Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations



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Topic: Religions > Atheism
User: "words of truth"
Date: 15 Nov 2005 02:23:48 PM
Object: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations
http://www.worldmag.com/world/issue/02-15-03/cultural_1.asp
http://forums.prolife.org.ph/yabbse/index.php?PHPSESSID=87094d4778b268132c3a0e41cac29b42&topic=321.msg568
Population implosion
Many nations are aborting their future generations, creating a
worldwide underpopulation crisis
By Gene Edward Veith
The president of Estonia goes on national TV to urge his countrymen to
have more children. Russian President Vladimir Putin warns his
parliament about "a serious crisis threatening Russia's survival": the
nation's low birth rate. The government of Singapore is trying to
reverse that country's birth dearth by sponsoring a massive
taxpayer-funded matchmaking service.
In 1968, Paul Ehrlich published The Population Bomb, panicking the
world with dire predictions of a population explosion. By the year
2000, he predicted, the world would be so crowded that hundreds of
millions would die of starvation. Although Mr. Ehrlich's prophecies
have turned out to be almost comically wrong, PBS has produced a
documentary taking him seriously, and philanthropists like Ted Turner
still donate millions to combat population growth.
But the problem today is not overpopulation; it's underpopulation. For
a population to reproduce itself, the fertility rate must average 2.1
children per woman. (The .1 allows for child mortality.) The fertility
rate today among major developed nations is only 1.6.
The United States is rare among its peers in keeping its fertility rate
at around the replacement level of 2.1, according to the Population
Reference Bureau, which provided the fertility data cited here. Europe,
though, is shrinking. Germany's rate is 1.3. Despite the stereotype of
large Catholic families, France has a fertility rate of 1.9 and Italy
has one of the lowest in Europe, 1.3. At this rate, there will be only
about half as many Italians in the next generation. There will also be
fewer Russians, whose fertility rate is 1.3.
Even nations that were once notorious for booming populations have
drastically slowed down in reproducing themselves. In the last 20
years, India's fertility rate has gone from over four children per
woman to about three. Mexico has gone from over four to just under
three. China has a fertility rate of 1.8.
African nations continue to have very high fertility rates, up to five
or six children per woman, but those lands are ravaged by AIDS, which
is decimating their population. Muslim nations, on the other hand, tend
to have booming population growth-Yemen's fertility rate is 7.2
children per woman.
Demographers predict that the world's population will level off at 9
billion, reports The Wall Street Journal. Then it will start dropping.
There may well be nearly 500 million fewer people by 2075.
Isn't this a good thing? Why are so many governments panicking at the
drop in their populations?
Although radical environmentalists like Mr. Ehrlich see human beings
only as "consumers of the earth's resources," human beings are in fact
the most valuable resource of all. Citizens are not just consumers but
producers. Having fewer people can wreak havoc on an economy, creating
both a labor shortage and a shortage of buyers. A government with a
shrinking population faces a smaller military and fewer taxpayers.
Dwindling populations have always signaled cultural decline, with less
creativity, energy, and vitality on every level of society.
Already Japan- fertility rate 1.3-is facing the problem of having
fewer taxpaying young people to support the burgeoning number of
retirees, something that will hit the generous welfare states of Europe
especially hard.
Already Europe has had to import large numbers of immigrants to bolster
the labor force, most of them from the Middle East. Fewer and fewer
native Europeans-along with the dwindling influence of
Christianity-and more and more Muslims raise the prospect of the
Islamification of Western Europe. One reason "old Europe" is not
supporting the United States in a war with Iraq is that politicians in
France and Germany fear the reaction among their Muslim voters.
Why the population decline? The worldwide collapse of what are,
literally, family values. Thanks to contraceptive technology, sex has
become separated from childbearing. With women pursuing careers of
their own and men getting sex without the responsibilities of marriage,
why bother with children? For many women and men, pregnancy has become
an unpleasant side effect, something to prevent with contraceptives or
easily treat with a trip to the abortion clinic.
The dirty little secret of the population implosion, one seldom
mentioned by demographers, is that the world is aborting its future
generations. China has shrunk its fertility rate by its cruel policy of
forced abortion. (The website of the International Planned Parenthood
Federation has only good things to say about China and does not even
mention how the government coerces women to have abortions. So much for
"choice.")
In the United States, abortion ends between one-third and one-fifth of
all pregnancies, and the U.S. abortion rate is relatively low. In
Russia, the average woman may have as many as four abortions in her
lifetime. There are two abortions for every live birth. That is to say,
Russians kill two-thirds of their children before they are born. That,
Mr. Putin, is the "serious crisis threatening Russia's survival."
.

