| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"J Young" |
| Date: |
22 Mar 2006 01:52:55 PM |
| Object: |
Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
Perhaps the most hidious crime that the LLL ( Looney Liberal Left ) is guilt
of is the labeling of those amongst their ranks who coerce women into
unwanted abortions as "egalitarians". Ladies, these men are not out for your
best interests, they're out for their own. To them you are just chattel
http://www.family.org/cforum/news/a0039896.cfm
Bill would allow 24-hour waiting period for women forced into killing their
preborn children.
With studies indicating as many as four in 10 women are pressured into
abortions by a boyfriend or parent, Michigan is working to become the first
state to address the problem legislatively.
The Coercive Abortion Prevention Act (CAPA), which is being opposed by
Planned Parenthood, would allow a 24-hour waiting period for a woman if it
is determined she was pressured to end her pregnancy. Sen. Michelle McManus,
the sponsor of the bill, said she wants abortion clinics to find out why
women show up at their door.
"The bill makes it illegal to coerce a female into seeking an abortion," she
said. "We grant a woman the right to a civil lawsuit when she's been
coerced, and require abortion providers to screen for potential coercion."
And the bill gives a woman 24 hours to reconsider and seek help if she is
being forced to end her child's life. McManus said abortion clinics will be
required to tell women of their rights before conducting an abortion.
"And once a woman knows what her legal rights are," she told Family News in
Focus, "she has the opportunity to then seek prosecution."
Barbara Listing, president of Right to Life of Michigan, said McManus'
legislation is pro-woman.
"It does give that woman an avenue, a networking, a way she can talk to
someone," she explained. "And if she is in an abusive situation, (she can)
get help to get out of that abusive situation. So that extra 24-hour waiting
period, I think, will be helpful."
Serrin Foster, president of Feminists for Life, said the plan should get the
support of people on both sides of the abortion debate.
"Those who are pro-life and those who say they believe in all choices,
whether we agree with them or not," she said, "should all agree on the fact
that no woman should have an abortion against her will."
--
----------------
" The truth shall set you free "
.
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| User: "DH" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
22 Mar 2006 04:15:51 PM |
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"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote in message
news:e9ednSQbDOCsNrzZ4p2dnA@giganews.com...
Perhaps the most hidious crime that the LLL ( Looney Liberal Left ) is
guilt
of is the labeling of those amongst their ranks who coerce women into
unwanted abortions as "egalitarians". Ladies, these men are not out for
your
best interests, they're out for their own. To them you are just chattel
http://www.family.org/cforum/news/a0039896.cfm
Bill would allow 24-hour waiting period for women forced into killing
their
preborn children.
With studies indicating as many as four in 10 women are pressured into
abortions by a boyfriend or parent, Michigan is working to become the
first
state to address the problem legislatively.
If they're getting pressured into an abortion by a boyfriend, don't you
suppose they were pressured into sex in the first place?
What are you going to do about that?
" The truth shall set you free "
The truth? You can't handle the truth.
So, you deny it.
*** Free account sponsored by SecureIX.com ***
*** Encrypt your Internet usage with a free VPN account from http://www.SecureIX.com ***
.
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| User: "Eris" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
22 Mar 2006 04:53:50 PM |
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On Wed, 22 Mar 2006 16:15:51 -0600, "DH" <dh@stargate.com> wrote:
"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote in message
news:e9ednSQbDOCsNrzZ4p2dnA@giganews.com...
Perhaps the most hidious crime that the LLL ( Looney Liberal Left ) is
guilt
of is the labeling of those amongst their ranks who coerce women into
unwanted abortions as "egalitarians". Ladies, these men are not out for
your
best interests, they're out for their own. To them you are just chattel
http://www.family.org/cforum/news/a0039896.cfm
Bill would allow 24-hour waiting period for women forced into killing
their
preborn children.
With studies indicating as many as four in 10 women are pressured into
abortions by a boyfriend or parent, Michigan is working to become the
first
state to address the problem legislatively.
If they're getting pressured into an abortion by a boyfriend, don't you
suppose they were pressured into sex in the first place?
What are you going to do about that?
" The truth shall set you free "
The truth? You can't handle the truth.
So, you deny it.
He seems to be a juvenile, his writing is very sophomoric.
.
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| User: "John Baker" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
22 Mar 2006 10:21:49 PM |
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On Wed, 22 Mar 2006 17:53:50 -0500, Eris <vithant@nospamgmail.com>
wrote:
On Wed, 22 Mar 2006 16:15:51 -0600, "DH" <dh@stargate.com> wrote:
"J Young" <youngopinions@aol.com> wrote in message
news:e9ednSQbDOCsNrzZ4p2dnA@giganews.com...
Perhaps the most hidious crime that the LLL ( Looney Liberal Left ) is
guilt
of is the labeling of those amongst their ranks who coerce women into
unwanted abortions as "egalitarians". Ladies, these men are not out for
your
best interests, they're out for their own. To them you are just chattel
http://www.family.org/cforum/news/a0039896.cfm
Bill would allow 24-hour waiting period for women forced into killing
their
preborn children.
With studies indicating as many as four in 10 women are pressured into
abortions by a boyfriend or parent, Michigan is working to become the
first
state to address the problem legislatively.
If they're getting pressured into an abortion by a boyfriend, don't you
suppose they were pressured into sex in the first place?
What are you going to do about that?
" The truth shall set you free "
The truth? You can't handle the truth.
So, you deny it.
He seems to be a juvenile, his writing is very sophomoric.
Actually, he's a not very bright 50 year old.
