| Topic: |
Religions > Atheism |
| User: |
"Mark K. Bilbo" |
| Date: |
16 Nov 2005 10:56:20 AM |
| Object: |
OT: Oh I so proud... |
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped build.
Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
http://makeashorterlink.com/?C2C863B2C
or
http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=topNews&storyID=2005-11-16T153432Z_01_ROB645614_RTRUKOC_0_UK-IRAQ.xml
--
Mark K. Bilbo
--------------------------------------------------
Forgotten Already
http://makeashorterlink.com/?H1233272C
Feds are treating Louisiana like enemy
"...it may be that they may have written us off."
http://makeashorterlink.com/?O21E51C1C
http://www.nola.com
.
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| User: "stoney" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
23 Nov 2005 12:27:04 PM |
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On Tue, 22 Nov 2005 21:49:30 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <0dl6o1l0gkpdm0kok6drmq5hujl2rs360c@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Mon, 21 Nov 2005 22:05:04 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <4hi4o1du1b7n7l77s02k69shv8km9bpnua@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 15:32:20 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <c4b1o1p3lkgeinuqscte3c1vdc4mjb933s@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 23:01:42 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <fuoun157u9kjj8icpkv9pu09fk73ja18pr@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Fri, 18 Nov 2005 23:59:30 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <i5nsn1h3a5294a0p7hee4vendlu198abvt@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 15:15:58 -0600, "Mark K. Bilbo"
<alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In <4lqpn1h2pr5dn2asphiajfqibk877otg17@4ax.com>, Dubh Ghall
<puck@pooks.hill.fey> wrote:
On Wed, 16 Nov 2005 22:42:17 -0800, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped
build.
Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Their standard of living has fallen, enormously.
Oh I almost forgot, the infrastructure is even worse than it was
under
Saddam the *****...
Then they had some infrastructure.
Which we destroyed so Halliburton and ilk could rebuild for a nice
fat
profit at the expense of the American taxpayer. That is except the
money
to do that has a funny way of disappearing.
It went into the proper palms.
And I assume that you are not talking about palm trees.
Depends on how you define 'tree.'
Eh?
Shades of 'that depends on how you define "is"'.
We never did get that definition, did we?
No idea.
Someone should ask Monica.
Why? She can't talk with her mouth full.
--
Contempt of Congress meter reading-offscale.
Hello, theocracy with a fundamentalist US Supreme
Court who will ensure church and state are joined
at the hip like clergy and altar boys.
America 1776-Jan 2001 RIP
"As democracy is perfected, the office of president
represents, more and more closely, the inner soul
of the people. On some great and glorious day the
plain folks of the land will reach their heart's
desire at last and the White House will be adorned
by a downright moron." --- H.L. Mencken (1880 - 1956)
Religion is the original war crime.
-Michelle Malkin (Feb 26, 2005)
.
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| User: "johac" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
23 Nov 2005 11:54:21 PM |
|
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In article <h2d9o1l1cqeptqjs2n9f529hjvl6clg9m1@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Tue, 22 Nov 2005 21:49:30 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <0dl6o1l0gkpdm0kok6drmq5hujl2rs360c@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Mon, 21 Nov 2005 22:05:04 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <4hi4o1du1b7n7l77s02k69shv8km9bpnua@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 15:32:20 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <c4b1o1p3lkgeinuqscte3c1vdc4mjb933s@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 23:01:42 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <fuoun157u9kjj8icpkv9pu09fk73ja18pr@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Fri, 18 Nov 2005 23:59:30 -0800, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <i5nsn1h3a5294a0p7hee4vendlu198abvt@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 15:15:58 -0600, "Mark K. Bilbo"
<alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In <4lqpn1h2pr5dn2asphiajfqibk877otg17@4ax.com>, Dubh Ghall
<puck@pooks.hill.fey> wrote:
On Wed, 16 Nov 2005 22:42:17 -0800, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we
helped
build.
Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Their standard of living has fallen, enormously.
Oh I almost forgot, the infrastructure is even worse than it
was
under
Saddam the *****...
Then they had some infrastructure.
Which we destroyed so Halliburton and ilk could rebuild for a
nice
fat
profit at the expense of the American taxpayer. That is except
the
money
to do that has a funny way of disappearing.
It went into the proper palms.
And I assume that you are not talking about palm trees.
Depends on how you define 'tree.'
Eh?
Shades of 'that depends on how you define "is"'.
We never did get that definition, did we?
No idea.
Someone should ask Monica.
Why? She can't talk with her mouth full.
Good point! :-)
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
.