User: "Peacenik"

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 15 Nov 2005 07:59:24 PM
"words of truth" <wordsoftruth@hoshmail.com> wrote in message
news:1132086228.580772.60120@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...


http://www.worldmag.com/world/issue/02-15-03/cultural_1.asp


http://forums.prolife.org.ph/yabbse/index.php?PHPSESSID=87094d4778b268132c3a0e41cac29b42&topic=321.msg568



Population implosion

Many nations are aborting their future generations, creating a
worldwide underpopulation crisis

There are too many people on the planet. Since it would be unthinkably evil
to kill people, the way to solve the problem is to lower the birth rate.
Contaception, education and abortion are all vital in this task.
.
User: "Robert J. Kolker"

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 16 Nov 2005 04:09:20 AM
Peacenik wrote:


There are too many people on the planet. Since it would be unthinkably evil
to kill people,

Why? We cull our herds, why not purge the hive? You are letting ethics
get in the way of clear thinking.
Bob Kolker
.
User: ""

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 16 Nov 2005 06:20:26 PM

There are too many people on the planet. Since it would be unthinkably evil
to kill people,

Why? We cull our herds, why not purge the hive? You are letting ethics
get in the way of clear thinking.

Ethics tends to be there for a reason. In this case, one reason is
that there's a big investment in raising children, around half of that
being pregnancy, and there's a matching payoff but it comes much later,
mostly during adulthood. If you kill already-born people, the
investment that we've already made yields no payoff.
Culling herds. What type of herd? For things we eat, there's a
benefit to killing, namely we get to eat it, and there's no
corresponding benefit to killing people. (I don't think cannibalism
will catch on, and even if it did, I doubt long pig would fetch a price
high enough to offset the cost of pregnancy and child rearing.)
.
User: "T.V."

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 16 Nov 2005 06:26:49 PM
<bob_jenkins@burtleburtle.net> wrote in message
news:1132186826.232555.134420@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...

There are too many people on the planet. Since it would be unthinkably
evil
to kill people,


Why? We cull our herds, why not purge the hive? You are letting ethics
get in the way of clear thinking.


Ethics tends to be there for a reason. In this case, one reason is
that there's a big investment in raising children, around half of that
being pregnancy, and there's a matching payoff but it comes much later,
mostly during adulthood. If you kill already-born people, the
investment that we've already made yields no payoff.

Culling herds. What type of herd? For things we eat, there's a
benefit to killing, namely we get to eat it, and there's no
corresponding benefit to killing people. (I don't think cannibalism
will catch on, and even if it did, I doubt long pig would fetch a price
high enough to offset the cost of pregnancy and child rearing.)

HALF of it being pregnancy????


.

User: "Robert J. Kolker"

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 16 Nov 2005 06:23:07 PM
wrote:


Culling herds. What type of herd? For things we eat, there's a
benefit to killing, namely we get to eat it, and there's no
corresponding benefit to killing people.

Get rid of nuisances is a benefit. Call it pest control.
The death of a Moslem in nowise diminishes my life.
Bob Kolker
.




User: "DaveJr"

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 15 Nov 2005 05:40:32 PM
GOOD! There are too many damn people on this rock anyways! Perhaps the
fundies will not be happy untill we are all jam packed everywhere, all of
our resources are completely drained, and the atmosphere is so jacked up
that it can no longer support life at all. For future generations ofcourse
huh!?!
.

User: "*nemo*"

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 15 Nov 2005 09:22:48 PM
In article <1132086228.580772.60120@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
"words of truth" <wordsoftruth@hoshmail.com> wrote:

Population implosion

Many nations are aborting their future generations, creating a
worldwide underpopulation crisis

You have no use for reality, do you?
--
Nemo - EAC Commissioner for Bible Belt Underwater Operations.
Atheist #1331 (the Palindrome of doom!)
BAAWA Knight! - One of those warm Southern Knights, y'all!
Charter member, SMASH!!
http://home.earthlink.net/~jehdjh/Relpg.html
Draco Dormiens Nunquam Titillandus
Quotemeister since March 2002
.
User: "Therion Ware"

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 16 Nov 2005 02:44:43 AM
On Wed, 16 Nov 2005 03:22:48 GMT in alt.atheism, *nemo* (*nemo*
<nemo0037@earthlink.dieSPAM.net>) said, directing the reply to
alt.atheism

In article <1132086228.580772.60120@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
"words of truth" <wordsoftruth@hoshmail.com> wrote:

Population implosion

Many nations are aborting their future generations, creating a
worldwide underpopulation crisis


You have no use for reality, do you?