.
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| User: "Don" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
22 Mar 2006 10:41:43 PM |
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So much anger over something so inconsequential. What's the difference
- it's 24 hours it's not like they're banning abortions in Michigan.
This decision may haunt a woman for her entire life if she rushes into
it because of pressure from a boyfriend or parent. 1 day - big deal get
over it.
.
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| User: "Eris" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
23 Mar 2006 12:11:38 PM |
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On 22 Mar 2006 20:41:43 -0800, "Don" <shafferdon@hotmail.com> wrote:
So much anger over something so inconsequential. What's the difference
- it's 24 hours it's not like they're banning abortions in Michigan.
This decision may haunt a woman for her entire life if she rushes into
it because of pressure from a boyfriend or parent. 1 day - big deal get
over it.
It is a big deal, give them an inch and they quickly take a mile.
Either abortion is a woman's privilege or it is not. What do you
yahoo's get out of causing her an inconvenience. Only in the silly
world of fundies is a woman forced to have an abortion a significant
number of times and only in the fundie world does a woman make a
decision to have a foreign object inserted into her vagina on the spur
of the moment. We are sick of your religion, your war, your president
and your mindless answers to complex problems.
Go suck a crucifix.
.
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| User: "Don" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
24 Mar 2006 06:54:20 PM |
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Eris wrote:
On 22 Mar 2006 20:41:43 -0800, "Don" <shafferdon@hotmail.com> wrote:
So much anger over something so inconsequential. What's the difference
- it's 24 hours it's not like they're banning abortions in Michigan.
This decision may haunt a woman for her entire life if she rushes into
it because of pressure from a boyfriend or parent. 1 day - big deal get
over it.
It is a big deal, give them an inch and they quickly take a mile.
Either abortion is a woman's privilege or it is not. What do you
yahoo's get out of causing her an inconvenience. Only in the silly
world of fundies is a woman forced to have an abortion a significant
number of times and only in the fundie world does a woman make a
decision to have a foreign object inserted into her vagina on the spur
of the moment. We are sick of your religion, your war, your president
and your mindless answers to complex problems.
Go suck a crucifix.
Actually your an idiot who offers no good argument to defend your point
of view and i'm a biomedical scientist who does not believe in
organized religion.
I don't know what world you live in but in this world, "the real one"
there are plenty of women who feel pressured by boyfriends and family
members to get an abortion. So they go to the clinic talk to a trained
professional (who is impartial - that means they don't care what the
woman decides one way or another ;) She examines her options and makes
the appointment for the next day. BIG DEAL..... I still don't see the
problem.
Unfortunately aside from some liberal sarcastic babble - you can't give
any real reasons why this is a bad idea. Your an idiot and it's
because of people like you the democrats never had a chance at winning
the election. Here's a tip, if you want a new party next go round -
keep your mouth shut or intelligent democrats will turn into
republicans so they don't have to associate with your kind.
.
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| User: "Eris" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
24 Mar 2006 09:45:33 PM |
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On 24 Mar 2006 16:54:20 -0800, "Don" <shafferdon@hotmail.com> wrote:
Eris wrote:
On 22 Mar 2006 20:41:43 -0800, "Don" <shafferdon@hotmail.com> wrote:
So much anger over something so inconsequential. What's the difference
- it's 24 hours it's not like they're banning abortions in Michigan.
This decision may haunt a woman for her entire life if she rushes into
it because of pressure from a boyfriend or parent. 1 day - big deal get
over it.
It is a big deal, give them an inch and they quickly take a mile.
Either abortion is a woman's privilege or it is not. What do you
yahoo's get out of causing her an inconvenience. Only in the silly
world of fundies is a woman forced to have an abortion a significant
number of times and only in the fundie world does a woman make a
decision to have a foreign object inserted into her vagina on the spur
of the moment. We are sick of your religion, your war, your president
and your mindless answers to complex problems.
Go suck a crucifix.
Actually your an idiot who offers no good argument to defend your point
of view and i'm a biomedical scientist who does not believe in
organized religion.
I don't know what world you live in but in this world, "the real one"
there are plenty of women who feel pressured by boyfriends and family
members to get an abortion. So they go to the clinic talk to a trained
professional (who is impartial - that means they don't care what the
woman decides one way or another ;) She examines her options and makes
the appointment for the next day. BIG DEAL..... I still don't see the
problem.
Unfortunately aside from some liberal sarcastic babble - you can't give
any real reasons why this is a bad idea. Your an idiot and it's
because of people like you the democrats never had a chance at winning
the election. Here's a tip, if you want a new party next go round -
keep your mouth shut or intelligent democrats will turn into
republicans so they don't have to associate with your kind.
Your post defines you and says nothing about me. You have no
statistics or facts to back up your claim that "there are plenty of
women who feel pressured by their boyfriends and family members to get
an abortion" Just more happy ***** from the whiners on the right.
Again I can not see a woman going through surgical insult on a whim.
You just want to ***** on the manger. Read the polls lately on where
intelligent Republicans are going.
You are not in touch with any kind of reality. Same old *****,
different *****.
Hitler was prochoice as are the Iraqi's and the Afghanistans.
.
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| User: "Don" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
25 Mar 2006 01:53:47 PM |
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Your right - I have mostly empirical evidence - talking to women who've
had abortions listening to ones who now regret it. You have to be the
most naive person alive if you don't think women get pressured into
having an abortion and later regret it.