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| User: "stoney" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
24 Nov 2005 10:14:45 AM |
|
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On Wed, 23 Nov 2005 21:54:21 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <h2d9o1l1cqeptqjs2n9f529hjvl6clg9m1@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Tue, 22 Nov 2005 21:49:30 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <0dl6o1l0gkpdm0kok6drmq5hujl2rs360c@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Mon, 21 Nov 2005 22:05:04 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <4hi4o1du1b7n7l77s02k69shv8km9bpnua@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 15:32:20 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <c4b1o1p3lkgeinuqscte3c1vdc4mjb933s@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 23:01:42 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <fuoun157u9kjj8icpkv9pu09fk73ja18pr@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Fri, 18 Nov 2005 23:59:30 -0800, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <i5nsn1h3a5294a0p7hee4vendlu198abvt@4ax.com>,
stoney <stoney@the.net> wrote:
On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 15:15:58 -0600, "Mark K. Bilbo"
<alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In <4lqpn1h2pr5dn2asphiajfqibk877otg17@4ax.com>, Dubh Ghall
<puck@pooks.hill.fey> wrote:
On Wed, 16 Nov 2005 22:42:17 -0800, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we
helped
build.
Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Their standard of living has fallen, enormously.
Oh I almost forgot, the infrastructure is even worse than it
was
under
Saddam the *****...
Then they had some infrastructure.
Which we destroyed so Halliburton and ilk could rebuild for a
nice
fat
profit at the expense of the American taxpayer. That is except
the
money
to do that has a funny way of disappearing.
It went into the proper palms.
And I assume that you are not talking about palm trees.
Depends on how you define 'tree.'
Eh?
Shades of 'that depends on how you define "is"'.
We never did get that definition, did we?
No idea.
Someone should ask Monica.
Why? She can't talk with her mouth full.
Good point! :-)
Heh.
--
Contempt of Congress meter reading-offscale.
Hello, theocracy with a fundamentalist US Supreme
Court who will ensure church and state are joined
at the hip like clergy and altar boys.
America 1776-Jan 2001 RIP
"As democracy is perfected, the office of president
represents, more and more closely, the inner soul
of the people. On some great and glorious day the
plain folks of the land will reach their heart's
desire at last and the White House will be adorned
by a downright moron." --- H.L. Mencken (1880 - 1956)
Religion is the original war crime.
-Michelle Malkin (Feb 26, 2005)
.
|
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| User: "johac" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
19 Nov 2005 01:55:55 AM |
|
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In article <4lqpn1h2pr5dn2asphiajfqibk877otg17@4ax.com>,
Dubh Ghall <puck@pooks.hill.fey> wrote:
On Wed, 16 Nov 2005 22:42:17 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped build.
Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Their standard of living has fallen, enormously.
The value of human life in Iraq, has nose dived.
Now, it is not just the government that imprisons people, indefinitely,
without
trial, and /or tortures them: They have got two invading fucking armies
doing
it, as well.
...But our leaders assure us that it is all legal, and it IS "progress".
And don't forget that there is a nasty civil war in progress.
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
.
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| User: "Kate " |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
17 Nov 2005 10:26:01 PM |
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On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 20:48:27 GMT, Dubh Ghall <puck@pooks.hill.fey>
wrote:
On Wed, 16 Nov 2005 22:42:17 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped build.
Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Their standard of living has fallen, enormously.
The value of human life in Iraq, has nose dived.
Now, it is not just the government that imprisons people, indefinitely, without
trial, and /or tortures them: They have got two invading fucking armies doing
it, as well.
...But our leaders assure us that it is all legal, and it IS "progress".
Most importantly - it's all over there, so it's a good thing. We all
know that Iraqis are unimportant even though er uh... we went to war
for their benefit.
hmmm, good thing Fred can't let himself see the outrageous hypocracy
of it being a good thing that the attacks are over there and it's also
a good thing that we americans are soooo concerned about the Iraqi's
that we didn't bother to go after the real enemy and went after Saddam
instead.
.
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
19 Nov 2005 10:36:30 AM |
|
|
In <43995683.260444359@news-west.newscene.com>, (Kate
) wrote:
On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 20:48:27 GMT, Dubh Ghall <puck@pooks.hill.fey> wrote:
On Wed, 16 Nov 2005 22:42:17 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped build.
Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Their standard of living has fallen, enormously. The value of human life
in Iraq, has nose dived. Now, it is not just the government that
imprisons people, indefinitely, without trial, and /or tortures them:
They have got two invading fucking armies doing it, as well.
...But our leaders assure us that it is all legal, and it IS "progress".
Most importantly - it's all over there, so it's a good thing. We all know
that Iraqis are unimportant even though er uh... we went to war for their
benefit.
hmmm, good thing Fred can't let himself see the outrageous hypocracy of it
being a good thing that the attacks are over there and it's also a good
thing that we americans are soooo concerned about the Iraqi's that we
didn't bother to go after the real enemy and went after Saddam instead.
And we didn't even get any cheap oil out of the deal.
Sheesh!
--
Mark K. Bilbo
--------------------------------------------------
Forgotten Already
http://makeashorterlink.com/?H1233272C
Feds are treating Louisiana like enemy
"...it may be that they may have written us off."
http://makeashorterlink.com/?O21E51C1C
http://www.nola.com
.
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| User: "stoney" |
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| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
18 Nov 2005 04:58:45 PM |
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On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 20:48:27 GMT, Dubh Ghall <puck@pooks.hill.fey>
wrote:
On Wed, 16 Nov 2005 22:42:17 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped build.
Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Their standard of living has fallen, enormously.
The value of human life in Iraq, has nose dived.
