On Jefferson



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Topic: Religions > Atheism
User: "Carol Lee Smith"
Date: 20 Oct 2003 10:22:42 PM
Object: On Jefferson
Complete interviews made by Ken Burns with 24 Jefferson scholars, for the
1996 PBS program "Thomas Jefferson" may be read at:
http://www.pbs.org/jefferson/archives/interviews/frame.htm
the sidebar has a whole listing of interviews re: Jefferson
.

User: "Carol Lee Smith"

Title: Re: On Jefferson 20 Oct 2003 10:31:08 PM
On Mon, 20 Oct 2003, Carol Lee Smith wrote:

Complete interviews made by Ken Burns with 24 Jefferson scholars, for the
1996 PBS program "Thomas Jefferson" may be read at:

http://www.pbs.org/jefferson/archives/interviews/frame.htm

the sidebar has a whole listing of interviews re: Jefferson

-------excerpt-------------
What kind of manyou spoke a bit about being unsure, being torn on the
bias in a way... What kind of man was Thomas Jefferson? Drink him in for
me.
Well, I'll give you one example. He was an atheist, and we were not sick
with religion in 1800 as we are sick with religion in 1995. Religion was a
private matter, and they had seen to it that it was kept a private matter.
People could go to any church they wanted, and the government stayed away
from them, and they stayed out of the government. Yet there was a certain
amount of evangelical Christianity going on, and they finally got after
Jefferson because they knew this was in his background, as indeed it was
in the background of Abraham Lincoln. So he gets caught on this, and
finally comes up with a weird premise that he's a deist, which means one
who believes in a god but he can't quite define what it is. Well, you're
living a lie every day of your life if you're surrounded by devout
Christians and you have to give them a feeling that you're one too, or at
least you're not hostile, and he was hostile. Well, these contradictions
are a joy for most politicians. I mean, there is nothing a real politician
loves better than telling a lie, and the bigger the lie, the more ecstatic
it is. I mean it's really exciting stuff to lie. Jefferson did lie, but he
didn't much enjoy it, and you could see that things were turning over in
his brain, and he would make excuses for his behavior, particularly over
the Aaron Burr case, that were just ludicrous." --Gore Vidal
---------end of excerpt---------
.
User: ""

Title: Re: On Jefferson 21 Oct 2003 05:37:58 AM
Carol Lee Smith <human@csd.uwm.edu> wrote:

:|On Mon, 20 Oct 2003, Carol Lee Smith wrote:
:|
:|> Complete interviews made by Ken Burns with 24 Jefferson scholars, for the
:|> 1996 PBS program "Thomas Jefferson" may be read at:
:|>
:|> http://www.pbs.org/jefferson/archives/interviews/frame.htm
:|>
:|> the sidebar has a whole listing of interviews re: Jefferson
:|-------excerpt-------------
:|
:| What kind of manyou spoke a bit about being unsure, being torn on the
:|bias in a way... What kind of man was Thomas Jefferson? Drink him in for
:|me.
:|Well, I'll give you one example. He was an atheist, and we were not sick
:|with religion in 1800 as we are sick with religion in 1995.

There are two problems with the above.
(1) Jefferson was NOT an atheist. Nor was Thomas Paine.
(2) There was a great deal of "sick" with religion in 1800. All anyone has
to do is read the various tracts published and newspaper articles published
during the presidential campaign of 1800 to know that.
There were still three New England States that had established religions.

:|Religion was a
:|private matter, and they had seen to it that it was kept a private matter.

Not in those particular New England states.

:|People could go to any church they wanted, and the government stayed away
:|from them, and they stayed out of the government. Yet there was a certain
:|amount of evangelical Christianity going on, and they finally got after
:|Jefferson because they knew this was in his background, as indeed it was
:|in the background of Abraham Lincoln. So he gets caught on this, and
:|finally comes up with a weird premise that he's a deist, which means one
:|who believes in a god but he can't quite define what it is. Well, you're
:|living a lie every day of your life if you're surrounded by devout
:|Christians and you have to give them a feeling that you're one too, or at
:|least you're not hostile, and he was hostile. Well, these contradictions
:|are a joy for most politicians. I mean, there is nothing a real politician
:|loves better than telling a lie, and the bigger the lie, the more ecstatic
:|it is. I mean it's really exciting stuff to lie. Jefferson did lie, but he
:|didn't much enjoy it, and you could see that things were turning over in
:|his brain, and he would make excuses for his behavior, particularly over
:|the Aaron Burr case, that were just ludicrous." --Gore Vidal

The above is not a very good article.
.
User: "Lord Calvert"

Title: Re: On Jefferson 21 Oct 2003 10:24:41 AM

The above [article written by Gore Vidal] is not a very good article.

Which is probably why it was used instead of something more accurate.
Rich Goranson, Amherst, NY, USA (aa#MCMXCIX, a-vet#1)
EAC Department of Applied Rattan Use
"Without faith we might relapse into scientific or rational thinking, which
leads by a slippery slope toward constitutional democracy." - Robert Anton
Wilson
.




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