You're also not very bright. As I think i've made it blantantly clear
that i'm pro-choice. So I don't really give a hoot what the Iraqi or
Afghani population feels about abortion. Let me say this again (read
slowly) I don't see any harm in educating women about all their options
and letting them come back in 24 hrs once they've had time to think it
over.
If you weren't such a pig headed liberal you'd see this is not an
attack on abortion but an attempt to help women who are in a tough
spot. No one is taking this option away from them. It's fairly common
practice in medicine, when someone is going to have a medical procedure
they're explained about the risks, alternative options (if any exist)
and potential outcomes. Unless its a life or death situation people
take a few days to think it over and schedule their appointment later.
Please provide me with some good hard evidence why this is a bad idea?
That's all I want. Leave your sarcastic liberal b.s. at the door and
present some evidence that this would be harmful to women........We're
waiting.....
Eris wrote:
On 24 Mar 2006 16:54:20 -0800, "Don" <shafferdon@hotmail.com> wrote:
Eris wrote:
On 22 Mar 2006 20:41:43 -0800, "Don" <shafferdon@hotmail.com> wrote:
So much anger over something so inconsequential. What's the difference
- it's 24 hours it's not like they're banning abortions in Michigan.
This decision may haunt a woman for her entire life if she rushes into
it because of pressure from a boyfriend or parent. 1 day - big deal get
over it.
It is a big deal, give them an inch and they quickly take a mile.
Either abortion is a woman's privilege or it is not. What do you
yahoo's get out of causing her an inconvenience. Only in the silly
world of fundies is a woman forced to have an abortion a significant
number of times and only in the fundie world does a woman make a
decision to have a foreign object inserted into her vagina on the spur
of the moment. We are sick of your religion, your war, your president
and your mindless answers to complex problems.
Go suck a crucifix.
Actually your an idiot who offers no good argument to defend your point
of view and i'm a biomedical scientist who does not believe in
organized religion.
I don't know what world you live in but in this world, "the real one"
there are plenty of women who feel pressured by boyfriends and family
members to get an abortion. So they go to the clinic talk to a trained
professional (who is impartial - that means they don't care what the
woman decides one way or another ;) She examines her options and makes
the appointment for the next day. BIG DEAL..... I still don't see the
problem.
Unfortunately aside from some liberal sarcastic babble - you can't give
any real reasons why this is a bad idea. Your an idiot and it's
because of people like you the democrats never had a chance at winning
the election. Here's a tip, if you want a new party next go round -
keep your mouth shut or intelligent democrats will turn into
republicans so they don't have to associate with your kind.
Your post defines you and says nothing about me. You have no
statistics or facts to back up your claim that "there are plenty of
women who feel pressured by their boyfriends and family members to get
an abortion" Just more happy ***** from the whiners on the right.
Again I can not see a woman going through surgical insult on a whim.
You just want to ***** on the manger. Read the polls lately on where
intelligent Republicans are going.
You are not in touch with any kind of reality. Same old *****,
different *****.
Hitler was prochoice as are the Iraqi's and the Afghanistans.
.
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| User: "Mike Painter" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
25 Mar 2006 02:36:20 PM |
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Don wrote:
Your right - I have mostly empirical evidence - talking to women
who've had abortions listening to ones who now regret it. You have
to be the most naive person alive if you don't think women get
pressured into having an abortion and later regret it.
You're also not very bright. As I think i've made it blantantly clear
that i'm pro-choice. So I don't really give a hoot what the Iraqi or
Afghani population feels about abortion. Let me say this again (read
slowly) I don't see any harm in educating women about all their
options and letting them come back in 24 hrs once they've had time to
think it over.
You have anechdotal evidence and the idea that women don't think or know
about their options far in advance of the decision would seem to only apply
to those who don't know about abortion.
I would also suggest that before saying someone is not very bright you read
what you have written.
"Your right..." is a direction. and "talking to women who've had abortions
listening to ones who now regret it" makes little sense.
If you weren't such a pig headed liberal you'd see this is not an
attack on abortion but an attempt to help women who are in a tough
spot. No one is taking this option away from them. It's fairly
common practice in medicine, when someone is going to have a medical
procedure they're explained about the risks, alternative options (if
any exist) and potential outcomes. Unless its a life or death
situation people take a few days to think it over and schedule their
appointment later.
Which is exactly what happens.
Please provide me with some good hard evidence why this is a bad idea?
That's all I want. Leave your sarcastic liberal b.s. at the door and
present some evidence that this would be harmful to women........We're
waiting.....
It's not a bad idea, it's what is done.
The only bad idea here is your implication that women make arbitrary
decisions without knowing all the options.
.
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| User: "Don" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
25 Mar 2006 07:50:38 PM |
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Let's be careful not to twist my words. I said some woman feel
pressured into abortions by boyfriends and/or parents. Do you deny
that this occurs? "He's going to leave me if I don't get an abortion -
"I can't let my parents find out I got knocked up I need to get an
abortion." Are you saying this type of thing never happens in your
area?
If that's true - I really need to know what they're adding to your
drinking water.
Mike Painter wrote:
Don wrote:
Your right - I have mostly empirical evidence - talking to women
who've had abortions listening to ones who now regret it. You have
to be the most naive person alive if you don't think women get
pressured into having an abortion and later regret it.
You're also not very bright. As I think i've made it blantantly clear
that i'm pro-choice. So I don't really give a hoot what the Iraqi or
Afghani population feels about abortion. Let me say this again (read
slowly) I don't see any harm in educating women about all their
options and letting them come back in 24 hrs once they've had time to
think it over.