Now, it is not just the government that imprisons people, indefinitely, without
trial, and /or tortures them: They have got two invading fucking armies doing
it, as well.
...But our leaders assure us that it is all legal, and it IS "progress".
Progress in another Hollocaust.
--
Contempt of Congress meter reading-offscale.
Hello, theocracy with a fundamentalist US Supreme
Court who will ensure church and state are joined
at the hip like clergy and altar boys.
America 1776-Jan 2001 RIP
"As democracy is perfected, the office of president
represents, more and more closely, the inner soul
of the people. On some great and glorious day the
plain folks of the land will reach their heart's
desire at last and the White House will be adorned
by a downright moron." --- H.L. Mencken (1880 - 1956)
Religion is the original war crime.
-Michelle Malkin (Feb 26, 2005)
.
|
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| User: "Fred Stone" |
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| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
17 Nov 2005 06:27:55 AM |
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johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped build.
Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually. CNN isn't covering up the story to keep "access".
And there are people in the government who are outraged at the discovery
and who will take action against those who have perpetrated this crime.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
"You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up
for something, sometime in your life." -- W. Churchill
.
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| User: "johac" |
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| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
19 Nov 2005 02:05:32 AM |
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In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped build.
Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
CNN isn't covering up the story to keep "access".
And there are people in the government who are outraged at the discovery
and who will take action against those who have perpetrated this crime.
A weak government propped up by a foreign army of occupation. Some
claimed that they deplored the torture, but I wonder how many applauded
it or may have even taken part in it.
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
.
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
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| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
19 Nov 2005 10:35:19 AM |
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In <jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com>, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped build.
Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
And *finally* there are chemical weapons in Iraq!
(Mission Accomplished!)
--
Mark K. Bilbo
--------------------------------------------------
Forgotten Already
http://makeashorterlink.com/?H1233272C
Feds are treating Louisiana like enemy
"...it may be that they may have written us off."
http://makeashorterlink.com/?O21E51C1C
http://www.nola.com
.
|
|
|
| User: "stoney" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
19 Nov 2005 11:41:23 AM |
|
|
On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 10:35:19 -0600, "Mark K. Bilbo"
<alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In <jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com>, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped build.
Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
And *finally* there are chemical weapons in Iraq!
(Mission Accomplished!)
Brought and utilized by the US on the civilian population.
--
Contempt of Congress meter reading-offscale.
Hello, theocracy with a fundamentalist US Supreme
Court who will ensure church and state are joined
at the hip like clergy and altar boys.
America 1776-Jan 2001 RIP
"As democracy is perfected, the office of president
represents, more and more closely, the inner soul
of the people. On some great and glorious day the
plain folks of the land will reach their heart's
desire at last and the White House will be adorned
by a downright moron." --- H.L. Mencken (1880 - 1956)
Religion is the original war crime.
-Michelle Malkin (Feb 26, 2005)
.
|
|
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
19 Nov 2005 02:43:09 PM |
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In <9toun1l991ununsrn37cgisi07otkg9jum@4ax.com>, stoney <stoney@the.net>
wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 10:35:19 -0600, "Mark K. Bilbo"
<alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In <jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com>, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped build.
Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
And *finally* there are chemical weapons in Iraq!
(Mission Accomplished!)
Brought and utilized by the US on the civilian population.
Well, Bush *said there were WMDs in Iraq didn't he? He didn't necessarily
say *whose WMDs...
--
Mark K. Bilbo
--------------------------------------------------
Forgotten Already
http://makeashorterlink.com/?H1233272C
Feds are treating Louisiana like enemy
"...it may be that they may have written us off."
http://makeashorterlink.com/?O21E51C1C
http://www.nola.com
.
|
|
|
| User: "johac" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
20 Nov 2005 12:57:22 AM |
|
|
In article <OeCdnSM3wPr1E-LeRVn-uw@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In <9toun1l991ununsrn37cgisi07otkg9jum@4ax.com>, stoney <stoney@the.net>
wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 10:35:19 -0600, "Mark K. Bilbo"
<alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In <jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com>, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped build.
Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
And *finally* there are chemical weapons in Iraq!
(Mission Accomplished!)
Brought and utilized by the US on the civilian population.
Well, Bush *said there were WMDs in Iraq didn't he? He didn't necessarily
say *whose WMDs...
Well, we did give him the first batch. We figured the Iraqi could use
some more. (But we didn't say how we would deliver them.)
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
.
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| User: "stoney" |
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| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
20 Nov 2005 11:03:38 AM |
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On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 14:43:09 -0600, "Mark K. Bilbo"
<alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In <9toun1l991ununsrn37cgisi07otkg9jum@4ax.com>, stoney <stoney@the.net>
wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 10:35:19 -0600, "Mark K. Bilbo"
<alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In <jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com>, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped build.
Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
And *finally* there are chemical weapons in Iraq!
(Mission Accomplished!)
Brought and utilized by the US on the civilian population.
Well, Bush *said there were WMDs in Iraq didn't he? He didn't necessarily
say *whose WMDs...
Yes.
--
Contempt of Congress meter reading-offscale.
