeh Spero
http://www.orthodoxytoday.org/articles5/SperoChristmas.php
<snip>
Rabbi Aryeh Spero, president of Caucus for America, is a pulpit rabbi
and radio talk show host and can be reached at www.caucusforamerica.com.
This is totally stupid.
It's worse than stupid. It's demented and malevolent.
But, words of troll is...
--
Mark K. Bilbo
--------------------------------------------------
So much for that "storm of the century" excuse
http://makeashorterlink.com/?A3992495C
NO held hostage by oil corporations,
ANWR demanded as ransom
http://makeashorterlink.com/?J5C92195C
White House balks at spending on US citizens,
needs more billions for Iraq!
http://makeashorterlink.com/?G1D93595C
(Tell me again how much we spent bailing out the S&Ls?)
http://www.nola.com
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| User: "nJb" |
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| Title: Re: Letter From 2030: How America Lost Christmas |
23 Dec 2005 04:09:30 PM |
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words of truth wrote:
More nonsense.
How touching. So Christmas doesn't last for two hundred years in
America. That would make it a fad.
--
Jack
bobo1148atxmissiondotcom
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