You have anechdotal evidence and the idea that women don't think or know
about their options far in advance of the decision would seem to only apply
to those who don't know about abortion.
I would also suggest that before saying someone is not very bright you read
what you have written.
"Your right..." is a direction. and "talking to women who've had abortions
listening to ones who now regret it" makes little sense.
If you weren't such a pig headed liberal you'd see this is not an
attack on abortion but an attempt to help women who are in a tough
spot. No one is taking this option away from them. It's fairly
common practice in medicine, when someone is going to have a medical
procedure they're explained about the risks, alternative options (if
any exist) and potential outcomes. Unless its a life or death
situation people take a few days to think it over and schedule their
appointment later.
Which is exactly what happens.
Please provide me with some good hard evidence why this is a bad idea?
That's all I want. Leave your sarcastic liberal b.s. at the door and
present some evidence that this would be harmful to women........We're
waiting.....
It's not a bad idea, it's what is done.
The only bad idea here is your implication that women make arbitrary
decisions without knowing all the options.
.
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| User: "Eris" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
25 Mar 2006 08:03:28 PM |
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On 25 Mar 2006 17:50:38 -0800, "Don" <shafferdon@hotmail.com> wrote:
Let's be careful not to twist my words. I said some woman feel
pressured into abortions by boyfriends and/or parents. Do you deny
that this occurs? "He's going to leave me if I don't get an abortion -
"I can't let my parents find out I got knocked up I need to get an
abortion." Are you saying this type of thing never happens in your
area?
Why would these women need counseling? How would a physician who is
not trained to scream at people, handle this situation to your
satisfaction? Call in screamers from Operation Rescue?
If that's true - I really need to know what they're adding to your
drinking water.
Mike Painter wrote:
Don wrote:
Your right - I have mostly empirical evidence - talking to women
who've had abortions listening to ones who now regret it. You have
to be the most naive person alive if you don't think women get
pressured into having an abortion and later regret it.
You're also not very bright. As I think i've made it blantantly clear
that i'm pro-choice. So I don't really give a hoot what the Iraqi or
Afghani population feels about abortion. Let me say this again (read
slowly) I don't see any harm in educating women about all their
options and letting them come back in 24 hrs once they've had time to
think it over.
You have anechdotal evidence and the idea that women don't think or know
about their options far in advance of the decision would seem to only apply
to those who don't know about abortion.
I would also suggest that before saying someone is not very bright you read
what you have written.
"Your right..." is a direction. and "talking to women who've had abortions
listening to ones who now regret it" makes little sense.
If you weren't such a pig headed liberal you'd see this is not an
attack on abortion but an attempt to help women who are in a tough
spot. No one is taking this option away from them. It's fairly
common practice in medicine, when someone is going to have a medical
procedure they're explained about the risks, alternative options (if
any exist) and potential outcomes. Unless its a life or death
situation people take a few days to think it over and schedule their
appointment later.
Which is exactly what happens.
Please provide me with some good hard evidence why this is a bad idea?
That's all I want. Leave your sarcastic liberal b.s. at the door and
present some evidence that this would be harmful to women........We're
waiting.....
It's not a bad idea, it's what is done.
The only bad idea here is your implication that women make arbitrary
decisions without knowing all the options.
.
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| User: "Don" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
25 Mar 2006 08:13:53 PM |
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Why would these women need counseling? Well if you found out you were
carrying a child and were considering having an abortion, wouldn't you
want to know what the procedure involved, what the potential side
effects were etc. (of course that kind of counseling already happens)
The new idea is that a women generally gets to see a health
professional alone - without the boyfriend breathing down her neck.
She's now also given information/diagrams as to the stage/development
of her fetus, given prenatal care information and parenting
information. The law is called "informed consent." The woman is also
given legal advice if necessary - ie parents saying they'll have the
child taken away if you decide to have it etc. etc. (Maybe in the
perfect world that you exist in - these types of situations don't come
up but they're not that uncommon in the US)
.
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| User: "--sexkitten--" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
25 Mar 2006 09:45:16 PM |
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Don wrote:
Why would these women need counseling? Well if you found out you were
carrying a child and were considering having an abortion, wouldn't you
want to know what the procedure involved, what the potential side
effects were etc. (of course that kind of counseling already happens)
The new idea is that a women generally gets to see a health
professional alone - without the boyfriend breathing down her neck.
That's not a new idea, and is already in place. Yes, everywhere. ALL
clinics see the woman alone, no matter her age, to ensure that there is
no pressure involved in her decision.
She's now also given information/diagrams as to the stage/development
of her fetus,
Blackmailed, in other words.
given prenatal care information and parenting
information. The law is called "informed consent." The woman is also
given legal advice if necessary - ie parents saying they'll have the
child taken away if you decide to have it etc. etc. (Maybe in the
perfect world that you exist in - these types of situations don't come
up but they're not that uncommon in the US)
--
--sexkitten--
"God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion. The
people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is wrong
will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts they
misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions, it is
lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty...
And what country can preserve its liberties, if it's rulers are not
warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of
resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to
the facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a
century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time,
with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure."
-- Thomas Jefferson, 1787
.
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| User: "Don" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
25 Mar 2006 11:22:07 PM |
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--sexkitten-- wrote:
Don wrote:
Why would these women need counseling? Well if you found out you were
carrying a child and were considering having an abortion, wouldn't you
want to know what the procedure involved, what the potential side
effects were etc. (of course that kind of counseling already happens)
The new idea is that a women generally gets to see a health
professional alone - without the boyfriend breathing down her neck.