Hello, theocracy with a fundamentalist US Supreme
Court who will ensure church and state are joined
at the hip like clergy and altar boys.
America 1776-Jan 2001 RIP
"As democracy is perfected, the office of president
represents, more and more closely, the inner soul
of the people. On some great and glorious day the
plain folks of the land will reach their heart's
desire at last and the White House will be adorned
by a downright moron." --- H.L. Mencken (1880 - 1956)
Religion is the original war crime.
-Michelle Malkin (Feb 26, 2005)
.
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| User: "Fred Stone" |
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| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
19 Nov 2005 08:38:00 AM |
|
|
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped
build. Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
But now it's against the law in fact as well as in principle.
CNN isn't covering up the story to keep "access".
And there are people in the government who are outraged at the
discovery and who will take action against those who have perpetrated
this crime.
A weak government propped up by a foreign army of occupation.
A government which will be holding parliamentary elections in less than
a month. A government with its own army that is increasingly capable of
carrying out security missions.
Some
claimed that they deplored the torture, but I wonder how many
applauded it or may have even taken part in it.
That's nothing more than rank cynicism on your part.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
"I actually think what we learned during the inspection
made Iraq a more dangerous place, potentially, than,
in fact, we thought it was even before the war." -- David Kay
http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=6075
.
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| User: "johac" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
20 Nov 2005 01:00:40 AM |
|
|
In article <Xns971362227976Ffstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped
build. Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
But now it's against the law in fact as well as in principle.
Until it happens again.
CNN isn't covering up the story to keep "access".
And there are people in the government who are outraged at the
discovery and who will take action against those who have perpetrated
this crime.
A weak government propped up by a foreign army of occupation.
A government which will be holding parliamentary elections in less than
a month. A government with its own army that is increasingly capable of
carrying out security missions.
49 Iraqis killed today. Where was the Iraqi army?
Some
claimed that they deplored the torture, but I wonder how many
applauded it or may have even taken part in it.
That's nothing more than rank cynicism on your part.
I prefer realism. I wish our government would get some.
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
.
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| User: "Walter Bushell" |
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| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
10 Dec 2005 01:13:17 AM |
|
|
In article <jhachm-3497F9.23004019112005@news.giganews.com>,
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
<snip>
I prefer realism. I wish our government would get some.
The House Committee on Unamerican Activities will be contacting you
shortly.
--
"The power of the Executive to cast a man into prison without formulating any
charge known to the law, and particularly to deny him the judgement of his
peers, is in the highest degree odious and is the foundation of all totali-
tarian government whether Nazi or Communist." -- W. Churchill, Nov 21, 1943
.
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| User: "johac" |
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| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
11 Dec 2005 11:05:29 PM |
|
|
In article <proto-8B552D.02131710122005@reader2.panix.com>,
Walter Bushell <proto@panix.com> wrote:
In article <jhachm-3497F9.23004019112005@news.giganews.com>,
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
<snip>
I prefer realism. I wish our government would get some.
The House Committee on Unamerican Activities will be contacting you
shortly.
I always wanted to see Cuba, or Poland, or Romania.
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
Contact - Throw a .net over the .com
.
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| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
20 Nov 2005 10:22:55 AM |
|
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johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-3497F9.23004019112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns971362227976Ffstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped
build. Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
But now it's against the law in fact as well as in principle.
Until it happens again.
No, if it happens again it'll still be against the law in fact as well
as in principle, and the perpetrators will be found and punished.
CNN isn't covering up the story to keep "access".
And there are people in the government who are outraged at the
discovery and who will take action against those who have
perpetrated this crime.
A weak government propped up by a foreign army of occupation.
A government which will be holding parliamentary elections in less
than a month. A government with its own army that is increasingly
capable of carrying out security missions.
49 Iraqis killed today. Where was the Iraqi army?
Oh, dear, another one got through, I guess we better abandon the whole
country to the terrorists so that they can *all* get through. That'll
make us a *WHOLE LOT* safer.
Some
claimed that they deplored the torture, but I wonder how many
applauded it or may have even taken part in it.
That's nothing more than rank cynicism on your part.
I prefer realism. I wish our government would get some.
You say that you prefer realism but you indulge in paranoid fantasies.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
"I actually think what we learned during the inspection
made Iraq a more dangerous place, potentially, than,
in fact, we thought it was even before the war." -- David Kay
http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=6075
.
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|
| User: "johac" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
20 Nov 2005 05:31:51 PM |
|
|
In article <Xns971473ECDED3Afstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-3497F9.23004019112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns971362227976Ffstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped
build. Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
But now it's against the law in fact as well as in principle.
Until it happens again.
No, if it happens again it'll still be against the law in fact as well
as in principle, and the perpetrators will be found and punished.
Maybe, maybe not.
CNN isn't covering up the story to keep "access".
And there are people in the government who are outraged at the
discovery and who will take action against those who have
perpetrated this crime.
A weak government propped up by a foreign army of occupation.
A government which will be holding parliamentary elections in less
than a month. A government with its own army that is increasingly
capable of carrying out security missions.
49 Iraqis killed today. Where was the Iraqi army?
Oh, dear, another one got through, I guess we better abandon the whole
country to the terrorists so that they can *all* get through. That'll
make us a *WHOLE LOT* safer.