Interestingly Italy, that home of Roman Catholicism has one of the
lowest birth rates in Europe, which suggest that either the Italians
are extremely - erm - continent, or at least some Roman Catholic
teaching is taken with a pinch of salt.
--
"Do Unto Others As You Would Have Them Do Unto You."
- Attrib: Pauline Reage.
#442. www.video2cd.co.uk. Your 8mm films on DVD.
.
User: ""

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 21 Nov 2005 11:37:50 PM

Interestingly Italy, that home of Roman Catholicism has one of the
lowest birth rates in Europe, which suggest that either the Italians
are extremely - erm - continent, or at least some Roman Catholic
teaching is taken with a pinch of salt.

Or maybe italian clothes don't protect testicles from fertility-killing
cellphones in the pockets, and so infertility is superhigh.
.


User: "2069 Dead"

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 15 Nov 2005 11:06:02 PM
On Wed, 16 Nov 2005 03:22:48 GMT, *nemo*
<nemo0037@earthlink.dieSPAM.net> wrote:

In article <1132086228.580772.60120@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
"words of truth" <wordsoftruth@hoshmail.com> wrote:

Population implosion

Many nations are aborting their future generations, creating a
worldwide underpopulation crisis


You have no use for reality, do you?

"a worldwide underpopulation crisis"
Is that really what I'm reading?
My monitor hasn't gone on the blink or something?
You know, that's gotta set a record of some sort or another.
--
"'I’m not meeting with that goddamned *****,' Bush screamed at aides
who suggested he meet with Cindy Sheehan, the war-protesting mother
whose son died in Iraq. 'She can go to hell as far as I’m concerned!'"
--Putsch, a decompensating drunk
"Grover Norquist couldn't drown the government, so he drowned New Orleans instead."
Not dead, in jail, or a slave? Thank a liberal!
Pay your taxes so the rich don't have to.
For the finest in liberal/leftist commentary,
http://www.zeppscommentaries.com
For news feed (free, 10-20 articles a day)
http://groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/zepps_news
For essays (donations accepted, 2 articles/week)
http://groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/zepps_essays
a.a. #2211 -- Bryan Zepp Jamieson
.


User: "Attila"

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 15 Nov 2005 04:05:15 PM
On 15 Nov 2005 12:23:48 -0800, "words of truth"
<wordsoftruth@hoshmail.com> in alt.abortion with message-id
<1132086228.580772.60120@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> wrote:
Absolute nonsense. Come back when humans are an endangered species.
.

User: "satyr"

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 16 Nov 2005 12:36:22 AM
On 15 Nov 2005 12:23:48 -0800, "words of truth"
<wordsoftruth@hoshmail.com> wrote:


http://www.worldmag.com/world/issue/02-15-03/cultural_1.asp

http://forums.prolife.org.ph/yabbse/index.php?PHPSESSID=87094d4778b268132c3a0e41cac29b42&topic=321.msg568


Population implosion

Many nations are aborting their future generations, creating a
worldwide underpopulation crisis

By Gene Edward Veith

The president of Estonia goes on national TV to urge his countrymen to
have more children. Russian President Vladimir Putin warns his
parliament about "a serious crisis threatening Russia's survival": the
nation's low birth rate. The government of Singapore is trying to
reverse that country's birth dearth by sponsoring a massive
taxpayer-funded matchmaking service.

And con men keep trying to attract new suckers into the pyramid. What
is your point?

The United States is rare among its peers in keeping its fertility rate
at around the replacement level of 2.1, according to the Population
Reference Bureau, which provided the fertility data cited here. Europe,
though, is shrinking. Germany's rate is 1.3. Despite the stereotype of
large Catholic families, France has a fertility rate of 1.9 and Italy
has one of the lowest in Europe, 1.3. At this rate, there will be only
about half as many Italians in the next generation. There will also be
fewer Russians, whose fertility rate is 1.3.

Even nations that were once notorious for booming populations have
drastically slowed down in reproducing themselves. In the last 20
years, India's fertility rate has gone from over four children per
woman to about three. Mexico has gone from over four to just under
three. China has a fertility rate of 1.8.

African nations continue to have very high fertility rates, up to five
or six children per woman, but those lands are ravaged by AIDS, which
is decimating their population. Muslim nations, on the other hand, tend
to have booming population growth-Yemen's fertility rate is 7.2
children per woman.

So that is a bright spot, yes?
What is the problem? India has a billion people and even after
compensating for China's slightly lower than replacement rate of
baby-making, it still more than covers the deficit in Germany, France,
Italy and Russia.

Demographers predict that the world's population will level off at 9
billion, reports The Wall Street Journal. Then it will start dropping.
There may well be nearly 500 million fewer people by 2075.

Isn't this a good thing? Why are so many governments panicking at the
drop in their populations?

Because they have made themselves dependent on continued economic
growth and that is hard to maintain if your population is shrinking.
The solution is to work the economy so that you can enjoy prosperity
even as the economy contracts. But that's hard to do. It's a lot
easier to promote baby-making (but not necessarily easier to convince
the population.)

