| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"atheist@home" |
| Date: |
05 Jan 2006 09:48:18 PM |
| Object: |
OT hyperspace" engine |
Welcome to Mars express: only a three hour trip
IAN JOHNSTON SCIENCE CORRESPONDENT
AN EXTRAORDINARY "hyperspace" engine that could make interstellar
space travel a reality by flying into other dimensions is being
investigated by the United States government.
The hypothetical device, which has been outlined in principle but is
based on a controversial theory about the fabric of the universe,
could potentially allow a spacecraft to travel to Mars in three hours
and journey to a star 11 light years away in just 80 days, according
to a report in today's New Scientist magazine.
http://news.scotsman.com/scitech.cfm?id=16902006
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| User: "Enkidu" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
05 Jan 2006 10:39:23 PM |
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"atheist@home" <atheist@home.com> wrote in
news:u11sr1tnml0nv24pp30euu3g63jn6pvcdd@4ax.com:
Welcome to Mars express: only a three hour trip
IAN JOHNSTON SCIENCE CORRESPONDENT
AN EXTRAORDINARY "hyperspace" engine that could make interstellar
space travel a reality by flying into other dimensions is being
investigated by the United States government.
The hypothetical device, which has been outlined in principle but is
based on a controversial theory about the fabric of the universe,
could potentially allow a spacecraft to travel to Mars in three hours
and journey to a star 11 light years away in just 80 days, according
to a report in today's New Scientist magazine.
http://news.scotsman.com/scitech.cfm?id=16902006
Very cool *if* it pans out. I'd bet it's crap, but I'd be very happy to
be wrong.
--
Enkidu AA#2165
http://www.thoughts.leaddogs.org/
EAC Chaplain and ordained minister,
ULC, Modesto, CA
PGP ID: 0xC4CE8CF0
An argument frequently used by believers [is] to force unbelievers to
soften their terms by accepting their opponents' definition; "Atheist"
means without a concept of God that is logically convincing, not with
proof that God does not exist.
-- Jim Herrick
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| User: "kathryn" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
06 Jan 2006 11:29:47 AM |
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"Enkidu" <jdwnx4702@sneakemail.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9742D221E66C1255229@130.133.1.4...
"atheist@home" <atheist@home.com> wrote in
news:u11sr1tnml0nv24pp30euu3g63jn6pvcdd@4ax.com:
Welcome to Mars express: only a three hour trip
IAN JOHNSTON SCIENCE CORRESPONDENT
AN EXTRAORDINARY "hyperspace" engine that could make interstellar
space travel a reality by flying into other dimensions is being
investigated by the United States government.
The hypothetical device, which has been outlined in principle but is
based on a controversial theory about the fabric of the universe,
could potentially allow a spacecraft to travel to Mars in three hours
and journey to a star 11 light years away in just 80 days, according
to a report in today's New Scientist magazine.
http://news.scotsman.com/scitech.cfm?id=16902006
Very cool *if* it pans out. I'd bet it's crap, but I'd be very happy to
be wrong.
--
Enkidu AA#2165
well the important word was hypothetical. I'll not get *too* excited until
they have something to test ;)
Kathryn
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| User: "johac" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
06 Jan 2006 01:12:36 AM |
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In article <Xns9742D221E66C1255229@130.133.1.4>,
Enkidu <jdwnx4702@sneakemail.com> wrote:
"atheist@home" <atheist@home.com> wrote in
news:u11sr1tnml0nv24pp30euu3g63jn6pvcdd@4ax.com:
Welcome to Mars express: only a three hour trip
IAN JOHNSTON SCIENCE CORRESPONDENT
AN EXTRAORDINARY "hyperspace" engine that could make interstellar
space travel a reality by flying into other dimensions is being
investigated by the United States government.
The hypothetical device, which has been outlined in principle but is
based on a controversial theory about the fabric of the universe,
could potentially allow a spacecraft to travel to Mars in three hours
and journey to a star 11 light years away in just 80 days, according
to a report in today's New Scientist magazine.
http://news.scotsman.com/scitech.cfm?id=16902006
Very cool *if* it pans out. I'd bet it's crap, but I'd be very happy to
be wrong.
My first reaction was to recall 'cold fusion', but who knows? Maybe it
could be something.
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
Contact - Throw a .net over the .com
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| User: "Les Hemmings" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
06 Jan 2006 02:03:27 AM |
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"johac" <jhachmann@sbcglobal.com> wrote in message
news:jhachmann-889B3B.23123605012006@news.giganews.com...