So you agree with Rep. Murtha.
Some
claimed that they deplored the torture, but I wonder how many
applauded it or may have even taken part in it.
That's nothing more than rank cynicism on your part.
I prefer realism. I wish our government would get some.
You say that you prefer realism but you indulge in paranoid fantasies.
I'm not the one who believes Bush's lies.
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
.
|
|
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| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
20 Nov 2005 05:50:00 PM |
|
|
In <jhachm-B7384E.15315120112005@news.giganews.com>, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <Xns971473ECDED3Afstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-3497F9.23004019112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns971362227976Ffstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped
build. Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
But now it's against the law in fact as well as in principle.
Until it happens again.
No, if it happens again it'll still be against the law in fact as well
as in principle, and the perpetrators will be found and punished.
Maybe, maybe not.
CNN isn't covering up the story to keep "access". And there are
people in the government who are outraged at the discovery and who
will take action against those who have perpetrated this crime.
A weak government propped up by a foreign army of occupation.
A government which will be holding parliamentary elections in less
than a month. A government with its own army that is increasingly
capable of carrying out security missions.
49 Iraqis killed today. Where was the Iraqi army?
Oh, dear, another one got through, I guess we better abandon the whole
country to the terrorists so that they can *all* get through. That'll
make us a *WHOLE LOT* safer.
So you agree with Rep. Murtha.
Some
claimed that they deplored the torture, but I wonder how many
applauded it or may have even taken part in it.
That's nothing more than rank cynicism on your part.
I prefer realism. I wish our government would get some.
You say that you prefer realism but you indulge in paranoid fantasies.
I'm not the one who believes Bush's lies.
Funny that nobody's picked up on the idea that one reason the new Iraqi
government has *not gotten its act together is "let the Americans do it."
Why should they bother? We're there to pick up the pieces, they can sit
around, waste time, embezzle funds, play political whiffle ball, hell,
watch TV. With a "until it's done" deadline, what's the incentive?
They need to be told "here's the start of the withdrawal, here's the end."
If they start whining "but the insurgents'll get us!" then we say "then
you better get your butt in gear huh?"
--
Mark K. Bilbo
--------------------------------------------------
Forgotten Already
http://makeashorterlink.com/?H1233272C
Feds are treating Louisiana like enemy
"...it may be that they may have written us off."
http://makeashorterlink.com/?O21E51C1C
http://www.nola.com
.
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| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
20 Nov 2005 07:12:28 PM |
|
|
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote in
news:74ydnTsEIJgtlhzenZ2dnUVZ_sOdnZ2d@megapath.net:
In <jhachm-B7384E.15315120112005@news.giganews.com>, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <Xns971473ECDED3Afstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-3497F9.23004019112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns971362227976Ffstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we
helped build. Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
But now it's against the law in fact as well as in principle.
Until it happens again.
No, if it happens again it'll still be against the law in fact as
well as in principle, and the perpetrators will be found and
punished.
Maybe, maybe not.
CNN isn't covering up the story to keep "access". And there
are people in the government who are outraged at the discovery
and who will take action against those who have perpetrated
this crime.
A weak government propped up by a foreign army of occupation.
A government which will be holding parliamentary elections in
less than a month. A government with its own army that is
increasingly capable of carrying out security missions.
49 Iraqis killed today. Where was the Iraqi army?
Oh, dear, another one got through, I guess we better abandon the
whole country to the terrorists so that they can *all* get through.
That'll make us a *WHOLE LOT* safer.
So you agree with Rep. Murtha.
Some
claimed that they deplored the torture, but I wonder how many
applauded it or may have even taken part in it.
That's nothing more than rank cynicism on your part.
I prefer realism. I wish our government would get some.
You say that you prefer realism but you indulge in paranoid
fantasies.
I'm not the one who believes Bush's lies.
Funny that nobody's picked up on the idea that one reason the new
Iraqi government has *not gotten its act together is "let the
Americans do it."
You're not really paying attention to the news from Iraq, are you?
Why should they bother? We're there to pick up the pieces, they can
sit around, waste time, embezzle funds, play political whiffle ball,
hell, watch TV. With a "until it's done" deadline, what's the
incentive?
They want us gone as much as we want to be gone.
They need to be told "here's the start of the withdrawal, here's the
end." If they start whining "but the insurgents'll get us!" then we
say "then you better get your butt in gear huh?"
If the Iraqis know that we'll pull out before their own forces are
sufficiently trained, what incentive do they have to stick their necks
out and support the government that they know will break down
immediately after we leave?
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
"I actually think what we learned during the inspection
made Iraq a more dangerous place, potentially, than,
in fact, we thought it was even before the war." -- David Kay
http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=6075
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "johac" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
22 Nov 2005 12:19:48 AM |
|
|
In article <74ydnTsEIJgtlhzenZ2dnUVZ_sOdnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In <jhachm-B7384E.15315120112005@news.giganews.com>, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <Xns971473ECDED3Afstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-3497F9.23004019112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns971362227976Ffstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped
build. Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
But now it's against the law in fact as well as in principle.
