johac <jhachm...@remove.sbcglobal.net> wrote:

Spanish scientists point at climate changes as the cause of the
Neanderthal extinction in the Iberian Peninsula

The problem with this is that their observation are not inconsistant
with other theories, while it is somewhat inconsistant with the
stated conclusions.

Cold, arid and highly variable climate was the least
favourable weather for Neanderthals and 24,000 years ago
they had to face the worst weather conditions in the last
250,000 years.

See, 24,000 years ago was more than 10,000 years AFTER
moderns arrived in Europe (and maybe more like 20,000 years),
and as much as 6,000 years AFTER many cites place their
extinction. Either way, Neanderthals were pretty much gone
everywhere in Europe except for a few isolated pockets (like
the Iberian Peninsula. In other words, the event -- the extinction
of the Neanderthals -- began long before their explanation
existed.

An even more obvious issue is the fact that, if anything,
Neanderthals were far better suited for colder climates than
moderns. If Neanderthals couldn't survive the cold then
certainly no moderns could.

I'm not saying that weather isn't related to their extinction,
but if it is then only indirectly. For example, Neanderthal
populations don't appear to have been very large to begin
with. Throw in just a little interbreeding and the eventual
outcome is going to be no more Neandethals. If the population
dwindles at all because of weather, that's going to happen
even quicker.

On May 1, 6:36 pm, johac <jhachm...@remove.sbcglobal.net> wrote:

Here's the latest, at least for this week.

---
25/02/2007

Spanish scientists point at climate changes as the cause of the
Neanderthal extinction in the Iberian Peninsula

- Recent studies carried out in Gorham's cave, on Gibraltar, proved to
be definitive for this work.

- Results show that the Neanderthal extinction could have been greatly
determined by environmental and climate changes and not by
competitiveness with modern humans.

- The research work was recently published in Quaternary Science Reviews
journal.
C@MPUS DIGITAL Climate ­ and not modern humans ­ was the cause of the
Neanderthal extinction in the Iberian Peninsula. Such is the conclusion
of the University of Granada research group RNM 179 - Mineralogy and
Geochemistry of sedimentary and metamorphic environments, headed by
professor Miguel Ortega Huertas and whose members Francisco José Jiménez
Espejo, Francisca Martínez Ruiz and David Gallego Torres work jointly at
the department of Mineralogy and Petrology of the University of Granada
(Universidad de Granada) and the Andalusian Regional Institute of Earth
Sciences (CSIC-UGR).

Together with other scientists from the Gibraltar Museum, Stanford
University and the Japan Marine Science & Technology Center (JAMSTEC),
the Spanish scientists published in the scientific journal Quaternary
Science Reviews an innovative work representing a considerable step
forward in the knowledge of human ancestral history.
The results of this multidisciplinary research are an important
contribution to the understanding of the Neanderthal extinction and the
colonisation of the European continent by Homo Sapiens.
During the last Ice Age, the Iberian Peninsula was a refuge for
Neanderthals, who had survived in local pockets during previous Ice
Ages, bouncing back to Europe when weather conditions improved.

Climate reconstructions

The study is based upon climate reconstructions elaborated from marine
records and using the experience of Spanish and international research
groups on Western Mediterranean paleoceanography. The conclusions point
out that Neanderthal populations did suffer fluctuations related to
climate changes before the first Homo Sapiens arrived in the Iberian
Peninsula. Cold, arid and highly variable climate was the least
favourable weather for Neanderthals and 24,000 years ago they had to
face the worst weather conditions in the last 250,000 years.
The most important about these data is that they differ from the current
scientific paradigm which makes Homo Sapiens responsible for the
Neanderthal extinction. This work is a contribution to a new scientific
current ­ leaded by Dr. Clive Finlayson, from the Gibraltar Museum ­
according to which Neanderthal isolation and, possibly, extinction were
due to environmental factors.
These studies on climate variability are part of the work of the group
RNM 179, funded by the excellence project RNM 0432 of the Andalusian
Regional Government¹s Department for Innovation, Science and Business
and by the MARCAL project of the Spanish Ministry of Education and
Science, both linked to the Andalusian Environment Centre (CEAMA -
Centro Andaluz de Medio Ambiente).

Reference: Prof. Francisca Martínez Ruiz. Andalusian Institute for Earth
Sciences.

---http://prensa.ugr.es/prensa/research/verNota/prensa.php?nota=435
--
John #1782

"We should always be disposed to believe that which appears to us to be
white is really black, if the hierarchy of the church so decides."

- Saint Ignatius Loyola (1491-1556) Founder of the Jesuit Order.

Based on the material reproduced hre, I'd hardly say this was a slam-
dunk (although if I were in the Bush administration I'd definitely say
that - right after I said, "You're doing a heckuva job Neandie!")!

I'd like to see more of the material and their rationale. I mean the
Neanderthals, from their earliest beginnings to their extinction
lasted some 300,000 years.

I think there's more going on here than just one thing - like "the
sapiens wiped them out", or "the climate killed them off". I'm
starting to think that it was an accumulation of things, including a
Borg invasion, with sapiens being the Borg. The Neanderthals were
assimilated!

I went looking over at www.scienceblogs.com for an article I thought
I'd read there in the last couple of days on Neanderthals, and I found
this, at Afarensis, also on the Gorham discoveries:
http://tinyurl.com/2j3ngd

Here's one on hybridization at "Stranger Fruit":
http://tinyurl.com/3ddjdf

I found this one at "Evolgen" too, but I'm not sure if it was the one
I was thinking of when I started looking!:
http://tinyurl.com/2tzcgv

Budikka

Spanish scientists point at climate changes as the cause of the
Neanderthal extinction in the Iberian Peninsula

Have any of the fundies ever found bible verses that refer
to Neandertals, the same way dinosaurs were referred to as
"leviathans"?

One fine day in alt.atheism, johac <jhachm...@remove.sbcglobal.net>
bloodied us up with this:

Spanish scientists point at climate changes as the cause of the
Neanderthal extinction in the Iberian Peninsula

Have any of the fundies ever found bible verses that refer to Neandertals,
the same way dinosaurs were referred to as "leviathans"?

--
Uncle Vic
aa Atheist #2011
Supervisor, EAC Department of little adhesive-backed "L" shaped
chrome-plastic doo-dads to add feet to Jesus fish department.
Convicted by Earthquack. Plonked by Fester.
Member Duke Spanking Club.