My first reaction was to recall 'cold fusion', but who knows? Maybe it
could be something.
I'd keep an eye on cold fusion. There is more to come from zero point
energy..
Les
--
Remove Frontal Lobes to reply.
http://armsofmorpheus.blogspot.com/
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little
temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
- Benjamin Franklin, 1759
Les Hemmings aa #2251 SA
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| User: "johac" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
07 Jan 2006 01:37:24 AM |
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In article <426midF1fq22pU1@individual.net>,
"Les Hemmings" <les.frontalclaire@lobesvirgin.net> wrote:
"johac" <jhachmann@sbcglobal.com> wrote in message
news:jhachmann-889B3B.23123605012006@news.giganews.com...
My first reaction was to recall 'cold fusion', but who knows? Maybe it
could be something.
I'd keep an eye on cold fusion. There is more to come from zero point
energy..
With science and technology, i've learned to never say never, but at
present the probability of seeing cold fusion in the near future seems
quite low.
Les
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
Contact - Throw a .net over the .com
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| User: "MarkA" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
06 Jan 2006 06:37:26 AM |
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On Fri, 06 Jan 2006 08:03:27 +0000, Les Hemmings wrote:
"johac" <jhachmann@sbcglobal.com> wrote in message
news:jhachmann-889B3B.23123605012006@news.giganews.com...
My first reaction was to recall 'cold fusion', but who knows? Maybe it
could be something.
I'd keep an eye on cold fusion. There is more to come from zero point
energy..
Les
Cold fusion has been under active development for 10-20 YEARS, and has
produced squat. It's a case of the potential payoff being so great that
the 'true believers' can't abandon the idea, even though it is obviously
going nowhere.
--
MarkA
(still caught in the maze of twisty little passages, all different)
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| User: "Wunderkind" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
06 Jan 2006 06:46:12 PM |
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MarkA wrote:
On Fri, 06 Jan 2006 08:03:27 +0000, Les Hemmings wrote:
"johac" <jhachmann@sbcglobal.com> wrote in message
news:jhachmann-889B3B.23123605012006@news.giganews.com...
My first reaction was to recall 'cold fusion', but who knows? Maybe it
could be something.
I'd keep an eye on cold fusion. There is more to come from zero point
energy..
Les
Cold fusion has been under active development for 10-20 YEARS, and has
produced squat. It's a case of the potential payoff being so great that
the 'true believers' can't abandon the idea, even though it is obviously
going nowhere.
Just like SDI "Star Wars" programs!
WK
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| User: "erikc" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
06 Jan 2006 01:39:06 PM |
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On Fri, 06 Jan 2006 12:37:26 GMT, MarkA <manthony@stopspam.net> wrote:
On Fri, 06 Jan 2006 08:03:27 +0000, Les Hemmings wrote:
"johac" <jhachmann@sbcglobal.com> wrote in message
news:jhachmann-889B3B.23123605012006@news.giganews.com...
My first reaction was to recall 'cold fusion', but who knows? Maybe it
could be something.
I'd keep an eye on cold fusion. There is more to come from zero point
energy..
Les
Cold fusion has been under active development for 10-20 YEARS, and has
produced squat. It's a case of the potential payoff being so great that
the 'true believers' can't abandon the idea, even though it is obviously
going nowhere.
Hot fusion doesn't seem to be going anywhere, either.
Erikc (alt.atheist #002) | "An Fhirinne in aghaidh an tSaoil."
BAAWA Knight (retired) | "The Truth against the World."
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| User: "MarkA" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
07 Jan 2006 04:25:26 PM |
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On Fri, 06 Jan 2006 13:39:06 -0600, erikc wrote:
On Fri, 06 Jan 2006 12:37:26 GMT, MarkA <manthony@stopspam.net> wrote:
On Fri, 06 Jan 2006 08:03:27 +0000, Les Hemmings wrote:
"johac" <jhachmann@sbcglobal.com> wrote in message
news:jhachmann-889B3B.23123605012006@news.giganews.com...
My first reaction was to recall 'cold fusion', but who knows? Maybe it
could be something.
I'd keep an eye on cold fusion. There is more to come from zero point
energy..
Les
Cold fusion has been under active development for 10-20 YEARS, and has
produced squat. It's a case of the potential payoff being so great that
the 'true believers' can't abandon the idea, even though it is obviously
going nowhere.