That's not a new idea, and is already in place. Yes, everywhere. ALL
clinics see the woman alone, no matter her age, to ensure that there is
no pressure involved in her decision.
She's now also given information/diagrams as to the stage/development
of her fetus,
Blackmailed, in other words.
Blackmailed? I can't get into the crazy liberal mindset to figure out
how this could be construed as black mail....please fill me in.....
Here's a fun thought: How come so many of the "extreme left" are
marching up an down the streets with their signs protesting the brutual
slaying of Americans and Iraqi's during the war and just a few years
earlier these same people were out at the streets protesting the ban on
partial birth abortion (you know the one where they extract the legs of
the fetus, stab a pair of scissors through the skull and aspirate out
the brain..)
Guess i'll never understand the thought processes.
given prenatal care information and parenting
information. The law is called "informed consent." The woman is also
given legal advice if necessary - ie parents saying they'll have the
child taken away if you decide to have it etc. etc. (Maybe in the
perfect world that you exist in - these types of situations don't come
up but they're not that uncommon in the US)
--
--sexkitten--
"God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion. The
people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is wrong
will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts they
misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions, it is
lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty...
And what country can preserve its liberties, if it's rulers are not
warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of
resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to
the facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a
century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time,
with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure."
-- Thomas Jefferson, 1787
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| User: "--sexkitten--" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
25 Mar 2006 11:32:54 PM |
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Don wrote:
--sexkitten-- wrote:
Don wrote:
Why would these women need counseling? Well if you found out you were
carrying a child and were considering having an abortion, wouldn't you
want to know what the procedure involved, what the potential side
effects were etc. (of course that kind of counseling already happens)
The new idea is that a women generally gets to see a health
professional alone - without the boyfriend breathing down her neck.
That's not a new idea, and is already in place. Yes, everywhere. ALL
clinics see the woman alone, no matter her age, to ensure that there is
no pressure involved in her decision.
She's now also given information/diagrams as to the stage/development
of her fetus,
Blackmailed, in other words.
Blackmailed? I can't get into the crazy liberal mindset to figure out
how this could be construed as black mail....please fill me in.....
Yes, you can. It's shoving pictures of cute little babies in front of
her to dissuade her. It's taking the protests from the sidewalk to the
office.
Here's a fun thought: How come so many of the "extreme left" are
marching up an down the streets with their signs protesting the brutual
slaying of Americans and Iraqi's during the war and just a few years
earlier these same people were out at the streets protesting the ban on
partial birth abortion (you know the one where they extract the legs of
the fetus, stab a pair of scissors through the skull and aspirate out
the brain..)
Because we see the big big difference between a dead person and a dead
fetus. I might ask the reverse- why are all the same people crying about
the poor murdered baybeez the same bloodthirsty bastards rooting for the
war?
And being as you're so well-informed, can you tell me why d&x abortions
are performed?
Guess i'll never understand the thought processes.
That's because it requires thought, dear.
--
--sexkitten--
"God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion. The
people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is wrong
will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts they
misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions, it is
lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty...
And what country can preserve its liberties, if it's rulers are not
warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of
resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to
the facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a
century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time,
with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure."
-- Thomas Jefferson, 1787
.
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| User: "Don" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
26 Mar 2006 11:35:02 AM |
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--sexkitten-- wrote:
Don wrote:
--sexkitten-- wrote:
Don wrote:
Why would these women need counseling? Well if you found out you were
carrying a child and were considering having an abortion, wouldn't you
want to know what the procedure involved, what the potential side
effects were etc. (of course that kind of counseling already happens)
The new idea is that a women generally gets to see a health
professional alone - without the boyfriend breathing down her neck.
That's not a new idea, and is already in place. Yes, everywhere. ALL
clinics see the woman alone, no matter her age, to ensure that there is
no pressure involved in her decision.
She's now also given information/diagrams as to the stage/development
of her fetus,
Blackmailed, in other words.
Blackmailed? I can't get into the crazy liberal mindset to figure out
how this could be construed as black mail....please fill me in.....
Yes, you can. It's shoving pictures of cute little babies in front of
her to dissuade her. It's taking the protests from the sidewalk to the
office.
Here's a fun thought: How come so many of the "extreme left" are
marching up an down the streets with their signs protesting the brutual
slaying of Americans and Iraqi's during the war and just a few years
earlier these same people were out at the streets protesting the ban on
partial birth abortion (you know the one where they extract the legs of
the fetus, stab a pair of scissors through the skull and aspirate out
the brain..)
Because we see the big big difference between a dead person and a dead
fetus. I might ask the reverse- why are all the same people crying about
the poor murdered baybeez the same bloodthirsty bastards rooting for the
war?
And being as you're so well-informed, can you tell me why d&x abortions
are performed?
Yes I can and you being so well informed hopefully know the reasons as
well. Likewise you should also know that there is know hard scientific
evidence that this method of removal is "safer" than performing a
Cesarean section.
Guess i'll never understand the thought processes.
That's because it requires thought, dear.
(You're right a twisted convoluted thought process. Don't get me wrong
i am pro-choice - i just don't think the pair of scissors in the back
of a fetuses head at 6 months is appropriate because someone couldn't
make up her mind until then)
--
--sexkitten--
"God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion. The
people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is wrong
will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts they
misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions, it is
lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty...
And what country can preserve its liberties, if it's rulers are not
warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of
resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to
the facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a
century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time,
with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure."
-- Thomas Jefferson, 1787
.