Until it happens again.
No, if it happens again it'll still be against the law in fact as well
as in principle, and the perpetrators will be found and punished.
Maybe, maybe not.
CNN isn't covering up the story to keep "access". And there are
people in the government who are outraged at the discovery and who
will take action against those who have perpetrated this crime.
A weak government propped up by a foreign army of occupation.
A government which will be holding parliamentary elections in less
than a month. A government with its own army that is increasingly
capable of carrying out security missions.
49 Iraqis killed today. Where was the Iraqi army?
Oh, dear, another one got through, I guess we better abandon the whole
country to the terrorists so that they can *all* get through. That'll
make us a *WHOLE LOT* safer.
So you agree with Rep. Murtha.
Some
claimed that they deplored the torture, but I wonder how many
applauded it or may have even taken part in it.
That's nothing more than rank cynicism on your part.
I prefer realism. I wish our government would get some.
You say that you prefer realism but you indulge in paranoid fantasies.
I'm not the one who believes Bush's lies.
Funny that nobody's picked up on the idea that one reason the new Iraqi
government has *not gotten its act together is "let the Americans do it."
Actually, I was thinking about the same thing today. With the Americans
there, the Iraqi government has a lot less incentive to fight. When the
going gets tough, call in the Yanks.
Why should they bother? We're there to pick up the pieces, they can sit
around, waste time, embezzle funds, play political whiffle ball, hell,
watch TV. With a "until it's done" deadline, what's the incentive?
And collaborate with the likes of Halliburton, Bechtel, et al. to steal
even more.
They need to be told "here's the start of the withdrawal, here's the end."
If they start whining "but the insurgents'll get us!" then we say "then
you better get your butt in gear huh?"
That might accomplish two things. Not only would it make them shape up
their army, but it might force them to look long and hard at the
prospect of a long and bloody civil war, and perhaps come to some
agreement with the insurgents.
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
.
|
|
|
| User: "Mark K. Bilbo" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
22 Nov 2005 08:23:41 AM |
|
|
In <jhachm-0E4A62.22194821112005@news.giganews.com>, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <74ydnTsEIJgtlhzenZ2dnUVZ_sOdnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In <jhachm-B7384E.15315120112005@news.giganews.com>, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <Xns971473ECDED3Afstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-3497F9.23004019112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns971362227976Ffstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped
build. Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
But now it's against the law in fact as well as in principle.
Until it happens again.
No, if it happens again it'll still be against the law in fact as
well as in principle, and the perpetrators will be found and
punished.
Maybe, maybe not.
CNN isn't covering up the story to keep "access". And there are
people in the government who are outraged at the discovery and
who will take action against those who have perpetrated this
crime.
A weak government propped up by a foreign army of occupation.
A government which will be holding parliamentary elections in less
than a month. A government with its own army that is increasingly
capable of carrying out security missions.
49 Iraqis killed today. Where was the Iraqi army?
Oh, dear, another one got through, I guess we better abandon the
whole country to the terrorists so that they can *all* get through.
That'll make us a *WHOLE LOT* safer.
So you agree with Rep. Murtha.
Some
claimed that they deplored the torture, but I wonder how many
applauded it or may have even taken part in it.
That's nothing more than rank cynicism on your part.
I prefer realism. I wish our government would get some.
You say that you prefer realism but you indulge in paranoid
fantasies.
I'm not the one who believes Bush's lies.
Funny that nobody's picked up on the idea that one reason the new Iraqi
government has *not gotten its act together is "let the Americans do
it."
Actually, I was thinking about the same thing today. With the Americans
there, the Iraqi government has a lot less incentive to fight. When the
going gets tough, call in the Yanks.
Why should they bother? We're there to pick up the pieces, they can sit
around, waste time, embezzle funds, play political whiffle ball, hell,
watch TV. With a "until it's done" deadline, what's the incentive?
And collaborate with the likes of Halliburton, Bechtel, et al. to steal
even more.
They need to be told "here's the start of the withdrawal, here's the
end." If they start whining "but the insurgents'll get us!" then we say
"then you better get your butt in gear huh?"
That might accomplish two things. Not only would it make them shape up
their army, but it might force them to look long and hard at the prospect
of a long and bloody civil war, and perhaps come to some agreement with
the insurgents.
That's what I'm thinking. Right now, they're not being allowed to fail. So
why should they care? It's like never letting a child fail, they never
grow up. Without the threat of failure (civil war), they can indulge in
petty squabbles, vindictive games, corruption, you name it.
With a bloody, deadly, "your kids'll die" civil war staring them down,
they'd have incentive to figure out how to get along...
--
Mark K. Bilbo
--------------------------------------------------
Forgotten Already
http://makeashorterlink.com/?H1233272C
Feds are treating Louisiana like enemy
"...it may be that they may have written us off."
http://makeashorterlink.com/?O21E51C1C
http://www.nola.com
.
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
22 Nov 2005 09:01:08 AM |
|
|
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote in
news:MfudnfULPI5ttB7eRVn-pg@megapath.net:
That's what I'm thinking. Right now, they're not being allowed to
fail. So why should they care? It's like never letting a child fail,
they never grow up. Without the threat of failure (civil war), they
can indulge in petty squabbles, vindictive games, corruption, you name
it.