Although radical environmentalists like Mr. Ehrlich see human beings
only as "consumers of the earth's resources," human beings are in fact
the most valuable resource of all. Citizens are not just consumers but
producers. Having fewer people can wreak havoc on an economy, creating
both a labor shortage and a shortage of buyers.

Kind of puzzling how you can have both. This is like saying that
there aren't enough workers to make all the products for all the
people who aren't there to buy them. The US had a lot fewer workers
in the 1950s and a lot fewer buyers, but that didn't seem to hurt the
economy then. Why would it cause a problem if our population shrunk
back to that size?

A government with a
shrinking population faces a smaller military and fewer taxpayers.

And fewer people who need services. Our population was a lot smaller
in the 1940s, but I seem to recall that we had a large military back
then.

Dwindling populations have always signaled cultural decline, with less
creativity, energy, and vitality on every level of society.

Really? Historically, when have populations dwindled? During the
Black Death? That might explain the lack of vitality.

Already Japan- fertility rate 1.3-is facing the problem of having
fewer taxpaying young people to support the burgeoning number of
retirees, something that will hit the generous welfare states of Europe
especially hard.

Have you been to Japan recently? I have. One thing they don't need
is more people. There didn't seem to be any shortage of young people
either. The only lack of vitality I saw was in the large number of
homeless people resulting from housing being in short supply and very
expensive. More people will not help that.


Already Europe has had to import large numbers of immigrants to bolster
the labor force,

The US (with it's 2.1 baby per incubator ratio) has to import a lot of
labor also. And we also outsource a lot of work. I guess we are
lucky that Mexico and India are still cranking out little wage slaves.

most of them from the Middle East.
Fewer and fewer
native Europeans-along with the dwindling influence of
Christianity-and more and more Muslims raise the prospect of the
Islamification of Western Europe.

Wait, I thought we were talking about economic vitality. Suddenly it
all comes out that you are just a Christian Supremacist and the real
problem is the dearth of white, Christian babies.

One reason "old Europe" is not
supporting the United States in a war with Iraq is that politicians in
France and Germany fear the reaction among their Muslim voters.

Another reason is that the non-muslim population overwhelmingly thinks
we are idiots thanks to that clown in the White House. Yes, European
politicians feared the wrath of the overwhelming majority of their
populations who wanted them to stay the hell out of Iraq. Witness the
wisdom of a true democracy.

Why the population decline? The worldwide collapse of what are,
literally, family values. Thanks to contraceptive technology, sex has
become separated from childbearing. With women pursuing careers of
their own

Poof! There goes that labor shortage.

and men getting sex without the responsibilities of marriage,
why bother with children? For many women and men, pregnancy has become
an unpleasant side effect, something to prevent with contraceptives or
easily treat with a trip to the abortion clinic.

It's called "freedom." Look it up.

The dirty little secret of the population implosion, one seldom
mentioned by demographers, is that the world is aborting its future
generations. China has shrunk its fertility rate by its cruel policy of
forced abortion. (The website of the International Planned Parenthood
Federation has only good things to say about China and does not even
mention how the government coerces women to have abortions. So much for
"choice.")

Funny, I can't find much at all about China at the PPFA web site.

In the United States, abortion ends between one-third and one-fifth of
all pregnancies, and the U.S. abortion rate is relatively low. In
Russia, the average woman may have as many as four abortions in her
lifetime. There are two abortions for every live birth. That is to say,
Russians kill two-thirds of their children before they are born. That,
Mr. Putin, is the "serious crisis threatening Russia's survival."

I would suggest that we solve this problem (if it is a problem) by
providing economic and living conditions which make people want to
have babies rather than by forcing them to have babies they don't
want. In the US, we might start with a universal health care system.
After you get that going, we'll talk about abortion.
--
satyr #1953
Chairman, EAC Church Taxation Subcommittee
Director, Gideon Bible Alternative Fuel Project
Supervisor, EAC Fossil Casting Lab
.

User: "T.V."

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 15 Nov 2005 06:27:02 PM
Someone correct me if i am wrong...i am not in my "math mind" right now..but
if a generation produces 2 babies per couple, and then those two babies
produce more babies before the original couple is dead...does that not mean
that the original couple is actually respnsible for producing MORE than 2
babies in their lifetime?
And would that not create population growth?
Please, if you are a mathematician reading this, would you kindly sort this
out for me?
thx,
tv
"words of truth" <wordsoftruth@hoshmail.com> wrote in message
news:1132086228.580772.60120@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...


http://www.worldmag.com/world/issue/02-15-03/cultural_1.asp

http://forums.prolife.org.ph/yabbse/index.php?PHPSESSID=87094d4778b268132c3a0e41cac29b42&topic=321.msg568


Population implosion

Many nations are aborting their future generations, creating a
worldwide underpopulation crisis

By Gene Edward Veith

The president of Estonia goes on national TV to urge his countrymen to
have more children. Russian President Vladimir Putin warns his
parliament about "a serious crisis threatening Russia's survival": the
nation's low birth rate. The government of Singapore is trying to
reverse that country's birth dearth by sponsoring a massive
taxpayer-funded matchmaking service.