Hot fusion doesn't seem to be going anywhere, either.
At least we know that hot fusion happens, the trick is slowing it down
enough make it useful. Currently, the rate of energy release is such
that it is hard on the apparatus, as well as the surrounding several
square miles.
--
MarkA
(this space accidentally filled in)
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| User: "Gregory Gadow" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
06 Jan 2006 04:25:02 PM |
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erikc wrote:
On Fri, 06 Jan 2006 12:37:26 GMT, MarkA <manthony@stopspam.net> wrote:
On Fri, 06 Jan 2006 08:03:27 +0000, Les Hemmings wrote:
"johac" <jhachmann@sbcglobal.com> wrote in message
news:jhachmann-889B3B.23123605012006@news.giganews.com...
My first reaction was to recall 'cold fusion', but who knows? Maybe it
could be something.
I'd keep an eye on cold fusion. There is more to come from zero point
energy..
Les
Cold fusion has been under active development for 10-20 YEARS, and has
produced squat. It's a case of the potential payoff being so great that
the 'true believers' can't abandon the idea, even though it is obviously
going nowhere.
Hot fusion doesn't seem to be going anywhere, either.
The problem with "hot" fusion is that it requires temperatures and pressures
that simply can not be sustained in the laboratory. "Cold" fusion is most
likely a pipe-dream, but at least it is theoretically feasable.
--
Gregory Gadow
techbear@serv.net
http://www.serv.net/~techbear
"Without faith we might relapse into scientific or rational thinking,
which leads by a slippery slope toward constitutional democracy."
- Robert Anton Wilson
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| User: "atheist@home" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
06 Jan 2006 04:27:43 AM |
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On 6 Jan 2006 04:39:23 GMT, Enkidu <jdwnx4702@sneakemail.com> wrote:
"atheist@home" <atheist@home.com> wrote in
news:u11sr1tnml0nv24pp30euu3g63jn6pvcdd@4ax.com:
Welcome to Mars express: only a three hour trip
IAN JOHNSTON SCIENCE CORRESPONDENT
AN EXTRAORDINARY "hyperspace" engine that could make interstellar
space travel a reality by flying into other dimensions is being
investigated by the United States government.
The hypothetical device, which has been outlined in principle but is
based on a controversial theory about the fabric of the universe,
could potentially allow a spacecraft to travel to Mars in three hours
and journey to a star 11 light years away in just 80 days, according
to a report in today's New Scientist magazine.
http://news.scotsman.com/scitech.cfm?id=16902006
Very cool *if* it pans out. I'd bet it's crap, but I'd be very happy to
be wrong.
I got chills when I read it.
I would love to live long enough to see that.
I agree with you though.
Probably crap.
atheist@home#1554
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| User: "Ron Baker, Pluralitas!" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
06 Jan 2006 01:59:14 AM |
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"atheist@home" <atheist@home.com> wrote in message
news:u11sr1tnml0nv24pp30euu3g63jn6pvcdd@4ax.com...
Welcome to Mars express: only a three hour trip
IAN JOHNSTON SCIENCE CORRESPONDENT
AN EXTRAORDINARY "hyperspace" engine that could make interstellar
space travel a reality by flying into other dimensions is being
investigated by the United States government.
The hypothetical device, which has been outlined in principle but is
based on a controversial theory about the fabric of the universe,
could potentially allow a spacecraft to travel to Mars in three hours
and journey to a star 11 light years away in just 80 days, according
to a report in today's New Scientist magazine.
http://news.scotsman.com/scitech.cfm?id=16902006
That is total nonsense.
--
rb #2187
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| User: "pluther" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
06 Jan 2006 03:23:03 AM |
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Ron Baker, Pluralitas! wrote:
"atheist@home" <atheist@home.com> wrote in message
news:u11sr1tnml0nv24pp30euu3g63jn6pvcdd@4ax.com...
Welcome to Mars express: only a three hour trip
IAN JOHNSTON SCIENCE CORRESPONDENT
AN EXTRAORDINARY "hyperspace" engine that could make interstellar
space travel a reality by flying into other dimensions is being
investigated by the United States government.
The hypothetical device, which has been outlined in principle but is
based on a controversial theory about the fabric of the universe,
could potentially allow a spacecraft to travel to Mars in three hours
and journey to a star 11 light years away in just 80 days, according
to a report in today's New Scientist magazine.
http://news.scotsman.com/scitech.cfm?id=16902006
That is total nonsense.