Nice excuse for the fact that you want them to fail.
With a bloody, deadly, "your kids'll die" civil war staring them down,
they'd have incentive to figure out how to get along...
Or they'd just start the mass slaughter.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
"I actually think what we learned during the inspection
made Iraq a more dangerous place, potentially, than,
in fact, we thought it was even before the war." -- David Kay
http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=6075
.
|
|
|
|
| User: "johac" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
22 Nov 2005 11:53:37 PM |
|
|
In article <MfudnfULPI5ttB7eRVn-pg@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In <jhachm-0E4A62.22194821112005@news.giganews.com>, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <74ydnTsEIJgtlhzenZ2dnUVZ_sOdnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In <jhachm-B7384E.15315120112005@news.giganews.com>, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <Xns971473ECDED3Afstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-3497F9.23004019112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns971362227976Ffstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we helped
build. Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
But now it's against the law in fact as well as in principle.
Until it happens again.
No, if it happens again it'll still be against the law in fact as
well as in principle, and the perpetrators will be found and
punished.
Maybe, maybe not.
CNN isn't covering up the story to keep "access". And there are
people in the government who are outraged at the discovery and
who will take action against those who have perpetrated this
crime.
A weak government propped up by a foreign army of occupation.
A government which will be holding parliamentary elections in less
than a month. A government with its own army that is increasingly
capable of carrying out security missions.
49 Iraqis killed today. Where was the Iraqi army?
Oh, dear, another one got through, I guess we better abandon the
whole country to the terrorists so that they can *all* get through.
That'll make us a *WHOLE LOT* safer.
So you agree with Rep. Murtha.
Some
claimed that they deplored the torture, but I wonder how many
applauded it or may have even taken part in it.
That's nothing more than rank cynicism on your part.
I prefer realism. I wish our government would get some.
You say that you prefer realism but you indulge in paranoid
fantasies.
I'm not the one who believes Bush's lies.
Funny that nobody's picked up on the idea that one reason the new Iraqi
government has *not gotten its act together is "let the Americans do
it."
Actually, I was thinking about the same thing today. With the Americans
there, the Iraqi government has a lot less incentive to fight. When the
going gets tough, call in the Yanks.
Why should they bother? We're there to pick up the pieces, they can sit
around, waste time, embezzle funds, play political whiffle ball, hell,
watch TV. With a "until it's done" deadline, what's the incentive?
And collaborate with the likes of Halliburton, Bechtel, et al. to steal
even more.
They need to be told "here's the start of the withdrawal, here's the
end." If they start whining "but the insurgents'll get us!" then we say
"then you better get your butt in gear huh?"
That might accomplish two things. Not only would it make them shape up
their army, but it might force them to look long and hard at the prospect
of a long and bloody civil war, and perhaps come to some agreement with
the insurgents.
That's what I'm thinking. Right now, they're not being allowed to fail. So
why should they care? It's like never letting a child fail, they never
grow up. Without the threat of failure (civil war), they can indulge in
petty squabbles, vindictive games, corruption, you name it.
Exactly.
With a bloody, deadly, "your kids'll die" civil war staring them down,
they'd have incentive to figure out how to get along...
What's that about the imminence of hanging focuses the mind?
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
.
|
|
|
|
|
| User: "Fred Stone" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
22 Nov 2005 07:06:30 AM |
|
|
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-0E4A62.22194821112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <74ydnTsEIJgtlhzenZ2dnUVZ_sOdnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In <jhachm-B7384E.15315120112005@news.giganews.com>, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <Xns971473ECDED3Afstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-3497F9.23004019112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns971362227976Ffstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article
<6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we
helped build. Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
But now it's against the law in fact as well as in principle.
Until it happens again.
No, if it happens again it'll still be against the law in fact as
well as in principle, and the perpetrators will be found and
punished.
Maybe, maybe not.
CNN isn't covering up the story to keep "access". And there
are people in the government who are outraged at the
discovery and who will take action against those who have
perpetrated this crime.
A weak government propped up by a foreign army of occupation.
A government which will be holding parliamentary elections in
less than a month. A government with its own army that is
increasingly capable of carrying out security missions.
49 Iraqis killed today. Where was the Iraqi army?
Oh, dear, another one got through, I guess we better abandon the
whole country to the terrorists so that they can *all* get
through. That'll make us a *WHOLE LOT* safer.
So you agree with Rep. Murtha.
Some
claimed that they deplored the torture, but I wonder how many
applauded it or may have even taken part in it.
That's nothing more than rank cynicism on your part.
I prefer realism. I wish our government would get some.
You say that you prefer realism but you indulge in paranoid
fantasies.
I'm not the one who believes Bush's lies.
Funny that nobody's picked up on the idea that one reason the new
Iraqi government has *not gotten its act together is "let the
Americans do it."
Actually, I was thinking about the same thing today. With the
Americans there, the Iraqi government has a lot less incentive to
fight. When the going gets tough, call in the Yanks.