In 1968, Paul Ehrlich published The Population Bomb, panicking the
world with dire predictions of a population explosion. By the year
2000, he predicted, the world would be so crowded that hundreds of
millions would die of starvation. Although Mr. Ehrlich's prophecies
have turned out to be almost comically wrong, PBS has produced a
documentary taking him seriously, and philanthropists like Ted Turner
still donate millions to combat population growth.

But the problem today is not overpopulation; it's underpopulation. For
a population to reproduce itself, the fertility rate must average 2.1
children per woman. (The .1 allows for child mortality.) The fertility
rate today among major developed nations is only 1.6.

The United States is rare among its peers in keeping its fertility rate
at around the replacement level of 2.1, according to the Population
Reference Bureau, which provided the fertility data cited here. Europe,
though, is shrinking. Germany's rate is 1.3. Despite the stereotype of
large Catholic families, France has a fertility rate of 1.9 and Italy
has one of the lowest in Europe, 1.3. At this rate, there will be only
about half as many Italians in the next generation. There will also be
fewer Russians, whose fertility rate is 1.3.

Even nations that were once notorious for booming populations have
drastically slowed down in reproducing themselves. In the last 20
years, India's fertility rate has gone from over four children per
woman to about three. Mexico has gone from over four to just under
three. China has a fertility rate of 1.8.

African nations continue to have very high fertility rates, up to five
or six children per woman, but those lands are ravaged by AIDS, which
is decimating their population. Muslim nations, on the other hand, tend
to have booming population growth-Yemen's fertility rate is 7.2
children per woman.

Demographers predict that the world's population will level off at 9
billion, reports The Wall Street Journal. Then it will start dropping.
There may well be nearly 500 million fewer people by 2075.

Isn't this a good thing? Why are so many governments panicking at the
drop in their populations?

Although radical environmentalists like Mr. Ehrlich see human beings
only as "consumers of the earth's resources," human beings are in fact
the most valuable resource of all. Citizens are not just consumers but
producers. Having fewer people can wreak havoc on an economy, creating
both a labor shortage and a shortage of buyers. A government with a
shrinking population faces a smaller military and fewer taxpayers.
Dwindling populations have always signaled cultural decline, with less
creativity, energy, and vitality on every level of society.

Already Japan- fertility rate 1.3-is facing the problem of having
fewer taxpaying young people to support the burgeoning number of
retirees, something that will hit the generous welfare states of Europe
especially hard.

Already Europe has had to import large numbers of immigrants to bolster
the labor force, most of them from the Middle East. Fewer and fewer
native Europeans-along with the dwindling influence of
Christianity-and more and more Muslims raise the prospect of the
Islamification of Western Europe. One reason "old Europe" is not
supporting the United States in a war with Iraq is that politicians in
France and Germany fear the reaction among their Muslim voters.

Why the population decline? The worldwide collapse of what are,
literally, family values. Thanks to contraceptive technology, sex has
become separated from childbearing. With women pursuing careers of
their own and men getting sex without the responsibilities of marriage,
why bother with children? For many women and men, pregnancy has become
an unpleasant side effect, something to prevent with contraceptives or
easily treat with a trip to the abortion clinic.

The dirty little secret of the population implosion, one seldom
mentioned by demographers, is that the world is aborting its future
generations. China has shrunk its fertility rate by its cruel policy of
forced abortion. (The website of the International Planned Parenthood
Federation has only good things to say about China and does not even
mention how the government coerces women to have abortions. So much for
"choice.")

In the United States, abortion ends between one-third and one-fifth of
all pregnancies, and the U.S. abortion rate is relatively low. In
Russia, the average woman may have as many as four abortions in her
lifetime. There are two abortions for every live birth. That is to say,
Russians kill two-thirds of their children before they are born. That,
Mr. Putin, is the "serious crisis threatening Russia's survival."

.
User: "Peacenik"

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 15 Nov 2005 08:01:51 PM
"T.V." <tvanroon@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:r1vef.2120$w84.373468@news20.bellglobal.com...

Someone correct me if i am wrong...i am not in my "math mind" right

now..but

if a generation produces 2 babies per couple, and then those two babies
produce more babies before the original couple is dead...does that not

mean

that the original couple is actually respnsible for producing MORE than 2
babies in their lifetime?

And would that not create population growth?