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| User: "Don" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
26 Mar 2006 11:40:01 AM |
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"no"
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| User: "--sexkitten--" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
26 Mar 2006 11:58:02 AM |
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Don wrote:
"no"
To what are you responding?
--
--sexkitten--
"Senator, when you took your oath of office, you placed your hand on the
Bible and swore to uphold the Constitution. You did not place your hand
on the Constitution and swear to uphold the Bible."
-Prof. Jamie Raskin
.
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| User: "Nick J." |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
26 Mar 2006 08:06:53 PM |
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Don wrote:
"no"
**PSSST!** Hey, you! Yeah, you, ***** for brains. Next time you write
a reply, *quote the post you are responding to*. If you don't do this,
then we WON'T KNOW WHAT THE ***** YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT!
Idiot.
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| User: "Don" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
26 Mar 2006 08:19:48 PM |
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Nick J. wrote:
Don wrote:
"no"
**PSSST!** Hey, you! Yeah, you, ***** for brains. Next time you write
a reply, *quote the post you are responding to*. If you don't do this,
then we WON'T KNOW WHAT THE ***** YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT!
Idiot.
Haha...insightful!
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| User: "--sexkitten--" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
26 Mar 2006 11:57:24 AM |
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Don wrote:
--sexkitten-- wrote:
Don wrote:
--sexkitten-- wrote:
Don wrote:
Why would these women need counseling? Well if you found out you were
carrying a child and were considering having an abortion, wouldn't you
want to know what the procedure involved, what the potential side
effects were etc. (of course that kind of counseling already happens)
The new idea is that a women generally gets to see a health
professional alone - without the boyfriend breathing down her neck.
That's not a new idea, and is already in place. Yes, everywhere. ALL
clinics see the woman alone, no matter her age, to ensure that there is
no pressure involved in her decision.
She's now also given information/diagrams as to the stage/development
of her fetus,
Blackmailed, in other words.
Blackmailed? I can't get into the crazy liberal mindset to figure out
how this could be construed as black mail....please fill me in.....
Yes, you can. It's shoving pictures of cute little babies in front of
her to dissuade her. It's taking the protests from the sidewalk to the
office.
Here's a fun thought: How come so many of the "extreme left" are
marching up an down the streets with their signs protesting the brutual
slaying of Americans and Iraqi's during the war and just a few years
earlier these same people were out at the streets protesting the ban on
partial birth abortion (you know the one where they extract the legs of
the fetus, stab a pair of scissors through the skull and aspirate out
the brain..)
Because we see the big big difference between a dead person and a dead
fetus. I might ask the reverse- why are all the same people crying about
the poor murdered baybeez the same bloodthirsty bastards rooting for the
war?
And being as you're so well-informed, can you tell me why d&x abortions
are performed?
Yes I can and you being so well informed hopefully know the reasons as
well.
Then why are you arguing with it?
Likewise you should also know that there is know hard scientific
evidence that this method of removal is "safer" than performing a
Cesarean section.
That would be up to the individual doctor at the particular time, which
is why it's none of our beeswax. Hemophilia and blood thinning
medication come immediately to mind, or any other problems that make
blood loss a potential risk to the woman's health.
Guess i'll never understand the thought processes.
That's because it requires thought, dear.
(You're right a twisted convoluted thought process. Don't get me wrong
i am pro-choice - i just don't think the pair of scissors in the back
of a fetuses head at 6 months is appropriate because someone couldn't
make up her mind until then)
And I thought you said you *knew* why they were performed.
Here's a few of those reasons:
http://www-medlib.med.utah.edu/WebPath/TUTORIAL/PRENATAL/PREN013.html
http://www-medlib.med.utah.edu/WebPath/TUTORIAL/PRENATAL/PREN019.html
http://www-medlib.med.utah.edu/WebPath/TUTORIAL/PRENATAL/PREN014.html
http://www-medlib.med.utah.edu/WebPath/TUTORIAL/PRENATAL/PREN052.html
http://asylumeclectica.com/malady/archives/harlequin.htm
http://www.emedicine.com/derm/topic192.htm
--
--sexkitten--
"God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion. The
people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is wrong
will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts they
misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions, it is
lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty...
And what country can preserve its liberties, if it's rulers are not
warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of
resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to
the facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a
century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time,
with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure."
-- Thomas Jefferson, 1787
.
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| User: "Don" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
26 Mar 2006 12:07:29 PM |
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You're right those are a few of the valid medical reasons why such a
procedure was orignally performed...................Are we assuming
that is the only time this procedure has been performed
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| User: "--sexkitten--" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
26 Mar 2006 03:47:31 PM |
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Don wrote:
You're right those are a few of the valid medical reasons why such a
procedure was orignally performed...................Are we assuming
that is the only time this procedure has been performed
It's none of my business why the procedure is performed. That's between
the woman and the doctor caring for her.
--
--sexkitten--
"Senator, when you took your oath of office, you placed your hand on the
Bible and swore to uphold the Constitution. You did not place your hand
on the Constitution and swear to uphold the Bible."
-Prof. Jamie Raskin
.
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| User: "Mike Painter" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
26 Mar 2006 02:35:32 AM |
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Here's a fun thought: How come so many of the "extreme left" are
marching up an down the streets with their signs protesting the
brutual slaying of Americans and Iraqi's during the war and just a
few years earlier these same people were out at the streets
protesting the ban on partial birth abortion (you know the one where
they extract the legs of the fetus, stab a pair of scissors through
the skull and aspirate out the brain..)