As recently as a few months ago Democrats were telling us how we needed
to send more troops. Now that the final round of elections are near, and
bound to succeed, they're demanding a pullout. I bet they'll be claiming
credit for any withdrawals when they happen after the election in
December.
Why should they bother? We're there to pick up the pieces, they can
sit around, waste time, embezzle funds, play political whiffle ball,
hell, watch TV. With a "until it's done" deadline, what's the
incentive?
And collaborate with the likes of Halliburton, Bechtel, et al. to
steal even more.
They need to be told "here's the start of the withdrawal, here's the
end." If they start whining "but the insurgents'll get us!" then we
say "then you better get your butt in gear huh?"
That might accomplish two things. Not only would it make them shape up
their army, but it might force them to look long and hard at the
prospect of a long and bloody civil war, and perhaps come to some
agreement with the insurgents.
Which gives the victory to the terrorists.
--
Fred Stone
aa# 1369
"I actually think what we learned during the inspection
made Iraq a more dangerous place, potentially, than,
in fact, we thought it was even before the war." -- David Kay
http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=6075
.
|
|
|
| User: "johac" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
22 Nov 2005 11:54:25 PM |
|
|
In article <Xns9716529E5E73Bfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-0E4A62.22194821112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <74ydnTsEIJgtlhzenZ2dnUVZ_sOdnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In <jhachm-B7384E.15315120112005@news.giganews.com>, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <Xns971473ECDED3Afstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-3497F9.23004019112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns971362227976Ffstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article
<6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture chambers in the "new" Iraq. The "new" Iraq we
helped build. Doesn't it just make you swell with pride?
Saddam is in jail but what else has changed?
Quite a bit, actually.
People are still being murdered and tortured.
But now it's against the law in fact as well as in principle.
Until it happens again.
No, if it happens again it'll still be against the law in fact as
well as in principle, and the perpetrators will be found and
punished.
Maybe, maybe not.
CNN isn't covering up the story to keep "access". And there
are people in the government who are outraged at the
discovery and who will take action against those who have
perpetrated this crime.
A weak government propped up by a foreign army of occupation.
A government which will be holding parliamentary elections in
less than a month. A government with its own army that is
increasingly capable of carrying out security missions.
49 Iraqis killed today. Where was the Iraqi army?
Oh, dear, another one got through, I guess we better abandon the
whole country to the terrorists so that they can *all* get
through. That'll make us a *WHOLE LOT* safer.
So you agree with Rep. Murtha.
Some
claimed that they deplored the torture, but I wonder how many
applauded it or may have even taken part in it.
That's nothing more than rank cynicism on your part.
I prefer realism. I wish our government would get some.
You say that you prefer realism but you indulge in paranoid
fantasies.
I'm not the one who believes Bush's lies.
Funny that nobody's picked up on the idea that one reason the new
Iraqi government has *not gotten its act together is "let the
Americans do it."
Actually, I was thinking about the same thing today. With the
Americans there, the Iraqi government has a lot less incentive to
fight. When the going gets tough, call in the Yanks.
As recently as a few months ago Democrats were telling us how we needed
to send more troops. Now that the final round of elections are near, and
bound to succeed, they're demanding a pullout. I bet they'll be claiming
credit for any withdrawals when they happen after the election in
December.
Why should they bother? We're there to pick up the pieces, they can
sit around, waste time, embezzle funds, play political whiffle ball,
hell, watch TV. With a "until it's done" deadline, what's the
incentive?
And collaborate with the likes of Halliburton, Bechtel, et al. to
steal even more.
They need to be told "here's the start of the withdrawal, here's the
end." If they start whining "but the insurgents'll get us!" then we
say "then you better get your butt in gear huh?"
That might accomplish two things. Not only would it make them shape up
their army, but it might force them to look long and hard at the
prospect of a long and bloody civil war, and perhaps come to some
agreement with the insurgents.
Which gives the victory to the terrorists.
You make the false assumption that every insurgent is a terrorist.
--
John Hachmann aa #1782
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities"
-Voltaire
.
|
|
|
| User: "stoney" |
|
| Title: Re: OT: Oh I so proud... |
23 Nov 2005 12:25:51 PM |
|
|
On Tue, 22 Nov 2005 21:54:25 -0800, johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com>
wrote:
In article <Xns9716529E5E73Bfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-0E4A62.22194821112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <74ydnTsEIJgtlhzenZ2dnUVZ_sOdnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
In <jhachm-B7384E.15315120112005@news.giganews.com>, johac
<jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote:
In article <Xns971473ECDED3Afstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-3497F9.23004019112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns971362227976Ffstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-1BF305.00053219112005@news.giganews.com:
In article <Xns97114C12EE5BCfstone69@213.155.197.138>,
Fred Stone <fstone69@earthling.com> wrote:
johac <jhachm@ixpres.remove.com> wrote in
news:jhachm-620483.22421716112005@news.giganews.com:
In article
<6v-dnaAcPL5U-ebenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@megapath.net>,
"Mark K. Bilbo" <alt-atheism@org.webmaster> wrote:
Torture | | | | | | | | | | | |
