Religions > Atheism > NC: Kingston passes 'god' resolution after contentious discussion
| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Brian Westley" |
| Date: |
21 Jan 2004 10:27:36 AM |
| Object: |
NC: Kingston passes 'god' resolution after contentious discussion |
What imbiciles:
http://www.kinston.com/SiteProcessor.cfm?Template=/GlobalTemplates/Details.cfm&StoryID=17428&Section=Local
Following an intense debate that seemed more private than public, the
Kinston City Council on Monday unanimously approved recognizing God as
the foundation of this country's heritage.
The 30 minutes officials spent discussing the subject at times extended
beyond the basic separation of church and state argument. The discussion
was capped by City Attorney Vernon Rochelle quoting the North Carolina
Constitution, which states the federal "Constitutional mandate is one of
secular neutrality toward religion."
Monday night's atmosphere was far from celebratory. Council member Jimmy
Cousins, who adamantly supported the resolution, labeled the way in
which it was presented to officials as "coercive." Rochelle and Council
member Van Braxton said they "resented" the resolution questioning their
faith.
Finer points of the debate focused on the actual wording of the
resolution, which Lenoir County commissioners unanimously approved
earlier this month. However, only one phrase was changed. In the
statement, "It is a fact that between 90 percent and 95 percent of those
who drafted and signed the U.S. Constitution … never intended that
there be a separation between [God] and the affairs of government," the
percentages were changed to "the majority."
"If you are a true Christian, then it is your duty to witness," Cousins
said during an afternoon work session. "If you believe in the Bible ...
then that is absolute."
"But we represent a diverse community," Mayor Pro Tem Joe Tyson said.
"Not in my religious life, I don't," Cousins said.
"This isn't a religious function. This is the City Council," Tyson said.
Similar exchanges continued, with Tyson and Braxton raising the most
questions about the resolution itself, and how it reached them in the
first place. Most of the debate was confined to the work session, which
isn't broadcast. The regular meeting is.
Kinston businessman Ted Sampley took to the council and commissioners
the resolution, which is modeled after one originally passed in Greene
County, Tenn. Sampley was not present Monday, but his business partner
Jan Barwick was. Barwick did not speak to the council.
"I don't think anybody should be embarrassed to recognize God," said
Council member Alice Tingle, who asked her colleagues to consider the
resolution. "It's our job to proclaim God. He's visible everywhere, in
nature. Not doing so … that's why we've gone astray in this country."
"I really do hate this came up," Braxton said. "I feel like I have a
very strong belief in God. But I don't like getting stuff like this
crammed down my throat."
Rochelle said he approached each council member individually several
weeks ago, telling them that this resolution would put them in a
"lose-lose" situation. He labeled Sampley's letter to the editor in The
Free Press Sunday as proof.
"It is the atheists, agnostics and anti-religious dissenters who should
stand down and stop tying to censor and rewrite American history,"
Sampley stated in the letter, which Rochelle quoted.
Officials also took the time to debate whose names would appear on the
signed resolution, which usually, but not always, is limited to Mayor
Johnnie Mosley. City Clerk Carol Barwick said after Monday's meeting
that her name attesting to the resolution's approval would be the only
one to appear on the final copy.
City and county versions of the Greene County, Tenn., resolution omitted
prior references to the Ten Commandments controversy in Alabama. The
debate didn't feature that omission.
"The judicial system is trying to dictate to this nation what it can and
cannot do in terms of their religion," Cousins said. He also said he
"absolutely" did not trust the judicial system.
"We're not telling anybody that they have to go to church," Tingle said.
"Our community would like to see us do this, pass it on to others, and
show them what we stand for."
Last week, an American Civil Liberties Union attorney labeled the
resolution as constitutional, but "irresponsible." Braxton said one
person called him to say the matter was "another ploy of the Christian
right."
The Free Press late Monday contacted a local Muslim, Abdur Rahim Saleem.
Saleem said he was pleased the resolution passed, labeling a "yes" vote
as "common sense."
"We (Muslims) believe that the Founding Fathers studied the gospel of
Jesus and the Koran," Saleem said. "Jews, Christians and Muslims … we
all serve the same God. We just call it by different names."
.
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| User: "Ron Baker, Pluralitas!" |
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| Title: Re: Kingston passes 'god' resolution after contentious discussion |
21 Jan 2004 12:30:38 PM |
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"Brian Westley" <westley@visi.com> wrote in message
news:400ea878$0$546$a1866201@newsreader.visi.com...