Please, if you are a mathematician reading this, would you kindly sort

this

out for me?

People die, too. For zero population growth, the number of people being born
on a particular day would have to match the number of people who die on a
particular day.
.

User: "T.V."

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 15 Nov 2005 06:37:02 PM
oh..i guess this answers my question:
http://www.census.gov/population/www/popclockus.html
COMPONENT SETTINGS
One birth every.................................. 7 seconds
One death every.................................. 14 seconds
"T.V." <tvanroon@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:r1vef.2120$w84.373468@news20.bellglobal.com...

Someone correct me if i am wrong...i am not in my "math mind" right
now..but if a generation produces 2 babies per couple, and then those two
babies produce more babies before the original couple is dead...does that
not mean that the original couple is actually respnsible for producing
MORE than 2 babies in their lifetime?

And would that not create population growth?

Please, if you are a mathematician reading this, would you kindly sort
this out for me?

thx,

tv


"words of truth" <wordsoftruth@hoshmail.com> wrote in message
news:1132086228.580772.60120@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...


http://www.worldmag.com/world/issue/02-15-03/cultural_1.asp

http://forums.prolife.org.ph/yabbse/index.php?PHPSESSID=87094d4778b268132c3a0e41cac29b42&topic=321.msg568


Population implosion

Many nations are aborting their future generations, creating a
worldwide underpopulation crisis

By Gene Edward Veith

The president of Estonia goes on national TV to urge his countrymen to
have more children. Russian President Vladimir Putin warns his
parliament about "a serious crisis threatening Russia's survival": the
nation's low birth rate. The government of Singapore is trying to
reverse that country's birth dearth by sponsoring a massive
taxpayer-funded matchmaking service.

In 1968, Paul Ehrlich published The Population Bomb, panicking the
world with dire predictions of a population explosion. By the year
2000, he predicted, the world would be so crowded that hundreds of
millions would die of starvation. Although Mr. Ehrlich's prophecies
have turned out to be almost comically wrong, PBS has produced a
documentary taking him seriously, and philanthropists like Ted Turner
still donate millions to combat population growth.

But the problem today is not overpopulation; it's underpopulation. For
a population to reproduce itself, the fertility rate must average 2.1
children per woman. (The .1 allows for child mortality.) The fertility
rate today among major developed nations is only 1.6.

The United States is rare among its peers in keeping its fertility rate
at around the replacement level of 2.1, according to the Population
Reference Bureau, which provided the fertility data cited here. Europe,
though, is shrinking. Germany's rate is 1.3. Despite the stereotype of
large Catholic families, France has a fertility rate of 1.9 and Italy
has one of the lowest in Europe, 1.3. At this rate, there will be only
about half as many Italians in the next generation. There will also be
fewer Russians, whose fertility rate is 1.3.

Even nations that were once notorious for booming populations have
drastically slowed down in reproducing themselves. In the last 20
years, India's fertility rate has gone from over four children per
woman to about three. Mexico has gone from over four to just under
three. China has a fertility rate of 1.8.

African nations continue to have very high fertility rates, up to five
or six children per woman, but those lands are ravaged by AIDS, which
is decimating their population. Muslim nations, on the other hand, tend
to have booming population growth-Yemen's fertility rate is 7.2
children per woman.

Demographers predict that the world's population will level off at 9
billion, reports The Wall Street Journal. Then it will start dropping.
There may well be nearly 500 million fewer people by 2075.

Isn't this a good thing? Why are so many governments panicking at the
drop in their populations?

Although radical environmentalists like Mr. Ehrlich see human beings
only as "consumers of the earth's resources," human beings are in fact
the most valuable resource of all. Citizens are not just consumers but
producers. Having fewer people can wreak havoc on an economy, creating
both a labor shortage and a shortage of buyers. A government with a
shrinking population faces a smaller military and fewer taxpayers.
Dwindling populations have always signaled cultural decline, with less
creativity, energy, and vitality on every level of society.

Already Japan- fertility rate 1.3-is facing the problem of having
fewer taxpaying young people to support the burgeoning number of
retirees, something that will hit the generous welfare states of Europe
especially hard.

Already Europe has had to import large numbers of immigrants to bolster
the labor force, most of them from the Middle East. Fewer and fewer
native Europeans-along with the dwindling influence of
Christianity-and more and more Muslims raise the prospect of the
Islamification of Western Europe. One reason "old Europe" is not
supporting the United States in a war with Iraq is that politicians in
France and Germany fear the reaction among their Muslim voters.

Why the population decline? The worldwide collapse of what are,
literally, family values. Thanks to contraceptive technology, sex has
become separated from childbearing. With women pursuing careers of
their own and men getting sex without the responsibilities of marriage,
why bother with children? For many women and men, pregnancy has become
an unpleasant side effect, something to prevent with contraceptives or
easily treat with a trip to the abortion clinic.