Well, the way the article is written - as if this was somehow news - is
nonsense.
NASA funds many researches into fringe theories through their
"breakthrough" propulsion programs. From careful reading of the
article it looks like someone has applied for one of these grants and
hasn't even been given funding for their first experiment yet, but is
trying to generate media buzz. Of course "... they may carry out a
test if the theory withstands further scrutiny." The question is
whether the theory could possibly withstand further scrutiny. At this
stage it's barely a concept - certainly nothing worth writing an
article about and trying to imply that this is real technology that's
just around the corner.
This is akin to issuing a press release for a new author because
"Reader's Digest is considering publishing three of my jokes".
This is sensationalism, not journalism.
-Pat
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| User: "Ron Baker, Pluralitas!" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
06 Jan 2006 09:52:52 AM |
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"pluther" <pluther@usa.net> wrote in message
news:1136539383.521735.194130@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Ron Baker, Pluralitas! wrote:
"atheist@home" <atheist@home.com> wrote in message
news:u11sr1tnml0nv24pp30euu3g63jn6pvcdd@4ax.com...
Welcome to Mars express: only a three hour trip
IAN JOHNSTON SCIENCE CORRESPONDENT
AN EXTRAORDINARY "hyperspace" engine that could make interstellar
space travel a reality by flying into other dimensions is being
investigated by the United States government.
The hypothetical device, which has been outlined in principle but is
based on a controversial theory about the fabric of the universe,
could potentially allow a spacecraft to travel to Mars in three hours
and journey to a star 11 light years away in just 80 days, according
to a report in today's New Scientist magazine.
http://news.scotsman.com/scitech.cfm?id=16902006
That is total nonsense.
Well, the way the article is written - as if this was somehow news - is
nonsense.
NASA funds many researches into fringe theories through their
"breakthrough" propulsion programs. From careful reading of the
article it looks like someone has applied for one of these grants and
hasn't even been given funding for their first experiment yet, but is
trying to generate media buzz. Of course "... they may carry out a
test if the theory withstands further scrutiny." The question is
whether the theory could possibly withstand further scrutiny. At this
stage it's barely a concept - certainly nothing worth writing an
It is crackpot.
"by flying into other dimensions"
There has never been an experiment that gives
evidence of a dimension other than the known four.
String theory involves other dimension but even its
supporters acknowledge that we can never conduct
an experiment high enough in energy to demonstrate
it. (In addition the hypothesized dimensions are
"small" and "curled up" if you know can follow
that.)
"journey to a star 11 light years away in just 80 days"
That is faster than light. Nothing has ever been
observe to go faster than light. All of modern
physics was made posible by the discovery that
light speed is the absolute maximum speed.
"creating an intense magnetic field that ... would
produce a gravitational field"
A connection between gravity and the other forces
of nature has never been demonstrated. It has been
desparately sought. String theory unifies gravity
with the other forces, but, again, it has never and
likely can never be demonstrated.
"Also, if a large enough magnetic field was created,
the craft would slip into a different dimension,
where the speed of light is faster, allowing
incredible speeds to be reached. Switching off
the magnetic field would result in the engine
reappearing in our current dimension."
Science-fiction nonsense. There has never been
even a mentionable theory of things moving into
or out of a dimension.
--
rb #2187
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| User: "atheist@home" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
06 Jan 2006 04:33:18 AM |
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On 6 Jan 2006 01:23:03 -0800, "pluther" <pluther@usa.net> wrote:
Ron Baker, Pluralitas! wrote:
"atheist@home" <atheist@home.com> wrote in message
news:u11sr1tnml0nv24pp30euu3g63jn6pvcdd@4ax.com...
Welcome to Mars express: only a three hour trip
IAN JOHNSTON SCIENCE CORRESPONDENT
AN EXTRAORDINARY "hyperspace" engine that could make interstellar
space travel a reality by flying into other dimensions is being
investigated by the United States government.
The hypothetical device, which has been outlined in principle but is
based on a controversial theory about the fabric of the universe,
could potentially allow a spacecraft to travel to Mars in three hours
and journey to a star 11 light years away in just 80 days, according
to a report in today's New Scientist magazine.
http://news.scotsman.com/scitech.cfm?id=16902006
That is total nonsense.
Well, the way the article is written - as if this was somehow news - is
nonsense.