What imbiciles:
http://www.kinston.com/SiteProcessor.cfm?Template=/GlobalTemplates/Details.c
fm&StoryID=17428&Section=Local
Following an intense debate that seemed more private than public, the
Kinston City Council on Monday unanimously approved recognizing God as
the foundation of this country's heritage.
If a city council can pass a resolution recognizing the
the heritage of the US then alt.atheism can pass a resolution
recognizing the heritage of Kinston, NC.
Resolved: Slavery is the foundation of Kinston's heritage.
All in favor say, Aye.
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| User: "Doc Smartass" |
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| Title: Re: Kingston passes 'god' resolution after contentious discussion |
21 Jan 2004 01:02:54 PM |
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"Ron Baker, Pluralitas!" <rbaker4@msnn.com> wrote in
news:izzPb.1259$uQ5.116@twister.socal.rr.com:
"Brian Westley" <westley@visi.com> wrote in message
news:400ea878$0$546$a1866201@newsreader.visi.com...
What imbiciles:
http://www.kinston.com/SiteProcessor.cfm?Template=/GlobalTemplates/Deta
ils.c fm&StoryID=17428&Section=Local
Following an intense debate that seemed more private than public, the
Kinston City Council on Monday unanimously approved recognizing God
as the foundation of this country's heritage.
If a city council can pass a resolution recognizing the
the heritage of the US then alt.atheism can pass a resolution
recognizing the heritage of Kinston, NC.
Resolved: Slavery is the foundation of Kinston's heritage.
All in favor say, Aye.
Aye.
--
Dr. Smartass
BAAWA Knight of Heckling -- a.a. #1939
Dissent is not a right.
It is a RESPONSIBILITY.
--me.
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| User: "Denis Loubet" |
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| Title: Re: Kingston passes 'god' resolution after contentious discussion |
21 Jan 2004 11:37:24 PM |
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"Ron Baker, Pluralitas!" <rbaker4@msnn.com> wrote in message
news:izzPb.1259$uQ5.116@twister.socal.rr.com...
"Brian Westley" <westley@visi.com> wrote in message
news:400ea878$0$546$a1866201@newsreader.visi.com...
What imbiciles:
http://www.kinston.com/SiteProcessor.cfm?Template=/GlobalTemplates/Details.c
fm&StoryID=17428&Section=Local
Following an intense debate that seemed more private than public, the
Kinston City Council on Monday unanimously approved recognizing God as
the foundation of this country's heritage.
If a city council can pass a resolution recognizing the
the heritage of the US then alt.atheism can pass a resolution
recognizing the heritage of Kinston, NC.
Resolved: Slavery is the foundation of Kinston's heritage.
All in favor say, Aye.
Aye.
By the way, how will we know when we have a majority?
--
Denis Loubet
dloubet@io.com
http://www.io.com/~dloubet
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| User: "Ron Baker, Pluralitas!" |
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| Title: Re: Kingston passes 'god' resolution after contentious discussion |
22 Jan 2004 01:04:50 AM |
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"Denis Loubet" <dloubet@io.com> wrote in message
news:0I6dnQd1wc6O_5LdRVn-uw@io.com...
"Ron Baker, Pluralitas!" <rbaker4@msnn.com> wrote in message
news:izzPb.1259$uQ5.116@twister.socal.rr.com...
"Brian Westley" <westley@visi.com> wrote in message
news:400ea878$0$546$a1866201@newsreader.visi.com...
What imbiciles:
http://www.kinston.com/SiteProcessor.cfm?Template=/GlobalTemplates/Details.c
fm&StoryID=17428&Section=Local
Following an intense debate that seemed more private than public, the
Kinston City Council on Monday unanimously approved recognizing God as
the foundation of this country's heritage.
If a city council can pass a resolution recognizing the
the heritage of the US then alt.atheism can pass a resolution
recognizing the heritage of Kinston, NC.
Resolved: Slavery is the foundation of Kinston's heritage.
All in favor say, Aye.
Aye.
By the way, how will we know when we have a majority?
I have unanimously appointed myself
chairperson of the resolution committee and will
therefore make the decission.
Using statistical interpolation it seems the majority
is already established.
I think another vote or two will establish a quorum
and the resolution will be passed.
;)
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| User: "Martin Thomas" |
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| Title: Re: Kingston passes 'god' resolution after contentious discussion |
22 Jan 2004 08:29:44 PM |
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On Wed, 21 Jan 2004 23:37:24 -0600 in alt.atheism
"Denis Loubet" <dloubet@io.com> wrote:
"Ron Baker, Pluralitas!" <rbaker4@msnn.com> wrote in message
news:izzPb.1259$uQ5.116@twister.socal.rr.com...