No, actually I don't. The term itself was made up by an anti-abortion non
medical person and the percentages of IDX or D&E is about .17% of all
abortions. This includes the removal of dead fetuses as the result of
miscarriages and is the most probable reason for the action.
Your ignorant discription is precisely the type of comment expected from
people who have no interest in either truth or a woman's rights.
Excuse me. I just reread it " extract the legs of the fetus, stab a pair of
scissors through the skull and aspirate out the brain..) "
It's not ignorant, it's stupid.
.
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| User: "Don" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
26 Mar 2006 11:39:28 AM |
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Mike Painter wrote:
Here's a fun thought: How come so many of the "extreme left" are
marching up an down the streets with their signs protesting the
brutual slaying of Americans and Iraqi's during the war and just a
few years earlier these same people were out at the streets
protesting the ban on partial birth abortion (you know the one where
they extract the legs of the fetus, stab a pair of scissors through
the skull and aspirate out the brain..)
No, actually I don't. The term itself was made up by an anti-abortion non
medical person and the percentages of IDX or D&E is about .17% of all
abortions. This includes the removal of dead fetuses as the result of
miscarriages and is the most probable reason for the action.
Apparently you know little about medicine? I'll give you that IDX is
more of a layman term so let me point you in the right direction. The
medical term is "intrauterine cranial decompression?"
Your ignorant discription is precisely the type of comment expected from
people who have no interest in either truth or a woman's rights.
Excuse me. I just reread it " extract the legs of the fetus, stab a pair of
scissors through the skull and aspirate out the brain..) "
Is that so MIKE? Haha. Well I just gave you the definition of the
procedure. How about you go out, educate yourself on how it is
performed and when you're ready you can come back and apologize for
speaking without having any knowledge of what your talking about.
It's not ignorant, it's stupid.
Who's the ignorant one?
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| User: "Don" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
26 Mar 2006 11:44:34 AM |
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Correction - "intrauterine cranial decompression" is not a traditional
medical term either but you should be able to find what you need if you
search under this term.
.
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| User: "Mike Painter" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
26 Mar 2006 02:39:17 PM |
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Don wrote:
Mike Painter wrote:
Here's a fun thought: How come so many of the "extreme left" are
marching up an down the streets with their signs protesting the
brutual slaying of Americans and Iraqi's during the war and just a
few years earlier these same people were out at the streets
protesting the ban on partial birth abortion (you know the one
where they extract the legs of the fetus, stab a pair of scissors
through the skull and aspirate out the brain..)
No, actually I don't. The term itself was made up by an
anti-abortion non medical person and the percentages of IDX or D&E
is about .17% of all abortions. This includes the removal of dead
fetuses as the result of miscarriages and is the most probable
reason for the action.
Apparently you know little about medicine? I'll give you that IDX is
more of a layman term so let me point you in the right direction. The
medical term is "intrauterine cranial decompression?"
I know about the medicine. I was denying the made up name. IDX and D&E are
medical terms in common use, the laymans term is the one you use.
Your ignorant discription is precisely the type of comment expected
from people who have no interest in either truth or a woman's rights.
Excuse me. I just reread it " extract the legs of the fetus, stab a
pair of scissors through the skull and aspirate out the brain..) "
Is that so MIKE? Haha. Well I just gave you the definition of the
procedure. How about you go out, educate yourself on how it is
performed and when you're ready you can come back and apologize for
speaking without having any knowledge of what your talking about.
Sorry Jack, "your" (sic) wrong. You gave somebody's idea of the procedure,
probably the same people who made up the "partial birth abortion" term.
I'm aware of how the human body is formed and know that the head is at the
opposite end from the feet. "where they extract the legs of the fetus, stab
a pair of scissors through the skull and aspirate out the brain.."
I'm not sure where you got your information but this is at best stupid. It
also contradicts the name you use since this would not be a partial birth,
but a full birth if they "extract the legs".
It's not ignorant, it's stupid.
Who's the ignorant one?
From what you write, it's certainly not you.
Ignorant people can learn.
.
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| User: "Don" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
26 Mar 2006 07:39:26 PM |
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Mike Painter wrote:
Don wrote:
Mike Painter wrote:
Here's a fun thought: How come so many of the "extreme left" are
marching up an down the streets with their signs protesting the
brutual slaying of Americans and Iraqi's during the war and just a
few years earlier these same people were out at the streets
protesting the ban on partial birth abortion (you know the one
where they extract the legs of the fetus, stab a pair of scissors
through the skull and aspirate out the brain..)
No, actually I don't. The term itself was made up by an
anti-abortion non medical person and the percentages of IDX or D&E
is about .17% of all abortions. This includes the removal of dead
fetuses as the result of miscarriages and is the most probable
reason for the action.
Apparently you know little about medicine? I'll give you that IDX is
more of a layman term so let me point you in the right direction. The
medical term is "intrauterine cranial decompression?"
I know about the medicine. I was denying the made up name. IDX and D&E are
medical terms in common use, the laymans term is the one you use.
Your ignorant discription is precisely the type of comment expected
from people who have no interest in either truth or a woman's rights.
Excuse me. I just reread it " extract the legs of the fetus, stab a
pair of scissors through the skull and aspirate out the brain..) "
Is that so MIKE? Haha. Well I just gave you the definition of the
procedure. How about you go out, educate yourself on how it is
performed and when you're ready you can come back and apologize for
speaking without having any knowledge of what your talking about.
Sorry Jack, "your" (sic) wrong. You gave somebody's idea of the procedure,
probably the same people who made up the "partial birth abortion" term.