The dirty little secret of the population implosion, one seldom
mentioned by demographers, is that the world is aborting its future
generations. China has shrunk its fertility rate by its cruel policy of
forced abortion. (The website of the International Planned Parenthood
Federation has only good things to say about China and does not even
mention how the government coerces women to have abortions. So much for
"choice.")

In the United States, abortion ends between one-third and one-fifth of
all pregnancies, and the U.S. abortion rate is relatively low. In
Russia, the average woman may have as many as four abortions in her
lifetime. There are two abortions for every live birth. That is to say,
Russians kill two-thirds of their children before they are born. That,
Mr. Putin, is the "serious crisis threatening Russia's survival."



.
User: "Therion Ware"

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 16 Nov 2005 02:38:36 AM
On Tue, 15 Nov 2005 19:37:02 -0500 in alt.atheism, T.V. ("T.V."
<tvanroon@sympatico.ca>) said, directing the reply to alt.atheism

oh..i guess this answers my question:

http://www.census.gov/population/www/popclockus.html

COMPONENT SETTINGS
One birth every.................................. 7 seconds
One death every.................................. 14 seconds

Now there's an interesting choice....
[snip]
.



User: "T.V."

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 23 Nov 2005 10:58:11 PM
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_003C_01C5F089.C34E6DD0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
From a Green Party (Canada email):
Message to Friends
From: Coordinator to Question of Direction Program
A Question of Direction:
Looking for Cooperation=20
We are faced today with an enormous challenge. Human beings fill the =
Earth, yet, our tradition is to grow more. We must change direction and =
pursue a new goal, a steady state relationship with our planet.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-------
The future depends on our choices today. The Green Party has emerged to =
give citizens an opportunity to vote for sustainability.
Since long ago, the more people there were and the more powerful our =
technologies, the better off we were. This age old pattern changed in =
the last century when we started to confront the limits of our planet. =
Today, the greatest problems facing the human family result from the =
enormous impacts we are having on the Earth.
Continuing to grow is making matters worse, yet, since expansion was so =
positive for so long, growth has become the underlying goal of our =
culture and institutions.
As a species, we are at the awkward adolescent stage where we have =
reached a mature size and strength, yet we hesitate to accept the =
accompanying responsibilities. Hope can be found in that, as =
individuals, our rapid growth came to an end and the vast majority of us =
accepted responsibility for our strength. At the same time, even as our =
material growth subsided, vast opportunities opened up in how =
effectively we could use the minds and bodies we had grown. Similarly a =
sustainable society will enjoy boundless frontiers of culture and =
ingenuity while living within the Earth's carrying capacity.
Today we face the greatest challenge a civilization can face. We have to =
look at our underlying goals and choose between continuing to grow, as =
we always have, and redirecting our economy toward a steady, mature =
state. It is a question of direction.
The Question of Direction program was adopted by the Green Party in =
2002. Much work has since gone into preparation. It is now time to =
gather a working group and lay a foundation for change. Please consider =
joining us in presenting this choice, and in the accompanying tasks of =
recreating the world in its new form.=20
This is a call to adventure, challenge, creativity and historic =
achievement. If future generations have the leisure to look back over =
human history, they will recognize those alive today as the ones who =
guided the human family to maturity.
Levels of involvement range from being on the Question of Direction =
contact list, through forwarding communications, to active campaigning =
and working on a steering committee. Please email
=
if you want to receive further notice, and/or work with this initiative.
Sincerely,
Mike Nickerson=20
Coordinator, Question of Direction program