"Brian Westley" <westley@visi.com> wrote in message
news:400ea878$0$546$a1866201@newsreader.visi.com...
What imbiciles:
http://www.kinston.com/SiteProcessor.cfm?Template=/GlobalTemplates/Details.c
fm&StoryID=17428&Section=Local
Following an intense debate that seemed more private than public, the
Kinston City Council on Monday unanimously approved recognizing God as
the foundation of this country's heritage.
If a city council can pass a resolution recognizing the
the heritage of the US then alt.atheism can pass a resolution
recognizing the heritage of Kinston, NC.
Resolved: Slavery is the foundation of Kinston's heritage.
All in favor say, Aye.
Aye.
By the way, how will we know when we have a majority?
So far I see 7 Aye's and not a single Nay!
Oh, and add another Aye for me :)
-
Martin Thomas
Official "Teddy Bear" Atheist
mart666t@netscape.NO.HAWKERS.net
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| User: "Michelle Malkin" |
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| Title: Re: Kingston passes 'god' resolution after contentious discussion |
22 Jan 2004 10:58:12 PM |
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"Martin Thomas" <mart666t@netscape.NO.HAWKERS.net> wrote in message
news:gl11105a04r040pa1crjqmc6e6ehdarul7@4ax.com...
On Wed, 21 Jan 2004 23:37:24 -0600 in alt.atheism
"Denis Loubet" <dloubet@io.com> wrote:
"Ron Baker, Pluralitas!" <rbaker4@msnn.com> wrote in message
news:izzPb.1259$uQ5.116@twister.socal.rr.com...
"Brian Westley" <westley@visi.com> wrote in message
news:400ea878$0$546$a1866201@newsreader.visi.com...
What imbiciles:
http://www.kinston.com/SiteProcessor.cfm?Template=/GlobalTemplates/Details.
c
fm&StoryID=17428&Section=Local
Following an intense debate that seemed more private than public, the
Kinston City Council on Monday unanimously approved recognizing God
as
the foundation of this country's heritage.
If a city council can pass a resolution recognizing the
the heritage of the US then alt.atheism can pass a resolution
recognizing the heritage of Kinston, NC.
Resolved: Slavery is the foundation of Kinston's heritage.
All in favor say, Aye.
Aye.
By the way, how will we know when we have a majority?
So far I see 7 Aye's and not a single Nay!
Oh, and add another Aye for me :)
Please add another aye for me, too.
-
Martin Thomas
Official "Teddy Bear" Atheist
mart666t@netscape.NO.HAWKERS.net
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| User: "Ron Baker, Pluralitas!" |
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| Title: Re: Kingston passes 'god' resolution after contentious discussion |
22 Jan 2004 11:50:35 PM |
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"Ron Baker, Pluralitas!" <rbaker4@msnn.com> wrote in message
news:izzPb.1259$uQ5.116@twister.socal.rr.com...
"Brian Westley" <westley@visi.com> wrote in message
news:400ea878$0$546$a1866201@newsreader.visi.com...
What imbiciles:
http://www.kinston.com/SiteProcessor.cfm?Template=/GlobalTemplates/Details.c
fm&StoryID=17428&Section=Local
Following an intense debate that seemed more private than public, the
Kinston City Council on Monday unanimously approved recognizing God as
the foundation of this country's heritage.
If a city council can pass a resolution recognizing the
the heritage of the US then alt.atheism can pass a resolution
recognizing the heritage of Kinston, NC.
Resolved: Slavery is the foundation of Kinston's heritage.
All in favor say, Aye.
Hear Ye, Hear Ye.
A Quorum has been established and the Vote has been tallied.
With a Tally of more than 8 Ayes and no Nays
Alt.Atheism unanimously resolves that
Slavery is the Foundation of Kinston's Heritage.
So let it be recorded.
And by the arbitrary Powers vested in me by me
as unanimously self-appointed Chairman of this
Committee, I arbitrarily attach the Rider proposed
by the honourable AutieLib
Stupidity is also the Foundation of Kinston's Heritage.
Good work Ladies and Gentlemen.
Let us adjourn to our Refrigerators
where Refreshments await.
--
Ron Baker
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| User: "Geoff" |
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| Title: Re: Kingston passes 'god' resolution after contentious discussion |
21 Jan 2004 08:07:54 PM |
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"Ron Baker, Pluralitas!" <rbaker4@msnn.com> wrote in message
news:izzPb.1259$uQ5.116@twister.socal.rr.com...