NASA funds many researches into fringe theories through their
"breakthrough" propulsion programs. From careful reading of the
article it looks like someone has applied for one of these grants and
hasn't even been given funding for their first experiment yet, but is
trying to generate media buzz. Of course "... they may carry out a
test if the theory withstands further scrutiny." The question is
whether the theory could possibly withstand further scrutiny. At this
stage it's barely a concept - certainly nothing worth writing an
article about and trying to imply that this is real technology that's
just around the corner.
This is akin to issuing a press release for a new author because
"Reader's Digest is considering publishing three of my jokes".
This is sensationalism, not journalism.
Probably.
Unfortunately I'm one of those guys who honestly believes we will
never travel to the stars.
atheist@home#1554
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| User: "J Forbes" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
06 Jan 2006 08:58:31 AM |
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atheist@home wrote:
On 6 Jan 2006 01:23:03 -0800, "pluther" <pluther@usa.net> wrote:
Ron Baker, Pluralitas! wrote:
This is sensationalism, not journalism.
Probably.
Unfortunately I'm one of those guys who honestly believes we will
never travel to the stars.
damn realists!
Jim
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| User: "The Ghost In The Machine" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
06 Jan 2006 09:00:16 AM |
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In alt.atheism, atheist@home
<atheist@home.com>
wrote
on Fri, 06 Jan 2006 03:48:18 GMT
<u11sr1tnml0nv24pp30euu3g63jn6pvcdd@4ax.com>:
Welcome to Mars express: only a three hour trip
IAN JOHNSTON SCIENCE CORRESPONDENT
AN EXTRAORDINARY "hyperspace" engine that could make interstellar
space travel a reality by flying into other dimensions is being
investigated by the United States government.
The hypothetical device, which has been outlined in principle but is
based on a controversial theory about the fabric of the universe,
could potentially allow a spacecraft to travel to Mars in three hours
and journey to a star 11 light years away in just 80 days, according
to a report in today's New Scientist magazine.
http://news.scotsman.com/scitech.cfm?id=16902006
Interesting. Burkhard Heim was a bit of a maverick
and a recluse, so this is suspect prior to peer review,
but it has the unusual result of being heavily developed
in the mathematical realm, to the point of having been
simulated on a computer in DESY in Hamburg, Germany;
the results agree with particle physics measurements to
within experimental error and furthermore predicts particle
masses and lifetimes, something which few other theories have
been able to do successfully, even the Standard Model.
If this is crankish, it's better developed than most cranks,
at least as far as I can tell.
However, the conclusion that this will lead to a new method
of hyperspace travel is AFAICT at best very premature without
a lot more study.
It's a dark horse. :-) Regrettably, any awards will have to be
done posthumously.
Considering that he blew off his hands and lost his sight
and hearing because of mishandling of unstable compounds
in his teen years, it's an impressive achievement.
We shall see.
--
#191,
It's still legal to go .sigless.
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| User: "Wunderkind" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
06 Jan 2006 06:43:44 PM |
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atheist@home wrote:
Welcome to Mars express: only a three hour trip
IAN JOHNSTON SCIENCE CORRESPONDENT
AN EXTRAORDINARY "hyperspace" engine that could make interstellar
space travel a reality by flying into other dimensions is being
investigated by the United States government.
The hypothetical device, which has been outlined in principle but is
based on a controversial theory about the fabric of the universe,
could potentially allow a spacecraft to travel to Mars in three hours
and journey to a star 11 light years away in just 80 days, according
to a report in today's New Scientist magazine.
http://news.scotsman.com/scitech.cfm?id=16902006
Move over, Mr. Scott!
WK
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| User: "Wunderkind" |
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| Title: Re: OT hyperspace" engine |
06 Jan 2006 06:45:36 PM |
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atheist@home wrote:
Welcome to Mars express: only a three hour trip
IAN JOHNSTON SCIENCE CORRESPONDENT
AN EXTRAORDINARY "hyperspace" engine that could make interstellar
space travel a reality by flying into other dimensions is being
investigated by the United States government.
The hypothetical device, which has been outlined in principle but is
based on a controversial theory about the fabric of the universe,
could potentially allow a spacecraft to travel to Mars in three hours
and journey to a star 11 light years away in just 80 days, according
to a report in today's New Scientist magazine.
http://news.scotsman.com/scitech.cfm?id=16902006
The great speed it could potentially produce would be of what use over
very short distances for the US military? Or does the US Air Force
really have a "stargate" program?
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