For more information see:
The Challenge and Goal
The Question of Direction=20
------=_NextPart_000_003C_01C5F089.C34E6DD0
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2900.2769" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>From a Green Party (Canada =
email):</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV class=3Dbox>
<H2>
<DIV class=3Dbox>
<H2><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Message to Friends<BR>From: Coordinator =
to Question=20
of Direction Program</FONT></H2></DIV>
<H1><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>A Question of Direction:<BR>Looking for =
Cooperation=20
</FONT></H1>
<P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>We are faced today with an enormous =
challenge. Human=20
beings fill the Earth, yet, our tradition is to grow more. We must =
change=20
direction and pursue a new goal, a steady state relationship with our=20
planet.</FONT></P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>
<HR>
</FONT>
<P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The future depends on our choices today. =
The Green=20
Party has emerged to give citizens an opportunity to vote for=20
sustainability.</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Since long ago, the more people there =
were and the=20
more powerful our technologies, the better off we were. This age old =
pattern=20
changed in the last century when we started to confront the limits of =
our=20
planet. Today, the greatest problems facing the human family result from =
the=20
enormous impacts we are having on the Earth.</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Continuing to grow is making matters =
worse, yet,=20
since expansion was so positive for so long, growth has become the =
underlying=20
goal of our culture and institutions.</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>As a species, we are at the awkward =
adolescent stage=20
where we have reached a mature size and strength, yet we hesitate to =
accept the=20
accompanying responsibilities. Hope can be found in that, as =
individuals, our=20
rapid growth came to an end and the vast majority of us accepted =
responsibility=20
for our strength. At the same time, even as our material growth =
subsided, vast=20
opportunities opened up in how effectively we could use the minds and =
bodies we=20
had grown. Similarly a sustainable society will enjoy boundless =
frontiers of=20
culture and ingenuity while living within the Earth's carrying=20
capacity.</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Today we face the greatest challenge a =
civilization=20
can face. We have to look at our underlying goals and choose between =
continuing=20
to grow, as we always have, and redirecting our economy toward a steady, =
mature=20
state. It is a question of direction.</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The Question of Direction program was =
adopted by the=20
Green Party in 2002. Much work has since gone into preparation. It is =
now time=20
to gather a working group and lay a foundation for change. Please =
consider=20
joining us in presenting this choice, and in the accompanying tasks of=20
recreating the world in its new form. </FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>This is a call to adventure, challenge, =
creativity=20
and historic achievement. If future generations have the leisure to look =
back=20
over human history, they will recognize those alive today as the ones =
who guided=20
the human family to maturity.</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Levels of involvement range from being on =
the=20
Question of Direction contact list, through forwarding communications, =
to active=20
campaigning and working on a steering committee. Please email </FONT><A=20
href=3D"mailto:
"><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>
</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> if =
you want to=20
receive further notice, and/or work with this initiative.</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Sincerely,</FONT></P>
<P><BR><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Mike Nickerson <BR>Coordinator, =
Question of=20
Direction program<BR></FONT><A =
href=3D"mailto:
"><FONT=20
face=3DArial size=3D2>
</FONT></A></P>
<P><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>For more information see:<BR>The =
</FONT><A class=3Dlink=20
href=3D"http://greenparty.ca/challenge_goal.html"><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>Challenge and Goal</FONT></A><BR><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>The </FONT><A=20
class=3Dlink =
href=3D"http://www.sustainwellbeing.net/Question/Question.shtml"><FONT=20
face=3DArial size=3D2>Question of Direction</FONT></A><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>=20
</FONT></P></H2></DIV></DIV></BODY></HTML>
------=_NextPart_000_003C_01C5F089.C34E6DD0--
.

User: "Conspiracy of Doves"

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 15 Nov 2005 02:35:42 PM
You are completly insane. You realize that, don't you?
.

User: "Robert J. Kolker"

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 16 Nov 2005 04:08:00 AM
words of truth wrote:

http://www.worldmag.com/world/issue/02-15-03/cultural_1.asp

http://forums.prolife.org.ph/yabbse/index.php?PHPSESSID=87094d4778b268132c3a0e41cac29b42&topic=321.msg568


Population implosion

Many nations are aborting their future generations, creating a
worldwide underpopulation crisis

What are you on? The world is bursting at the seems with over six
billion humans. It may be the case that advanced industrial nations are
experiencing low birth rates, but the world as a whole is a rather going
and growing concern.
Bob Kolker
.

User: "--sexkitten--"

Title: Re: Population Implosion: The World Is Aborting Its Future Generations 16 Nov 2005 07:23:57 AM
words of truth wrote:

http://www.worldmag.com/world/issue/02-15-03/cultural_1.asp

http://forums.prolife.org.ph/yabbse/index.php?PHPSESSID=87094d4778b268132c3a0e41cac29b42&topic=321.msg568


Population implosion

Many nations are aborting their future generations, creating a
worldwide underpopulation crisis

You're kidding, right?
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/rankorder/2119rank.html
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/static/in_depth/world/2000/world_water_crisis/default.stm
http://www.pollution.com/
--
--sexkitten--
Sneechres on marital rape:
1414fd53.0312142051.5e760545@posting.google.com
Marriage is a contract in which everything is shared, including
bodies. What's yours is his and what's his is yours.
By withholding sex from him you violated your marriage vows. You
stole from your husband what was rightfully his.
1126802087.688528.21760@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com
Making your mind up is called the marriage
certificate. If you want to change it, it's called a divorce.
1414fd53.0311032335.47dd4971@posting.google.com
How would a witnesses' opinion, or a DA's opinion, or
a jurist's opinion, or a judge's opinion of the significance of force
involved be relevant?
The issue is that you think the government and it's
various judicial arms should act as people's parents and guardians,
even when it isn't there and can't possibly mediate what goes on in the
privacy of someone's bedroom without resorting to testimony--"he said,
she said".
.


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