If a city council can pass a resolution recognizing the
the heritage of the US then alt.atheism can pass a resolution
recognizing the heritage of Kinston, NC.
Resolved: Slavery is the foundation of Kinston's heritage.
All in favor say, Aye.
Aye.
.
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| User: "Mekkala" |
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| Title: Re: Kingston passes 'god' resolution after contentious discussion |
21 Jan 2004 02:30:53 PM |
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On Wed 21 Jan 2004 12:30:38p, "Ron Baker, Pluralitas!"
<rbaker4@msnn.com> kicked back with a beer, ruminated at length, fell
asleep, woke up, lit up a joint, then fell asleep again after
thoughtfully blurting out:
"Brian Westley" <westley@visi.com> wrote in message
news:400ea878$0$546$a1866201@newsreader.visi.com...
What imbiciles:
http://www.kinston.com/SiteProcessor.cfm?
Template=/GlobalTemplates/Deta
ils.c fm&StoryID=17428&Section=Local
Following an intense debate that seemed more private than public, the
Kinston City Council on Monday unanimously approved recognizing God
as the foundation of this country's heritage.
If a city council can pass a resolution recognizing the
the heritage of the US then alt.atheism can pass a resolution
recognizing the heritage of Kinston, NC.
Resolved: Slavery is the foundation of Kinston's heritage.
All in favor say, Aye.
Aye!
--
Mekkala, Atheist #2148
"Atheism is ... the bed-rock of sanity in a world of madness."
--Emmett F. Fields
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| User: "Vic Sagerquist" |
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| Title: Re: Kingston passes 'god' resolution after contentious discussion |
21 Jan 2004 10:01:37 PM |
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One day in alt.atheism, Also Sprach Ron Baker, Pluralitas!:
"Brian Westley" <westley@visi.com> wrote in message
news:400ea878$0$546$a1866201@newsreader.visi.com...
What imbiciles:
http://www.kinston.com/SiteProcessor.cfm?Template=/GlobalTemplates/Deta
ils.c fm&StoryID=17428&Section=Local
Following an intense debate that seemed more private than public, the
Kinston City Council on Monday unanimously approved recognizing God
as the foundation of this country's heritage.
If a city council can pass a resolution recognizing the
the heritage of the US then alt.atheism can pass a resolution
recognizing the heritage of Kinston, NC.
Resolved: Slavery is the foundation of Kinston's heritage.
All in favor say, Aye.
Aye, aye aye
--
Vic Sagerquist
aa#2011
______________
The fool says in his heart, "There is no God".
The wise man announces it to the world.
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| User: "AuntieLib" |
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| Title: Re: Kingston passes 'god' resolution after contentious discussion |
22 Jan 2004 04:22:45 PM |
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Ron Baker wrote:
Following an intense debate that seemed more private than public, the
Kinston City Council on Monday unanimously approved recognizing God as
the foundation of this country's heritage.
If a city council can pass a resolution recognizing the
the heritage of the US then alt.atheism can pass a resolution
recognizing the heritage of Kinston, NC.
Resolved: Slavery is the foundation of Kinston's heritage.
All in favor say, Aye.
I'd change "slavery" to "stupidity" but otherwise...
Aye.
elizabeth
aa#2098
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
"The easy confidence with which I know another man's religion
is folly teaches me to suspect that my own is also."
Mark Twain
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
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| User: "towelie" |
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| Title: Re: Kingston passes 'god' resolution after contentious discussion |
21 Jan 2004 02:16:00 PM |
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TV's Ron Baker, Pluralitas! wrote:
"Brian Westley" <westley@visi.com> wrote in message
news:400ea878$0$546$a1866201@newsreader.visi.com...
What imbiciles:
http://www.kinston.com/SiteProcessor.cfm?Template=/GlobalTemplates/Details.c
fm&StoryID=17428&Section=Local
Following an intense debate that seemed more private than public, the
Kinston City Council on Monday unanimously approved recognizing God
as the foundation of this country's heritage.
If a city council can pass a resolution recognizing the
the heritage of the US then alt.atheism can pass a resolution
recognizing the heritage of Kinston, NC.
Resolved: Slavery is the foundation of Kinston's heritage.
All in favor say, Aye.
Aye!
--
Don't waste your touch, you won't feel anything
Or were you sent to save me?
I've thought too much
You won't find anything worthy of redeeming
AFI - The Leaving Song Pt. II
aa #2133
apatriot #19
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