I'm aware of how the human body is formed and know that the head is at the
opposite end from the feet. "where they extract the legs of the fetus, stab
a pair of scissors through the skull and aspirate out the brain.."
I'm not sure where you got your information but this is at best stupid. It
also contradicts the name you use since this would not be a partial birth,
but a full birth if they "extract the legs".
Geez Mikee, stop posting stuff on here if your not going to educate
yourself first. Did you look up how these procedures are performed?
Let me give you a medical reference for you to read. Please do not post
back here until you've read it.
Really - even your fellow liberals are shaking their heads at you for
talking out of your *****. I would say "sexkitten" shares similar
political views with you, so maybe you would believe her? She seems
relatively intelligent and could probably give you some insight into
how an IDX is performed.
Do us a favor....do some research before typing away. Educate
yourself! Here's the Wikipedia description (quite unbiased I believe).
Read the Intact D&X abortion and please write back!! I'd love to hear
your comments.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intact_dilation_and_extraction
Cheers.
It's not ignorant, it's stupid.
Who's the ignorant one?
From what you write, it's certainly not you.
Ignorant people can learn.
.
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| User: "--sexkitten--" |
|
| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
26 Mar 2006 08:38:22 PM |
|
|
Don wrote:
Mike Painter wrote:
Don wrote:
Mike Painter wrote:
Here's a fun thought: How come so many of the "extreme left" are
marching up an down the streets with their signs protesting the
brutual slaying of Americans and Iraqi's during the war and just a
few years earlier these same people were out at the streets
protesting the ban on partial birth abortion (you know the one
where they extract the legs of the fetus, stab a pair of scissors
through the skull and aspirate out the brain..)
No, actually I don't. The term itself was made up by an
anti-abortion non medical person and the percentages of IDX or D&E
is about .17% of all abortions. This includes the removal of dead
fetuses as the result of miscarriages and is the most probable
reason for the action.
Apparently you know little about medicine? I'll give you that IDX is
more of a layman term so let me point you in the right direction. The
medical term is "intrauterine cranial decompression?"
I know about the medicine. I was denying the made up name. IDX and D&E are
medical terms in common use, the laymans term is the one you use.
Your ignorant discription is precisely the type of comment expected
from people who have no interest in either truth or a woman's rights.
Excuse me. I just reread it " extract the legs of the fetus, stab a
pair of scissors through the skull and aspirate out the brain..) "
Is that so MIKE? Haha. Well I just gave you the definition of the
procedure. How about you go out, educate yourself on how it is
performed and when you're ready you can come back and apologize for
speaking without having any knowledge of what your talking about.
Sorry Jack, "your" (sic) wrong. You gave somebody's idea of the procedure,
probably the same people who made up the "partial birth abortion" term.
I'm aware of how the human body is formed and know that the head is at the
opposite end from the feet. "where they extract the legs of the fetus, stab
a pair of scissors through the skull and aspirate out the brain.."
I'm not sure where you got your information but this is at best stupid. It
also contradicts the name you use since this would not be a partial birth,
but a full birth if they "extract the legs".
Geez Mikee, stop posting stuff on here if your not going to educate
yourself first. Did you look up how these procedures are performed?
Let me give you a medical reference for you to read. Please do not post
back here until you've read it.
Really - even your fellow liberals are shaking their heads at you for
talking out of your *****. I would say "sexkitten" shares similar
political views with you, so maybe you would believe her? She seems
relatively intelligent and could probably give you some insight into
how an IDX is performed.
Mmmmm... I sense a prior hostility between you two... no particular
reason, just this feeling I have. :))
I also sense a misunderstanding. You are more or less right if somewhat
histrionic ("stab a pair of scissors through the brain"??!!). From
emedicine:
"Dilatation and extraction
* This procedure is accomplished by cervical preparation similar to
cases of dilatation and evacuation, but the fetus is removed in a mostly
intact condition. The fetal head is made of cartilage and is able to be
collapsed after the contents are evacuated so that it may pass through
the cervix.
* Very few providers perform the procedure. It is usually reserved for
cases of maternal medical complications or fetal abnormalities.
* With an intact fetus, the family may hold their baby and have time to
say good-bye as part of the grieving process. Reconstituting the fetal
head with a jellied substance can restore fetal anatomy.
* The procedure has also been referred to as intact dilatation and
extraction and has been called partial-birth abortion by abortion
opponents."
The skull, such as it is at that stage, is collapsed to make it easier
to remove through the cervix with minimal damage to the woman- vital in
cases such as encephalitis where the head is abnormally large.
A better description:
http://www.healthatoz.com/healthatoz/Atoz/ency/abortion_partial_birth.jsp
--
--sexkitten--
"God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion. The
people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is wrong
will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts they
misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions, it is
lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty...
And what country can preserve its liberties, if it's rulers are not
warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of
resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to
the facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a
century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time,
with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure."
-- Thomas Jefferson, 1787
Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
----------------------------------------------------------
** SPEED ** RETENTION ** COMPLETION ** ANONYMITY **
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| User: "Don" |
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| Title: Re: Michigan Seeks to Stop Coercive Abortions |
26 Mar 2006 07:43:28 PM |
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Here's one more just in case you think there is a conspiracy at hand
and Wikipedia articles are written by the religious right. This one is
from emedicine - generally a trusted source of medical information.
http://www.emedicine.com/MED/topic5.htm
(its about half way down the page - under dilation/extraction - they're
not quite as graphic with their description but an interesting read.
Remember no replying till you do your homework....lol
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